# van ambulances



## C.T.E.M.R. (Dec 2, 2010)

I was wondering if anyone who runs in a "vanbulance" has any problems with storage. A private service here only runs them and i got a good look at theirs. Can you carry multiple backboards, stair chair, Other larger equipment with a lack of out side compartments?  I'm not sure all of the equipment we carry on our "box" rigs at my DEPT. would fit in a van ambulance. Or are there any problems moving around or problems with Technician space? thanks


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## EMSLaw (Dec 2, 2010)

No, I don't think it's a problem.  Around here, most private services, and even ALS in a pinch, have Type II ambulances (vans).  They have to carry at least the state minimum in equipment, same as we do in the box, which means two backboards, stair chair, scoop stretcher, reeves, etc.  

Things can get a little tight in the back, but they have an airway chair and squad bench the same as a box ambulance.  Usually, though, the stretcher is flush against the left (driver's side) wall, instead of being in the middle of the floor, so there is no CPR seat. 

They also have advantages.  Easier to drive, easier to park, and a lot cheaper.


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## WolfmanHarris (Dec 2, 2010)

Honestly, there's been talk about transitioning back to Sprinters around here and I have my doubts.

We keep adding more equipment to the trucks that require not only storage space, but room to operate, chargers and more importantly often extra crewmembers who need to access both sides of the stretcher.

For example, in the last year my service has not only added CPAP, and the LP15 (not a big change over the 12, but we do now have in car chargers), harnesses for service dogs (to remain compliant with the Ontarians with disabilities act) but is now rolling out the Lucas 2 CPR device. We've also added tracked stair chairs which take up significant space. Once it hits the market we'll be getting the Stryker powerload system, which as per Stryker will not currently fit in Type II trucks.

Further, one of the biggest changes needed in Ambulance safety is leaving behind the squad bench and switching to captain's chairs that allow us to remain belted without the side impact zone being the small of our backs. While this is necessary and desired, we'll also loose the under bench storage.

Certainly there's room for efficiency. We don't need so much guaze and saline in a single truck, but that will only free up so much room.


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## Amber2313 (Dec 2, 2010)

I work for a private serivce that uses vans. We just got our first mini-mod, but haven't actually put it out yet. We have, I believe, 13 vans now, a wheelchair van, and 1 mini-mod. We also used to have a box, but the owner despises them so he got rid of it. That was before my time with the company. We don't carry multiple backboards, but probably could. As far as too much extra goes, I don't see it happening, and if it does, I don't see it being easy whatsoever. We have Indiana's minimum requirements on our rigs. (Mind you, we're a BLS service doing emergent and (mainly) non-emergent transports. For our purposes, the rigs do what we need them to. If you tried running them ALS though, I would have very serious doubts.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 2, 2010)

My old service in NM used Type IIs and we never had any problems with space unless we happened to pick up an overlarge specialty flight team. And almost all of the trucks we ran were ALS or CCT level.


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## Flight-LP (Dec 2, 2010)

jtpaintball70 said:


> My old service in NM used Type IIs and we never had any problems with space unless we happened to pick up an overlarge specialty flight team. And almost all of the trucks we ran were ALS or CCT level.



Damn man, are you sayin' we be fat?!?!? lol


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## medicdan (Dec 2, 2010)

I, as well, for for a large service that puts BLS providers in vans, ALS in boxes, although I work PB and when our usual truck is in the shop, we end up in a van fairly often. 

Vans with BLS loading really do accommodate all the equipment quite well. We keep 2-3 LSBs/Scoops under the bench without trouble (accessible only with the doors open). Stairchair goes on driver's side near the patient's feet. 

With an ALS/CCT configuration, our drugs, pedi, vent/cpap, pump, suction and backup jump kit replace the BLS jump kits and AED near the side door shelves. The larger jump kit either lives on the bench (near the main O2) or on the stretcher (with the LP12, which moves to behind the patient's head or side rail during transport). 

Generally, all the equipment previously mentioned fits in a BLS truck, it seems, with the exception of the Lucus, which I presume could be placed under the bench seat or behind the airway seat. In fact, a Lucus/AutoPulse/Geezer Squeezer is more important in a van, because of the lack of CPR seat/room for additional personnel just for compressions. A monitor charger/harness does fit on the shelf near the airway seat. I'm not familiar with the Stryker power stretcher, but I do know a powered Ferno fits in a van without difficulty. 

Long story short, BLS has no trouble fitting, and ALS can make it work, even CCT is possible.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 2, 2010)

Flight-LP said:


> Damn man, are you sayin' we be fat?!?!? lol



I dunno, have you seen some of the Native Air planes... they're large enough to haul several whales 

Heh, but no really I had one flight crew that was three members plus an isolet on their special Stryker. Plus another flight team I took had a very large vented patient on multiple drips and the crew was RN/RRT/EMTP so it got pretty crowded in the back


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## Shishkabob (Dec 2, 2010)

Storage was never really a problem on Type IIs.  The problem lies with actually working inside one.


Hate it, hate it, hate it, hate it, hate it.  Especially if you need access to the patients right side.  




Straddling a patient with one leg on the floor and the other in a cabinet to start an IV on the right arm is not something I enjoy doing.


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## brentoli (Dec 2, 2010)

I can honestly say Linuss is the first person I have ever heard thats worked in a van, complain about a van. Most of the people I hear complaining about them, have never worked in one.


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## WolfmanHarris (Dec 2, 2010)

emt.dan said:


> I'm not familiar with the Stryker power stretcher, but I do know a powered Ferno fits in a van without difficulty.
> .



The cot isn't the problem. The Power LOAD system will be. Stryker hasn't placed it on their site yet, but we've had the reps at my service and the plan is to purchase the powercots with the power load system as part of our transition to no lift. 

Finding info on this system is hard at the moment, but I have found some bits and pieces that state the system will not be able to go on Type II's.


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## clibb (Dec 2, 2010)

My agency is talking about moving to the setup the European ambulances are doing but with the box like how Careflite in Texas has theirs.


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## medicdan (Dec 2, 2010)

clibb said:


> My agency is talking about moving to the setup the European ambulances are doing but with the box like how Careflite in Texas has theirs.



Just for the peanut gallery, Careflite showed off their new configuration (with Crestline, I believe) for a CCT-level Sprinter chassis. 
Take a look at Kelley Grayson (Ambulance Driver)'s description

http://ambulancedriverfiles.com/2010/10/a-fresh-outlook-on-ambulance-design/

(photos taken from AD's blog)


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## Flight-LP (Dec 3, 2010)

Linuss said:


> Straddling a patient with one leg on the floor and the other in a cabinet to start an IV on the right arm is not something I enjoy doing.



Could be worse man, you could have to teabag the pt. for the whole transport like we do in some of the smaller rotors. lol

In the AS350 as well as some of the smaller Bell products, you have minimal access to the whole lower body, the left side, and you get up close and personal with them. Hope you had a breath mint and clean underwear!


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## Flight-LP (Dec 3, 2010)

emt.dan said:


> clibb said:
> 
> 
> > My agency is talking about moving to the setup the European ambulances are doing but with the box like how Careflite in Texas has theirs.
> ...



I like the new Crestline set up. Safety is emphasized, you have adequate room to work, and it appears to be quite aerodynamic and cost effective as well.


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## usalsfyre (Dec 3, 2010)

Flight-LP said:


> Could be worse man, you could have to teabag the pt. for the whole transport like we do in some of the smaller rotors. lol
> 
> In the AS350 as well as some of the smaller Bell products, you have minimal access to the whole lower body, the left side, and you get up close and personal with them. Hope you had a breath mint and clean underwear!



The AS 350 variants were the only one I've seen in which you REALLY went gonads to face on, all of my flying was in the small Bells, and they're head at least stayed above the waist. :blush:


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## Chimpie (Dec 3, 2010)

holy margin killer batman... changed photo sizes to make them viewer friendly


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## Flight-LP (Dec 3, 2010)

You are correct overall, it really depended on the product. The old Critical Air aircraft had the pts. head against the back wall with the two providers sitting to the right facing each other. When AEL bought us out and started rolling out their L-4 conversions (a.k.a. a pretty paint job with even less lift capabilities) they had the 2 forward facing seats with the oversized drug box being in the aft facing seat. Even with these, depending on the placement of the flat, you may still be up close and personal.

The 407 at least had some room to breathe. I'll still take my A-Star anyday of the week and twice on Sunday as I will never have to worry about power getting out of a scene or having to limit my patient to under 250 lbs. because we were at our max gross weight. Sorry, but Bell 206's have no place in EMS, especially in the south with the humidity and higher DA.


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## usalsfyre (Dec 3, 2010)

Flight-LP said:


> You are correct overall, it really depended on the product. The old Critical Air aircraft had the pts. head against the back wall with the two providers sitting to the right facing each other. When AEL bought us out and started rolling out their L-4 conversions (a.k.a. a pretty paint job with even less lift capabilities) they had the 2 forward facing seats with the oversized drug box being in the aft facing seat. Even with these, depending on the placement of the flat, you may still be up close and personal.
> 
> The 407 at least had some room to breathe. I'll still take my A-Star anyday of the week and twice on Sunday as I will never have to worry about power getting out of a scene or having to limit my patient to under 250 lbs. because we were at our max gross weight. Sorry, but Bell 206's have no place in EMS, especially in the south with the humidity and higher DA.



Absoloutely agree about the 206 in EMS. My ride was one of the unconverted Crit Air configurations...and it sucked. Hard. The forward facing seats were only marginally better. 

I flew a few flights in a 407, and the difference was amazing, even if it was only a few cubic feet. Plus the A/C was nice.


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## NomadicMedic (Dec 3, 2010)

Ahem... back to the subject of Typle IIs...

I work ALS for an agency that uses only Type II rigs and while they are cramped, we manage to make it work. It's tough with two or three people plus a patient. 

The bigger concern for me is the fact that we don't secure much of our gear. Our Pelican Box full of drugs, pedi kit, monitor and asorted other flotsam and jetsam that accumulate in the back of the rig will all turn into projectiles that will KILL ME if we ever get in an accident.


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## katgrl2003 (Dec 3, 2010)

Flight-LP said:


> Could be worse man, you could have to teabag the pt. for the whole transport like we do in some of the smaller rotors. lol
> 
> In the AS350 as well as some of the smaller Bell products, you have minimal access to the whole lower body, the left side, and you get up close and personal with them. Hope you had a breath mint and clean underwear!



Dang Flight! I was drinking a coke when I read this, and now my sinuses have been powerwashed. The carbonation tingles a bit when its shooting out your nose. :wacko:


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## the_negro_puppy (Dec 3, 2010)

We use these














and for our larger pts


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## HotelCo (Dec 4, 2010)

At my service ALS (including CCT), and BLS work primarily in vans. I've never had an issue with it. When I first started at the company, I had my doubts, but it's not really an issue.


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## HotelCo (Dec 4, 2010)

n7lxi said:


> The bigger concern for me is the fact that we don't secure much of our gear. Our Pelican Box full of drugs, pedi kit, monitor and asorted other flotsam and jetsam that accumulate in the back of the rig will all turn into projectiles that will KILL ME if we ever get in an accident.



Why isn't your gear secured? I've never seen a Type II that wasn't able to be configured to safely store all of the ALS gear properly.


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## gicts (Dec 4, 2010)

emt.dan said:


> Just for the peanut gallery, Careflite showed off their new configuration (with Crestline, I believe) for a CCT-level Sprinter chassis.
> Take a look at Kelley Grayson (Ambulance Driver)'s description
> 
> http://ambulancedriverfiles.com/2010/10/a-fresh-outlook-on-ambulance-design/
> ...



can't transport a second on the bench seats can ya?
....or nearly anywhere for that matter. Otherwise it is a pretty cool setup. For CCT and other transports it is pretty much perfect.


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## rook901 (Dec 4, 2010)

brentoli said:


> I can honestly say Linuss is the first person I have ever heard thats worked in a van, complain about a van. Most of the people I hear complaining about them, have never worked in one.



Then you can add me as your second . I've spent more than my fair share of time in a type II, and it sucks immensely. Maybe the people who AREN'T complaining about vans have never worked in a box unit.

The space is cramped as hell. You have almost no room to move around. Accessing equipment on scene is awkward with no outside doors. I've even worked in one vanbulance where you couldn't turn on the under-bench main O2 without opening the rear doors (we usually leave them off because most of our units have O2 line leaks). So, if you run into a situation where you start out on portables and need to switch to main, you get to play musical doors.

Fortunately, the company that I work for typically only uses the vans for BLS units, so it's not that big of a deal with accessing the equipment. But problems do happen occasionally. And occasionally ALS units have to use vans when the boxes are in the shop. Working a big MVC and having to fight against your unit trying to get spinal immob gear out is a PITA.

The only thing I hate as much as Type II's are Medium Duty units, but that's for a whole different set of reasons. Give me a Type III any day.


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## NomadicMedic (Dec 7, 2010)

HotelCo said:


> Why isn't your gear secured? I've never seen a Type II that wasn't able to be configured to safely store all of the ALS gear properly.



Well, we have a bracket for the monitor that is useless because the cables don't reach the patient when it's secured. Our pelican doesn't have a mount point. It sits on the floor next to the side door. Our other kits and bags are on open shelves. There is a tray of "stuff", including an EZIO driver kit, blood tubes, iv set ups and other stuff in the action area. There are also portable radios, metal clipboards, portable o2 and other stuff that is "secured" in the back of the rig. It will become a maelstrom of churning debris if the rig ever rolls. I've mentioned that we need to secure the gear in the rigs and I'm subsequently told to "deal with it". 
It is what it is. And it's been like that in EVERY type II I've ever been in. 

And please, don't say "you should find another job". Landing a full time non fire based medic position is like finding a needle in a haystack in Washington state.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 7, 2010)

rook901 said:


> Then you can add me as your second . I've spent more than my fair share of time in a type II, and it sucks immensely. Maybe the people who AREN'T complaining about vans have never worked in a box unit.
> 
> The space is cramped as hell. You have almost no room to move around. Accessing equipment on scene is awkward with no outside doors. I've even worked in one vanbulance where you couldn't turn on the under-bench main O2 without opening the rear doors (we usually leave them off because most of our units have O2 line leaks). So, if you run into a situation where you start out on portables and need to switch to main, you get to play musical doors.
> 
> ...



I've worked in Type I, II, and III rigs, and now work in Medium duty rigs (I absolutely hate them. Too big, sucks to drive). Out of all of them I love the Type IIs I've worked in the most  So soem of us that like vans have worked in boxes too


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## rook901 (Dec 7, 2010)

jtpaintball70 said:


> So soem of us that like vans have worked in boxes too



I only made that statement because of the silly "only people complaining are the ones who haven't worked in vans" statement.


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## TransportJockey (Dec 7, 2010)

rook901 said:


> I only made that statement because of the silly "only people complaining are the ones who haven't worked in vans" statement.


Makes sense  Just making sure you knew that some of us like them and haven't just worked in them


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## RanchoEMT (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm going to assume the original post was pertaining to actual "mini-Van" Vans... not type II ambulances.  (ex: http://southerncaliforniamedicaltransportation.com/) I've worked for a company that used them.  And their horrible. ....Its a MiniVan! Not an ambulance. We would do IFT type transfers with them and it was so cramped in these things that both EMT's would be forced to sit up front and turn around every 15 minutes(5 min. for an unstable patient... ;o) and ask "How you doing Sir."  There's NO room for storage.  Our extra O2 was shimy'ed under the spare tire, which needed to be unscrewed to access.  Our Sheet/pillow and BLS bag was a cardboard box on the rear passenger seat that would fall on top the patient when making hard turns... JUST HORRIBLE.


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## EMSLaw (Dec 11, 2010)

RanchoEMT said:


> I'm going to assume the original post was pertaining to actual "mini-Van" Vans... not type II ambulances.  (ex: http://southerncaliforniamedicaltransportation.com/) I've worked for a company that used them.  And their horrible. ....Its a MiniVan! Not an ambulance. We would do IFT type transfers with them and it was so cramped in these things that both EMT's would be forced to sit up front and turn around every 15 minutes(5 min. for an unstable patient... ;o) and ask "How you doing Sir."  There's NO room for storage.  Our extra O2 was shimy'ed under the spare tire, which needed to be unscrewed to access.  Our Sheet/pillow and BLS bag was a cardboard box on the rear passenger seat that would fall on top the patient when making hard turns... JUST HORRIBLE.



I'm flabbergasted.  While I recognize that they only do non-emergent transports, I'm sure we can all come up with a few dozen stories of dispatchers and nursing homes getting it wrong.  

So, this company can't even have an EMT in the back with the patient.  It's worse than a Cadillac ambulance.  What happens if the supposedly stable patient starts to go south?  You pull over and call a real ambulance on your cell phone?

Ambulance regulations are a wonderful thing.  As long as you can squeeze a cot and the necessary equipment in there, you're good to go.  (Though CA must be different from NJ.  I don't see any backboards or other necessary equipment in that 'ambulance'.)


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## JJR512 (Dec 11, 2010)

EMSLaw said:


> I'm flabbergasted.  While I recognize that they only do non-emergent transports, I'm sure we can all come up with a few dozen stories of dispatchers and nursing homes getting it wrong.
> 
> So, this company can't even have an EMT in the back with the patient.  It's worse than a Cadillac ambulance.  What happens if the supposedly stable patient starts to go south?  You pull over and call a real ambulance on your cell phone?
> 
> Ambulance regulations are a wonderful thing.  As long as you can squeeze a cot and the necessary equipment in there, you're good to go.  (Though CA must be different from NJ.  I don't see any backboards or other necessary equipment in that 'ambulance'.)



In my experience doing IFT, my feeling is that a lot of the patients transported by BLS ambulance didn't need an ambulance at all. The only reason they got one is because their doctor felt (sometimes legitimately) that they couldn't sit in a chair, otherwise they could have been transported by a wheelchair van with only one worker (the driver) that doesn't even need to be an EMT.

I always felt that there needed to be an option between wheelchair vans and BLS ambulances, an option that is essentially equal to wheelchair van service in terms of the care available, except the patient lays down on a stretcher. The minivan shown there would be perfect for this, especially if they stop trying to pretend it's an ambulance. There would still need to be two crew members, since it takes two to handle a loaded stretcher, but just like the solo wheelchair van driver, neither would need to be an EMT.

On another note, I've never liked Sprinter ambulances. I've never worked in one, or even been in one, so I don't know first-hand what they're like to work in or drive. My main dislike is that they seem disproportionately tall for their width, which makes them look top-heavy, which makes it seem like they'd tip over easily. In other words, they scare me.


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## medicdan (Dec 11, 2010)

It looks like those vans are "bed coaches"-- they have electric (1 man) stretchers, so likely are horizontal chair cars. With some good body mechanics training (bed to stretcher, stretcher to dialysis chair, etc), I'm sure this works well... although is absolutely not an ambulance...


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## RanchoEMT (Dec 11, 2010)

I'm not sure how EMS is ran outside of CA, but in San Bernardino County we have code3's (ALS) and code2's (BLS).  These code2's are pretty much the ALS bull:censored::censored::censored::censored: calls that paramedics really don't need to be tied up with. So they run x2 EMT's and its kinda of a B.S. taxi service to the ER...  The MiniVan company that i worked for pretty much would steal these code2 calls from the qualified ambulance companies and would charge maybe 1/10 of the price. Providing about 1/20 the service.  And OMFG..... working for this one company in particular was horrid!   Our Ops Manager would send us to calls without 02.  Cus they forgot to order it..... Only myself and another guy were actual EMT's putn in time to get hired somewhere else... Our equipment was ALWAYS broke.... ALWAYS.  Our check engine light was on for a month, until the owner popped open the hood of the van and cut a couple wires.. FIXED. One homie they hired would smoke while transporting.  Just an amazing experience. You'd think you were in a movie.
Anyways... I Just Had To Vent That All Out... 

Ha! and YES they're trying to look like AMR.


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## medicdan (Dec 11, 2010)

Wait, i'm sorry, I just want to understand this correctly. Southern CA medical transport is operating AMBULANCES in those vans, and billing for ambulance-level care? Do they carry medical equipment or supplies- it seems not even oxygen. 
I can understand those vans being used for transport (dialysis, etc), as long as it's kosher with the government, but transporting patients to the ER in those??? What?


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## Minnick27 (Dec 11, 2010)

JJR512 said:


> I always felt that there needed to be an option between wheelchair vans and BLS ambulances, an option that is essentially equal to wheelchair van service in terms of the care available, except the patient lays down on a stretcher. The minivan shown there would be perfect for this, especially if they stop trying to pretend it's an ambulance. There would still need to be two crew members, since it takes two to handle a loaded stretcher, but just like the solo wheelchair van driver, neither would need to be an EMT.
> me.




My company used to run a couple trucks like this. We had a modified paratransit van that could hold a stretcher and we had two paratransit drivers in the truck to take Pts who didn't have a medical necessity but couldn't comfortably sit for the ride. Both people rode up front. We called it an ambulette. I'm still not sure how legal it was but we don't do it anymore


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## EMSLaw (Dec 11, 2010)

JJR512 said:


> In my experience doing IFT, my feeling is that a lot of the patients transported by BLS ambulance didn't need an ambulance at all. The only reason they got one is because their doctor felt (sometimes legitimately) that they couldn't sit in a chair, otherwise they could have been transported by a wheelchair van with only one worker (the driver) that doesn't even need to be an EMT.



I'm in complete agreement that many - perhaps even a majority of - people transported by ambulance don't need to be.  That goes for 9-1-1 as well as IFT.  However, if that minivan is being advertised as, and billing as, a BLS ambulance, it most assuredly is not one.


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## RanchoEMT (Jan 1, 2011)

Southern California Medical Transport(SCMT) predominantly runs hospital transports.  They have a contract with a Kaiser down here in San Bernardino County.  They provide some renal roundup, and do take some calls like the code2’s mentioned previously and transport to the hospital.  They wait in the waiting room like regular people and provide oxygen.  All employees are “required” to have a CPR card in hand when working, though no one has ever given CPR, practiced(Cert.  is from Online)nor know what to do if they needed to do compressions.  When I asked one of them about it, they said “Isn’t it 30 and something?”  Myself, “30 what?” SCMT Employee “iunno haha...”


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## njff/emt (Jan 2, 2011)

the IFT companies i worked for had the type II's., one had a sprinter which was not fun to work in., the vans aren't too bad but it is a major pain tryin to work on the pt's right side., plus depending how tall you are you had pretty good odds of whacking your head afew times on the bars reaching for stuff., added bonus with vans was squeezing places you can't with a box


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## Jon (Feb 16, 2011)

RanchoEMT said:


> Ha! and YES they're trying to look like AMR.


Just saw one locally that used the AMR logo... but replaced the USA outline with a single state. Pretty impressive. AMR has obviously built some brand recognition.



Minnick27 said:


> My company used to run a couple trucks like this. We had a modified paratransit van that could hold a stretcher and we had two paratransit drivers in the truck to take Pts who didn't have a medical necessity but couldn't comfortably sit for the ride. Both people rode up front. We called it an ambulette. I'm still not sure how legal it was but we don't do it anymore


Legal - as long as you aren't billing for it as an ambulance. There is very little regulation in the paratransit side... because Medicare won't pay for it anyway.




As for the OP? I've worked BLS and ALS transport work in Type II and Type III's, and ALS AND BLS 911 in Type I, II, III's and medium duty trucks. Some are good, some are bad. Aside from working a code, I'd be comfortable with any standard call in a Type II.


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## adamjh3 (Feb 19, 2011)

My station has four Type IIs and one mini-mod. 

We often Tx CCTs with aircrews that come in with prisoners. In the back we'll have two from the flight team, a corrections officer and our company's attendant. Never had any issues other than bumped elbows on those with the type IIs. 

I've got a buddy who works at AMR here (as a basic) and he's run 911s with medics in a type II, I've never heard him complain.


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## johnrsemt (Mar 9, 2011)

We used to have Sprinters, with bench seats:   it was great to take a nap on;  the bench padding was about 3" wide   so you just made sure that you had a cheek on both sides, and your driver never could roll you off the bench.  And believe me they tried


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## DesertMedic66 (Mar 9, 2011)

The major company in this area uses vans for BLS and ALS. The main ones are the ford vans but they are switching to sprinters. The only box units are CCT rigs. The vans get tight and working on the right side of a patient is really hard. They don't carry stair chairs but carry several backboards under the bench seat. As for being seatbelted in I have never seen a medic in the back of the unit wear a seatbelt when a patient is back there. The medics get pretty creative on where to store stuff in the unit.


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## mycrofft (Mar 9, 2011)

*Notes from Flinststone EMS*

 I notice the overhead litter hooks are gone??

I worked in two types of vans, the original DOD Chevy's, and "stretch" Ford's. The better individuals had an outside hatch for the M cylinder, so it didn't have to go under the squad bench or wherever. The Chevy's leaked road dust into the storage and presumably exhaust fumes. Storage for little stuff was excessive; for the larger stuff nowadays, it could have been modified.

The Sprinters look to have a center of gravity versus lateral wheelbase issue.

PS: Ever worked in a Cadillac conversion or Suburban? Could get a little busy inside, but there was so little care compartment room you could not pick up acceleration in a crash to get injured. Except for the caps flying off and the floors ejecting in a rollover....


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## mct601 (Mar 10, 2011)

firefite said:


> The major company in this area uses vans for BLS and ALS. The main ones are the ford vans but they are switching to sprinters. The only box units are CCT rigs. The vans get tight and working on the right side of a patient is really hard. They don't carry stair chairs but carry several backboards under the bench seat. As for being seatbelted in I have never seen a medic in the back of the unit wear a seatbelt when a patient is back there. The medics get pretty creative on where to store stuff in the unit.



Your Ford vans don't have stair chairs? Our 2009 E-350 has a stair chair and 3 back boards. I like ours besides the fact that it just rolled over 100,000 miles and the steering isn't as tight as when I first hired on in August and it had just under 40,000 on it.


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## DesertMedic66 (Mar 11, 2011)

from the units i have seen and been in, no they do not have the stair chairs. some divisions dont carry KEDs and some do.


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## shfd739 (Mar 11, 2011)

We've got a few leftover Ford vans from an acquisition 2 years that are crap. Everyone avoids having to be in them. I think most are being pulled by this summer. 

The rest of our trucks are 1 1/2 year old Sprinters and type 1s. The Sprinters are a mix of Medtec and AEV conversion. The AEVs are much nicer with a better layout and features. Both types carry Stryker stair chairs,KEDs etc. 

As for the Sprinter looking top heavy they aren't. The handling is great and they feel less top heavy than the Fords. 

Our type 1s still have hanging hooks and a few times a year we wind up hanging a patient.


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## mct601 (Mar 12, 2011)

Odd, our AEV Fords are fine, but our company keeps them well maintained.  I have not been in a Sprinter but from the looks of it, looks like patient care may be a little cramped?


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## jbell1955 (May 22, 2011)

I spent my first years working in a van. Then when I worked for a service with the box ambulances, I was spoiled. I prefer the room in a type-III over a type-II, but economically the type-II is cheaper to buy an operate.


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## pa132399 (Jun 6, 2011)

the company i work for is a combination department and we run 2 type III ambulances that are nice when they want to start up. we also have a type II which is mainly used by us career guys. the company is bls and we fit everything for licensure onto the type II but its not very friendly if your about 6 ft its cramped and fortunately i havent had to work a call in it but i have done many ift and bls transports in it to know it just doesnt fit for me. but still the most reliable in the fleet when it comes down to starting.


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