# My Soon To be Squads Rigs



## TheAfterAffect (Feb 3, 2008)

Chiefs Car:






Rescue 976 (Bigger then Rescue 1 in NYC):








































Rig 62:





Rig 58:





Rig 57:





Rig 56:





Boat:


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 3, 2008)

First welcome to the site. 

Not to be insulting (please don't take as such) and especially since I am not aware of this particular community but in general. I continue to wonder and ask why towns spend millions on equipment, vehicles (such as Chief's car for first-aid) etc.. and still perform 40 year old treatment to their citizens? Does this community have ALS response every time within 8 minutes? Would it not make better sense to have a professional ALS services that actually could perform *medical care* and do away with the first-aid style? 

This appears to be very common in N.J. ... and you would wonder why they not recognize that no other state still has first-aid squads? Again, tradition versus the needs of community. 

Again, this is was not aimed at one particular community rather a continuum I see from those of the Northeast U.S. 

Again, welcome to the site! 

R/r 911


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 3, 2008)

Ridryder911 said:


> First welcome to the site.
> 
> Not to be insulting (please don't take as such) and especially since I am not aware of this particular community but in general. I continue to wonder and ask why towns spend millions on equipment, vehicles (such as Chief's car for first-aid) etc.. and still perform 40 year old treatment to their citizens? Does this community have ALS response every time within 8 minutes? Would it not make better sense to have a professional ALS services that actually could perform *medical care* and do away with the first-aid style?
> 
> ...



No Problem, I dont take it as offensive. But I can sure answer some of your questions for my town particular. 

As to why we spend money on Equipment: We are a rich Town, That simple. I know it doesn't sound like a good reason, But we are. 

ALS Response In under 8 Minutes: BLS responds first normally through the town, and ALS Can respond to a Call for Help within 8 Minutes, as a Rather Large Hospital is both in town, and Next town over. 

I guess it would make better sense to have only ALS, But I know most of the work we do as The Volunteer Squad is respond to most accidents at the rather Large Highway that runs through the center of my town. And also Alot of Elderly in our town that just need transport to the hospital. Plus it saves the town money, At which they pour it into vehicles and equipment like above.


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## Arkymedic (Feb 3, 2008)

Ridryder911 said:


> First welcome to the site.
> 
> Not to be insulting (please don't take as such) and especially since I am not aware of this particular community but in general. I continue to wonder and ask why towns spend millions on equipment, vehicles (such as Chief's car for first-aid) etc.. and still perform 40 year old treatment to their citizens? Does this community have ALS response every time within 8 minutes? Would it not make better sense to have a professional ALS services that actually could perform *medical care* and do away with the first-aid style?
> 
> ...


 
Rid I agree. To my knowledge LR FD, Russellville FD, Pine Bluff FD, Branson FD, Memphis FD, Springdale FD, Fort Smith FD, TFD and OKC FD don't even have trucks as large and nice as that. Is the first aid squad part of an FD? Just curious as to the need for a boat, heavy rescue, and huge rescue style box units. Is the Chief unit an ALS "flycar"? What all does that unit respond to? Population of service area? Type of area? Number of runs? etc. Just curious as I am mainly in rural areas.


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 3, 2008)

Arkymedic said:


> Rid I agree. To my knowledge LR FD, Russellville FD, Pine Bluff FD, Branson FD, Memphis FD, Springdale FD, Fort Smith FD, TFD and OKC FD don't even have trucks as large and nice as that. Is the first aid squad part of an FD? Just curious as to the need for a boat, heavy rescue, and huge rescue style box units. Is the Chief unit an ALS "flycar"? What all does that unit respond to? Population of service area? Type of area? Number of runs? etc. Just curious as I am mainly in rural areas.



First Aid Part of a FD: Answer: No, We have one FAS for the entire town, and 4 fire Depts in town, Also all Volunteer.

Need For a Boat: Lots of flooding in my town, And Deep flooding at that. We have a good amount of rivers that run through it and houses down in lil gorges that fill up really nicely with a decent amount of Rain.

Need for a Heavy Rescue: Our FD's dont do Rescue at all. And as said In my Previous post, We have a Huge Highway, Route 23, that runs directly through the center of my town and we use the Heavy rescue for alot of pileups we get on the highway. 

Rescue Style Box Trucks: Same as above, The Highway, If it isnt a multi car pileup we take one of our Regular Rescue Ambulances.

Chiefs Unit: I believe it is an ALS Style "Flycar" If Im sure as to what your referring to. Chiefs car is more used for when hes not on shift To Respond to any and all Major acts that we may have. Our chief is normally at 99.9 Percent of all our calls, Not an exaggeration at all. 

Wayne Township Population: As of 2000 = 54,069
Type of Area = Township, Suburban. 
Number of Runs For the Last 10 years: 1997 3,303
1998 3,442
1999 3,958
2000 4,144
2001 4,229
2002 4,135
2003 4,235
2004 4,207
2005 4,276
2006 4,523
2007 4,477


As for the "40 year old Treatment to Citizens": Our EMT's are required to recertify every year and are constantly taking classes and listening to lectures of new treatments and skills.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 3, 2008)

These are the areas that irritate and actually give volunteers a bad name. The town much rather save the money for "toys" and keeping tradition than to provide the best care. 

Nothing against anyone on a personal level, rather for the EMS System in general. Instead of the community assuring that they will receive the highest level of care, each time within a minimal amount of time, they much rather keep a tradition. 

I do wonder how many times a year that large rescue is really needed? As well, you describe the ..._"Alot of Elderly in our town that just need transport to the hospital"..._ large EMS units would not be needed. If your community really wanted to save money, I would gladly consult for them and I can guarantee I can save them a couple of million by returning most of those luxurious toys. It has been proven over and over large "Peterbilt" type I's have NO advantages. Even Critical Care Transports that carries hospital style beds, balloon pumps, vents, etc.. have a hard time justifying them. 
When I see such units anymore, I think to myself what a waste of money, that could be used for education and training. Seriously the most anyone needs in the back of an EMS unit even on a critical patient is two to three. 

I do wonder what the salaries of the professional EMS providers are. I would think that subsidizing a paid professional Fire and EMS would be more adventitious. 

Again, nothing personal; but I bet you will understand my opinion as you obtain more education and in-depth EMS training you receive. Hopefully, you will be the change of the future. 

R/r 911


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 3, 2008)

I do see what your saying, But Also I want to say that Our town is not Neglecting our training or any of that. Our EMT's are to recertify themselves in CPR and I believe as EMT's every year. Also classes are given on the newest treatment methods and the best equipment. 


And Within I believe 2007 we used the Rescue truck around 30-35 times I heard from another member that has been there longer.


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## medicdan (Feb 3, 2008)

Question:
I see that you have a cot horizontal in the Heavy Rescue truck-- what do you use that for? Can you transport in the heavy rescue truck (would you ever want to)? 
How often do you use the cot? What type of medical equipment do you carry on the big rig?
Are you based out of Fire stations? Do you have your own stations? How many of those BLS rigs do you have active at any time?


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## rgnoon (Feb 4, 2008)

Rid,
 I don't know very much about Wayne aside from the fact that the personnel that I have known have been very well educated, and I certainly understand the point that you are communicating (I'm definitely not arguing THERE). My post is NOT in regard to this issue, but rather the ALS service that you questioned. 
Wayne is the next county over from one of the services that I am with and their ALS is provided in the same manner as the rest of the state (with the exceptions of Newark, Jersey City and Camden as we discussed in a past thread http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=5962&highlight=patterson )

Again, I hope this clears up some of the questions regarding ALS in NJ.

Welcome to the Forum DarkAge!


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## rgnoon (Feb 4, 2008)

I apologize for the multiple posts, I failed to catch the last post in time.

There is a thread for posts of this nature...."What Does Your Agency Ride In" so before people start posting photos of their vehicles here, I figured that someone ought to point that out. 

Said thread can be found here:
http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=732


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 4, 2008)

emt-student said:


> Question:
> I see that you have a cot horizontal in the Heavy Rescue truck-- what do you use that for? Can you transport in the heavy rescue truck (would you ever want to)?
> How often do you use the cot? What type of medical equipment do you carry on the big rig?
> Are you based out of Fire stations? Do you have your own stations? How many of those BLS rigs do you have active at any time?



For the Cot Horizontal, I Do not know. But Ill be sure to find out for you ASAP. 

As for Transporting in the Heavy Rescue, I know that you can. I believe it can hold 2 or 3 in the back, Again ill check with that. 

Medical Equipment Carried on the big Rig, I remember one of the guys telling me its the same equipment we carry on the Other Rescue Ambulances, Just that this one is usually last to leave the scene and its used so multiple vehicles can be extricated. 

We are not based out of fire stations, We have Two Stations. And Uptown Station and a downtown station to serve to the different areas of town. Soon from what I hear the Downtown Station is getting demolished and the Uptown one is being renovated to house all our rigs. 

Rigs active at a Time I was told they Have 2 active normally at all times, and More activated during holidays from what Im told. 

Again, Sorry Im not that knowledgeable on some of these questions but Ill be sure to ask one of the other guys and respond ASAP.


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## Jon (Feb 4, 2008)

NJ EMS is a different animal. State law prohibits anyone other than hospital-based medics to provide ALS. So if a Rescue Squad wants to provide ALS... they can't. It is a state-wide issue.

The transport-rescue seems a bit extreme. I've heard of putting rigs like this with paramedic engine complanies in busy cities, so that they can transport if needed. I can't see that being economical for routine use, but maybe they got grant money or are able to pay for the equipment on the rig differently becuase it is an ambulance.

As for the freightliners... they are useful if you need to carry extra equipment... like a CAFS system or rescue tools (which this squad seems to carry).


To continue on Rid's post - If you guys are 100% volunteer... do you guys ever miss a call? If you can afford to spend hundreds of thousands on 4 ambulances and a Squadzilla rescue, there is no reason you shouldn't be able to street EVERY RIG every time it is called. If you can't, the squad needs to reevaluate how they spend their money, and consider adding paid staff


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## emtwacker710 (Feb 4, 2008)

yea, I'm kinda for and against the vehicles your town has purchased, I feel that there is no need for a heavy rescue, (especially one bigger than FDNY Rescue 1)...leave the extrication, heavy rescue and all that tecnical stuff to the FD...thats what we are here for...anyways lookign that rigs..I like them they look pretty good..I'm just against the heavy rescue


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## reaper (Feb 4, 2008)

I don't see this as tradition. I see it as a wealthy community flaunting their bigger and better toys. There is no reason for a city smaller then million people to have a heavy truck that big. Our county has two MAJOR interstates that run through it. We average 2-3 major mvc's a day. Still don't have a need for a truck that big.

NJ needs to concentrate on getting the state laws changed, so more cities can provide ALS service. The millions wasted on those trucks, could have been used to campaign for changes in the law.

But, as long as the citizens see the big shiny trucks, they must be getting top notch medical care!!


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## rgnoon (Feb 4, 2008)

I really don't understand where this notion of inadequate ALS coverage in New Jersey comes from. Granted, the BLS Volunteers from NJ are clearly more visible on this forum, and online communities like it, but we have excellent ALS programs in this state, and in particular in the north (where Wayne, and DarkAgeKnights are located). 

Our Paramedics are tested and trained to and beyond national registry standards, and many of the MICU programs in this particular area of NJ are considered to be exceptionally progressive and forward thinking. 

Please don't misunderstand me, I am by no means defending the purchasing of unneeded equipment as many have suggested may have occurred in Wayne, and I simply do not know the township of Wayne well enough to discern that that is the case there. I'm also not defending a traditionalist attitude that disregards continuing education and progressive research as values integral to EMS. I have however heard more than a handful of unfair judgments made of our state's hard working, and highly paid paramedics and MICU programs. 

Yes we here in the Garden state have issues that need to be dealt with, but PLEASE understand that we do have highly educated ALS professionals responding quickly and reliably to nearly every call demanding ALS intervention (with very few exceptions). Our citizens deserve, and receive better than the bunch of knuckle dragging first aiders that so many here and elsewhere make our EMS system out to be.

I apologize if this came across as a rant, It is NOT directed at anyone in particular, but is a result of many many people expressing similar notions of how this state is run.


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 4, 2008)

emtwacker710 said:


> leave the extrication, heavy rescue and all that tecnical stuff to the FD...thats what we are here for



Our towns 4 Vol FD's dont do Extrication. Our First Aid Squad is the primary Extrication source for the Town. This isn't only Wayne that is like this. In my EMT Class, I had alot of FireFighters from Surrounding towns, Both Paid and Volunteer, Most of their towns EMS Squads were Primary Extrication and Heavy Rescue for their town Also. 



Jon said:


> To continue on Rid's post - If you guys are 100% volunteer... do you guys ever miss a call?



Never miss a Call, To that I can verify. Any and every call that goes in to our  towns 911 System as requiring Medical we are there. That I know for a fact.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 4, 2008)

darkageknights, please don't feel that you are being attacked. It is that that is not the "norm" and should be considered unique. 

R/r 911


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 4, 2008)

Oh, Dont worry Sir. I know its not an attack, I just like to answer all the questions that are being asked of our Squad.


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## emtwacker710 (Feb 4, 2008)

ok, so you guys do all extrication with no FD assistance..lets say you get a bad MVA and you arrive and there is some fluid leaking that you didn't notice and then something happens to make it ignite...well now you have to call the FD and wait for them to arrive because I doubt that heavy rescue has a pump and handlines on it...


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## TheAfterAffect (Feb 4, 2008)

emtwacker710 said:


> ok, so you guys do all extrication with no FD assistance..lets say you get a bad MVA and you arrive and there is some fluid leaking that you didn't notice and then something happens to make it ignite...well now you have to call the FD and wait for them to arrive because I doubt that heavy rescue has a pump and handlines on it...



True, But thats why Fire Auto Responds to all MVA's along with us. I Know it sounds weird, but thats how we do it.


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## fireemslife (May 7, 2008)

I know this forums been dead for a while but to answer a few questions

1) Wayne's got money and we use it on equipment and training
2) We don't transport in the rescue but can use it for triage or waiting for transport in MCIs
3)I'm on both Wayne EMS and Wayne Fire, EMS does extrications and fire comes to back up, one company also has a rescue, it works for us and we have no issues.


finally new question, darkages who are u I'm away in college and haven't met you so welcome to the squad and I'm sure Ill be meeting you soon.


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## rmellish (May 8, 2008)

Well, its good to see tax dollars so hard at work. 

I really don't see the point of running BLS or even ALS in a medium duty ambulance, but some of the FDs in the more affluent communities in my state are buying them up like crazy. 

But if the money's there, then they'll spend it I guess. I wonder how many paramedic salaries could be paid with the money saved by buying equipment better suited to a communities' needs? After all, cost is one of the major reasons cited as to why more communities don't provide ALS on all ambulances.


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## MAC4NH (May 12, 2008)

If you read jon's post (#12 in this thread), you'll see that ALS is not an option for this community.  ALS providers in NJ have to be hospital-based.  The community in question has good ALS coverage from 3 different hospitals.  Salaries are not an issue because the crews are volunteers.  The residents choose to have the best equipment, even if it may seem a little over the top.  BTW, they can afford it.  

Anyone who has had any contact with the Wayne squad will tell you that they are one of the most organized, tightly-run volunteer organizations in the state.  I'm sure they're run better than some paid organizations.  

I say good for them.  Congratulations on the new rigs!


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