# Inside Combat Rescue



## RocketMedic

I caught the first episode last night on National Geographic, and I was blown away. Folks, this is not entertainment. It is a real-life documentary of USAF Pararescue Jumpers in Afghanistan, and it does not pull punches. Most of it is shot via helmet cameras, and it is pretty harrowing.

I'd recommend watching it for anyone who wants to be a military medic, regardless of service or nation. 
**WARNING**, not for the squeamish.


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## Handsome Robb

Definitely a good show. Been looking forward to it for a while, glad it didn't turn out to be garbage.


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## shfd739

Got it on the DVR to watch sometime this week. 

A few people were talking about it this morning and turns out our medic that just got back from deployment was flying from the same base as those guys when the series was being filmed. 

Super neat stuff. If I was younger I'd try to do it.


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## RocketMedic

Robb said:


> Definitely a good show. Been looking forward to it for a while, glad it didn't turn out to be garbage.



That's pretty much what you can look forward to as an Army flight medic, Robb.


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## DPM

When I deployed I saw RAF (Royal Air Force) Medivac and USAF Pararescue, but no US Army types. I was told it was because their Aircraft used the red cross and thus were un-armed, making them useless in Helmand. Any truth in this?


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## mycrofft

USAF combat rescue is definitely armed . (Hooah 129th).


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## RocketMedic

DPM said:


> When I deployed I saw RAF (Royal Air Force) Medivac and USAF Pararescue, but no US Army types. I was told it was because their Aircraft used the red cross and thus were un-armed, making them useless in Helmand. Any truth in this?



Truth.


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## mycrofft

Online article about the show.

http://www.channelguidemagblog.com/...ide-combat-rescue-national-geographic-channel


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## hibiti87

watched it last night, very good show.

are they using blood substitutes in the military yet?


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## Wheel

Just set it to record on my DVR. I'm excited.


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## wanderingmedic

*Online*

Does anyone know if/when the episodes will be available online or on itunes?


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## Household6

hibiti87 said:


> watched it last night, very good show.
> 
> are they using blood substitutes in the military yet?



No.. They just go into the chow hall or USO, and yell out a blood type they need.


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## Veneficus

hibiti87 said:


> watched it last night, very good show.
> 
> are they using blood substitutes in the military yet?



The studies on those have not been promising.

The military has the ability to use what it refers to as "a walking blood bank" and is one of the few places that transfuse whole blood and not a combination of blood components.

Besides, if the British attempt at making synthetic blood from stem-cell lines works, it will completely negate the need for these products.

Based on past results, it is far more likely to work than the synthetic products.


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## RocketMedic

Household6 said:


> No.. They just go into the chow hall or USO, and yell out a blood type they need.



My old platoon had three O- soldiers in the same squad. The one time it was needed, TOC simply put out an all-call and our battalion's five O-s showed up at the aid station.


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## Household6

Rocketmedic40 said:


> My old platoon had three O- soldiers in the same squad. The one time it was needed, TOC simply put out an all-call and our battalion's five O-s showed up at the aid station.



Good thing they all had sense enough not to jump on the "Pre-D train-up tattoo bandwagon"..  We had so many back in '05 who thought it would be oh so cool to get inked (exposed) before they shipped out. They never thought about not being eligible to give blood..


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## Wheel

Just watched it, very interesting. It's a tough job they have to do for sure.


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## WTEngel

Total job envy boner...not even gonna lie!


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## BSE

hibiti87 said:


> watched it last night, very good show.
> 
> are they using blood substitutes in the military yet?



As mentioned...no.

The J's and other USAF CASEVAC assets will fly with whole blood if they are working in an area with a bloodbank (Bastion does).  

Whole blood has been very valuable with initial resuscitation of battlefield trauma over the last decade. 

If blood is not available, colloid solutions are used in 500cc boluses until a total of 1000cc, then normal saline or LR from there.  The aim for BP is to have it titrated to about 90ish systolic.  *This only after all major bleeding has been stopped.


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## Handsome Robb

WTEngel said:


> Total job envy boner...not even gonna lie!



Agreed.

Always dreamt of swooping down from the sky sitting on the floor with my legs hanging out of the side door of a 60!

Shooting the minigun in flight is a close second.


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## Youngin

Pretty cool show. If you have Charter, it's free on-demand.


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## DPM

Any tips on where to catch it online?


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## medrills

Great show


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## Anonymous

DPM said:


> Any tips on where to catch it online?



http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iL6t6Z0YulA


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## wanderingmedic

Anonymous said:


> http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iL6t6Z0YulA



thank you. you are my new favorite person.


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## hogwiley

I admit to having expressed a very low opinion of military medicine in the past, but these guys are top notch.


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## chaz90

hogwiley said:


> I admit to having expressed a very low opinion of military medicine in the past, but these guys are top notch.



PJs are markedly different than most other military (or any other) EMS providers.


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## GaMedic

Great show for sure


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## Akulahawk

Thanks to some folks posting on this thread, I was able to catch the episodes on YouTube. Suffice it to say that if I were able to rewind the clock about twenty years, I could easily see myself wanting to become a PJ. In a way, if I had been born about twenty years later, and some circumstances had been slightly different, I probably would have given it a serious run.

Somehow, I have a very strong sneaking suspicion that I am simply too old…


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## mycrofft

COMCAST-OnDemand has episodes 1 and 2 as of today. Watched both. No ads.

I especially like that this show filmed then showed the basic humanity and the deployment sense of humor of these guys, who as a class in person tend to be physically and competitively very imposing. I wish they will do an overall show about this, since may of the PJ's belong to Guard units and are in on some extremely impressive saves during peacetime as well, using their COMBAT SHADOW version MC-130P's to refuel their PAVE HAWK helos.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/129th_Rescue_Wing 

This unit holds the over-all USA military record for distance over-water to a rescue and away from base to rescue (from Mountain View CA to, respectively, off of Hawai'i, and off the west coast of Mexico, each of which required finding fuel on the ground for the return leg.


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## Akulahawk

mycrofft said:


> COMCAST-OnDemand has episodes 1 and 2 as of today. Watched both. No ads.
> 
> I especially like that this show filmed then showed the basic humanity and the deployment sense of humor of these guys, who as a class in person tend to be physically and competitively very imposing. I wish they will do an overall show about this, since may of the PJ's belong to Guard units and are in on some extremely impressive saves during peacetime as well, using their COMBAT SHADOW version MC-130P's to refuel their PAVE HAWK helos.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/129th_Rescue_Wing
> 
> This unit holds the over-all USA military record for distance over-water to a rescue and away from base to rescue (from Mountain View CA to, respectively, off of Hawai'i, and off the west coast of Mexico, each of which required finding fuel on the ground for the return leg.


A guy that I used to work for also worked for the 129th Air Rescue Wing. He was with them for quite a while, and eventually got himself a full-time position with that unit.


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## mycrofft

Ditto but I left before we traded in our biplanes.



And definitely not a PJ.


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## AzValley

By far, best show on TV right now.  Can't get enough of it.


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## AzValley

Also check out surviving the cut.   The have a pj training episode.   It is pretty intense.


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## Y Knot

Guys I need some advice! I have no prior emergency medicine experience and am one step away from swearing in to ANG as an Aerospace Medical Tech. I am fine with blood and good with and love watching this show but how do I know that I will be able to keep a level head and handle the major gore and trauma I am sure to encounter as a Flight Medic/AMT in action? I would hate to commit to this job only to find out that in real life I pass out with major wounds and such.

Thanks!


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## chaz90

Make sure you know what the job is about before you commit to it. I'm sure you've done research, but you're not enlisting as a PJ. I don't think the AMT position is as oriented to critical or emergency care as you may be envisioning. Picture a tech or medical assistant at a primary care office.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/airforceenlistedjobs/a/afjob4n0x1.htm


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## Y Knot

Thanks Chaz. Yes I have read the description and understand what it is about. I am actually going into the CERFP program so my squadrons response would be on something rather major within the USA. Really my goal is to take this as far as I can go and on the civilian side get to Paramedic or perhaps even ER Doc. I tend to be a 110% kind of guy which is why I want to make sure I can handle the gross of the gross before jumping in.


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## FearTheSkill

*I really wanted to do that*

I think that show is very informative. I wish they came out with something earlier.


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## Walter Sobchak

Y Knot said:


> Guys I need some advice! I have no prior emergency medicine experience and am one step away from swearing in to ANG as an Aerospace Medical Tech. I am fine with blood and good with and love watching this show but how do I know that I will be able to keep a level head and handle the major gore and trauma I am sure to encounter as a Flight Medic/AMT in action? I would hate to commit to this job only to find out that in real life I pass out with major wounds and such.
> 
> Thanks!



Take a Wilderness EMT course, and work with a volunteer ambulance as much as possible.  i saw some pretty rough wounds in Iraq, also you will prob get trigger time so make sure you are cool with that aspect.  Some ambulance services will let you do ride alongs as a EFR or Driver.


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## takl23

There is a show on Discovery that is now on Netflix streaming that goes behind the scenes of Special Operations and one episode focuses on PJ's. The show is called Surviving the Cut. Season 1 Episode 2 focuses on PJ's. They don't cover much medicine but they cover the physical aspect of the training quite heavily. 

If you want a larger picture seek this episode out and the entire series is worth the watch IMHO.


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## emtblaze

decided to give it a watch after seeing this post. Wasn't disappointing. 

If anyone else is looking for it, I found it on youtube- Just search 
"Inside Combat Rescue - Episode 1 "


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## airbornemedic11

DPM said:


> When I deployed I saw RAF (Royal Air Force) Medivac and USAF Pararescue, but no US Army types. I was told it was because their Aircraft used the red cross and thus were un-armed, making them useless in Helmand. Any truth in this?


 
True. See back in 1538, the US and a few other nations, which no longer exist, were dumb enough to sign this well intended, but outdated and useless document, called the Geneva Convention. It pretty much handcuffed our infantry and gave the advantage to our enemies. One rule states that any vehicle, aircraft or watercraft displaying a Red Cross or dedicated as a Medevac, can not have crew served weapons on board. So your medic better be a damn good shot with his M-4, from 500+ yds, from a moving helicopter.


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## chaz90

airbornemedic11 said:


> True. See back in 1538, the US and a few other nations, which no longer exist, were dumb enough to sign this well intended, but outdated and useless document, called the Geneva Convention. It pretty much handcuffed our infantry and gave the advantage to our enemies. One rule states that any vehicle, aircraft or watercraft displaying a Red Cross or dedicated as a Medevac, can not have crew served weapons on board. So your medic better be a damn good shot with his M-4, from 500+ yds, from a moving helicopter.



Apologies for being nitpicky, but my history nerd is about to show. You're a few hundred years off on the Geneva Convention. First was in 1864, but the one we typically reference when talking about the Geneva Convention occurred in 1949. The US didn't really exist in 1538 either. I'd say you might be thinking about the Magna Carta as another big historical document, but 1500s are about three centuries too late for that one.


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## mycrofft

Household6 said:


> No.. They just go into the chow hall or USO, and yell out a blood type they need.



You mean a DFAC?
:huh:


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## mycrofft

Y Knot said:


> Guys I need some advice! I have no prior emergency medicine experience and am one step away from swearing in to ANG as an Aerospace Medical Tech. I am fine with blood and good with and love watching this show but how do I know that I will be able to keep a level head and handle the major gore and trauma I am sure to encounter as a Flight Medic/AMT in action? I would hate to commit to this job only to find out that in real life I pass out with major wounds and such.
> 
> Thanks!



Aerospace medics , I believe, have nothing to do with the PJ's except give them immunizations and DNF's ("Do Not Fly"), which make them and the PJ's natural enemies from the PJ's point of view. Maybe the ROLE 2 uses them differently than stateside? (Of course).


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## mycrofft

airbornemedic11 said:


> True. See back in 1538, the US and a few other nations, which no longer exist, were dumb enough to sign this well intended, but outdated and useless document, called the Geneva Convention. It pretty much handcuffed our infantry and gave the advantage to our enemies. One rule states that any vehicle, aircraft or watercraft displaying a Red Cross or dedicated as a Medevac, can not have crew served weapons on board. So your medic better be a damn good shot with his M-4, from 500+ yds, from a moving helicopter.



Just take the red cross off the copter and arm it. PJ's are not medics, they are combat troops with enhanced medical abilities and responsibilities. They don't go in with peashooters.

 And any medic is allowed to defend himself, his patient, and his facility and logistics, with lethal force if necessary.


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## socalmedic

mycrofft said:


> ... PJ's are not medics, they are combat troops with enhanced medical abilities and responsibilities...



or are they medics with enhanced combat abilities and responsibilities...:unsure: when they are embedded with other units are they not there to fill the medic role? they way I look at it is over 24 months of training 9 of them will be medical.


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## socalmedic

double post


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## airbornemedic11

Originally Posted by *airbornemedic11* 

 
_True. See back in 1538, the US and a few other nations, which no longer exist, were dumb enough to sign this well intended, but outdated and useless document, called the Geneva Convention. It pretty much handcuffed our infantry and gave the advantage to our enemies. One rule states that any vehicle, aircraft or watercraft displaying a Red Cross or dedicated as a Medevac, can not have crew served weapons on board. So your medic better be a damn good shot with his M-4, from 500+ yds, from a moving helicopter._



chaz90 said:


> Apologies for being nitpicky, but my history nerd is about to show. You're a few hundred years off on the Geneva Convention. First was in 1864, but the one we typically reference when talking about the Geneva Convention occurred in 1949. The US didn't really exist in 1538 either. I'd say you might be thinking about the Magna Carta as another big historical document, but 1500s are about three centuries too late for that one.


 

Apologies for using sarcasm.


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## 11bangbang

DPM said:


> When I deployed I saw RAF (Royal Air Force) Medivac and USAF Pararescue, but no US Army types. I was told it was because their Aircraft used the red cross and thus were un-armed, making them useless in Helmand. Any truth in this?




you were in helmand province which is held down by the usmc and uk together. certain branch's get better equipment and assets. However, OVER in RC EAST(ontrolled by the army),in thetangi valley climbing mountains,breathing in dirt...we got something called good ole blackhawk (uh60) and yes they are armed and yes they have regular ARMY medics on board. and never fly alone. always in 2 pairs. for coverage/support, but even then....it still doesnt always make it on the ground :sad:

everyone thinks the hollywood marines do all the fighting..HA! yeah okay. when pigs fly.....


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## mycrofft

Hahaha. Good on you!


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## Handsome Robb

11bangbang said:


> you were in helmand province which is held down by the usmc and uk together. certain branch's get better equipment and assets. However, OVER in RC EAST(ontrolled by the army),in thetangi valley climbing mountains,breathing in dirt...we got something called good ole blackhawk (uh60) and yes they are armed and yes they have regular ARMY medics on board. and never fly alone. always in 2 pairs. for coverage/support, but even then....it still doesnt always make it on the ground :sad:
> 
> everyone thinks the hollywood marines do all the fighting..HA! yeah okay. when pigs fly.....



I have a buddy that flew MEDEVAC in a Army National Guard unit right along side the PJs in Helmand province as well. Definitely not just PJs and RAF.


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## 11bangbang

Robb said:


> I have a buddy that flew MEDEVAC in a Army National Guard unit right along side the PJs in Helmand province as well. Definitely not just PJs and RAF.



yup, majority of aviation crew are warrant officers and national guard. for the army at least.


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## Handsome Robb

11bangbang said:


> yup, majority of aviation crew are warrant officers and national guard. for the army at least.



Sorry should have clarified. He's a flight medic in the 1/168th DUSTOFF unit. So someone flew him in Helmand


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## 11bangbang

Robb said:


> Sorry should have clarified. He's a flight medic in the 1/168th DUSTOFF unit. So someone flew him in Helmand



its a national guard unit. most NG dont see real intense combat or leave the wire, verus the active duty troops...especially light infantry...now the medics that are attached to the infantry..have a pretty rough job as long as you can hack it.


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## DPM

11bangbang said:


> its a national guard unit. most NG dont see real intense combat or leave the wire, verus the active duty troops...especially light infantry...now the medics that are attached to the infantry..have a pretty rough job as long as you can hack it.



The ANG PJs from Moffet might have something to say about that...

And when I said we didn't see US Army units I was just speaking from experience. I didn't see any USN / USMC medevac either.


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## RocketMedic

11bangbang said:


> its a national guard unit. most NG dont see real intense combat or leave the wire, verus the active duty troops...especially light infantry...now the medics that are attached to the infantry..have a pretty rough job as long as you can hack it.



You would be sorely mistaken. Who are you and what sort of training do you have again?
Also, I see that Fort Benning still does not mandate proper grammar.


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## Handsome Robb

11bangbang said:


> its a national guard unit. most NG dont see real intense combat or leave the wire, verus the active duty troops...especially light infantry...now the medics that are attached to the infantry..have a pretty rough job as long as you can hack it.



:rofl:

Really?  I'd love to see you tell the guys from my agency that are in that unit that.

You know why the Army now requires EMT-P for 68WF3s? Because the 1/168th made the active duty DUSTOFF units look like fools clinically. 

The PJs were generally the cover helo for them while they snatched patients. They use PJs as the snatch for missions labeled high risk.

Your information is very flawed, my friend. I'd check your facts before you start offending people with your statements. 

I'd take a 1/168th medic over a combat vet active duty 68W any day of the week. Except for rocket...I'd trust him haha


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## 11bangbang

Rocketmedic40 said:


> You would be sorely mistaken. Who are you and what sort of training do you have again?
> Also, I see that Fort Benning still does not mandate proper grammar.



mm not goin to brag about anything, nor care for how i spell over a computer bud. i got more combat experience than you, more schools, i can tell you that. Fort Benning is the backbone of the military inf train. so in reality stfu. I chose infantry because you ACTUALLY FIGHT the war. 

did too many 11bz punk you while you were in???
awww how cute.


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## 11bangbang

Robb said:


> :rofl:
> 
> Really?  I'd love to see you tell the guys from my agency that are in that unit that.
> 
> You know why the Army now requires EMT-P for 68WF3s? Because the 1/168th made the active duty DUSTOFF units look like fools clinically.
> 
> The PJs were generally the cover helo for them while they snatched patients. They use PJs as the snatch for missions labeled high risk.



Really? you think pjs actually go on patrol and look for enemy fighters? ya didn't think so. no i don't really care about the army anymore, i'm not in bud. 
any military personnel is used poorly as a number. not for any specific reason DERP. 
cool story about your agency bro. i know more "basic" 68w, 18yr olds that have performed more medical aid than a paramedic...in a warzone.


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## chaz90

RIP Thread


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## PotatoMedic

Yeah... it was good information for a while.  Anyone know how long the PJ pipe line is?  Last time I hear it was two years.  Least that is what my brother in law told me.  (an air combat controller with 12 years in).


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## rwik123

11bangbang said:


> Really? you think pjs actually go on patrol and look for enemy fighters? ya didn't think so. no i don't really care about the army anymore, i'm not in bud.
> any military personnel is used poorly as a number. not for any specific reason DERP.
> cool story about your agency bro. i know more "basic" 68w, 18yr olds that have performed more medical aid than a paramedic...in a warzone.



I'm not sure of the percentage but its a split between flight based PJs on a helo, and AFSOC PJs that are attached to SOF groups (Think its like 70% to 20% unit wise). It is the latter that actually go on patrol/ground missions, and the direct action stuff. Direct action is not their usual task (CSAR being their main skillset) but if you think PJs are not capable of a DA mission set, you are highly disillusioned.


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## rwik123

FireWA1 said:


> Yeah... it was good information for a while.  Anyone know how long the PJ pipe line is?  Last time I hear it was two years.  Least that is what my brother in law told me.  (an air combat controller with 12 years in).



This gives an overview http://www.pararescue.com/unitinfo.aspx?id=446


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## PotatoMedic

Thanks!  Just looking at that the only two schools he would need to attend are the paramedic course and the PARARESCUE Recovery Specialist Course.  Granted that is more than half the pipeline but still only two of 7 needed.  Any who...  Now I need to keep an eye out for the black helicopters that are coming to get me.  Never know if you have said too much...


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## Wheel

chaz90 said:


> RIP Thread



Killing them like the plague


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## Handsome Robb

11bangbang said:


> Really? you think pjs actually go on patrol and look for enemy fighters? ya didn't think so. no i don't really care about the army anymore, i'm not in bud.
> any military personnel is used poorly as a number. not for any specific reason DERP.
> cool story about your agency bro. i know more "basic" 68w, 18yr olds that have performed more medical aid than a paramedic...in a warzone.



This is a thread about military MEDEVAC units. No one cares that you were an 11b or "actually fought" at all. I thought the military taught humility but apparently not. 

Who ever said anything about PJs going out on patrol looking for enemy fighters? Apparently you not only suck at writing but reading as well...

Military medics are awesome at treating trauma. Put a sick, complex medical patient in front of them and let's see what happens. 

I didn't tell you a story about my agency, bro. I told you to tell the guys I work with who are in an NG MEDEVAC unit that they never fly outside the wire or see contact and see how they react. 

With all due respect to the whiskeys out there that aren't idiots, congrats, your 18 year old, basic military medics can apply a tourniquet and request a MEDEVAC, which often times is a NG unit. Cool story, bro. 

"Any military personnel is used poorly as a number. not for any specific reason DERP" what does that even mean? 


No one gives a rat's *** about your combat experience, how many people you killed, how many patrols you went on or how "tough" you are. I deal with vets like you on a daily basis, being in the military doesn't give the right to be a douche bag. You served your country? Awesome, thank you for your service, if I had fractured my neck in high school I would have been over there with you saving your dumbass when you got cocky and got yourself shot. We serve our cities and counties every day at work and you don't see us civilian medics looking for handouts or special treatment because of it. Now get your self-entitled *** out of here.


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## ffemt8978

As the only veteran among the Community Leaders, I pay particular attention to these types of threads.  As such, I will not tolerate the disrespect that I see being tossed around in both directions in this thread.

So let me put everyone on notice...

*KNOCK IT OFF OR YOU WILL BE THE FOCUS OF MY COMPLETE AND UNDIVIDED ATTENTION AS LONG AS IT TAKES ME TO BAN YOU...

I :censored::censored::censored::censored: YOU NOT!*

This thread is now closed.


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