# Clinicals



## EMT-B2B (Dec 24, 2008)

Can anyone tell me what the majority of the cliniclas will be like or what they consist of in the EMT-B school. I am getting ready to start the school on Jan. 23rd and would just like a heads-up on the clinicals, ie. how often, when, where, etc. Thanks a Ton!


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## rhan101277 (Dec 24, 2008)

I had to do one 12 hour clinical at the emergency room and it was done about two months into class.


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## Shishkabob (Dec 24, 2008)

Too many factors.

My school required 80 hours of clinical between ERs/Ambulances/Fire depts.


You could have a day where you don't rest at all (My ambulance ones) or you could go a whole day with only 3 calls (my Fire Dept. one).

You can have major trauma (especially when at the local level 1 trauma center) or you could have respiratory arrest.




Just keep in mind you're a student and there to learn and most people will be more then willing to teach you AND give you the 'fun' stuff.


My first clinical at a hospital, they had me bag a lady for over an hour for practice before CareFlight came.


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## 41 Duck (Dec 24, 2008)

Depends on where you are, I guess.  We weren't required to do any clinical time to get our EMT-B here in PA.


Later!

--Coop


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## Ridryder911 (Dec 24, 2008)

41 Duck said:


> Depends on where you are, I guess.  We weren't required to do any clinical time to get our EMT-B here in PA.
> 
> 
> Later!
> ...



In which I do not understand how some states can do this? Even NHTSA requires 8 ED and 8 EMS. As well, we wonder why they don't understand some things. 

R/r 911


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## silver (Dec 24, 2008)

I did mine in a ED on Thursday and Friday nights from 11pm-6am. Great time slot for a student. I mostly took vitals, and it was really good practice. Take as man vitals as possible. When there was down time I followed a tech, and I got to see the cool things. I had a MVA victim come in, so got to see the trauma team assemble and work.

Just remember you are there to learn, don't be afraid to ask questions.


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## 41 Duck (Dec 24, 2008)

Rid:  I hear you, but really... would sixteen hours make all that much of a difference?  


Later!

--Coop


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## reaper (Dec 24, 2008)

A big difference.


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## Shishkabob (Dec 24, 2008)

41 Duck said:


> Rid:  I hear you, but really... would sixteen hours make all that much of a difference?
> 
> 
> Later!
> ...




16 is better then 8 is better then 0.


But always volunteer to do more... I was able to do 96 total even though only 80 was required..


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## marineman (Dec 25, 2008)

Ridryder911 said:


> In which I do not understand how some states can do this? Even NHTSA requires 8 ED and 8 EMS. As well, we wonder why they don't understand some things.
> 
> R/r 911



Hmm, do you have a link for me? I'd like to show my school. For EMT-B we didn't have any set number of hours but had to get 5 patient contacts on the ambulance. No ER time required but that might be because no hospitals in my area hire EMT-B's. If it's an NHTSA requirement though I'd say our school needs to change.


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## Ridryder911 (Dec 25, 2008)

Actually field or ED clinicals are written in the NHTSA requirements. Unfortunately, states such as MA & PA can and have excluded them. Very shameful and is a good representation upon what they consider the EMT level to be. 

This is one of the many reasons, the EMT level is not regarded to be very accountable. One cannot even say they have been on a EMS unit or seen a real patient. Even though most Basic clinicals are usually just exposure. Strange in comparison of some that requires 60 -100 hours (which is still negligible but better than nothing). 

The suggested requirements are in the EMT and EMS instructor materials from NHTSA. 

R/r 911


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## Shishkabob (Dec 26, 2008)

Well, considering most classes are 120-150 hours, I actually think 100 hours in clinicals is not too shabby since it almost doubles the time of the course.


Granted, some of you want the class longer to begin with, but you take what you can get.  

I noticed that those in my class who didn't sign up for extra shifts failed the class.  45 started, 20 finished, of which statistically, 13 with get certified.


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## JPINFV (Dec 26, 2008)

marineman said:


> Hmm, do you have a link for me? I'd like to show my school. For EMT-B we didn't have any set number of hours but had to get 5 patient contacts on the ambulance. No ER time required but that might be because no hospitals in my area hire EMT-B's. If it's an NHTSA requirement though I'd say our school needs to change.





> *Clinical/Field Rotations*
> 
> In addition to the required 110 hours of instruction, this course requires that the student have patient interactions in a clinical setting.  Ideally, areas that have access to an Emergency Medical Services system should send students into the field with experienced preceptors.  However, in low volume systems or systems with legal considerations, the training program may utilize emergency departments, clinics, or physician offices.  The program director or medical director must establish appropriate relationships with various clinical sites to assure adequate contact with patients.
> 
> ...



http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/ems/pub/emtbnsc.doc

page 34


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## jochi1543 (Dec 26, 2008)

Hm, my school doesn't require any clinicals for EMT-B/EMR. The closest we ever got to it was going to the EMT-I classroom and taking vitals on them.


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## marineman (Dec 27, 2008)

JPINFV said:


> http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/ems/pub/emtbnsc.doc
> 
> page 34



Thank you sir, seems as if my school read that particular page before as that's exactly what we had to do.


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## EMT-B2B (Dec 27, 2008)

Thanks for the replies! The way I understand it now is that my school requires the clinicals to be split between the ER, FD, and EMS. Im not sure on the schedule or how often. Guess Ill find out when I get there.


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## Elliot (Jan 10, 2009)

get ready for a fun time~!


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## artman17847 (Jan 10, 2009)

41 Duck said:


> Depends on where you are, I guess.  We weren't required to do any clinical time to get our EMT-B here in PA.
> 
> 
> Later!
> ...



That's odd? I took my EMT-B in 87' at MCP (Medical College of Pa.) in Phila. and had to do 16 hrs in the ER.

The ER was quite busy. I remember the PFD brought in a burn pt and his shirt was still smoldering!!!

RULE #1 STOP THE BURNING PROCESS!!!!


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## PotatoMedic (Jan 11, 2009)

I get 10 hours at Harborview for my observation time.  That will be an interesting experience.


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## firecoins (Jan 11, 2009)

marineman said:


> Hmm, do you have a link for me? I'd like to show my school. For EMT-B we didn't have any set number of hours but had to get 5 patient contacts on the ambulance. No ER time required but that might be because no hospitals in my area hire EMT-B's. If it's an NHTSA requirement though I'd say our school needs to change.



I was required to do 10 hours in the ER and ERs don't hire in my area.  It had more to do with the fact that is where we bring patients.  Its good to know how an ER operates.


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## bowulf (Jan 11, 2009)

I had to have 48 total hours (24 field and 24 clinical), but could be required to do more if I did not provide any treatment (including just taking vitals or SAMPLE history) to at least 10 medical and 5 traumas in clinical ED, and at least 5 patients (even if they refused after being assessed and taken vitals) in the field.  I ended up needing to do more field hours as I picked the slowest days of the year.


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## smvde (Jan 11, 2009)

Just wait till you hit medic school, you will look back fondly at those small clinical requirements


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## Jon (Jan 11, 2009)

Some TI's in PA require some form of clinicals - 8-16+ hours on an ambulance, a shift or two in an ED... it varies by the program.


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## 41 Duck (Jan 11, 2009)

artman17847 said:


> That's odd? I took my EMT-B in 87' at MCP (Medical College of Pa.) in Phila. and had to do 16 hrs in the ER.
> 
> The ER was quite busy. I remember the PFD brought in a burn pt and his shirt was still smoldering!!!
> 
> RULE #1 STOP THE BURNING PROCESS!!!!



May have been the program you were in--or the requirements at the time.  But it's not a statewide requirement as of current.


Later!

--Coop


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## ffemt8978 (Jan 11, 2009)

41 Duck said:


> May have been the program you were in--or the requirements at the time.  But it's not a statewide requirement as of current.
> 
> 
> Later!
> ...



I would think it would be common sense...you don't let a patient that is on FIRE in your rig or near oxygen until the fire is out...:wacko:


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## 41 Duck (Jan 11, 2009)

Well, yes, of course.  However, I was speaking more of the clinical time he had to do in '87....  perhaps I should have clipped part of his previous post.  Sorry.


Later!

--Coop


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## ffemt8978 (Jan 11, 2009)

Ahhh...that makes more sense.


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## rhan101277 (Jan 12, 2009)

I forgot to mention, including the 12 hour ER clinical.  We had to do a minimum of 5 documented 911 runs.  It took me about 40 hours at the ambulance station to get these.  Some calls were non-emergency transports where I got to take vitals and such.


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## Shishkabob (Jan 12, 2009)

rhan101277 said:


> I forgot to mention, including the 12 hour ER clinical.  We had to do a minimum of 5 documented 911 runs.  It took me about 40 hours at the ambulance station to get these.  Some calls were non-emergency transports where I got to take vitals and such.



Gah, that would be boring to me, no offense.

My first day on a 12 hour ambulance, we had 12 calls, 7 of which were priority 1/2's.


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## buscommando (Feb 6, 2009)

I had my first ED clinical last night, I have to have 25 hours of ED as part of the EMT-B class I'm taking with the community college.

I assisted with a spinal tap, watched triage of a Baker Act patient that smelled like bleach, watched the ER staff take radiographs of a patient whose girlfriend ran him over with her car. Someone in the "fish tank" sang a tuneless song that included the lyrics, "I'm singing this goddamn song to piss people off." A patient with pneumonia got hit by his pacemaker several times in my presence, and threw his medications across the room once. I watched tachycardic EKG of a patient after his cocaine and beer dinner.

The RN I had been following was thankful it was a slow night, and I don't blame her. From all appearances, Shands/UF looks like it'd be a madhouse with just twice the patient volume.


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## TransportJockey (Feb 6, 2009)

The EMT-B course I took did not require any clinical or third riding experience. I was kinda mad at that one. And since I was under 21 when I took it, I could not volunteer to third ride here in ABQ during the class. I did however volunteer with a volly FD a little south of me to get the extra experience


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## Combilation (Feb 6, 2009)

For my school we have to do 4 ambulance rides at the FD. They are all 8 hours. Then there is one clinical we do at the ER for another 8.


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## apagea99 (Feb 6, 2009)

I haven't had any clinical time yet. We have to pass our 3rd exam and be signed off on our IV skills before we start them. Test 3 should be at the end of this month, then we have to complete 16 hours in the ED and 48 hours on the ambulance.

I am so looking forward to it B)


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## jochi1543 (Feb 6, 2009)

I'm starting my EMT-A/I/PCP ambulance practicum next week...yikes! Fairly slow service, though, 2-3 calls a day (96 hr shifts). I'm glad I already have some ambulance experience, especially considering that it's the one spot where we do hospital practicum AFTER ambulance.h34r:


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## Level1pedstech (Feb 7, 2009)

EMT B2B

I can answer some questions and give you a few pointers if you would like to PM me. Part of my tech duties include cross training CNA's and working with students at all levels from EMT to MD. I remember my first ED rotation and knowing what I know now would have made a great experience even better. Good luck!


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## tlkennedy5 (Feb 7, 2009)

I'm starting my EMT-B next week here in Kentucky.  Our class only requires 12 hours of ambulance ride time.  Being that I'm a premed student at the university and the fact that I want to do trauma surgery, I was hoping for more practice...especially since my school (University of Louisville) has a great level 1 trauma center here.  Anyway, I've already done ambulance ride time on my own and made some contacts there, but how can I observe and learn at University ER since my class doesn't require it?  Do I just call them up and explain that I'm a premed student and that I'm working on my EMT-B and that I want to learn and observe?  Who would I call?


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## medicdan (Feb 7, 2009)

States vary on their requirement for EMTs. MA in particular, does not require clinical or ride along time before certification at the Basic level. Many schools make it possible, albeit optional for their students to ride along and observe in an ER. In many cases, the School (student) pays the ambulance company and ER to be able to do this-- so scheduling additional time is sometimes problematic. 

Tlkennedy, ERs are likely not going to allow you to observe additional time because you are pre-med, but you should consider volunteering in the ER or working as an ER-Tech if you are interested in some additional exposure once you become an EMT.


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## csly27 (Feb 7, 2009)

In the course I took it is 12 hour ride a long with the local fire dept. Mine is actually coming up on valentines day. I am not sure what to expect, I know that I am absolutly excited, but terrified at the same time. Not entirely sure what to expect and how much I will actually be able to do. I am ready to get my feet wet and go out there and get it done. I am used to working with people just not sick or injured people.


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## Outbac1 (Feb 8, 2009)

When I did my PCP(Primary Cara Paramedic) course in 2001 we had 144 hrs of hospital clinicals and 244 hrs of preceptored ride time. For my ACP course I have 350 hrs of hospital clinicals and 504 hrs of preceptored ride time.


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## jochi1543 (Feb 8, 2009)

Outbac1 said:


> When I did my PCP(Primary Cara Paramedic) course in 2001 we had 144 hrs of hospital clinicals and 244 hrs of preceptored ride time. For my ACP course I have 350 hrs of hospital clinicals and 504 hrs of preceptored ride time.



Our EMT/PCP hospital is only about 30-40 hours (4 days) and ambulance is minimum 25 calls, plus there are specific competencies that need to be signed off, so I'd say something like 35 calls would be about average (although I've heard of people doing 60+ and then failing h34r.


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## Outbac1 (Feb 8, 2009)

For my PCP I had about 70 calls and the big list of specific compentcies.


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## EMT-B2B (Feb 15, 2009)

Ok....Finally got the clinicals figured out here.  Doing 12 hours with amb....12 hours ED.....shouldnt be to bad...being that we do have trauma, burn, stroke, cardiac centers all within 30 or 40 miles. We get to pick. Start clinicals at the end of Feb.....and we  can do as many hours as we want....12 being min.....:beerchug:


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## Shishkabob (Feb 15, 2009)

You damn well better do more then just 24.  I recommend 100.  Sucks ***, but nowhere near what medics do, sooo....


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## medic417 (Feb 15, 2009)

EMT-B2B said:


> Ok....Finally got the clinicals figured out here.  Doing 12 hours with amb....12 hours ED.....shouldnt be to bad...being that we do have trauma, burn, stroke, cardiac centers all within 30 or 40 miles. We get to pick. Start clinicals at the end of Feb.....and we  can do as many hours as we want....12 being min.....:beerchug:




UMMM how can you get experience?  How can you develope any confidence?  How can a school get away with only requiring 12 hours?  No wonder EMS continues going down hill.  My first responder course many years ago required a whole lot more than that.  Do a lot more than the school requires.  It will benefit you and your future patients.


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## ffemt8978 (Feb 15, 2009)

Before you start accusing a school or program of criminal acts, you better have proof.  As such, the post has been edited.


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## medic417 (Feb 15, 2009)

ffemt8978 said:


> Before you start accusing a school or program of criminal acts, you better have proof.  As such, the post has been edited.




OK should have used a different term.  But its robbing their students of an extremely important part of the education process by only requireing 12 hours.  Is that better?


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## ffemt8978 (Feb 15, 2009)

medic417 said:


> OK should have used a different term.  But its robbing their students of an extremely important part of the education process by only requireing 12 hours.  Is that better?



Yep.  And I agree with you on this point.


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## medic417 (Feb 15, 2009)

ffemt8978 said:


> Yep.  And I agree with you on this point.




Thank you I will try and do better next time.


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## WarDance (Feb 15, 2009)

We had to do 10 ER and 10 ambulance.  I ended up staying 12 hours in the ER because the place was so slammed that I didn't even notice I had been there 2 extra hours.  I did mine in Georgia instead of Colorado and I don't regret it at all.  Southern ERs are quite entertaining!


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## EMT-B2B (Feb 16, 2009)

I agree with the small amount of hours required not being enough. I am going to do as many as I can, and try to even it out between ED and ride time.


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