# Harassment in EMS



## Sasha (Nov 5, 2011)

Have you ever really felt harassed by your partner or your coworkers? Sexually, religiously, racially, etc? 

Especially women, did you feel hesitant to report it because you didn't want to seem like a whiner?
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## Chimpie (Nov 5, 2011)

Especially women?  I think guys would have a harder time reporting it for that same reason.


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## Sasha (Nov 5, 2011)

Really? I think it is more women, the whole "this is a man's profession and I don't wanna seem like I can't cut it"

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## medicsb (Nov 5, 2011)

I have never personally experienced any form harassment.  

I do know of a couple medics and one EMT/FF who were fired because of sexual harassment in separate incidents.  I know what they did and I know one of them was trying to make a joke, but it was inappropriate considering the circumstances.  Had he said what he said to someone he knew better, it might not have been an issue.  

I know of one EMT who was fired for racial harassment.

I do not doubt for a second that all forms of harassment are under-reported in EMS and elsewhere.


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## JPINFV (Nov 5, 2011)

I was confronted once by a coworker who I worked with once where I ended up filing an incident report on him (note: don't answer a phone and hold a conversation in a patient's room in front of the patient and family, don't be exceedingly rude to SNF staff, don't give an impression that you want to go to X hospital (especially when we're just posting in the area) because they have free food, and don't sit at the rear end of the bench seat and send text messages with a patient on board. Especially don't do all of those in THE SAME SHIFT). I shrugged that one off. Words being words.


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## Epi-do (Nov 5, 2011)

I've only ever had one issue, but reported it right away due to a history of similar behavior towards another employee.  After investigating it further, he was eventually terminated.


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## mycrofft (Nov 5, 2011)

*I was told I would not graduate nursing collegiate by a dean.*

She said "Most male students don't", and she was sort of right, four out of 26 made it through four years after being microscopically managed, harassed, and told to our faces men should not be in the profession. 
As for being the recipient of unwanted passes, no.


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## MissK (Nov 6, 2011)

I was verbally and sexually harrassed by my first partner who was also the manager. I was hesitant at first to make a fuss about it because I was brand new and just a driver with no experience, and I knew it'd be hard to get a job elsewhere. I tried talking to this partner a few times about the things he said and did and told him to stop. He continued doing such things, so I went over his head to the district supervisor and filed a complaint. I switched stations and partners. That same partner a few months later did the same things to another new female partner. For some reason, he is still working here, but he is not allowed to have anymore female partners.


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## mpc83 (Nov 7, 2011)

i get treated differently for what i think is a weird reason... I'm married (to a guy) and of the 12 women i work with i'm only one of two that aren't lesbians... I don't judge anyone for who they want to be or date but i get judged for being married and feminine (even though im not a princess or even really girly) how do you file a complaint for that?


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## FourLoko (Nov 7, 2011)

I'd like to harass my current female partner but it's because she's slow and annoying.

Good thing I'm a nice guy and can tolerate working with just about anyone.


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## WickedGood (Nov 7, 2011)

mpc83 said:


> i get treated differently for what i think is a weird reason... I'm married (to a guy) and of the 12 women i work with i'm only one of two that aren't lesbians... I don't judge anyone for who they want to be or date but i get judged for being married and feminine (even though im not a princess or even really girly) how do you file a complaint for that?



You don't.  Just laugh and get over it.


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## McGoo (Nov 7, 2011)

We have refresher training every year, part o which is anti harassment training. At the end of a very dreary session, one of the guys asked the lecturer "do we mean we aren't allowed to talk in the van then?"
Girl: "uh, what do you mean?"
Paramedic: "well, we can't talk about sex, drugs, cute women, racial jokes, or complain about other people, so what are we supposed to talk about?"
Girl: (shocked silence)


I haven't been harassed, but I have been bullied at work by someone who was supposed to be teaching me. I reported it, as did someone else, I believe he doesn't get fresh students anymore.


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## JPINFV (Nov 7, 2011)

McGoo said:


> We have refresher training every year, part o which is anti harassment training. At the end of a very dreary session, one of the guys asked the lecturer "do we mean we aren't allowed to talk in the van then?"
> Girl: "uh, what do you mean?"
> Paramedic: "well, we can't talk about sex, drugs, cute women, racial jokes, or complain about other people, so what are we supposed to talk about?"
> Girl: (shocked silence)


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWZO_zehR9w[/youtube]

/Yes, I have a video for everything...


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## FourLoko (Nov 7, 2011)

good video lol


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## johnrsemt (Nov 8, 2011)

We had a gentleman that worked for us for about 3 days.
  He went out with a female partner driving on his first released day  and they were out about 10 minutes when she called on radio and said that they were coming back, she needed a new partner and he needed an ambulance.

  He put his hand down her blouse and she broke his arm.   Surprising what he said when he was given Morphine for the pain.  Admitted it all.

  Needless to say  he was fired.


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## Seaglass (Nov 8, 2011)

In EMS, I haven't gotten much of it. It's pretty constant in fire--almost every new guy assumes I'll be weak--but that's another story. 

I have found that I need to walk a fine line between "looking cute" (which means you won't be taken seriously, at best) and "trying to be one of the guys" (same result). Some of the men I work with are also immature enough so that they think any pretty girl who speaks to them must be interested, or that girls can't do the job. As a result, I try to keep myself from looking feminine at work. I don't pay much attention to my hair, never wear makeup, and buy my uniforms a size too big. 

I've avoided the worst of it, but I've seen it get ugly. One boss managed to make 3/4s of the female employees quit within his first year of being promoted. In a typical case, he assigned a really attractive rookie to a series of guys who'd spend the shift making passes at her, in order to see if she was "tough enough." After a few months, she quit. The boss seemed to think it proved that pretty women really are just weak and whiny. I won't be surprised if that place gets sued someday...



McGoo said:


> We have refresher training every year, part o which is anti harassment training. At the end of a very dreary session, one of the guys asked the lecturer "do we mean we aren't allowed to talk in the van then?"
> Girl: "uh, what do you mean?"
> Paramedic: "well, we can't talk about sex, drugs, cute women, racial jokes, or complain about other people, so what are we supposed to talk about?"
> Girl: (shocked silence)



Totally true for some of my crews. They're doing it because they're comfortable with me, not because they're trying to intimidate me. I throw it right back at them, and a good time is had by all.


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## firecoins (Nov 9, 2011)

johnrsemt said:


> We had a gentleman that worked for us for about 3 days.
> He went out with a female partner driving on his first released day  and they were out about 10 minutes when she called on radio and said that they were coming back, she needed a new partner and he needed an ambulance.
> 
> He put his hand down her blouse and she broke his arm.   Surprising what he said when he was given Morphine for the pain.  Admitted it all.
> ...



wow! what an idiot!


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## FourLoko (Nov 9, 2011)

Oh, and the same female partner spent 12 minutes last night (while i'm sitting there waiting to clear a call) talking on the phone to her baby daddy about who knows what drama.

That happens again I'm not sure what I'll do.


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## abckidsmom (Nov 9, 2011)

FourLoko said:


> Oh, and the same female partner spent 12 minutes last night (while i'm sitting there waiting to clear a call) talking on the phone to her baby daddy about who knows what drama.
> 
> That happens again I'm not sure what I'll do.



Just interrupt her, and say that you're clearing.


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## FourLoko (Nov 9, 2011)

abckidsmom said:


> Just interrupt her, and say that you're clearing.



She was outside of the rig in the parking lot. I started it up to give her the hint but it still took her a while to catch on.

Sorry for derailing the thread.


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## Sasha (Nov 9, 2011)

FourLoko said:


> She was outside of the rig in the parking lot. I started it up to give her the hint but it still took her a while to catch on.
> 
> Sorry for derailing the thread.



Turn on the siren.

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## JPINFV (Nov 9, 2011)

You need her in the ambulance to pick up the radio and say, "Unit 75, clear"


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## FourLoko (Nov 9, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> You need her in the ambulance to pick up the radio and say, "Unit 75, clear"



clearly not but it's either let the current call run long or take longer to be on scene for the next one

we usually go back to back to back


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## JPINFV (Nov 9, 2011)

FourLoko said:


> clearly not but it's either let the current call run long or take longer to be on scene for the next one
> 
> we usually go back to back to back




Unit 75 clear.

Unit 75's pager(s) buzz with ending information.

Unit 75's pager(s) buzz with new call information. 

"Hey, partner, get off the phone, we've got a call."


Something else to consider. How much of your calls are scheduled and you're dispatched with enough time to get on scene before pickup time. There's a difference between calls that need to be run now (be it emergency calls, scheduled calls that are late, or hospital discharges where often the patient is ready when the service is called) and calls where pickup is 20 minutes from now and the facility is 15 minutes down the road.


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## DrParasite (Nov 9, 2011)

Seaglass said:


> In EMS, I haven't gotten much of it. It's pretty constant in fire--almost every new guy assumes I'll be weak--but that's another story.


not for nothing, but for every guy that assumes the girl is weak, there are 3 girls who will have the guy do all the heavy work for them, and 2 girls who are too weak to do the heavy lifting.  It's not right, but it happens.


Seaglass said:


> I have found that I need to walk a fine line between "looking cute" (which means you won't be taken seriously, at best) and "trying to be one of the guys" (same result). Some of the men I work with are also immature enough so that they think any pretty girl who speaks to them must be interested, or that girls can't do the job. As a result, I try to keep myself from looking feminine at work. I don't pay much attention to my hair, never wear makeup, and buy my uniforms a size too big.


Nothing wrong with looking cute.  Nothing wrong with wearing makeup, doing your hair, wearing lipstick, etc.  I knew a girl on my FD who used to use the reflective metal of the tower ladder  as a mirror to apply her lipstick, was into hello kitty, and said "I'm a pretty firefighter!!!!"  whatever, to each her own.  but when push came to shove, she would get down and dirty, pack hose, and do the dirty work just like every other guy.

And if you are buying clothes to big, and not "looking pretty" to downplay your attractiveness, than you are doing yourself a disservice.  Nothing wrong with wearing clothes that fit properly or doing your hair.  if guys don't accept you, but you do still do the job, than that's their problem


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## DrParasite (Nov 9, 2011)

Seaglass said:


> I've avoided the worst of it, but I've seen it get ugly. One boss managed to make 3/4s of the female employees quit within his first year of being promoted. In a typical case, he assigned a really attractive rookie to a series of guys who'd spend the shift making passes at her, in order to see if she was "tough enough." After a few months, she quit. The boss seemed to think it proved that pretty women really are just weak and whiny. I won't be surprised if that place gets sued someday...


than the boss should have been fired, as well as all the guys who were making passes at the girl.  and the women should have sued.  That type of behavior (from the bosses and the staff) should not be tolerated.


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## DrParasite (Nov 9, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Have you ever really felt harassed by your partner or your coworkers? Sexually, religiously, racially, etc?
> 
> Especially women, did you feel hesitant to report it because you didn't want to seem like a whiner?
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


Lets see......

1) when I was offered a full time position at my job, one of the field crews gave me a welcome to the shift present.... a box of matza

2) my former partner, a Puerto Rican with a daughter out of wedlock, was constantly called a Mexican... by me.... and when he really pissed me off, he was called an Ecuadorean.....

3) I told a field crew staffed with a person from Boston that she wasn't allowed to talk on the radio anymore, because I couldn't understand a word she said

4) I told a cop once, if he was gonna feel me up, he would need to buy me drinks first

oh, and the 3 people involved in #1 and #2 are going to be in my wedding, and you don't want to know what #2 called me.

There are other things, but those are the 4 things that come to mind.  and I have no doubt if I had felt offended and said something, they would have stopped and apologized

Just so we are clear, I don't think harassment should be permitted at all.  And those black and white cases (hand down the blouse, etc) are pretty clear.  But there can be a lot of grey area... a lot.... and it is the responsibility of the person being harassed to SAY SOMETHING.  

The NCIS clip is a great example.  is a hug unacceptable?  is a slap to the back of the head unacceptable?  is licking the back of a coworker's ear unacceptable?  well, it depends on the person, and if the person doesn't say anything, maybe the offender doesn't know that the victim is feeling harassed?

If you feel harassed, or uncomfortable, than SAY SOMETHING to the harasser.   If the person doesn't stop, than take things further.  Often a culture clash or rather a new culture can be viewed as harassment (such as the new female probie has to always clean the bathrooms), when in reality, if something is said, the whole situation can be explained or rectified without it getting blown out of proportion.


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## JPINFV (Nov 9, 2011)

DrParasite said:


> 2) my former partner, a Puerto Rican with a daughter out of wedlock, was constantly called a Mexican... by me.... and when he really pissed me off, he was called an Ecuadorean.....


[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsorXfwfA9g[/YOUTUBE]


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## 46Young (Nov 9, 2011)

What you have to watch out for is the person that's having a bad day, and you say something inappropriate to them at the wrong time. What ususally is tolerated or received well suddenly becomes offensive and is reported. 

Anyone can flip the script on you at any time. It doesn't matter if they've enabled your inappropriate behavior for months or years; it only takes one reported incident to get you written up or worse. For all you know, they could be playing it cool while they're writing it all down for a future payday in court. We've had two recent cases where I work. A year or more of documented incidents from people who no one though had a problem with the behavior of others.

I had a former female shift member that would occasionally fellate a banana, and voice sexual double entendres for attention. I'm not going anywhere near that.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Have you ever really felt harassed by your partner or your coworkers? Sexually, religiously, racially, etc?
> 
> Especially women, did you feel hesitant to report it because you didn't want to seem like a whiner?
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



There are women in our service who have reported such things, however I think it becomes abit difficult. We in EMS and Fire joke around so much sometimes about stuff that people can accidently get carried away and mistakenly offend someone. Now, if you touch someone or make such bold advances as "wanna join the code 3 club" then peace, your fired. But crude humor is part of our nature. I never think someone should feel uncomfortable or threatened when they come to work.

Personally, I am not a very easy person to offend or harass. I like to joke around, I like to laugh and I know nobody is being malicous it is all ment as a joke. Then again, I have never had anyone trying to put their hand down my blouse and had to break that arm either.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

46Young said:


> I had a former female shift member that would occasionally fellate a banana, and voice sexual double entendres for attention. I'm not going anywhere near that.





I know this person


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## clibb (Nov 10, 2011)

It's a fine line and the line is different with everyone. It is nearly impossible to sexually harass me as a guy, but I do know other guys who it would be very easy to do. 
The other question is; what if you're dating the person that is on the same crew as you? How do you act around other people and how do other people view you as?
^^ Something me and my ex had a hard time with. Now, it's pretty simple for me to stay out of it. I just stay away from her and problem is solved, haha.


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## Sasha (Nov 10, 2011)

clibb said:


> It's a fine line and the line is different with everyone. It is nearly impossible to sexually harass me as a guy, but I do know other guys who it would be very easy to do.
> The other question is; what if you're dating the person that is on the same crew as you? How do you act around other people and how do other people view you as?
> ^^ Something me and my ex had a hard time with. Now, it's pretty simple for me to stay out of it. I just stay away from her and problem is solved, haha.



Dude everyone here is dating everyone. We have three engaged crews right now! 

One crew was so bad students started to complain that it was really uncomfortable because they would hang on each other and get the whole "oh baby I love you" thing.

I don't support couples working together on a truck. Why would they want to? Don't you need time away from your significant other? Dang.

Too each their own.

This thread came along because I had trouble reporting harassment due to my religious beliefs because I didn't want to be a whiner or appear too sensitive.

He sang religious songs in the truck, piped gospel into the patient compartment, told me he would pray for me, told me I wasn't happy because I wasn't a Christian and that I feel god with me but ignore it.

Finally snapped last week and reported it when he started off the shift as "hey still atheist?" And that was the least offensive thing out of his mouth for the little bit of time we worked together after that.

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## sir.shocksalot (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Finally snapped last week and reported it when he started off the shift as "hey still atheist?" And that was the least offensive thing out of his mouth for the little bit of time we worked together after that.



Absolutely report that. That stuff drives me nuts. I really don't have a problem with really religious people, however they need to keep their beliefs off the ambulance and out of my face. I had a partner once who would do the same thing and try and talk about the bible all shift, it made me extremely uncomfortable. If you want to read your bible, fine, just do it quietly in the corner and don't talk to me about it.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

I am religous, I go to Church every sunday that I am not at work. But do I like it when another religion is constantly bombarding me and trying to change me? No, so I would never do that to someone else.


As far as people working together who are in a relationship, we certainly have a policy for that. Infact there is a legal name for it that I cannot remember. Here you cannot work in the same region if you are in a relationship. You certainly cannot work on the same ambulance, and if you are a supervisor you cannot be a supervisor on that shift because you cannot supervise/disipline those you are in a relationship with.


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## EMT424 (Nov 10, 2011)

Certain topics don't come to work. Period.

In my dept is is that I often get paired with females who don't think that they should have to help lift patients. I am 6'3" and 250 but when having to put a 400 pounder and the 150 pound power cot into the bus, I would love a little team work. 

Also our female staff feel that any repairs/PMCS on the rig is my job by virtue of being male. We have one who always *****es about windshield washer fluid and will make no effort to put it in herself. 

So I think that their is BS that cuts both ways.


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## Aidey (Nov 10, 2011)

Not to totally sound like a typical female, but I leave all the vehicle maintenance stuff up to the guys I share the amb with. I know NOTHING about cars. I could manage windshield washer fluid and changing the headlights, but that is about it. I'm a little too short to do the oil because of where the dip stick is. I do however make sure to let someone know if I think there is something up. 

I don't really see that as sexism, so much as playing the strengths of different people.


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## JPINFV (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> I don't support couples working together on a truck. Why would they want to? Don't you need time away from your significant other? Dang.



There was a married couple that worked at my first EMT job and that was exactly the reason why they didn't want to work with each other. 



> This thread came along because I had trouble reporting harassment due to my religious beliefs because I didn't want to be a whiner or appear too sensitive.
> 
> He sang religious songs in the truck, piped gospel into the patient compartment, told me he would pray for me, told me I wasn't happy because I wasn't a Christian and that I feel god with me but ignore it.
> 
> ...



You should have used the response I gave you for him...


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## Sasha (Nov 10, 2011)

Aidey said:


> Not to totally sound like a typical female, but I leave all the vehicle maintenance stuff up to the guys I share the amb with. I know NOTHING about cars. I could manage windshield washer fluid and changing the headlights, but that is about it. I'm a little too short to do the oil because of where the dip stick is. I do however make sure to let someone know if I think there is something up.
> 
> I don't really see that as sexism, so much as playing the strengths of different people.



I just don't want to get that car crap on my hands or under my finger nails. 

But as I take all the patients I see it as things to do with patient care at mine. Things to do with driving are theirs. I will help wash the truck at the end but I don't think I should have to.

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## JPINFV (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> But as I take all the patients I see it as things to do with patient care at mine. Things to do with driving are theirs. I will help wash the truck at the end but I don't think I should have to.




So do you expect your driver to help carry bags or reset the gurney at the end of a call or decon the patient compartment after a patient requiring isolation precautions?


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

"I don't really see that as sexism, so much as playing the strengths of different people"

That might be how you see it, but to others it is seen as not pulling your weight.

Just because a guy is a guy does not make him a mechanic and a power lifter all in one. Females and males who work the same job should expect to do the same things, lift the equipment and stretcher, change the oil etc...


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## JPINFV (Nov 10, 2011)

Fish said:


> change the oil etc...



That's the mechanic's job. I'll check and add oil, but I don't even change the oil in my own car.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> I just don't want to get that car crap on my hands or under my finger nails.
> 
> But as I take all the patients I see it as things to do with patient care at mine. Things to do with driving are theirs. I will help wash the truck at the end but I don't think I should have to.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



I totally disagree, if your EMT partner is washing the truck you should feel obligated to help them. That is both of yours Ambulance and you should both participate in keeping it cleaned and maintained. Just like you both contribute to the Patient care.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> That's the mechanic's job. I'll check and add oil, but I don't even change the oil in my own car.



I agree, we do not change oil here. But you must understand some system have there crews change the oil. Us, every 5k miles we take it to our Mechanics for the oilchange.

As for you not even changing it in your own car, thats up to you. I do it to save time and money


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## JPINFV (Nov 10, 2011)

I might try if it was reasonable, but my car is so low that I'd have to jack it up just to get under it (2003 Sebring). Besides, half the time I get my oil change recently, I'm having other maintenance issues being taken care of as well.


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## Fish (Nov 10, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> I might try if it was reasonable, but my car is so low that I'd have to jack it up just to get under it (2003 Sebring). Besides, half the time I get my oil change recently, I'm having other maintenance issues being taken care of as well.



I have Truck, SUV and Classic. All easily accessibly for me, I like to buy the exspensive synthetic. Mechanics charge you and arm plus 2 legs for that stuff.


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## atropine (Nov 10, 2011)

EMT424 said:


> Certain topics don't come to work. Period.
> 
> In my dept is is that I often get paired with females who don't think that they should have to help lift patients. I am 6'3" and 250 but when having to put a 400 pounder and the 150 pound power cot into the bus, I would love a little team work.
> 
> ...



Typical, when I used to work for AMR many years ago in the LA County area, the company had a rule that two females could not work together, because LA Co.FD complained that they could not handle the gurney, I don't know if it's like that anymore with Care taking over most of the county.


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## Sasha (Nov 10, 2011)

Fish said:


> "I don't really see that as sexism, so much as playing the strengths of different people"
> 
> That might be how you see it, but to others it is seen as not pulling your weight.
> 
> Just because a guy is a guy does not make him a mechanic and a power lifter all in one. Females and males who work the same job should expect to do the same things, lift the equipment and stretcher, change the oil etc...



I have reports to get checked off and equipment to restock or sign back in and other end of shift crap. So... I don't think I should have to wash the truck. Once its washed they're free to go, I still have more crap to do. If we both tackle our respective responsibilitys then we both can be done at the same time.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


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## EMSrush (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> I just don't want to get that car crap on my hands or under my finger nails.
> 
> But as I take all the patients I see it as things to do with patient care at mine. Things to do with driving are theirs. I will help wash the truck at the end but I don't think I should have to.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



So wear gloves... there are usually plenty in the rig. A great manicure is not a reason to not pull your weight at work.


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## Aidey (Nov 10, 2011)

I'm with Sasha, just because you don't split the work exactly down the middle does not mean someone isn't pulling their weight. I work for a busy 911 system that also is responsible for almost all of the IFTs. I am a medic and my partner is a basic. I take all of the calls, IFT or not. 

My partner is...a fairly bad EMT. His contribution to patient care is minimal. I have to double check most of the work he does independently, like stocking. It is in no way unfair that he washes the ambulance and makes the gurney by himself. I help with the ambulance sometimes, when we've had a slow night and I don't have paperwork or anything to do.


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## Sasha (Nov 10, 2011)

EMSrush said:


> So wear gloves... there are usually plenty in the rig. A great manicure is not a reason to not pull your weight at work.



Who said I don't pull my weight? I don't check fluids... I pull my weight by checking, stocking, and cleaning the entire rest of the truck.

I do this for two reasons. I don't want to depend on someone to know that all my crap is there. I've been bitten by "Oh no I already checked the o2, we are good."

I feel that since I do all the calls, inside the ambulance is my domain. I even wipe down the steering wheel, and all that other stuff as a courtesy when I'm saniwiping everything.

And if I needed further justification: the fluids should be checked on a cold truck. I am a non driver. That means I can't pull the truck from the field to around the back where we check it out. That is something my partner HAS to do. So while he's out there, s/he can check the fluids before starting the truck. I COULD walk out there, check them, and walk back, get fluids, then walk back and fill the fluids, but that's where it comes back to I don't like the car stuff under my nails. And that seems silly.

It is not slacking, it's dividing the labor up.


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## DrParasite (Nov 10, 2011)

Sasha said:


> This thread came along because I had trouble reporting harassment due to my religious beliefs because I didn't want to be a whiner or appear too sensitive.
> 
> He sang religious songs in the truck, piped gospel into the patient compartment, told me he would pray for me, told me I wasn't happy because I wasn't a Christian and that I feel god with me but ignore it.
> 
> Finally snapped last week and reported it when he started off the shift as "hey still atheist?" And that was the least offensive thing out of his mouth for the little bit of time we worked together after that.


I have had to deal with christmas music from halloween to new years.  so I hear your pain when it comes to religious songs in the truck.   Either way, what your partner is doing is wrong, report it, it shouldn't be tolerated.    You aren't whining or being overly sensitive, it's your truck too, and his actions are obviously making you uncomfortable.





Aidey said:


> Not to totally sound like a typical female, but I leave all the vehicle maintenance stuff up to the guys I share the amb with. I know NOTHING about cars. I could manage windshield washer fluid and changing the headlights, but that is about it. I'm a little too short to do the oil because of where the dip stick is. I do however make sure to let someone know if I think there is something up.
> 
> I don't really see that as sexism, so much as playing the strengths of different people.


omg, how sexist are you?  you are stereotyping guys.  I'll have you know, I am a male.  I know nothing about cars.  Wouldn't know how to manage windshield washer fluid unless you showed me, and I had to call a mechanic to show me how to change a headlight.  and the only reason I know about checking the oil was someone showed me (and even then I barely do it).

Just because someone has a penis, doesn't automaticly make them an expert in auto repair.  And thinking that it does is extremely sexist.





Sasha said:


> I just don't want to get that car crap on my hands or under my finger nails.
> 
> But as I take all the patients I see it as things to do with patient care at mine. Things to do with driving are theirs. I will help wash the truck at the end but I don't think I should have to.


and maybe the guy doesn't want crap on his hands or under his nails?  If you are on the crew, you should be washing the truck with your partner.  it's your truck too.



Aidey said:


> My partner is...a fairly bad EMT. His contribution to patient care is minimal. I have to double check most of the work he does independently, like stocking. It is in no way unfair that he washes the ambulance and makes the gurney by himself. I help with the ambulance sometimes, when we've had a slow night and I don't have paperwork or anything to do.


if your partner is a fairly bad EMT, than he should be fired and replaced with a better EMT.  If you can't trust your partner, than he or she isn't a partner, he is just your driver.  a partner is someone you work with; based on what you just said, you don't have a partner, just a grunt who doesn't even need to be an EMT, just a clean DL and maybe a valid CPR card.



Sasha said:


> Who said I don't pull my weight? I don't check fluids... I pull my weight by checking, stocking, and cleaning the entire rest of the truck.


and your partner doesn't check the truck, restock, or clean any of the inside with you?  damn,I feel bad for you.





Sasha said:


> I do this for two reasons. I don't want to depend on someone to know that all my crap is there. I've been bitten by "Oh no I already checked the o2, we are good."


than your partner should be smacked, reprimanded, and fired.  smacked for making you look like an idiot in front of the patient, reprimanded for laying about the status of patient equipment, and fired for lying on the ambulance check sheet.


Sasha said:


> I feel that since I do all the calls, inside the ambulance is my domain. I even wipe down the steering wheel, and all that other stuff as a courtesy when I'm saniwiping everything.


that is your opinion, and as long as your partner agrees, that's fine.  if you were my partner, than we would definitely not be in agreement here.


Sasha said:


> And if I needed further justification: the fluids should be checked on a cold truck. I am a non driver. That means I can't pull the truck from the field to around the back where we check it out. That is something my partner HAS to do. So while he's out there, s/he can check the fluids before starting the truck. I COULD walk out there, check them, and walk back, get fluids, then walk back and fill the fluids, but that's where it comes back to I don't like the car stuff under my nails. And that seems silly.
> 
> It is not slacking, it's dividing the labor up.


Maybe you should just become a driver, and that way you could do the job?  this isn't a volunteer thing where you can choose what you want to do, when you work in EMS, you should be able to both drive and treat (the level of training not withstanding).  and I don't like crap under my nails either.

Maybe it's different in the IFT world vs the 911 world, but in every 911 system I am familiar with, the duties are shared.  each employee is expected to do both sides of the job (drive and treat).  But I still think if two people are PARTNERS, than the work should be handled equally, regardless of the gender of the crew members.


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## Handsome Robb (Nov 10, 2011)

All this talk of checking the fluids, O2, supplies, yada yada is making me feel extremely spoiled to have a FT VST department and a FT Mechanic department onsite at our garage that stock. They maintain, stock and wash our units. We clean the inside though, not fair for them to clean up our mess. I have heard of VSTs and mechanics getting offended by a Medic/EMT popping the hood to check fluids.

Our bags are our responsibility and we do a visual check through the cabinet windows for supplies but everything is shrink wrapped and cabinets are ziptied shut and the VSTs get angry if we open every last compartment to check it. Broken zip tie = them having to count everything in that cabinet and check it off and re-seal/zip tie.

You have to get to know the people around you, like people said something could be perfectly acceptable or funny to one person and completely offensive to the next. 

As for the religion thing. I'm not religious, I have nothing against religion or religious people, but if your preaching to me I'll ask you to stop and if you don't I'll call a supervisor and complain while sitting in the cab with you. Don't force your beliefs on me, I'm entitled to my own opinion. 

I have yet to have a female partner that can't lift her half of the gurney. 9/10 fire will lift it for them but they all can do it. Heck my partner the other day was all gung ho about lifting a large patient with just the two of us while I was talking to fire about 4 pointing him. 

Tire chains, I haven't dealt with it yet but if we need to put 'em on and I'm with a female partner I'm absolutely going to be out playing in the snow while she stays warm in the cab unless we have calls pending but that's just the way I am...or maybe it has something to do with her being the Medic and me being the Intermediate...I'm gonna go with a little bit of everything


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## Handsome Robb (Nov 10, 2011)

DrParasite said:


> omg, how sexist are you?  you are stereotyping guys.  I'll have you know, I am a male.  I know nothing about cars.  Wouldn't know how to manage windshield washer fluid unless you showed me, and I had to call a mechanic to show me how to change a headlight.  and the only reason I know about checking the oil was someone showed me (and even then I barely do it).










:unsure: Someone needs to take your man-card...alright I'm kidding but seriously? Idk about all of you guys but I can't afford to pay someone to fix twiddly-dink problems on my Jeep.


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## Tigger (Nov 11, 2011)

NVRob said:


> All this talk of checking the fluids, O2, supplies, yada yada is making me feel extremely spoiled to have a FT VST department and a FT Mechanic department onsite at our garage that stock. They maintain, stock and wash our units. We clean the inside though, not fair for them to clean up our mess. I have heard of VSTs and mechanics getting offended by a Medic/EMT popping the hood to check fluids.
> 
> Our bags are our responsibility and we do a visual check through the cabinet windows for supplies but everything is shrink wrapped and cabinets are ziptied shut and the VSTs get angry if we open every last compartment to check it. Broken zip tie = them having to count everything in that cabinet and check it off and re-seal/zip tie.
> 
> ...



When I work nights I have to play the VST role, and god does it suck, though more because I should be sleeping, not counting Kerlix roles. We have sealed _bags_ as well, but I am not a big proponent of them. Finding a dead cylinder on the 12th floor in a sealed bag is not good when the patient has to be transported on her prescribed 3lpm.

I worked with a female partner for a few shifts and it was great. If I couldn't calm a patient down, she usually could, and vice versa. Plus she was more than capable of lifting her fair share, and she drove every shift (since I couldn't yet), so I know that she is just as competent, if not more so than I am.


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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

Tigger said:


> When I work nights I have to play the VST role, and god does it suck, though more because I should be sleeping, not counting Kerlix roles. We have sealed _bags_ as well, but I am not a big proponent of them. Finding a dead cylinder on the 12th floor in a sealed bag is not good when the patient has to be transported on her prescribed 3lpm.



That happens, an incident report gets written.

That happens often and the tags come off when I start a shift. 

VSTs are great, when they're as anal about stocking as I am. Unfortunately, it doesn't take much to break that trust, and it's almost impossible to get it back once it's gone.


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## Aidey (Nov 11, 2011)

DrParasite said:


> omg, how sexist are you?  you are stereotyping guys.  I'll have you know, I am a male.  I know nothing about cars.  Wouldn't know how to manage windshield washer fluid unless you showed me, and I had to call a mechanic to show me how to change a headlight.  and the only reason I know about checking the oil was someone showed me (and even then I barely do it).
> 
> Just because someone has a penis, doesn't automaticly make them an expert in auto repair.  And thinking that it does is extremely sexist.and maybe the guy doesn't want crap on his hands or under his nails?  If you are on the crew, you should be washing the truck with your partner.  it's your truck too.
> 
> if your partner is a fairly bad EMT, than he should be fired and replaced with a better EMT.  If you can't trust your partner, than he or she isn't a partner, he is just your driver.  a partner is someone you work with; based on what you just said, you don't have a partner, just a grunt who doesn't even need to be an EMT, just a clean DL and maybe a valid CPR card.



I cant tell if you are being serious or not, but I dont assume just because somene has a penis they know about cars. I assume it when they tell me they were a mechanic before a medic and they spend 1/2 their time in the break room talking about cars. 3 of the 6 guys who share my amb are self admitted car guys. My last partner was female, and also a car person. It has nothing to do with reproductive apparatus. 

You're right, I have a driver not a partner. He isnt going to get fired because all he needs to work here is a clean DL, CPR card and EMT cert. Our company rarely fires people, and he wont get fired unless he actively does something wrong. Right now he just isn't very useful.


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## DV_EMT (Nov 11, 2011)

sir.shocksalot said:


> Absolutely report that. That stuff drives me nuts. I really don't have a problem with really religious people, however they need to keep their beliefs off the ambulance and out of my face. I had a partner once who would do the same thing and try and talk about the bible all shift, it made me extremely uncomfortable. If you want to read your bible, fine, just do it quietly in the corner and don't talk to me about it.



Ya know...(just to clarify)

I absolutely hate it when people falaunt their personal beliefs on you and hrow it into your face.... it happens here in California alot (especially myself bein republican in a predominately democratic state). It seems as though everyday I'm getting a "you need to be more tolerant of homosexuality" or "its a womans right if thy want to abort a fetus". I'm not going to turn this thread into a ethics course, but people shouldn't be afraid to "discuss" these topics so long as they are comfortable with the person their discussing them with. I think people in todays day in age are just to D@mn sue happy.

Example 1: My partner and I have known each other for some time. We bounce topics off each other that pertain to life, religion, relationships, and even politics. We're not afraid to talk about it because we have the comfort level of being friends.

Example 2: you'd never find me talking about such topics with a fresh partner or some joe blo schmo off the street.


Lastly, I'd like to point out that there is sexism (wont divulge into too much detail) at the hospital I work at. In recent months I had to meet with HR because someone (a female) thought that that scratching my groin (because it itched, not because I was making sexual advances with my itching) was considered 3rd party sexual harasment... so yeah.... next thing you know I'll be getting sued for my dandruff or something :wacko:


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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

DV_EMT said:


> Lastly, I'd like to point out that there is sexism (wont divulge into too much detail) at the hospital I work at. In recent months I had to meet with HR because someone (a female) thought that that scratching my groin (because it itched, not because I was making sexual advances with my itching) was considered 3rd party sexual harasment... so yeah.... next thing you know I'll be getting sued for my dandruff or something :wacko:



Tell her you're feeling harassed because she's wearing makeup in an obvious attempt to come on to you.


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## Handsome Robb (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Tell her you're feeling harassed because she's wearing makeup in an obvious attempt to come on to you.



win.


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## Tigger (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> That happens, an incident report gets written.
> 
> That happens often and the tags come off when I start a shift.
> 
> VSTs are great, when they're as anal about stocking as I am. Unfortunately, it doesn't take much to break that trust, and it's almost impossible to get it back once it's gone.



An incident report was written for that one as soon as we cleared. It only happened once and now I cut every seal off the bag at the start of shift. Since we don't have real VSTs, the outgoing crew is responsible for submitting an equipment request form, the night crew is responsible for stocking the requested items, and every crew is responsible for checking their truck at shift start. In theory this prevents things from slipping through the cracks but in reality it just makes people lazy as they assume a different crew will take care of the truck. I hate it. The night crew also dislikes me because they have to reseal the bags every night. I don't care, and I'd do myself if they let me.

But I digress, I think we were talking about harassment. Oops:unsure:


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## DV_EMT (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Tell her you're feeling harassed because she's wearing makeup in an obvious attempt to come on to you.



H3ll yes.... totally doing that next time I work with her. ^_^


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

DrParasite said:


> I have had to deal with christmas music from halloween to new years.  so I hear your pain when it comes to religious songs in the truck.   Either way, what your partner is doing is wrong, report it, it shouldn't be tolerated.    You aren't whining or being overly sensitive, it's your truck too, and his actions are obviously making you uncomfortable.omg, how sexist are you?  you are stereotyping guys.  I'll have you know, I am a male.  I know nothing about cars.  Wouldn't know how to manage windshield washer fluid unless you showed me, and I had to call a mechanic to show me how to change a headlight.  and the only reason I know about checking the oil was someone showed me (and even then I barely do it).
> 
> Just because someone has a penis, doesn't automaticly make them an expert in auto repair.  And thinking that it does is extremely sexist.and maybe the guy doesn't want crap on his hands or under his nails?  If you are on the crew, you should be washing the truck with your partner.  it's your truck too.
> 
> ...



I am a non driver because the company made me a non driver. I am dying to drive so I can take some out of state transports. 

There are five non driving EMTs and Medics at my service.

And no, they don't check or stock anything inside the truck. It's my responsibility. Sometimes they will help clean. Never had someone complain about it.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


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## EMT424 (Nov 11, 2011)

As long as the chores are agreed upon I am cool with it. I run with a 6 ambulance rural county unit. What Pisses me off is when we have our staff meeting and the same female pipes up with "who's supposed to clean the windshield" as though it is my job. She can scrub the vehicle just as well as I can. 

Further, you are passing up the chance to learn about your vehicle. What you learn is transferable to other vehicles (like your own) and might just save your butt some day. 


My comment on lifting stands. We have several "volies" who are on the top side of 60. When it comes to lifting they whine about their backs. If that is the case, they need to quit so others can cover those shifts. Either you can meet the physical standards or you need to go bye-bye. It is that simple. 

As for your unskilled "driver" teach him. Just like you can learn about the vehicle and get more comfortable there, maybe he is tentative because there is always a medic there saying "you just drive". Speed and proficiency are a function of experience.


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## Aidey (Nov 11, 2011)

If you are addressing me the situation is _*VERY *_complicated, and over the last 10 months he has earned the position he is in. I won't get into it here because this is not the thread for it.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

As far as all these gender issues and EMT vs medic duties and responsibilites, it's real simple - you employer should have provided you with a document stipulating your job function, what you're responsible for. If the function is in your job description, you're subject to that task or function, pure and simple.

If you have a medic partner that feels like they're above having to clean or do other menial tasks, simply put off emptying the trash or restocking suppies until they're done with their reports. When they complain, tell them that you do not condone their ideology that the EMT is their personal assistant or slave, that the only time you're truly in a subservient role is when pt care is involved.

As far as "male" tasks, when your female partner tries to get you to check the oil or whatever, just say it's their turn, and say that you're going to do something else, like wipe down eauipment, check the tires, so that you're also doing work at the same time. If they say they don't know how to do something, you can show them so that this is no longer an exuse, or simply shrug you shoulders, say "I don't either," turn away, and play Scrabble on your phone.

As far as incompetent partners, the employer and certifying body says that they're able to perform their job, so you're SOL. The only thing you can do is complain to your supervisor, document their inadequacies, or let them drop the ball during pt care, and get them investigated.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

> If you have a medic partner that feels like they're above having to clean or do other menial tasks, simply put off emptying the trash or restocking suppies until they're done with their reports. When they complain, tell them that you do not condone their ideology that the EMT is their personal assistant or slave, that the only time you're truly in a subservient role is when pt care is involved.
> 
> As far as "male" tasks, when your female partner tries to get you to check the oil or whatever, just say it's their turn, and say that you're going to do something else, like wipe down eauipment, check the tires, so that you're also doing work at the same time. If they say they don't know how to do something, you can show them so that this is no longer an exuse, or simply shrug you shoulders, say "I don't either," turn away, and play Scrabble on your phone.



So how is it fair that the emt sits there and does nothing while the medic does there report then expect the medic to do the cleaning/trash emptying?

Real crappy division of labor.

No one has said they are too good to do its they said they have other stuff to be doing or that they have done.

Sorry no one person does all the work on my truck.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


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## atropine (Nov 11, 2011)

Wow, I can't belive all the whining, or waite yes I can from private ems, suck it up. When I was on probation at my current job, I had to clean the rigs, station, kitchen, bathrooms, bunks, give company drills on equipenment, and write my pcr's, all while still working on the ambulance. Too many sissies in ems now days who can't hack it, and if you couldn'g hack where I work you were let go.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> So how is it fair that the emt sits there and does nothing while the medic does there report then expect the medic to do the cleaning/trash emptying?
> 
> Real crappy division of labor.
> 
> ...



If you finish your report before they're done with decon and restock, you ask them what they need. If you take your time with the reports, and/or waste time socializing with other crews and the ER staff, then the EMT has a right to be annoyed, since you should have been finished much sooner and doing your part to get the rig back in service. Reports shouldn't take an hour. Most paper reports can be done in 10-20 mins, and most computer reports can be done in 20-30. Mine takes 30-45 due to crappy software, but we're using a new system soon.

In the morning, the division of labor is simple - the EMT checks the fluids, belts, hoses, etc, the tires, L/S, then it's the outside - the O2, chair, immobilization equipment if outside, then they jump in to help you check whatever you haven't gotten to. Then, you both clean the interior.

Do EMT's in your service not ride the seat on BLS calls?

At the end of the day, don't take your time filing the reports just to get out of washing the vehicle. If you have web based software, you should have taken care of most of it on the way back. My IFT PD job uses this technology. Whoever happens to be driving back from the last call will empty trash, clean the interior, straighten everything up, change O2, then wash the rig. the other person files the PPW. whoever finishes first helps the other person. Again, it's wrong to BS with staff to stall and not help the other person. The EMT can file PPW, and so can I. The EMT can clean and prep the vehichle, and so can I.


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## medic417 (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> Most paper reports can be done in 10-20 mins, and most computer reports can be done in 20-30. Mine takes 30-45 due to crappy software, but we're using a new system soon.



And if the person cleaning is not done in 10 minutes I would be wondering why they are goofing off while I was busy doing paperwork.  There is no excuse to take more than 10 minutes to clean the ambulance after 99% of the calls.  

I do agree that work load should be equal and shared by all.


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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> So how is it fair that the emt sits there and does nothing while the medic does there report then expect the medic to do the cleaning/trash emptying?



Here's the problem I have with how you're describing the situation. It's one thing to expect the non-attendant partner to help with turning around the gurney, deconing the back, etc while the partner is also working, such as giving report or finishing up the PCR. It's another thing to say, "Well, I have to write a report (which, in my opinion, needs to be done before clearing anyways), therefore I don't have to do anything else."


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> If you finish your report before they're done with decon and restock, you ask them what they need. If you take your time with the reports, and/or waste time socializing with other crews and the ER staff, then the EMT has a right to be annoyed, since you should have been finished much sooner and doing your part to get the rig back in service. Reports shouldn't take an hour. Most paper reports can be done in 10-20 mins, and most computer reports can be done in 20-30. Mine takes 30-45 due to crappy software, but we're using a new system soon.
> 
> In the morning, the division of labor is simple - the EMT checks the fluids, belts, hoses, etc, the tires, L/S, then it's the outside - the O2, chair, immobilization equipment if outside, then they jump in to help you check whatever you haven't gotten to. Then, you both clean the interior.
> 
> ...



Have you missed where I said three times in this thread that I am a non driver at my service? I don't drive because the company doesn't allow me. So i take every call. So no, they don't sit back for any of the calls not even non medical stretcher. 

We use paper reports. And my reports can go for pages. I turn it in. I check our equipment back in. They wash the truck. Simple easy peasy.

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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

Oh, something else to think about. Is it fair that the partner has to drive (hence work) everywhere while you get to play on your phone or sleep when not on a call?


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Here's the problem I have with how you're describing the situation. It's one thing to expect the non-attendant partner to help with turning around the gurney, deconing the back, etc while the partner is also working, such as giving report or finishing up the PCR. It's another thing to say, "Well, I have to write a report (which, in my opinion, needs to be done before clearing anyways), therefore I don't have to do anything else."



Never said I just sit there. I do my report or end of shift stuff while they remake the stretcher or wash the truck. I don't get the problem. I don't see why I should help and then have to do my own stuff.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


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## FourLoko (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Oh, something else to think about. Is it fair that the partner has to drive (hence work) everywhere while you get to play on your phone or sleep when not on a call?



amen, current female partner has her face buried in that thing all day, even has to charge the damn thing with our inverter to keep it going 

Tired of gurney cleanup (and loading by myself) while she sits her happy *** in the passenger seat writing down addresses that should have been filled out before we got on scene.

<_<


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

FourLoko said:


> amen, current female partner has her face buried in that thing all day, even has to charge the damn thing with our inverter to keep it going
> 
> Tired of gurney cleanup (and loading by myself) while she sits her happy *** in the passenger seat writing down addresses that should have been filled out before we got on scene.
> 
> <_<



What's wrong with charging your phone? My battery lasts MAYBE six hours.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Oh, something else to think about. Is it fair that the partner has to drive (hence work) everywhere while you get to play on your phone or sleep when not on a call?



The medics at my IFT job pull that crap. On the overnight, we get runs from local hospitals to a university hospital 2 1/2 - 3 hours away, sometimes two in the same shift (why I don't do nights there - I don't like 3-4 hour late calls, thank you). The EMT drives, and the medic sleeps on the way back. I'm sorry, but I find driving a whole lot more fatiguing than riding in the back. On our tablets, we have our protocols and such available to look over to kill some time. The problem is, this hospital only does 12's or less, so the EMT can't say that they're tired, like they could if it was a 24 hr shift.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Have you missed where I said three times in this thread that I am a non driver at my service? I don't drive because the company doesn't allow me. So i take every call. So no, they don't sit back for any of the calls not even non medical stretcher.
> 
> We use paper reports. And my reports can go for pages. I turn it in. I check our equipment back in. They wash the truck. Simple easy peasy.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



When I used paper, the reports were done before leaving the hospital. Our reports also went on for pages. Unless it was an arrest, these got knocked out in 20 mins tops, counting what I could get done in the back on the way to the receiving facility. IFT, the reports were typically done before I hit the receiving floor. I would get a signature, then wipe down the cot while my partner cleans the monitor (they should both be wiped after every call). Then we both dress the cot, and we're back in service.

Checking equipment back in and turning in reports should only take a few minutes, unless your company uses some convoluted system. I've worked more than a few places, and it shouldn't take longer than that. Changing O2, restock, and cleaning the inside and such will take about the same amount of time. If you can do all that and wash/dry off the truck in ten minutes, then you're cutting corners somewhere.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

medic417 said:


> And if the person cleaning is not done in 10 minutes I would be wondering why they are goofing off while I was busy doing paperwork.  There is no excuse to take more than 10 minutes to clean the ambulance after 99% of the calls.
> 
> I do agree that work load should be equal and shared by all.



To wipe down the cot and monitor, change O2, dress the cot, and empty the trash will put me close to ten minutes right there. Add in restock, particularly for traumas and we're easily over ten minutes, even more so if the other medic can't clean up after themselves (the bench and floor) when starting a line and placing an ECG.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> What's wrong with charging your phone? My battery lasts MAYBE six hours.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



Five or six hours is a lot of phone conversation and texting while at work, I would think.

(I should talk - I get at least an hour or more of computer time at the station every day, and 1 - 1 1/2 hrs. of working out as well)


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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

Bottom line from my perspective. If there's work to be done that can be shared, then both partners needs to be involved in tackling that work until it is done.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Never said I just sit there. I do my report or end of shift stuff while they remake the stretcher or wash the truck. I don't get the problem. I don't see why I should help and then have to do my own stuff.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



If you're finished, then you're obligated to help. You're both being paid. The fact that you do all the reports because you can't drive was not their doing.

Only in the volunteer world is it acceptable to only perform the tasks that you want to.


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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Bottom line from my perspective. If there's work to be done that can be shared, then both partners needs to be involved in tackling that work until it is done.



Funny, we both just said that at the exact same time.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

JPINFV said:


> Bottom line from my perspective. If there's work to be done that can be shared, then both partners needs to be involved in tackling that work until it is done.



Or both can do something different so you get back in service quicker or you can both get off at the same time.

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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> Five or six hours is a lot of phone conversation and texting while at work, I would think.
> 
> (I should talk - I get at least an hour or more of computer time at the station every day, and 1 - 1 1/2 hrs. of working out as well)



No. Even in stand by my phone doesn't last very long. It's a powerful phone with a crap battery life.

I also use my phone for things at work. Looking up facility addresses/phone numbers for family members, talking to dispatch or a supervisor, or researching meds, equipment, procedures or diseases
I had not encountered before.

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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Or both can do something different so you get back in service quicker or you can both get off at the same time.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



That's not what he meant. He was saying that whoever finishes first ought to help the other. The two of you are supposed to be a team. 

Just like when I'm at the firehouse, if I see someone working on something, I'll ask what they need.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> To wipe down the cot and monitor, change O2, dress the cot, and empty the trash will put me close to ten minutes right there. Add in restock, particularly for traumas and we're easily over ten minutes, even more so if the other medic can't clean up after themselves (the bench and floor) when starting a line and placing an ECG.



You change the o2, empty the trash and restock after every call?

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## 46Young (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> No. Even in stand by my phone doesn't last very long. It's a powerful phone with a crap battery life.
> 
> I also use my phone for things at work. Looking up facility addresses/phone numbers for family members, talking to dispatch or a supervisor, or researching meds, equipment, procedures or diseases
> I had not encountered before.
> ...



The medical research makes sense, but you ought to be provided with a facility list and a cell phone by the employer. If they expect you to call them otherwise, either go by radio, a facility phone, or have them comp you in part for your phone bill.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> That's not what he meant. He was saying that whoever finishes first ought to help the other. The two of you are supposed to be a team.
> 
> Just like when I'm at the firehouse, if I see someone working on something, I'll ask what they need.



If it takes more than a few minutes to wipe down and dress the stretcher you have problems.

I don't prewrite my reports. It takes me more than a few minutes, especially if the transport was short. And how are they gonna help me with reports?

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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

46Young said:


> The medical research makes sense, but you ought to be provided with a facility list and a cell phone by the employer. If they expect you to call them otherwise, either go by radio, a facility phone, or have them comp you in part for your phone bill.



Yet they don't. Facility list is kept in the truck so it does me no good at the hospital where family is. So as I said, I use my cell phone for quite a lot and its constantly on the charger.

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## firetender (Nov 11, 2011)

*Just a reminder...*



Sasha said:


> Have you ever really felt harassed by your partner or your coworkers? Sexually, religiously, racially, etc?
> 
> Especially women, did you feel hesitant to report it because you didn't want to seem like a whiner?
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk


 
This is the topic.


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## JPINFV (Nov 11, 2011)

Edit: Never mind... saw the above post after posting this.


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## EMSrush (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Who said I don't pull my weight? I don't check fluids... I pull my weight by checking, stocking, and cleaning the entire rest of the truck.
> 
> I do this for two reasons. I don't want to depend on someone to know that all my crap is there. I've been bitten by "Oh no I already checked the o2, we are good."
> 
> ...




I don't have an issue with what you've written above, per se... especially considering that different agencies distribute some of the responsibilities differently, and I'm not sure how yours works. What I take issue with, is your justification of your refusal to do a task by saying, 

*"I just don't want to get that car crap on my hands or under my finger nails."* 

That, in itself, is NOT a reason to not perform an EMS related duty. To tie this in to the original thread topic (which is what really piqued my interest in the first place), I would respectfully point out that making statements such as the one above could possibly elicit the types of responses from some of your co-workers that you may construe as "harassment". This might also contribute to why some believe that women have it harder in EMS than men do, which may easily be misconstrued as, "Harassment in EMS".


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

Sweets it was brought around because of religious harassment. Not gender.

And even if I was a guy I wouldn't want the crap under my finger nails. Dirty nails mess with my self diagnosed ocd.

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## Fish (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> I have reports to get checked off and equipment to restock or sign back in and other end of shift crap. So... I don't think I should have to wash the truck. Once its washed they're free to go, I still have more crap to do. If we both tackle our respective responsibilitys then we both can be done at the same time.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



Your harassing me!


To this I say wah! Being medic means you have EMTB responsibilities and then some, thats why you get paid more. Your EMTB is not your personal B****.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

Fish said:


> Your harassing me!
> 
> 
> To this I say wah! Being medic means you have EMTB responsibilities and then some, thats why you get paid more. Your EMTB is not your personal B****.



Nope. That will be how I continue to run my truck. 

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## EMSrush (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Sweets it was brought around because of religious harassment. Not gender.



Sorry, Sweets, there was a bit more to your original thread than merely religious harassment:



Sasha said:


> Have you ever really felt harassed by your partner or your coworkers? Sexually, religiously, racially, etc?
> 
> Especially women, did you feel hesitant to report it because you didn't want to seem like a whiner?



I don't like crap under my fingernails, either. So, I keep them short and wear gloves. As for me, being vomited on messes with MY self diagnosed OCD.


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## Fish (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> Nope. That will be how I continue to run my truck.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



I have told you before I would hate to be your patient, now I am adding hate to be your partner to the list. Your 23, inexperienced and immature. Grow up.


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## Sasha (Nov 11, 2011)

Fish said:


> I have told you before I would hate to be your patient, now I am adding hate to be your partner to the list. Your 23, inexperienced and immature. Grow up.



You first love.

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## Fish (Nov 11, 2011)

Sasha said:


> You first love.
> 
> Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk



To call me love you have to either be my wife, older than me, or from England. No pet names here.


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## Handsome Robb (Nov 11, 2011)

I had a response then decided it was off topic so I'll go back on topic. At my old job (2 jobs ago) I was a lifeguard supervisor/manager for a General Improvement District, read: local government with a fancy smancy name. I made it very clear to my employees that I was always available to talk to about harassment claims/complaints whether it be employee/employee or customer/employee. In a job where board shorts and tankinis are the uniform it is a common problem. The big one I dealt with was customer/employee. The older gentleman that used our facilities loved to make passes and comments towards our attractive female guards.

As a supervisor yes it's a headache to deal with but an absolutely necessary one that I never had a problem dealing with as soon as it was presented. Happy employees make a supervisors job *much* easier in the long run. 

If your afraid to report it because your sup just rights it off or tells you "your being difficult" you need to go over their head and that supervisor needs to be talked to as well. These things are part of their job.


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## Seaglass (Nov 11, 2011)

Truck maintenance: I’m glad to lend a hand and learn. Being clueless is not as embarrassing as staying clueless. I’m always cleaning my nails. And everything else, because this is a dirty job.   

Coworkers trying to convert me: I’ve had a few. Most people have been fine when I’ve said no thanks. For the worst one, though, I tried to convert him to a cult that I found online. That put an end to it pretty quickly.  



			
				DrParasite said:
			
		

> not for nothing, but for every guy that assumes the girl is weak, there are 3 girls who will have the guy do all the heavy work for them, and 2 girls who are too weak to do the heavy lifting. It's not right, but it happens.



I know why it’s happening, but it’s still annoying. I need to prove myself all over with every new supervisor and partner, no matter what the previous performance reports or earlier coworkers say.  



			
				DrParasite said:
			
		

> Nothing wrong with looking cute. Nothing wrong with wearing makeup, doing your hair, wearing lipstick, etc. I knew a girl on my FD who used to use the reflective metal of the tower ladder as a mirror to apply her lipstick, was into hello kitty, and said "I'm a pretty firefighter!!!!" whatever, to each her own. but when push came to shove, she would get down and dirty, pack hose, and do the dirty work just like every other guy.
> 
> And if you are buying clothes to big, and not "looking pretty" to downplay your attractiveness, than you are doing yourself a disservice. Nothing wrong with wearing clothes that fit properly or doing your hair. if guys don't accept you, but you do still do the job, than that's their problem



I’d rather enjoy a good working relationship with my coworkers than do my makeup. Many of them simply find attractive women distracting. Maybe that’s their problem, but it creates more problems for me. If I can avoid that by dressing differently, I will. Besides, my hair and uniform are always neat and professional. They’re just not flattering. 

I also don’t have to deal with as many patients making passes at me. That would be worth it alone.  



			
				DrParasite said:
			
		

> than the boss should have been fired, as well as all the guys who were making passes at the girl. and the women should have sued. That type of behavior (from the bosses and the staff) should not be tolerated.



In theory, I totally agree. In practice, they thought their reputations were more important than a lawsuit, which they didn’t have the time or energy to handle anyways. It’s not right, but sometimes things like that win out.


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## EMSrush (Nov 12, 2011)

Seaglass said:


> Being clueless is not as embarrassing as staying clueless.



I'm stealing this. I hope you don't mind.


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## Seaglass (Nov 13, 2011)

EMSrush said:


> I'm stealing this. I hope you don't mind.



Thank you for the compliment.


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