# Spanish



## phideux (Nov 22, 2011)

Our service is making it mandatory to learn Spanish. At our monthly in-service we have a mandatory1hr Spanish lesson. My brain is not wired to learn to speak a foreign language. I know they are pushing the Spanish at us so we can communicate with the large influx of illegal people in the country that don't speak English. I was just wondering what happens to the people like me who have a hard time learning it. Do we lose our jobs if we don't pass their little Spanish test that they are going to throw at us???
I'm all for furthering education, but if an agency is going to force their employees to learn a foreign language, shouldn't we have a choice of languages?? Maybe I'd like to order my Chinese food in their language instead of talking to the No-speak-english drunk driver with the Boo-Boo on his head that just ran over grandma.
Our Spanish instructor had a BLS field guide in her hand the other day, she made the statement that it was a shame that there was only 1 page of Spanish translations in there, there needs to be more. I wanted to ask how many pages of English translation is there in the Mexican Field guide.
My main question still is can we be fired if we don't or can't learn the language??? Even If I could learn a foreign language, I don't think an hour a month for 10 months would make anyone proficient. If they can fire people for not learning Spanish, I know where there will be quite a few job openings in May.


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## mycrofft (Nov 22, 2011)

*Probably yes, they can.*

Your only leg to stand upon is that a proficiency in  languages was not specified in your contract. However, if such proficiency becomes an imperative for the business, they can require you at least try to learn it. You can pick a lot of it up with just practicing colloquially with your co-workers if not with patients.
If as many people as you say cannot learn it, however, they will drop the requirement and maybe go with a bonus system.


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## medic417 (Nov 22, 2011)

The majority of people that are Spanish speaking only are not illegals.  Very large stereotyping to say they are illegal just because they do not speak English.  Even many of people that do speak English still understand better when given information in their native tongue.  No you will not become fluent in any language if you only study 1 hour per month pero es mejor que nada.


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## mycrofft (Nov 22, 2011)

*Even if they are very prevalent locally, "illegals" are patients too.*

Where in your license did it say "Only Gringos or persons carrying a passport, visa, work pass, or American birth certificate"?. Even though we did not have a requirement, my co-workers and I picked up a modicum of Spanish just through humanitarian necessity and exposure.


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## akflightmedic (Nov 22, 2011)

Sounds like your service is building up tolerance and combating negative perceptions as opposed to actually trying to teach you.

Your mindset on this subject is very telling by how you described everything.

There was absolutely nothing positive about the way you presented it. To say one is not programmed to learn a foreign language is wrong. I am willing to wager if I dropped you in a remote Mexican city for 5 weeks with no English contacts of any sort and no way to leave you would be quite proficient in basic conversational Spanish. (This is the total immersion concept and people pay big bucks for it).

Why not change your view on this? Step back, breathe and say, hey this is kind of cool...I am getting a very basic introduction to another language for free and getting paid for it. For fun, you should practice. Start inserting one or two words in your English assessments (Spanglish). If you actually keep an open mind you will be surprised at what you retain and even more so when you see how those patients react to you.


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## abckidsmom (Nov 22, 2011)

Have a positive attitude, man.  

10 years ago, 12 leads weren't required either.  If you think this 1 hour a month spanish lesson is actually stretching your brain beyond its capacity, your brain needed the exercise anyway.

It's part of good customer service to be able to communicate with the patients.


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## mycrofft (Nov 22, 2011)

*Take weekly lessons then go out with the other students.*

Once a month is sort of ludicrous, that's the "partial immersion with wet suit and water wings" approach. Make it less onerous and do it more often. Hey, if it is so unpopular and you DO it, you will stand out.


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## phideux (Nov 22, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> Have a positive attitude, man.
> 
> 10 years ago, 12 leads weren't required either.  If you think this 1 hour a month spanish lesson is actually stretching your brain beyond its capacity, your brain needed the exercise anyway.
> 
> It's part of good customer service to be able to communicate with the patients.



I try to keep a positive attitude, I know this one hour a month is not stretching my brain, but they will not teach the whole dept Spanish by making us take a one hour class a month. It takes a whole lot more teaching than that, I am just worried that our jobs might be on the line if we can't hack it.
As far as people not speaking English, and us learning a different language, In the area I've been working I have run into people speaking Chinese and Indian, alot more than people speaking Spanish. If they want to require a language, why only Spanish and not one that conforms to the local demographics? I just don't get it sometimes.
Also, the supervisors, managers, etc. don't take the Spanish classes, even though the majority do spend time in the field.


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## firetender (Nov 22, 2011)

*Cheat!*

http://www.speedylanguage.com/ssfems.html

Terry Hart (Baja Books) was a former partner of mine (no payola for me!). Excellent start and it may help you get over the hump.

In fact, based on experience, mastering the Guide pretty much covers what you need to be able to communicate without getting bogged down by the nuances of the language. There is really NO need to learn conversational Spanish to run a call adequately.


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## bigbaldguy (Nov 22, 2011)

medic417 said:


> The majority of people that are Spanish speaking only are not illegals.  Very large stereotyping to say they are illegal just because they do not speak English.  Even many of people that do speak English still understand better when given information in their native tongue.  No you will not become fluent in any language if you only study 1 hour per month pero es mejor que nada.



+1

People go on and on about the need for increased education in EMS to improve patient care. Guess what, being able to communicate with your patient improves patient care.


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## abckidsmom (Nov 22, 2011)

phideux said:


> I try to keep a positive attitude, I know this one hour a month is not stretching my brain, but they will not teach the whole dept Spanish by making us take a one hour class a month. It takes a whole lot more teaching than that, I am just worried that our jobs might be on the line if we can't hack it.
> As far as people not speaking English, and us learning a different language, In the area I've been working I have run into people speaking Chinese and Indian, alot more than people speaking Spanish. If they want to require a language, why only Spanish and not one that conforms to the local demographics? I just don't get it sometimes.
> Also, the supervisors, managers, etc. don't take the Spanish classes, even though the majority do spend time in the field.



This mostly sounds like whining.  "Try" to keep a positive attitude?  The Great Jedi Master said, "Do or do not, there is no try."

Have you ever studied logic?  You employed at least three examples of faulty logic in your argument.


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## Aidey (Nov 23, 2011)

Two words: Google translate.


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## mycrofft (Nov 23, 2011)

*Two words:*

Medical terminoilogy


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## Aidey (Nov 23, 2011)

What makes you think medical terminology isn't included? If you insist like talking like a text book you may run into some problems, but we shouldn't be doing that with our English speaking patients so why would we do it with anyone else?


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## systemet (Nov 23, 2011)

phideux said:


> Our service is making it mandatory to learn Spanish. At our monthly in-service we have a mandatory1hr Spanish lesson.



You're getting free language training, paid for by your employer?  Awesome!  Where do I sign up!  Sounds fantastic!



> My brain is not wired to learn to speak a foreign language.



My daughter is not even two years old, and she speaks a blend of two languages.  She's mostly able to separate the two as well.  I have a friend whose four-year old switches between English, Swedish and Arabic.  One of the people I work with speaks Uighur, Mandarin, Danish, Swedish and English.

Us native English speakers are an exception for people in developed countries.  Most places where English isn't the first language, people speak a second language.  



> I know they are pushing the Spanish at us so we can communicate with the large influx of illegal people in the country that don't speak English.



Sounds like a good idea, doesn't it?  That way you can communicate with them.  Sounds like it might make your job easier, perhaps even safer?



> I was just wondering what happens to the people like me who have a hard time learning it. Do we lose our jobs if we don't pass their little Spanish test that they are going to throw at us???



I don't know your agency, but I'd be surprised if they can do this.  It's probably not legal to fire you, and having Spanish fluency as a job requirement in the US is probably legally indefensible in a wrongful dismissal lawsuit. 

[This being said, I know next to nothing about the relevant law.]




> I'm all for furthering education, but if an agency is going to force their employees to learn a foreign language, shouldn't we have a choice of languages??



They're paying you to learn a language, and you think you should be choosing which language you learn?  It sounds like you're getting something people would pay for, for nothing.  Something that might be useful to you in your personal life if you travel to a Spanish speaking country.



> Maybe I'd like to order my Chinese food in their language instead of talking to the No-speak-english drunk driver with the Boo-Boo on his head that just ran over grandma.



Maybe you would, but why should your employer pay for this?  I mean, if you're taking a grand of your own money, on your own time, and paying some university to learn Estonian, and your employer gives you a warning letter and says, "Hey buddy, you should enroll in Spanish class instead", then I'd see why you'd be upset.

But how can you be angry that your employer is providing free language training, and you're not getting to choose the language?  Why do you think that you should be able to?



> Our Spanish instructor had a BLS field guide in her hand the other day, she made the statement that it was a shame that there was only 1 page of Spanish translations in there, there needs to be more.



She's a Spanish teacher.  Of course she'd think that it's important to have more Spanish in the field guide.  It's (presumably) her passion.  It's possible she doesn't realise that there's a limit to the amount of information you can put in the guide and that putting more Spanish in might mean removing your nitrodrip cheat sheet, or whatever's in a BLS guide.  APGAR score?  Maybe she's right, have you considered that?



> I wanted to ask how many pages of English translation is there in the Mexican Field guide.



I'm guessing probably quite a few.  I'm going to suggest that there's probably a greater fluency amongst Mexican EMTs and Paramedics in English that there is Spanish fluency amonst US EMTs and Paramedics.  I'm going to also guess that it's probably required to learn English during basic schooling there.  I'm going to also guess that any of the resort towns probably have a lot of paramedics and EMTs coming into regular contact with drunk English speakers.




> My main question still is can we be fired if we don't or can't learn the language???



My guess is, probably they can't.  From your post it doesn't sound like this has even been threatened, just that you're worried about this.  Should you be?



> Even If I could learn a foreign language, I don't think an hour a month for 10 months would make anyone proficient.



I agree absolutely.  A standard university introductory language class would be about 5 hours a week for 13 weeks.  I think it would be possible to make headway with less time, perhaps even with an hour a week, although it would be slow going.  An hour a month isn't going to cut it for fluency.  But it might help you get to the point where you can use a few phrases, and pronounce written words in a halfway reasonable manner.  



> If they can fire people for not learning Spanish, I know where there will be quite a few job openings in May.



I'd be surprised if they can.  I don't think that you have anything to worry about here.


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## Handsome Robb (Nov 23, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> The Great Jedi Master said, "Do or do not, there is no try."


I love it.



Aidey said:


> Two words: Google translate.


Quoted for truth.

We do spanish once a week in medic school and every now and again have our spanish teacher as a spanish speaking patient. She does a great status hispanicus. 

Alright I'll get to my point. I'm not a fan of our spanish lessons, but once a week really isn't that bad. Once a month is even easier. There's no way they actually expect you to become proficient with only 1 hr/month, I don't think you need to worry about your job. Just play the game.


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## DrParasite (Nov 23, 2011)

It is my personal belief that everyone in the US should speak English.  English is the unofficial language of the US.  You want to come here, fine, learn the language.  You move to France and refuse to learn French and they treat you like a second class citizen.  Same for many other countries.  If you refuse to learn the native tongue, you are looked at as an arrogant American.

That all being said, if they are paying you to learn spanish, DO IT!!!!! they are paying you to do something to help you with the job.  and it makes you more valuable if you become bilingual if you apply for another job.

My former partner was hispanic, in a heavily spanish speaking city.  My spanish isn't great, but I still tried to communicate with all the spanish speaking people on calls.  and when I failed (or got frustrated with them not making any sense), he would step in.  But I always tried, and am going to get the rosetta stone software and see what happens and see if it helps in prove my spanish.

Can you be fired for not learning it?  probably not, esp since it wasn't a requirement when you were hired.  But if a large majority of your population speak spanish, you have a responsibility to learn the language, so you can communicate better with them.  Plus it allows you to better assess them when you know what they are saying.


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## Flightorbust (Nov 24, 2011)

phideux said:


> My brain is not wired to learn to speak a foreign language. Maybe I'd like to order my Chinese food in their language  Even If I could learn a foreign language,



ok so your not wired to learn a foreign language but want to learn Chinese? Even tho Chinese is harder to learn the Spanish from my understanding. Besides alot of employers will pay more if you speak Spanish. So why not open your mind, add a skill to your resume, and become that much better at your job.


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## DesertMedic66 (Nov 24, 2011)

I come from a very "unique" family. Learning a different language isn't really an option. My family believes that in the US you should speak English. If you don't speak English or aren't trying to learn English and your in the US then basically you get no help. 

This does make calls with Spanish only speakers very interesting and normally pretty quiet. I have no interest at all in learning another language. I took French in High school because I was forced to in order to graduate but I had no urge to remember any of it. 

And now is when someone is going to comment about this being poor patient care and that I don't care about the patients.


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## Aidey (Nov 24, 2011)

Flightorbust said:


> ok so your not wired to learn a foreign language but want to learn Chinese? Even tho Chinese is harder to learn the Spanish from my understanding. Besides alot of employers will pay more if you speak Spanish. So why not open your mind, add a skill to your resume, and become that much better at your job.



I'm 99.99999% sure they were being sarcastic about the Chinese thing...


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## atropine (Nov 24, 2011)

wow, spanisg is way easier to learn than english, if your having a hard time with that the education problems in the carolinas must be bad.


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## JeffDHMC (Nov 25, 2011)

DrParasite said:


> But I always tried, and am going to get the rosetta stone software and see what happens and see if it helps in prove my spanish.



Don't blow your $ on Rosetta Stone, there are better programs out there IMO. Rostta costs A LOT for what you get. Try Michel Thomas, it's all audio based and you can listen to it anywhere, no need to sit in front of your computer and you'll get usable skill much quicker. I have the online version of all the available Rosetta languages and it's the tool I'm least impressed with. 

The 2 languages I've spent the most time with are French and Arabic and I have reams of resouces on both, there is no one perfect way to self teach a language, but if you're going to start with one, try Thomas. Also; pick up a copy of "How to Learn Any Language" by Barry Farber, he gives loads of great tips on language aquisition.


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## JeffDHMC (Nov 25, 2011)

firefite said:


> I come from a very "unique" family. Learning a different language isn't really an option. My family believes that in the US you should speak English. If you don't speak English or aren't trying to learn English and your in the US then basically you get no help.
> 
> This does make calls with Spanish only speakers very interesting and normally pretty quiet. I have no interest at all in learning another language. I took French in High school because I was forced to in order to graduate but I had no urge to remember any of it.
> 
> And now is when someone is going to comment about this being poor patient care and that I don't care about the patients.



Not sure it's poor pt care, but it is kind of sad.


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## JeffDHMC (Nov 25, 2011)

Flightorbust said:


> ok so your not wired to learn a foreign language but want to learn Chinese? Even tho Chinese is harder to learn the Spanish from my understanding. Besides alot of employers will pay more if you speak Spanish. So why not open your mind, add a skill to your resume, and become that much better at your job.



Not so; give Mandarin a try, you'll be suprized. I insist that my girls learn a foriegn language and my 12 y/o daughter studies Mandarin Chinese. She is a wizard with that stuff and is only half way through her 2nd year. To see her read and write is impressive. 

Mandarin has mercifully simple grammar compared to English or any of the romance semetic languages. Also there is no verb conjugation to speak of. Verbs come in one form and one form only. The hardest parts (for me) of spoken Mandarin are the tones, but with a little practice you can pick them up pretty easily though it helps to have a native or fluent speaker to correct you when need be. I have not tried written Mandarin yet but think that may be a bit of a challenge.


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## dstevens58 (Nov 25, 2011)

I'm not sure if I would like to be forced to learn another language, but if given options and/or free training, I wouldn't mind learning a second language.

I went out and took courses in sign language and enjoy it very much.  I even immerse myself into their culture in order to learn more than what I can/have learned in the classroom.


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## systemet (Nov 25, 2011)

atropine said:


> wow, spanisg is way easier to learn than english, if your having a hard time with that the education problems in the carolinas must be bad.



Jeff makes some interesting points.  I think a lot of this stuff depends on what background you're coming from.  For most people who's first language is English, it's probably going to be easier to learn something with a Latin or Germanic background, e.g French, Spanish, Italian, German, Dutch, Swedish, Norwegian, Danish, compared to something coming from a completely different linguistic group, like Finnish, Korean or Hindi.

I also think learning sign language counts as having a second language.  I find it absolutely amazing how quickly two people can transfer information in sign language... it makes talking seem so inefficient.


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