# Hatian Girl Rescued... Dies.



## 18G (Jan 16, 2010)

Sounds like this girl died of crush syndrome.

[January 15, 2010]
Television audiences around the world watched as rescuers tried to free an 11-year-old Haitian girl from a collapsed building in Port-au-Prince on Thursday. But her story came to a tragic end shortly after they finally managed to remove her from the rubble.

The family of Annaika St. Louis told CNN reporter Ivan Watson, who covered the rescue attempt for hours Thursday, that the girl died just one hour after an iron beam was cut, freeing her right leg.

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## lightsandsirens5 (Jan 16, 2010)

18G said:


> Sounds like this girl died of crush syndrome.
> 
> [January 15, 2010]
> Television audiences around the world watched as rescuers tried to free an 11-year-old Haitian girl from a collapsed building in Port-au-Prince on Thursday. But her story came to a tragic end shortly after they finally managed to remove her from the rubble.
> ...


 
That is sad. I watched all thoes CNN clips on her and thought she had made it.

Yea, sounds like compartment or crush syndrome. I'm guessing that is probably a major cause of death after a quake.


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## Aidey (Jan 16, 2010)

I tend to leave CNN/MSNBC on just for the noise so I saw a lot of the quake stuff the night it happened and that was one of the major issues they were talking about. 

They interviewed some doctor or health correspondent and asked what kind of medical problems were going to be the biggest issue for the trapped and crush syndrome was up there right after dehydration. They just can't handle that many patients with crush syndrome with the medical infrastructure in place. 

I think what is especially sad is that I bet a lot of people think "Oh, my daughter is out, everything will be ok". Because they don't know/understand what crush syndrome is, and not realizing freeing the patient is what is going to kill them.


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## CAOX3 (Jan 16, 2010)

I just read their estimating 200,000 deaths.

Very sad


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## Akulahawk (Jan 16, 2010)

Remember folks, out on the West Coast, we've had two 7+ Richter Scale earthquakes in recent years. While there was damage, sometimes significant damage, there wasn't the wide-spread destruction that Haiti has. 

Longer term... 200k is simply going to be seen as the "first wave" of deaths. In the coming weeks, there could very easily be that number again from disaster-related disease.

Very sad...


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## Aidey (Jan 16, 2010)

There has been more than that if you include all of the earthquakes in Alaska. 

The situation in Haiti is definitely complicated by the long-term poverty the county has experienced and the lack of infrastructure in place before the earthquake even happened.


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## lightsandsirens5 (Jan 16, 2010)

Aidey said:


> They interviewed some doctor or health correspondent and asked what kind of medical problems were going to be the biggest issue for the trapped and crush syndrome was up there right after dehydration. They just can't handle that many patients with crush syndrome with the medical infrastructure in place.


 
Could we even handle that many crush pts? I'll bet you that in my area, we could not, right off the bat at least. Maybe once large scale outside aid arrived. Not sure, but it seems to me that tens of thousands of trapped people would overwhelm our system too.


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## VentMedic (Jan 16, 2010)

lightsandsirens5 said:


> Could we even handle that many crush pts? I'll bet you that in my area, we could not, right off the bat at least. Maybe once large scale outside aid arrived. Not sure, but it seems to me that tens of thousands of trapped people would overwhelm our system too.


 
We have more options to fly the patients either by fixed wing or helicopter to just about any hospital in the U.S. within a short period of time.   Once the MASH units are set up in Haiti, triage and treatment will run more smoothly.   Also, if this did occur in the U.S. to this magnitude, the powers of just country would just have to suck it up and allow doctors from other countries such as Doctors Without Borders and their resources to help as well as those from Cuba who can mobilize faster than most of the emergency units here in the states.  

Right now Miami and Ft. Lauderdale are taking as many patients as possible but many are also residents of the U.S. or other countries that are coming here from Haiti.


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## lightsandsirens5 (Jan 16, 2010)

VentMedic said:


> We have more options to fly the patients either by fixed wing or helicopter to just about any hospital in the U.S. within a short period of time. Once the MASH units are set up in Haiti, triage and treatment will run more smoothly. Also, if this did occur in the U.S. to this magnitude, the powers of just country would just have to suck it up and allow doctors from other countries such as Doctors Without Borders and their resources to help as well as those from Cuba who can mobilize faster than most of the emergency units here in the states.
> 
> Right now Miami and Ft. Lauderdale are taking as many patients as possible but many are also residents of the U.S. or other countries that are coming here from Haiti.


 
Ok, I get you.

So Cuba has a pretty good international disaster response team?


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## VentMedic (Jan 16, 2010)

lightsandsirens5 said:


> So Cuba has a pretty good international disaster response team?


 
They have the doctors.


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## mycrofft (Jan 16, 2010)

*Another case reminiscent of this:*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omayra_S%C3%A1nchez

Inescapable crush syndrome deaths are one of EMS's Greek tragedy deals, not unlike the Columbia shuttle disaster. Sort of like the first penicillin pt; dying of sepsis, they tried it, he rallied...then succumbed because they ran out.
The fatal act is not release, but the crushing injury itself. Despite minutes to even hours of continued mental clarity, sometimes characterized by lack of pain (the screamers don't make the news, and go into shock), they are already doomed.


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## Jon (Jan 16, 2010)

Akulahawk said:


> ...Longer term... 200k is simply going to be seen as the "first wave" of deaths. In the coming weeks, there could very easily be that number again from disaster-related disease.
> 
> Very sad...



Another aspect of disaster-related disease: The fact that what medical system there was in Haiti is GONE... no way to get more prescriptions. No way to get dialysis. Etc. Lots of chronically ill folks are going to have big issues.


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## VentMedic (Jan 16, 2010)

Jon said:


> Another aspect of disaster-related disease: The fact that what medical system there was in Haiti is GONE... no way to get more prescriptions. No way to get dialysis. Etc. Lots of chronically ill folks are going to have big issues.


 
Not every hospital has been destroyed as the more modern ones built later to code are still standing and functioning. Hospital Albert Schweitzer Haiti is about 40 miles outside of Port-au-Prince and is also one of only two dialysis centers on the island.

Medications might not be as difficult to get as you think since you might only have the U.S. way of doing things as a reference.


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## Aidey (Jan 17, 2010)

Right now it doesn't look like getting supplies, food, medications etc is the problem, it looks more like handing them out is the bigger issue. It looks like a lot of people have been patient and understand that they have to wait in line and such, but there have also been people mobbing supply trucks so bad the trucks had to leave the area. 

There was also the huge mishap with the food and the packaged date vs the expiration date. People thought the packaged date was the expiry date and started rioting because they thought they were getting expired food. 

Disclaimer - That is strictly from what I have seen/read through the media. 

As far as treating existing problems, I can definitely see that being an issue. Not because of a lack of resources, but just because of the logistics and organization needed to identify who needs what meds, at what doses, how long of a supply they can give out etc. Plus dealing with all of that is going to tie up doctors, and right now it seems like the main focus is on emergency treatment and stabilization. 


As for the crush syndrome, I bet what L&S5 says applies to many parts of the US. Crush syndrome patients require a lot of medical management just to keep them alive to get to the hospital, and that is the part where I see there being a problem in a MCI. We're talking multiple IVs, multiple medications, cardiac monitoring, pain management. It is a resource intensive condition to treat.


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## rhan101277 (Jan 17, 2010)

I have seen folks with compartment syndrome in the legs.  Their legs get as hard as a rock.


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## mycrofft (Jan 17, 2010)

*USe SEARCH for prior crush injury discussion.*

tencharacters


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## zmedic (Jan 17, 2010)

The first penicillin patient survived, died in her 90s:

http://www.wellesley.edu/Chemistry/Chem101/antibiotics/obit-a-miller.html


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## Jeffrey_169 (Jan 17, 2010)

Some people get sad about things like this, me, I get really angry. I just do not understand why there aren't LSV's and carriers of the coast with a makeshift operating facility under the flight deck ready to receive patients. The aircraft can then bring them to the flight deck; they can be transported below decks and then treated. 

Furthermore I do not understand why the planes on the tarmac are leaving empty. I can't help but wonder why they are not coming in, getting unloaded, refueled, and then being reloaded with patients which can then be transported to a facility in one of the neighboring nations. The fuselage inboard a transport plane is huge, and why they cannot be converted into operating rooms and why surgeries are not being performed within them is a mystery to me. Either option is better than making excuses. 

There are a variety of places the necessary surgeries can be performed. I know we have ambulances have been used as operating rooms, so why not something else; improvise!!! We say we are there to help these people, then let’s do it, and do it now!!!

People say we don't have the capacity; to this I say BOLOGNA!!! Our military is designed to fight 2 wars simultaneously. WE did it in WWII, and we can do it now. Several years ago we did a mock NBC drill in Washington D.C. Within 24 hours we had operating rooms, triage facilities, showers, etc set up and in place. Overnight the Sea Bees and the Marine Combat Engineers, together with Army detachments, had built mobile hospitals and ORs. Containers were compeered and used for everything from ORs, command centers, quarters, etc. It’s not a complicated concept. It is amazing to me how we can, within 24 hours, have a complete triage and treatment center, not to mention ORs, available in politician central, yet we can't help our neighbors. We say we are there to help, but then we half a** it. I know all too well the protocols and procedures involved with mass casualties and now I wonder why, after almost a week, we are still unable to get people, material, and expertise to the region which is right off our coast. If we are going to help, lets help; if we are not, then we are not; one or the other. 

I may seem out of place but I know in my heart, from both experience and common sense, we can do a lot better for a lot less money and time. It’s called efficiency; let’s give it a try for once. When we waste money and time its and inconvenience most of the time, but when it costs the lives of the people we claim we are trying to help it is infuriating.

I know we can do better, and when we don’t we wonder why we have dead children on our hands. The lack of organization and the excuses being made are beyond logical explanation and are completely unacceptable.


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## triemal04 (Jan 18, 2010)

You just don't get it.  I can understand you sentiments and wanting to help/have something done, but...what's being done is what can be done.  As I said in another thread, there is no magic wand to wave to fix this problem, and, if you haven't noticed, we have our own problems to deal with in the US (and certain other countries that we are committed to) at this time.

Not to mention the resources we have in this country are not infinite.  Transport 50,000 (or maybe that should be 500,000 or 5,000,000) people here...great...now what do you do with them?  Which hospitals do they go to?  How do you track them?  Who is responsible for them?  Who takes care of their day to day needs?  Who translates for them (French being the predominate language there)?  Who pays for it?  What happens after they are no longer sick/injured?  Who enforces that?  Do you actually think that you could just dump numbers that large onto any type of system without major problems?  Did you pay attention to what happened during Katrina and the aftermath?

But you do bring up an interesting point.  Why don't we do all the things you have talked about for the Haitians?  I mean, it's the right thing to do, isn't it?  Of course, in that case I do have to ask why you aren't jumping up and down and screaming that we do all that for the people in THIS COUNTRY that need help.  I mean, there are plenty of people in America who are in similar situations (though for different reasons) as the people of Haiti...where is your call to help them and the cost and resource demands be damned?  Or are you that much of a hypocrite?


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## Jeffrey_169 (Jan 19, 2010)

triemal04 said:


> You just don't get it.  I can understand you sentiments and wanting to help/have something done, but...what's being done is what can be done.  As I said in another thread, there is no magic wand to wave to fix this problem, and, if you haven't noticed, we have our own problems to deal with in the US (and certain other countries that we are committed to) at this time.
> 
> Not to mention the resources we have in this country are not infinite.  Transport 50,000 (or maybe that should be 500,000 or 5,000,000) people here...great...now what do you do with them?  Which hospitals do they go to?  How do you track them?  Who is responsible for them?  Who takes care of their day to day needs?  Who translates for them (French being the predominate language there)?  Who pays for it?  What happens after they are no longer sick/injured?  Who enforces that?  Do you actually think that you could just dump numbers that large onto any type of system without major problems?  Did you pay attention to what happened during Katrina and the aftermath?
> 
> But you do bring up an interesting point.  Why don't we do all the things you have talked about for the Haitians?  I mean, it's the right thing to do, isn't it?  Of course, in that case I do have to ask why you aren't jumping up and down and screaming that we do all that for the people in THIS COUNTRY that need help.  I mean, there are plenty of people in America who are in similar situations (though for different reasons) as the people of Haiti...where is your call to help them and the cost and resource demands be damned?  Or are you that much of a hypocrite?



It is incredible to me how you make such judgments upon someone you have never met, and then base it on speculation and a complete lack of topic relevance. I do advocate AMERICANS, I AM ONE!!! Everyday I speak out against he injustices dealt to our own people; the poverty, then financial turmoil, etc. I am a lifetime member of the NRA, I support the Tea Party, I have spent 14 years volunteering on multiple agencies, I have volunteered at a number of drives and other functions, and I work hard to raise awareness of veterans affairs and American ideals and needs. I grew up in a corrupt foster care system, I spent four years the Marine Corps, and I know what is is to be poor. I write my Congressman and Senators often. I have protested the misdeeds and injustices here in the US. You don't have a clue who you are talking about, and therefore I find you presumptuous and judgmental to the point of arrogance.  

As far as Haiti is concerned, I believe a person, or a nation, is only as good as its word. When you promise something and then refuse to  deliver you are a liar, and I have a zero tolerance policy for liars. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU MAKE SUCH ACCUSATORY STATMENTS!!! If we are going to help, then lets help the best ways we can, and if not then don't tell these people we are. I have dedicated my life to the needs of others, and although now I am married ad have 2 children my time is not as it once was, AI still do what I can without sacrificing my family. 

As too who will pay for it, hmmm lets see.....maybe the wealthy bankers and the auto industry can; after all they have been screwing us for years. It was our money who bailed them out because of their stupidity and ultimately their irresponsibility. How about the politicians who have taken our money for years and pocketed it, or gave it to special interest groups who have destroyed what America once was.

It has nothing to do with money, and everything to do with greed. I am all about helping Americans. I am against helping people who refuse to help themselves. 

Open your eyes, or are you too enveloped in your hypocrisy to see you might be incorrect in your own prejudgments and biases?


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## Jeffrey_169 (Jan 19, 2010)

It may not be right on topic, but yesterday another women was rescued from a building that collapsed on her. I watched on the news as the firefighters from LA were able to free her. Her fingers were pinned, but they were able to get them free and extricate her. She had been trapped there for 6 days without food, water, or light. 

She is one tough cookie. OOHRAH for the FF's who rescued her...it was a good day.


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## triemal04 (Jan 19, 2010)

Jeffrey_169 said:


> It is incredible to me how you make such judgments upon someone you have never met, and then base it on speculation and a complete lack of topic relevance. I do advocate AMERICANS, I AM ONE!!! Everyday I speak out against he injustices dealt to our own people; the poverty, then financial turmoil, etc. I am a lifetime member of the NRA, I support the Tea Party, I have spent 14 years volunteering on multiple agencies, I have volunteered at a number of drives and other functions, and I work hard to raise awareness of veterans affairs and American ideals and needs. I grew up in a corrupt foster care system, I spent four years the Marine Corps, and I know what is is to be poor. I write my Congressman and Senators often. I have protested the misdeeds and injustices here in the US. You don't have a clue who you are talking about, and therefore I find you presumptuous and judgmental to the point of arrogance.
> Good.  I'm glad you aren't a hypocrite of that level.  It's something that is very common to hear though, so I had to check.  I think though, that on this topic, you are letting your emotions get the better of you.
> 
> As far as Haiti is concerned, I believe a person, or a nation, is only as good as its word. When you promise something and then refuse to  deliver you are a liar, and I have a zero tolerance policy for liars. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU MAKE SUCH ACCUSATORY STATMENTS!!! If we are going to help, then lets help the best ways we can, and if not then don't tell these people we are. I have dedicated my life to the needs of others, and although now I am married ad have 2 children my time is not as it once was, AI still do what I can without sacrificing my family.
> ...


Replies in red.  Maybe.  I could be.  If you can show me some evidence of that then I'll admit you're right. But until then, you need to check your emotions at the door, look at all the facts as they relate to this situation, and realize that, like it or not, what is being done is what can be done.  Now, if you don't like it, then you need to go a step further in your volunteering.  Start working for an aid organization that goes to third-world countries BEFORE a disaster and works on fixing the problems BEFORE it get's this bad.  That is what will help prevent this type of situation from happening again.

It's good to have a strong belief system and be as passionate about things as you seem to be, but when it prevents you from admitting that what you want isn't feasible, or that you are wrong, it becomes a problem.


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## Jeffrey_169 (Jan 19, 2010)

I will this and then I will be done with this topic; with as much as we waste, we can do more. We can do more for our people, and we can do more for them. I am done trying to argue my point on this issue because it is getting me nowhere, and it is only causing turmoil. 

We all have our opinions, and we are all entitled to it. 

My prayers go out to these people.


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## triemal04 (Jan 19, 2010)

Jeffrey_169 said:


> I will this and then I will be done with this topic; with as much as we waste, we can do more. We can do more for our people, and we can do more for them. I am done trying to argue my point on this issue because it is getting me nowhere, and it is only causing turmoil.
> 
> We all have our opinions, and we are all entitled to it.
> 
> My prayers go out to these people.


Fair enough.  So let me have my parting words.  You're right.  We should do more for people (incluidng our own in THIS country).  But, for Haiti, the time to do it would have been in the years before this happened.  Right now...it's to bad there isn't more to be done, but for the situation that exists...  To bad it can't be more.


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