# Turlock/United Steel Workers Union



## RanchoEMT (May 21, 2011)

My company is voting for union soon... We're voting Yes/No to Turlock Emergency Medical Services Association under the United Steel Workers Union (the same Union of the Highly Paid Kaiser Fontana employees)....  Would Like to hear your guy's 'imput' on unions and turlock/USW...

Thank You, Pre-Empt.


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## usafmedic45 (May 21, 2011)

I saw a hospital that was under USW for their union.  The tactics the union utilized during the strike were heavy handed and absolutely uncalled for.  I'd stay as far away from them as I could if I were you.


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## RanchoEMT (May 22, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> The tactics the union utilized during the strike were heavy handed and absolutely uncalled for.


Can you elaborate?


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## usafmedic45 (May 22, 2011)

The two big ones were:
-Attempted to flip over ambulances coming into the hospital
-Blocked patient access to the hospital

Mind you this was the only hospital for about 50-70 miles in any given direction in rural Kentucky so it wasn't like people really had many other options than to go to this hospital.


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## DrParasite (May 22, 2011)

with all due respect to usafmedic45, I like having a union behind me.

true, they take money out of my paycheck, are seen as the downfall of many industries, and have resulted in employees staying on the job who should have been fired months and years ago, but it's nice to know that you can't be fired because your boss is having a bad day, or because your coordinator has it out for you.

don't get me wrong, there are some downsides, but I have worked with :censored::censored::censored::censored:ty bosses, one who tried to get me fired for something that wasn't my fault, and I wish I had a union behind me who would have told management "no, you can't fire the employee for a management screw up."

btw, if any union member tries to flip over an ambulance that is arriving at the ER, those people should be fired immediately, and have criminal charges filed against them.


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## DesertMedic66 (May 22, 2011)

I like not having a union. We voted to go union a couple of years ago. 90% of the employees voted for no union. The pay is better non union and our area is really laid back. I hang out with the supervisors on the weekends and go hiking.


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## usafmedic45 (May 22, 2011)

> with all due respect to usafmedic45, I like having a union behind me.



I don't have a problem with unions per se (although I don't believe that EMS providers and other health care workers should be allowed to strike due to the risk of endangering the lives of those we are charged with protecting), I just have a problem with the way some health care unions act once they walk off the job.  Consider it a friendly reminder to be very careful who you get into bed with.  

Personally, I would never work for a unionized hospital or service, but that's just more a matter of preference than anything against the idea of collective bargaining.


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## crazycajun (May 22, 2011)

I would rather work for a non union company. Even though a Union can help you keep your job, they take money from your check and when they decide to strike you have no other choice. The other thing is seniority. If there is a layoff and anther person is higher up than you they get the job and you go home even though they may not be more experienced or better at the job.


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## RanchoEMT (May 23, 2011)

crazycajun said:


> They take money from your check



This Union's is stating for every $2000 the union dues will be $30..... That's 1.5% of your paycheck.... Make of that statement what you will.



crazycajun said:


> when they decide to strike you have no other choice.



I used to work for Ralph's. Ralph's and other Grociers had a strike and all one had to do to get groceries(ignore the strike) was drive a block more down the street and hit the Stater Brother's (as they were designated to stay open during the strike).... 
--POINT BEING--
My Provider provides coverage for the entire county(the BIG one), I don't see a strike lasting long without extreme pressure from local Government, citizens, Fire, PD, etc... It's not like one can just drive a block down and get ambulance services someplace else. People DEPEND on us like air.

NOT TO MENTION: Our County/city bids are coming up for provider contracts, a one "C-Schaf" i hear is already making plans on usurping my current company... 

With that said a strike I think would be in favor of the employees... If it were to ever come to it at this given time.


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## RanchoEMT (May 23, 2011)

Question: A company that has in a day approx. 30 units running about 6 calls(often much more), all charging about $1,000(+100 for air, +200 for 12 Lead), how much money does this company produce gross/net a year???

30(ambulances)x6(calls)x1,000(minimum)= *$180,000 a day.*

$180,000(Daily Gross Income)x 365(1 year)= *$65,700,000.*

Do you all concur?


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## Tommerag (May 23, 2011)

RanchoEMT said:


> Question: A company that has in a day approx. 30 units running about 6 calls(often much more), all charging about $1,000(+100 for air, +200 for 12 Lead), how much money does this company produce gross/net a year???
> 
> 30(ambulances)x6(calls)x1,000(minimum)= *$180,000 a day.*
> 
> ...



No. Remember that medicare/medicaid doesn't pay even close to full price for the costs.


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## JPINFV (May 23, 2011)

RanchoEMT said:


> This Union's is stating for every $2000 the union dues will be $30..... That's 1.5% of your paycheck.... Make of that statement what you will.
> 
> 
> 
> I used to work for Ralph's. Ralph's and other Grociers had a strike and all one had to do to get groceries(ignore the strike) was drive a block more down the street and hit the Stater Brother's (as they were designated to stay open during the strike)....


Was this the strikes around 2004, 2005 time frame? The ones where pretty much everyone went, "Wait, people are being paid $20-30/hr to slide products over a bar code scanner and want more money?" and then proceeded to freely pass the picket line? The one where the companies called the union's bluff and basically put a lot of striking employees in financial ruin? Also, if I remember correctly, the companies still got essentially all of their demands (especially the dual pay scale system).

Something tells me that the problem wasn't just going down the street to the Stater Brothers. 




> With that said a strike I think would be in favor of the employees... If it were to ever come to it at this given time.


...however it's a Pyrrhic victory when the company loses the contract or if the benefits gained in the strike don't compensate for the lost wages during the strike period.


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## JPINFV (May 23, 2011)

Tommerag said:


> No. Remember that medicare/medicaid doesn't pay even close to full price for the costs.



Don't forget about patients who simply don't pay and have their debts written off.


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## DesertMedic66 (May 23, 2011)

RanchoEMT said:


> Question: A company that has in a day approx. 30 units running about 6 calls(often much more), all charging about $1,000(+100 for air, +200 for 12 Lead), how much money does this company produce gross/net a year???
> 
> 30(ambulances)x6(calls)x1,000(minimum)= *$180,000 a day.*
> 
> ...



Others have already stated that, that amount is not accurate. Most insurance companies will not pay the full cost. $1,000 can easily drop down to $600. Even down below $100. Then you have some people that don't get charged at all. Now take all the money and it still may seem like alot but subtract insurance rates, employee pay, repairs, utilities, and a whole list of other costs and you will see how much the company really gets paid (it's not alot).


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## RanchoEMT (May 23, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Was this the strikes around 2004, 2005 time frame? The ones where pretty much everyone went, "Wait, people are being paid $20-30/hr to slide products over a bar code scanner and want more money?"



$20-$30?!?!?! These figures are FAR OFF!!!!!!! Consider this: I left Ralph's to get into EMS as it payed twice as much. ALSO, Ralph's workers don't get full time unless there managers. It was irregular to get more than 25 hours a week at any position. Further Consider, there is no Healthcare for employees that don't work over 40hr.

Ha, Ralph's is a far off and distant memory I care not to remember. But to respond quickly to your statement.  Cashier's Top out at roughly $20 after 25-30 years of service. The Ralph's Raise Increase is .05 after 1000 hours. Do the Math. The equation is horrid. Some employees were lucky enough to have the OLD contract that bordered over-pay(which is what I believe you may be referring to) an employee I used to work with used to work on holidays under the Old Contract and would make $60/hr.  However the majority of people striking were of the "second newer" contract. The .05 cent contract.

I do and I don't have sympathy for grocery workers.  They(excluding Grocery Veterans) are not paid nearly close to "$20-30hr." NO WHERE NEAR. Top level employees such as Store Directors/Operations Managers can make over/close to $100,000. 
A Courtesy Clerk however(what everybody is hired in as) is hired in at minimum wage and has the ability after a year worth of work to have .10 cents added to his/her pay. My girlfriend works for Ralph's still(this is where we met) She has worked there for over 3 years and has gotten a promotion. Since being hired she gotten a .30 cent raise.... That's .30 cents above minimum.

But yes, as you stated, these are people that slide groceries from right to left across a bar code reader.... I'm not impressed either.



JPINFV said:


> ...however it's a Pyrrhic victory when the company loses the contract or if the benefits gained in the strike don't compensate for the lost wages during the strike period.


Agreed. They won .05 cents..... 5 cents to there pay. Don't get the idea that I was for or currently am for a strike. I'm just entertaining discussions... Infact! BACK TO THE DISCUSSION!



Tommerag said:


> No. Remember that medicare/medicaid doesn't pay even close to full price for the costs.



I was hoping to excite a more accurate figure from you guys with my information given....


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## RanchoEMT (May 23, 2011)

*Let's keep this on-track..*
Reason for the Question: I'm hoping to gain a rough net(including expenses) figure of how much money the company ends up with at the end of the day...  Let's be honest hear, when we talk about voting in a union. We're 'actually mostly' talking about pay increase for employees.


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## RanchoEMT (May 23, 2011)

firefite said:


> Others have already stated that, that amount is not accurate. Most insurance companies will not pay the full cost. $1,000 can easily drop down to $600. Even down below $100. Then you have some people that don't get charged at all. Now take all the money and it still may seem like alot but subtract insurance rates, employee pay, repairs, utilities, and a whole list of other costs and you will see how much the company really gets paid (it's not alot).



Also EVERYONE take into thought, I'm not yet adding into the figure the the extra charges of air, 12-Lead, and an Entire BLS Division that has its own Seperate Income. 8 BLS units running about 5 calls a day($1,000ish) and 4 CCT units charging Tops..... Which gets added into the Entire Pot....

Can we Agree that in addition to ALS(30 units) we're looking at about $50,000,000ish a year???  Is Medicare/Medicaid that bad that we're looking at $40,000,000ish???? 30,000,000ish???  Whatcha guys think?


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