# Los Angeles - What good opportunities for employment?



## PeterB (May 15, 2009)

Just got my NREMT. Working on L.A. County Card, Ambulance License, etc.

After that, where is the best place to work to get experience? And maybe fairly good pay? I would like 911 experience.

AMR? McCormick? Gerber?

Are there any hospitals in the area that hire EMT's?

Thanks everyone.

Peter the Rookie


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## medic417 (May 15, 2009)

LA is not known for its EMS, well at least not in a positive way.  Odds are you will have to get a transfer job to start.  If you really intend on working EMS continue on with your Paramedic education ASAP.


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## VentMedic (May 15, 2009)

medic417 said:


> LA is not known for its EMS, well at least not in a positive way. Odds are you will have to get a transfer job to start. If you really intend on working EMS continue on with your Paramedic education ASAP.


 
I'am sure one of the others can tell him which company will get him a decent start while he is working on his FF cert and Paramedic.


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## daedalus (May 15, 2009)

McCormick, Care, AMR

These three keep there standards higher than all the rest. They are also much more difficult to get hired at. 

The IFT companies with a better than average reputation:
Bowers and PRN

Any other company will be a medicare frauding renal roundup gig.


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## AJ Hidell (May 16, 2009)

Where does Schaefer figure in there these days?


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## JPINFV (May 16, 2009)

I know Schaefer lost the Costa Mesa 911 contract to Care....


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## daedalus (May 16, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> Where does Schaefer figure in there these days?



Forgot about that one. 
Better than most.


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## AJ Hidell (May 16, 2009)

Okay, I was thinking so.  I did my last refresher with a couple Schaefer guys at Loma Linda just last year, so I didn't think they went out of business that fast, lol.


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## Sapphyre (May 16, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> Okay, I was thinking so.  I did my last refresher with a couple Schaefer guys at Loma Linda just last year, so I didn't think they went out of business that fast, lol.



They're still around, have East San Gabriel Valley.  Run into them once in a while, when they venture to a hospital out of their area.


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## PeterB (May 17, 2009)

*Thanks I will look into it*

Appreciate everyone's responses. Some are a little mysterious, I have no idea why. Could you send me a private email?  P G Bognar at G mail dot com no spaces.

Thanks


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## Sapphyre (May 17, 2009)

Peter, the mysterious posts are, because, well, some of us are not supposed to shout from the roof tops who we work for, among other things.  Anyway, what you didn't say is WHERE in LA you wanted to work.  That does make a difference.  Consolidate the posts and you'll get some good suggestions that cover pretty much the whole county.


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## AnthonyM83 (May 17, 2009)

Peter,

The 5 companies with primary 911 contracts in Los Angeles are: AMR, Care, Gerber, Westmed-McCormick, and Cole-Schaefer. Gerber runs with Santa Monica and Torrance FD. The rest run with LA County FD. All the other cities have their own FD ambulances (like LAFD or Burbank).

I hear the best things about Care and McCormick. AMR had a strong history of being lazy and unorganized, but have heard that has changed in last couple years. Schaefer seems to run slower areas, but I'm told it's decent exposure. Gerber will probably be slowest. Note that Torrance FD has them respond without lights/sirens to 911 calls and requires them to wait for FD to arrive before going on-scene (except for rare circumstances).

I recommend working for one where you can get high call-volume areas. AMR has Palmdale and Lancaster. Care has Florence and East LA. McCormick has Inglewood and county South Central. Schaefer and Gerber seem to be best for full-time students needing downtime, but who still want some experience. I'm told their schedules are more flexible, also.

I do not recommend working for any other company, as they would be primary Inter-Facility Transports, unless you feel very weak in your assessment skills and need practice. You can learn a good deal from IFTs, but the experience would be over-run by that which you would get at a 911 company (that also does some IFTs). The bar seems to be set lower at those companies, so you won't have the best influences around (this is a generalization). For this reason, you might also be a less desirable applicant at 911 companies later. But if needed, I tend to see Ambuserve, Bowers, and PRN often. Some will very occasionally run backup 911 calls. 

911 rates are usually $8-$10/hr. IFT rates are just a bit higher, usually. Go on ride-alongs with all your prospective companies. Talk to the employees. Find out if you'll be required to do a certain number of IFT hours before transferring to a 911 shift. Ask if the attractive hiring bonuses are paid all at once or over an entire year. They can be tricky.

Working in an ER will definitely be good experience. Contact all your local hospitals. Some require phlebotomy certification. Some require 911 field experience. Some just require EMT cert. I would recommend ambulance AND hospital work.


That was my attempt at a comprehensive and non-biased reply.
What are your career goals? Why are you an EMT?
(FD? PD? Pre-med? Physician's Assistant? Private Medic? Nursing? Just for kicks?)


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## VentMedic (May 17, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> Note that Torrance FD has them respond without lights/sirens to 911 calls and requires them to wait for FD to arrive before going on-scene (except for rare circumstances).
> 
> **************************************
> I do not recommend working for any other company, as they would be primary Inter-Facility Transports, unless you feel very weak in your assessment skills and need practice. You can learn a good deal from IFTs, but the experience would be over-run by that which you would get at a 911 company (that also does some IFTs). The bar seems to be set lower at those companies, so you won't have the best influences around (this is a generalization). For this reason, you might also be a less desirable applicant at 911 companies later. But if needed, I tend to see Ambuserve, Bowers, and PRN often. Some will very occasionally run backup 911 calls.


 
This is the part I don't get when some say doing 911 calls is better than IFT especially if the FD makes you wait before entering the scene. I also take it the FD medic will be on board if the patient if ALS is required. Hence, you end up being the fetch it guy for the FD. On an IFT, you can take the initiative to do some excellent assessments and interview the paitents instead of just standing in the background waiting for the Fire Medics to say you can load and go now. 

The bar appears to be set lower at transfer companies because of the "its not 911" attitude displayed by the employees themselves. Somewhere the patient care concept is missed. Thus, if may not be the company that sets the bar but the EMTs with the company recognizing this to use for their own gain when it comes to wages and equipment. Why spend much if you know your employees are only waiting for a glamourous job as the "load 'em up" boys and girls for the FDs?


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## JPINFV (May 17, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> This is the part I don't get when some say doing 911 calls is better than IFT especially if the FD makes you wait before entering the scene. I also take it the FD medic will be on board if the patient if ALS is required. Hence, you end up being the fetch it guy for the FD. On an IFT, you can take the initiative to do some excellent assessments and interview the paitents instead of just standing in the background waiting for the Fire Medics to say you can load and go now.



At least with a medic you get instaneous feedback on what questions/assessment points you missed. In my limited (n=1) experience at large IFT companies, once basics got cleared from field training there was virtually no QA/QI unless something drastic went wrong. I agree that making a provider sit around and wait for the FD is bass ackwards at best, though. That said, I will say that a self directed basic can get a really good experience working IFT. Key word is self directed.


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## Sasha (May 17, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> This is the part I don't get when some say doing 911 calls is better than IFT especially if the FD makes you wait before entering the scene. I also take it the FD medic will be on board if the patient if ALS is required. Hence, you end up being the fetch it guy for the FD. On an IFT, you can take the initiative to do some excellent assessments and interview the paitents instead of just standing in the background waiting for the Fire Medics to say you can load and go now.
> 
> The bar appears to be set lower at transfer companies because of the "its not 911" attitude displayed by the employees themselves. Somewhere the patient care concept is missed. Thus, if may not be the company that sets the bar but the EMTs with the company recognizing this to use for their own gain when it comes to wages and equipment. Why spend much if you know your employees are only waiting for a glamourous job as the "load 'em up" boys and girls for the FDs?



I also don't get the aversion to IFT. It's experience that may get you on a 911 truck if you so desire, and a good majority of your patients on IFT are actually sick, oppose to the toe pains, feeling funny, drunk a lot last night and now have a headache that so burdens 911 agencies. It's also an invaluable time to learn about diseases, injuries, treatments and equipment like trachs and vents and different oxygen delivery devices you wouldn't have much exposure to in the field. You also get experience giving verbal reports to nurses.  

Some areas the only "experience" EMTs get in 911 is driving and compressions every so often.

And let's not forget Critical Care trucks are IFT, as are helicopters.


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## AnthonyM83 (May 17, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> This is the part I don't get when some say doing 911 calls is better than IFT especially if the FD makes you wait before entering the scene. I also take it the FD medic will be on board if the patient if ALS is required. Hence, you end up being the fetch it guy for the FD. On an IFT, you can take the initiative to do some excellent assessments and interview the paitents instead of just standing in the background waiting for the Fire Medics to say you can load and go now.
> 
> The bar appears to be set lower at transfer companies because of the "its not 911" attitude displayed by the employees themselves. Somewhere the patient care concept is missed. Thus, if may not be the company that sets the bar but the EMTs with the company recognizing this to use for their own gain when it comes to wages and equipment. Why spend much if you know your employees are only waiting for a glamourous job as the "load 'em up" boys and girls for the FDs?



Only two FD's (that I know of) require staging. The 911 experience gained IS offset by never running assessments on critical patient. That's why I don't really recommend it.

Depending on your service area at other companies, you may be first on-scene over half the time. This would be your chance to assess critical patients.

***Now, whether you have to stage for FD or not, you'll be getting a large number of BLS patients handed off to you. That's where most of my assessment practice come from. It's just me in the back. I can go nuts from listening to heart sounds to asking about every risk factor and family history related to chief complaint. As a "bonus" you often get "BLS patients" who should really be ALS (though usually not as obviously unstable).***

I admit IFTs give you a good number of ALS patient assessments, since many nursing homes try to send their patients BLS to the ER to avoid a 911 activation. But the variety might be limited and interspersed with so many routine hospital-to-hospital transfers, regular dialysis visits, and hospital discharges. So many are altered mental status as baseline and stable, so you're limited in the practice you get out of those (reading their discharge papers is interesting/educational I do admit).

My disclaimer is I haven't actually worked for a primary IFT company...though I have done many in between the 911 responses.




As far as the lower bar at IFT companies. Yes, it's likely management allowing it to get the kind of people who will "do their bidding". I'm worried about having a brand new EMT go into that environment, since he won't know any better. He can definitely rise above the rest, but it will be hard for him to know where that bar should actually be. Higher chance of not having good role-models. 

When I was new, I kept thinking I was the best, then would work with someone who was way more on top of this stuff than I. The next few months would be spent surpassing that level....until I found someone better. If I had never seen that caliber of work performance, I wouldn't know any better.

Lastly, 911 experience offers the chance to develop quick thinking and quick acting during critical and stressful situations. While EMS doesn't always have to be "go go go", one certainly need to have the ability for it. You want to be able to a have patient vomit, turn the board and suction, while you spike the IV line, and navigate your driver if needed with background noise.

So, in the end, there are definitely trade-offs. I side with 911, because I consider them EMS entities. It would make sense to get one's EMS experience with an EMS company. I definitely acknowledge the valuable experience from IFT's too.


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## Sasha (May 17, 2009)

> Lastly, 911 experience offers the chance to develop quick thinking and quick acting during critical and stressful situations.



You want stressful? Have you non-DNR "stable" BLS hip fx patient suddenly go apneic in the middle of a 2 hour transport! Loads of fun while you're holding on dispatch for the location of the closest hospital.


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## AnthonyM83 (May 17, 2009)

Sasha said:


> You want stressful? Have you non-DNR "stable" BLS hip fx patient suddenly go apneic in the middle of a 2 hour transport! Loads of fun while you're holding on dispatch for the location of the closest hospital.


 Again, not that stressful doesn't happen with IFT's. I ended up bagging the very first IFT I got after field training and my partner had only three weeks experience on me. It was probably my 3rd call ever. It was stressful. But it was still the exception, not the norm.


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## Sasha (May 17, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> Again, not that stressful doesn't happen with IFT's. I ended up bagging the very first IFT I got after field training and my partner had only three weeks experience on me. It was probably my 3rd call ever. It was stressful. But it was still the exception, not the norm.



That depends entirely on what kind of IFT we're talking about. I'd say that stressful and critical thinking calls are the norm for a medic critical care truck where the patients are actually sick and requiring high levels of care, but defintely not on one that does renal runs and discharges all day.


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## CAOX3 (May 18, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> Peter,
> I hear the best things about Care and McCormick. AMR had a strong history of being lazy and unorganized, but have heard that has changed in last couple years. Schaefer seems to run slower areas, but I'm told it's decent exposure. Gerber will probably be slowest. Note that Torrance FD has them respond without lights/sirens to 911 calls and *requires them to wait for FD to arrive before going on-scene (except for rare circumstances*).



Who comes up with this stuff, better yet who allows it?


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## daedalus (May 18, 2009)

CAOX3 said:


> Who comes up with this stuff, better yet who allows it?



After Gerber and Santa Monica FD started being dispatched by LA County Fire's dispatch center (giving up their proprietary center), I believe they did away with the ridiculous (that is not a strong enough word) rule that Gerber units had to stage a block away so that the city fire medics could get on scene first, and than the silly private ambulance could roll up quietly with no l/s as to keep the glory with the fire medics. I was told this practice has been abolished recently.


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## AJ Hidell (May 20, 2009)

CAOX3 said:


> Who comes up with this stuff, better yet who allows it?


Your friends at the IAFF and IAFC.  Heaven forbid that the public come to realize that the ambulance drivers can get there faster and render the same care as the FD, plus transport them to the hospital, unlike the FD.  If that were to become common knowledge, people in an already bankrupt state might begin to ask really uncomfortable questions, like "why are we paying two different entities to do the same job here when one is obviously capable of doing it themselves?"  And when they learned that the ones doing the least are making four times more than those doing the most, well... it would be really embarrassing to our city managers, and some fire budgets might have to suffer.  We can't be having that now, can we?


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## PeterB (May 20, 2009)

*San Fernando Valley*

Thanks Anthony and others. I live in North Hollywood, one block from McCormick Station #6. Burbank is a half mile away. Would be nice to work around here, but I want to do 911 calls to get experience, even if that experience is farther away.

I was a personal trainer for years, I always wanted to be a Paramedic. I enjoy being the person who helps those having a rough situation. Not sure if I have the skills yet, I am good at book stuff, not so much at practical stuff. 

I have checked online, on Monster.com, there is not a lot of calls for EMT's. Strange. Neither at hospital websites under 'careers'. 

I just got my L.A. County Card and my Ambulance Certificate, so i am ready to go.

Any more info you guys and gals have, thanks.

Peter


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## AnthonyM83 (May 20, 2009)

daedalus said:


> After Gerber and Santa Monica FD started being dispatched by LA County Fire's dispatch center (giving up their proprietary center), I believe they did away with the ridiculous (that is not a strong enough word) rule that Gerber units had to stage a block away so that the city fire medics could get on scene first, and than the silly private ambulance could roll up quietly with no l/s as to keep the glory with the fire medics. I was told this practice has been abolished recently.



I have been told it was done away with for Santa Monica FD, but Torrance FD still requires it (the two FDs that Gerber Ambulance runs with in Los Angeles). This is second hand information, though, so treat appropriately.



Peter,

The private ambulance companies have an extremely high turn-over rate. If one isn't hiring at the moment, the other four will be. That tends to be the trend. The IFT companies are always out recruiting, in case you need a job, now. The 911 companies have stacks of applications, so might take a few weeks to get the process going.

I would also call local hospitals and speak to HR or their ER coordinators directly if you really want to find a spot. For now, I would just start setting up ride-alongs with the different companies.


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## AJ Hidell (May 21, 2009)

PeterB said:


> I have checked online, on Monster.com, there is not a lot of calls for EMT's. Strange. Neither at hospital websites under 'careers'.


Could be because being an EMT is not a career.  It's just a job, like driving a taxi or a wrecker, but with a lot fewer openings, and a lot more people seeking them.  There are a dozen schools cranking out hundreds more EMTs every month in LA.  Most of them never, ever get an EMS job.  And those that do won't keep it for too long before moving on to something that pays more than $10 dollars an hour max.  With all those people running around LA, so desperate for any ambulance job that they'll work for nearly minimum wage, why would any employer advertise?


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## EMT-StudxMuffin (May 21, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> Could be because being an EMT is not a career.  It's just a job, like driving a taxi or a wrecker, but with a lot fewer openings, and a lot more people seeking them.  There are a dozen schools cranking out hundreds more EMTs every month in LA.  Most of them never, ever get an EMS job.  And those that do won't keep it for too long before moving on to something that pays more than $10 dollars an hour max.  With all those people running around LA, so desperate for any ambulance job that they'll work for nearly minimum wage, why would any employer advertise?



wow....that's depressing..... :sad:


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## AnthonyM83 (May 21, 2009)

Agreed.

In Los Angeles, EMS is run by fire departments. FDs that do not transport contract private EMT ambulances for transport. Medic jumps onto the BLS ambulance with his equipment if he deems it ALS (99.9% of ALS runs are code 3, even if patient is 100% stable but meets ALS criteria). If it's BLS, the EMTs transport code 2 on their own.

I would say 75% of these EMTs are simply trying to get onto a FD and that most seem to have no interest or actually hate EMS. Many go onto paramedic school to become a more attractive FD applicant while they openly "hate medical stuff". Often, once hired, they are forced to attend paramedic school, anyway. The other 25% are students who wish to be doctors, RN, and PA's. Some PD hopefuls, too.

Since the 911 companies often pay minimum wage, there's no alternative but to make it a stepping stone job. I'd say most EMTs are between 18 and 24. Even those who want to be career paramedics, can't, as they would have to become firefighters (a VERY lengthy process here...years of applying, usually).

So, what you end up with are companies with ridiculously high turnovers who know they can get away with paying minimum wage (and to be fair, the companies themselves don't seem to rake in THAT much money...). A senior EMT or Field Training Officer tends to be one with 1 or 2 years on. You do get an occasional "lifer" who makes it his career...but it's limiting...just transporting for the FD (even if you have a medic cert, private ambulance companies wish you to follow FD's orders to maintain their contracts).

It is definitely depressing if you care about EMS...especially when you get a look at how things are outside the local area and when you go to school for higher levels of care and realize the negligence being done by those who were forced to attend medic school. That's our daily lives here.


Still, Los Angeles is a busy area and a good opportunity to get call volume and experience. Just know that your idea of what EMS is will be warped.


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## daedalus (May 21, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> In Los Angeles, EMS is run by fire departments. FDs that do not transport contract private EMT ambulances for transport. Medic jumps onto the BLS ambulance with his equipment if he deems it ALS (99.9% of ALS runs are code 3, even if patient is 100% stable but meets ALS criteria). If it's BLS, the EMTs transport code 2 on their own.
> 
> ...



Great insights, Anthony.

Los Angeles is spoiled to me by the EMS system, otherwise I would have loved to make the area the place of my employ. There are beautiful areas here and it depresses me that I will have to leave.


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## EMT-StudxMuffin (May 22, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> In Los Angeles, EMS is run by fire departments. FDs that do not transport contract private EMT ambulances for transport. Medic jumps onto the BLS ambulance with his equipment if he deems it ALS (99.9% of ALS runs are code 3, even if patient is 100% stable but meets ALS criteria). If it's BLS, the EMTs transport code 2 on their own.
> 
> ...




So I was looking around trying to find some info but I came up empty handed maybe you guys can help me out. 

I'm moving to the O.C. area, south of L.A. In order to work as an EMT in that general area, I need to become a FF also? or can i just work with the EMS side of that FD? If I were to move there, what can I do with my EMT certification? Thanks in advance


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## CAOX3 (May 22, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> Could be because being an EMT is not a career.  It's just a job, like driving a taxi or a wrecker, but with a lot fewer openings, and a lot more people seeking them.  There are a dozen schools cranking out hundreds more EMTs every month in LA.  Most of them never, ever get an EMS job.  And those that do won't keep it for too long before moving on to something that pays more than $10 dollars an hour max.  With all those people running around LA, so desperate for any ambulance job that they'll work for nearly minimum wage, why would any employer advertise?



Wow that is depressing.


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## JPINFV (May 22, 2009)

EMT-StudxMuffin said:


> So I was looking around trying to find some info but I came up empty handed maybe you guys can help me out.
> 
> I'm moving to the O.C. area, south of L.A. In order to work as an EMT in that general area, I need to become a FF also? or can i just work with the EMS side of that FD? If I were to move there, what can I do with my EMT certification? Thanks in advance




Orange County is even worse than LA. At least LA allows private companies to have paramedics while in Orange County only the fire department has paramedics. They're currently looking at allowing the private companies to have something that looks like a quarter of a medic (monitor/defib, a few non-cardiac drugs, and combitubes), but even that hasn't been approved yet.


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## Sapphyre (May 22, 2009)

EMT-StudxMuffin said:


> So I was looking around trying to find some info but I came up empty handed maybe you guys can help me out.
> 
> I'm moving to the O.C. area, south of L.A. In order to work as an EMT in that general area, I need to become a FF also? or can i just work with the EMS side of that FD? If I were to move there, what can I do with my EMT certification? Thanks in advance



As an EMT in OC, you can work for a private transport company, which transports under contract for the local fire departments, with out actually being a fire fighter.  Of course, this means you also don't get to benefit from FD pay.  As a medic in OC, you also need to be a firefighter.   That is, if you want to work 911.

If you want to work transfers, you do NOT have the option of joining fire, and, like jpinfv already said, you don't get to be a medic either.  

Working in the surrounding counties is a little better, LA, San Bernardino, Riverside....  San Bernardino and Riverside you can even be a 911 medic without being part of fire, although, you are under contract to fire  (again, the pay is no where near what fire makes).


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## PeterB (May 24, 2009)

Thanks Anthony and others.

So I have applied to those four companies. Only Gerber has contacted me and they want me to go to a 4-day school while being paid. More school. Sheesh. Then a probationary period.

All of this for $9 hour?

I wish I could get on with McCormick, but no word yet.

What's really weird to me is that I also work occasionally as an interpreter at a college. I make $27 an hour, and if I am the only interpreter, they pay me double. So last month I got $53 per hour to interpret a college class for a entire semester. 

And saving lives is $9 per hour? What is going on people?


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## PeterB (May 24, 2009)

But interpreting is NOT what I want to do. I guess if I really want to go for it, I should try Paramedic. I am not a young dude though, but I am in good shape. 

Does anyone have any info about the Paramedic Training Institute? Hard to get in? Why is it so much cheaper than Daniel Freeman?

Maybe that's for another thread? 

Let me know, this is all learning for me.

Peter


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## AnthonyM83 (May 24, 2009)

PeterB said:


> But interpreting is NOT what I want to do. I guess if I really want to go for it, I should try Paramedic. I am not a young dude though, but I am in good shape.
> 
> Does anyone have any info about the Paramedic Training Institute? Hard to get in? Why is it so much cheaper than Daniel Freeman?



I haven't been through PTI, but what its graduates have told me is "it sucks". You get only the basics. It's a FF/Medic mill. Again, I haven't attended it, but its reputation is for teaching you only the bare minimum and that while staff says they'll be supportive, not much effort is put in into helping you through. Last I heard, you have to have fire academy to go through it.

I heard UCLA might now be getting a financial aid program setup...so it might not be as bad.


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## Sapphyre (May 24, 2009)

AnthonyM83 said:


> I haven't been through PTI, but what its graduates have told me is "it sucks". You get only the basics. It's a FF/Medic mill. Again, I haven't attended it, but its reputation is for teaching you only the bare minimum and that while staff says they'll be supportive, not much effort is put in into helping you through. Last I heard, you have to have fire academy to go through it.



Hmmmm, I thought you also had to be sponsored by a fire department as well.  Maybe not...


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## JPINFV (May 24, 2009)

Why does the thought of the EMS based fire suppression agencies in LA County having their own paramedic training institute scare the crap out of me?


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## medic417 (May 24, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why does the thought of the EMS based fire suppression agencies in LA County having their own paramedic training institute scare the crap out of me?



I don't see a problem.  In fact I think I may rent my mother-in-law an apartment out there.h34r:


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## Sapphyre (May 25, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why does the thought of the EMS based fire suppression agencies in LA County having their own paramedic training institute scare the crap out of me?



Just don't get seriously hurt or sick in LA County to where you'll need medics.  But, yeah, the guys that come out of there are even more scary than the ones that come out of Freeman.


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## JPINFV (May 25, 2009)

Wow. The sad part was that I always assumed that Freeman would be a good program since it's associated with UCLA.


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## Sapphyre (May 25, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Wow. The sad part was that I always assumed that Freeman would be a good program since it's associated with UCLA.



I'm sure it was, until fire got ahold of it and used it as their medic mill.

The good ones come out of Mt SAC and Crafton.  Don't see as many out of (steels herself against the negativeness to come) RCC in LA.


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## JPINFV (May 25, 2009)

Sapphyre said:


> (steels herself against the negativeness to come) RCC in LA.




...but RCC has a kick *** drumline.


[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wo8PNzMQSyc&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]
2003 National Championships... At least wait till you get past the opening...


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## peskyfish (May 25, 2009)

PeterB said:


> I wish I could get on with McCormick, but no word yet.



Peter,
From what I know, McCormick is not actively hiring at the moment, I was told by management that it could change in 2 weeks or 2 months, probably sooner rather than later. So hang in there and you may hear from them soon.


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## PeterB (May 31, 2009)

*What the $(#*@?*

So after reading all of your posts and encouragement, I applied at AMR, McCormick, Care, Gerber, Schaefer, and APT.

So Gerber calls me back right away. I go down there, and there are three guys sitting in a room taking a test. Two are in business attire, one in jeans. I was dressed professionally, as they told me. So I start the written test, but its hard to concentrate because the HR lady is talking the entire time. She tells us our possible scheduling, hours, all this stuff. She gives us candy during the test, funny lady. So I pass the written test, and I go outside for the physical. We GS carried one of the other job candidates across the parking lot. Plus we lifted a guy on a backboard from the ground six times in a row. Easy.
So I go back inside, and the HR lady tells me I DIDN'T PASS THE WRITTEN TEST. She says the last question is a scenario. It says "Write in Essay form the procedure." I wrote it sort of an essay, sort of an outline, so it would be clear what the procedures are, PENMAN, AVPU, ABC's, etc. I didn't think it was correct to write a STORY! So I said to her, "Excuse me?" She said sorry but we have to follow directions. I watched the guy in jeans go to the next step of filling out a schedule request, and the other guys that scored lower than me on the multiple choice test, and I left.
I feel like saying I was burned by the informal HR lady, but maybe I just have sour grapes.
What do you guys think? Anyway, five other companies to go. We will see how soon I can get hired.


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## HereToLearn (May 31, 2009)

PeterB said:


> So after reading all of your posts and encouragement, I applied at AMR, McCormick, Care, Gerber, Schaefer, and APT.
> 
> So Gerber calls me back right away. I go down there, and there are three guys sitting in a room taking a test. Two are in business attire, one in jeans. I was dressed professionally, as they told me. So I start the written test, but its hard to concentrate because the HR lady is talking the entire time. She tells us our possible scheduling, hours, all this stuff. She gives us candy during the test, funny lady. So I pass the written test, and I go outside for the physical. We GS carried one of the other job candidates across the parking lot. Plus we lifted a guy on a backboard from the ground six times in a row. Easy.
> So I go back inside, and the HR lady tells me I DIDN'T PASS THE WRITTEN TEST. She says the last question is a scenario. It says "Write in Essay form the procedure." I wrote it sort of an essay, sort of an outline, so it would be clear what the procedures are, PENMAN, AVPU, ABC's, etc. I didn't think it was correct to write a STORY! So I said to her, "Excuse me?" She said sorry but we have to follow directions. I watched the guy in jeans go to the next step of filling out a schedule request, and the other guys that scored lower than me on the multiple choice test, and I left.
> ...




Welcome to the world of private ambulance companies.


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## AnthonyM83 (May 31, 2009)

Sorry to hear that happened. She might have "burned you" by not letting you rewrite it, but if the test said to write it in essay form, I imagine they...well, wanted you to write it in essay form. Outlines are easy, but they probably wanted to grade your ability to write and gauge your knowledge and critical thinking based on the details of what you would do on that scenario, rather than just listing procedures from school.

I would take that experience as your test trial. You'll be more comfortable at your next interviews, now. Good luck Peter.


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## terrible one (Jun 1, 2009)

where are you located? if you really want good experience stay out of LA county. the FD runs everything and you are nothing more than a gurney jockey. if you can make a commute id go to San Bernadino, Riverside, Ventura, or Kern County. you can get 1 on 1 with a medic, instead of being a taxi for LA county FD. 

and I did two years at Schafer, and two at McCormick. all 911 companies are basically the same in LA, maybe a lil different pay/equipment but in the end you wont learn much (other than how to BLS ALS calls and cut corners)


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## jgmedic (Jun 1, 2009)

Sapphyre said:


> I'm sure it was, until fire got ahold of it and used it as their medic mill.
> 
> The good ones come out of Mt SAC and Crafton.  Don't see as many out of (steels herself against the negativeness to come) RCC in LA.



I didn't realize that RIVERSIDE community college was in Los Angeles.   I have met many good and bad medics from all 3 of those as well as Freeman.  I can only assume you don't like the "paramilitary" structure that RCC has or maybe how long it is. Honestly, any student will get out of medic school what they put in. Mt. SAC has the rep for toughness but also for not teaching and merely throwing the book at students and telling them to memorize it.


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## JPINFV (Jun 1, 2009)

Just because RCC isn't in LACo doesn't mean that medics from RCC don't make their way to LACo.


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## Sapphyre (Jun 1, 2009)

jgmedic said:


> I didn't realize that RIVERSIDE community college was in Los Angeles.   I have met many good and bad medics from all 3 of those as well as Freeman.  I can only assume you don't like the "paramilitary" structure that RCC has or maybe how long it is.



I never said RCC was in LA, in fact, it's in RIVERSIDE, based out the Moreno Valley Campus.  The program itself shares grounds with several Public Safety academies not too far March Air Reserve Base.

I also never said *I* didn't like the program.  (why don't you check my profile picture again, a little more carefully....)  But, every time I bring it up, there are a number of people here who complain that it sucks, JUST because of the paramilitary attitude....

The reason it was associated with LA in my post, is because I work in LA, very closely with LACoFD medics....


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## JPINFV (Jun 1, 2009)

Sapphyre said:


> But, every time I bring it up, there are a number of people here who complain that it sucks, JUST because of the paramilitary attitude....



I plead the 3rd.


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## Sapphyre (Jun 1, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> I plead the 3rd.



hahahaha

don't worry JPINFV, I don't want to stay at your house anyway....


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## jgmedic (Jun 1, 2009)

Sapphyre said:


> I never said RCC was in LA, in fact, it's in RIVERSIDE, based out the Moreno Valley Campus.  The program itself shares grounds with several Public Safety academies not too far March Air Reserve Base.
> 
> I also never said *I* didn't like the program.  (why don't you check my profile picture again, a little more carefully....)  But, every time I bring it up, there are a number of people here who complain that it sucks, JUST because of the paramilitary attitude....
> 
> The reason it was associated with LA in my post, is because I work in LA, very closely with LACoFD medics....



My fault, I think I misread your original post. You were saying there are not a lot of RCC medics in LA? Apologies for jumping to conclusions. I went to RCC's medic program, and I loved it, there are a lot of "hoops" to jump through, but I feel the EMS education is very good. I think the reason you don't see many RCC medics in LA is that the program is really long and in-depth for those who are looking for a quick P-card just to get on with FD.Many of us were there for medicine and not necessarily just for a FD job.


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## Sapphyre (Jun 1, 2009)

jgmedic said:


> My fault, I think I misread your original post. You were saying there are not a lot of RCC medics in LA? Apologies for jumping to conclusions. I went to RCC's medic program, and I loved it, there are a lot of "hoops" to jump through, but I feel the EMS education is very good. I think the reason you don't see many RCC medics in LA is that the program is really long and in-depth for those who are looking for a quick P-card just to get on with FD.Many of us were there for medicine and not necessarily just for a FD job.



No, I was recommending the program, as a (in my very uneducated opinion) much better alternative to Freeman.  Seems like everyone discounts the IE when asking about the Greater LA area.  And, the issue about the negativeness, again, is that a lot of the posters here don't like the paramilitary atmosphere.  They think it breeds hose jockeys....

Did you check my profile picture?  When you do, look at the shoulders.... you might see something familiar.


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## jgmedic (Jun 1, 2009)

Sapphyre said:


> No, I was recommending the program, as a (in my very uneducated opinion) much better alternative to Freeman.  Seems like everyone discounts the IE when asking about the Greater LA area.  And, the issue about the negativeness, again, is that a lot of the posters here don't like the paramilitary atmosphere.  They think it breeds hose jockeys....
> 
> Did you check my profile picture?  When you do, look at the shoulders.... you might see something familiar.



lol at the uniform, mine are folded up in the corner of my closet, if I never put that horrible Class A jacket on again, it will be too soon.  When did you go? I was PM class 9 09/07-10/08. 

So this isn't a total hijack, to the OP, If I were looking for B employment in LAco, I would go Care or McCormick. I worked for Care for 2 years and it was a good experience, solid company with 1st rate equipment. Working P/B is cool, but most places you will not be allowed in the back to do pt care unless you are on a BLS unit.


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## Sapphyre (Jun 1, 2009)

jgmedic said:


> lol at the uniform, mine are folded up in the corner of my closet, if I never put that horrible Class A jacket on again, it will be too soon.  When did you go? I was PM class 9 09/07-10/08.



Ahhh, we may have run into each other.  I was Spring '08, Wednesdays.


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## ochacon80 (Jun 23, 2009)

PeterB said:


> So after reading all of your posts and encouragement, I applied at AMR, McCormick, Care, Gerber, Schaefer, and APT.
> 
> So Gerber calls me back right away. I go down there, and there are three guys sitting in a room taking a test. Two are in business attire, one in jeans. I was dressed professionally, as they told me. So I start the written test, but its hard to concentrate because the HR lady is talking the entire time. She tells us our possible scheduling, hours, all this stuff. She gives us candy during the test, funny lady. So I pass the written test, and I go outside for the physical. We GS carried one of the other job candidates across the parking lot. Plus we lifted a guy on a backboard from the ground six times in a row. Easy.
> So I go back inside, and the HR lady tells me I DIDN'T PASS THE WRITTEN TEST. She says the last question is a scenario. It says "Write in Essay form the procedure." I wrote it sort of an essay, sort of an outline, so it would be clear what the procedures are, PENMAN, AVPU, ABC's, etc. I didn't think it was correct to write a STORY! So I said to her, "Excuse me?" She said sorry but we have to follow directions. I watched the guy in jeans go to the next step of filling out a schedule request, and the other guys that scored lower than me on the multiple choice test, and I left.
> ...




Sorry for bumping this thread, but I find this funny. I know the HR woman your talking about, she is quite the card to say the least. I have four friends who have left Gerber due to "broken promises" I chose to stay away because during recruiting I asked if my school schedule would be a problem, even went as far as to give them a 90 day detailed schedule. She looked it over and told me it wouldn't be a problem, that if I went to Mccormick it would be, but not with Gerber. I took there tests, passed them all, when it came time for final interview they put up a fuss about my schedule. I explained to them that THEIR recruiter told me it was no issue, they responded with " you were misinformed." 

They wanted me to take time off from school, I told then no, and said thank you and left.


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## PeterB (Jun 23, 2009)

*Here's the latest*

I am not sure about putting all these Ambulance company names on here, but anyway. 

I finally went down to McCormick in person, PeskyFish and a couple of others told me to go down there in person. So I did, and finally I will have an interview this Wednesday. Written, Physical, Skills, the usual.
Then Care called me! Finally!! I have an interview there on Friday morning. 

So I am pretty happy that at least something is happening. I feel like I am forgetting stuff. I am studying again.

Oh and I went down to Schaefer twice, and called three times. They said they have my app and will call me.

Thanks for all the tips, people!!!

Peter


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## peskyfish (Jun 23, 2009)

Good luck with the interview on Friday Peter. Hope to see you around in McCormick land!


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## MMTG (Jun 24, 2009)

Peter,
good luck with getting the experience you desire! In my experience, working in LACoFD jurisdictions has been a blessing-I grew up here in the East SGV. Working in the area I live is a great benefit as it was easier to train, learn and better myself as an EMT.

Having worked for the same private ambulance company for the 4 yrs, I have good memories(partners/crazy calls) as well as horror stories similar to many here running 911 in LACo...

 You either treat every day working on a BLS rig like the field training it is or you become bitter at FF's PM's for the position they're in and you're not...

I've come to appreciate "paying my dues" and feel that when I'm on scene first, my partner and I can handle anything were presented with until The engine/squad show up.

Yes the pay is brutal(In 'n' Out burger flippers make waaaay more than me) but if you're a good EMT,chances are you'll be a good paramedic.

 Lots of slackers,crybabies, and bitter EMT's are employed by various private ambulance companies her in  LACo...It's up to you, and only you if you want to join their ranks,OR, better yourself/situation.


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## JPINFV (Jun 24, 2009)

MMTG said:


> Yes the pay is brutal(In 'n' Out burger flippers make waaaay more than me)



Yea, but In-N-Out is an outlier with the quality of food, customer service, and their employees' ability to speak English.


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## PeterB (Jun 26, 2009)

terrible one said:


> where are you located? if you really want good experience stay out of LA county. the FD runs everything and you are nothing more than a gurney jockey. if you can make a commute id go to San Bernadino, Riverside, Ventura, or Kern County. you can get 1 on 1 with a medic, instead of being a taxi for LA county FD.
> 
> and I did two years at Schafer, and two at McCormick. all 911 companies are basically the same in LA, maybe a lil different pay/equipment but in the end you wont learn much (other than how to BLS ALS calls and cut corners)


Thanks, Terrible One. I am going to Ventura today, I will apply to Gold Coast Ambulance there. I think its a very interesting idea what you mentioned, I am definitely looking into it. I have no problem driving for one hour to a job if it means a lot more experience.

Peter


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## PeterB (Jun 28, 2009)

*Tomorrow I interview with Care Ambulance*

I didn't make it to Gold Coast Ambulance in Ventura yet. Got there too late. 

Tomorrow, Monday, I have an interview with Care Ambulance in Anaheim. On the email they sent me it seems like a lot of testing to be hired. Any comments or tips would be appreciated. I am nervous as always. 

Peter


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## jgmedic (Jun 29, 2009)

Care's testing is not too bad. when I worked there it was a 50-question written, a skills test kind NR-style(although there was no absolute fail pts.) and a panel interview. IIRC, there were about 12 of us who tested and they hired 7 or 8. Think about this though, do you want to work for a company that has standards or one who will take any one with a cert and a pulse? I loved it there for 2 years, and if I had to work any ambo job in OC or LACo as a basic it would be with them. Good luck!


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## terrible one (Jun 29, 2009)

PeterB said:


> Thanks, Terrible One. I am going to Ventura today, I will apply to Gold Coast Ambulance there. I think its a very interesting idea what you mentioned, I am definitely looking into it. I have no problem driving for one hour to a job if it means a lot more experience.
> 
> Peter



No problem. I have many friends at Gold Coast. Great place to learn as a beginner. They only run the city of Oxnard, (busiest in Ventura Co) and the FD is all BLS so if you can get in and work with a medic you will learn a lot. Also the company pays for you to attend paramedic school if you choose to.

Good luck if you have any questions feel free to P/M me


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## PeterB (Jul 6, 2009)

*Here's the latest*

So I diidn't get hired at Care. I did well on the written test, and the interview. I think I blew the skills test, not sure. My first "patient" was a boy with lower left leg bleeding, non-arterial. I put direct pressure on it, the proctor said "still bleeding." So I put pressure on the femoral artery. Still bleeding. So I elevated. Still bleeding. Then he said, "what's next?" I said, "transport code 3." He hesitated, I know he wanted to help me but he cant. I said, "tourniquet?". He said ok. BUT I THOUGHT WE NEVER PUT ON A TOURNIQUET! So we never learned that in class. I was nervous, the tourniquet had some sort of twisty thing on it. Then I said I would check pedal pulse. I think that was wrong. Anyway, Care emailed me and said no. They said during the hiring process that all new employees work at IFT's only for six months, then 911. 
So that's that. I am still looking, 8 weeks after graduating. McCormick, AMR, and Schaefer say they could hire me any day. 
So I went and applied at FirstMed, a strictly IFT company in North Hollywood, and Metropolitan in Glendale. I have read on here that it might be a blessing in disguise to work IFT's to work on my assessment skills. 
I am going to check on Gold Coast today. 
Any tips on how to move this process along, I would appreciate. 

Peter


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## atropine (Jul 6, 2009)

Why don't you apply for LAFD, it's a great place to work for.


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## Sapphyre (Jul 6, 2009)

atropine said:


> Why don't you apply for LAFD, it's a great place to work for.



They also just cut their budget, and subsquently round filed a bunch of tests/applications. 

(no, I'm not bitter, don't want to be a hose jockey, I know someone that happened too)


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## AnthonyM83 (Jul 7, 2009)

PeterB said:


> I am still looking, 8 weeks after graduating. McCormick, AMR, and Schaefer say they could hire me any day.
> So I went and applied at FirstMed, a strictly IFT company in North Hollywood, and Metropolitan in Glendale. I have read on here that it might be a blessing in disguise to work IFT's to work on my assessment skills.



What do you mean they could hire you any day? As in you passed their hiring process, but you're on a waiting list? Or they said they have open spots, so you're free to apply anytime?

There can definitely be a lot of benefits to working IFTs. As far as fast tracking it, I'd ask every company when you should expect to hear back from them, then call them on that day, then keep calling often. If you want to be a FF, sure apply to LAFD now, but expect that to take a few years...do it to get the process going, not to get a job right now.

As far as the bleeding scenario with the tourniquet, where did you go to EMT school? Some instructors (for some reason) still think you can't do a TQ in Los Angeles...


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## terrible one (Jul 7, 2009)

atropine said:


> Why don't you apply for LAFD, it's a great place to work for.



LAFD is on a hiring freeze atleast for another year


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## Shishkabob (Jul 7, 2009)

PeterB said:


> BUT I THOUGHT WE NEVER PUT ON A TOURNIQUET! So we never learned that in class.



Take a look at the new National Registry skills as of January.  Direct pressure and if that doesn't work, go straight to TQ.

Evidence in Iraq and Afghanistan pointed to the ineffectiveness of pressure points and elevation in major bleeding.


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## PeterB (Jul 24, 2009)

*Well, I got hired!!!*

Hey everyone, I got hired, finally at a 911 company!!!

I applied at 6 different 911 companies, and several IFT companies as well, so I am very excited to finally get the call. According to what several of you have told me, I shouldn't say the name of the company I work for, for several reasons. But if you send me a private message I will tell you.

Thanks everyone for the help and encouragement. I will put some stories down and questions, when I start training on Monday.

Peter B


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