# Online paramedic program?



## jemt

a EMT was telling me the other day shes taking a online paramedic program and than only has to do her clinicals and ride time.

Anyone ever hear of something like this?


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## Anjel

jemt said:


> a EMT was telling me the other day shes taking a online paramedic program and than only has to do her clinicals and ride time.
> 
> Anyone ever hear of something like this?



Heard of it.

I think it is a VERY VERY VERY bad idea.


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## socalmedic

yea its in texas. while it could be done correctly i feel as though the company that is currently doing it is reputable. there is no time spent on skills.


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## Handsome Robb

The one is Texas is the only one that I have heard of. I don't know a lot about it, it seems to be catered towards active duty military personnel.


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## medic417

www.percomonline.com does online class with hands on skills classes plus clinicals . 
Techpro services closed.

Many colleges now offer hybrids.  Online can be as good as regular courses and better if done right.


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## BF2BC EMT

medic417 said:


> www.percomonline.com does online class with hands on skills classes plus clinicals .
> Techpro services closed.
> 
> Many colleges now offer hybrids.  Online can be as good as regular courses and better if done right.



Yeah, if it's an online English, math, psych class etc. Online paramedic class doesn't sound good at all. Shortcuts in learning about medicine are never good, espically when it involves people who are the highest authority outside of the hospital.


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## Chief Complaint

My Spidey sense is telling me that this thread could potentially go down hill very quickly.


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## Anjel

I am usually an all A or B student.

I failed miserably at online Michigan History.

I live in Michigan. It shouldn't of been that hard. 

I cant do online classes period. Guess it depends on the person.

But to learn these skills you need to do them over and over again. I dont know how you are gonna do that online.


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## terrible one

Chief Complaint said:


> My Spidey sense is telling me that this thread could potentially go down hill very quickly.




+ 1 


:deadhorse:


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## medic417

BF2BC EMT said:


> Yeah, if it's an online English, math, psych class etc. Online paramedic class doesn't sound good at all. Shortcuts in learning about medicine are never good, espically when it involves people who are the highest authority outside of the hospital.



I assure you that quality online programs are not a shortcut.


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## BrushBunny91

I might not move to Texas now :unsure:


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## bigbaldguy

Sit in a classroom with a glazed expression listening to a professor, sit in front of a computer listening to the same professor with a glazed expression. As long as hands on time is the same whats the dif? 90 percent of class time is now all power point anyway it seems.


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## Medic2409

Meh.  I live in the same county as the school, which is TrainingDivision.Com, by the way.

As with any school, you get out of it what you put into it.

Is it for everyone?  Nope.

However, I have had a number of students ride out with me, many of which have had to take the classes online due to not having any school locally that teaches EMS.

That being said, apparently the school is having to drop ParaMedic due to not being able to gain accreditation.


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## medic417

Medic2409 said:


> Meh.  I live in the same county as the school, which is TrainingDivision.Com, by the way.
> 
> As with any school, you get out of it what you put into it.
> 
> Is it for everyone?  Nope.
> 
> However, I have had a number of students ride out with me, many of which have had to take the classes online due to not having any school locally that teaches EMS.
> 
> That being said, apparently the school is having to drop ParaMedic due to not being able to gain accreditation.



Again quality online programs are equal to or better than many regular programs.  The quality ones have survived the accreditation process.  In Texas and actually the USA there are many online Paramedic programs including some run by colleges.


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## DV_EMT

I was actually going to do this program as well. My friend is an AEMT and He said that he got the materials and started some of the work and the hardest part is the flying out to do the clinicals. I think it's best if you have many paramedic friends or other local Paramedic Instruction resources. I did my pharmacy tech course soley online while working in a retal pharmacy and I passed the national exam my first time. I think that you need to consider it long and hard before jumping into it head first.

That being said, has anyone taken paramedic through Percom?


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## Flight-LP

BrushBunny91 said:


> I might not move to Texas now :unsure:



That's ok, enjoy EMS in SoCal............lol


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## emt junkie

DV_EMT said:


> I was actually going to do this program as well. My friend is an AEMT and He said that he got the materials and started some of the work and the hardest part is the flying out to do the clinicals. I think it's best if you have many paramedic friends or other local Paramedic Instruction resources. I did my pharmacy tech course soley online while working in a retal pharmacy and I passed the national exam my first time. I think that you need to consider it long and hard before jumping into it head first.
> 
> That being said, has anyone taken paramedic through Percom?



 I did not do the Paramedic but did the intermediate through percom.   I learned alot through the program.   You have to be self motivated and self starter to be able to thrive in an online class.  My instructor was almost always available if I had questions and was very knowledgable.  We had 2 skills weekends and on the third weekend we had a skills testing session which was alot more skills than the national registry requires.   At the skills weekend these instructors were extremely knowledgable in the skills that needed to be performed and learned, also the skills sessions were limited to 4 students which gave you tons of one on one if you needed it.

As far as CLinicals go I think as an intermediate I had about 168 hours total of clinical time.  Their clinicals were handled through TEEX in College Station and had sites across the state were you could go to do them.   I learned a ton from my clinical time.

The final which is online is timed and you're desktop, your voice, and you are monitored, so in my opinion cheating on this would be very hard.  However, if your cheating to pass your only cheating yourself because you would probably fail registry if you have to cheat in class to pass. Also, before you start the course if you have not had an A& P course you have to take their A & P for paramedics course.

In order to be successful in the class you have to put for the effort and you have to want it to do well.

I passed my National Registry Skills and CBT first time through,  So they must have taught me something in order to pass both first time around.   But then again I studied my butt off as well.

Just my .02 on the percom course.  I think it is a good program and good for people who work shift work and can not go to class on specific days of the week.

Also,  The Homework can be a bear.  Some of my homework assigments took me days to finish.   They were not cookie cutter questions,  you actually have to do research beyond your textbook in order to figure out the answers.  Alot of the questions make you have to clear the cob webs from your brain and make you think.  I don't think you can "Coast" through this program and expect to pass.  You have to work at it.


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## bstone

Just so you all know there is a med school where the students never go to class. They sit in front of computers watching the lectures. They read the books and take the tests, all without ever going to a lecture. They then do their last 2 years of clinicals in accredited hospitals. At the end of 4 years they graduate and become physicians.

I don't know about you, but I hate lecture. I have no idea what the person is saying and they make no sense to me. It's like being Charlie Brown when he is talking to an adult. I am as far from an audio learner as one can be. I am a book learned. I read the books and it makes tons of sense to me. 

So, if you ask me, does online paramedic school sounds good? Yes, as long as their clinicals are of the highest quality and they pass all the exams. Having someone stand there and go "waaa wa waaa wa waaa wa waa waa" is meaningless.


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## bstone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUyLwXhqlWU

That is seriously what happens to be in lecture:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ss2hULhXf04


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## redneckmedic

Have heard of it. The girl I know that used it used www.trainingdivision.com Not sure how much it costs compared to an actual course but like everybody else on the forum I recommend taking the actual classes. You will learn more and get more experience in my opinion. My class, for example, was held in the actual ambulance building so if a call came in during classes we were allowed to go out to it in POV to watch and learn. This profession is more of a hands-on learning environment anyway. Not saying throw out the textbook and tune out your instructor, but I have found that there is never a "textbook case" and you may need to modify/adapt your techniques (within the law and scope of practice, of course) to treat individual patients. No two calls are the same, unlike what the book says.


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## STXmedic

I have yet to come across a single "good" medic who went through training division. Last one I talked to still got his "A" drugs confused..... Not saying there aren't a few, but none have proved me wrong yet.


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## rhstanford

emt junkie said:


> I did not do the Paramedic but did the intermediate through percom.   I learned alot through the program.   You have to be self motivated and self starter to be able to thrive in an online class.  My instructor was almost always available if I had questions and was very knowledgable.  We had 2 skills weekends and on the third weekend we had a skills testing session which was alot more skills than the national registry requires.   At the skills weekend these instructors were extremely knowledgable in the skills that needed to be performed and learned, also the skills sessions were limited to 4 students which gave you tons of one on one if you needed it.
> 
> As far as CLinicals go I think as an intermediate I had about 168 hours total of clinical time.  Their clinicals were handled through TEEX in College Station and had sites across the state were you could go to do them.   I learned a ton from my clinical time.
> 
> The final which is online is timed and you're desktop, your voice, and you are monitored, so in my opinion cheating on this would be very hard.  However, if your cheating to pass your only cheating yourself because you would probably fail registry if you have to cheat in class to pass. Also, before you start the course if you have not had an A& P course you have to take their A & P for paramedics course.
> 
> In order to be successful in the class you have to put for the effort and you have to want it to do well.
> 
> I passed my National Registry Skills and CBT first time through,  So they must have taught me something in order to pass both first time around.   But then again I studied my butt off as well.
> 
> Just my .02 on the percom course.  I think it is a good program and good for people who work shift work and can not go to class on specific days of the week.
> 
> Also,  The Homework can be a bear.  Some of my homework assigments took me days to finish.   They were not cookie cutter questions,  you actually have to do research beyond your textbook in order to figure out the answers.  Alot of the questions make you have to clear the cob webs from your brain and make you think.  I don't think you can "Coast" through this program and expect to pass.  You have to work at it.


Just wondering if you would answer some questions about percom online.


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## Fish

Online Paramedic programs and accelerated 6month Paramedic progra,s in Texas are posting 58% pass rates on the National Registry, that is horrible.

Most College programs are above 90%


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## Fish

PoeticInjustice said:


> I have yet to come across a single "good" medic who went through training division. Last one I talked to still got his "A" drugs confused..... Not saying there aren't a few, but none have proved me wrong yet.



I second this, I also have not come across one who has passed the NR


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Online Paramedic programs and accelerated 6month Paramedic progra,s in Texas are posting 58% pass rates on the National Registry, that is horrible.
> 
> Most College programs are above 90%



Citation needed.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> Citation needed.



Are you requesting a link? I read this years results in a Texas EMS magazine I picked up at a Station. I do not remember what months issue it was though. But google texas EMS magazine and look at them online in PDF, you will find it.

The Magazine post the results every year.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Are you requesting a link? I read this years results in a Texas EMS magazine I picked up at a Station. I do not remember what months issue it was though. But google texas EMS magazine and look at them online in PDF, you will find it.
> 
> The Magazine post the results every year.



I look forward to you supplying a reference for your assertion.


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## Fish

I just gave you my response...

GOOGLE

And to clarify I should say most of the Central Tx colleges post high numbers. Not most of the Colleges throughout all of Texas...

TEEX post numbers in the 50% range

Training Division 70% range

EMS online training plus in the 50% range


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## bstone

Fish said:


> I just gave you my response...
> 
> GOOGLE
> 
> And to clarify I should say most of the Central Tx colleges post high numbers. Not most of the Colleges throughout all of Texas...
> 
> TEEX post numbers in the 50% range
> 
> Training Division 70% range
> 
> EMS online training plus in the 50% range



You don't seem to understand how proving something works. You state a point or assertion and then back it up with proof. You don't state a point and then demand the other person dig up the evidence. I sincerely look forward to your evidence, which I promise to thoroughly examine.


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## DesertMedic66

Only link I could find:

http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/emstraumasystems/JF10NatRegistryNumbers.pdf


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## Fish

bstone said:


> You don't seem to understand how proving something works. You state a point or assertion and then back it up with proof. You don't state a point and then demand the other person dig up the evidence. I sincerely look forward to your evidence, which I promise to thoroughly examine.



You don't understand that I could care less, do you?

Texas EMS magazine has been around for years, the first issue of every year has the posting. Look it up yourself.


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## Fish

firefite said:


> Only link I could find:
> 
> http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/emstraumasystems/JF10NatRegistryNumbers.pdf



That is 09, I will try finding 2011.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> You don't understand that I could care less, do you?
> 
> Texas EMS magazine has been around for years, the first issue of every year has the posting. Look it up yourself.



I am sorry but until you provide evidence for your position I will have to summarily dismiss it. Have a good day.


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## Fish

Scroll down to Medic
http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/emstraumasystems/Mag_JanFeb11.shtm

Hopefully you can tell what colleges are central Texas, what schools are online and what schools are 6 month Medic programs.

Also note how low Texas's first time pass rate is compared to the rest of the Nation


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## JPINFV

EMS Online: 59% out of 22 students. Borderline.
Tech Pro Services: 67%, but only 6 students so not bad.
TEEX: 52% out of 112 students. Really bad. 

The problem with 2 of the programs is one isn't nearly large enough to draw a conclusion off of and the other one is borderline. The smaller the denominator, the more useless a percent is for comparison. It's like complaining the school with 1 student sucks if that 1 student doesn't pass.


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## Handsome Robb

bstone said:


> I am sorry but until you provide evidence for your position I will have to summarily dismiss it. Have a good day.



Then don't say anything about it. Did that ever occur to you?


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## Fish

bstone said:


> I am sorry but until you provide evidence for your position I will have to summarily dismiss it. Have a good day.



Not sure if you think this hurts my feelings or if you feel I would care that you are dissmissing it? But you would be wrong to think so.


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## bstone

NVRob said:


> Then don't say anything about it. Did that ever occur to you?



The honorable gentleman made an assertion and suggested I accept it, without proof. That is impossible, sir.


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## Fish

JPINFV said:


> editing



I found the 2011 one and supplied the link, the 2011 one is the magazine I read and the one I made my initial comment off of. In 2011 the numbers were lower than 09


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Not sure if you think this hurts my feelings or if you feel I would care that you are dissmissing it? But you would be wrong to think so.



Banish the thought! Sir, I am commenting only on your position, not you. I would never, ever be as so unkind as to comment on your character.


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## JPINFV

Fish said:


> I found the 2011 one and supplied the link, the 2011 one is the magazine I read and the one I made my initial comment off of. In 2011 the numbers were lower than 09


Hence why the quote you have says, "editing".


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## Fish

bstone said:


> Banish the thought! Sir, I am commenting only on your position, not you. I would never, ever be as so unkind as to comment on your character.



Banish.ed


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## Fish

JPINFV said:


> Hence why the quote you have says, "editing".



There goes me not paying attention again


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## JPINFV

...but since it's likely to get looked over, I'll post it again.

EMS Online: 59% out of 22 students. Borderline.
Tech Pro Services: 67%, but only 6 students so not bad.
TEEX: 52% out of 112 students. Really bad. 

The problem with 2 of the programs is one isn't nearly large enough to  draw a conclusion off of and the other one is borderline. The smaller  the denominator, the more useless a percent is for comparison. It's like  complaining the school with 1 student sucks if that 1 student doesn't  pass.

/bonus post count.


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## bstone

^This does seem to demonstrate that their numbers are less than stellar. The lesson: online programs work for some, not for all, and perhaps not a majority. There are, however, students who are passing.


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## Fish

Training Division.com 63 students  71% (45/63)


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Training Division.com 63 students  71% (45/63)



That's passable. It's unknown how many more passed on the second try. I would be interested to see those numbers.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> ^This does seem to demonstrate that their numbers are less than stellar. The lesson: online programs work for some, not for all, and perhaps not a majority. There are, however, students who are passing.



And of those who are passing, what is the quality? I have no way of knowing this answer. 

I have talked with Medics who went to TEEX, or did Training Division. They stated they feel they are horribly under prepared to be a Medic.



But that is all here say...


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## bstone

Fish said:


> And of those who are passing, what is the quality? I have no way of knowing this answer.
> 
> I have talked with Medics who went to TEEX, or did Training Division. They stated they feel they are horribly under prepared to be a Medic.
> 
> 
> 
> But that is all here say...



Presumably, by passing the exams they have demonstrated competency. This is the point of the exams. I'd enjoy to see their progress 3 months, 6 months and one year after passing the exams.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> That's passable. It's unknown how many more passed on the second try. I would be interested to see those numbers.



They don't post that, but they do post the Final passing number after all 3 attempts 86% (54/63)

I would consider it a failure if 71% passed first try, that is a very low number for a test as easy as the Natinal Registry.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> Presumably, by passing the exams they have demonstrated competency. This is the point of the exams. I'd enjoy to see their progress 3 months, 6 months and one year after passing the exams.



I've seen it, it = bad


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## bstone

Fish said:


> They don't post that, but they do post the Final passing number after all 3 attempts 86% (54/63)
> 
> I would consider it a failure if 71% passed first try, that is a very low number for a test as easy as the Natinal Registry.



86% pass after all three tries? That's pretty good.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> I've seen it, it = bad



How many have you seen? Are you an FTO, ALS instructor, etc? By what objective criteria are you basing this assessment on?


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## Fish

bstone said:


> 86% pass after all three tries? That's pretty good.



I guess our opinions on this are worlds apart.


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## EMSLaw

I would have to agree with JP that at least as far as TEEX is concerned, the numbers are alarming.  If I saw a law school with a 52% first-time bar passage rate, I wouldn't go there.  (Indeed, in doing some research, I was alarmed to find out that several law schools do have California Bar Exam passage rates this low.  See the link here.  However, some of the schools,at least La Verne, are not accredited by the ABA, only by the California Board of Bar Examiners.  And I am somewhat cheered by the fact that of 185 law schools, you'd have to go to the 184th to find a bar passage rate among all graduates of worse than the 52% here.  Anyway, moving on...)

JP, how would the AMA react to a medical school where 52% of students in a class passed their USMLE or COMLEX exams?

Like any licensing exam, the NREMT is supposed to be a test of baseline professional competence.  So, TEEX is graduating students who are unprepared for even the most basic of paramedic skills.  That's unfortunate.  

What I'm curious to know is whether Texas, or the NREMT, is looking into this, or whether it is a matter of any concern at all.  Or is it all on the students, who are simply not preparing.  This is the problem with a retrospective analysis.  We can't control the (many) variables.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> How many have you seen? Are you an FTO, ALS instructor, etc? By what objective criteria are you basing this assessment on?



Well, no one who has gone to one of these programs has ever passed the hiring process with our service, so FTO would not be an option. I see them on the fire side(which does not test your medical knowledge) I am an instructor, and I am basing this off of first hand account.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Well, no one who has gone to one of these programs has ever passed the hiring process with our service, so FTO would not be an option. I see them on the fire side(which does not test your medical knowledge) I am an instructor, and I am basing this off of first hand account.



So what you are saying is that you've never been in the position for formally evaluate them, either as their instructor or FTO. Right?


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## Fish

EMSLaw said:


> I would have to agree with JP that at least as far as TEEX is concerned, the numbers are alarming.  If I saw a law school with a 52% first-time bar passage rate, I wouldn't go there.  (Indeed, in doing some research, I was alarmed to find out that several law schools do have California Bar Exam passage rates this low.  See the link here.  However, some of the schools,at least La Verne, are not accredited by the ABA, only by the California Board of Bar Examiners.  And I am somewhat cheered by the fact that of 185 law schools, you'd have to go to the 184th to find a bar passage rate among all graduates of worse than the 52% here.  Anyway, moving on...)
> 
> JP, how would the AMA react to a medical school where 52% of students in a class passed their USMLE or COMLEX exams?
> 
> Like any licensing exam, the NREMT is supposed to be a test of baseline professional competence.  So, TEEX is graduating students who are unprepared for even the most basic of paramedic skills.  That's unfortunate.
> 
> What I'm curious to know is whether Texas, or the NREMT, is looking into this, or whether it is a matter of any concern at all.  Or is it all on the students, who are simply not preparing.  This is the problem with a retrospective analysis.  We can't control the (many) variables.



As far as the NR? I do not know, Texas has taken a step in the right direction by requiring all programs to be affiliated with a College.

This will not rid us of TEEX, but it will not allow for some online programs or these shanty start ups that are posting extremely low numbers.


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## JPINFV

EMSLaw said:


> JP, how would the AMA react to a medical school where 52% of students in a class passed their USMLE or COMLEX exams?


Considering a school can be put on probation simply for not having enough study space, probably a lot of bad things. Besides, with how connected premeds are through things like SDN, I imagine there would be few to little takers as most of that 52% wouldn't be eligible for non-primary care specialties anyways.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> So what you are saying is that you've never been in the position for formally evaluate them, either as their instructor or FTO. Right?



Correct, however living with them and running every call with them is exposure enough to be able to determine their competency.

Like I said, they do not work for us so I cannot FTO them. Also I do not work as an instructor for one of these low brow schools so I did not instruct them.

However I am an instructor for other schools so proper level and quality of instruction is not alien to me


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Correct, however living with them and running every call with them is exposure enough to be able to determine their competency.
> 
> Like I said, they do not work for us so I cannot FTO them. Also I do not work as an instructor for one of these low brow schools so I did not instruct them.



Sorry, but you just said you don't work with them and have never formally assessed their competency level. That doesn't strike me as being authoritative.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> Sorry, but you just said you don't work with them and have never formally assessed their competency level. That doesn't strike me as being authoritative.



Nothing I have said strikes me as Authoritative, it strikes me as opinion.

Cept for the numbers I posted.

That being said, since I am here and you are there and we are talking about Texas. I feel I am in a better position to judge.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Nothing I have said strikes me as Authoritative, it strikes me as opinion.
> 
> Cept for the numbers I posted.
> 
> That being said, since I am here and you are there and we are talking about Texas. I feel I am in a better position to judge.



I can respect your personal opinion, but of course you realize I do not and cannot accept it as fact. It is respected.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> I can respect your personal opinion, but of course you realize I do not and cannot accept it as fact. It is respected.



I have stated, it is only opinion.


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## bstone

Fish said:


> I have stated, it is only opinion.



It is respected.


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## polisciaggie

I too took my Intermediate through PERCOM and I can attest that it is not a "shortcut" to getting certified.  The homework assignments/case studies/exams are far more in depth than any other program I've come across.  Gene Gandy, who along with being a Paramedic is also a lawyer and he is amazingly knowledgeable about anything EMS related, teaches the Intermediate and Paramedic courses.  He occasionally writes columns for the EMS World magazine. 

Before you even start working on EMS stuff you have to pass their A&P course witch is included in the prince. You are required to participate in a number of chat sessions with your instructor and fellow students that can sometimes last as long as two hours. Along with the didactic portions we were also required to attend three, two-day, weekend classes to learn, practice, and test-out on skills.  

Without a doubt, I learned far more and had a better understanding of the concepts being taught in my Intermediate class, than I ever did in my classroom based Basic course.  I see no difference between sitting in a physical classroom listening to an instructor lecture out of a book/powerpoint for multiple hours at a time and doing the same course work at your own pace on your own time.  In fact I prefer the latter, but maybe it's because I've been in college for almost four years now and am tired of the lecture based classroom setting.  :wacko:


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## Fish

I wish we could see the PERCOM pass rates


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## polisciaggie

Fish said:


> I wish we could see the PERCOM pass rates



Most up-to-date numbers that TX DSHS has is from 2009, which I believe is around when PERCOM was started, but:

EMT-B: First time pass rate: 100%, 10/10 
No one took the Intermediate or Paramedic exam in 2009. (Not sure they even offered the I or P courses then)

http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/emstraumasystems/JF10NatRegistryNumbers.pdf


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## Fish

polisciaggie said:


> Most up-to-date numbers that TX DSHS has is from 2009, which I believe is around when PERCOM was started, but:
> 
> EMT-B: First time pass rate: 100%, 10/10
> No one took the Intermediate or Paramedic exam in 2009. (Not sure they even offered the I or P courses then)
> 
> http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/emstraumasystems/JF10NatRegistryNumbers.pdf



That is a good number, PERCOM might be the one reputable online course yet.


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## polisciaggie

Fish said:


> That is a good number, PERCOM might be the one reputable online course yet.



As far as I know they are probably the only one. I did extensive research on all the programs I found, because I was at first quite leery of online programs since I didn't even know they existed until I stumbled across Training Divisions website then PERCOM's. 

Also, I know they were in the process of applying for accreditation when I was enrolled.  Not sure if they are finished with the process yet.


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## polisciaggie

Fish said:


> I wish we could see the PERCOM pass rates



Just got an email saying that the 2011 pass percentages were just posted today. So for 2011 they were: 

ECA: 100%, 1/1
EMT-B: 92%, 36/39 (looks like the 3 that didn't pass the first time didn't retest)
EMT-I: 100%, 7/7
EMT-P: 67%, 4/6. 
EMT-P Second Attempt: 100%, 6/6

http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/WorkArea/linkit.aspx?LinkIdentifier=id&ItemID=8589962610


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## bstone

polisciaggie said:


> Just got an email saying that the 2011 pass percentages were just posted today. So for 2011 they were:
> 
> ECA: 100%, 1/1
> EMT-B: 92%, 36/39 (looks like the 3 that didn't pass the first time didn't retest)
> EMT-I: 100%, 7/7
> EMT-P: 67%, 4/6.
> EMT-P Second Attempt: 100%, 6/6
> 
> http://www.dshs.state.tx.us/WorkArea/linkit.aspx?LinkIdentifier=id&ItemID=8589962610



This is all for PERCOM? If so then those percentages look very good.


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## polisciaggie

bstone said:


> This is all for PERCOM? If so then those percentages look very good.



Yep, those are all PERCOM's percentages.  

For a comparison, the 2011 Texas first time pass rate was 74%, 67%, 76%, and 62% respectively, with the overall pass percentages being 78%, 77%, 83%, and 76%.


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## bstone

polisciaggie said:


> Yep, those are all PERCOM's percentages.
> 
> For a comparison, the 2011 Texas first time pass rate was 74%, 67%, 76%, and 62% respectively, with the overall pass percentages being 78%, 77%, 83%, and 76%.



So PERCOM's online school has higher pass rates than the tradition in-class schools. Interesting.


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## exodus

If anyone has any questions about the program and pass rates or such, you could send them an email or even call them and ask them about it, I'm sure they would have no problem speaking to you about anything you want to know about it.


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## medic417

Jane really cares about her students and their future patients. Give her a call at Percom .


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## exodus

Here's the contact info (WITH phone #): http://percomonline.com/Contact-Us.php

I think one of our writers here should interview them and talk about how they feel the online class relates to a real class, along with the pass rates of their program vs other programs, etc. It would probably bring to light the flaws of many programs compared to theirs.

And I know with Gene, if he thinks you're skimping by bare minimum with your assignment, he'll kick it back and make you re-do it. As well as any research you do on your own for an assignment, you must provide all of your sources and they must be credible.


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## medic417

exodus said:


> Here's the contact info (WITH phone #): http://percomonline.com/Contact-Us.php
> 
> I think one of our writers here should interview them and talk about how they feel the online class relates to a real class, along with the pass rates of their program vs other programs, etc. It would probably bring to light the flaws of many programs compared to theirs.
> 
> And I know with Gene, if he thinks you're skimping by bare minimum with your assignment, he'll kick it back and make you re-do it. As well as any research you do on your own for an assignment, you must provide all of your sources and they must be credible.



You got that right. Dare any students to use Wikipedia as the only reference. Jane and Gene would send paper back failed in a hurry.


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## bstone

medic417 said:


> You got that right. Dare any students to use Wikipedia as the only reference. Jane and Gene would send paper back failed in a hurry.



It is unwise to use wikipedia as a source in an academic paper. It is wise to use the references that wikipedia uses, assuming they are reliable and authoritative to the topic.


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## 18G

There is a Community College in PA that offer's a hybrid Paramedic program. The didactic portion is online with skills labs a day or so a week plus clinicals. I have never heard anything bad about this program. If you do choose the hybrid program and decide it's not for you, you are than able to transition into the traditional program at the College. 

For me personally, I am not disciplined enough to do an entire Paramedic program online but that is just me. I feel it takes more of a student to do the program online than a classroom setting. 

I see no lesser value in education delivered online. What's it matter if the same information comes from a human being standing in front of you or if you receive the same information through your computer in a written, audio, and video format?


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## polisciaggie

18G said:


> I see no lesser value in education delivered online. What's it matter if the same information comes from a human being standing in front of you or if you receive the same information through your computer in a written, audio, and video format?



Couldn't agree with you more!


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## bstone

18G said:


> For me personally, I am not disciplined enough to do an entire Paramedic program online but that is just me. I feel it takes more of a student to do the program online than a classroom setting.



I agree with you entire on this! I have taken some "hybrid" or "mostly online" courses in the past few years. Concentration is definitely an issue when doing something in front of a computer. I actually would print up most of the materials and study them offline, going back to answer the questions and quizes online. Worked really well for me. I'm the sort who needs a book, highlighter, notebook and pencil, but can easily go back to the computer to complete the assignments.

And then there are those who work much better sitting in front of a computer, digest things very well and have a high degree of understand.

Then there are those who need a lecture with a real human being standing there and professing the subject material.

Different strokes for different folks. Time that we all realize, acknowledge this and stop trying to put everyone into one box.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> So PERCOM's online school has higher pass rates than the tradition in-class schools. Interesting.



Depends on which in the Classroom traditional school your talking about


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Depends on which in the Classroom traditional school your talking about



True! But their numbers don't like. They have very high pass rates. Very impressive.


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## Fish

Here is the latest for Texas, Just came out

Online Courses and accelerated Programs:

EMS Online Training Plus: 33%

Integrated Training Services, Inc. 38%

Texas Engineering Extension Service 52%

Training Division.com 72%

Pro Action Emergency Services Training 32%


PERCOM beats out these scores big time, so good for them


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## bstone

Fish said:


> Here is the latest for Texas, Just came out
> 
> Online Courses and accelerated Programs:
> 
> EMS Online Training Plus: 33%
> 
> Integrated Training Services, Inc. 38%
> 
> Texas Engineering Extension Service 52%
> 
> Training Division.com 72%
> 
> Pro Action Emergency Services Training 32%
> 
> 
> PERCOM beats out these scores big time, so good for them



I think it's clear that if you're going to go to EMT school you should go to a school that has a good reputation for educating prepared students, whom are capable of passing the board exam. This goes for online or in-person schools. Heck, I went to the "premier" EMS school in New England for Intermediate. While there they taught us incorrectly and every single student failed the Advanced Trauma Assessment station of the NREMT exam. 0% success rate. This is a school that is accredited by the CAAHEP, licensed as a post-secondary educational institution, accredited by the adjacent states and is operated by a large hospital system.


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## Fish

bstone said:


> I think it's clear that if you're going to go to EMT school you should go to a school that has a good reputation for educating prepared students, whom are capable of passing the board exam. This goes for online or in-person schools. Heck, I went to the "premier" EMS school in New England for Intermediate. While there they taught us incorrectly and every single student failed the Advanced Trauma Assessment station of the NREMT exam. 0% success rate. This is a school that is accredited by the CAAHEP, licensed as a post-secondary educational institution, accredited by the adjacent states and is operated by a large hospital system.



Agreed


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