# Biology Degree



## medichopeful (Feb 22, 2009)

Hi all,

This may be a stupid question, so please excuse me for asking it :unsure:.

I was recently reading the thread entitled "Ways to Stay on Top of Your Skills," and I have a question about education.  I read many posts about the need for the "new-era" of paramedics to have advanced education.  Here is my question.  I will be going to college this year, where I will be majoring in pre-health biology (basically pre-med).  It will include things such as A&P, and obviously other biology related subjects.  Do you all think that this would count as the "higher education" you are talking about?  I would like to be a paramedic sometime in the future, and I would like to make sure that I strive for excellence.

If anybody has any other suggestions for ways to increase my education, that would be greatly appreciated.  (For the record, I will be taking an EMT-B class in college, so no need to suggest that as a starting point )

Thanks all,
Eric


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## Veneficus (Feb 22, 2009)

a pre health or pre med course of study should do very well for you. I would only add biochemistry to it. That will help you understand much of more advanced physio and make pharmacology much easier.

Molecular biology is also a good course.


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## firecoins (Feb 22, 2009)

yes, that counts as higher education.


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## AJ Hidell (Feb 22, 2009)

It absolutely will significantly maximize your paramedic educational experience with an understanding of the curriculum that those without such a foundation can simply not realize.  There are few better ways to prepare for paramedic practice than with a biology degree.

That said, most biology programs do not involve a dedicated human anatomy & physiology course.  That is usually reserved for the professional programs (nursing, PT, medical technology), and not the pre-professional programs like pre-med.  Check on that before you commit to a major degree program.  You may want to lean towards a physiology concentration instead of pre-med.

Are you looking at a biology major strictly as a means of preparation for paramedic practice?  Or is there some other motivation going on here?  If you are looking at med school, grad school, teaching biology, or a job in research, then biology is a good choice.  But otherwise, there is an astounding number of people out here with biology degrees that can do absolutely nothing with them, career wise.  If paramedicine is your ultimate goal, then I would strongly recommend nursing or respiratory therapy over biology.  The relevance is much more significant, and either would make you a much better medic than a bio degree would.

If paramedicine is not your ultimate goal, then I would encourage you to simply focus all your attention and efforts on whatever that goal is and just forget about EMS.  We are already overpopulated by tourists, hobbyists, and others just using us for a stepping stone to something else.

Good luck!


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## Veneficus (Feb 22, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> We are already overpopulated by tourists, hobbyists, and others just using us for a stepping stone to something else.
> 
> Good luck!




In defense of those who used EMS as a stepping stone. Many like myself entered EMS with the intention of making it a career. It was only after many years of lack of career ladder, no interest in fire suppresion, and having to work 2-3 jobs or 20 hours of OT a week that people decide it is time to move on. From my personal perspective, I was encouraged to move on by providers (physicians) who thought that being a paramedic severly wasted my talents. I have met many others, even on this forum where remaining in prehospital EMS would be a waste of thier abilities as well. 


back on topic, it is harder to get into med school with a bio degree than it is with a philosophy degree. I agree with AJ though, if EMS is your goal, nursing would be a better option. There is no job for those with a "pre med" degree. (to say a degree focused on getting into med school instead of concentrating on a particular subject) You wind up with a lot of low level classes in many different disciplines and very few junior or senior classes in anything, so if you don't get into med school your options are majorly limited. If you go back for a masters you will quickly find you needed the upper level course work.

As much as I really enjoyed being part of EMS, if med school is your goal, do not waste time with it, all it does is delay you.


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## AJ Hidell (Feb 22, 2009)

Veneficus said:


> In defense of those who used EMS as a stepping stone. Many like myself entered EMS with the intention of making it a career. It was only after many years of lack of career ladder, no interest in fire suppresion, and having to work 2-3 jobs or 20 hours of OT a week that people decide it is time to move on.


You're right about that.  I did the same, as did too many others.  It is a sad reality that we have always faced, and will continue to face for the foreseeable future.  But if we can at least discourage those from doing so from the very get-go, then we can at least decrease our turnover a little bit.  And decreasing that turnover, establishing a more stable workforce, will ultimately contribute to the growth of the profession.

While I appreciate the perspective that physicians who spent time in EMS bring with them, ultimately I believe it is one of the poorer choices for obtaining that all-important "patient contact" experience that admission committees look for in med school applicants.  EMS is so far removed from the realities of real medical practice as to render that experience negligible in the context of a physician.


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## Veneficus (Feb 22, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> While I appreciate the perspective that physicians who spent time in EMS bring with them, ultimately I believe it is one of the poorer choices for obtaining that all-important "patient contact" experience that admission committees look for in med school applicants.  EMS is so far removed from the realities of real medical practice as to render that experience negligible in the context of a physician.



I think that is quite dependant on the EMS system or individual. Medics in hospital or in systems where medicine and education are valued seem to do very well in med school. The EMT-B who did it for "patient contact" wasted their time and the admissions people know that. (but it doesn't stop people from taking it ) One of my classmates who already graduated worked as a medic in an extremely restrictive EMS system and as you said, it did not serve him well. In fact it inhibited him quite a bit.


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## medichopeful (Feb 22, 2009)

Thank you for the responses so far.   To start off, let me say that I do know for a fact that A&P 1&2 is offered as part of the biology program. Veneficus, you had mentioned that they might not be offered, but fortunately they are. In fact, that was one of the reasons I chose this biology program. 

I see where people are coming from with the suggestion to skip EMS if I want to go to med school. At the moment, I have no interest in med school.  I believe that I will make EMS a career. 

Now, I have read the comments about how people can get bored with EMS. I realize that that is a real problem. But, the same is true for a lot of professions. If I do get bored, I can always go back to school (PA, nursing, etc.). 

However, I do not think I will get bored in EMS. I want to do something where I can help people, be outside, and have some sort of regimented lifestyle. I originally wanted to be a cop, but have realized that I do not want to be seen in that way by the public. (Don't get me wrong, though. I do have an admiration for the police.)

Sorry for the rambling. Back on track.

I realize that biology might not be the greatest field to major in, but it is something that has always interested me. And from what I have heard, it can't hurt when it comes to a career in EMS.

I am rambling again. Any other thoughts would be appreciated. 

Eric


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## Veneficus (Feb 22, 2009)

It was AJ that suggested A&P might not be offered. 

Most A&P courses are 200 or sophmore level. In the higher levels they become seperate topics. Usually gross anatomy and medical physiology. 

The texts alone are 3-5 times the size of the A&P books. The material is not even close to comparable.

If biology is your thing, go for it. 

If regimented life is your ideal, you may want to go with the fire service. With a degree many of the "regimented" aka "mother may I?" services strictly follow protocols designed for the GED employee. With advanced education you may get bored very fast. You may also encounter problems taking orders from people with less education than yourself.


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## silver (Feb 22, 2009)

Hmm well you can always find your specific concentration in biology and go off with that.  For instance you can always find a subject you like ie. molecular biology and then write a thesis on it.

I actually just changed my major to bio since biochemistry has like no good electives and i can at least take functional histoloy, cancer biology, and physiology while still taking biochemistry classes + electives to fulfill the requirement.

So I'm specifically trying to concentrate on top of that in medical ethics or a medicine and public policy program, by adding my minor as faith peace and justice. So for that minor i can take classes in the sociology dep, theology dep, philosophy and biology specifically on those social ideas.

No matter, if you take a intro bio, chem, orgo, molecular bio, calc during your first years you can continue with a science major, change to what ever you are really most interested in, or go into a BSN program.


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## medichopeful (Feb 22, 2009)

Veneficus said:


> It was AJ that suggested A&P might not be offered.
> 
> Most A&P courses are 200 or sophmore level. In the higher levels they become seperate topics. Usually gross anatomy and medical physiology.
> 
> ...



Oops.  Sorry about that, AJ!  :blush:

I see what you mean about the fire service.  I was thinking of actually trying to get on with a big city "public" EMS provider.  At the moment, I am looking at Boston EMS.  From everything I have heard, they are a great service.

There is always the concern that I will get bored.  However, I am thinking that if that happens, I can always try to advance in the ranks.  I am sure there would be plenty of things that I could do after doing time on the street if I wanted to.  True, I might have to do some more training, but that is fine with me.  I could also always move on to another agency (such as Med-Flight) where the level of training is increased.

I appreciate that you brought up the fact that it may be tough to take orders from someone who has a "lower" level of education than me (I do not mean any disrespect by this.  There is nothing wrong with not having a high level of education).  However, I have never had any problems taking orders from people, regardless of their relationship to me.  So, I don't think this will be a major problem.  But who knows, it might in the future.  I will have to keep that in mind.  

Eric


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