# IN YOUR OWN WORDS: saline versus sterile water



## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

Please do not let another reply influence your response.

Articulate how you think of it.

An ambulance, in NYS, at least, has sterile water and saline.

Is saline considered sterile? Can you use it to flush an eye out ?

Under what circumstances would you personally use either one only or both.

Thank you in advance.


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## jwk (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> Please do not let another reply influence your response.
> 
> Articulate how you think of it.
> 
> ...



Of course it's sterile.

For eye irrigation, you should use saline if available.


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## Sasha (May 16, 2011)

Sounds like a homework question


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## usalsfyre (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> Please do not let another reply influence your response.
> 
> Articulate how you think of it.
> 
> ...


Look up the tonicity of solutions and how it applies to the body. Your answer is there.


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Sounds like a homework question



Do you get any other excercize aside from jumping to conclusions ?


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## abckidsmom (May 16, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Sounds like a homework question



No, it's not a homework question...he just likes to ask every single question under the sun.

Saline is sterile.  Water is sterile.

IMO, saline is for irrigating eyes and wounds.  I usually just use those bottles of sterile water for people to have a sip when they are thirsty.  It probably would be cheaper to use regular water bottles.

The only specific use for sterile water I can think of right off hand is pouring into waterseal devices on chest tubes, or bubbling oxygen through to humidify.


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

usalsfyre said:


> Look up the tonicity of solutions and how it applies to the body. Your answer is there.



I did some searching on key words, I found something about the saline in breast implants and being toxic to the vascular system in part because of bacteria that grows over time. However, the saline in an ambulance has an expiration date, I assuem to avoid that.

I read something about avoiding it for deep wounds.

I appreciate your intelligent reply.

This sort of popped in my head because my service mainly deals with transporting sick elderly people (who conisder us a neighborhood fixture) to an ER, which I am grateful to be a part of, I am trying to make up for my inexperience with trauma with self study and reviewing other people's thoughts.

My primary concern is a list of situations which to NOT use either the saline or the sterile water.

Can you suggest anyother keywords to search for aside from "toxicity saline" ?


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> No, it's not a homework question...he just likes to ask every single question under the sun.
> 
> Saline is sterile.  Water is sterile.
> 
> ...



Thank you for replying.

As far as asking every question under the sun, that is what an online forum is for. We make ourselves semi-anonymous and post all the questions we are afraid to ask.

Rememember the series of books in the 60s/70s, "EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT something or other BUT WERE AFRAID TO ASK." ?

When I ride with my service, I only ask "what are we doing", while a call is happening. Otherwise, I just listen, I wait for a spontaneous utterance. Some experienced people enjoy randomly asking questions to people either individually or in a group.

Sometimes when people are arguing with each other over non-sense, fighting, rough housing, or criticizing other people out of ear shot, or they start watching porno, I suggest to one of those people that does it to start-up a session.  

If I offend you by "asking every question under to sun" then just ignore my posts. When people ask about something I have some experience with, insurance, law enforcement, driver education, I offer a reply.

If you want be a "Nancy Drew" search my posts, I even revealed the interview questions/format at a private ambulance service that did not offer me a job because I froze up in the process. Someone here interviewed at the very same service, I told them what to expect, and they got the job.

I really do not care if you think I ask too many or too stupid a question. I never let psychological pressure affect what I do or think in real time, with people in the same room, and I certainly will not be influenced by it from someone miles away in an online forum.

I am me regardless of how I earn money or spend my free time. I have dealt with EMS people as a cop, as a family/friend or a patient, and as co-workers. 

Once again, if I offend your personal sensibilities just do not reply. I am asking in an open thread. I am not emailing or private messaging anyone with my silly questions.

Once again, thank you for your reply and be safe out there.


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> No, it's not a homework question...he just likes to ask every single question under the sun.
> 
> Saline is sterile.  Water is sterile.
> 
> ...



Thank you for replying.

As far as asking every question under the sun, that is what an online forum is for. We make ourselves semi-anonymous and post all the questions we are afraid to ask.

Rememember the series of books in the 60s/70s, "EVERYTHING YOU WANTED TO KNOW ABOUT something or other BUT WERE AFRAID TO ASK." ?

When I ride with my service, I only ask "what are we doing", while a call is happening. Otherwise, I just listen, I wait for a spontaneous utterance. Some experienced people enjoy randomly asking questions to people either individually or in a group.

Sometimes when people are arguing with each other over non-sense, fighting, rough housing, or criticizing other people out of ear shot, or they start watching porno, I suggest to one of those people that does it to start-up a session.  

If I offend you by "asking every question under to sun" then just ignore my posts. When people ask about something I have some experience with, insurance, law enforcement, driver education, I offer a reply.

If you want be a "Nancy Drew" search my posts, I even revealed the interview questions/format at a private ambulance service that did not offer me a job because I froze up in the process. Someone here interviewed at the very same service, I told them what to expect, and they got the job.

I really do not care if you think I ask too many or too stupid a question. I never let psychological pressure affect what I do or think in real time, with people in the same room, and I certainly will not be influenced by it from someone miles away in an online forum.

I am me regardless of how I earn money or spend my free time. I have dealt with EMS people as a cop, an investigator, as a family/friend or a patient, and as co-workers. 

Once again, if I offend your personal sensibilities just do not reply. I am asking in an open thread. I am not emailing or private messaging anyone with my silly questions.

Once again, thank you for your reply and be safe out there.


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## Sasha (May 16, 2011)

He said tonicity not toxicity


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

Sasha said:


> He said tonicity not toxicity



Thank you.


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## mycrofft (May 16, 2011)

*Saline versus water?*

I did some searching on key words, I found something about the saline in breast implants and being toxic to the vascular system in part because of bacteria that grows over time. However, the saline in an ambulance has an expiration date, I assuem to avoid that.

Saline tates too salty for me.
Interesting thought, does the medium (saline or whatever) in a mammary prosthetic "go bad", and if so, potential issues?

Let's see...first, those babies are supposedly quite tough to blunt force and will be further protected by anatomy and behavior. Good question for the forum would be if anyone's seen ruptured breast implants? Could be that the trauma sufficient to free the implant medium might be such that you would be busy saving their life and not worried about ruptures per se.

Second, yes, most if not all medical fluids (liquids or solids as powder) have an expiration date. Intersting to ask a pro about that aspect! Try googling a medical office that does them, and ask. (Might need to ask five or six to get an answer). Also ask the FDA? Questions might arise about where the impant was manufactured, counterfeit implants, and quality assurance in foreign manufacturers.

Third, saline loose in the system would be pretty innocuous versus silicone or other gels, assuming it has not picked up bacteria, or absorbed significant chemicals from the container it was in (the implant's "skin"). 

ANYWAY, SNS is supposedly better for irrigating wounds and eyes, etc., than  water, I can tell you it feels better to me than regular water in the eyes, but in an emergency situation either is ok. Probabyl better for dropping an avulsed tooth into.  The degree of hypotonicity of water versus serum, over the period of time you would be treating the pt in an urban or suburban setting, is not very significant. Far worse to allow burns or occular foreign objects to persist untreated at all, or to let an abrasion scab and scar over foreign objects needing a hard scrub later to remove.


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## abckidsmom (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> Thank you for replying.
> 
> As far as asking every question under the sun, that is what an online forum is for. We make ourselves semi-anonymous and post all the questions we are afraid to ask.
> 
> ...



Not so defensive, ok?  

You are the guy that asks a lot of questions, Brown is the guy that talks in the third person...everybody has a thing.  

I thought I was just telling Sasha that you were asking a real question and that this wasn't a homework question, I didn't mean to strike such a nerve.


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> Not so defensive, ok?
> 
> You are the guy that asks a lot of questions, Brown is the guy that talks in the third person...everybody has a thing.
> 
> I thought I was just telling Sasha that you were asking a real question and that this wasn't a homework question, I didn't mean to strike such a nerve.



Thank you.


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

*So I did a key word search :*

http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=71940&start=24

I found this thread and I am reading through it now.

Any comments on anything there would be welcome.


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## mycrofft (May 16, 2011)

*What a reassuring link title!*

Ever drink bottled water left in the sun or anywhere way past expiration? Nasty due to leached chemicals. Also, "sterile" does not mean "Absolutely free of any spores or organisms til the end of time"; it was prepared and pkged sterilely IAW applicable laws and standards.


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## samiam (May 16, 2011)

mycrofft said:


> I did some searching on key words, I found something about the saline in breast implants and being toxic to the vascular system in part because of bacteria that grows over time. However, the saline in an ambulance has an expiration date, I assuem to avoid that.
> 
> Saline tates too salty for me.
> Interesting thought, does the medium (saline or whatever) in a mammary prosthetic "go bad", and if so, potential issues?
> ...


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## samiam (May 16, 2011)

That font is really really bigh34r:


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## silver (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> http://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=71940&start=24
> 
> I found this thread and I am reading through it now.
> 
> Any comments on anything there would be welcome.



FYI that is the "best" forum ever...

One can spend hours looking and maybe laughing at their first aid section.


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## medicstudent101 (May 16, 2011)

Water is sterile. 
Saline is sterile.
Can you use saline to flush out your eyes? Yes.
Would water be better? Probably.
Would saline hurt the eyes? No, It'd just dry them out a bit.


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## samiam (May 16, 2011)

medicstudent101 said:


> Water is sterile.
> Saline is sterile.
> Can you use saline to flush out your eyes? Yes.
> Would water be better? Probably.
> Would saline hurt the eyes? No, It'd just dry them out a bit.




FYI OSHA/FDA approved eyewash stations contain 0.9% NaCl Solution.

In my experience Saline is more soothing to wash out eyes because it is chemically closer to your own tears.

Via Wikipedia There are three different types of tears that all have slightly different formuals: Basal Tears (normal lubrication), Reflex Tears (you sprayed acid in my eyes owww it hurts) and Psychic Tears (crying tears.)

They all have different hormones and proteins but they all do contain sodium.

Cite: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tears


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## medicstudent101 (May 16, 2011)

samiam said:


> FYI OSHA/FDA approved eyewash stations contain 0.9% NaCl Solution.
> 
> In my experience Saline is more soothing to wash out eyes because it is chemically closer to your own tears.
> 
> ...



Cool cool. Like I said, either of the substances are more than appropriate for said situation.


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## LucidResq (May 16, 2011)

Those sterile saline bullets used for nebs are the best for flushing eyes. Easy to manipulate, and if your patient is more comfortable flushing their own eyes (as I am, perhaps because I'm a contact-lens-wearer), you can just hand them 1 or 2 and they can easily do it themselves.


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## Sandog (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> I did some searching on key words, I found something about the saline in breast implants and being toxic to the vascular system in part because of bacteria that grows over time. However, the saline in an ambulance has an expiration date, I assuem to avoid that.
> 
> I read something about avoiding it for deep wounds.
> 
> ...



Check out this site. Very good info.
http://www.anaesthesiamcq.com/FluidBook/index.php


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

samiam said:


> FYI OSHA/FDA approved eyewash stations contain 0.9% NaCl Solution.
> 
> In my experience Saline is more soothing to wash out eyes because it is chemically closer to your own tears.
> 
> ...



Thank you for your reply.

It makes 100% sense but without your reply I never would have thought about tears.


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## medicstudent101 (May 16, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> Thank you for your reply.
> 
> It makes 100% sense but without your reply I never would have thought about tears.



I'm so happy, I'm tearing up a bit. {Insert teary eyed smiley here}


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

Sandog said:


> Check out this site. Very good info.
> http://www.anaesthesiamcq.com/FluidBook/index.php



excellent 

thank you


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## samiam (May 16, 2011)

Sandog said:


> Check out this site. Very good info.
> http://www.anaesthesiamcq.com/FluidBook/index.php



Ooooooo I like this


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## emt seeking first job (May 16, 2011)

medicstudent101 said:


> I'm so happy, I'm tearing up a bit. {Insert teary eyed smiley here}




everybody is a comedian here....


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## mycrofft (May 16, 2011)

*Lucid, I've been using those saline pillows for years.*

Actually, decades. 
Very fast, sterile, clean, and compact. Deliver the solution in low or high pressure, albeit in very small quantity, but three mls placed right, and "right now", can help prevent issues later. 
Do not accidentally get the pillows with nebulizer medicine in them, though!:wacko:


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## mycrofft (May 16, 2011)

*Lucid, I've been using those saline pillows for years.*

Actually, decades. 
Very fast, sterile, clean, and compact. Deliver the solution in low or high pressure, albeit in very small quantity, but three mls placed right, and "right now", can help prevent issues later. 
Do not accidentally get the pillows with nebulizer medicine in them, though!:wacko:


PS: no pun intended about "saline pillows", that's what they're called. (I just can't stay out of troubnle, sorry OP)


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## LucidResq (May 16, 2011)

mycrofft said:


> Do not accidentally get the pillows with nebulizer medicine in them, though!:wacko:



Yeah I've almost done that and caught myself. From what I've seen, most of the saline bullets are pink and albuterol bullets clear or white.


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## NomadicMedic (May 16, 2011)

mycrofft said:


> PS: no pun intended about "saline pillows", that's what they're called. (I just can't stay out of troubnle, sorry OP)



Hmm. Funny. Here we call them "saline fish". Don't know why.


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## MrBrown (May 16, 2011)

We carry saline in 10ml snapoules and 1 litre bags

The snapoules are used to flush IV sites, eyes, clean and irrigate whereas we use the one litre bags for IV fluid and soaking wet dressings, sheets or pillow cases for burns (size dependant) but we also have glad wrap for burns, marvelous stuff.


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## samiam (May 16, 2011)

MrBrown said:


> We carry saline in 10ml snapoules and 1 litre bags
> 
> The snapoules are used to flush IV sites, eyes, clean and irrigate whereas we use the one litre bags for IV fluid and soaking wet dressings, sheets or pillow cases for burns (size dependant) but we also have glad wrap for burns, marvelous stuff.



How do you flush IV sites with them do they screw on? Luer Lok?

I am feeling the need for a picture and or a step by step instructive video.


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## mycrofft (May 16, 2011)

*I've seen those, am contemplating buying some for kits.*

Troubles are money (cost) and expiration. In conjunction with the field kits for animal control officers, I'm suggesting they be trained to carry at least a liter of fresh potable water with them at all times (not just to drink, they'll use it up) for use in the field for eyes and wounds.
I don't think, in a first aid situation, that the trace compounds leached into bottled water from plastic containers would be as harmful as not rinsing when it is necessary, but I would not use it for oral hydration due to chance of initiating vomiting from the taste.


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## the_negro_puppy (May 16, 2011)

samiam said:


> How do you flush IV sites with them do they screw on? Luer Lok?
> 
> I am feeling the need for a picture and or a step by step instructive video.



We draw up the 10ml ina 10ml syringe, then pushed through

we also mix 9ml of saline with 1ml of morphine to make 10mg in 10ml in the same syringes.

We carry Sodium Chloride 0.9% but we also caryy small quantities of "Water for injection" which is used to dissolve and mix certain drugs such a Ceftriaxone as they dont mix with NaCl.

To the thread starter, it might be helpful if you look up isotonic, hypotonic, hypertonic, colloid and crystalloids.

Cheers


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## medicdan (May 17, 2011)

I love those little things. See picture below. We carry them for use with albuterol nebs (to dilute for peds, so it's 2.5g in 6mL, as opposed to 3mL).














In case others haven't made this clear, the reason Saline is used for many medical applications is for it's salinity (0.9% NaCl), which matches the body's salinity ([nearly] isotonic). It's a crystalloid solution-- and when given intravenously is a volume expander. 

Most contact lens solutions are simply saline with chemicals to rinse, disinfect, clean and store lenses.

Question for the RTs in the room: Some call the bullets above "Respiratory Saline". Why is this? What is added to make it fit for nebs?


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## usafmedic45 (May 17, 2011)

> I found something about the saline in breast implants and being toxic to the vascular system in part because of bacteria that grows over time. However, the saline in an ambulance has an expiration date, I assuem to avoid that.



LOL Riddle me this Batman....how the :censored::censored::censored::censored: do bacteria get through a membrane that's not permeable to water molecules such as that in breast implants?   Also, I'd like to see your source for that bit of information you're trying to pass along there about "toxic to the vascular system".



> Question for the RTs in the room: Some call the bullets above "Respiratory Saline". Why is this? What is added to make it fit for nebs?



Nothing.  It's just regular old normal saline.  It's just that it's not QCed to the same standards as the IV grade stuff.  



> We carry them for use with albuterol nebs (to dilute for peds, so it's 2.5_g_ in 6mL, as opposed to 3mL



You mean, 2.5 mg, right? 

BTW, in my experience diluting it is not a good way to give the medication in young kids.  The pedi dose (for kids under 6-8 years) I've used most places is 1.25 mg of albuterol.  That said, I've never seen a serious issue arise from giving a toddler or older child an adult dose.


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## emt seeking first job (May 17, 2011)

*I do like the tangents, it gets me thinking.*

Yet I just want to write my original intention was a BLS discusion of external uses.

I was curious if there was a ever a situation NOT to use either.


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## usafmedic45 (May 17, 2011)

Any situation involving elemental sodium, potassium, etc on the skin would be about the only ones I could think of.


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## Sandog (May 17, 2011)

> LOL Riddle me this Batman....how the do bacteria get through a membrane that's not permeable to water molecules such as that in breast implants? Also, I'd like to see your source for that bit of information you're trying to pass along there about "toxic to the vascular system".



Really good and valid point. You caused me to say Hmm. My only thought was (If claim is valid) that perhaps the bacterium were introduced into the saline during the manufacture of the implant. Considering extremophiles, and despite our best efforts to produce a microbial free prosthetic, there is always the possibility.

I have nothing to cite to support this, it was just a thought and one should always explore the implausible as it may be plausible.


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## medicdan (May 17, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> Nothing.  It's just regular old normal saline.  It's just that it's not QCed to the same standards as the IV grade stuff.
> 
> You mean, 2.5 mg, right?
> 
> BTW, in my experience diluting it is not a good way to give the medication in young kids.  The pedi dose (for kids under 6-8 years) I've used most places is 1.25 mg of albuterol.  That said, I've never seen a serious issue arise from giving a toddler or older child an adult dose.



My mistake!!! Thanks for catching. 
Sorry for hijacking, one more note: I agree, but can't justify carrying the separate dosage (my supplier doesn't carry it), and my state protocols calls for 2.5mg in 6. For BLS, state protocol also doesn't allow it to be given to kids under 6. All it's doing is diluting the med, so it's given over double the time. 

Should the decreased QC standard translate into any change in practice? Should we not be using it for non-resp procedures?


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## samiam (May 17, 2011)

the_negro_puppy said:


> We draw up the 10ml ina 10ml syringe, then pushed through
> 
> we also mix 9ml of saline with 1ml of morphine to make 10mg in 10ml in the same syringes.
> 
> We carry Sodium Chloride 0.9% but we also caryy small quantities of "Water for injection" which is used to dissolve and mix certain drugs such a Ceftriaxone as they dont mix with NaCl.




Interesting thanks for the reply! That seems like a lot of work compared to our (assuming these are used all over the US not positive) pre-filled 10ml flushes. Also from my experience of patients *coming in* (I am not a US paramedic maybe one can contribute) that those who get a IV also get a saline lock. The tubing as access points and we have cool little adapters that have a shot blunt needle on one side to draw stuff up and a plastic needle to access the port in the tubing.


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## mycrofft (May 17, 2011)

*Nebulizer saline is plain, opthalmic has buffers etc.*

And take it from me, don't use nasal saline as an eye flush...I did the little dance from point A to the sink with great vigor and language. Again, must have buffers and preservatives or something in there, but it stung.


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## DrParasite (May 17, 2011)

Sterile waters tastes good on a hot day.  Saline, not so much.


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## crazycajun (May 17, 2011)

Sandog said:


> Really good and valid point. You caused me to say Hmm. My only thought was (If claim is valid) that perhaps the bacterium were introduced into the saline during the manufacture of the implant. Considering extremophiles, and despite our best efforts to produce a microbial free prosthetic, there is always the possibility.
> 
> I have nothing to cite to support this, it was just a thought and one should always explore the implausible as it may be plausible.



Actually implants are inflated with saline at the time of surgery. They come with a small amount of saline with an anti-microbial agent added from the factory. The inner most membrane also contains anti-microbial agents. The possibility of bacterium in FDA approved implants is virtually impossible. In addition, my wife has 780cc in each breast. The surgeon injected an additional 10% of anti-microbial in each breast to ensure no future infection.


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## usafmedic45 (May 18, 2011)

> In addition, my wife has 780cc in each breast.



Lucky man. LOL


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## socalmedic (May 18, 2011)

780 is nucking futs, those things must be huge...


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## usafmedic45 (May 18, 2011)

That's something around an F or G cup, depending upon the size of the torso involved.  Either way....some big ol' titties.


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## emt seeking first job (May 19, 2011)

*Getting back on track here.....*

Thank you for all the replies.

Even the jokes and the tangents.

From a BLS standpoint, ie, external use only, is there an instance you can think of where you would not use the saline or the plain water or is it that they can be both used but the saline is better ?

Why does the NYS DOH mandate both ?


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## usafmedic45 (May 20, 2011)

> From a BLS standpoint, ie, external use only, is there an instance you can think of where you would not use the saline or the plain water or is it that they can be both used but the saline is better ?



Either or....for irrigation and wound cleaning (which you honestly shouldn't be doing in the field to begin with 99.99% of the time), it's the force of the flow that matters, not what you're using (so long as its clean).



> Why does the NYS DOH mandate both ?



To be difficult and to spark debates like this one.  That or they are taking kickbacks and bribes from the sterile water manufacturers.


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## Sandog (May 20, 2011)

crazycajun said:


> Actually implants are inflated with saline at the time of surgery. They come with a small amount of saline with an anti-microbial agent added from the factory. The inner most membrane also contains anti-microbial agents. The possibility of bacterium in FDA approved implants is virtually impossible. In addition, my wife has 780cc in each breast. The surgeon injected an additional 10% of anti-microbial in each breast to ensure no future infection.



Really, so it is not even done in a factory clean room? This further supports my supposition that microbes are introduced at the beginning stage. And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?

And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and  how she treats others.


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## systemet (May 20, 2011)

Sandog said:


> And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and  how she treats others.



I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.

What makes you think his wife isn't a great person?  Why does she have to be superficial just because she has implants?  

I don't see why you need to make a simple medical conversation into a personal attack.


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## usafmedic45 (May 20, 2011)

> And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?



You know...in the absence of a sustainable food supply and in a environment that's toxic.



> I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.



Agreed.  She may have a medical reason for having them put in and decided to just go for that particular size to match her body type.


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## Sandog (May 20, 2011)

systemet said:


> I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.
> 
> What makes you think his wife isn't a great person?  Why does she have to be superficial just because she has implants?
> 
> I don't see why you need to make a simple medical conversation into a personal attack.



I can appreciate that and I appreciate what you are saying. Perhaps I was over the line. I reacted to some of the proceeding comments and equated them to that particular post. You are correct, I was out of line and my apologies.


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## usafmedic45 (May 20, 2011)

Likewise, I hope my earlier comments were not excessively crass.  If so, my apologies are also hereby extended.


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## Sandog (May 20, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> Likewise, I hope my earlier comments were not excessively crass.  If so, my apologies are also hereby extended.



Perfect example of the problem with forums. Somehow the context is often lost. If one cannot articulate themselves just quite right, perceptions are made as to the intent of the post that are often not the true and original intention of the post. At any rate, I meant no disrespect.  

USAF, I was USN, as a fellow person who served, I extend a hand.


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## usafmedic45 (May 20, 2011)

> USAF, I was USN, as a fellow person who served, I extend a hand.



Next time I find myself in San Diego (my fiancee's aunt lives there so we're trying to figure out how to get out there to visit soon), I'll do you one better. I'll extend you a beer or lunch if you're not 21 yet.


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## Sandog (May 20, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> Next time I find myself in San Diego (my fiancee's aunt lives there so we're trying to figure out how to get out there to visit soon), I'll do you one better. I'll extend you a beer or lunch if you're not 21 yet.



I work at a nice National Park here in SD, if you want to see some nice tide pools teaming with ocean life, I can help ya out. Also make sure you take your wife to http://www.sandiegorestaurants.com/keyword.cfm?keyword=bacci

Best Filet in San Diego. Be prepared to spend a few bucks though, but it is worth it. Oh sorry, I guess I went off topic...  Bacci steak is to die for....

P.S. Been over 21 for quite some time. B)


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## emt seeking first job (May 20, 2011)

Sandog said:


> I can appreciate that and I appreciate what you are saying. Perhaps I was over the line. I reacted to some of the proceeding comments and equated them to that particular post. You are correct, I was out of line and my apologies.




The discussion about microbes being in the implants was welcome. I often pondered how sterile is sterile.

Reading thoughts about that is beneficial.

However, in the future, I think we should all leave people's significant others, friends, and family out of any discussion. We should be thick skinned about ourselves, of course, and anyone who can not take it should not have this job, however, leave people's loved one's out if.


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## emt seeking first job (May 20, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> Either or....for irrigation and wound cleaning (which you honestly shouldn't be doing in the field to begin with 99.99% of the time), it's the force of the flow that matters, not what you're using (so long as its clean).
> 
> 
> 
> .



May I ask the reason an EMT should not be cleaning a wound.

I assume if there is heavy bleeding stopping the flow take priority. What about someone has a nice road rash, is it for some reason why an EMT should not clean it off before bandaging ?

I am not disagreeing with you, I just wanted to know the reasons you poseted that.

ty


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## Sandog (May 20, 2011)

emt seeking first job said:


> The discussion about microbes being in the implants was welcome. I often pondered how sterile is sterile.
> 
> Reading thoughts about that is beneficial.
> 
> However, in the future, I think we should all leave people's significant others, friends, and family out of any discussion. We should be thick skinned about ourselves, of course, and anyone who can not take it should not have this job, however, leave people's loved one's out if.



As I have already stated, my comments were out of line and I apologized, I can do no more. I see no point in dwelling on this.


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## emt seeking first job (May 20, 2011)

Sandog said:


> As I have already stated, my comments were out of line and I apologized, I can do no more. I see no point in dwelling on this.



I wrote : "In the future..."


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## crazycajun (May 20, 2011)

usafmedic45 said:


> That's something around an F or G cup, depending upon the size of the torso involved.  Either way....some big ol' titties.



Actually DD.


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## crazycajun (May 20, 2011)

Sandog said:


> Really, so it is not even done in a factory clean room? This further supports my supposition that microbes are introduced at the beginning stage. And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?
> 
> And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and  how she treats others.



It is a factory clean room. There are only 2 manufacturers accepted by the FDA in the US. Although you can get some that are "Black Market" we did not want to go this route. Some women want implants but don't want to pay the $8000.00 to have them done so they go with a doctor that only charges $2500.00. The problem is you get what you pay for.

I love my wife dearly. She is my soul mate and her choice to get implants was hers as I was happy just the way she was. She did it for self esteem and I can appreciate that. It had nothing to do with her being superficial. She had given birth to 2 children and this was something she wanted. All I did was write the check. I thought after having 2 kids, standing 5' 11" and only weighing 132 lbs she was as sexy as ever. She didn't agree and who am I to argue. It is her body. But to say she is superficial is way off base. I am sure you didn't mean anything by it and it is no big deal. Just thought some explanation was due.


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## Sasha (May 20, 2011)

Sandog said:


> Really, so it is not even done in a factory clean room? This further supports my supposition that microbes are introduced at the beginning stage. And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?
> 
> And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and  how she treats others.



You know it's not just the men who want the implants. Many times women want them for their own reasons and it's not all about pleasing men.


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## crazycajun (May 20, 2011)

Sasha said:


> You know it's not just the men who want the implants. Many times women want them for their own reasons and it's not all about pleasing men.



Thank you Sasha. You are absolutely correct. My wife had no reason to please any man. I was already pleased. This was simply for her benefit and it brought her self esteem up. If she wants anything that will make her feel better as a person, I am more than willing to get it for her.


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## firetender (May 20, 2011)

*Well, I'm glad that's cleared up, so...*

...now that we've covered/uncovered a side topic, made our comments and apologies (which, were appreciated!), and a great closing statement by Sasha, let's get back to the original intent/subject of the thread.


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## DesertMedic66 (May 20, 2011)

We also carry sterile water and saline. I have only ever used the saline tho. 

Little tip for eye washing: we had a guy get a chemical in his eye. The only thing that stopped the pain was constant saline being poured on his eye. So I stripped out an IV line and hung it up. I connected the end of the IV tubing (no needle) to a nasal cannual. Placed the split for the cannual right on the bridge of his nose and set it to a constant flow. Patient had no more pain for the 10 min drive to the hospital. Made things alot easier.


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