# How long will it last ???



## Ms.Medic (Feb 26, 2009)

Does anyone know how long pea can be present on a strip if pt isnt worked ? If thats an unclear question, let me know so I can try to reword it. What is the longest down time with pea still present you've seen?


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## tydek07 (Feb 27, 2009)

Don't think anyone can give you an exact answer to that one. Its a case-by-case thing. I have seena pt jump from asystole to PEA for about 15ish minutes before going into a very stable rythym 

But yah, as for "how long can PEA last"... I don't know.


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## Sasha (Feb 27, 2009)

PEA lasts exactly 10 minutes, for every patient. I found it in my "How to be a Paramedic" cookbook.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 27, 2009)

You mean this one?


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## Ms.Medic (Feb 27, 2009)

HAHA, thats the book I get all my training from.

Just curious because we had a call awhile back that we didnt work, 88y/o,  rigor had set in slightly, family said he could not have been down for more than an hour due phone calls. Its just one of those cases that stuck a little bit because I could never get and answer.


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## el Murpharino (Feb 27, 2009)

Ms.Medic said:


> HAHA, thats the book I get all my training from.
> 
> Just curious because we had a call awhile back that we didnt work, 88y/o,  rigor had set in slightly, family said he could not have been down for more than an hour due phone calls. Its just one of those cases that stuck a little bit because I could never get and answer.



Rigor mortis usually starts to set in after about 3 hours, maximizes around 12, and is over after about 72 hours.  Either he was down much longer than less than an hour, or the stiffness you felt wasn't rigor mortis.

To answer your original question...it depends.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 27, 2009)

I have seen some last that long. It is not unusual to see EMD or PEA condition to last a long time. The reason I am against "hooking" them to a monitor to determine death. If you hook them up, you have to work them. As well, the public does not understand the difference.

In some of the terminal cases with a DNR, I have seen patients with pulseless electrical activity last for a long time.


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## Veneficus (Feb 27, 2009)

Have seen patients declared dead after working them for 45 minutes and the monitor was removed before PEA terminated in hospital. Not sure how long the medics on the squad worked her prior.


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## MSDeltaFlt (Feb 27, 2009)

I've seen DNR's go into PEA and still show it up to half an hour.


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## Ms.Medic (Feb 27, 2009)

Ridryder911 said:


> I have seen some last that long. It is not unusual to see EMD or PEA condition to last a long time. The reason I am against "hooking" them to a monitor to determine death. If you hook them up, you have to work them. As well, the public does not understand the difference.
> 
> In some of the terminal cases with a DNR, I have seen patients with pulseless electrical activity last for a long time.






In our service, or county I should say, the jp wants a strip on every pt they come out on. Even on obvious sign of death pt from mva's and ones that have been down a few days. Not sure why, maybe just confirmation, or maybe its some sort of requirement for legal reasons in this county, who knows. But no, in our service we dont have to work them just because we hook a monitor on them for confirmation of asystole.


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## MSDeltaFlt (Feb 27, 2009)

Ms.Medic said:


> In our service, or county I should say, the jp wants a strip on every pt they come out on. Even on obvious sign of death pt from mva's and ones that have been down a few days.* Not sure why*, maybe just confirmation, or maybe its some sort of requirement for legal reasons in this county, who knows. But no, in our service we dont have to work them just because we hook a monitor on them for confirmation of asystole.


 
Because it's easier to immediately get your 2-4 strips of Asystole without taking a photo and risk compromising privacy... I think.


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## AJ Hidell (Feb 27, 2009)

I've never actually timed it, but I know I have seen it go on for at least a half an hour at times.  The eerie part is when it occurs spontaneously after you've already pronounced them dead, and worked them in asystole prior to that.  Sometimes adrenalin and isoproteronol can kick in and do funny things long after you are already done.


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