# Ever forget to put on your gloves?



## rhan101277 (Feb 8, 2009)

I did, but remembered immediately just after I put my hand on the pt. to take their pulse.  I wasn't in danger of blood or anything, but afterwards I felt bad about it and realized I could have put myself in some danger if there was a cut on my hand and I came in contact with blood or somehow mucous membranes.

It was banged into my head and I forgot... or I was just in to big a hurry.


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## LucidResq (Feb 8, 2009)

I did it once while drawing blood... I was extremely sleep deprived. I'm sure my eyes popped out my head once I looked down at my hands and realized what I was doing. I doubt I'll make that mistake again. This is why sleep is so important... keeps you from making those stupid little mistakes that have the potential for huge ramifications.


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## JPINFV (Feb 8, 2009)

Not wearing gloves isn't the end of the world. Do you go around life wearing gloves, or do you, from time to time, end up touching strangers? Yes, it's good practice, but not the end of the world.


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## Sasha (Feb 8, 2009)

Once. We were taking a patient from the nursing home to the ER.

The patient listed off to the side due to a previous stroke and had a chief complaint of diarrhea, abdominal pain, and a fever.  We had trouble keeping upright, despite pillows and the like she still wanted to fall off the stretcher. 

The closest ER was ORMC, which is a very busy Level I trauma center. While we were there they had two trauma alerts come in, one from flight, one by ground, so needless to say it was awhile before we got a room and held the wall for wel over an hour. I hate to stand around with gloves on, so I would take mine off, and re glove when I had to adjust the patient on the stretcher or something or another. 

One time she was about to fall right off the edge so I grabbed her quick, bare handed, and we hauled her up  back on the stretcher just as the triage nurse told us which room we could put her in, so I grabbed some foamy spray and off we went, re gloved, sheeted her over. After giving report to the nurse, he just shrugged his shoulders "Oh! She has C-Diff!".

I scrubbed my hands in the sink for about fifteen minutes after that and have not touched a patient bare handed since.


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## marineman (Feb 8, 2009)

Only once, our response time was 17 seconds and I was more thinking about my plan of attack for the patient in that time that I forgot about gloves. Luckily I keep several pairs in my pocket so I grabbed a pair and put them on while getting a quick history from the patient. 

Like JP said, it's not the end of the world to forget them when doing non invasive procedures. I know several medics who flat out don't wear them while taking vitals and such, the reason for drilling on it so hard in school is that if you get in the habit of always wearing them you will be more likely to have them on at the time that you need to have them on.


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## Buzz (Feb 8, 2009)

A lot of people will take vitals and move patients without wearing gloves. I occasionally forget mine when there's nothing blatantly obvious to remind me, but touching someone's wrist is probably a safer bet than touching a public door handle or most of the stuff you've touched on your way TO that patient.


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## marineman (Feb 8, 2009)

Buzz said:


> A lot of people will take vitals and move patients without wearing gloves. I occasionally forget mine when there's nothing blatantly obvious to remind me, but touching someone's wrist is probably a safer bet than touching a public door handle or most of the stuff you've touched on your way TO that patient.



definitely safer than touching the steering wheel in the ambulance.


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## Buzz (Feb 9, 2009)

marineman said:


> definitely safer than touching the steering wheel in the ambulance.



I frequently disinfect the entire front compartment, particularly the steering wheel and radio for that very reason.


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## Sapphyre (Feb 9, 2009)

Buzz said:


> I frequently disinfect the entire front compartment, particularly the steering wheel and radio for that very reason.



I decon the front at the start of every shift.... including the AC and stereo controls as well.


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## Kendall (Feb 9, 2009)

I am a bit OCD when it comes to decon on my truck... cab and pt compartment!


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## RESQ_5_1 (Feb 9, 2009)

Might as well decon the seats. And the floor. And the outside door handles. And the hood release. And the center console. And the door to the bay. And the doors to the hospital. And the pavement (so you don't track your boots in it). And your boots. And your uniform. And all the supplies. And the tires. And the entire outside of the rig. And.....insert any of a million things you touch every day. 

As a general rule, I put on about 10 pairs of gloves that I keep in a special sterile chamber in my house and shed them as the day goes on. 

As good as it is to prevent cross contamination, some of you border on germophobia. Which, in my opinion, should possibly make you want to consider a more sanitary career.


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## RESQ_5_1 (Feb 9, 2009)

Just googled C-Diff and found this:

Infection control measures, such as wearing gloves when caring for patients with CDAD, have been proven to be effective at prevention. This works by limiting the spread of C. difficile in the hospital setting. In addition, washing with soap and water will eliminate the spores from contaminated hands, but alcohol-based hand rubs are ineffective.[25]


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## EMTinNEPA (Feb 9, 2009)

To the OP, yes I do.  More often than I should be ok with.  There have been times that I worked a code without gloves on.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 10, 2009)

I never leave the truck without a pair on. As one that remembers when gloves were never carried, the company I worked at enforced a "fired if no BSI" policy. This got most of our attention, so I now never forget. 

It's not that hard. I usually hand a pair as soon as we arrive to my partner driving, and a pair for myself before I exit the door. 

R/r 911


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## Sasha (Feb 10, 2009)

RESQ_5_1 said:


> Just googled C-Diff and found this:
> 
> Infection control measures, such as wearing gloves when caring for patients with CDAD, have been proven to be effective at prevention. This works by limiting the spread of C. difficile in the hospital setting. *In addition, washing with soap and water will eliminate the spores from contaminated hands, but alcohol-based hand rubs are ineffective*




So? I washed my hands.


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## emtgirl515 (Feb 10, 2009)

Yesss! On my second clinical.....
First call of the day turned out to be a cardiac arrest & to my horror after I had started doing compressions I realized my bare hands, ahhhh!!! When I finally did get gloves there were only Large & XL on that particular truck which slipped down/off my hands anyway. *BSI* was officially drilled into my memory after that & stocking up on Small size gloves!!!

Oh the pt however did live, but I still haven't & probably won't ever live that one down


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## RESQ_5_1 (Feb 10, 2009)

Sasha said:


> So? I washed my hands.



If you look at my post, I didn't mention you specifically. You mentioned your pt had C-Diff. I posted what I did as an information source for everyone. Many people think that a quick rub with the disinfectant at the hospital is enough.

Not everything is a dig at you. Get over it.


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## rescuepoppy (Feb 10, 2009)

rhan101277 said:


> I did, but remembered immediately just after I put my hand on the pt. to take their pulse.  I wasn't in danger of blood or anything, but afterwards I felt bad about it and realized I could have put myself in some danger if there was a cut on my hand and I came in contact with blood or somehow mucous membranes.
> 
> It was banged into my head and I forgot... or I was just in to big a hurry.



 This is something that a vast majority of us has done at one time or another.  Is it the worst thing we can do? No. Is it a good habit to get into?No! If we make it routine to work on patients we deem to be low risk of cross contamination without gloves then we will be more likely to forget to glove on calls where the potential is higher. As some have mentioned i come from a time when gloves were not worn or were optional. I personally had trouble remembering to put them on when they first became mandatory. Now I feel almost naked being around a patient without them.


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## jochi1543 (Feb 10, 2009)

I've never forgotten gloves, but I always forget goggles with medical pts (unless I have to start an IV or do a BGL on them or something). Even after a friend told me that he had a stroke pt randomly projectile-vomit in his face and thanking god he had worn his goggles.


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## reaper (Feb 10, 2009)

Just don't forget the full biochem suit and you Will be fine!


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## sarahharter (Feb 10, 2009)

i did and it was a good and bad thing. we had a wreck and i kinda ran outta the car cuz we were going to do a rapid extrication . we pulled him out and i got blood all over my hands arms and shirt. i was freaked out a little. so we got him in the truck and i was driving that call so i cleaned off my hands and arms the best i could and rushed the guy to the trauma center. after we got him in the trauma bay i talked to the medic on the call and one of the docs. they said it was no big deal but they did blood work and stuff anywho cuz my work required it. well it all came bakc fine. but the dr and medic asked me why i didnt put on gloves. i told thetruth and said i forgot and then we went out to the truck to decon and noticed i couldnt have work gloves anyway. there were no latex free in the truck for some reason and well i am allergic. but i have always carried my own since then and have not forgotten.


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## JPINFV (Feb 10, 2009)

1. Lay off the caffine.
2. You being allergic or sensitive to latex should be the best reason to insure that you do a unit checkout at the start of every shift.


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## Shishkabob (Feb 10, 2009)

The number one comment from all my preceptors on my clinical papers---

"Very good at BSI"


Translation--- gloves were on my hand from the minute the call went out until we cleared the hospital.


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## lightsandsirens5 (Feb 10, 2009)

Once, on a full arrest run. Was doing CPR in the back of the rig and the pt vomited (or should I say his stomach contents came out) all over my hands and arms. (Combi-tube puke deflector pointed in wrong direction!:wacko: ) Gloves wouldn't have helped much then, but I haven't forgotten again!


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## rhan101277 (Feb 11, 2009)

Linuss said:


> The number one comment from all my preceptors on my clinical papers---
> 
> "Very good at BSI"
> 
> ...



Yes this is why I was so mad at myself because it was beaten into my head.  Put them on at the start of the call.  Guess I was excited about my first transport in the back.  I'll never forget again.  Only worked 2 days this month :sad:


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## Jon (Feb 11, 2009)

Buzz said:


> A lot of people will take vitals and move patients without wearing gloves. I occasionally forget mine when there's nothing blatantly obvious to remind me, but touching someone's wrist is probably a safer bet than touching a public door handle or most of the stuff you've touched on your way TO that patient.


Great point.

Also - what's with all the brand new EMT's I see that put gloves on when we are RESPONDING to calls? I mean, we won't be onscene for 5 minutes still.

I believe that gloves are important for BSI... but we also need to remember to take them OFF. Once gloves are on, they are dirty. We shouldn't be touching our cell phones, or radios, or anything else we would want to touch with "clean" hands with our gloves on. I often go through 3 pairs of gloves on a call.

Therefore it aggravates me when someone insists on wearing the same gloves they were touching the patient with when they go to re-make the stretcher.


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## medic417 (Feb 11, 2009)

Linuss said:


> The number one comment from all my preceptors on my clinical papers---
> 
> "Very good at BSI"
> 
> ...



I hope you actually change gloves after procedures and before touching other stuff.  I hate when my partner with bloody gloves calls in report, or opens cabinets.  And I'm talking blood just from IV start not like major trauma where you are working your rear off to keep them alive.  I'm talking your every day really should have gone by other means call.  Change gloves often.


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## JPINFV (Feb 11, 2009)

Jon said:


> I believe that gloves are important for BSI... but we also need to remember to take them OFF. Once gloves are on, they are dirty. We shouldn't be touching our cell phones, or radios, or anything else we would want to touch with "clean" hands with our gloves on. I often go through 3 pairs of gloves on a call.



Only 3 pairs? I'll go through twice that on a stable IFT (pair on scene that comes off before pushing patient to ambulance, pair in the unit for exam and V/S, new pair when writing report/after patient contact [see below], new pair on scene). The way I was taught was that the gurney should be considered clean and not to cross contaminate it by wearing gloves when pushing, loading/unloading, and when raising/lowering the gurney. 

As far as during transport, I'll change my gloves when I'm writing my report. This way I have a clean pair on to prevent cross contamination, but will still be able to render prompt patient care if need be.


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## medic417 (Feb 11, 2009)

A way to help keep clean for initial treatment is double glove.  Then you can easily remove top gloves when they get bloody.  I will do that on traumas to help keep from getting everything dirty and to avoid fighting with a new pair of gloves when hands get sweaty. 

It is not uncommon for me to go through 10 pairs of gloves on a simple transport.  And yes I often take vitals w/o gloves then use hand cleaner.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 11, 2009)

Although I agree with keep as clean as possible, remember they are NOT sterile gloves. Most only use examination gloves and does NOT mean they are truly aseptic. Even then there is much difference in aseptic and sanitized or clean. The terminology does NOT mean the same.

R/r 911


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## Shishkabob (Feb 11, 2009)

Jon said:


> Also - what's with all the brand new EMT's I see that put gloves on when we are RESPONDING to calls? I mean, we won't be onscene for 5 minutes still.



It takes me a while to get them on my big hands 


But no, I don't use the same gloves on the PT that I do on other things.  I just always have gloves during a call.


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## lightsandsirens5 (Feb 11, 2009)

medic417 said:


> A way to help keep clean for initial treatment is double glove.  Then you can easily remove top gloves when they get bloody.  I will do that on traumas to help keep from getting everything dirty and to avoid fighting with a new pair of gloves when hands get sweaty.




Good idea! I have also found that if your hands are sweaty and you can't get new gloves on you can use some alcohol based hand cleaner (W/O stuff like aloe and moisturizer! Then it don't work.), let your hands dry (you can speed it up by putting you hands in front of the air blower) and the new gloves go right on. I've also used plain old alcohol pads, but it takes a few of them.^_^


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## Epi-do (Feb 11, 2009)

I would venture to guess anyone that has been doing this very long has touched a patient without gloves on, some because they chose to do so and some because they forgot to put gloves on.  I have done it under both circumstances.  It does happen, and while it isn't something that you need to "freak out" about, it is something that you shouldn't do on a regular basis.  Remember it is not only protecting you, but your patient as well.

(I appoligize for any typos.  I am trying to do it with a rigid splint on my left wrist adn Epi is wanting to play catch, so she is dropping a tennis ball on my keyboard.)


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## marineman (Feb 12, 2009)

medic417 said:


> A way to help keep clean for initial treatment is double glove.  Then you can easily remove top gloves when they get bloody.  I will do that on traumas to help keep from getting everything dirty and to avoid fighting with a new pair of gloves when hands get sweaty.
> 
> It is not uncommon for me to go through 10 pairs of gloves on a simple transport.  And yes I often take vitals w/o gloves then use hand cleaner.



I've gotten in the habit because I like a clean truck is immediately after I have the IV in and flowing I pick up all the garbage and pull my first pair of gloves off keeping the garbage in it then toss it all together. Gets the garbage cleaned up quickly and keeps a fresh pair of gloves on top. I'm sure there will come a day that I forget but so far that works really well for me to get in the habit of doing it that way every time regardless if I have a messy IV or not.


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## hellofirstresponders (Feb 13, 2009)

I remember the first and last time. I was coming home from college. I didn't have my gloves once when I saw a car flip right in front of me on the freeway. I parked on the emergency lane, and ran to the car which was right on the offramp. All four occupants extracted themselves out of the car. A LEO fortunately got there and managed the scene. I managed my ABC and AOX4 on all of them. On the fourth pt. I saw she wasn't doing too well. Did my initial assessment then by some miracle a bystander had some gauze and I told her to apply pressure on her lower chin which was bleeding profusely. To this day, I regret touching her by moving her from the shards of glass she was sitting on by doing a sit pick. Some of the blood from the girl got on my jacket and hands. I washed my hands and used disinfectant right after.

Learned my lesson. Have some gloves and basic BSI in my car if I ever want to pull over and help anyone. At the time, I felt I needed to do something...i wanted to continue going, but my conscious started to bug me. This was my first time that the saying actually sunk in. Their emergency isn't my emergency.


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## medic417 (Feb 13, 2009)

hyrisk said:


> I remember the first and last time. I was coming home from college. I didn't have my gloves once when I saw a car flip right in front of me on the freeway. I parked on the emergency lane, and ran to the car which was right on the offramp. All four occupants extracted themselves out of the car. A LEO fortunately got there and managed the scene. I managed my ABC and AOX4 on all of them. On the fourth pt. I saw she wasn't doing too well. Did my initial assessment then by some miracle a bystander had some gauze and I told her to apply pressure on her lower chin which was bleeding profusely. To this day, I regret touching her by moving her from the shards of glass she was sitting on by doing a sit pick. Some of the blood from the girl got on my jacket and hands. I washed my hands and used disinfectant right after.
> 
> Learned my lesson. Have some gloves and basic BSI in my car if I ever want to pull over and help anyone. At the time, I felt I needed to do something...i wanted to continue going, but my conscious started to bug me. This was my first time that the saying actually sunk in. Their emergency isn't my emergency.



Did you catch anything?  I bet not.  Just wash it off.  

Lesson learned should be don't stop.  Dial 911 and let the professionals take care of the patient.


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## hellofirstresponders (Feb 13, 2009)

No. Didn't have any cuts at all or anything on me. Even put rubbing alcohol on me to see if I had any openings. 

Sometimes I still think I'd stop in that situation because its in my nature and our scope of practice has been instilled into me. Ironically enough, I remember seeing the baby seat dangling on that accident. I was so relieved when I knew all four passangers were accounted for. No infant. Different situations keep recurring in my mind at times, maybe the only thing I'd do is cpr/face mask if someone doesn't have a pulse or a child is bradycardic....but its something to think about. 

In reality, the smart thing to do is just to continue driving and call 911.


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## downunderwunda (Mar 3, 2009)

What has been found & recommended here for th euse of glove is that to use them on every call, every day was increasing the number of people with allergies to gloves & the ingredients that make them up. What is recommended now is that we glove only when there is a chance we will come into contact with body fluids. That is a judgment call to each officer as they see fit.


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

I get made fun of for my insistence on gloves at all times. Never do anything patient related without them until I KNOW the pt. is clean.  Usually, they don't come off until I drop them off.

I even wear them when starting IV's.  Most people in our system only wear one glove during IV sticks, one for actual use around the blood, and the ungloved to help them find a vein.  Me, I just deal and find one with it on.  I don't want ANY chance of getting their personal petri dish all over me.


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## JPINFV (Mar 3, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> Usually, they don't come off until I drop them off.



Do you change your gloves during the call at all, or is it the same pair of gloves from start to finish?


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Do you change your gloves during the call at all, or is it the same pair of gloves from start to finish?



Depends.  If they are a "clean" patient, no, I just keep them on just in case they squirt some fluid out of someplace.  I take them off after I clean up the stretcher.  If they are bloody, I change after all the bleeding is controlled.  If I just get a little blood on my glove via a glucose check or something, I just use the remaining alcohol left on the pad to clean it off.

But one way or another, I rarely if ever touch the patient with an ungloved hand, and I never touch anything else like my pen or something with a glove that has been exposed to a fluid.  

Then, of course, my pen is covered with alcohol cleaner when the call is done anyway.


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## JPINFV (Mar 3, 2009)

What's the point of wearing gloves if you're paperwork, clipboard, and pen (even if you clean the pen afterwards) has been cross contaminated? When I wear gloves (essentially every patient, but there are a few exceptions) I tend to change them after every patient contact. Take a set of V/S, do an exam, etc. Change gloves so I'm wearing a clean set. Document what I need to document. I'm still wearing gloves in case I need to do something immediately, but I'm also controlling the cross contamination.


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> What's the point of wearing gloves if you're paperwork, clipboard, and pen (even if you clean the pen afterwards) has been cross contaminated? When I wear gloves (essentially every patient, but there are a few exceptions) I tend to change them after every patient contact. Take a set of V/S, do an exam, etc. Change gloves so I'm wearing a clean set. Document what I need to document. I'm still wearing gloves in case I need to do something immediately, but I'm also controlling the cross contamination.



As I said, if they are "clean," I'm not that worried.  The gloves are just in case they START to bleed, urinate, or otherwise start oozing something gross.  I won't have to waste time on grabbing a new set of gloves to start helping them.  After I"m done, THEN I change out before touching my stuff or the report again.


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## VentMedic (Mar 3, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> As I said, if they are "clean," I'm not that worried.


 
Define clean.

The microbes you can not see are the ones that will make you or another patient the sickest.


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> Define clean.
> 
> The microbes you can not see are the ones that will make you or another patient the sickest.



That's why I was putting quotation marks around the word.  Obviously, I can't see everything.  But I am most concerned with bodily fluids, wounds, sweaty parts of the body...  Anywhere the cooties are most likely to be.  I'm only terribly worried about the most obvious nastiness.  

I get what you're saying, I do, but as I said I am only worried about major exposures.


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## VentMedic (Mar 3, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> Anywhere the cooties are most likely to be. I'm only terribly worried about the most obvious nastiness.
> 
> I get what you're saying, I do, but as I said I am only worried about major exposures.


 
MRSA, VRE, C-Diff etc are of no concern to YOU?  But, what about your patients who don't have healthy immune systems?


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## medicdan (Mar 3, 2009)

How do you define a clean patient, not worthy of different gloves between tasks? What is "clean" on your ambulance? 

I change my gloves fairly often between patient contacts, but everytime it is a different set of gloves. 

MRSA is spread by staff (most often CNAs), not chaning their gloves between tasks and patients. 

I just got into the habit of keeping two pens-- one for myself, one for patients. When I do my paperwork, I dont wear gloves, but when I get signatures, I don one glove, and use a piece of cardboard for my patient to sign, then put the pen back with my gloved hand... weird, right? 

On non-emergencies, it goes something like this:
Go in meet patient, while donning gloves, transfer to stair chair, stretcher, whatever, then gloves OFF (usually hand sanitizer at the elevator or on the way out of the room). At my company, it is assumed that straps are always handled without gloves. Get the patient out to the truck no gloves, etc. When I get vitals, gloves go on, then off for paperwork, and back on for signatures, off when out of the truck, and finally back on to transfer back to bed. Lastly I wash my hands (or, in some facilities, use hand sanitizer).


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## VentMedic (Mar 3, 2009)

emt.dan said:


> MRSA is spread by staff (most often *CNAs*), not chaning their gloves between tasks and patients.


 
And you know this how? 

Read this post by *PapaBear434*



> That's why I was putting quotation marks around the word. Obviously, I can't see everything. But* I am most concerned with bodily fluids, wounds, sweaty parts of the body... Anywhere the cooties are most likely to be. I'm only terribly worried about the most obvious nastiness.*
> 
> I get what you're saying, I do, but as* I said I am only worried about major exposures. *


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> MRSA, VRE, C-Diff etc are of no concern to YOU?  But, what about your patients who don't have healthy immune systems?



Aren't we picking nits here?  If they are obviously ill in some way or I suspect that they might be thanks to their appearance or apparent lack of hygiene, yes, gloves are on and changed frequently.  If they are a perfectly healthy 20 year old male and fell during a hockey game and busted their arm, I'm not terribly worried about touching their other wrist for a pulse and then going to my paperwork.  

Common sense sometimes prevails.


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## VentMedic (Mar 3, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> Aren't we picking nits here? If they are obviously ill in some way or I suspect that they might be thanks to their appearance or apparent lack of hygiene, yes, gloves are on and changed frequently. If they are a perfectly healthy 20 year old male and fell during a hockey game and busted their arm, I'm not terribly worried about touching their other wrist for a pulse and then going to my paperwork.
> 
> Common sense sometimes prevails.


 
I hope commonsense will prevail here which is why I have some good reading for you especially with the example you just mentioned. Also, how would this young person feel if you passed on MRSA from your hands to a break in his skin from the fall? 

http://www3.niaid.nih.gov/topics/antimicrobialResistance/Examples/mrsa/default.htm

Here's an exert but you definitely should read the ENTIRE article. 


*Community –associated MRSA (CA-MRSA)*

CA-MRSA is caused by newly emerging strains unlike those responsible for HA-MRSA and can cause infections in otherwise healthy persons with no links to healthcare systems. CA-MRSA infections typically occur as skin or soft tissue infections, but can develop into more invasive, life-threatening infections. CA-MRSA is occurring with increasing frequency in the United States and around the world and tends to occur in conditions where people are in close physical contact, such as athletes involved in football and wrestling, soldiers kept in close quarters, inmates, childcare workers, and residents of long-term care facilities.


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## daedalus (Mar 3, 2009)

Actually, labcoats and ties have been implicated in MSRA so be sure you throw MDs in there too, however I am sure that CNAs also contribute. We all do (MRSA). EMTs and Paramedics wear the same jacket for three shifts a week at my company. I too have seen CNAs walk room to room with the same gloves and gown. Actually, I see it all the time.


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## VentMedic (Mar 3, 2009)

daedalus said:


> Actually, labcoats and ties have been implicated in MSRA so be sure you throw MDs in there too, however I am sure that CNAs also contribute. We all do (MRSA). EMTs and Paramedics wear the same jacket for three shifts a week at my company. I too have seen CNAs walk room to room with the same gloves and gown. Actually, I see it all the time.


 
Trying to say "they" do it also does NOT excuse EMTs who believe their hands are not dirty if they don't have icky stuff on them. However, I will say most CNAs do know better since they do get more education on infection control than EMTs. If they work in a hospital, they must review this at least yearly and will be frequently monitored by the infection control staff. If they work in a surgical area, they may also be subject to period hand inspections/cultures or even nasal swabs just like the other staff members. 

I, too, will touch a patient on rare occasions without gloves. But, I am no more than 3 feet away from hand cleaner or 8 feet from a place to wash my hands. I *know* that I have touched a patient and must clean my hands before moving out of this patient's immediate area. I also know that if I have touched charts or other common areas, I must wash my hands before going near another patient even if I am going to wear gloves. I also know myself to be relatively disease free but still feel that I should wash my hands after eating before I go to the bedside of a patient regardless of the fact that I will be wearing gloves.


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## Fragger (Mar 3, 2009)

PPEs are always on before we head out!


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## medicdan (Mar 3, 2009)

i cannot dig up the study I informally quoted about CNAs-- I do remember seeing it a few months ago, though. I have no doubt hospital CNAs are subjected to many controls and much education, but I worry about the staff at some of the nursing homes I frequent. In fact, I worry about most of them. 
I agree, EMTs are just as guilty. I wash my outer coat every week, but that is barely enough for the contamination I encouter. I acknowledge the nastiness of most of what I touch, that is why I "pump in, pump out" with hand sanitizer, and wash my hands as often as possible. I keep a bottle of sanitizer taped to the suction in the back of the truck and in the central console in the front, and clean my hands as I come in. I dont eat in the truck, and when i do eat, I wash my hands before and after. 

Take a microbiology course, it will scare you into conforming.


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## swindlman (Mar 3, 2009)

I did once, the first call ive was ever on and remembered so had to run back to the rig looking stupid. so since then i always have some in a pocket


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 3, 2009)

emt.dan said:


> i cannot dig up the study I informally quoted about CNAs-- I do remember seeing it a few months ago, though. I have no doubt hospital CNAs are subjected to many controls and much education, but I worry about the staff at some of the nursing homes I frequent. In fact, I worry about most of them.
> I agree, EMTs are just as guilty. I wash my outer coat every week, but that is barely enough for the contamination I encouter. I acknowledge the nastiness of most of what I touch, that is why I "pump in, pump out" with hand sanitizer, and wash my hands as often as possible. I keep a bottle of sanitizer taped to the suction in the back of the truck and in the central console in the front, and clean my hands as I come in. I dont eat in the truck, and when i do eat, I wash my hands before and after.
> 
> Take a microbiology course, it will scare you into conforming.



Funny thing is, I wash all of my gear after every shift.  Though, I don't actually wear a coat.  I just have a pullover thing, so it's like wearing an over shirt over my polo.  I get home, everything goes in the washer.

I guess I figure that in the course of moving a patient, helping them up, whatever...  I am getting covered in stuff already by everything that the gloves don't cover.  If they have MSRA, well, I'm probably gonna get it too.  I don't take unnecessary risks (like licking them or something), but I'm also not going to change my gloves every time I touch them during a 10 minute transport.

Also, I myself keep hand sanitizer in my pocket in addition to the two on the walls of the rig and every couple feet in the ER.


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## medicdan (Mar 4, 2009)

I'm with you, I understand...
I am trying to point out that you want to eliminate any chance that if you have nasties on your gloves, they arent transmitted to everything you touch, from straps on the cot  to door handles to elevator buttons, to switches in the ambulance, etc. They are still going to get cleaned, but reduce the chance of the transmission as much as possible.


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## rhan101277 (Mar 5, 2009)

swindlman said:


> I did once, the first call ive was ever on and remembered so had to run back to the rig looking stupid. so since then i always have some in a pocket



Yeah it makes you look super stupid, especially when the person needs some quick help.


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## EmsPrincess* (Mar 5, 2009)

I wash everything everytime I wear it for infection control. As mentioned above I wouldn't use the same gloves for a "clean" patient and thank goodness have never witnessed it being done. 
I do recall a dental assistant walking out of the examination room with her gloves on after hitting the xray button for my daughter's xrays and then returning STILL GLOVED! Needless to say she was reported for leaving the room and returning with the same gloves on and AS MY SEVEN - YEAR - OLD pointed out Mommy, she needed clean gloves anyway after hitting the xray button!
It never ceases to amaze...


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## AJ Hidell (Mar 5, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> Funny thing is, I wash all of my gear after every shift.  Though, I don't actually wear a coat.  I just have a pullover thing, so it's like wearing an over shirt over my polo.  I get home, everything goes in the washer.


That's why I don't understand people who whine about white shirts showing dirt, grime, and blood.  Dude, if you have that stuff on you, you need to change shirts!  If I have that nasty stuff on me, I want to know about it, not just remain blissfully ignorant for the next 24 hours because the dark blue hides it well.


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## jordanfstop (Mar 5, 2009)

I generally use the New York State Bureau of EMS's guidelines.







http://www.health.state.ny.us/nysdoh/ems/policy/88-22.htm


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## HotelCo (Mar 5, 2009)

I wear gloves during all patient contact. Taking vitals, doing an assessment, even while cleaning the cot. I figure I'd rather go overboard with the BSI (to an extent) than not do enough.


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## AJ Hidell (Mar 5, 2009)

I "forgot" to put on gloves for my first fifteen years of practice.  We didn't even stock them for the first ten.  As someone has already pointed out, it's not the end of the world.  I managed to survive, and I still don't wear them often.  But I wash my hands better and  more often than the vast majority of medics who do wear gloves too.  Nine out of ten of our patients are no more a threat to our hands than the people you shake hands with and share equipment with at work.  I am unconcerned.


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## VentMedic (Mar 5, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> I "forgot" to put on gloves for my first fifteen years of practice. We didn't even stock them for the first ten..


 
Amazing what happens when somebody dares to put a name to the stuff we had probably already been seeing for years.




AJ Hidell said:


> As someone has already pointed out, it's not the end of the world. I managed to survive, and I still don't wear them often. But I wash my hands better and more often than the vast majority of medics who do wear gloves too. Nine out of ten of our patients are no more a threat to our hands than the people you shake hands with and share equipment with at work. I am unconcerned.


 
It is when your hands then touch another patient whose immune system may not be as strong as yours that it can become an issue.


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## frdude1000 (Mar 8, 2009)

I have never forgotten to put on my gloves.  I carry gloves in my wallet and I wear a holster on my belt with gloves and a cpr shield.  When I do events standbys and I wear a fanny pack kit, I keep alot of gloves in a side pocket.  Never forget to wear your gloves!!  Even if their are no bodily fluids, its a good practice.  Remember scene safety and BSI??!!??


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## exodus (Mar 8, 2009)

frdude1000 said:


> I have never forgotten to put on my gloves.  I carry gloves in my wallet and I wear a holster on my belt with gloves and a cpr shield.  When I do events standbys and I wear a fanny pack kit, I keep alot of gloves in a side pocket.  Never forget to wear your gloves!!  Even if their are no bodily fluids, its a good practice.  Remember scene safety and BSI??!!??



Uhmmm..........lol


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## 281mustang (Mar 11, 2009)

frdude1000 said:


> I carry gloves in my wallet and I wear a holster on my belt with gloves and a cpr shield.


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## Hockey (Mar 12, 2009)

exodus said:


> Uhmmm..........lol



Scary part is, he is probably serious


I'll attach a photo of someone who I recently saw at a bus stop, and then later walking through a parking lot at the mall in a haz mat suit


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## 281mustang (Mar 12, 2009)

Hockey9019 said:


> Scary part is, he is probably serious
> 
> 
> I'll attach a photo of someone who I recently saw at a bus stop, and then later walking through a parking lot at the mall in a haz mat suit


 Maybe he had AIDS?:unsure:


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## JPINFV (Mar 12, 2009)

281mustang said:


> Maybe he had AIDS?:unsure:


Pfft, join the 21st century. It's all about MRSA now, no one cares about AIDS.


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## exodus (Mar 12, 2009)

This thread got entertaining  

BACK ON TOPIC YO! 

On my IFT ride alongs, only time I really wore gloves is when I was in the hospital, or going to stick my hands somewhere icky like under their shirt for breath sounds, or if they actually were icky. But believe me, I used hand sanitizer before and after any contact.  But these were all "not sick" people.


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## Hockey (Mar 12, 2009)

Hockey9019 said:


> Scary part is, he is probably serious
> 
> 
> I'll attach a photo of someone who I recently saw at a bus stop, and then later walking through a parking lot at the mall in a haz mat suit





281mustang said:


> Maybe he had AIDS?:unsure:





JPINFV said:


> Pfft, join the 21st century. It's all about MRSA now, no one cares about AIDS.








This guy never forgets his gloves 


Its a hazmat suit.  I couldn't get any closer faster.  He had a "mask" on and everything.


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## FutureParamedic609 (Mar 24, 2009)

I'm not an EMT at all yet, nor will I will be for some time...but I will be changing gloves after handling anything and everything. That means going through lots of pairs. 
It doesn't matter how 'clean' your patient is  there are still things you're not going to see... 

I will never touch a patient without gloves...unless I'm so rushed I absolutely forget. 

Emily


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## AJ Hidell (Mar 24, 2009)

It's not so much about what you get from your patient as it is about what you give to your patient.

Just don't ever use your gloves as an excuse to not wash your hands -- properly -- at every available opportunity.  The only medics I've ever seen to engage in proper handwashing were either nurses or had taken microbiology, or both.


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## PapaBear434 (Mar 24, 2009)

AJ Hidell said:


> It's not so much about what you get from your patient as it is about what you give to your patient.
> 
> Just don't ever use your gloves as an excuse to not wash your hands -- properly -- at every available opportunity.  The only medics I've ever seen to engage in proper handwashing were either nurses or had taken microbiology, or both.



I have a perpetual case of "dish pan hands."  Cracked, dry, and raw.  My microbiology class is next semester, so we'll see what happens to me THEN.  I might end up one of those OCD guys that just can't stop.


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## EMTinNEPA (Mar 25, 2009)

FutureParamedic609 said:


> but I will be changing gloves after handling anything and everything.



I'll bet you one American dollar that at some point in your career you will forget or not have time to put a pair of gloves on.


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## Scout (Mar 25, 2009)

i remember a discussion a while back that we use gloves all too often. If i recall correctly one side of the argument was that you should only wear gloves in situations that required them,open wounds, risk of infection etc. , and that excessive use of gloves was a bad thing.


Now that was before nitrile came in big time so alot of the weight behind it has been removed.


And i have an opinion that anyone who says they have NEVER interacted with a pt without gloves is either very green or has a poor memory


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## FutureParamedic609 (Apr 4, 2009)

EMTinNEPA said:


> I'll bet you one American dollar that at some point in your career you will forget or not have time to put a pair of gloves on.



And that probably will happen lol. 
But the best thing to do, is try to prevent it


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## nomofica (Apr 4, 2009)

FutureParamedic609 said:


> And that probably will happen lol.
> But the best thing to do, is try to prevent it



Yes, it will happen.
I'm almost tempted to buy a glove holder to put on my belt.


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## Hockey (Apr 4, 2009)

nomofica said:


> Yes, it will happen.
> I'm almost tempted to buy a glove holder to put on my belt.



Don't forget everything else


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## Shishkabob (Apr 4, 2009)

Hockey9019 said:


> Don't forget everything else



Kitchen sink is mandatory.  How else do you think we was our hands in between calls in the truck?!


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## Hockey (Apr 4, 2009)

Linuss said:


> Kitchen sink is mandatory.  How else do you think we was our hands in between calls in the truck?!



See, I don't wash my hands.  I just cover it in a coating of alcohol (from my bottle of Vodka behind the drivers seat) and light it on fire to burn the germs off.


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## Melclin (May 9, 2009)

Was at a major trauma and popped a glove, blood everywhere. Not to fussed about that, it just washes off.

I was more disgusted by the my lack of p2 mask and the subsequent distinct taste of blood that I noticed when I got back in the truck after we called it. Unpleasant, but I wasn't too worried given the setting. 

All in all, not a good day for personal protection equipment:blush:.


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## DavethetrainWreck (May 11, 2009)

I rarely ever forget to forget to put on gloves because I keep them in my pockets all the time before the shift starts so I always have them handy. I usually put them on before I show up on scene. I usually feel better putting on gloves because most of the Pts I deal with are :censored::censored::censored::censored:ing gross.


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## DavethetrainWreck (May 11, 2009)

Linuss said:


> Kitchen sink is mandatory.  How else do you think we was our hands in between calls in the truck?!


I was thinking of something called hand sanitizer.


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## kb1ofc (May 13, 2009)

I don't even get off the truck with out gloves on


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## exodus (May 13, 2009)

kb1ofc said:


> I don't even get off the truck with out gloves on



You better when you walk into the hospital, it's against OSHA to wear gloves outside of the pt rooms.


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## JPINFV (May 13, 2009)

kb1ofc said:


> I don't even get off the truck with out gloves on



Do you at least take the gloves off before you return to the truck?


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## kb1ofc (May 13, 2009)

double post


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## kb1ofc (May 13, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Do you at least take the gloves off before you return to the truck?



depends on the call but usually they come off before i get in the back


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## JPINFV (May 13, 2009)

Cross contamination much?


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## MGary (Jun 9, 2009)

Haha, mine was the same as Swindlman.

First ever ride-along. Too much excitement of that first-ever call where you actually are 911 instead of the person calling it. 

Jumped out, checked the scene, jogged over to the patient (minor car accident, nonsignificant mechanism) and started in on the initial assessment. Wasn't until the Medic I was riding with told me to take C-Spine for her that I looked down at my hands and had to tell her I was an idiot and didn't think she'd actually have me in there giving patient care. In retrospect, what I thought I was doing on the ambulance if not learning through application, I don't know. 

I guess for some reason I thought I would be more job-shadowing, sitting back and watching kind of thing. But they needed an extra pair of hands and here was a guy 3/4 of the way through EMT-Basic training. Good enough to hold a head in position. 

Never actually made skin-to-skin contact without the BSI, just made myself look like an idiot by having to run back for it. Great start to an EMS career. Haha.

On a side note, as a CNAT (finishing training) here they actually tell us not to glove up unless doing something invasive (catheter care, perineal washing, etc) or dealing with a patient with a known illness or open sores. If just doing range-of-motion exercises, feeding, grooming, dressing, etc, no BSI required.  Personally... :unsure:


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## JPINFV (Jun 9, 2009)

MGary said:


> On a side note, as a CNAT (finishing training) here they actually tell us not to glove up unless doing something invasive (catheter care, perineal washing, etc) or dealing with a patient with a known illness or open sores. If just doing range-of-motion exercises, feeding, grooming, dressing, etc, no BSI required.  Personally... :unsure:



Think of it this way. If you met your patients at the grocery store and they offered to shake your hand, would you? No sane person (and, yes, OCD'ing to the point of wearing gloves at all times is not sane) wears gloves 24/7/365. We have an immune system for a reason.


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## MedicObserver (Jun 10, 2009)

holy crap that would be nasty! lucky for all of you it wasn't one of those cases where the pt. spurted blood out of a severed artery while you were doing CPR. i've seen it happen before and believe me it's nothing like the sprinkler in your back yard. the pressure is intense and it just goes everywhere.


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## STATION4 (Jul 9, 2009)

been their done that to


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## MendoEMT (Jul 10, 2009)

I always carry two extra pairs of gloves with me on every call. One of my very first calls was for a motorcyclist down and he had an open fracture on his R femur.  In my haste to trauma-shear the ****ens out of his pants I sliced open both my gloves and got blood all over my hands, and the worst thing is is that I'm a nail biter, so I know I probably had some opening on my hands.  Needless to say I was super relieved to hear later that the pt didn't have anything communicable, but it was a lousy way to start my career!:blush:


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## WuLabsWuTecH (Jul 10, 2009)

Nope, never forgotten.  Gloves go on enroute, if its a messy call, I put on a large pair and an XL pair over those.  Almost ever touch anything w.o gloves on.  When I'm writing my report I use a new set of gloves incase I forgot and touched my pen with dirty gloves earlier.  I keep a 'clean pen' in a different pocket for use in the hospital outside of patient action areas.


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## Sasha (Jul 10, 2009)

WuLabsWuTecH said:


> Nope, never forgotten.  Gloves go on enroute, if its a messy call, I put on a large pair and an XL pair over those.  Almost ever touch anything w.o gloves on.  When I'm writing my report I use a new set of gloves incase I forgot and touched my pen with dirty gloves earlier.  I keep a 'clean pen' in a different pocket for use in the hospital outside of patient action areas.



Let's not forget, gloves are there for the patient's protection to. Putting them on enroute kind of defeats the point.


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## Medic744 (Jul 11, 2009)

PapaBear434 said:


> I have a perpetual case of "dish pan hands."  Cracked, dry, and raw.  My microbiology class is next semester, so we'll see what happens to me THEN.  I might end up one of those OCD guys that just can't stop.



In one of my microlabs our assignment was to take a petri dish and rub it on something that was supposedly clean and see what grew.  I took a few and tested a few spots in a truck that had just been decon.  Its scary what all survives.


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## JPINFV (Jul 11, 2009)

Medic744 said:


> In one of my microlabs our assignment was to take a petri dish and rub it on something that was supposedly clean and see what grew.  I took a few and tested a few spots in a truck that had just been decon.  Its scary what all survives.



Was it cleaned properly? Most cleaners require up to 10 minutes of the surface being damp to properly kill all bacteria and viruses.


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## WuLabsWuTecH (Jul 12, 2009)

Sasha said:


> Let's not forget, gloves are there for the patient's protection to. Putting them on enroute kind of defeats the point.


Not really, the only thing I'm going to touch between now and then are my patient care equipment which I would have touched anyway, and maybe a door handle that i always clean and disinfect throughly.


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## HotelCo (Jul 12, 2009)

Forgot? No. I'm very anal about putting on my gloves.

There have been times that I haven't had time to put on my gloves. Those times never included any bodily fluids though.


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## VCEMT (Jul 13, 2009)

If the patient has any iso, I put on two pairs. I've been in situations where, a patient needs something an I've just taken my gloves off and my hands are sweating. Though, with MRSA, I play it extra safe. The places I dread the most are con. homes. Those nurses are spreading MRSA everywhere.

Just the other day, I was doing paperwork and fifteen minutes came and I began taking another set. I didn't have gloves on, though, I don't think a 12 year-old's arm is gonna infect me with some horrid disease.


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## VentMedic (Jul 13, 2009)

VCEMT said:


> Those nurses are spreading MRSA everywhere.


 
How are they spreading MRSA everywhere?


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## VCEMT (Jul 13, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> How are they spreading MRSA everywhere?



Half of those con home nurses do not take iso precautions. They are constantly coming into contact with patients that have VRE, c-diff, and the variations of MRSA. I see iso carts outside of practically every room or a sign stating isolation. 

I have personally, seen nurses at con homes touching MRSA sputum patients without a gown and gloves on. After touching the patient they grab a pen and their clipboard. Come on, have you been to con homes?


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## medic417 (Jul 13, 2009)

VentMedic said:


> How are they spreading MRSA everywhere?



Maybe they are using a magic mister and sprayng everyone that comes in?:wacko:


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## VentMedic (Jul 13, 2009)

VCEMT said:


> con homes


 
??  Are we talking a Prison/Jail or a LTC facility of some type?  I will admit prisons are difficult to control inmate activity and right now we have gotten several cases of Influenza A identified from them.  As well, like school gyms, their showers can also be a source of MRSA.   We do have a prison wing in the hospital where everyone now gets a MRSA and flu nasal swab upon admission.



VCEMT said:


> I have personally, seen nurses at con homes touching *MRSA sputum patients* without a gown and gloves on.


 
If the MRSA is isolated to the sputum, I don't gown either if the patient is not spewing sputum everywhere.   If it is isolated to a wound that is covered, I am careful not to touch the bedding.   While it is wise to exercise caution and good hand washing techniques, it is also possible to go over board.   The institution requirements and  precautions for MRSA have changed depending on the location of the colonization or active infection.     They are now classified as aerosol, droplet and contact with different requirements for each.


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## usafmedic45 (Jul 13, 2009)

> ?? Are we talking a Prison/Jail or a LTC facility of some type?



LTC, nursing home, rest home...pick your term.


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## VentMedic (Jul 13, 2009)

usafmedic45 said:


> LTC, nursing home, rest home...pick your term.


 
Too many terms and homes...

We've got half-way type houses now for  TB patients who no longer qualify for the big TB Hospital (A.G. Holley) but can't be fully trusted to be compliant.


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## Lifeguards For Life (Aug 6, 2009)

I had forgotten to put gloves on a few times while working for a beach patrol agency, not so much now. I remember one incident involving a shark bite, while i was wearing gloves i wondered how much they really protected me, considering all i was wearing was a swimsuit. this is the only time i have been grossed out by blood, when i realized i was standing barefoot in a puddle of it.


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## EMTzimp (Aug 6, 2009)

Glove it up and all will be ok!


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## JeffDHMC (Aug 11, 2009)

I forgot once in Thailand.


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## VFFforpeople (Aug 11, 2009)

I never forget..well ok once but thats why I always keep a spare pair in the pockets of my turnouts, never know.


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## Seaglass (Aug 13, 2009)

I ripped a glove the other night when I was practically asleep. I noticed my hand and thought something was wrong with the picture, but it took me a moment to realize that what was wrong was blood on my bare skin. Told myself I was a moron, went for the hand sanitizer, put a glove on, and made sure to wash really well when I got back.


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## exodus (Aug 14, 2009)

Seaglass said:


> I ripped a glove the other night when I was practically asleep. I noticed my hand and thought something was wrong with the picture, but it took me a moment to realize that what was wrong was blood on my bare skin. Told myself I was a moron, went for the hand sanitizer, put a glove on, and made sure to wash really well when I got back.



Did the pt have any Blood Borne Illness's? Did you have any open cuts on your hand, or peeling or cracked skin where it happened? If you answered yes, you better fill out an incident report...


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## dmc2007 (Aug 16, 2009)

Tonight we got done bringing in an ETOH and were just about ready to head out when four patients came in on two ambulances from an MVA.  We helped the crews get the patients on on our stretcher.  In the rush I forgot gloves and ended up sticking my hand in a glob of blood (only exposed my thumb which has no visible open cuts).  I literally jumped across the ED to the sink and got it off immediately (blood was maybe on my hand for a second) and thoroughly scrubbed my hands off.  How concerned should I be?


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## kittaypie (Aug 16, 2009)

dmc2007 said:


> Tonight we got done bringing in an ETOH and were just about ready to head out when four patients came in on two ambulances from an MVA.  We helped the crews get the patients on on our stretcher.  In the rush I forgot gloves and ended up sticking my hand in a glob of blood (only exposed my thumb which has no visible open cuts).  I literally jumped across the ED to the sink and got it off immediately (blood was maybe on my hand for a second) and thoroughly scrubbed my hands off.  How concerned should I be?




umm, don't be concerned. there was no exposure.


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## Scout (Aug 16, 2009)

dmc2007 said:


> ended up sticking my hand in a glob of blood





BE afraid be very afraid.........

Well no not really. Blood is not the evil carryer of death. 

1 there needs to be something bad a the blood. Lets call this dark matter.
2 the dark matter needs to come in contact with you. check
3 It needs to get in and mix with you. Thought cuts, eyes mouth or some other orifice.  
4 you need to be unlucky enough for all that to happen before you die a horrible death outcast by society.

Or it could be you just got a bi of dirt on you and you washed it off...


O and kitty for you its a 10 tonne penguin


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## dmc2007 (Aug 16, 2009)

Thanks guys.  I understand I'm just being a paranoid newb.

I figure this has to happen all the time at varying levels of healthcare and you don't see providers dropping left and right.


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## Scout (Aug 16, 2009)

Its ok, Most fall down thou. Its got to do with gravity...


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## Ridryder911 (Aug 16, 2009)

All exposures should be reported. Sorry, but it appears a lot of you need some further education. Blood borne pathogens can enter the body through small cracks and cuts that you are not aware of. One should definitely not be paranoid but be aware and take the formal precautions and as well report in case there is an incidence later. If you did not report it, the consequences and costs will be upon you and not your employer. 

R/r 911


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## NomadicMedic (Aug 16, 2009)

To echo Rid, you should make sure to obtain and read a copy of your employer's BBP exposure plan. This is required by OSHA for any job where the employee may come in contact with potentially infectious material.

Not knowing ALL of your employer's mandated engineering  and work practice controls, PPE requirements and reporting guidelines leave you open to assume some or all liability in the event of an exposure.

If your company doesn't have one, suggest that they prepare a document ASAP and distribute it to all staff.


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## EMTelite (Aug 17, 2009)

I actually just did it the other day... I was off duty and I was at the movies with my girlfriend and some friends and I had an elderly fall victim I did my assessment and went to take a pulse and realized that I didnt have my gloves on but I went on with my procedures but afterwards I scrubbed the hell out of my hands with sani


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## Seaglass (Aug 20, 2009)

exodus said:


> Did the pt have any Blood Borne Illness's? Did you have any open cuts on your hand, or peeling or cracked skin where it happened? If you answered yes, you better fill out an incident report...



No to all of the above. I would've been more concerned if that were the case, or if the pt wasn't a frequent flier. I technically should've reported it anyways... but on the last call of a busy shift, when I'm not alert enough to notice my glove ripping, the chances of that happening were pretty slim. 

We have mandatory bloodborne pathogens seminars every so often, as well as health screenings.


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## CF919 (Sep 19, 2009)

*Never*

Gloves go on as soon as we clear the call and go in route.


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## JPINFV (Sep 19, 2009)

>.>     <.<   


So you're wearing gloves while inside the ambulance prior to even going on scene? I hope none of your patients are ever immunocompromised.


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## amberdt03 (Sep 19, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> >.>     <.<
> 
> 
> So you're wearing gloves while inside the ambulance prior to even going on scene? I hope none of your patients are ever immunocompromised.



i know right.......used to have a partner that would wear gloves while driving after making patient contact.


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## fiddlesticks (Sep 19, 2009)

i have never forgot to put gloves on but i have gone to itch my face or brush my hair out of my face with some pretty gross gloves on not thinking, thank god i caught my self at the last second yuck!


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## Medic One (Sep 19, 2009)

I am 95% complient when it comes to putting gloves on but the worst thing of all to happen is........

Moving a pt from bed to the EMS cot on kneeling in urine....Even after a uniform change and bath in a bag/spit wash I still feel nasty....uhg I hate that!!!!

From now on I stay on the stretcher side and pull pt to me.


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## exodus (Sep 19, 2009)

Medic One said:


> I am 95% complient when it comes to putting gloves on but the worst thing of all to happen is........
> 
> Moving a pt from bed to the EMS cot on kneeling in urine....Even after a uniform change and bath in a bag/spit wash I still feel nasty....uhg I hate that!!!!
> 
> From now on I stay on the stretcher side and pull pt to me.



If I ever have to get on the bed, I always feel the bed with my gloved hand first, then look on the glove for moisture :]


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## CF919 (Sep 19, 2009)

*Let me clarify*

Ok let me make myself clear the gloves go on while Enroute to the call. No thet are not driving gloves but when the door of the rig is opened everyone has BSI on.  And in no means are the gloves worn while driving after patient contact has been maid....<_<


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## Jon (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Ok let me make myself clear the gloves go on while Enroute to the call. No thet are not driving gloves but when the door of the rig is opened everyone has BSI on.  And in no means are the gloves worn while driving after patient contact has been maid....<_<


Ok... We've discussed this attitude and why it's BAD earlier in the thread.... first of all... you are now thinking of gloves as "clean" when you need to always think of them as "dirty". That confusion could cause you to do something silly down the road.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

I know what you are saying Jon....  But I have to disagree somewhat.  I don't care who or what it is these days when that door opens on the rescue rig all my basic BSI equip. is in place.  In my small town I see way to many people make patient contact and not were BSI equip.  because they have known the person there whole life. Doesn't matter who what when were or why when you get out of the rig BSI is on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## JPINFV (Sep 20, 2009)

I wonder how many people realize that standard precaution is not gloves on for all patients without thought.


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## amberdt03 (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Ok let me make myself clear the gloves go on while Enroute to the call. No thet are not driving gloves but when the door of the rig is opened everyone has BSI on.  And in no means are the gloves worn while driving after patient contact has been maid....<_<




how often do you clean the inside of the door? what we are trying to tell you is that you don't know what is on the door. so when you open the door with a gloved hand, and then make patient contact you don't know what you could be exposing them to.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

amberdt03 said:


> how often do you clean the inside of the door? What we are trying to tell you is that you don't know what is on the door. So when you open the door with a gloved hand, and then make patient contact you don't know what you could be exposing them to.



ok by my ways and habits i have never forgotten to put my gloves on!!!  Another thing bsi is more for me for me not the patient. And decon is not just after a bloody run every patient that gets in that ambulance is justified a clean buss.  My buss is clean..... And like i was saying bsi is for me and my partner more than the patient.  I can go on for days!!!!!!!!!!!! Once you get in a habit of having gloves on when you get out of the buss you will never have to worry about starting a topic about this,


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## amberdt03 (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> ok by my ways and habits i have never forgotten to put my gloves on!!!  Another thing bsi is more for me for me not the patient. And decon is not just after a bloody run every patient that gets in that ambulance is justified a clean buss.  My buss is clean..... And like i was saying bsi is for me and my partner more than the patient.  I can go on for days!!!!!!!!!!!! Once you get in a habit of having gloves on when you get out of the buss you will never have to worry about starting a topic about this,



first of all, chill out dude. nobody is attacking you. second of all, i have never said that i don't wear gloves. the first thing i do *before* i make any physical contact with the patient is put gloves on. 

let me ask you this, how many times do you write your report with your gloves on? by writing with your pen with your gloves on, and then making contact with your pen without gloves on will put you in contact with lord knows what.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

*Ok I give up..*

ok well my ways of practicing BSI is not up to your standards its a now win situation.  Yes i have written reports with my gloves on and yes that opens me up to many things. But I stand strong on the point i made of BSI is for me.


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Another thing bsi is more for me for me not the patient.



Wrong.  BSI is for both you AND the patient.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> Wrong.  BSI is for both you AND the patient.


Yes You are right But My first Priority is mine and my partners personal safety.  if its not safe for use im sorry about your luck.. sorry thats the life of the EMT my job is to save you but if i cant do it safely i cant do it.. end of story


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Yes You are right But My first Priority is mine and my partners personal safety.  if its not safe for use im sorry about your luck.. sorry thats the life of the EMT my job is to save you but if i cant do it safely i cant do it.. end of story



Yes, you are correct that your safety is the most important thing.  But remember, part of BSI includes what you do AFTER and during BSI precautions.  In other words, if you don't take your gloves off immediately after the call is over, you are exposing yourself and your coworkers to unneeded risks.


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

exodus said:


> If I ever have to get on the bed, I always feel the bed with my gloved hand first, then look on the glove for moisture :]



You sticky-test the bed?  Nice


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> I wonder how many people realize that standard precaution is not gloves on for all patients without thought.



Techinically, it's not.  But for me, I will wear gloves 100% of the time.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

medichopeful said:


> Yes, you are correct that your safety is the most important thing.  But remember, part of BSI includes what you do AFTER and during BSI precautions.  In other words, if you don't take your gloves off immediately after the call is over, you are exposing yourself and your coworkers to unneeded risks.



Oh no after the call we like to keep wearing them showing off all the body fluids on them kinda like the warriors don't clean the blood off there swords.  im the biggest decon freak there is. honestly how often do you decon youre scope.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

*How do you Figure the scene is never really safe??*


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Oh no after the call we like to keep wearing them showing off all the body fluids on them kinda like the warriors don't clean the blood off there swords.  im the biggest decon freak there is. honestly how often do you decon youre scope.



No need to get sarcastic.

Maybe I didn't phrase my response correctly, but you stated that you write reports with your gloves on.  By doing this, remember, you are affecting YOUR personal safety.


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> *How do you Figure the scene is never really safe??*



Here's an example.  Let's say you are dispatched to a basic medical call.  At the start of the call, you determine the scene is safe.  Does that mean the scene is safe the whole time?  Not in the least.  Things change.  What if the patient pulls a weapon?  Or the family becomes uncontrollable?

You just need to constantly re-evaluate.  Once again, it comes back to YOUR safety.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

*White Towel Time*

_*OK i give up again for real this time you guys are way to good for me.*_


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> _*OK i give up again for real this time you guys are way to good for me.*_



Why not just learn from what people have told you instead of giving up so easily?  They are just trying to help you out.


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

*you are so right on that.  i give you props.  scene size up doesn't end it continues through out the call up to the point when you transfer care over.  oh crap i was gonna give up!!! lol*


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## CF919 (Sep 20, 2009)

In this field i learn everyday every call you will not ever stop learning there will allways be somthing new.. i take every recomindation into consideration


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## medichopeful (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> In this field i learn everyday every call you will not ever stop learning there will allways be somthing new.. i take every recomindation into consideration



Good to hear.


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## JPINFV (Sep 20, 2009)

CF919 said:


> Yes You are right But My first Priority is mine and my partners personal safety.  if its not safe for use im sorry about your luck.. sorry thats the life of the EMT my job is to save you but if i cant do it safely i cant do it.. end of story



If you care about yourself then you would care about preventing cross contamination. Do you ever handle your clipboard without gloves on?


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## Scout (Sep 20, 2009)

do people not clean the pen and such?


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## Gen09 (Sep 21, 2009)

That's always one of the first things on my mind. Whether I'm in truck or an ambulance I make sure I have some gloves and depending on the severity of the call I'll either put them on on the way or once I get to the patient. They come off before I hop back in the the truck/ambulance also.


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## JB42 (Sep 21, 2009)

Oh also, yes, I have fogotten gloves on occasion. The most memorable and probably worst time was my first code, I was still riding as a non-EMT as I was waiting for my license to come back


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