# Paramedic Challenge



## d3653je (Dec 3, 2010)

I did a search and did not see a thread so if this is a dup, I am sorry.

Does anyone know of any Paramedic Program that offers advanced placement and or the ability to challenge their programs tests? Mine is kind of a long story but I was advised to search for a program that might offer this option. This would not be or should I say I would not be one of these book smart people looking for any easy way out. I completed a Paramedic Program in the 1990's and want to get back into things which is proving to be a lot harder than I thought it would be. For those who may say things have changed and testing would be a bad idea, In the last six months I have completed EMT-B, ACLS, PALS, PHTLS, TCCC, and a DOT 40 hour Paramedic Refresher Course and test so I am current on all the advances that have been made so any help guys and gals would be of great value to me.

Thank you.


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## Flight-LP (Dec 4, 2010)

http://www.emtlife.com/showthread.php?p=247270#post247270

You got some answers and suggestions from your previous thread.

There are some programs that require only 3-6 months to complete, these are going to be your most expedient options. 

Is there a program that you can simply "test out" of? Nope, might as well accept it now.

Do yourself and your future clientele a favor, do it right and get the education that you need to adequately perform as a Paramedic.

Good luck!


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## d3653je (Dec 7, 2010)

Thank you.

Yeah the previous thread had a few people make suggestions that were positive in nature. The rest were cheap shots taken by the cyber bully crowd... you know the ones that hide behind a computer and won't say jack to your face. 

In any event I am doing my best to stay upbeat and looking for a way to solve this. There is some data that I did not post in either threads that could change minds but I am not ready to release that just yet.

All in all... just looking for someone somewhere to give me a chance. I just want to test and let the test scores be the judge.


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## reaper (Dec 7, 2010)

No offense, but if you are unwilling to fully explain what the circumstances are that make you think you have a right to just "test out". Then you better expect the answers you received. There are to many out there that try to take the easy way out. 

EMS has changed greatly since the 90's. Taking the alphabet classes are not going to bring you up to speed. I walked away for 3 years and still redid the entire class, because that's how much things had changed. You are dealing with peoples lives. Do what needs to be done, to make sure you have the proper education, for your pts sake!


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## d3653je (Dec 7, 2010)

PM me and I can explain


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## fast65 (Dec 7, 2010)

I have the perfect solution to your problem...take another paramedic course, take the test, PASS the test and then you can call yourself a paramedic. That is the only solution to your problem right now, the time you've spent so far trying to challenge an organizations (NREMT) policies, that are plainly and simply stated btw, could have been used to begin a medic course.

EDIT: Oh yes, I don't know of any programs that offer advanced placement.


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## d3653je (Dec 8, 2010)

Can someone answer this question with an intelligent response and not drama?

Taking in all that everyone has said from here and everywhere else I ask this question, what does NREMT stand to lose by letting me take the CBT? If I fail then well... that will speak for itself. Many in here see that as a likely outcome. I test and I pass... well then that means in spite of the issues raised by others, I am up for the task... which in this case would be the skills test. One step at a time. Tests are designed to assess one's ability to learn, retain, and to perform to the standards the test governs.


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## fast65 (Dec 8, 2010)

I'm sorry, I guess I'm just confused with how my response wasn't intelligent?

The NREMT isn't letting you challenge it because if they make an exception for you, then they have to make an exception for everyone. Your situation (or at least the details you've provided) is not a unique one by any means and the NREMT obviously hasn't seen any reason to to grant you the PRIVELAGE to test.


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## d3653je (Dec 8, 2010)

Maybe I am starting to give in to what has been told to me on this forum. I am not giving up but looking for a plan B. Given the fact I have ticked off most on here, this next question should continue to do the same...

Medic Mills and other like terms, anybody know of any? May not be the ideal plan or choice but at this point an option to consider.


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## Flight-LP (Dec 8, 2010)

Yeah, most of us know a medic mill or two. While I can't speak for others, I will not provide you any information on them.

I got your PM and really don't know what to say other than your conspiracy theory is laughable at best. It is quite easy to receive the same grade twice if you missed the same number of questions. It really is that simple. If you feel that the National Registry was biased or discriminated in its testing, then you should have filed a formal complaint at that time. Not over a decade later when you realized that you passed on a potentially great career opportunity.

Look, here's the deal and the reality. 14 years ago you failed to meet the prescribed completion standards to receive credentials from a nationally based testing agency. As such, you did not become a Paramedic. You now have to meet those standards to qualify for another testing opportunity. PERIOD! Absolutely nothing you can do will change the National Registry's standpoint. You cannot sue them, you have no recourse through your State or Congressman. You are trying to fight a national testing agency that clearly outlines it's standards and one that has provided valid and reliable results. Accept it and move on or continue to waste your time and further damage any level of credibility you possess. Doesn't matter to most of us either way, but let's clear the air of any question you may have. You are not a Paramedic, you are not currently qualified to be a Paramedic, nor will you be one until you meet the prescribed requirements.

Do a search of previous threads on this site and you will find the half a$$ed methods you seek to cut corners and obtain a minimalistic education. I hope you reconsider, but I'm not banking on it. Either way, good luck..............................


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## fast65 (Dec 8, 2010)

Flight-LP said:


> Yeah, most of us know a medic mill or two. While I can't speak for others, I will not provide you any information on them.
> 
> I got your PM and really don't know what to say other than your conspiracy theory is laughable at best. It is quite easy to receive the same grade twice if you missed the same number of questions. It really is that simple. If you feel that the National Registry was biased or discriminated in its testing, then you should have filed a formal complaint at that time. Not over a decade later when you realized that you passed on a potentially great career opportunity.
> 
> ...



Well, I suppose you just said everything I was thinking. 

Thousands of people have been in the same situation you have (i.e. outside of their testing window) and they took the smart way out, they went back to school, got an education and then took the test again. Now I personally don't care if you want to go to a medic mill, but please, give what I'm about to say some very, very serious thought. Why do you really want to be a paramedic? Do you really, truthfully want to be the person that people put their trust and hope in during an emergency, or do you just want a patch and a job? Quite honestly...if you're considering a medic mill, then the answer is more than likely the latter. 

I'll step down off my soap box now.


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## d3653je (Dec 8, 2010)

See all this doubt about me, my skills, knowledge, and abilities. Now we can add to the list a conspiracy theorist, a guy who does not care about patients and just wants money, somebody looking for short cuts to get to that payday, a jerk who thinks he deserves a second because he completed a real Paramedic class 14 years ago.  Did I leave anything else out? Please feel free to add. It would be a true shame if people out there actually believed that this a$$hole who wants to test actually cares about people and wants to make a difference. He must be a real jerk in real life... the :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: is a true wanna be and nuts for thinking he could or should be a Paramedic. I sure hope he never has to take care of anyone I care about because this Medic wanna be loser clearly has no knowledge or skills to take care of people. So what if he thinks he cares, he has no business being in EMS because I am sure his abilities are lacking and I can base this on his words here... I don't need to know him or run calls with him to pass that judgment.  This jerk d3653je is clearly in it just for a patch and money...nothing more! Everyone please add more and lets see just how much assumptions we can make about this guy... what a jerk!


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## reaper (Dec 8, 2010)

There have been some shots taken and that is not right. But, you still can't see the big picture. 

You never finished being certified. It has been 14 years. In which time, EMS has done major changes. If you had 10 years experience as a medic. We would still tell you the same thing. 

There are rules for a reason. They must be followed. Your schooling 14 years ago makes no difference today. It is outdated and the school was only part of being a medic. I don't know why you choose not to finish your testing. You should have fought it then. 

If you want to be a good well respected medic today. Do not take the easy way and go to a quick mill. Go back to school and get a full education. Do that for yourself and most of all for your pts.


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## fast65 (Dec 8, 2010)

d3653je said:


> See all this doubt about me, my skills, knowledge, and abilities. Now we can add to the list a conspiracy theorist, a guy who does not care about patients and just wants money, somebody looking for short cuts to get to that payday, a jerk who thinks he deserves a second because he completed a real Paramedic class 14 years ago.  Did I leave anything else out? Please feel free to add. It would be a true shame if people out there actually believed that this a$$hole who wants to test actually cares about people and wants to make a difference. He must be a real jerk in real life... the :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: is a true wanna be and nuts for thinking he could or should be a Paramedic. I sure hope he never has to take care of anyone I care about because this Medic wanna be loser clearly has no knowledge or skills to take care of people. So what if he thinks he cares, he has no business being in EMS because I am sure his abilities are lacking and I can base this on his words here... I don't need to know him or run calls with him to pass that judgment.  This jerk d3653je is clearly in it just for a patch and money...nothing more! Everyone please add more and lets see just how much assumptions we can make about this guy... what a jerk!



Well now that we have that established, if you really want to go to a medic mill just do a quick forum search.


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## terrible one (Dec 8, 2010)

I guess I don't understand the dilemma in taking a NON-ACCELERATED course in paramedicine. I mean what it's two semesters of school??!?!?! You can get a paramedic license easily in less than a year from a repuatbale college, why are people trying so hard and desperate to go through mills in 3-6months? what are you saving a few months at best? wtf? 
paramedic education is already a joke in the US comparred to actual health care degrees, why are so many in hurry to rush through the process? 
I guess I'll never understand it. This wasn't meant directly to the OP as much as the one post a week we get on here about how some accelerated course.


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## d3653je (Dec 8, 2010)

I don't know a whole lot about the mills but in looking around I have formed an opinion. One clearly would benefit more from a full year like course than a mill. If a person is a Basic and wants to become a Medic, a mill would be the last place to go. I agree a mill is 100% fast food. 

That being said, for both others and myself who fall into this pit if you will, a mill seems like a viable option.

I know that sounds like a paradox and it is what it is. Two trains of thought come to mind. Would a student who has never had formal schooling in Paramedicine be able to get a good quality education at a mill? I am going to say 90% of the time no. Too much to learn in such a short amount of time. It is a recipe for failure not to mention stress. Now in the same breath I say that those who have had formal training and education in the past may be the right students for a mill. 

For the sake of argument lets call me and the others out there who are in the same jam... pre-paramedics. Again don't focus on the name tag I just made it up. Going into a mill environment armed with the knowledge learned in the past, the high place flow should be something a pre-medic can handle. 

For example cardiology, to a new Medic student I could see a chapter being this is a P wave and this is what is means/does. This is a QRS complex and this is what it does. This ekg tracing is A-fib and this is what a-fib is. A good Medic school will take those terms and explain them very well, much like the Paramedic school I went to. A mill may cram that along with other in depth knowledge into a one day lecture. For a person like myself, keeping the pace and tempo would be easier since I did all this years ago and did a lot of this through various jobs. What is my foundation to support this... I am going to say the relative ease it was for me to pass the various ALS classes I have mentioned. I know that is going to tick people off but it his the honest truth.

It seems like in a perfect world there could be a series of tests one could take to establish a baseline and see where their strengths and weaknesses are. You then apply that data to a class structured or design for those who completed ALS a while back and need a tune up. In theory this could be a 4-6 week course that would bring a pre-medic up to speed.

However while the above suggestion for a course makes sense to be and to perhaps even some of you readers, sadly no course exists. The closet course that comes to this would be a mill. Is a mill the perfect answer, no way at all. However mills are the only viable option aside from taking a real Paramedic class, like you all have done and like how I did in 1996. The school I went to in 1996 will always be my Medic school. A mill is something I had to do because the situation warrants it. 

Now going in some what of a different direction and this is just a question so keyboard warriors cease fire... EMT-I, is testing out at that level an option or should I cease that thought?


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## TransportJockey (Dec 8, 2010)

d3653je said:


> Now going in some what of a different direction and this is just a question so keyboard warriors cease fire... EMT-I, is testing out at that level an option or should I cease that thought?



By NREMT, it wouldn't happen. They do let people who can match the requirements test for EMT-I if something has happened and they don't finish medic school. That's how I got my EMT-I (all didactic and most clinicals were completed). But there's the time limit from when classes were finished that you have to deal with for that. I doubt any state office would let you test for it since your original class was in 96.


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## Aerin-Sol (Dec 9, 2010)

terrible one said:


> I guess I don't understand the dilemma in taking a NON-ACCELERATED course in paramedicine. I mean what it's two semesters of school??!?!?! You can get a paramedic license easily in less than a year from a repuatbale college



Really? The ones in my area are 1 year of pre-reqs + 2 years of classes/clinicals.


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## fast65 (Dec 9, 2010)

d3653je said:


> Now going in some what of a different direction and this is just a question so keyboard warriors cease fire... EMT-I, is testing out at that level an option or should I cease that thought?



Probably not...see, I can play nice B)


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## reaper (Dec 9, 2010)

No one will allow you to test. You have been out of school too long!


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## Outbac1 (Dec 9, 2010)

I can't comment on how testing and certifications are done in the US as I am in Canada. However, here we just had a medic come back to service after almost 5 years away. He was 2 months from having to go to school all over again. He just got his application in, in time. As it was he had to take weeks of refresher training to be certified again. I also know a Dr. who has been away from practice for over 10 years and has to do at least a 2 year refresher to requalify. My sister has her RN but hasn't worked for 20 years. It would almost be faster for her to take a 4 year Bsc. than to requalify. 

 The bottom line is that no matter how smart or good you are or were, it has been too long a time away. You have to start again. Your previous experience just means it should be easier this time around. Best of luck.


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## Flight-LP (Dec 9, 2010)

d3653je said:


> I am going to say the relative ease it was for me to pass the various ALS classes I have mentioned. I know that is going to tick people off but it his the honest truth.



It is the truth, I agree with you there. But then again, my 10 year old daughter could take and successfully complete an ACLS and PALS class. It isn't rocket science and you can't fail them anymore (see, yet another change from 14 years ago).



d3653je said:


> It seems like in a perfect world there could be a series of tests one could take to establish a baseline and see where their strengths and weaknesses are. You then apply that data to a class structured or design for those who completed ALS a while back and need a tune up. In theory this could be a 4-6 week course that would bring a pre-medic up to speed.
> 
> However while the above suggestion for a course makes sense to be and to perhaps even some of you readers, sadly no course exists. The closet course that comes to this would be a mill. Is a mill the perfect answer, no way at all. However mills are the only viable option aside from taking a real Paramedic class, like you all have done and like how I did in 1996. The school I went to in 1996 will always be my Medic school. A mill is something I had to do because the situation warrants it.



It is not sad, nor does any "situation" "warrant" it. I believe very few professionals out there would agree with your conception of the perfect world. Honestly, all I am continuously hearing is how you JUST DO NOT WANT TO DO ANOTHER PARAMEDIC COURSE! I know quite a few people who did a medic program more than once for whatever reasons life presented. You are not unique or special and you deserve no consideration above what any other applicant for certification should receive.


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## Sasha (Dec 9, 2010)

> It would be a true shame if people out there actually believed that this a$$hole who wants to test actually cares about people and wants to make a difference.



What is truly a shame is that you don't see if you truly cared about your patients and wanted to make a difference, you'd swallow your pride and go to a GOOD paramedic program. Medicine has changed in the past 14 years. Heck, it's changed since I've been in school! You can't possibly learn all you need to know and be proficient in your skill set from a simple refresher and a few alphabet courses. The refresher is there for people who have taken the course recently, not way back when.

A great paramedic knows that medicine is always changing and education is very important.


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## TheyCallMeNasty (Dec 9, 2010)

d3653je said:


> I don't know a whole lot about the mills but in looking around I have formed an opinion. One clearly would benefit more from a full year like course than a mill. If a person is a Basic and wants to become a Medic, a mill would be the last place to go. I agree a mill is 100% fast food.


Im sure basics that have trained and worked in recent years prolly have a better grasp on todays ems than someone that went to school 14 years ago. If anything you would benefit more from a full year course.


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## terrible one (Dec 9, 2010)

Aerin-Sol said:


> Really? The ones in my area are 1 year of pre-reqs + 2 years of classes/clinicals.



Schools all around the country will have different requirements. Some here have pre-reqs adding up to a year but many only require an EMT card and then only satisfy the 1,000 hours of school in two semesters


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## ERMedic (Dec 10, 2010)

Wanna take the NREMT-P test? Heres an idea....GO TAKE A PARAMEDIC COURSE, PASS THE CLASS AND THEN TAKE THE DAMN TEST! Stop crying and do it.


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## Trauma Chaser (Dec 10, 2010)

your not even an emt......or a first responder lol....a lot has changed in the last 15 years buddy!!! your better off taking the 2 years and starting over. i did the same thing you did only to the emt level and decided just to start over to be a paramedic....its all worked out but i was glad i redid the 6 month emt class.


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## Chimpie (Dec 12, 2010)

Several posts have been removed from this thread. 

*Please keep it on topic and remember our first rule: Be Polite.*

The CL Team will be watching this thread closely.


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