# Higher Paying/Most Desired Depts.



## Canadian (Jul 5, 2014)

Hi all,

Just curious if you all could list some of the harder to get into, higher paying, tougher competition, outfits (EMS and Fire Departments) that you know of, and any experiences you have had with them.  Any notes of interest including pay, working conditions, scheduling, or notes of interests would be appreciated.

Thanks


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## BeachMedic (Jul 5, 2014)

Canadian said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just curious if you all could list some of the harder to get into, higher paying, tougher competition, outfits (EMS and Fire Departments) that you know of, and any experiences you have had with them.  Any notes of interest including pay, working conditions, scheduling, or notes of interests would be appreciated.
> 
> Thanks



King County - No experience with them.

San Francisco Fire Department - Starting EMT Academy with them on Monday. EMTs top out at about 90k a year after 4 years and Medics start at 92k a year and top out at about 115-120k a year. They have a killer pension and deferred comp, as well as excellent medical benefits.

Almost everyone gets hired as an EMT. Out of 35 EMTs in my academy starting Monday - 32 are working paramedics for other nearby systems.

It's a busy, burnout system, and EMS is the :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: step child of the suppression side but you wont find better pay anywhere else in the US.


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## TRSpeed (Jul 5, 2014)

Do you have to "promote" to suppression side or can you stay in the ems side. Because sac metro they want them to move to the fire side after 3 yrs I believe.


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## BeachMedic (Jul 5, 2014)

TRSpeed said:


> Do you have to "promote" to suppression side or can you stay in the ems side. Because sac metro they want them to move to the fire side after 3 yrs I believe.



It's very very difficult to move from EMS to suppression. That is one of the issues causing moral problems for all the guys who would like to be Engine/Medics.

There is no mandatory transition.


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## TRSpeed (Jul 5, 2014)

So it would be perfectly fine to say you are happy being a transport only medic and don't have desire in fire? I don't really get depts like those because it sounds like an insult to the dept saying you want to only stay in the ambulance


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## STXmedic (Jul 5, 2014)

San Antonio Fire Department. As a medic in EMS, you'll make at least 70k without any OT. With OT, there are guys making ~130k. The cost of living is also quite cheap.

EMS used to have a bad reputation and poor morale, but that's been changing dramatically over the past 5 years or so.

Fire is 24/48, EMS is 24/72. Excellent pension (one of the best in the country, and not just for fire departments), and great benefits.


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## Chewy20 (Jul 5, 2014)

STXmedic said:


> San Antonio Fire Department. As a medic in EMS, you'll make at least 70k without any OT. With OT, there are guys making ~130k. The cost of living is also quite cheap.
> 
> EMS used to have a bad reputation and poor morale, but that's been changing dramatically over the past 5 years or so.
> 
> Fire is 24/48, EMS is 24/72. Excellent pension (one of the best in the country, and not just for fire departments), and great benefits.



Was just looking over their recruiting site and over 900 people took and passed the exam for SAFD :wacko: Highest score was an 88 with vet points. Wonder if the CPAT weeds a lot of those people out or not.


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## STXmedic (Jul 5, 2014)

Yeah, that's the lowest scoring test I've ever seen highest raw score was an 83. Usually you have to score in the mid to high 90s to get in. Nearly 4,000 tested.

The CPAT doesn't weed too many people out. If you are in any shape at all and you're not claustrophobic, you should pass.


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## Chewy20 (Jul 5, 2014)

STXmedic said:


> Yeah, that's the lowest scoring test I've ever seen highest raw score was an 83. Usually you have to score in the mid to high 90s to get in. Nearly 4,000 tested.
> 
> The CPAT doesn't weed too many people out. If you are in any shape at all and you're not claustrophobic, you should pass.



Wouldn't think it would, just surprises me how many people sit for the exam. But after looking at their pay/benefits I can see why. I will stick with A/TCEMS for now.


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## terrible one (Jul 5, 2014)

Any large / medium sized FD in SoCal you can make 100k after a few years and some OT.
Very competitive. I have an AS fire and BS EMS, exp as EMT and paramedic, fire academy, exp with a reserve dept and wildland dept. I'd say I'm your average candidate applying too. Nothing about me stands out to these depts.


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## Drax (Jul 5, 2014)

Canadian said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just curious if you all could list some of the harder to get into, higher paying, tougher competition, outfits (EMS and Fire Departments) that you know of, and any experiences you have had with them.  Any notes of interest including pay, working conditions, scheduling, or notes of interests would be appreciated.
> 
> Thanks



U.S.:
All fire departments are difficult to get into. You might have luck if you're a paramedic in Texas from what I hear, but that is just rumor. Reciprocity is different everywhere you go, some states are easy, some are not. Fire is highly competitive and because there are so many players in Washington State, experience is a stepping stone to get a Fire gig, thus, making non-fire EMS gigs competitive too.

Paid EMS jobs in Washington State specifically are not easy to get into.

Every department is different in terms of scheduling. I've heard of Four 10s, Four 12s, Five 8's, 2 days on 4 days off, 1 on 1 off 1 on 1 off 1 on 4 off, 1 on 2 off, 1 on 1 off 1 on 2 off 1 on 3 off and so on.

Working conditions will differ where you work. High end neighborhoods typically have nice stations but sometimes not. It depends on the taxes in the  area.

Larger cities have better pay than small cities/communities. For the most part.


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## STXmedic (Jul 5, 2014)

Yeah, I'm not sure what it is about Texas, but we have tons of Canadians down here. There were three Canadians between the shifts at my previous station, and I know of many more throughout the department. My brother also just got done with TEEX's fire academy, and his class was nearly 50% Canadian students.


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## rescue1 (Jul 5, 2014)

I think with the push to make having your Firefighter 1/2 as an entry requirement for Canadian departments the big academies in Texas, especially with an online portion, are very appealing.


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## Canadian (Jul 11, 2014)

There are EMT-P's making over 100K per year at San Francisco Fire Department?  Wow that's crazy!  It must be super competitive to get into!  Would they even hire EMT-B's?  Any chance you could do work for them as a non-citizen?  Specifically Canadian?

Thanks


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## Medic Tim (Jul 12, 2014)

Canadian said:


> There are EMT-P's making over 100K per year at San Francisco Fire Department?  Wow that's crazy!  It must be super competitive to get into!  Would they even hire EMT-B's?  Any chance you could do work for them as a non-citizen?  Specifically Canadian?
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks




As a EMT-P/ACP in Alberta or BC you can make a base of 120k + working industrial (2 week on 2 week off rotation)


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## dC0m (Jul 12, 2014)

Canadian said:


> There are EMT-P's making over 100K per year at San Francisco Fire Department?  Wow that's crazy!  It must be super competitive to get into!  Would they even hire EMT-B's?  Any chance you could do work for them as a non-citizen?  Specifically Canadian?
> 
> Thanks



They do hire EMT-B's. Not a lot, because those who get hired on don't leave (given the salary and benefits, who would?!) I think most of their units are EMT/Medic, if not dual medics. They also don't have many units. San Francisco is a very busy system where they also contract 911 service with a third-party company. 

If I can get into SFFD's system as an EMT, I would never leave...


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## BeachMedic (Jul 12, 2014)

The list might open again next year when it expires.

EMS is still short a ton of bodies. 

If you can get on the list and are eligible to work in the US I don't see why a Canadian couldn't work here.

Expect up to a 3-4 year wait before getting a call unless you're lucky.

Starting at 35 bucks an hour, a good pension, and paying 0 into medical benefits is awesome. There is a 6% differential for any college degree, and a 6% differential for night shifts. There is also a bilingual differential if you can pass the fluency test.

You could do a lot worse and you can't do any better as a single role EMT. Don't get me started on the Medic pay.


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## fortsmithman (Jul 18, 2014)

Medic Tim said:


> As a EMT-P/ACP in Alberta or BC you can make a base of 120k + working industrial (2 week on 2 week off rotation)



As well Tim do the companies still pay for your flights to and from the work site if you live out of province.


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## Medic Tim (Jul 18, 2014)

fortsmithman said:


> As well Tim do the companies still pay for your flights to and from the work site if you live out of province.



It depends. Some pay a higher day rate.. Some just don't. 
My company books an pays flights for ACP/EMT-Ps and RNs. Another company I worked for reimbursed you on your pay check if you submit your receipt.


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## Emergency Metaphysics (Jul 19, 2014)

Canadian said:


> There are EMT-P's making over 100K per year at San Francisco Fire Department?  Wow that's crazy!  It must be super competitive to get into!  Would they even hire EMT-B's?  Any chance you could do work for them as a non-citizen?  Specifically Canadian?
> 
> Thanks



The "WOW" was my response, too. Although I'm not Canadian, the idea of an EMT-B making that much money is encouraging and discouraging all at the same time. I feel that with pay that high there has to be a serious catch: like it sucks to live there.

I'm wondering what other departments people can think of. Texas seems to have a pretty well thought of system as I look at other threads. I don't know what a city like San Antonio would be like to live in.

M.


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## Drax (Jul 19, 2014)

Emergency Metaphysics said:


> The "WOW" was my response, too. Although I'm not Canadian, the idea of an EMT-B making that much money is encouraging and discouraging all at the same time. I feel that with pay that high there has to be a serious catch: like it sucks to live there.
> 
> I'm wondering what other departments people can think of. Texas seems to have a pretty well thought of system as I look at other threads. I don't know what a city like San Antonio would be like to live in.
> 
> M.



A notoriously high cost of living.


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## STXmedic (Jul 19, 2014)

Emergency Metaphysics said:


> I'm wondering what other departments people can think of. Texas seems to have a pretty well thought of system as I look at other threads. I don't know what a city like San Antonio would be like to live in.
> 
> M.



SA and the surrounding area is alright. Low cost of living is nice. My only gripe about the SA area is there's not enough to do outdoors (coming from the guy who is trying hard to convince his wife to move to either Colorado or Oregon...). There's plenty to do here, just not a lot that interests me personally. It does get quite hot down here, though. And rarely gets cold (rarely below freezing)


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

edit - decided to be quiet instead lol.


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## SandpitMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

Drax said:


> A notoriously high cost of living.



Like for instance $3000 per month rent to live in an 800sq ft shoe box on the second floor. Laundry down the street, loud busy area outside, no yard or privacy stacked up like sardines. 

That's just rent...

My sister lives in SF.

The only way I'd take that job is to commute from the Bay Area or central CA. But they work 4 10's and they street post just like privates. Not to mention the crazy call volume, steep hillside streets, narrow stair and hallways, ancient tight housing areas. All that makes the job more difficult. Not saying that as a deterrent or because its not easy... It just isn't worth it to me to be stuck as a single role provider in a system like that for too long. My own opinion of course.


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## SandpitMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

Vegas is good to me. I'm on par to make 60-65k here working 4 12's a week (one OT shift a pay period.) I'm a paramedic though, basic and intermediates make diddly unfortunately. 

Cost of living is dirt cheap, there are no state taxes, and the wage is nothing to get rich off of but it is decent and enough to have some toys or buy a house.

The step raises aren't the best though as my pay won't change that much even if I stayed for a few more years; it definitely is a good place to gain experience towards that next step though.


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## chaz90 (Jul 19, 2014)

^^Everything posted above shows how many different answers there can be to the question of "what department is best." Everyone has an individual definition of what is best for them. The overall consensus should be to figure out what you want most, find departments/areas that offer those things, and move there. 

The only universal recommendation is to get out of SoCal BLS IFT.


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## SandpitMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

chaz90 said:


> The only universal recommendation is to get out of SoCal BLS IFT.



+1

Keep moving forward and out of that circus.


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

SandpitMedic said:


> Like for instance $3000 per month rent to live in an 800sq ft shoe box on the second floor. Laundry down the street, loud busy area outside, no yard or privacy stacked up like sardines.
> 
> That's just rent...
> 
> ...



You wouldn't take that job for this?
http://citidex.sfgov.org/cgi-bin/dhr/findClass.cgi?MyID=H003
First row is EMT.
Second Row is Medic. (120k+ for that 40 hour week you're talking about)
Top step is FireMedic/Supression. 
Don't even factor in the extra 6% for any kind of degree(including 2 year), 6% night shift differential, and 6% bilingual pay. (18% more potentially)
Then there is the pension, and paying zero into medical.

The great thing about SFFD is that is a major metropolitan FD with tons of opportunity for promotion via either the EMS or Supression route. It's not dead-end be a forever Paramedic or end up Supervisor like with privatized EMS.

The SF Bay Area is a huge place and a great place to live. I'm not one of the tech bros so I can't afford to live in the city lol. Luckily there are a ton of cities within a stone's throw with affordable living. I've been to almost every major city in the country and we've got it all here + nearby mountains, oceans, and phenomenal weather.

On the other hand, due to my own personal bias, you couldn't pay me enough to live in a place like Texas. Almost none of the outdoor things I like to do are within driving distance of the major cities. It's flat, it's hot. There is no Pacific ocean.

Not saying we don't have our problems; because we do. Just saying that as far as EMS gigs go it's a pretty good one.


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## STXmedic (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Just saying that as far as EMS gigs go in regards to pay, it's a pretty good one.



Fixed.


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

STXmedic said:


> Fixed.



Lol. Fair enough. Urban EMS is what it is in all big cities. Definitely not for everyone.


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## STXmedic (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Lol. Fair enough. Urban EMS is what it is in all big cities. Definitely not for everyone.



I'm just referring to California EMS in general. I work urban EMS and rather enjoy it.


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## TransportJockey (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Lol. Fair enough. Urban EMS is what it is in all big cities. Definitely not for everyone.


Very true. I can't stand the to lose my expansive scope or long transport times... I don't think I could do urban.


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## STXmedic (Jul 19, 2014)

TransportJockey said:


> Very true. I can't stand the to lose my expansive scope or long transport times... I don't think I could do urban.



Okay, I like urban unless I get to do even half the stuff TJ gets to while working rural... I do wish I had longer with my patients, though.


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

STXmedic said:


> I'm just referring to California EMS in general. I work urban EMS and rather enjoy it.



Yeah after working in Hawaii I feel a little handicapped in general coming back to California. There are a ton of amazing Medics, and a fair number of amazingly bad EMS personnel, here. EMS is just so varied from county to county in this state. (I've worked in 4 different counties now lol)

So Cal is particularly bad. Nor Cal is a bit better but we're not going to be RSIing or surgical cricing in SF anytime soon. Getting steroids on early really isn't our thing either. Fentanyl is barely starting to hit all the Bay Area counties. Our transports are almost always shorter than 10 minutes though so some things really aren't a priority for us. Nasal tubes, CPAP, and needle cric are what we have to work with.

Quality of life and things do in the area are great though. Give and take. Trade surfboards and hiking boots for an expanded scope.


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## TransportJockey (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Yeah after working in Hawaii I feel a little handicapped in general coming back to California. There are a ton of amazing Medics, and a fair number of amazingly bad EMS personnel, here. EMS is just so varied from county to county in this state. (I've worked in 4 different counties now lol)
> 
> So Cal is particularly bad. Nor Cal is a bit better but we're not going to be RSIing or surgical cricing in SF anytime soon. Getting steroids on early really isn't our thing either. Fentanyl is barely starting to hit all the Bay Area counties. Our transports are almost always shorter than 10 minutes though so some things really aren't a priority for us. Nasal tubes, CPAP, and needle cric are what we have to work with.
> 
> Quality of life and things do in the area are great though. Give and take. Trade surfboards and hiking boots for an expanded scope.


I live in Albuquerque and commute six.hours one way to work because I like the location I live. Lots to do outside, good breweries, and easy to drive places and go do things. It is a givr and take, but I like functioning in the field woth lots of options


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

TransportJockey said:


> I live in Albuquerque and commute six.hours one way to work because I like the location I live. Lots to do outside, good breweries, and easy to drive places and go do things. It is a givr and take, but I like functioning in the field woth lots of options



Wow..
What kind of shifts?


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## STXmedic (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Quality of life and things do in the area are great though. Give and take. Trade surfboards and hiking boots for an expanded scope.



Agreed. Thus why I'm trying to convince my wife to move.


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## TransportJockey (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Wow..
> What kind of shifts?


Seven days on, seven off. But I also use my time at work to study for class lol. Plus I'm looking at staying here for two years or so max


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## BeachMedic (Jul 19, 2014)

TransportJockey said:


> Seven days on, seven off. But I also use my time at work to study for class lol. Plus I'm looking at staying here for two years or so max



Nice haha. Hope you have a good partner. That's a long time to be at work! At least the drive through NM and TX is scenic.


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## TransportJockey (Jul 19, 2014)

BeachMedic said:


> Nice haha. Hope you have a good partner. That's a long time to be at work! At least the drive through NM and TX is scenic.



Ummm I'll have to take some pictures of the parts of TX and NM I drive through, it's flat and boring  And we have two trucks on and we love doing things like cookouts and fish fries, so it makes the days go by quick lol. I actually drive less per pay period (2 weeks) than when I worked at my old job for AMR, though, so this works for me.


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## SandpitMedic (Jul 20, 2014)

Transport Jockey

You're on flight correct?


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## TransportJockey (Jul 20, 2014)

SandpitMedic said:


> Transport Jockey
> 
> You're on flight correct?


Some days. I'm alternating ground 911 and fixed wing flights depending on thr week.


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## SandpitMedic (Jul 21, 2014)

Angel care?


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## TransportJockey (Jul 21, 2014)

SandpitMedic said:


> Angel care?



Nope, Pecos EMS


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## Danno (Jul 21, 2014)

Emergency Metaphysics said:


> The "WOW" was my response, too. Although I'm not Canadian, the idea of an EMT-B making that much money is encouraging and discouraging all at the same time. I feel that with pay that high there has to be a serious catch: like it sucks to live there.
> 
> I'm wondering what other departments people can think of. Texas seems to have a pretty well thought of system as I look at other threads. I don't know what a city like San Antonio would be like to live in.
> 
> M.



Depends on how you define "sucks". Its super expensive to live there but I would move to SF in a heart beat. Awesome, beautiful city with tons to do and see.


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