# McCormick vs AMR/AMR vs McCormick



## Tony Maximilian (Jun 14, 2017)

Forgive me if this has been covered elsewhere on the forum... I'm interested in learning more about AMR & McCormick, specifically how they compare in terms of *starting pay*, *benefits*, *availability of 911 work vs mandatory IFT*, *24-hour shift availablity*, *employee satisfaction*, *reputation*, *uniform allowance*,* length of orientation/field training period*, etc. Reps from AMR spoke to my class but none from McCormick. I know things like 24s/911 work tend to be seniority based...

I recently completed a four-month EMT program at a local college in L.A. County and just last week passed the NREMT. Currently awaiting my LA Co license. My ultimate goal is medic school sometime in 2018. Any info or suggestions on where to look for answers would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance!


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## CALEMT (Jun 14, 2017)

If end goal is paramedic I'd go AMR. At least you can reclass and transfer to a different county and work as a medic.


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## wtferick (Jun 14, 2017)

Just be aware that AMR lost most of Of there LA 911 contracts.


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## Jim37F (Jun 14, 2017)

McCormick starting pay is currently minimum wage. I got a 3% pay bump after a year (works out to 30 something cents) for having a good eval, apparently, the 3% was the max yearly bump, but we'll see how that changes with the changes to the county and state minimum wage laws.

However, despite the low pay, the biggest draw for new EMTs coming to McCormick over places like AMR or Care is the fact that everyone runs virtually 100% 911 calls. There is some IFTs, but it's more like one once in a while. We have no IFT only units. Even the medic units are in the 911 rotation (where they run as a BLS unit due to the County EMS politics we all know and love). Even as a new employee on a day car, you'll still run tons more 911 calls than IFTs.

New employees typically start off on 12 hour "Day Cars" (though roughly half of them are actually 11 1/2 hours long and the rest are a full 12 hours, with no apparent rhyme or reason I've ever been able to figure out for the difference), though there's always openings on the station based 24 hour units. Once you clear training you can pick up overtime at any opening at any station to your hearts content essentially.....if you manage to catch the schedule as it's posted, you may even be able to snag an OT shift on one of the coveted Malibu units! (though openings on those are......less rare than down in busier areas such as Willowbrook or Lynwood or Hawthorne lol). They've changed the rule recently but I do believe it's currently after 3 months you can start to bid on stations. (Just be aware that while you can bid on Malibu stations 19 and 20.....you're bid will be in the back of a loooonnnggg line of other bids for those coveted spots, you'll have much more luck bidding somewhere like Ladera Heights, less busy then down in Inglewood, but still not known as a "vacation station" lol. I have a shift bid in for our West Hollywood station (Station 4), I placed that one maybe 6 months ago now? Word is there's still a couple people in line in front of me for when openings there occur)

You don't really hear too much of people leaving for other ambulance companies. Unless you're talking about people who get their medic then leave for somewhere like AMR Ventura or Rancho or the like. So I guess there's not much of any widespread dissatisfaction problems. Now, of course, you get a room of us together we can ***** and gripe and complain about the company all day long if you let us lol, but honestly, that's really gonna be true no matter where you go. After being here a little longer than a year I only know of one person who left for another ambulance company (Care) who wasn't fired first and everyone else I know that has plans to leave, those plans all involve either going Fire, or Police or Nursing or PA or Med school....so unlike some other companies I've worked for in the past, there's not really any exodus of people getting hired than fleeing for other companies after a few months lol

New hire orientation (at least at the time I went through) is 5 days long, mostly classroom stuff with a  skills day, then you get assigned to an FTO and you work 5 shifts (12 hours) on their shift as a third rider doing Field Training. Then you have to pass a policy test and a mapping test. Pass those and you get assigned to a shift, wherever they need you at that time. You'll be an "Attendant Only" i.e. not allowed to drive for the first 3 to 6 months until they have an EVOC class (classroom plus cone course) then you find an FTO and do 3 drivers training shifts before you're allowed to drive.


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## VentMonkey (Jun 14, 2017)

Or you can just move to Bakersfield and have Hall front it all. Boom, Kern Co. Cult out!


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## CALEMT (Jun 14, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Kern Co. Cult out!



I knew you guys would find your way into this thread.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 14, 2017)

wtferick said:


> Just be aware that AMR lost most of Of there LA 911 contracts.



Thanks. I'm aware. But my preference would be for their Antelope Valley division, for which they've maintained their 911 contract.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 14, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Or you can just move to Bakersfield and have Hall front it all. Boom, Kern Co. Cult out!



Haha. Relocating won't really be an option for at least the next couple of years.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 14, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> McCormick starting pay is currently minimum wage. I got a 3% pay bump after a year (works out to 30 something cents) for having a good eval, apparently, the 3% was the max yearly bump, but we'll see how that changes with the changes to the county and state minimum wage laws.
> 
> However, despite the low pay, the biggest draw for new EMTs coming to McCormick over places like AMR or Care is the fact that everyone runs virtually 100% 911 calls. There is some IFTs, but it's more like one once in a while. We have no IFT only units. Even the medic units are in the 911 rotation (where they run as a BLS unit due to the County EMS politics we all know and love). Even as a new employee on a day car, you'll still run tons more 911 calls than IFTs.
> 
> ...



Thanks, Jim! This was incredibly helpful. I actually know the Inglewood/Ladera/Windsor Hills areas quite well owing to family nearby. Given that my ultimate goal is medic school, I'd ideally like to work in an area where I'm busy and have the chance to use as full a range of my skills as postsible, so no "vacation stations". Incidentally, how would you rate the relationship between McCormick EMTs and LA Co medics?


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## VentMonkey (Jun 14, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Haha. Relocating won't really be an option for at least the next couple of years.


I did not go to school here, and am from the greater Los Angeles area as well. It's still a remarkable opportunity if you can get in. @NPO can elaborate, but get experience for the next couple of years then apply.

For what it's worth, I did my time with "The Borg", and while it certainly beats most any other place, this has to be as good as it gets for California privates, let alone, single-roles and those striving to pursue the art of the clinician in_ this state_.

Our East Kern units seen plenty of AV AMR folk in and around AVMC and PRMC, and they're typically every bit the stereotype of the "salty", and often slovenly-looking crews.


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## VentMonkey (Jun 15, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> how would you rate the relationship between McCormick EMTs and LA Co medics?


@Jim37F can clarify if it's changed or not, but having lived in, and around Los Angeles for ~30 years of my life not much ever changes.

I have worked every area Jimbo is telling you about with a few exceptions (Inglewood, and Hawthorne specifically). There was a time when AMR literally had the entire county in the palm of its hands in regards to LACoFD EOA's. In typical AMR fashion they mucked it up.

The relationships vary from crew to crew, division to division, day to day, aura to aura, etc., etc., etc. I just saw an AMR crew with a county squad at Mayo our last rotation and they looked every bit as thrilled as ever, so ya.

That said more often than not the squaddies weren't the nicest people to be around, or directly learn from; indirectly I learned way more. And yes, this would include guys in Athens, Ladera, E. LA, Pico, South Gate, Malibu, Calabasas, WeHo, Carson, La Mirada.

We even had every non-transport fire contract (Santa Monica, Vernon was staffed with our paramedics, SFS-FD, Long Beach had a BLS contract with AMR pre-AO program). It used to be fun because you could work any division in any of their areas from Glendale to Irwindale, Carson to Cerritos. Do a coveted Dodger stand-by for OT, or learn another divisions area (this was fun to piss the squads off with at 3 a.m. when you didn't know how to get around).

The AV, and Santa Clarita divisions have always kind of kept to their own though since they're sort of the vestigial part of LA County. All in all it made for a lot of good "stories", and what and how I never wanted to be as a paramedic. Like my buddy @gonefishing likes to say- those were way different times...


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## gonefishing (Jun 15, 2017)

If relocation is an issue, PM me. I know plenty with extra rooms or couch space they would rent.  Tread lightly with the borg army aka AMR.  They are treading on very thin ice as seeing Envision health who is the owner behind the curtain is looking to offload AMR.  McCormick no offense to any one like Jim and a few others ive met over the years, is full of jr fire fighters.  Doing the job waiting to get their number called while making minimum wage.  Yes you are getting great exposure but their are a few bad squaddies out their that do not play nice with their emts.   Alot of great teachers in the league and those you tend to find in the deep south of LA.  If you want exposure, great pay, a great boss, a great ems system, paramedic school sponsorship go North young man, go Hall.  Times in LA county have changed from once they used to be.  

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## Nick15 (Jun 15, 2017)

I currently work in the San Gabriel valley division for amr, but have worked a few times in AV. Its definitely a different atmosphere up there and more of a team aspect from the other employees to even the fire guys. In the few shifts I worked there I learned more and did more skills with fire or as an emt than I have in a little over a year in San Gabe. I'm not giving SGV a bad rap, but you can become a victim of complacency. I've had to catch myself at times because of it and you can get tired of running on so many bogus calls and always having to transport. So if you want to, go to AV I recommend it. I think that's one of the better divisions that AMR has in la county right now. Otherwise look at Ventura county. Not sure if they're hiring emts right now, but it's a better system than la and amr is the primary care provider on scene. 


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## VentMonkey (Jun 15, 2017)

Nick15 said:


> I currently work in the San Gabriel valley division for amr, but have worked a few times in AV. Its definitely a different atmosphere up there and more of a team aspect from the other employees to even the fire guys. In the few shifts I worked there I learned more and did more skills with fire or as an emt than I have in a little over a year in San Gabe. So if you want to, go to AV I recommend it. I think that's one of the better divisions that AMR has in la county right now.


When you say San Gabe do you mean Irwindale? No doubt AMR still has halfway decent divisions, none of which are in Los Angeles, and here is why: LACoFD.

Are their good apples? Absolutely, but the bunch sure seems to spoils even them. Their general approach to "medicine" is deplorable, their lack of empathy is atrocious, their habits leave much to be desired. You will pick up their habits, and culture, I did...then had to grow up and unlearn much of it. I had to re-learn to be a better provider. 

When you're division bends over backwards to keep an EOA for a service that shows no sense of promise, improvement, or EBM, let alone desire that speaks volumes.

Again, this is regardless of the LA division you are in. You don't know what you don't know until you know it, often by living it. If you want an AMR division in SoCal--> Santa Barbara (more Central California), Ventura, RivCo, and if you're desperate San Bernardino. Riverside was a lot of fun, and I would have been ok working there but it wasn't in my cards.

This whole "AMR is in charge of the scene in such and such other county" isn't exactly true, regardless of the policies, or protocols. You're still running with ALS departments, some of whom have their own _modus operandi. 
_
Honestly speaking, if relocating is that big of an issue, CARE is probably your better option. McCormick seems ok as well, but just go in knowing you will mostly see things that has no real purpose in any other part of the EMS world of medicine other than in Los Angeles. 

I will say this, OP. I very much miss the laxed environment of my area, and the amenities, but as a career paramedic I have no regrets. So yeah, you can drive the same amount of time it will take you to get from the SFV to the CARE or McCormick areas/ stations that it would going north on the I-5 to the 99. What I am saying is it's a no-brainer, IMO.

-VM


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## gonefishing (Jun 15, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> When you say San Gabe do you mean Irwindale? No doubt AMR still has halfway decent divisions, none of which are in Los Angeles, and here is why: LACoFD.
> 
> Are their good apples? Absolutely, but the bunch sure seems to spoils even them. Their general approach to "medicine" is deplorable, their lack of empathy is atrocious, their habits leave much to be desired. You will pick up their habits, and culture, I did...then had to grow up and unlearn much of it. I had to re-learn to be a better provider.
> 
> ...


Better times......
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





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## Nick15 (Jun 15, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> When you say San Gabe do you mean Irwindale? No doubt AMR still has halfway decent divisions, none of which are in Los Angeles, and here is why: LACoFD.
> 
> Are their good apples? Absolutely, but the bunch sure seems to spoils even them. Their general approach to "medicine" is deplorable, their lack of empathy is atrocious, their habits leave much to be desired. You will pick up their habits, and culture, I did...then had to grow up and unlearn much of it. I had to re-learn to be a better provider.
> 
> ...



I agree with you vent. I'm not defending amr at all with anything. Right now I feel a tad embarrassed to be associated with the area I work at at times because of what they're trying to do to keep the area without any different promises at all. 
Yes the problem is la county fire, and I honestly am thankful every day I pull into work because none of my family lives in la county at all. I would be very worried if they did. 
But you are right, some of the amr operations are leaps and bounds better than others. 


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## Nick15 (Jun 15, 2017)

But to get back to the topic for the op, get hired wherever you feel is best for you. We are just here to offer you suggestions haha. I know when I was in your place when I got hired I used this forum to look for the best possible place to get hired at that fit for me. 


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## CALEMT (Jun 15, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Riverside



Yeah we're legit out here in Riverside.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 15, 2017)

I'm very much appreciative of all the insight and feedback shared here. Tricky waters to navigate indeed, but my first priority is (and hopefully always will be) providing excellent, compassionate patient care. That said, yeah, some companies do seem slightly 'better' than others, at least from the perspective of a newbie EMT still on the outside looking in.

To clarify, I'm not above relocating, despite being a dyed-in-the-wool big city urbanite. I do, however, have some unwell relations which is why I need to remain in or near LA Co for the next couple of years. I'm certainly open to relocating out-of-area if I can find a company willing to invest in me; sponsorship or subsidisation of medic school is something I am VERY much interested in (especially given I have absolutely zero interest in ever becoming a firefighter).

I asked about the working relationship of LA Co medics with various companies' EMTs given my relatively few personal observations. I'm well aware that people can be and are quite different. And in the course of two 14-hour ridealongs, I was treated to displays paramedic professionalism and deportment that ran the gamut from compassionate to patients/respectful to EMTs/helpful to ridealongs to the complete opposite extreme -- rude to patients/dismissive to EMTs/visibly & vocally annoyed by the mere presence of a ride-along. Still, I refuse to let a few arrogant and dismissive LA Co medics dissuade me from becoming a paramedic myself or from working for certain companies or in certain areas. I used to work in the performing arts; I know how to deal with _prima donas_. But I still think back to some of the disgruntled scuttlebutt I've heard over the past few months: 'Medics hate Care EMTs because they just stand around waiting to be told what to do', 'medics working with EMTs in the AV are far more patient and helpful than medics in Santa Clarita', etc, etc. Hard to know what to filter out and what to investigate further...


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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> I'm certainly open to relocating out-of-area if I can find a company willing to invest in me; sponsorship or subsidisation of medic school is something I am VERY much interested in



AMR Riverside, Hemet, and Palm Springs divisions are offering scholarships for medic school at NCTI, Moreno Valley College, and Crafton Hills College.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> AMR Riverside, Hemet, and Palm Springs divisions are offering scholarships for medic school at NCTI, Moreno Valley College, and Crafton Hills College.



Good to know. Thanks! Do you happen to know what the 'stings' are, like repayment, minimum contract following school, etc?


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## gonefishing (Jun 16, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Good to know. Thanks! Do you happen to know what the 'stings' are, like repayment, minimum contract following school, etc?


Hall Ambulance will do just the same.

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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> minimum contract following school



3 year commitment, if you break your commitment then obviously you repay what you owe. I can't give all the details (Im part time putting myself through medic school). All I know is they'll probably be running scholarships for the foreseeable future in RivCo.



gonefishing said:


> Hall Ambulance will do just the same.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk



He doesn't want the Kern Co. Cult ok!


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## gonefishing (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> 3 year commitment, if you break your commitment then obviously you repay what you owe. I can't give all the details (Im part time putting myself through medic school). All I know is they'll probably be running scholarships for the foreseeable future in RivCo.
> 
> 
> 
> He doesn't want the Kern Co. Cult ok!


LOL! When it comes to company health, Hall is superior in comparison.

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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

gonefishing said:


> LOL! When it comes to company health, Hall is superior in comparison.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk



Until all the cult members drink the funny drink or take the funny pill and next thing you know y'all are national headlines. "Cult mass killing in California"


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## gonefishing (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> Until all the cult members drink the funny drink or take the funny pill and next thing you know y'all are national headlines. "Cult mass killing in California"


LOL ?????? Jones Town? LOL
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 16, 2017)

You guys are cracking me up over here. Much needed.


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## Amberlamps916 (Jun 16, 2017)

This whole "AMR is in charge of the scene in such and such other county" isn't exactly true, regardless of the policies, or protocols. You're still running with ALS departments, some of whom have their own _modus operandi._

-VM[/QUOTE]

It is true for Santa Barbara at least. 6 out of the 9 fire departments are BLS. And the departments that are ALS have nowhere near the large egos as their compatriots down south so it's an interesting change from someone who as worked in other areas.

Also, no MICNs


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## VentMonkey (Jun 16, 2017)

This is just getting weird. Anyhow, I've been around both company's to know which is the better choice. It has nothing to do with water, or drinks lol it's company (i.e., employee) investments.

AMR is not a bad option, and @Nick15 I would never be ashamed of where I worked per se. It's mostly the politics tied to the EMS within that county, and AMR like CARE and McCormick who are merely playing the game. The nurse and fire unions strengths and presence are remarkably prevalent there.

Back to your original question: again, when I started it was still Westmed/ McCormick and they were in the middle of a transition and acquisition. They've since become a 911 workhorse for their county contract. I don't know how realistically sustainable this is from a "keep the lights on standpoint" though.

IFT pays the bills plain and simple and to say or think that 911 is where it's at is an all too common misconceived notion. It seems neat, and fun, and thrilling, and exciting...until it's not and you're losing your hearing, and/ or finding ways to avoid having to listen to those damn things in your ears while going to the address of a patient who's address you already know and complaint you can recite; sad, really.

Anyhow, in LA if you want "fire calls" go CARE (seems easiest to get on with), AMR and McCormick open up frequently also. If not there are a few decent IFT only companies where you could learn some good stuff doing CCT and picking the CCT nurses brain as well. This is actually an excellent, and often overlooked option as well.

@Addrobo no MICN's huh? That's pretty interesting. Who answers the radio, the attending? Or are you all just working off of off-line protocols?


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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

Addrobo said:


> Also, no MICNs



That's interesting. Curious on how that works. 

OP, I joke about hall but it's a good company to work for. However, if you're gonna work in LACo. as a EMT and no offense to Jim but go AMR. At least when your get your paramedic you can transfer within AMR to a different county.


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## VentMonkey (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> if you're gonna work in LACo. as a EMT at least when your get your paramedic you can transfer within AMR to a different county.


100% this, though I would still opt for Ventura or Santa Barbara AMR. Two words: beach weather. Again, another no brainer, IMO.


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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Two words: *better protocols*. Again, another no brainer, IMO.



Fixed.


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## VentMonkey (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> Fixed.


Eh, I vote beach weather over "better protocols" any day. Also, retirement trumps both.


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## CALEMT (Jun 16, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Eh, I vote beach weather over "better protocols" any day. Also, retirement trumps both.



Considering I'm a mountains and pine trees kinda guy beach weather is "eh". Retirement is #1 IMO.


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## Amberlamps916 (Jun 16, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> That's interesting. Curious on how that works.
> 
> OP, I joke about hall but it's a good company to work for. However, if you're gonna work in LACo. as a EMT and no offense to Jim but go AMR. At least when your get your paramedic you can transfer within AMR to a different county.




All five hospitals here are base hospitals with no MICNs. When we need orders, we talk to the physician directly. Per protocol, physician radio contact is mandatory for STEMIs and all AMAs. Everything else is just advising whichever nurse picks up the phone/radio of what is coming in.

It's really nice to have the ability to speak with a physician directly without jumping through hoops. Coming from a different area, it was almost impossible to do so.


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## DesertMedic66 (Jun 16, 2017)

Addrobo said:


> This whole "AMR is in charge of the scene in such and such other county" isn't exactly true, regardless of the policies, or protocols. You're still running with ALS departments, some of whom have their own _modus operandi._


When it is county protocol it certainly does help..


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## RocketMedic (Jun 17, 2017)

How is the pay in Santa Barbara?


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## Amberlamps916 (Jun 17, 2017)

RocketMedic said:


> How is the pay in Santa Barbara?




Really good for central/southern Cali. Not as good as the bay area but I'll take it for a not too busy system close to the beach (Just had 0 calls on my 24 hour overtime shift last night).

There are three shift types: 12 hour days, 12 hour nights with differential, and 24 hour.

You get credit for experience.


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## Daiawa (Jun 19, 2017)

Man this thread is making me incredibly thankful to be on the east coast. 

They way addrobo makes it seem, is that its a big deal for services out there to talk with a physician? Refusals here are done simply by an agreance between the crew, the only thing in our protocols we need on line med control for is to use Vec over Sux. If I want to do something that is out of my protocols, all I have to do is call on the radio and request a Dr. and one is there immediately. If you can present a valid reason of why you want to do what you want to do, they will almost always approve it, or converse with you and look at an alternative. FD and EMS all get along and there's no pissing matches about what scene is who's.

Our EMT's start at 35K, couldn't imagine living on minimum wage in CA.


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## Tony Maximilian (Jun 19, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> IFT pays the bills plain and simple and to say or think that 911 is where it's at is an all too common misconceived notion. It seems neat, and fun, and thrilling, and exciting...until it's not and you're losing your hearing, and/ or finding ways to avoid having to listen to those damn things in your ears while going to the address of a patient who's address you already know and complaint you can recite; sad, really.
> 
> Anyhow, in LA if you want "fire calls" go CARE (seems easiest to get on with), AMR and McCormick open up frequently also. If not there are a few decent IFT only companies where you could learn some good stuff doing CCT and picking the CCT nurses brain as well. This is actually an excellent, and often overlooked option as well.



All fair and excellent points. But, for what it's worth, I'm not an adrenaline junky. I just want to keep the full range of my skills as sharp as possible for the year or two I'll be working as an EMT before medic school. I know EMTs working IFT sometimes end up with really interesting, challenging medical cases. But, to be blunt, most of the IFT companies I've looked into (at least locally) are either dialysis taxi services or primarily hospital discharge. (I'll not mention names here out of a desire not to burn potential bridges.) 

Great point about CCT. From what you know, about how long before a new EMT is able to do CCT, even occasionally?


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## VentMonkey (Jun 19, 2017)

Daiawa said:


> Man this thread is making me incredibly thankful to be on the east coast.
> 
> They way addrobo makes it seem, is that its a big deal for services out there to talk with a physician?


Eh, not really that big of a deal to talk with a doctor. Every county here is different. Los Angeles in the most notoriously archaic system bar none. And as he eluded to, there aren't pissing matches in every part of the state. 

Where I am, much like where he is, generally everyone gets along fine. I don't call for orders unless perhaps it's something that's rarely done, or seen that I may want coverage from my end on. 

Every state, city, system, county has issues. Read the _whole_ thread before responding next time.


Tony Maximilian said:


> From what you know, about how long before a new EMT is able to do CCT, even occasionally?


Re: fly-by-night IFT companies- this is nothing new.

As far as CCT work, it depends. Some of the more reputable heavy IFT companies probably contract for better/ higher acuity transfer cars, and (I would imagine) yield higher quality nurses with more experience, and better equipment. It's been a good while since I've been involved with that area so I couldn't give you any current companies other than those previously mentioned already, good luck.


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## TheComebacKid (Jun 21, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Or you can just move to Bakersfield and have Hall front it all. Boom, Kern Co. Cult out!



Give me a couple more months and I'll be putting in my medic app!


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## TheComebacKid (Jun 21, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> @Jim37F That said more often than not the squaddies weren't the nicest people to be around, or directly learn from



So much truth to this. Medics in LA county are either incredibly friendly or absolutely hate private EMTs (Although some private guys give them a good reason to) You truely learn what NOT to do by working along side county fire medics. They aren't all bad, but as someone who takes patient care and bedside manner to heart, they are some of the most laziest, inconsiderate jerks who do not deserve a blue card or belong anywhere near a tackle box.



gonefishing said:


> McCormick no offense to any one like Jim and a few others ive met over the years, is full of jr fire fighters.  Doing the job waiting to get their number called while making minimum wage.



I loved everything about working at McCormick except the other EMTs. The job was a lot of fun, but when I first started, all the inglewood and Lynwood guys would be holding the wall with unzipped boots, untucked shirts, trying to pull rank, talking about how the company ain't like it used to be and how they are the back bone of county fire. Then you walk into the Er bay to find a thick layer of grime and dirt on their ambulance with the inside cab littered with week old fast food bags and water bottles filled with dip spit. (Dipping on the job is hilarious since a majority of mccormick guys only started dipping because they saw county medics doing it and wanted to pick up their habits). Just like county medics, They aren't all bad (Jim37F was always an awesome and friendly dude when I worked in the South bay!) but there will always be the good and the bad.


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## Jim37F (Jun 21, 2017)

Fortunately most of "those guys"^ seem to be gone now (word has it management has quietly let go a lot of those old guard for various infractions over the last few months, personally I don't know anyone who got the boot, but I do know that with a bunch of recent new hire classes there is a bunch of openings in the schedule...)

Fortunately the new shiny red ambulances do have a bit of a psychological impact of "oooh new, better keep this brand new rig that belongs to me clean" vs some of the old rigs pushing 200k miles so full of old dents and dings it was like "why bother?" (My old frontline was kinda like that)

And while there's a few EMTs there i don't like (and one guy that if I saw I was scheduled to work with, if seriously consider calling off sick that day...) but for the most part it's the fellow EMTs that make it worth coming in to work, at least at my station haha.


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## gonefishing (Jun 21, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Fortunately most of "those guys"^ seem to be gone now (word has it management has quietly let go a lot of those old guard for various infractions over the last few months, personally I don't know anyone who got the boot, but I do know that with a bunch of recent new hire classes there is a bunch of openings in the schedule...)
> 
> Fortunately the new shiny red ambulances do have a bit of a psychological impact of "oooh new, better keep this brand new rig that belongs to me clean" vs some of the old rigs pushing 200k miles so full of old dents and dings it was like "why bother?" (My old frontline was kinda like that)
> 
> And while there's a few EMTs there i don't like (and one guy that if I saw I was scheduled to work with, if seriously consider calling off sick that day...) but for the most part it's the fellow EMTs that make it worth coming in to work, at least at my station haha.


You never answered me Jimbo, what happened to the station with the Jacuzzi tub? lol

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## Jim37F (Jun 21, 2017)

gonefishing said:


> You never answered me Jimbo, what happened to the station with the Jacuzzi tub? lol
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk


Hmmm.....I wish we had one at mine! lol but no I have no idea about any with such a nicety. Sounds like a Malibu thing lol, which also happens to be the only couple of stations I haven't yet visited up in that area lol but I have not run across one yet


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## gonefishing (Jun 21, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Hmmm.....I wish we had one at mine! lol but no I have no idea about any with such a nicety. Sounds like a Malibu thing lol, which also happens to be the only couple of stations I haven't yet visited up in that area lol but I have not run across one yet


LOL last time I knew it exsisted was around 2 years ago and I know the owner was looking to end the lease.

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## TheComebacKid (Jun 21, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Hmmm.....I wish we had one at mine! lol but no I have no idea about any with such a nicety. Sounds like a Malibu thing lol, which also happens to be the only couple of stations I haven't yet visited up in that area lol but I have not run across one yet



I can confirm that the Malibu and Zuma stations do not have hot tubs, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did at some point. Both of them are just beach houses fitted to accommodate two EMTs.


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## gonefishing (Jun 21, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> I can confirm that the Malibu and Zuma stations do not have hot tubs, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did at some point. Both of them are just beach houses fitted to accommodate two EMTs.


The station I speak of I believe is no longer used.  Owner wanted to end the leasing terms to sale off the property.

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## TheComebacKid (Jun 21, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Fortunately the new shiny red ambulances do have a bit of a psychological impact of "oooh new, better keep this brand new rig that belongs to me clean" vs some of the old rigs pushing 200k miles so full of old dents and dings it was like "why bother?" (My old frontline was kinda like that)



I honestly liked the White and Blue color scheme better. The red is just so bland with a skinny little grey stripe.


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## Jim37F (Jun 21, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> I honestly liked the White and Blue color scheme better. The red is just so bland with a skinny little grey stripe.


totally agree they needed to include a stripe down the middle, just look at the red Mercy rigs you see at the shop, those are alright, like you said, without it, ours are just kinda boring solid......and honestly the "ooh shiny new rig" would prob work just as well with the old color scheme....but in any case, I get to go wash and wax goldenrod yellow rigs now


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## VentMonkey (Jun 21, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> Give me a couple more months and I'll be putting in my medic app!


Good luck, feel free to PM me if you have any questions specifically.


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## TheComebacKid (Jun 21, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Good luck, feel free to PM me if you have any questions specifically.


Awesome, Thank you!


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## CALEMT (Jun 22, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> I get to go wash and wax goldenrod yellow rigs now



Sippin on mai tai's in board shorts I'm assuming?


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## Jim37F (Jun 22, 2017)

Not yet at least, hopefully soon! I'm thinking after I put in my 2 weeks I'll find a Space-A flight (when my schedule is a lot more flexible lol) to go apartment hunting


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## Jim37F (Jun 22, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> I honestly liked the White and Blue color scheme better. The red is just so bland with a skinny little grey stripe.


The black "PARAMEDIC" on RA504 helps, but yeah, still needs a stripe lol


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## Tony Maximilian (Jul 8, 2017)

Very last question for this thread: Anyone know if McCormick pay for a full 24-hour shift, regardless of call volume?


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## Jim37F (Jul 8, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Very last question for this thread: Anyone know if McCormick pay for a full 24-hour shift, regardless of call volume?


For 24 hour shifts. There's a designated sleep period from 11 (2300) to 0700.....any 5 uninterrupted hours in that time period and you only get paid for 22 hours. Doesn't matter if you've already ran 15 calls in the meantime. Conversely any call or move up, even if you immediately get cancelled and returned and even if that's your only call of the shift, and you get the full 24 hrs. Most shifts you'll end up paid the full 24 lol, especially the ones newbies get placed on lol


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## Tony Maximilian (Jul 8, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> For 24 hour shifts. There's a designated sleep period from 11 (2300) to 0700.....any 5 uninterrupted hours in that time period and you only get paid for 22 hours. Doesn't matter if you've already ran 15 calls in the meantime. Conversely any call or move up, even if you immediately get cancelled and returned and even if that's your only call of the shift, and you get the full 24 hrs. Most shifts you'll end up paid the full 24 lol, especially the ones newbies get placed on lol



Interesting. Thanks.


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## gonefishing (Jul 8, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> For 24 hour shifts. There's a designated sleep period from 11 (2300) to 0700.....any 5 uninterrupted hours in that time period and you only get paid for 22 hours. Doesn't matter if you've already ran 15 calls in the meantime. Conversely any call or move up, even if you immediately get cancelled and returned and even if that's your only call of the shift, and you get the full 24 hrs. Most shifts you'll end up paid the full 24 lol, especially the ones newbies get placed on lol


I'm pretty sure that violates CA labor law

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## DME107 (Jul 8, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Very last question for this thread: Anyone know if McCormick pay for a full 24-hour shift, regardless of call volume?


Care pays 24 out of 24 no matter what. I've ran 2 calls on a 24. I have to agree with @gonefishing. I'm pretty sure that violates state law..... Unless they pull that federal law trumps state law bull


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## GMCmedic (Jul 8, 2017)

DME107 said:


> Care pays 24 out of 24 no matter what. I've ran 2 calls on a 24. I have to agree with @gonefishing. I'm pretty sure that violates state law..... Unless they pull that federal law trumps state law bull



By bull you mean article VI of the  Constitution? That says when state law conflicts with federal law, federal law prevails. 



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## DME107 (Jul 9, 2017)

GMCmedic said:


> By bull you mean article VI of the  Constitution? That says when state law conflicts with federal law, federal law prevails.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


Yeah that stuff. Who cares about that.


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## Isaias Martinez Jr (Jul 11, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> McCormick starting pay is currently minimum wage. I got a 3% pay bump after a year (works out to 30 something cents) for having a good eval, apparently, the 3% was the max yearly bump, but we'll see how that changes with the changes to the county and state minimum wage laws.
> 
> However, despite the low pay, the biggest draw for new EMTs coming to McCormick over places like AMR or Care is the fact that everyone runs virtually 100% 911 calls. There is some IFTs, but it's more like one once in a while. We have no IFT only units. Even the medic units are in the 911 rotation (where they run as a BLS unit due to the County EMS politics we all know and love). Even as a new employee on a day car, you'll still run tons more 911 calls than IFTs.
> 
> ...




Hey Jim, thanks for the info. I just passed McCormick's map and written test. I have orrientation in 2 weeks. About that policy test. It's la county policy just like what we studied in emt school right?


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## Jim37F (Jul 11, 2017)

Isaias Martinez Jr said:


> Hey Jim, thanks for the info. I just passed McCormick's map and written test. I have orrientation in 2 weeks. About that policy test. It's la county policy just like what we studied in emt school right?


If you're asking about this policy test 





> New hire orientation (at least at the time I went through) is 5 days long, mostly classroom stuff with a skills day, then you get assigned to an FTO and you work 5 shifts (12 hours) on their shift as a third rider doing Field Training. *Then you have to pass a policy test and a mapping test.* Pass those and you get assigned to a shift, wherever they need you at that time.


Then it's a McCormick policy test on our own internal policys and procedures. Stuff like uniform standards (differences in Class A and B, etc) out of chute and response times, attendance, etc etc. You'll be given a policy book and go over everything in Orientation, but your FTO will expect you to be studying and know them cuz they'll quiz you on it, because you have to pass the test to clear training.


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## DME107 (Jul 11, 2017)

Isaias Martinez Jr said:


> Hey Jim, thanks for the info. I just passed McCormick's map and written test. I have orrientation in 2 weeks. About that policy test. It's la county policy just like what we studied in emt school right?



You still have to do a lift test, patient assessment and interview with Lucas. 

Then you go through orientation.... If I'm not mistaken.


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## Isaias Martinez Jr (Jul 11, 2017)

DME107 said:


> You still have to do a lift test, patient assessment and interview with Lucas.
> 
> Then you go through orientation.... If I'm not mistaken.




Okay thanks! Appreciate the feedback


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## Isaias Martinez Jr (Jul 11, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> If you're asking about this policy test Then it's a McCormick policy test on our own internal policys and procedures. Stuff like uniform standards (differences in Class A and B, etc) out of chute and response times, attendance, etc etc. You'll be given a policy book and go over everything in Orientation, but your FTO will expect you to be studying and know them cuz they'll quiz you on it, because you have to pass the test to clear training.




Oh okay. Thanks for the info


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## gonefishing (Aug 9, 2017)

More end of an Era.  Bowers, Schaefer (slowly dying) now they are gonna kill off McCormick.  Unbelievable.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





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## CALEMT (Aug 9, 2017)

gonefishing said:


> More end of an Era.  Bowers, Schaefer (slowly dying) now they are gonna kill off McCormick.  Unbelievable.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk


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## Mufasa556 (Aug 9, 2017)

Welcome to the family!!


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## DME107 (Aug 9, 2017)

Now my biggest question is what is amr gonna do with the Red rigs?


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## VentMonkey (Aug 9, 2017)

DME107 said:


> Now my biggest question is what is amr gonna do with the Red rigs?


Lol, clearly you're new to this- whatever they want. 

I think it's a sneaky, underhanded way to get back their EOA they once possessed known as their "South Bay" deployment; and some of their old Cerritos areas, too. Classic AMR stickin' it to the "LA County boys".

*A*h *M*y *R*ide is back in _the real_ LA County every bawdy!


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## DME107 (Aug 9, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Lol, clearly you're new to this- whatever they want.
> 
> I think it's a sneaky, underhanded way to get back their EOA they once possessed known as their "South Bay" deployment; and some of their old Cerritos areas, too. Classic AMR stickin' it to the "LA County boys".
> 
> *A*h *M*y *R*ide is back in _the real_ LA County every bawdy!



Clearly you didn't get the joke, but whatever...you old timers on this site are funny. 

It's obvious they only want mccormick because of the previously lost la county contracts. I'm sure in the end it's a good thing for current mccormick employees but what do I know.


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## gonefishing (Aug 9, 2017)

DME107 said:


> Clearly you didn't get the joke, but whatever...you old timers on this site are funny.
> 
> It's obvious they only want mccormick because of the previously lost la county contracts. I'm sure in the end it's a good thing for current mccormick employees but what do I know.


Well Jr alot of us saw what happened what the amr buy outs in the past and it didn't work out well.

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## DME107 (Aug 9, 2017)

gonefishing said:


> Well Jr alot of us saw what happened what the amr buy outs in the past and it didn't work out well.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk



Haha junior.... You have no idea who I am or how long I have been around. Keep talking old timer. 

AMR can and will do what it wants so why get all serious about it.


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## VentMonkey (Aug 9, 2017)

DME107 said:


> Haha junior.... You have no idea who I am or how long I have been around. Keep talking old timer.


Well, if you started at Liberty in LA, not that long, youngster. They were barely starting up when I got my medic, but that's really neither here nor there.


DME107 said:


> why get all serious about it.


I agree with this, but give fish a little respect. I don't know too many old timers calling themselves old timers. Don't be a tool.

Anyhow, unless they're contractually obligated to keep these units this scheme, they're known to re-paint with the classic AMR red, white, and blue. That said, it is a lucrative contract, so I don't see them not bending over to keep their contracts happy. Maybe you work there, maybe you know //shrugs//

Also, the McCormick HQ seen on their website sure looks a lot like AMR's old LA County dispatch center. If it is, well that sure smells like coincidence to this "fogie".


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

Nice knowing you mccormick. Enjoy those red rigs.

Discuss?


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## CALEMT (Aug 9, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> they're known to re-paint with the classic AMR red, white, and blue.



The old R/M units in SD are still red. AMR has red units in the So Cal area... well primarily in SD county. I see AMR doing what AMR does best... saving money and keeping the color the same.


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## VentMonkey (Aug 9, 2017)

CALEMT said:


> I see AMR doing what AMR does best... saving money and keeping the color the same.


Quoted for the truth, and spoken like a tried and true AMR employee.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

Shame, I loved McCormick and ever since they got their Torrance Contract two-three years ago they've been going downhill at Mach-5.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

DME107 said:


> Haha junior.... You have no idea who I am or how long I have been around. Keep talking old timer.
> 
> AMR can and will do what it wants so why get all serious about it.



Watchoutguyswegotabaddassoverhere.exe


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## DesertMedic66 (Aug 9, 2017)

The cheapest option is the best. They will probably initially just add a small “powered by AMR decal” to save money.


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## gonefishing (Aug 9, 2017)

The old bowers fleet had the name and cross scraped off.  They kept the blue line and just put AMR over it.  Simple, cheap, 20 minute fix.

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## VentMonkey (Aug 9, 2017)

DesertMedic66 said:


> The cheapest option is the best. They will probably initially just add a small “powered by AMR decal” to save money.


Followed by the "_proudly serving X, Y, Z City_" splurge


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

DesertMedic66 said:


> The cheapest option is the best. They will probably initially just add a small “powered by AMR decal” to save money.



I can Picture it already:

MCCORMICK AMBULANCE
- A Westmed Company
- Powered by AMR
- Owned and Operated by E̶n̶v̶i̶s̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶H̶e̶a̶l̶t̶h̶c̶a̶r̶e̶  Air Medical Group Holdings
- Proudly Serving the City of Compton/Inglewood/Torrance/etc.​


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## Tony Maximilian (Aug 9, 2017)

gonefishing said:


> More end of an Era.  Bowers, Schaefer (slowly dying) now they are gonna kill off McCormick.  Unbelievable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Wow. Just wow.

The comments on McCormick's FB page have been...well, lively.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Wow. Just wow.
> 
> The comments on McCormick's FB page have been...well, lively.



Its been a fun day reading reading all the comments in Facebook pages and groups, reddit, and here! At least for a local it is. I imagine the drama would seem pretty mundane for someone who didn't live in SoCal.


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## Tony Maximilian (Aug 9, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> Its been a fun day reading reading all the comments in Facebook pages and groups, reddit, and here! At least for a local it is. I imagine the drama would seem pretty mundane for someone who didn't live in SoCal.



Drama, indeed!


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 9, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Drama, indeed!


Well, Turns out they couldn't handle the heat. After four hours they deleted their AMR "Merger" Post on facebook. I also screenshotted everything before they deleted it for future keks.


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## Jim37F (Aug 10, 2017)

Wow....looks like I left McCormick just in time haha.....wonder if they'll keep it a semi independent operation and keep the McCormick name a la Gold Coast? Or slap an AMR sticker on the side and be in red rigs in LA as well as SD? 

But the bigger issue....where will guys find none in the AMR light blue???? (But seriously, hope that comes with a pay raise.....though I wonder how many guys used to 95+% 911 calls will like the almost guaranteed increase in county wide IFT calls? On the flip side maybe some of those AMR cars chilling in Santa Clarita Valley can come down and post in Inglewood/Compton and some of our stand up 24s stations can actually get some rest?? Well one can hope/dream lol


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## DesertMedic66 (Aug 10, 2017)

A decent amount of AMR operations have changed from the light blue uniforms to the black/navy blue uniforms. 

Also from the Facebook comments McCormick said that they will be keeping their name and paint schemes... at least for now.


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## Tony Maximilian (Aug 10, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> Well, Turns out they couldn't handle the heat. After four hours they deleted their AMR "Merger" Post on facebook. I also screenshotted everything before they deleted it for future keks.



Silly move. Before deleting the post they took time to respond rather defensively to some of the more pointed comments. Peculiar social media usage for a company. Whatevs.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 10, 2017)

Tony Maximilian said:


> Silly move. Before deleting the post they took time to respond rather defensively to some of the more pointed comments. Peculiar social media usage for a company. Whatevs.



I talked to one of my friends about that. He said that the facebook page got snappy and passive aggressive with any current or former employee who left a comment (yours truly included).

You'd think they would have a more political presence when making a post about SELLING THE COMPANY. Also love that they call it a merger when AMRs email to their employees confirmed it was a sale.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 10, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Wow....looks like I left McCormick just in time haha.....wonder if they'll keep it a semi independent operation and keep the McCormick name a la Gold Coast? Or slap an AMR sticker on the side and be in red rigs in LA as well as SD?
> 
> But the bigger issue....where will guys find none in the AMR light blue???? (But seriously, hope that comes with a pay raise.....though I wonder how many guys used to 95+% 911 calls will like the almost guaranteed increase in county wide IFT calls? On the flip side maybe some of those AMR cars chilling in Santa Clarita Valley can come down and post in Inglewood/Compton and some of our stand up 24s stations can actually get some rest?? Well one can hope/dream lol



My best guess is like you said. Gold Coast. McCormick operations with an AMR umbrella.


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## Mufasa556 (Aug 10, 2017)

Since were talking about McCormick's social media presence, can anyone explain to me why instead of referring to employees as EMTs they call them Caregivers in social media posts? 

The "Caregiver Mufasa and his partner Caregiver Nahasapeemapetilon arrived onscene and did a great job" posts were always so weird to me.


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## Jim37F (Aug 10, 2017)

Good question....then you'll see "Paramedic Caregiver Whatshisface did this thing..."


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 10, 2017)

Mufasa556 said:


> Since were talking about McCormick's social media presence, can anyone explain to me why instead of referring to employees as EMTs they call them Caregivers in social media posts?
> 
> The "Caregiver Mufasa and his partner Caregiver Nahasapeemapetilon arrived onscene and did a great job" posts were always so weird to me.


I heard through the grapevine that when upper management went to an EMS convention in March(?), one company recommended calling your employees caregivers instead of EMTs or Paramedics as its _supposed to _imply that you consider your employees caring and empathetic. Instead they come off completely as patronizing and condescending.


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## GMCmedic (Aug 10, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> I heard through the grapevine that when upper management went to an EMS convention in March(?), one company recommended calling your employees caregivers instead of EMTs or Paramedics as its _supposed to _imply that you consider your employees caring and empathetic. Instead they come off completely as patronizing and condescending.


I assume everyone that went to that convention got participation trophies? 

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## Jim37F (Aug 11, 2017)

According to my friends/former coworkers there who got to talk with management, they (AMR) are supposedly gonna treat it like Doctors, Gold Coast, Medic West....i.e. McCormick is going to stay McCormick as a more or less independent operation. No AMR logos or patches on the rigs or uniforms, current AMR employees wanting to work for McCormick would still have to apply, test, interview, get hired, go to orientation and FTO field training to work for McCormick (and vice versa). They're supposedly not going to come in and make major operational changes (McCormick is keeping the same amount of 24 hour shifts and the same stations) and no one at the EMT and Paramedic level is going to lose their job, the new red rigs are staying etc etc. Apparently according to some AMR guy that came down the biggest operational change they are planning on is changing the ePCR to AMRs system, and hinted at payroll changed (while joking about how a lot of people probably got raises when the minimum wage increases, which is def true as McCormick's starting wage is minimum wage currently, with a 3% yearly raise ($0.33, I went from $10.50 to $10.83 with the yearly raise).

Apparently AMR is interested in having McCormick help staff their special event standbys though.

But otherwise per what the higher ups are saying, field crews shouldn't notice any drastic changes....of course there's the worry that in 6-12 months some AMR big wig won't show up and change half the policies and plenty of people are expressing concern about what happened with Doctors (and even AMR itself in Irwindale) losing their contract after being bought out (which management answered basically by saying not nice things about Care's bidding practices)


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## Tony Maximilian (Aug 11, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> According to my friends/former coworkers there who got to talk with management, they (AMR) are supposedly gonna treat it like Doctors, Gold Coast, Medic West....i.e. McCormick is going to stay McCormick as a more or less independent operation. No AMR logos or patches on the rigs or uniforms, current AMR employees wanting to work for McCormick would still have to apply, test, interview, get hired, go to orientation and FTO field training to work for McCormick (and vice versa). They're supposedly not going to come in and make major operational changes (McCormick is keeping the same amount of 24 hour shifts and the same stations) and no one at the EMT and Paramedic level is going to lose their job, the new red rigs are staying etc etc. Apparently according to some AMR guy that came down the biggest operational change they are planning on is changing the ePCR to AMRs system, and hinted at payroll changed (while joking about how a lot of people probably got raises when the minimum wage increases, which is def true as McCormick's starting wage is minimum wage currently, with a 3% yearly raise ($0.33, I went from $10.50 to $10.83 with the yearly raise).
> 
> Apparently AMR is interested in having McCormick help staff their special event standbys though.
> 
> But otherwise per what the higher ups are saying, field crews shouldn't notice any drastic changes....of course there's the worry that in 6-12 months some AMR big wig won't show up and change half the policies and plenty of people are expressing concern about what happened with Doctors (and even AMR itself in Irwindale) losing their contract after being bought out (which management answered basically by saying not nice things about Care's bidding practices)



Interesting. I guess time will tell whether this holds up or not. Thanks for the info.


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## gonefishing (Aug 11, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> According to my friends/former coworkers there who got to talk with management, they (AMR) are supposedly gonna treat it like Doctors, Gold Coast, Medic West....i.e. McCormick is going to stay McCormick as a more or less independent operation. No AMR logos or patches on the rigs or uniforms, current AMR employees wanting to work for McCormick would still have to apply, test, interview, get hired, go to orientation and FTO field training to work for McCormick (and vice versa). They're supposedly not going to come in and make major operational changes (McCormick is keeping the same amount of 24 hour shifts and the same stations) and no one at the EMT and Paramedic level is going to lose their job, the new red rigs are staying etc etc. Apparently according to some AMR guy that came down the biggest operational change they are planning on is changing the ePCR to AMRs system, and hinted at payroll changed (while joking about how a lot of people probably got raises when the minimum wage increases, which is def true as McCormick's starting wage is minimum wage currently, with a 3% yearly raise ($0.33, I went from $10.50 to $10.83 with the yearly raise).
> 
> Apparently AMR is interested in having McCormick help staff their special event standbys though.
> 
> But otherwise per what the higher ups are saying, field crews shouldn't notice any drastic changes....of course there's the worry that in 6-12 months some AMR big wig won't show up and change half the policies and plenty of people are expressing concern about what happened with Doctors (and even AMR itself in Irwindale) losing their contract after being bought out (which management answered basically by saying not nice things about Care's bidding practices)


They said the same at Bowers. LOL 6 months later it turned into AMR.

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## aquabear (Aug 11, 2017)

Here's my prediction of what will go down. Probably in this order:

1) everyone will do the AMR compliance training

2) the McCormick HR department will be all laid off on a Friday... say four to six months from now.

3) billing department goes next...

4) upper management is fired and replaced by AMR people from other operations.

5) no more nomex uniforms. They are replaced with Horace-Small brand uniforms. They suck.

6) you will switch to the MEDS e-pcr system.

7) Ford Transit Van ambulances show up in your color scheme to start doing IFTs. Oh, and you start doing IFTs.

8) when all of your Leader type 3 trucks start to get higher milage, they will be replaced with the standard issue AMR AEV type 3 (without a power load).

9) then you come to work to see a memo that "the McCormick brand" is being "absorbed" into AMR and you will get new patches and the name will be scraped off the side and replaced with an AMR logo.

The only reason they didn't rebrand Medic West and Gold Coast was to limit outsiders from coming into their respective counties. Obviously not a problem in LA where there are more companies than you can shake a stick at.


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## Jim37F (Aug 11, 2017)

Just repeating what management (both AMR and McCormick) have said on these points specifically:





aquabear said:


> 6) you will switch to the MEDS e-pcr system.


This is already confirmed and will be happening sometime in the near future switching from McCormicks current ePCR to AMRs ePCR



aquabear said:


> 7) Ford Transit Van ambulances show up in your color scheme to start doing IFTs. Oh, and you start doing IFTs.
> 
> 8) when all of your Leader type 3 trucks start to get higher milage, they will be replaced with the standard issue AMR AEV type 3 (without a power load).


Apparently the LA County Fire contract (that is a 10 year contract just renewed last year) straight up requires Type 3s for LA Co FD responses. The Torrance Fire contract already has had this requirement, so the new boxes cannot, legally speaking, go away. 

Management has said they would like to see more IFTs (most actual crew members came to McCormick to avoid them) but the goal os still 100%compliance with) LA Co, Torrance, Redondo, and Compton Fire contract response times, so short of a large increase in the number of available units, they cannot take on a large number of additional IFTs without sacrificing the preexisting 911 contracts. Now, word is that AMR is comfortable with the minimum required 92% compliance rate whereas McCormick managemt shoots for 100% (may just be company koolaid lol), so until the McCormick managemt is changed I don't foresee a huge increase in IFTs...even maintaining a 92% 911 compliance rate, there's so many, ots a busy enough area, I highly doubt guys would see more IFTs vs 911. As it is you could double the amount of IFTs currently run and most units would still 1 a shift or less (I spent a yr and a half there, I can count the number of BLS IFTs on one hand I got...)


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## VentMonkey (Aug 11, 2017)

Why are IFT's beneath LA County EMT's at these wannabe FD places still? Lol, what a joke. 

I have to say our EMT's run their butts off between IFT's and pretty much sole-provider 911 calls those in LA think are "awesome fire calls", and you know what? They hardly bat an eye.

@Jim37F I promise you this sounds just like the AMR I walked into in the early 2000's--snake oil, my friend. I think @aquabear hit the nail on the head with what will, overall, go down. 

The fact that AMR is ok meeting the minimum most likely means that they already have their IFT wheels turning. Ha, try having to meet that contract plus an entire, yep _entire_ county-wide, Kaiser contract. That was the AMR of old, which is the AMR of new. Don't think they aren't going after deep hospital pockets already. 

Heck, my spin would add that the reasons they wanted back in was for this purpose more than those contracts. They meant little to them then, and probably mean little to them now, but they do know that it draws in the "I only run fire calls" type EMT's only so they can run transfers, too.

Meh, these mediocre fire departments deserve an underhanded, and shrewd business driven machine on wheels. It remains most unfortunate for the general public in these areas, but I guess when you're thought to believe that these guys are "gods", and "heroes" ya' don't know what ya' don't know. 

It looks like you got out just in time.


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## Chris07 (Aug 12, 2017)

I don't understand the draw of 100% 911 in LA County. I mean I can see the excitement for the brand new EMT, but once you start to understand the game it gets old. There were days when I was so fed up with LACoFD and the BS 911 calls that I prayed for an IFT only day. I'd take a long out of the area IFT over an ETOH urban outdoorsman any day. Granted running IFTs all day everyday gets boring after a while, I like the mixture. The only thing that really ticks me off though is giving IFTs to a 24 hour shift at 3am. That just plain sucks....but that's the industry.


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 12, 2017)

Chris07 said:


> I don't understand the draw of 100% 911 in LA County. I mean I can see the excitement for the brand new EMT, but once you start to understand the game it gets old. There were days when I was so fed up with LACoFD and the BS 911 calls that I prayed for an IFT only day. I'd take a long out of the area IFT over an ETOH urban outdoorsman any day. Granted running IFTs all day everyday gets boring after a while, I like the mixture. The only thing that really ticks me off though is giving IFTs to a 24 hour shift at 3am. That just plain sucks....but that's the industry.



911 is fun until you realize LACoFD paramedics are just advanced EMTs with a blue P-card in their wallet who ship Chest pains, ALOC, and DKAs BLS so they can go back to their station.

I once took a chest pain BLS, paramedic came to the back of the ambulance and said, "We're gonna go with the chief complaint of left arm pain so we don't have to come with you guys, Okay?"


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## BryanR (Aug 12, 2017)

TheComebacKid said:


> 911 is fun until you realize LACoFD paramedics are just advanced EMTs with a blue P-card in their wallet who ship Chest pains, ALOC, and DKAs BLS so they can go back to their station.
> 
> I once took a chest pain BLS, paramedic came to the back of the ambulance and said, "We're gonna go with the chief complaint of left arm pain so we don't have to come with you guys, Okay?"



I took a sudden onset, nonprovoked chest pain radiating to the left arm (with cardiac history) BLS and the medic told me to go with neck pain. *upside down smiley face emoji*
That same squad has shipped multiple unresponsive patients BLS with me before. *lots of upside down smiley faces*
The list goes on and on with LACoFD...


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## Jim37F (Aug 12, 2017)

Because you're not picking up a sick person from the little band aid station and taking them to a level 1 50 miles away because they're too sick for the doc to manage.....the healthiest most stable "you really called 911 at 3am for 2 week old constipation?" patient is about the sickest patient you'll see doing BLS IFTs 
 BLS IFT in LA is either Dialysis Derby, "Miss Jenkins was in our hospital for pneumonia, but she's all better now so you're taking her back to the SNF across the street" (No joke, there's one hospital that routinely discharges to a SNF whose parking lot is connected to the hospitals parking lot, literally <.1mile away, and back when I was doing IFTs you could get 3 or 4 of those discharges in a row) 
Or "Mr Jones is here at Local Hospital but he has Kaiser insurance so they want us to transfer him to their facility now" 
Etc etc......anyone who is actually sick gets a Paramedic or Critical Care Nurse, the only EMT skill you're using is lifting and moving the patient


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## VentMonkey (Aug 12, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Because you're not picking up a sick person from the little band aid station and taking them to a level *2* 50 miles away because they're too sick for the doc to manage...


This Jimbo, is literally the definition of a large portion of the IFT's we do from CAH's in our county down to our city; and they're quite often very sick. And when those band aid stations tap out, they go up north or down south.


Jim37F said:


> the healthiest most stable "you really called 911 at 3am for 2 week old constipation?" patient is about the sickest patient you'll see doing BLS IFTs


I think we can all attest to having to run these calls with the exception of a few very well-tiered systems. I know plenty of our paramedics still do.


Jim37F said:


> Or "Mr Jones is here at Local Hospital but he has Kaiser insurance so they want us to transfer him to their facility now"
> Etc etc......*anyone who is actually sick gets a Paramedic or Critical Care Nurse*, the only EMT skill you're using is lifting and moving the patient


Kaiser is Kaiser is Kaiser as is there "hub"-aka- Lucifer. You oughta see some of the stuff they write off as "CCT", but hey, it's a guaranteed pay, so why not?

We all know it ain't true (the bolded), I just think it's silly that these companies become so "coveted" for their 911 contracts only to get treated like dirt by these fire jerks. That said, they're about as legitimate as one will ever get in LA County.

I'm not picking on ya', big Jim. Lol, if anything I'd venture to guess you could give one, let alone two flocks sippin' mai thais on the beaches of Hawaii...haha.


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## GMCmedic (Aug 12, 2017)

I really enjoy the transfers from the CAH to the big hospital 20 minutes away. Especially when the patient was on the floor unit for 3 or 4 days. Gave the hospital ample time to make things worse and the run interesting for me. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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## Mufasa556 (Aug 13, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> ...but she's all better now so you're taking her back to the SNF across the street" (No joke, there's one hospital that routinely discharges to a SNF whose parking lot is connected to the hospitals parking lot, literally <.1mile away,...



Are we talking about La Palma Hospital? Or are there others? Those were some great calls. "175 transporting and you can show us destination 0.1". We sometimes considered walking but figured the gurney would tip over, kill our patient, and we'd have days worth of IRs to write. 

I also liked transporting from St. Francis to the SNF across the street. You arrive on scene. Go up on the floor. Stare at destination from the window while the patient finishes dinner. Get hassled by dispatch for being on scene so long for such a quick call. Stare at destination from the window some more.


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## Jim37F (Aug 13, 2017)

Mufasa556 said:


> Are we talking about La Palma Hospital? Or are there others? Those were some great calls. "175 transporting and you can show us destination 0.1". We sometimes considered walking but figured the gurney would tip over, kill our patient, and we'd have days worth of IRs to write.
> 
> I also liked transporting from St. Francis to the SNF across the street. You arrive on scene. Go up on the floor. Stare at destination from the window while the patient finishes dinner. Get hassled by dispatch for being on scene so long for such a quick call. Stare at destination from the window some more.


Whittier PIH actually lol.....picked up out of that SNF going to Francis before though lol One time for an earache......then a stabbing in district came in and the Quint told the guy the SNF staff would take care of him and left


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## VentMonkey (Aug 13, 2017)

@Mufasa556, @Jim37F lol you all are giving me some serious flashbacks. Jim, I didn't know PIH was in McCormick's first-in district.

Either way, both areas are vividly remarkable. I believe the one across SFM was a "Country Villa" SNF when I last saw it.

As far as La Palma, or LPI, as our run tickets used to abbreviate it- they had thee best $5.00 lunch tickets back then. Good times, y'all.


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## trell959 (Aug 13, 2017)

Sigh. It took me a year and a half to appreciate how terrible LA county really is. 1 year of ******** IFT, 5 months of county’s bull. Get outside the county if you can OP, it’s worth it.


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## Jim37F (Aug 13, 2017)

VentMonkey said:


> Jim, I didn't know PIH was in McCormick's first-in district.


Oh sorry, That was from my PRN days when I first became an EMT (Worked there 2013), though McCormick does occasionally transport to PIH Downey


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## Qulevrius (Aug 13, 2017)

911 call for a 'runny, congested nose'. Fire decides ti send them to ER and when I rise eyebrows, the cap'n responds 'are you gonna be the one to tell the pt she can't go to the hospital ?'

A 911 call for non provoked, non radiating chest pain. A 44 y.o., attractive female with no cardiac hx who had a panic attack, so fire decide to load her onto the ambulance because they need to 'expose her chest to take a picture of her heart'. 4 (four) _fyremangs_ are cramming in and nearly fighting ea other for the leads. Then they send her BLS because, well, she's 100% stable with normal sinus rhythm & absolutely normal vitals.

The list goes on.


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## Woodtownemt (Aug 13, 2017)

I personally enjoyed IFT. I was never one to kid myself about the nature of the beast. Truth is we all have to pay our dues one way or another. Don't get me wrong I enjoy flashy lights and all but the truth is it increases our chances of getting hit or crashing. 911 is good as far acclimating ones self to others worst moments. But at least in LA Co IFT was where you would be first in scene and have discretion over which treatment or route to proceed. I'm personally tainted with FD EMS. When ever you get a squad and engine crew in your house trying they're damnest to get you to ama just because you called at shift change and they went as far as to say you had clear bilateral lung sounds so they could go back to station really pisses me off. Turns out one of my lungs was filled with fluid when I went to ED to get second opinion. Yeah LA Co "EMS" is over rated. Fires they deserve all the credit but EMS is just out o their expertise.


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## Woodtownemt (Aug 13, 2017)

On another not I always got a kick out of transporting a psych Pt from St Francis ED to around the building to the psych unit after hours.


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## wtferick (Aug 13, 2017)

AMR ruined Doctors. Closed down a company in EMS history. Now has McCormick. I bet the big man at Care is very happy with how this is all playing out. His goal is to shut every company down c: 

From what he told me.... lol


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## BryanR (Aug 13, 2017)

wtferick said:


> AMR ruined Doctors. Closed down a company in EMS history. Now has McCormick. I bet the big man at Care is very happy with how this is all playing out. His goal is to shut every company down c:
> 
> From what he told me.... lol



He seems quite excited lol


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## TheComebacKid (Aug 23, 2017)

Jim37F said:


> Oh sorry, That was from my PRN days when I first became an EMT (Worked there 2013), though McCormick does occasionally transport to PIH Downey



Hey, I worked for PRN!


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