# Tactical EMS



## SarahT (Mar 8, 2006)

After getting rid of the idea of Flight Paramedic sad, I've been doing some research on Tactical EMS. I'm very intrigued. I realize that by taking these classes, you improve your knowledge on how to handle different situations. I'm wondering, however, when do you really utilize it? 

:excl: http://www.tactical-ems.com



> Tactical Medical Training for high-risk situations:
> 
> Tactical Operations
> 
> ...



This sounds to me like you would have to be in law inforcement maybe? Or it could be one of those badass jobs you can only think about working with the SWAT teams.

Any thoughts?


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## DT4EMS (Mar 8, 2006)

Tac-Medics definately have a place in EMS. Luno is a great resouce here for this topic. Hopefully he will be along soon to answer your questions.


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## Wingnut (Mar 8, 2006)

Wow, that sounds even better than HAZMAT. I wouldn't mind working with law enforcement at all (hell I live with one) but I don't want to be a cop. I just couldn't see myself being all Mrs. Macho with the arresting and fighting and stuff. That's one of the other problems with where I live, the options are SO limited and you really have to know someone to get anything "different" opened up to you. But I'm going to have to check that out in my area...sounds really cool


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## JJR512 (Mar 9, 2006)

SarahT said:
			
		

> After getting rid of the idea of Flight Paramedic sad, I've been doing some research on Tactical EMS...


If you don't mind me asking, why are ditching the idea of becoming a Flight Paramedic? I'm curious because this is a direction I've strongly been considering. In Maryland, FP's are regular State Police officers.

_All_ MDSP officers are hired as road troopers, and all go through the same six-month live-in military-style academy. After being assigned to a road unit, if one has a current NREMT-P certification, one can request a transfer to Aviation Command, a process that itself takes several months. The MDSP operates eight Eurocopter Dauphin 2 medevac helicopters, and is the primary medevac provider in the state; in fact, the MDSP performed the first civilian (non-military) medevac.

I've been interested in being a police officer for a long time, and actually took the written test once and scored very high. But I was never in good enough physical condition, and for a bunch of reasons never got in shape. I've also been interested in helicopters, and now I'm interested in EMS, so it seems to me that being a Flight Paramedic would be an excellent combination of three of my main interests. I mentioned this to one of my EMT-B instructors, and he said I should consider becoming a "Flight _Nurse_", because they'll make twice as much money working for some private transport companies or other agencies. But to me, it's not about the money (as long as I can support my family); it's about pride, doing something (finally) that my family can be proud of me for, and that I can be proud of myself for. It's about having a really cool job and surviving a highly competetive process to get it, and being one of only about 25 people to have it at any one time. Some transport job isn't going to give me that.

So, that's why I'm interested in being one myself, and why I'm interested in why you were interested but decided to pursue another direction. If I'm not being too nosy.


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## MMiz (Mar 9, 2006)

Being a tactical medic can mean many things.  While there are recognized courses, the level of training and responsibility really varies.

I know our private service is training a TEMS team.  Right now they're no more than an ALS unit trained in specific treatments for GSW / similar trauma injuries.  Over time I know they're looking to expand their education and scope of practice.


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## SarahT (Mar 9, 2006)

JJR512 said:
			
		

> If you don't mind me asking, why are ditching the idea of becoming a Flight Paramedic? I'm curious because this is a direction I've strongly been considering.



For me, it's all about Chemistry and Algebra. I just cannot pass it. No matter what I do, I cannot get this stuff to stick in my head. For a Flight Paramedic, I've been informed that you need to be a RN as well, with 3+ years in trauma/critical care (if I remember right). The RN degree is a little out of reach for me. :sad: 

You're not being too nosy by the way.   If you want to be a Flight Paramedic, go for it! What a great job. Wish you the best.


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## JJR512 (Mar 9, 2006)

SarahT said:
			
		

> For me, it's all about Chemistry and Algebra. I just cannot pass it. No matter what I do, I cannot get this stuff to stick in my head. For a Flight Paramedic, I've been informed that you need to be a RN as well, with 3+ years in trauma/critical care (if I remember right). The RN degree is a little out of reach for me. :sad:
> 
> You're not being too nosy by the way.  If you want to be a Flight Paramedic, go for it! What a great job. Wish you the best.


Thanks!  As far as I can tell, being an RN isn't a requirement for the MD State Police. They have the actual requirements pretty well spelled out. Now I have no doubt that being an RN in addition to being a paramedic would make an applicant look better. Maybe it's one of those not-official good things to have, like a college degree in criminal justice; the State Police only says you have to be a high-school graduate, but most people will say you can pretty much forget it these days with that CJ degree.


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## Jon (Mar 9, 2006)

MDSP are one of the few services that dosen't use nurses.


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## nyc.ems (Mar 21, 2006)

Sounds like ems skills in new york city B)


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## natrab (Mar 21, 2006)

California Highway Patrol uses medics in their helos.


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## Luno (Mar 27, 2006)

*Tac Med*

Well, there are a lot of different facets of Tac-Med, and what that course encompasses appears to focus more on SWAT Tac-Med.  Usually when one thinks of Tac-Med, it's usually thought of the last guy in the stack on an entry team, but there are all kinds of jobs for the "shooter/medic."  Feel free to send me an e-mail if you have any specific questions.  I may take a while to get back to you, but I do eventually get back to people.  (I don't want to hear it EMTPrincess  )


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## curt (Apr 14, 2010)

Holy Necro, Batman!

I've been looking at taking a SWAT-ready Tactical Medic course (I'm not LE, but I'd love to work with them), but looking at all these TEMS academies is showing me that, even though there's two of them based reasonably close to me, I'm going to have to chase down a class halfway across the country if I don't want to wait a year for training. Is this really the case/ any suggestions of places that do in-house Tactical Medic training year-round?


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## Twix623 (Apr 14, 2010)

JJR512 said:


> If you don't mind me asking, why are ditching the idea of becoming a Flight Paramedic? I'm curious because this is a direction I've strongly been considering. In Maryland, FP's are regular State Police officers.
> 
> _All_ MDSP officers are hired as road troopers, and all go through the same six-month live-in military-style academy. After being assigned to a road unit, if one has a current NREMT-P certification, one can request a transfer to Aviation Command, a process that itself takes several months. The MDSP operates eight Eurocopter Dauphin 2 medevac helicopters, and is the primary medevac provider in the state; in fact, the MDSP performed the first civilian (non-military) medevac.
> 
> ...



It's only 7 Troopers now, Trooper 8 was taken out of service. Trooper 8 served my area, now we have a long flight time with Trooper 2. From what I know it was because of the Trooper crash back in 2008. 

But also look in Eagle 1,2 & 3 from the United States Park Police. They too are an amazing bunch of guys with invaluable experience to offer. Obviously it's not all about Medevacs either, they'll do car pursuits, river rescues and more.

Just curious, what part of Md you from?


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## 8jimi8 (Apr 14, 2010)

Jon said:


> MDSP are one of the few services that dosen't use nurses.



They also have a very poor reputation for safety.  In fact, most of what I've seen about that outfit has been quite negative


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## Twix623 (Apr 14, 2010)

JUST realized that this thread was revived from 2006... haha.


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## 8jimi8 (Apr 14, 2010)

nice, got me too lol


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## LucidResq (Apr 14, 2010)

WTF on the revival... 

well in case anyone is looking at this thread NOW in curiosity...

Out here in my neck of the woods there are two primary flight services. One hires only RNs, the other uses RN/medic teams. 

TEMS comes in to play out here in the fire service. The LE SWAT teams partner with local fire departments for SWAT medics. So paramedics who work with the fire department, who undergo loads of additional training, are on call for local LE SWAT calls. They do a bunch of regular training with the SWAT team too. 

So the sheriff's office and police departments out here do not hire EMTs or Medics, they just use well-trained medics from the fire department, and train with them routinely.


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## JJR512 (Apr 15, 2010)

8jimi8 said:


> They also have a very poor reputation for safety. In fact, most of what I've seen about that outfit has been quite negative


Your statement about their repuation in wrong. Within the Maryland EMS community, in general the Maryland State Police Aviation Command is very highly regarded. That being said, you need to bear in mind that they suffered a fatal crash in 2008, and the aftermath of any such incident will always bring to light any problems that exist within such an agency. That is no doubt the source of any negative information you may have come across regarding the agency. However, the fact of the matter is that compared to other medevac helicopter services in the USA, the MSP medevac service is substantially safer than average:



> A recent study reported that the average Helicopter EMS accident rate between 1998 and 2008 was 3.8 accidents per 100,000 flight hours.  Prior to the crash of Trooper 2, the Aviation Command had flown over 100,000 accident free flight hours and had not suffered a fatal crash in over 22-years.  Although the Command considers one accident to be one too many, this equates to 2.8 accidents less than the average rate.



http://www.mdsp.org/media/press_release_details.asp?identifier=860

Looking at other information on the MSP Aviaton Command website, I have learned that since its creation in 1961, the service has suffered eleven fatalities in five crashes. The first was in a fixed-wing plane on a search-and-rescue mission before the agency began helicopter-based EMS services in 1970. The next nine deaths occurred in four helicopter crashes between 1972 and 2008. (The most recent crash, in 2008, also included the death of one of two patients onboard, a death not otherwise included in the numbers mentioned herein; of the four helicopter crashes, this one was the only one with patients onboard.) The most recent death occurred on the ground, when a flight paramedic was struck and killed by a vehicle on the ground as he was attempting to perform his duties.

The 2008 crash has served to illuminate some problems within the agency, as I've already mentioned. No such agency is perfect. It is sad that it took an incident of that magnitude to initiate needed changes within the agency. However, it is worth pointing out that any safety improvements the agency can affect will only serve to make it that much more better than it already is, which as has already been pointed out, is better than the national average.


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