# A quick rant about last night..



## biggee72 (Jun 17, 2009)

Just have to complain to people who understand, not that it's even a huge deal.  We are 100% volunteer first.  Last night 11PM I'm home about to go to sleep but I am on call for duty crew and we get a call for man with flu like symptoms.  First responder returns us right away telling us there is no patient.  No problem!  Let's go home and go back to sleep.  0130 call comes in flu like symptoms, patient requests transport.  We get there his girlfriend walks him out and he gets on the stretcher.  We load and go and his girlfriend tail gates us the whole way there!  WTF?  She could have driven him.  We take vitals, etc.  He's cooperative and somewhat friendy..obviously sick.  We get to the hospital (same hospital house was filmed at) and the nurse asks why is he there.  He flipped on her screaming he wants to go to a different hospital, he hates her attitude, etc.  She tells him to leave..we obviously left.  Now I sit at my day job in a daze because someone couldn't have their girlfriend drive them 20 mins to a hospital, although it wasn't even an ER treatable condition!!!  End of rant.


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## Scout (Jun 17, 2009)

When ye say ye left. Does that mean to say you transported to a different hospital? Or just told him hop off the cot and left him there?


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## TransportJockey (Jun 17, 2009)

You want to play EMT. No sympathy if it interferes with your real job.


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## emt1994 (Jun 17, 2009)

some people just like to abuse the system I am on avolunteer service and I dont mind going to help you if you need it but as a taxi Ihave a real problem. People sometimes think its funny do you guys bill for the services because he wont be laughing when he gets the bill.


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## JonTullos (Jun 17, 2009)

Part of the gig... I honestly can't give you any sympathy either.  I'm a volly FF and had a house fire one night recently... went to bed at 2330, got paged out at 0100, left the scene at 0600, left the station (after taking down wet hoses and putting dry hoses on the truck) at 0700 and had to be at work at 0900.  Sorry to be so blunt if you can't handle that you may want to consider if you really want to be in EMS, volly or otherwise.

Yes, abuse of the system is also just part of it... but sometimes it can result in some good stories.


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## TransportJockey (Jun 17, 2009)

emt1994 said:


> some people just like to abuse the system I am on avolunteer service and I dont mind going to help you if you need it but as a taxi Ihave a real problem. People sometimes think its funny do you guys bill for the services because he wont be laughing when he gets the bill.



People abuse the system everywhere in the country. That's nothing new. And yes, the system I work in they do get billed. Still doesn't stop them from doing stupid :censored::censored::censored::censored: that ties up our busses


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## medic417 (Jun 17, 2009)

Welcome to EMS.  If you volunteer to do this what makes you think you should only get "real" calls, when in real professional EMS we deal with this all the time?  Plus are you truly educated enough to know there was not some other physical/mental issue taking place?  If you are only trained at a basic level you have no real medical education.  

Sorry to be blunt but being a volunteer does not exempt you from all "BS" runs and basic training is not medical education.


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## JPINFV (Jun 17, 2009)

Don't like it, don't volunteer. Sorry, not all patients are going to be major traumas or cardiac arrests and professionals don't get to pick and choose their calls.


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## biggee72 (Jun 17, 2009)

Holy crap.  I'm sorry if I came off wrong.  I'm not looking for sympathy and I've been doing this for 8 yrs.  However, I've never seen someone take such advantage of the system before ergo my rant.  It was a vent to people who I thought would understand the point of the story.  Apparently not.


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## medic417 (Jun 17, 2009)

biggee72 said:


> Holy crap.  I'm sorry if I came off wrong.  I'm not looking for sympathy and I've been doing this for 8 yrs.  However, I've never seen someone take such advantage of the system before ergo my rant.  It was a vent to people who I thought would understand the point of the story.  Apparently not.



If this was the worst abuse you have seen you should be thanking the citizens in your area.  And again it is possible with only a basic training you may have overlooked a more serious issue.


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## biggee72 (Jun 17, 2009)

You are correct, but his girlfriend could have driven him as well.  I should also clarify I am new to EMS.  I have been a firefighter since 2000 and the abuse of the EMS system came as quite a shock to me.  I got my EMT cert mainly to help others including my kids (which I do not have yet), my wife, parents, etc.  It's always good to have more knowledge, but I def. didn't go through the training to "play EMT".


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## el Murpharino (Jun 18, 2009)

It's the nature of the beast.  We have many patients that don't realize that as paramedics we are trained professionals capable of doing more than just picking 'em up and dropping 'em off at the hospital with no interventions performed.  The public is ill-informed of our capabilities in the field, and many people still think of us as the ambulance drivers from the 1950's.  They do think of us as a taxi service that will take them to the hospital and hopefully get them seen by a doctor quicker.  

Secondly, regardless of the nature of the call, it's not your emergency.  Yes you may think of the call as a bullsh*t sick-guy call because you don't get to play with all the fancy toys we have at our disposal, but that doesn't mean you should skimp on a good patient assessment and treat the patient any less than a patient you deem as legitimitely sick.  The worst you will do is perfect your technique and assessment skills, which will in turn make you a better provider.

Lastly, you mention you wanted to help people as an EMT....you did help this guy - get to the hospital safely.  Or did you only want to help those YOU deem as needing help?


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

biggee72 said:


> Holy crap.  I'm sorry if I came off wrong.  I'm not looking for sympathy and I've been doing this for 8 yrs.  However, I've never seen someone take such advantage of the system before ergo my rant.  It was a vent to people who I thought would understand the point of the story.  Apparently not.



come on down to memphis and we will show you what it looks like 1st hand stubbed toes on ambulances while people drive dead bodies in


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## VentMedic (Jun 18, 2009)

biggee72 said:


> You are correct, but his girlfriend could have driven him as well.


 
Considering how you described the girlfriend's driving, I don't think I would have wanted her driving him 20 minutes to the hospital. She probably would have been too distracted with him in the car but then that could have led to an exciting trauma. She at least had your bumper to concentrate on to get her to the hospital.


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

emt1994 said:


> some people just like to abuse the system I am on avolunteer service and I dont mind going to help you if you need it but as a taxi Ihave a real problem. People sometimes think its funny do you guys bill for the services because he wont be laughing when he gets the bill.



you assume he will pay the bill


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

emt1994 said:


> some people just like to abuse the system I am on avolunteer service and I dont mind going to help you if you need it but as a taxi Ihave a real problem. People sometimes think its funny do you guys bill for the services because he wont be laughing when he gets the bill.



i dont think they like to abuse the system as much as it is a lack of education

gotta hand it to ya vollies though, dont get me wrong i love my job but I dont think i could do it for free


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## 8jimi8 (Jun 18, 2009)

i just gotta ask.  WHY IS EVERYONE SO SALTY ON THIS FORUM?!

Bro, sorry you got paged out for a taxi ride.  Glad you got if off your chest!  

**Keep on volunteering**

I drove 1.5 hours away from my house for 4, 12 hours shifts WHERE NOT A SINGLE TONE DROPPED.  Well we did get toned out ONCE, but unfortunately I was on the rig that went to get breakfast tacos, so the other crew rolled out on the call!

I was the biggest freaking white cloud there is!

I broke the seal on my 5th shift (after i finally realized that If i have to commute for 3 hours to volunteer in a 911 service, i'm not going to do a 12. i'm gonna do a 24!) ...we rolled out on 4 calls including a 1 vehicle rollover with 2 unrestrained passengers, one being the ejected child.  This kid's dad was rushing to Sonic for the "free rootbeer floats" trying to get there before midnight when the deal ended.  Took his corner too sharp and rolled it.  Of course, they lied to us and said that they were both wearing seatbelts.  I couldn't for the life of me figure out why the kid had dirt in his mouth, or why he was lying on the ground behind the overturned SUV (he said he got out of the car and realized his neck hurt, so he layed down).  It wasn't until after we went back to the ER for the final call that night that i spoke with his nurse and was informed that they changed their stories and fessed up to being unrestrained.  Since then, I usually get at least 1 call in a 24 hour period and i don't care how AWESOME the call is, i'm just glad to be able to get some experience and help people.  I've had such awesome experiences volunteering and  have yet to go out on a taxi call.  

to the rest of the forum, jeeze guys, its always said that nurses eat their young.  Why bag on the guy for a little rant?!  He made a disclaimer that it was just a rant.  Guess y'all taught him a lesson!

Freakin internet courage! its worse than liquid courage, at least when someone's drunk and talking **** to you, you can smack him in the mouth.  Over the internet people just take potshots left and right with no come-uppance.  Would you really treat a volunteer basic like that face to face?

I mean would you really scare off all your volunteer coverage like that?  If you hate it too, why blast him cause he got his first bad taste in his mouth, why not buy him a beer?!


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## SanDiegoEmt7 (Jun 18, 2009)

jtpaintball70 said:


> You want to play EMT. No sympathy if it interferes with your real job.



amen        .


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## Sasha (Jun 18, 2009)

> to the rest of the forum, jeeze guys, its always said that nurses eat their young. Why bag on the guy for a little rant?! He made a disclaimer that it was just a rant. Guess y'all taught him a lesson!
> 
> Freakin internet courage! its worse than liquid courage, at least when someone's drunk and talking **** to you, you can smack him in the mouth. Over the internet people just take potshots left and right with no come-uppance. Would you really treat a volunteer basic like that face to face?
> 
> I mean would you really scare off all your volunteer coverage like that? If you hate it too, why blast him cause he got his first bad taste in his mouth, why not buy him a beer?!



Buy him a beer because he's complaining about his patient and ranting about the call? 

Sorry sweetheart, patients like these are part of the job. If he doesn't like it, then perhaps he SHOULDN'T volunteer. When you are annoyed or fed up with a patient or a call, it shows and makes it uncomfortable for all. Just because someone volunteers doesn't mean they are wonderful.

And by the way, telling everyone how horrible and mean they are is just as bad as people "bagging on him". Pot, meet kettle.


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## emt1994 (Jun 18, 2009)

Hey you know let me say something  those who volunteer are not always just basics and yes as basics were not allowed to do medications except assist with things but when you have been doing it for a ton of years you pick up things also that upper levels have. Yes as volunteers we get crap calls and my husband who is a full time paramedic also volunteers is the chief of our service and were a basic level service we see all kinds of stuff and you folks who do it full time also get crap calls of taxi service 101.

I think you do get frustrated after a while be real about abuse of the system paid service or volunteer you get tired of it after a while but its going to happen no matter what so I guess we just all have to deal with it.

I like the fact that our vol. service bills so they can get a huge bill at the end of it so it makes me feel better about the whole thing. 

And remember folks were here to help people in the long run thats why we became emt's and up


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

emt1994 said:


> I like the fact that our vol. service bills so they can get a huge bill at the end of it so it makes me feel better about the whole thing.



And I like the joy of rolling that bill into shape of a ball and trying to make a long shot into the trash can.  Yes you can bill but you can't make them pay.


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## biggee72 (Jun 18, 2009)

Sasha said:


> Buy him a beer because he's complaining about his patient and ranting about the call?
> 
> Sorry sweetheart, patients like these are part of the job. If he doesn't like it, then perhaps he SHOULDN'T volunteer. When you are annoyed or fed up with a patient or a call, it shows and makes it uncomfortable for all. Just because someone volunteers doesn't mean they are wonderful.
> 
> And by the way, telling everyone how horrible and mean they are is just as bad as people "bagging on him". Pot, meet kettle.



Your the worst out of all of them.


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## Sasha (Jun 18, 2009)

biggee72 said:


> Your the worst out of all of them.



How so?


10chars


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## fortsmithman (Jun 18, 2009)

I've had pts like that.  No matter how many times they will call us with calls like that I will still go because how do we know that the next call isn't something major. I am a member of a paid on call service.  We have had nights where we get toned out 4 times.  That night I had about 2 hours sleep and I had to go to my regular job.  No complaints from me because I accept it as part of the job.


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## ffemt8978 (Jun 18, 2009)

Play nice, people


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## reaper (Jun 18, 2009)

You can rant all you want. You won't get any sympathy, due to the fact, that this is the job.

What you think is abuse of the system, may be an emergency to the pt. You are there to do the job and treat the pt, not judge what is BS.

If all the abuse stopped tomorrow, you would not have a job to do. Over half of EMS would be out of work! Remember, that BS pt is job security!


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## biggee72 (Jun 18, 2009)

I'm really curious..why does the word sympathy keep coming up?  At which point did I mention I was looking for anyone to hold my hand?  Why anyone would go out of their way to look for an excuse to be a jerk off is beyond me.  I'm sorry I ever posted on this forum, I really am.


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## 8jimi8 (Jun 18, 2009)

reaper said:


> You can rant all you want. You won't get any sympathy, due to the fact, that this is the job.
> 
> What you think is abuse of the system, may be an emergency to the pt. You are there to do the job and treat the pt, not judge what is BS.
> 
> If all the abuse stopped tomorrow, you would not have a job to do. Over half of EMS would be out of work! Remember, that BS pt is job security!




I hadn't thought about that.  Good point!


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## Scout (Jun 18, 2009)

Sorry FF in advance.


But in the name of all sweet things censored ITS A RANT STOP ITCHING AND MOANING.


I didn't see him asking for sympathy or asking for clarification or anything. We have all had these calls, it does not mean we do not care or should give up or would not do it again.

:deadhorse:


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

reaper said:


> Remember, that BS pt is job security!



How?  Very few of them pay.


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> How?  Very few of them pay.



usually can be written off as a loss or maybe a charitable donation(not quite sure on the latter)


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

biggee72 said:


> I'm really curious..why does the word sympathy keep coming up?  At which point did I mention I was looking for anyone to hold my hand?  Why anyone would go out of their way to look for an excuse to be a jerk off is beyond me.  I'm sorry I ever posted on this forum, I really am.



I don't see any problem with your original post.  I don't see any problem wih venting, as I believe that it is actually pretty good for people to get things off their chest.  Granted, I am not an EMT (yet), so my view is different.

Here is my take: just because someone (in this case you, biggee) states his frustration at something, or complains about it, does not mean he is automatically a screw-up as an EMT.  Him venting his frustration about abuse of the system is no worse than others complaining about his venting.  

Biggee, people on this forum can be very rough or harsh at times.  A lot of the posts I saw responding to your original posts were out of line.  Many people on this forum think they are always right, or that they are above everybody else.  These people need to remember that they are not perfect, and that they have had calls that they complained about.  Does this make them screw-ups as paramedics or EMTs?  Not in the least.

Here is my point.  I hope you stay with this forum.  Do not listen to the people who are all "high and mighty."  I have complained about it already, and unfortunately, no one really seems to care.  People forget that everybody is on the same team.  Though there is a lot of b*tching on this forum, it is a valuable resource.  I have learned a lot from it, and so can you.  Just ignore (or try to ignore) all the BS.

If you need anything else, or have any questions or need support or anything, you are more than welcome to send me a PM.  (Note: I am not in the EMS field as of yet, so I don't know how much help I can be.  Just thought I would throw out the offer.)

Eric


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## Hockey (Jun 18, 2009)

Just tell the people who pick apart your post and assume stuff where to stick it


I did so and it stopped real quick 


I hear ya


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## cbjfan (Jun 18, 2009)

To all the ones who were telling biggee to suck it up, and its part of the job, I have read many "Professional" ems members on here complaining about the same thing or even more pathetic things, like "oh the previous crew went on a late in shift run, and when they got back the rig had a full trash can." Really? Get over it you are a "professional."

Then bashing the vollies. Im my county we have 8 911-Ems departments. One is full time, three are paid per call (mine is one of these) and the other 4 are strictly vollie. We are the ONLY department that runs ALS only rigs. The full time department has a total of 4 medics and 1 intermediate then a bunch of emt-b's. We have 8 medics 4 intermediates, 16 emt-b's, and 2 drivers (both of us are in basic class). My dept also has 3 of our b's in medic school and 1 in intermediate. So I'm sorry to step on your "professional" toes, but I think our department provides a higher level of care than the "professional's" in our county. 

Moral of the story, just because it is a vollie department doesn't mean that there isn't the high level and standard of care as "professional" departments. We are all in it to help our communities, vollie and professional both. Why not get along and play nice?


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

Dont take the responses you get from this post if any the wrong way.




medichopeful said:


> I don't see any problem with your original post.  I don't see any problem wih venting, as I believe that it is actually pretty good for people to get things off their chest.  Granted, I am not an EMT (yet), so my view is different.
> 
> Eric


You are right there is nothing wrong with venting (IE *itching, pissin and moanin, crying) most of us do it in one way or another, usually to our partner or other coworkers.  Just as it is acceptable for me to complain to them I fully expect at least one if not most to at some point and time tell me to "pop the tit out of my mouth and get over it"






medichopeful said:


> Biggee, people on this forum can be very rough or harsh at times.  A lot of the posts I saw responding to your original posts were out of line.  Many people on this forum think they are always right, or that they are above everybody else.  These people need to remember that they are not perfect, and that they have had calls that they complained about.  Does this make them screw-ups as paramedics or EMTs?  Not in the least.
> 
> 
> Eric


This job attracts and breeds the cocky, I am always right, PARAGOD, and I have one feeling and thats pissed off  attitudes.  And for good reason, if you set there and questioning your gut and doubting your self, you will waste time that can be used to treat your pt.  Case in point have you ever met a neuro resident while they are working? Many will say they that are stuck up or asses or any number of colorful terms, and guess what they usually are.    

But think about it who do you want digging around in you head with a power drill fishhook and chicken wire?  The "Dr. Cox" or "Mr. well is that what we do or is it this."  Its not much different in a car upside down in a ditch in the rain with with the water rising.  

So no offense but cut em some slack Darlene.





medichopeful said:


> Here is my point.  I hope you stay with this forum.  Do not listen to the people who are all "high and mighty."  I have complained about it already, and unfortunately, no one really seems to care.  People forget that everybody is on the same team.  Though there is a lot of b*tching on this forum, it is a valuable resource.  I have learned a lot from it, and so can you.  Just ignore (or try to ignore) all the BS.
> Eric



And at last, he been doing this a while so i doubt it will get to him at all.  But if it does maybe he may need to reevaluate how much he vollenteers.
For you grasshopper one thing that is just as important as your assessment skills is THICK SKIN. Oh and cockyness.




medichopeful said:


> If you need anything else, or have any questions or need support or anything, you are more than welcome to send me a PM.  (Note: I am not in the EMS field as of yet, so I don't know how much help I can be.  Just thought I would throw out the offer.)
> 
> Eric




PS 
BTW thanks for the support


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## reaper (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> How?  Very few of them pay.



They are still call volume for your service. Most of the true BS calls are from those that have insurance or medicaid, so yes, they do pay!


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

reaper said:


> They are still call volume for your service. Most of the true BS calls are from those that have insurance or Medicaid, so yes, they do pay!



Actually if the call is not a true emergency you will not get paid in most "BS" cases by insurance/Medicaid/Medicare unless you commit fraud.  

Now call volume I agree can benefit a city/county service when you go beg money.


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

hrmeeks said:


> Dont take the responses you get from this post if any the wrong way.



I am under the impression that all of this is directed at me, not at biggee.  If not, ignore this whole response 




> You are right there is nothing wrong with venting (IE *itching, pissin and moanin, crying) most of us do it in one way or another, usually to our partner or other coworkers.  Just as it is acceptable for me to complain to them I fully expect at least one if not most to at some point and time tell me to "pop the tit out of my mouth and get over it"



People should be allowed to come onto a forum of their co-workers and rant a little bit without getting told to suck it up.  Especially in a career like this one, where stress is a major problem.  I have read on this forum (and heard other places) that one way to relieve the stress is to talk to somebody.  Yet when people go to talk to somebody on this forum, they get jumped on.  This is ridiculous, and it makes me furious.  It seems that some people on this forum want to help people, but only if they are not a co-worker.  Co-workers, as far as they are concerned, are "above" help or do not deserve to be listened to.




> This job attracts and breeds the cocky, I am always right, PARAGOD, and I have one feeling and thats pissed off  attitudes.  And for good reason, if you set there and questioning your gut and doubting your self, you will waste time that can be used to treat your pt.  Case in point have you ever met a neuro resident while they are working? Many will say they that are stuck up or asses or any number of colorful terms, and guess what they usually are.
> 
> But think about it who do you want digging around in you head with a power drill fishhook and chicken wire?  The "Dr. Cox" or "Mr. well is that what we do or is it this."  Its not much different in a car upside down in a ditch in the rain with with the water rising.



Being cocky when on the job is a little different than dealing with a co-worker who is just making conversation or looking for a little support or conversation.  I assure you that I would want a cocky person to be operating on me, rather than somebody who is not great

I have never met a neurosurgeon while they are working, but I can imagine that they are cocky.  And they have to be.  But here is the key phrase: while they are working.  When they are talking to a co-worker, I am sure many are jerks, but the majority of them are probably supportive.  People who come onto here should not have to deal with cocky, "I am better than everybody and I am God" attitudes.  They are not working, and the responders to the forum are (in a sense) not working when they are on here.



> So no offense but cut em some slack Darlene.



I actually do take some offense to this.  But I am going to just let it slide.




> And at last, he been doing this a while so i doubt it will get to him at all.  But if it does maybe he may need to reevaluate how much he vollenteers.
> For you grasshopper one thing that is just as important as your assessment skills is THICK SKIN. Oh and cockyness.



There seems to be a common belief on here that EMS providers should have no emotions.  That they should just do their work, have good patient care, and then not feel bad if something happens.  If something bad happens on the job, too bad for the provider.  They can't go here for help, because they are not going to get anything but an ear full of crap.  And this makes me furious.

There is a time and a place for thick skin.  On the job, yes, people should have thick skin.  But off the job, people should be able to get a little support.  Otherwise, there are going to be a lot of EMS providers dying from stress related illnesses.  



> PS
> BTW thanks for the support



Not sure how I supported you, but if I am always glad to help.  Don't hesitate to ask.

Eric


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## reaper (Jun 18, 2009)

For one, he was not asking for help. He did not have a problem that needed help. He came on here *****ing about having to do the job. BS calls are part of the job and that will not change.

If someone comes here with a real problem, we all step up and offer advice. It is up to them whether to heed that advice or not.


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

reaper said:


> For one, he was not asking for help. He did not have a problem that needed help. He came on here *****ing about having to do the job. BS calls are part of the job and that will not change.
> 
> If someone comes here with a real problem, we all step up and offer advice. It is up to them whether to heed that advice or not.



Seems like stress to me.  Isn't it possible that the fact that he has to deal with abuse of the system stressful?  Granted, this is not a life or death thread, but still, he should be able to complain.

People complain about their work all the time.  There is nothing wrong with this.  It happens in every field.  Here is an example: I teach karate, where I have to deal with children all day long.  Some of these kids are very difficult to deal with.  I sometimes complain about these kids to my co-workers, and they complain to me.  Does this mean that I should not teach karate anymore because I cannot "handle" the job?  No.  Does the fact that I complain make me a bad teacher?  I don't think so.  Does the fact that I complain or get ticked off away from the students with a co-worker mean that I am weak?  No.  Do my co-workers jump on me or shoot me down for complaining?  No.  Do I love to teach, even though the job can be a bit stressful (not as stressful as EMS) or irritating, mean that I should not keep doing it?  No.  I love the job, and will continue to do it.  

There is nothing wrong with not liking something about a job and complaining about it.  I think it would be impossible to find someone who has never complained about their job at one point in their life.  

And yes, I have seen advice given on here.  But a lot of it is given in a very degrading way.

Eric


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> I am under the impression that all of this is directed at me, not at biggee.  If not, ignore this whole response
> 
> Eric



Humor does not translate well in type.  Alot of the "jumping on" comes as intended humor.  You are right on alot of your points, problem being cockyness and thick skin are not shirt that go on or come off easy.  Not saying any of it is right or fair.  Just letting you know it s the nature of the beast. You may just have to learn to put up with it.  Many of us get bitter quickly.   
As for the  stress related deaths its a major contribuiting factor in all of us.  Just burried a good friend and former coworker bout 3 weeks ago 36 y/o b m in top physical shape ff/emt in a busy and rough part of memphis.  Anurism went pop and 3 days later pulled him off the vent and let him go.  
Man dont know what to tell you other than death sucks for the living but in the end its just the  next stage in living.  

And the thanks is for being willing to support or listen or what ever even if onone uses it.


And I thought the Darlene joke was kinda funny (scrubs)


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> .
> 
> And yes, I have seen advice given on here.  But a lot of it is given in a very degrading way.
> 
> Eric



Its a very paramilitary style industry, again just how a lot of people are on the job


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

What is this paramilitary crap?  A lot of EMS are not fire.


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

hrmeeks said:


> As for the  stress related deaths its a major contribuiting factor in all of us.  Just burried a good friend and former coworker bout 3 weeks ago 36 y/o b m in top physical shape ff/emt in a busy and rough part of memphis.  Anurism went pop and 3 days later pulled him off the vent and let him go.
> Man dont know what to tell you other than death sucks for the living but in the end its just the  next stage in living.



Sorry for your loss.  36 is WAY too young to die.  May he rest in peace.



> And the thanks is for being willing to support or listen or what ever even if onone uses it.



I can't believe I missed that.  My bad :blush:

Anytime.  I seriously hope that I can help anybody whenever they need it.



> And I thought the Darlene joke was kinda funny (scrubs)



No hard feelings sir.  I didn't take it for what it was.  I thought you were being degrading, which was my fault.  Now that I see what you meant, it is pretty funny .  Scrubs was a great show


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

hrmeeks said:


> Its a very paramilitary style industry, again just how a lot of people are on the job



I know what you mean.  I hope to be paramilitary when I am on the job, and I hope that the rest of the department I work for (hopefully Boston EMS) is the same.

But still, that doesn't mean that everybody should be short-tempered and degrading.

Eric


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> I know what you mean.  I hope to be paramilitary when I am on the job, and I hope that the rest of the department I work for (hopefully Boston EMS) is the same.
> 
> But still, that doesn't mean that everybody should be short-tempered and degrading.
> 
> Eric



Why?  We are medical professionals.  Do you see them acting paramilitary at the hospital?  No.  So why should we?


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> What is this paramilitary crap?  A lot of EMS are not fire.


I ll spare you the prehospital hx lesson, nor did I say I was fire.  But many of our traditions come from those areas.  Hell even the ranking system in this community come from that.


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

hrmeeks said:


> I ll spare you the prehospital hx lesson, nor did I say I was fire.  But many of our traditions come from those areas.  Hell even the ranking system in this community come from that.



And tradition is what is wrong with EMS.  Should we go back to just placing patient in the back and deciding whether to take them back to our funeral home or to the hospital?  It is time that we become Pre Hospital Medical Professionals that practice proven medicine not do things because bubba did it that way 50 years ago.  

Plus I know very few services that use rank unless they are fire.


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> Why?  We are medical professionals.  Do you see them acting paramilitary at the hospital?  No.  So why should we?



Many of those in the hospital do not have the dicipline respect integerity comrodardy to make it in the feild either.  The ones that do mostly come from military or similar backgrounds(PD FD EMS)  I am just saying there are many similarlities.

BTW Spelling is not my strong suit

No offense to the hospital only people out there


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## el Murpharino (Jun 18, 2009)

Here is my problem with this "rant":  "Now I sit at my day job in a daze because someone couldn't have their girlfriend drive them 20 mins to a hospital, although it wasn't even an ER treatable condition!!!"

How do we know it wasn't a treatable condition?  Especially nowadays with the H1N1 flu deemed a pandemic.  Too many times I see EMT's say "oh this was a bullsh*t call", only to find out it was a true emergency.  Want examples?  See ectopic pregnancies and mesenteric infarcts as "bullsh*t abdominal pain" calls.  Yes, plenty of times these patients get discharged as quickly as we brought them in.  But that's not our call to deem it as BS or not.    

Yes, you're a volunteer, and you're proud of it...but if that's the case, why get upset that you have to sit in a daze at your day job?  Isn't that part of the risk/reward of signing up for the night shift when you work the next day?  What if you were up that night on a status asthmaticus patient?  Would you still be complaining about it?  Yes, most of us on here wouldn't call for an ambulance for feeling sick for a few hours...but some people don't know any better.  Be fortunate your transport time wasn't longer.


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## hrmeeks (Jun 18, 2009)

el Murpharino said:


> Here is my problem with this "rant":  "Now I sit at my day job in a daze because someone couldn't have their girlfriend drive them 20 mins to a hospital, although it wasn't even an ER treatable condition!!!"
> 
> How do we know it wasn't a treatable condition?  Especially nowadays with the H1N1 flu deemed a pandemic.  Too many times I see EMT's say "oh this was a bullsh*t call", only to find out it was a true emergency.  Want examples?  See ectopic pregnancies and mesenteric infarcts as "bullsh*t abdominal pain" calls.  Yes, plenty of times these patients get discharged as quickly as we brought them in.  But that's not our call to deem it as BS or not.
> 
> Yes, you're a volunteer, and you're proud of it...but if that's the case, why get upset that you have to sit in a daze at your day job?  Isn't that part of the risk/reward of signing up for the night shift when you work the next day?  What if you were up that night on a status asthmaticus patient?  Would you still be complaining about it?  Yes, most of us on here wouldn't call for an ambulance for feeling sick for a few hours...but some people don't know any better.  Be fortunate your transport time wasn't longer.



Thanks for bringing us back on topic


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> Why?  We are medical professionals.  Do you see them acting paramilitary at the hospital?  No.  So why should we?



I am talking mostly about paramilitary uniforms.  I believe that it is important for any public servant to look professional, and paramilitary uniforms help achieve that professionalism.  Doctors and nurses are a little bit different from EMS providers.  Just because somebody is in a paramilitary uniform does not mean they are a bad EMS provider.


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## medic417 (Jun 18, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> I am talking mostly about paramilitary uniforms.  I believe that it is important for any public servant to look professional, and paramilitary uniforms help achieve that professionalism.  Doctors and nurses are a little bit different from EMS providers.  Just because somebody is in a paramilitary uniform does not mean they are a bad EMS provider.



Why do we not wear medical style clothing?  We can look professional w/o looking like a cop.


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

medic417 said:


> Why do we not wear medical style clothing?  We can look professional w/o looking like a cop.



I guess for each his own.  You prefer medical-style clothing, I prefer military style clothing.  Either one gets the job done.


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## Ridryder911 (Jun 18, 2009)

Here is why there is frustration with many of the original posts. If one did this full time, in a high level call volume, one would automatically know that this is a routine deal. In a shift of responding to 15+ more calls a shift, 3-4 could be called B.S. In reality, you are a health care provider and the service you are providing is just that .... as service. The same attitude one attempts to maintain in the ED when treating a chronic toothache, STD's, etc... all that could had been treated better and cheaper through their PCP or clinic. Again, it's just part of the job... and those that do work in it; realizes it very fast. 

It would be nice if life was as simple as the idealogy we have for EMS or even similar to the patients presented in EMT text books. It is black & white..... real life is all gray. 


Here is a link Thom **** wrote regarding something similar to our discussion; please read it.    
  www.emsresponder.com/print/EMS-Magazine/Cant-Pee--Eh/1$9638
You can see it is common. Common enough that those of us that deal with it everyday do not understand even venting about it. It just makes us notice that you are getting a taste of real EMS. Personally, it sounds like whining, alike if someone complained about standing in line to be served... it's just part of life.


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## medichopeful (Jun 18, 2009)

Ridryder911 said:


> Here is why there is frustration with many of the original posts. If one did this full time, in a high level call volume, one would automatically know that this is a routine deal. In a shift of responding to 15+ more calls a shift, 3-4 could be called B.S. In reality, you are a health care provider and the service you are providing is just that .... as service. The same attitude one attempts to maintain in the ED when treating a chronic toothache, STD's, etc... all that could had been treated better and cheaper through their PCP or clinic. Again, it's just part of the job... and those that do work in it; realizes it very fast.
> 
> It would be nice if life was as simple as the idealogy we have for EMS or even similar to the patients presented in EMT text books. It is black & white..... real life is all gray.
> 
> ...



You have a fair point sir.  I guess, on the most basic level, all the arguments in this thread can be chalked up to a culture difference.  There is nothing wrong with working in a service where there are not many calls, just as there is nothing wrong with working in a service with a lot of calls.  All I am saying is that people should just be more respectful and supportive, or they shouldn't get involved.  If you (not you, rid, a general "you") don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything.

Eric


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## Hockey (Jun 18, 2009)

Ridryder911 said:


> Here is why there is frustration with many of the original posts. *If one did this full time, in a high level call volume, one would automatically know that this is a routine deal.*





Isn't that the freaking truth


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