# Just a Friendly Reminder



## Mountain Res-Q (May 18, 2009)

Summer is upon us and recreational activities abound.  This is just a friendly reminder for those that like to boat, fish, water ski, jet ski, or just play in and around the water.  Be careful!!!  Water can be fun, but dangerous.  I am speaking specifically about rivers and creeks.  They can deceptively fast, cold, and will kill the unsuspecting.  I bring this up because we (SAR) have just run our second Swiftwater Rescue call, and retrieved our second body.  Traditionally our “swiftwater season” starts around Memorial Weekend.  Yet our high sierra, snow fed rivers have already claimed two lives.  I won’t get into any details on this call, other than to say that inflatable pool chairs are not rafting devices.  In Swiftwater Rescue we call then K-Mart Coffins.  We have several newbies on the team whom I am trying to convince that moving water is far more dangerous than it looks, so please be careful.  On an EMS note, now is a good time for those who deal with water rescue/recovery calls to really brush up on hypo and hyperthermia as well as drownings and head injuries (collisions with rocks in water), especially as it relates to rescuers (Fire or SAR) who often put themselves in those same waters.  I know that I am far more concerned with rescuer safety than anything on our calls.  Hypothermia and hyperthermia can quickly affect mental status and judgment, thereby increasing the chance for rescuer injury.

Be SAFE.  Have a good summer.  Hopefully this next weekend (Memorial Day) won’t claim any more lives in my area or in yours.  If you are on a water rescue call this summer, be safe and keep you partner/team safe.


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## minneola24 (May 18, 2009)

Thankyou for the reminder, 

If my mom decides to send me to Yosemite summer camp then I will definitely be careful. I have been in their rivers before and let me tell you, they are VERY VERY cold. I have seen many idiots at Vernal Falls swimming across the river onto the cliffs. You do not at all want to fall off Vernal Falls (picture below). Mother Nature is not someone you want to mess with.


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 18, 2009)

minneola24 said:


> Thankyou for the reminder,
> 
> If my mom decides to send me to Yosemite summer camp then I will definitely be careful. I have been in their rivers before and let me tell you, they are VERY VERY cold. I have seen many idiots at Vernal Falls swimming across the river onto the cliffs. You do not at all want to fall off Vernal Falls (picture below). Mother Nature is not someone you want to mess with.



Our call today was at 5200 feet, class 2-3 water, 8-10 feet deep at its center, 40-42 degrees.  We are just north of yosemite and have pretty much the same types of water you picture.  Sad deal as most recoveries are (despite the humor and comments of on scene peronnel coping with their job).  I will say one good thing about this call.  Our team responded great and as fast as we possibly can... and, the various agencies involved worked great together, used ICS, and got the job done.  We have SAR, Deputies, the Coroner, the SO Investigator, Chaplin, the Forest Service LEOs, the Forest Service Fire Guys, and County Fire all on scene.  The Forest Service folks were first on scene, called for County Fire (Rescue) and SAR (Water Rescue) immediately.  Forest and Fire controlled the scene, made our job easier, LEOs stayed back when they were in the way and lent a hand to maje things easier when they could.  Our team (33% newbies) did their job 100%.  Call went out at 1150 (scene is 50 minutes from the SAR Cache) and we were eating Mexican Food by 1600.  Good call, but like always not the rescue we want.  Pre SAR, I never had a rael respect (as a fisherman) for the rivers I played in.  You help fish out a half dozen bodies a year from rushing rivers and you will.  4th year in SAR, 20-25 drownings (that I have been on), and only one rescue.  RESPECT THE H2O!!!


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## JPINFV (May 18, 2009)

Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?


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## VFFforpeople (May 18, 2009)

had a mom and son, and almost her second son drown, about 3weeks ago at lake shasta. They were playing at the water edge and it was a "false" ledge, gave out and took the 8year old down, the mom 43 went in, and couldnt recover, then the 6yro jumped in, and he came up swam to shore and was treated for water inhalation.


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## minneola24 (May 18, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



Well actually in Yosemite during the summer it can get very warm, sometimes in the 90's. Going in 40 degree water is painful. At camp what we did was run on the sand for 1-2 minutes to warm our bodies then jump in. It is not comfortable at all but after a while you get used to it. It is all fresh snow melt by the way.


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## medicdan (May 18, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



Wreck diving. Spearfish diving. Recreation+5/7mil wetsuit.


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## Sasha (May 18, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



Some people just aren't quite right.


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## mycrofft (May 18, 2009)

*Bad downstream too.*

The rivers downstream frmo the Sierra Navadas get the accelerated melt from these new hot temperatures and are running deceptively fast and tricky. We lose a few each year in the American and Sacramento Rivers because it looks like a nice beach, the kids go in or the drunks go tubing, and ...hasta la vista.


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 18, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



???????????????

Water Rescoveries in my area almost always have 3 factors involved:

1. Stupid Adult Males (Easily 75% of all recoveries, and when it is a child or female... a stupid adult male is usually nearby.)
2. Alcohol - DUH!  Why else would we go into 40-45 degree water?
3. And a lack of understadning when it comes to water (almost all of our victims are out of county... never locals.)

As always, the reporting sucks:

http://www.mymotherlode.com/news/local/news_detail.php?ID=267253

http://www.uniondemocrat.com/2009051796731/News/Local-News/Possible-drowning-reporter-in-Strawberry

STAY SAFE!


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## Shishkabob (May 18, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



Never white water rafted in an Alaskan river fed by a glacier, have you?

We were required to wear drysuits.    Buuuurrrrr.


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## minneola24 (May 18, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> ???????????????
> 
> Water Rescoveries in my area almost always have 3 factors involved:
> 
> ...




Actually, you are right about #1. In the Sierras last summer we were out on a river right after a water fall that was about 5-10 feet high. There were rocks everywhere. You could actually get right under the waterfall and it would feel really good. A little while later an *adult male* walked somehow on the river at the top and was looking down the waterfall as if he was going to jump, we told him that it was unsafe, he sounded a little woohoo (drunk). 

They never learn...


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 19, 2009)

Odd that you should mention my neighbor to the south, Yosemite, in a discusion about the dangers of swiftwater and waterfalls.

http://www.mymotherlode.com/news/local/news_detail.php?ID=269692

_"Yosemite National Park, CA -- Officials are seeking the public's help in locating 31 year old Katrin Lehmann. Lehmann was last seen when she fell into the Merced River below the Vernal Fall footbridge at approximately 3:30 Monday afternoon. Lehmann is six feet tall and weighs 150 pounds. She has light brown hair and brown eyes. Lehmann was last seen wearing a maroon rain jacket, dark blue pants, light green button shirt, lightweight hiking boots, a light blue backpack and a dragonfly necklace. Any information should be reported to Yosemite Communications Center at (209) 379-1992."_

The temperatures are rising, the snow is melting quick, there are periodic afternoon thunderstorms.  All of that means more water in the rivers.  The water is cold, fast, and you will not survive for more than a few minutes.

One good thing I can say about our call two days ago is that we found him qucik and extricated the remain within a few hours.  It brings closure to the family and the team.  Too many times we will have to spend days, weeks, or years searching and may never find remains.  That sucks for the family and for us.  In 2006 we ran a call where two guys went over a waterfall and into a hole that we refered to as the toilet bowl.  It was an amazing section of river.  We knew that there was no way this guy went past this 200 foot section of water, but portions (under and around the fall) were at least 30 feet deep, class 4, and partially subterranian.  We searched for two days on that section that week, and came back the next weekend for another go.  We had to rappel into the waterfall, using sandbags to try and divert the waterfall, used a tow truck to remove a log jam, and even (at one point) put a diver in the water.  NOTHING!  We searched that section of water off and on for a year.  Then 13 months latter we decided to organize a training for teh newbies in that area and do one last really good search.  The water was really slow and class 1-2 at this point, but still really deep.  We sent a diver in again and he was shocked... it was far deeper than we thought.  The boulders and debrie had created a false roof about 15-20 feet under the surface that was 6-8 feet thick.  He was trapped within that massive amount of branches and dirt (and the real bottom was 15 feet deeper).  His location meant that he was protected from the force of the water and from the river creatures.  He was very well preserved, just water-logged.  But it took 13 months, thousands of man hours, and mutual aid equipment from a variety of agencies.  But we found him.

Yosemite has a great Swiftwater Rescue Team, but even they will admit that unless this woman "chooses" to surface, all the serching in the world won't matter until the water flow decreases.  'Tis teh season for swiftwater.  My team will be on high alert next weekend, for sure (memorial weekend).


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## 8jimi8 (May 19, 2009)

hell even with a 5 or 7 mil wetsuit that would be WAY too cold! lol

i'd say ... DRYSUIT ftw!


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## mycrofft (May 20, 2009)

*When I was a lifeguard/dock hand at 7,000 feet...*

Even with still lake water, flatlanders were a danger to self and others, especially in two circumstances: one female with two or three males, and/or alcohol or drugs of ANY quantity or type. Imagine adding that to running cold water, hidden obstructions.
And as for kids...watch these so-called parents. They let little kids run free on these watercourses while the "adults" schmooze, nap, drink beer, smoke, and do anything but cover their kid.


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## rescuepoppy (May 20, 2009)

Our streams and rivers do not compare to other areas in depth intensity or temperature. But regardless one thing that both bothers and scares me is to have a vehicle accident in any moving water and see people show up in the hot zone wearing full turn-out gear. If you go down in that your gear is going to serve as a pretty effective anchor.


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 20, 2009)

rescuepoppy said:


> Our streams and rivers do not compare to other areas in depth intensity or temperature. But regardless one thing that both bothers and scares me is to have a vehicle accident in any moving water and see people show up in the hot zone wearing full turn-out gear. If you go down in that your gear is going to serve as a pretty effective anchor.



Hello, fellow SRT.  Couldn't agree more.  It was an camn creak out east in the late 70's that propted the "Father of Swiftwater Rescue" to develop the Swiftwater tactics taht are still the basis of what we do today.  In that incident, numerous firefighters died trying to rescue victims.  They wore turnouts and fire helmets and didn't understand the dynamics that make swiftwater or whitewater rescue so different than ocean or pool water rescue.  (A kudos from me if you can name that founder.)

For all you none water folks out there, if you sow up on teh scene of a swiftwater rescue in aa medicl/fire role, I will give you these 15 absolutes that are the guiding principles of swiftwater rescue (but please, I encourage all to take at least an awareness course in swiftwater):

1.  *Always wear a Personnel Flotation Device (PFD) if you are in the warm or hot zones*.
2.  Always deploy upstream spotters above the operation; ideally on both sides of the river.
3.  Your priorities are always your safety or self rescue, team safety or their rescue second, and the rescue of victim last.
4. Always have a backup plan for your current operation.
5. Always have multiple downstream backups ready to affect rescues.
6. KISS.  Always Keep it Simple.  The more complicated the operation is, the more that can go wrong.
7. Always use the correct equipment.  *Don’t use unapproved gear and always use them appropriately*.
8. Never put your feet down if swept away or while swimming.  You will be injured or killed if you do so.
9. Never count victims to help in their own rescue.  They will probably panic and put you at further risk.
10. Never tie a rope around a rescuer or victim.  There are methods for using ropes, but never in this fashion.
11. If a rope is to be used across a river for safety or crossings, never tension the line at a right angle to the current. 
12. When tensioning a rope across the river, never stand inside the bight, and always stand on the upstream side of the line.
13. Once the victim is contacted, never lose them.  This involves legal issues surrounding negligence and abandonment. 
14 *Given the choice between a Fire Helmet (with a water collecting brim) and no helmet, always go with no helmet*.
15. ALWAYS BE PROACTIVE.  Public Education and constant Team Preparation can help mitigate problems.


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## nomofica (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> Our call today was at 5200 feet, class 2-3 water, 8-10 feet deep at its center, 40-42 degrees.  We are just north of yosemite and have pretty much the same types of water you picture.  Sad deal as most recoveries are (despite the humor and comments of on scene peronnel coping with their job).  I will say one good thing about this call.  Our team responded great and as fast as we possibly can... and, the various agencies involved worked great together, used ICS, and got the job done.  We have SAR, Deputies, the Coroner, the SO Investigator, Chaplin, the Forest Service LEOs, the Forest Service Fire Guys, and County Fire all on scene.  The Forest Service folks were first on scene, called for County Fire (Rescue) and SAR (Water Rescue) immediately.  Forest and Fire controlled the scene, made our job easier, LEOs stayed back when they were in the way and lent a hand to maje things easier when they could.  Our team (33% newbies) did their job 100%.  Call went out at 1150 (scene is 50 minutes from the SAR Cache) and we were eating Mexican Food by 1600.  Good call, but like always not the rescue we want.  Pre SAR, I never had a rael respect (as a fisherman) for the rivers I played in.  You help fish out a half dozen bodies a year from rushing rivers and you will.  4th year in SAR, 20-25 drownings (that I have been on), and only one rescue.  RESPECT THE H2O!!!




I totally agree; we've had THREE bodies fished out of the North Saskatchewan River here in Edmonton since Friday... Three in under a week in an urban environment. Sad...


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## minneola24 (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> 8. Never put your feet down if swept away or while swimming.  You will be injured or killed if you do so.



I learned this from an instructor while going white water rafting in or around the Sierras.

I actually fell off in a big rapid but I put my feet up, it is so you don't hit the rocks and you break your legs right?


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 20, 2009)

minneola24 said:


> I learned this from an instructor while going white water rafting in or around the Sierras.
> 
> I actually fell off in a big rapid but I put my feet up, it is so you don't hit the rocks and you break your legs right?



If you put your feet down it is with the intention to stop yourself.  It will work.  You feet may become caught up by rocks or other subsurface debris and your feet will stop... but your torso is another story.  You will probably casue significant damage to your legs (including breaking) but it won't matter, becsue the force of the water will likely push your torso under water while your feet anchor you... thereby drowning you.  Feet up, dointed downstream and tehn we use ferry angles to swim or simply float our way out.  if you get a chance to ever do Swiftwater Rescue Classes I highly recommend them for nothing more than the fun times.


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## minneola24 (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> If you put your feet down it is with the intention to stop yourself.  It will work.  You feet may become caught up by rocks or other subsurface debris and your feet will stop... but your torso is another story.  You will probably casue significant damage to your legs (including breaking) but it won't matter, becsue the force of the water will likely push your torso under water while your feet anchor you... thereby drowning you.  Feet up, dointed downstream and tehn we use ferry angles to swim or simply float our way out.  if you get a chance to ever do Swiftwater Rescue Classes I highly recommend them for nothing more than the fun times.



Yeah that would probably be a good idea to take those classes. Although the only rivers we have here in San Diego are either completely dry or dripping water after it rains. But we definently have high angle rescue in the summer when alot of people are at the beach.

Notice the high cliffs at the beach, they have had some rescues on the cliffs before. Our city has a 100ft ladder truck even thoe the tallest building in the city is 3 stories. One of the guys told me if they need to they can go above on the top of the cliffs, extend the ladder outward over the cliff and then repell someone down, that to me is very smart.

Do you guys get any high angle rescues in the Sierras? I would assume you guys do because of all the mountains.


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 20, 2009)

High angle, hell ya.  Remember we are just norht of yosemite.  Many of teh same geologic features that dot the valley are similar to what we have... only a little less exptreme.

As far as swiftwater goes... we are not just talking river... we are also talking canals, rivers, aquaducts, and flood planes

From the new SAR team Manual I am writing:

_“Swiftwater” is broadly defined as “any natural or artificial watercourse that is at least 1 foot deep and flowing down any gradient at speeds in excess of 3mph”, which isn’t very deep or fast.  This includes all rivers, creeks, canals, and aqueducts.  This term has also recently expanded to encompassed flood conditions as many of the same dynamics and hazards that exist on swiftwater calls exist in flood planes._


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## minneola24 (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> High angle, hell ya.  Remember we are just norht of yosemite.  Many of teh same geologic features that dot the valley are similar to what we have... only a little less exptreme.
> 
> As far as swiftwater goes... we are not just talking river... we are also talking canals, rivers, aquaducts, and flood planes
> 
> ...



Oh okay, cool. Is this SAR Manual I hear you talking about going to be published and released to the public? I would like to have a look at it.

Yeah yosemite's geological features are incredible, a bunch of tourists as well. I don't like how its become a place where everyone goes with cameras around their necks saying oooohhhh ahhhh when really if you go outside Yosemite it is just as beautiful. Whenever I go to Yosemite it is very crowded, reminds me more like Disneyland then a forest.


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 20, 2009)

No, the new SAR Manual, if i ever get to finish it will be for new team members to orient themselves to what we do.  It will replace an older one that needs to be burned.  It will include orienteation to sar, navigation, search tacitics and theory, swiftwater orientation, a comprehensive rope rescue section, a basic medical orientation, atv orientation, nordic survival skills, helo operations, canine orientation, horse orientation, and the like.

A far as Yosemite goes, yes it is a tourist trap.  The Stanislaus national Forest and the Emigrant Wilderness are in my backyard and back up to the park and are much better for scenery and seclusion.


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## minneola24 (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> No, the new SAR Manual, if i ever get to finish it will be for new team members to orient themselves to what we do.  It will replace an older one that needs to be burned.  It will include orienteation to sar, navigation, search tacitics and theory, swiftwater orientation, a comprehensive rope rescue section, a basic medical orientation, atv orientation, nordic survival skills, helo operations, canine orientation, horse orientation, and the like.
> 
> A far as Yosemite goes, yes it is a tourist trap.  The Stanislaus national Forest and the Emigrant Wilderness are in my backyard and back up to the park and are much better for scenery and seclusion.



Oh okay, good luck on the book!

I have a question about water rescue.

1. When you guys get calls, how do you get them? Usually in the mountains phone reception doesn't work.

2. Do people usually survive the rough waters? I was thinking if it takes about an hour to get to them how do they survive that?

3. Have you ever used a helicopter for water rescue?

Sorry for all the questions but the sierras have always fascinated me. ^_^


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## Mountain Res-Q (May 20, 2009)

minneola24 said:


> Oh okay, good luck on the book!
> 
> I have a question about water rescue.
> 
> ...



1.  We are dispatched via 1. alpha numeric pagers through the sheriffs office and 2. via text message that is sent out to every phone by computers in dispatch.  How disptch gets notified is anyones guess.  Sometimes they drive to the closest ranger station or fire station... and sometimes they just get lucky.

2. No.  We do more recoveries than rescues in the higher elevations.  By the time we get dispatched they are usually already dead, but we still respond with all haste.  We also get flash floodin at teh lower elevations, to which we may actually rescue some kid or idiot in a car that tried to ford a river.

3.  We can.  But heres a phrase you should know:  Reach, throw, row, go, helo.  Meaning that we do not enter teh water (go) when we can stay safe and simply reach for the victim, or throw a rope bag, or row a boat.  Helo is at the end of that.  Helo rescues are dangerous and should only be used when all else fails.  And we will not risk so many lives for a simple body recovery... even if taht means returning latter in the year to recover remains.  but as I said before, the founder of modern swiftwater rescue was also a founding member of our team.  Our team has been generally viewed as experts in swiftwater and technical rescue... some of our team members helped construct state and federal disaster response plans.


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## minneola24 (May 20, 2009)

Mountain Res-Q said:


> 1.  We are dispatched via 1. alpha numeric pagers through the sheriffs office and 2. via text message that is sent out to every phone by computers in dispatch.  How disptch gets notified is anyones guess.  Sometimes they drive to the closest ranger station or fire station... and sometimes they just get lucky.
> 
> 2. No.  We do more recoveries than rescues in the higher elevations.  By the time we get dispatched they are usually already dead, but we still respond with all haste.  We also get flash floodin at teh lower elevations, to which we may actually rescue some kid or idiot in a car that tried to ford a river.
> 
> 3.  We can.  But heres a phrase you should know:  Reach, throw, row, go, helo.  Meaning that we do not enter teh water (go) when we can stay safe and simply reach for the victim, or throw a rope bag, or row a boat.  Helo is at the end of that.  Helo rescues are dangerous and should only be used when all else fails.  And we will not risk so many lives for a simple body recovery... even if taht means returning latter in the year to recover remains.  but as I said before, the founder of modern swiftwater rescue was also a founding member of our team.  Our team has been generally viewed as experts in swiftwater and technical rescue... some of our team members helped construct state and federal disaster response plans.



Thanks for the response, appreciate it.


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## Seaglass (May 26, 2009)

JPINFV said:


> Why the hell would anyone want to be anywhere near 43 degree water to begin with?



I used to go whitewater kayaking in the winter, as long as there wasn't ice. It really isn't that cold, since you're moving so much and wearing a lot of gear. (Unless something bad happens, of course.) I'd still be going if I had a river nearby. 

My club was headed by a river guide who insisted we know a good deal about rope rescue and water hazards before he turned us loose. We did have some close calls, which hammered home just how valuable that training was. When I get back to an area with whitewater, I intend to take some official swiftwater rescue classes. In some of the prettier areas where I used to paddle, it wasn't that uncommon to hear of kayakers and rafters pulling drunk idiots with cameras out of the rapids.


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