# Filtered Needle Question



## Elk Oil (Jul 13, 2011)

I read another thread about the use of filtered needles and thought it was pretty good.  One more question on the subject, if I may:

I was told we don't need to use filtered needles to draw from ampules because any glass particles will settle to the bottom.  :excl:

This confuses me and personally, I believe we really need to use filtered needles because of two reasons.  First, it simply seems risky to me to not use them.  Filtered needles were created for a reason, and it seems logical that glass particles can be drawn up.  Second, unless I've been taught or trained otherwise, I won't have a defensible reason if I ever cause harm by not using one. 

I mean... if you ever cause detriment with this practice, how do you possibly explain your way out of it???  :sad:


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## abckidsmom (Jul 13, 2011)

Elk Oil said:


> I read another thread about the use of filtered needles and thought it was pretty good.  One more question on the subject, if I may:
> 
> I was told we don't need to use filtered needles to draw from ampules because any glass particles will settle to the bottom.  :excl:
> 
> ...



Yep, you're right.  The filtered needle is for drawing from ampules.


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## Tommerag (Jul 13, 2011)

Elk Oil said:


> I mean... if you ever cause detriment with this practice, how do you possibly explain your way out of it???  :sad:



You cant. If your company uses glass ampules there's no reason they shouldn't have filtered needles.


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## Leanne (Jul 13, 2011)

We were told in theory that you could draw from the ampule holding it upside down. I haven't tried it so not sure if that is true or not.


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## TransportJockey (Jul 13, 2011)

Leanne said:


> We were told in theory that you could draw from the ampule holding it upside down. I haven't tried it so not sure if that is true or not.



It works just fine. That's how I draw up epi and narcan since my service doesn't carry filter needles (and neither did my old one in Texas or my old hospital) 

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk


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## parapaulieFL (Jul 14, 2011)

*??*

Ive been in the field 10 years and never had an issue and I've always tipped up the amps like they teach in school. Ive actually never heard of glass shards in the amps. If that was a real big issue I don't imagine they would stay on the market.


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## Elk Oil (Jul 14, 2011)

I did some Googling and found an interesting study...


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## Elk Oil (Jul 14, 2011)

...that discusses the need for filtered needles...


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## Elk Oil (Jul 14, 2011)

http://classic.aacn.org/aacn/practice.nsf/a40dd285cb9efd8e8825669e00031e21/69d2c30ba9fa866c88256754006d7cde?OpenDocument


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## Elk Oil (Jul 14, 2011)

Sorry about that -- I had to have at least five posts before posting the link.


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## mycrofft (Jul 14, 2011)

*Cool reference and resourceful posting*

Note study referred to was only for IV admin. Other studies show that a particulate filter downstream from any IV solution bag can be stopping particulates which occur as a result of manufacturing and filling. Since we aren't dropping them by the dozens, it must get by somehow, but if we can prevent damage, we ought to. (Blood is a whole different critter).

 I had a hard time persuading my service to adopt filter needles, then my co-workers were sometimes guilty of not switching the needle out for a "smooth bore" one. Now, no more glass amps except epi.

PS: IV and subQ drug abusers often inject *much* larger quantities of inert material such as talc, and exhibit so-called sterile "silver dollar" abcesses in their muscles, and in some cases talc deposits visible on xray (as glass would not).


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## Farmer2DO (Jul 14, 2011)

I'm not sure why glass ampules are even used anymore.  I wish they would just do away with them all together.


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## parapaulieFL (Jul 14, 2011)

*cool*



Elk Oil said:


> http://classic.aacn.org/aacn/practice.nsf/a40dd285cb9efd8e8825669e00031e21/69d2c30ba9fa866c88256754006d7cde?OpenDocument



Thanks for the link. That is some very good info...


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## zzyzx (Jul 14, 2011)

Does anyone know why glass ampules are even used in the first place? Why not a  1-ml vial for, say, epi, rather than an ampule?


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## usafmedic45 (Jul 14, 2011)

zzyzx said:


> Does anyone know why glass ampules are even used in the first place? Why not a  1-ml vial for, say, epi, rather than an ampule?


Ease of manufacture mostly.


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## MrBrown (Jul 14, 2011)

We have filtered needles (draw up) for brown glass ampoules, oh God how Brown hates glass ampoules


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## Elk Oil (Jul 14, 2011)

zzyzx said:


> Does anyone know why glass ampules are even used in the first place? Why not a  1-ml vial for, say, epi, rather than an ampule?



The thing that confuses me is that they do make epi vials.  I don't get it, either.  If you have the choice, why oh why would you buy the amps?  :unsure:


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## usafmedic45 (Jul 14, 2011)

Elk Oil said:


> The thing that confuses me is that they do make epi vials.  I don't get it, either.  If you have the choice, why oh why would you buy the amps?  :unsure:


They are cheap and honestly I've never had a problem while using them.


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## 8jimi8 (Jul 14, 2011)

The standard of care, is to use a filtered needle with glass ampules


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## Akulahawk (Jul 14, 2011)

8jimi8 said:


> The standard of care, is to use a filtered needle with glass ampules


Yep. Of course the fix is to not use glass ampules unless you absolutely must. Because of cost reasons ($1.65 per amp of epi) it's cheaper to use those than to crack open a 30 mg vial and use that maybe once before you have to consider it expired. It's not that hard to remember to use one needle to draw from and another for injection - especially if the two look very different...


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## usafmedic45 (Jul 14, 2011)

> especially if the two look very different...



....and if one has a blunt tip.  "Why won't this thing go in?" *stabs patient even harder*


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## 8jimi8 (Jul 14, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> ....and if one has a blunt tip.  "Why won't this thing go in?" *stabs patient even harder*



uhh.. TWSS?


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## Anjel (Jul 14, 2011)

Lmfao


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## usalsfyre (Jul 14, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> ....and if one has a blunt tip.  "Why won't this thing go in?" *stabs patient even harder*



I watched a medic give an IM injection of thiamine with the metal part of a Twinpack one day :blink:...good times


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## TransportJockey (Jul 15, 2011)

usalsfyre said:


> I watched a medic give an IM injection of thiamine with the metal part of a Twinpack one day :blink:...good times



Ow... just ow..


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## mycrofft (Jul 15, 2011)

*Irrigation needles*

Hey, try drawing Rocephin with a filter needle then try to give the injection with it? Builds thumb muscles.


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## cfd3091 (Jul 18, 2011)

Elk Oil said:


> Sorry about that -- I had to have at least five posts before posting the link.


 Ha, been there did the same thing


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