# Working as a Paramedic at McCormick Ambulance



## toyskater86 (Nov 23, 2015)

Anyone here have experience working as a paramedic at McCormick in Los Angeles? Are they dual medic units? Pay?


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## Mufasa556 (Nov 24, 2015)

Don't know all that much about them. I believe they're dual medic and get payed $13/hr.


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## FoleyArtist (Nov 24, 2015)

As far as i know. Dual medic. Youll respond to more bls 911 than ift and youres BLS on scene. La co has scene control. You get call bonus per ift you run. 24hr kelley schedule


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## olaf1988 (Nov 24, 2015)

Dual medic, IFT and 911 (act as BLS)- on any 911, LA County Fire has the lead and usually does not take kindly to having the ambulance crew act as medics from what I've heard. If you work in Inglewood/Lynwood you get run into the ground with call volume and they pay is no where near what a lot of other private companies pay.


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## 911paramedic (Nov 25, 2015)

They also back up some of the beach cities and Culver city where they respond as first in Paramedics whenever the cities run out of ALS. Happens more often then you think.


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## wirk242 (Dec 1, 2015)

Soooo McCormick bls medics make more than the 911 medics in San Diego.  Time for those dudes to ask for a raise or move to a new company. Especially with the higher hourly rate and signing bonus the other companies are offering.


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## Jim37F (Dec 1, 2015)

I wonder how often on those borderline "should this be ALS or not?" calls the CoFD medics on the squad say "oh hey, they'll have a medic anyway, let's let MC take it and we'll clear"


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## Chris07 (Dec 1, 2015)

Jim37F said:


> I wonder how often on those borderline "should this be ALS or not?" calls the CoFD medics on the squad say "oh hey, they'll have a medic anyway, let's let MC take it and we'll clear"


I really don't think that having an ALS crew on the ambulance really effects their decision. If they send it with the ambulance, barring some sort of MCI, they consider it sending it BLS even though the ambulance crew has a medic or two. I've been on ALS shifts where our medic didn't agree with how the county fire medic sent a call BLS and as soon as they left made base contact and made it an ALS call. Theoretically if the call is designated BLS and its not, the fire medic can get in trouble regardless of whether or not the ambulance crew is ALS. If the call is ALS, they have to ride it in unless they hand it off. I've never seen CoFD hand an ALS patient to an ambulance ALS crew. They always ride in.


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## CentralCalEMT (Dec 4, 2015)

I never got why fire department paramedics would ride in with a dual medic unit that is fully staffed and equipped, especially if it is a non critical ALS patient. Gotta love taking 2 ALS units out of service for one patient. It must be an ego thing, since I can't imagine there is much liability seeing as most of the country paramedic first response units hand off to paramedic transport units all the time. However, what if the ALS McCormick unit is first on scene? Do they get to act as paramedics until the fire department paragods get there? I hope they can at least act as paramedic in that situation. The system down there makes no sense. I am so glad I left LA county years ago.

I love working where fire is BLS. We all play nicely together and egos do not get in the way.


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## gonefishing (Dec 4, 2015)

CentralCalEMT said:


> I never got why fire department paramedics would ride in with a dual medic unit that is fully staffed and equipped, especially if it is a non critical ALS patient. Gotta love taking 2 ALS units out of service for one patient. It must be an ego thing, since I can't imagine there is much liability seeing as most of the country paramedic first response units hand off to paramedic transport units all the time. However, what if the ALS McCormick unit is first on scene? Do they get to act as paramedics until the fire department paragods get there? I hope they can at least act as paramedic in that situation. The system down there makes no sense. I am so glad I left LA county years ago.
> 
> I love working where fire is BLS. We all play nicely together and egos do not get in the way.


It's 50/50 ego and job security.  Most of the big players that are private could easily wipe the floor with what fire cost to do ems in the county.  LA city board members have long discussed going private vs fire ems.  What prevents all of this is the good old IAFF.  Fire is in complete control and as well has alot to do with why LA county has such a small scope of practice.  Example: LA city charges a fee of $2k-$3k 911 response and ALS transport.  Private provider LA based does the same transport at around $1k-$1500k 

LA City Fire charges: $1500 for a bls run
Private Provider does it for $800

You cut fires ems grip and fire loses money.  They than lose a justification for a large budget and large staffing model.

You ever wonder why there has never been a ALS IFT protocol?
Because that doesnt involve fire.
You than have case studys, somebody at city hall sees this and sais holy cow, same license yet doing more and good quality.  It than pushes for a further justification for doing away with fire ems.

Most fireman only go on the box in this county for the 15% pay increase and to climb the ladder no pun intended.

What gives a black eye on the private side is the abundance of small companies in the county that have not the greatest track records with the management teams.  Scandals etc
This provides fuel for fire to say we do it better and this can't happen with the FD in control.

So to summ it up in several factors:
1)Politics
2)large budget justifications
3)egos

I kid you not, I once had a fire medic tell me private medics can not pronounce in LA county..........

Remember LAFD and other FDs in the county had single function employees.
A fire fighter was a fire fighter
A paramedic a paramedic 
Now its Fire fighter Paramedic
Fire fighter emt.
Those people we're chased out of employment by fellow crew members and most if not all are now retired.

Ems is just that, a money bag for fire to dip into.


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## ITBITB13 (Dec 5, 2015)

gonefishing said:


> It's 50/50 ego and job security.  Most of the big players that are private could easily wipe the floor with what fire cost to do ems in the county.  LA city board members have long discussed going private vs fire ems.  What prevents all of this is the good old IAFF.  Fire is in complete control and as well has alot to do with why LA county has such a small scope of practice.  Example: LA city charges a fee of $2k-$3k 911 response and ALS transport.  Private provider LA based does the same transport at around $1k-$1500k
> 
> LA City Fire charges: $1500 for a bls run
> Private Provider does it for $800
> ...



Do you want to be friends?


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## Patrick Holland (Dec 6, 2015)

McCormick has moved things around a little bit in regards in the ALS rigs. There are 3 ALS rigs in McCormick's system everyday. One out of Inglewood, Hawthorne and Redondo Beach. The two in Inglewood and Hawthorne respond to LACoFD calls in the area and they act just like the regular BLS rigs in McCormick's system. Some ALS IFT's from Centinela, Harbor-UCLA or RR-UCLA. All of McCormick's ALS units are fully stocked ALS rigs. The third ALS rig is stationed in Redondo Beach has now been turned into a Torrance Fire first up dedicated rig. So that unit mostly responds to Torrance Fire calls. The other BLS unit at the Redondo station responds to the LACoFD calls and Redondo calls that come in. The medics at McCormick are treated just like the EMT's same orientation, same hiring process except your FTO time is on one of the ALS rigs with a medic FTO. All ALS rigs are dual medic and the pay is the same as EMT's. $10 during training, $11 on 12 hour shifts, $9.50 on 24's, $9 if you elect to receive medical benefits from them. Also McCormick enacted a policy that if you don't get a call at night you will not get paid for the night. Pay increases are non-existent. McCormick also just removed call bonuses, they were a big money maker for the busy units in Hawthorne and Inglewood. In all of my time working there I never heard one of the ALS rigs being used as ALS first in for any of the backup cities.


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## gonefishing (Dec 6, 2015)

Patrick Holland said:


> McCormick has moved things around a little bit in regards in the ALS rigs. There are 3 ALS rigs in McCormick's system everyday. One out of Inglewood, Hawthorne and Redondo Beach. The two in Inglewood and Hawthorne respond to LACoFD calls in the area and they act just like the regular BLS rigs in McCormick's system. Some ALS IFT's from Centinela, Harbor-UCLA or RR-UCLA. All of McCormick's ALS units are fully stocked ALS rigs. The third ALS rig is stationed in Redondo Beach has now been turned into a Torrance Fire first up dedicated rig. So that unit mostly responds to Torrance Fire calls. The other BLS unit at the Redondo station responds to the LACoFD calls and Redondo calls that come in. The medics at McCormick are treated just like the EMT's same orientation, same hiring process except your FTO time is on one of the ALS rigs with a medic FTO. All ALS rigs are dual medic and the pay is the same as EMT's. $10 during training, $11 on 12 hour shifts, $9.50 on 24's, $9 if you elect to receive medical benefits from them. Also McCormick enacted a policy that if you don't get a call at night you will not get paid for the night. Pay increases are non-existent. McCormick also just removed call bonuses, they were a big money maker for the busy units in Hawthorne and Inglewood. In all of my time working there I never heard one of the ALS rigs being used as ALS first in for any of the backup cities.


Wow you guys get ran and paid so little! Why do people keep puting themselves through that kind of suffering?


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## Patrick Holland (Dec 7, 2015)

I have no idea why we do it. McCormick was my first EMT job. The place is slowly going downhill, I'm sure I will take flack for it, but it's the truth. They have been doing massive hiring due to the Torrance Fire contract, they have been hiring anyone who comes through the door. They never had enough people to cover shift's, mandatory holdovers, delayed FTO time so they could have trainees as Emergency Attendants to put rigs on the road. Pagers that don't work, Nextel phones that don't work and some dispatchers that have no idea what they are doing. Too many days where I was a single on a unit, management raffling TV's, XBOX's and money for you to pick up shifts. One day this past spring the VP wrote up the entire company for any infraction, it didn't matter how small. Being told to falsify PCR's, faking vitals, fire faking vitals, illegal Code 3 move ups due to poor coverage, and medics and EMT' making constant sexual remarks about patients. EVOC was a joke for us who had never driven an ambulance code 3 before. 4 units for an entire battalion in Malibu where the call volume can be extreme going code 3 from Inglewood to Malibu for a move up. Brush jackets that are over 10 year old, mobile PCR's that are junk and break all of the time. You need to pay for your own uniforms even though uniform fees are taken out of your paycheck. Good relationship with fire, some stations that are really like a brotherhood. New hires cannot bid for a permanent shift until you have been there for 8 months, you are given your schedule Saturday for a schedule that starts on Sunday. All of that to maybe have a shot for getting on with County or City Fire. I'm sure people will disagree with me on some of the stuff I said but it is what I experienced and no hard feeling to anyone wishing to get on with them or who are currently employed by them.


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## onrope (Dec 7, 2015)

Sounds about right for any private operation in LA. It's sad because McCormick used to have a really good rep as the "best" place for BLS 911 experience in LA, with their cool little wanna be LACoFD chopped jackets and cute station patches. Why any Paramedic would want to subject themselves to that when they can go north to Kern, East to ICEMA or REMSA and actually be a real medic and make more than minimum wage.


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## CentralCalEMT (Dec 7, 2015)

I can't believe any paramedic would work as a BLS ambulance for minimum wage when there are so many better paying options who give great experience in the surrounding counties. It seems that management is taking advantage of people with a medic license who desperately want a fire job and think that their only option for a spot is to work in LA, so they stay there. I highly doubt that working as a first in 911 paramedic in another county with primary patient care and scene control looks bad on a resume. I can't imagine a fire department giving preference to a McCormick medic just because they worked down in LA when the medics up here do so much more and run the show.


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## toyskater86 (Dec 7, 2015)

such little pay with such a huge liability! And, per our california labor code, no ambulance company is required to pay full 24 of 24, its a nice gesture and it should be paid, but when they can pick and choose who they want to hire, what can you do?


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## gonefishing (Dec 7, 2015)

If that's not a justification for a union I don't know what is.  At least I would contact the NAEMT to do some reform work in California when it comes to labor.  The company's in LA county have the Ambulance Association where all the owners and reps get together once a month.  What's talked about who knows and even if the public is allowed to attend.


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## FoleyArtist (Dec 8, 2015)

gonefishing said:


> If that's not a justification for a union I don't know what is.  At least I would contact the NAEMT to do some reform work in California when it comes to labor.  The company's in LA county have the Ambulance Association where all the owners and reps get together once a month.  What's talked about who knows and even if the public is allowed to attend.


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## gonefishing (Dec 10, 2015)

LOL!!! NO KIDDING!


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## MS Medic (Dec 10, 2015)

gonefishing said:


> If that's not a justification for a union I don't know what is.  At least I would contact the NAEMT to do some reform work in California when it comes to labor.  The company's in LA county have the Ambulance Association where all the owners and reps get together once a month.  What's talked about who knows and even if the public is allowed to attend.



That probably wouldn't work out as well as you think. About 4-6 years ago (I can't remember the exact time frame), AMR had the contract there. When the union went on strike, AMR sent people out from the disaster response team to cover during negotiations, including some medics I knew. I see they no longer have the county so things seem not to have panned out so well.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 10, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> That probably wouldn't work out as well as you think. About 4-6 years ago (I can't remember the exact time frame), AMR had the contract there. When the union went on strike, AMR sent people out from the disaster response team to cover during negotiations, including some medics I knew. I see they no longer have the county so things seem not to have panned out so well.


That's part of the application for the DRT. I know I did one personnel shortage deployment. Great overtime for those. Most medics will jump at it, especially if it's a 911 operation


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## gonefishing (Dec 10, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> That probably wouldn't work out as well as you think. About 4-6 years ago (I can't remember the exact time frame), AMR had the contract there. When the union went on strike, AMR sent people out from the disaster response team to cover during negotiations, including some medics I knew. I see they no longer have the county so things seem not to have panned out so well.


Yes and if I remember correctly the county wasn't happy and neither was the labor board.


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## MS Medic (Dec 10, 2015)

My only point was that unionization isn't a solution for our problems. What I said seems to be taken the wrong way.


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## gonefishing (Dec 10, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> My only point was that unionization isn't a solution for our problems. What I said seems to be taken the wrong way.


No I got your point.  I was simply stating that it opened a flood door of labor violations and county health not appreciating the fact of a flood of out of state providers.
Second, if nobody is willing to stand up and change things at a state law or federal level for all of ems or the same craps going on a union usually helps.  The point im making is the company's gather on a monthly basis and forever have held the rains.  If ems had such a thing you know damn well every owner would be looking to shut that down in what ever way possible.  Alot of owners claim to care for their employees but it most always turns out to be a wolf in sheeps clothing.  A momentarily change that within months when mistakes are suspected to be forgotten things go back the way they were before.


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## MS Medic (Dec 10, 2015)

We have the same problems here so I understand but unions aren't the solution. Unions are nothing but one more organization looking out for their own interests at our expense. Just like OSHA and the EPA, unions were created to fix a very real problem that existed. And just like those buerocracies, unions are run by people who are dependant on a problem for their livelihoods. So once one problem is solved another has to "be found," leading to a perpetual cycle. A better solution would be a political trade organization comprised of EMS personnel.


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## gonefishing (Dec 11, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> We have the same problems here so I understand but unions aren't the solution. Unions are nothing but one more organization looking out for their own interests at our expense. Just like OSHA and the EPA, unions were created to fix a very real problem that existed. And just like those buerocracies, unions are run by people who are dependant on a problem for their livelihoods. So once one problem is solved another has to "be found," leading to a perpetual cycle. A better solution would be a political trade organization comprised of EMS personnel.


And that would be the NAEMT which is on a federal level.  What would be better would be state assosciations.


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## MS Medic (Dec 11, 2015)

gonefishing said:


> And that would be the NAEMT which is on a federal level.  What would be better would be state assosciations.



 I'm actually referring to establishing EMS lobby groups that function at the state level.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 11, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> I'm actually referring to establishing EMS lobby groups that function at the state level.


We just formed one here in Texas. I wish all states would do it.


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## gonefishing (Dec 11, 2015)

MS Medic said:


> I'm actually referring to establishing EMS lobby groups that function at the state level.


Yes and I agree.lol


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