# From E911 to NG911..



## mikie (Aug 11, 2011)

Has anyone heard of this? Have it in place?  

http://www.cnn.com/2011/TECH/mobile/08/11/text.911.mashable/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Are people going to start texting instead of calling 911?  Don't get me wrong, it has it's place, but is the dispatcher going to text back CPR instructions? 



> Being that texting has replaced talking  in the teen demographic, this plan seems like a step in the right  directions, as it aligns with the evolving nature of telecommunications.


 Source CNN.com


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## Shishkabob (Aug 11, 2011)

Deaf/Mutes


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## mikie (Aug 11, 2011)

Linuss said:


> Deaf/Mutes



+1.  Didn't think about that!


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## WTEngel (Aug 11, 2011)

I will bet a pre filled text back with pre arrival instructions for certain situations would work well.

What about sending the person a multimedia file that just played simple, step by step instructions for CPR. I know we aren't there yet, but it isn't too highly unlikely in the future. 

In Saudi Arabia the cell phones could automatically transmit their location to the dispatcher when the caller placed the call. When used effectively, it worked pretty well. 

Technology on smart phones is quickly changing the way people do so many day to day tasks. I don't think calls for emergency assistance will be immune from this trend...


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## ArcticKat (Aug 11, 2011)

Saskatchewan is currently in the process of implementing this system, also e-mail and text to voice.  Using a telephone to contact 911 is still the preferred method but with all of the communication options available these days they want to make sure people have every possile option available.

A few weeks ago we got a 911 via Facebook.  The guy had internet service but no phone service.


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## samiam (Aug 11, 2011)

They are starting it in NY and durham NC   http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/9945706/


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## DrParasite (Aug 11, 2011)

While great in theory, who is going to pay for all the technological upgrades to all the 911 centers? 

Wireless 2 is supposedly the standard for cell phones, yet it hasn't been adopted by all the cell phones in the US. Not only that, but not every 911 center has the technology to even use the data provided by wireless 2 cell phones to locate a caller who needs help. 

Its a good concept, but there are other things that need to be funded first before 911 starts accepting texts


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## LucidResq (Aug 11, 2011)

Linuss said:


> Deaf/Mutes



They already have TTY and easily accessible Relay services. We "talk" to deaf and mute people everyday. 

Texting 911 is completely unnecessary and will cause a lot of problems. We already deal with ridiculous prank calls, kids playing around on phones, butt dials and people who are hard to get information from. This will only make it worse and increase the burden. I'd say about half of the 911 calls I take or more are butt dials or kids playing. 

If you need help and can't speak either a) call from a land line and make some indication you need help if possible   or b) call from a cell phone, make some indication that you need help and don't hang up. I will find you. If you have VOIP keep your address information updated. Same with your cell phone. 

I can come up with a long list of people I've sent help to without them speaking a word to me, and I didn't need a text message to do it.


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## fast65 (Aug 12, 2011)

Kind of a good theory, but often times people are already hysterical enough when they call 911, how are they going to type out a coherent text to 911 when they can hardly speak?


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## jjesusfreak01 (Aug 15, 2011)

samiam said:


> They are starting it in NY and durham NC   http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/9945706/



I believe we are working on it in Wake too, but it won't be ready for a bit.


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## AK_SAR (Aug 15, 2011)

*Could be very useful for some 911 calls*

I think this could be very useful for some situations.  I think some of you are thinking only in terms of 911 calls for emergent medical situations (such as CPR).  There are other valid emergencies where people call 911.  Even in medical emergencies there can be some advantages in texting.

My understanding is that a text message will sometimes get through in situations (very weak cell signal) where a voice call will not.  Recall that in the widely publicized Kim search in Oregon a few years ago, the missing people could not call out, but were still located by weak cell signals.  Mr. Kim died from hypothermia before being found, but his familly survived.

Consider an auto accident on a rural highway. Would it not be better to quickly get out a text to EMS, rather than wait until someone can be flagged down to travel to where they can make a voice call?  Likewise, in SAR situations, a person might be able to text a GPS coordinate from a location where they can't successfully make a voice call.  A lost person might send a photo of their surroundings, enabling a searcher familiar with the area to direct them how to self rescue.

Yes, there will be bogus 911 text messages (just as there already are voice calls), but in some situations sending text or photos to 911 could be a very useful tool.


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## LucidResq (Aug 16, 2011)

Those situations are going to be exceedingly rare and although there are exceptions, you and I both know that most of those situations (in which a person has become lost in the backcountry and is totally reliant on a cell phone to get help) can be prevented in the first place. 

There are 911 centers nationwide facing budget cuts and layoffs. Adding the capability to text 911 will not only require funding for the technology, it will require significant additions to staffing levels. I guarantee it. Where is that money going to come from? 

 Will it save a life or two? Perhaps. But when people start taking advantage of the anonymity of texting and sending PD and FD to even more bogus calls, we could very well lose a few as well. It's also not uncommon to be on a 911 call with someone reporting an accident and then hear them get in an accident themselves because they're distracted and rubber-necking. Now every other person who drives by is going to feel compelled to text us about it, even though they're the 20th person to report it?


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## AK_SAR (Aug 16, 2011)

LucidResq said:


> Those situations are going to be exceedingly rare and although there are exceptions, you and I both know that most of those situations (in which a person has become lost in the backcountry and is totally reliant on a cell phone to get help) can be prevented in the first place.


Rare? I think not.  While I don't have hard statistics, it seems to me that emergency cell phone calls from the backcountry have become quite common. Even here in Alaska where our cell coverage is much more limeted than most places, we have had a number of backcountry rescues initiated by cell phones. There seem to be more each year.  Prevention?...sure, in theory.  Just like most car wrecks in the city could be prevented....in theory.

And, as I mentioned, getting a text out can help in any area of weak signal, not just in the back country.  In my experience, there are many miles of highway, particularly in western states, with poor cell coverage.  



LucidResq said:


> Will it save a life or two? Perhaps. But when people start taking advantage of the anonymity of texting and sending PD and FD to even more bogus calls, we could very well lose a few as well. ?


  Texting from a cell phone is no more anonymous than a voice call.


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## LucidResq (Aug 16, 2011)

Of course emergency cell phone calls from the backcountry aren't rare - I mean situations in which someone can't call, can text, and getting a text out is a life-or-death matter. I've had one instance in which I've tried to call 911 out in the sticks, and I couldn't get a phone call out to 911 or a text message out to anyone. I'm willing to bet this situation is more common.

I know many times when I've texted someone from the sticks they'll get it... but days later.  

I can think of one search off the top of my head in which a lost dude texted his family who then passed that info on to us. The information reached us just as quickly as it would have if he texted 911 himself.


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## HotelCo (Aug 16, 2011)

LucidResq said:


> Texting 911 is completely unnecessary and will cause a lot of problems.



Active shooter scenario pops to mind for it's usefulness. If I'm huddled down somewhere, trying not to be noticed, I'd much rather text 911 telling them what's going on, how many shooters there are, where they are, what they're armed with, etc. rather than calling and just keeping the line open and hoping you figure out where I am.

Same with a home invasion. I want to keep quiet so they don't know I'm there/where I am. Texting would be useful.


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## Sasha (Aug 16, 2011)

Are they going to have to take classes in text speak to run this??

"Hlp dis guy is tryin 2 rob me n hez blk n he sk8ed awy"


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## LucidResq (Aug 16, 2011)

HotelCo said:


> Active shooter scenario pops to mind for it's usefulness. If I'm huddled down somewhere, trying not to be noticed, I'd much rather text 911 telling them what's going on, how many shooters there are, where they are, what they're armed with, etc. rather than calling and just keeping the line open and hoping you figure out where I am.
> 
> Same with a home invasion. I want to keep quiet so they don't know I'm there/where I am. Texting would be useful.



If you look at actual active shooter incidents, such as Columbine or Virginia Tech, it seems the 911 system as it is worked just fine. For example, at Columbine the shooting started at 11:19-11:20. First 911 call was 11:21, and first officer was on scene at 11:24. It didn't take him long to determine who the suspects were or where they were because shots were exchanged just after that. 

True home invasions... exeedingly rare. Most of the time burglars are surprised when they find someone home and run away as soon as they realize it. 

I'm not saying there are NO circumstances in which texting 911 would be helpful, I just think those situations are very rare and the benefits must be weighed against the negatives and cost. 

You may all think of the 1 in a 1000 active shooter or home invasion call, I think of the fact that someone calling to report a run-of-the-mill accident will now text me instead of calling me, distracting them from driving safely. I think about people who will text something like what Sasha said, and how it will now take me 8x as long to decipher what they've said and will lose the ability to just ask them the questions I need to know. Most people are much more focused on "he's just so rude to me and he used to be so nice, and since my aunt died I don't know what to do anymore, and he doesn't take good care of our daughter, and he cheated on me with blah blah blah" and that is what they are going to text. More time wasted that could be spent more efficiently just taking calls and getting my answers in real time, and moving on to that next 911 line that's already ringing. 

If you spend enough time in a very busy 911 center, you would understand. I routinely have to put several 911 callers on hold to answer another one of the other 10+ 911 lines ringing. I don't think having to deal with "fund racon in hse wat do i do?" and such is going to help me or anyone else who is calling for my help.


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## LucidResq (Aug 16, 2011)

Another concern I have is that when someone calls into 911 we are typically able to get Phase II GPS coordinates. Sometimes we get them automatically, but more often than not we have to wait 20 seconds + into the phone call to obtain this information. It took a very long time for wireless providers to comply with even these standards, even though the bar is still pretty darn low (google wireless phase II for more information). So I doubt we will have this capability with text-messaging, which is extremely problematic considering how often people have no clue where they are. So I can now imagine taking that 1 in a 1000 home invasion call, but they have no idea where they are and I will have no ability to triangulate their location. I'd rather be able to find out where they are within 20 seconds or less and have no real idea what exactly is going on, than have no clue where they are but know what the suspect looks like.


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## mikie (Aug 16, 2011)

*oy, i can see it now...*

Some one is going to see a MVA on the side of the road, text 911 and end up rear-ending the person in front of them...[domino effect = many car pileup] :wacko:

Or potential 'abuse' of the system.  Texting when calling is (physically for the caller) more feasible/practical, as the original article pointed out, teens are more inept to texting over calling.


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## Youn0469 (Aug 17, 2011)

I think the idea of having the capability to text between 911 and the caller is a good tool to be able to utilize. I don't think it would be practical to use as a main mean of communication but rather a backup or as an alternative. 

Like was mentioned previously, if I'm in a situation where I cannot make my presence known I'd much rather text 911 rather than call because my safety matters over all else. 

Another aspect to consider too is backcountry safety. Say you go for a hike, get lost and miss your check in or you get hurt. Personal Locator beacons are a great way to be able to communicate your position with rescuers and it could also be a great means by which the rescuers could either send instructions or questions about your well being. I've been camping all over and texting has always been a great back up for me when I cannot receive cell service. 

The use of multimedia messaging service (MMS) or short messaging service (SMS) can greatly help responders. Say a caller contacts the police about a fight or medical emergency. More time than not that person is going to be a bystander and can take pictures to assist cops in the apprehension of offenders or assist EMS in the evaluation of the incident. 

My theory is, if we got it, use it!


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## LucidResq (Aug 17, 2011)

Youn0469 said:


> I don't think it would be practical to use as a main mean of communication but rather a backup or as an alternative.



The problem is, if this becomes available a very large number of people will start using it as the primary way to contact 911. See, most of you are rational people who know something about the emergency response system. Most of you would realize when it would appropriate to text 911 and when it would be better to call. Most of you know that if you were to send a text, you would send something like "1234 Main St. Someone breaking into my house right now." If semi-educated folks with knowledge of how emergency services work were the only people using this system, it'd be great. 

I think some of you are imagining using such technology yourself and forgetting that 96% of the people who call 911 don't know where they are, don't know what we need to know, don't know what we can and can't do and need quite a bit of guidance just to get the right help started to the right place (never mind any directions such as "don't shove a sandwich in the seizing man's mouth" and "evacuate the burning house"). Texting would either remove or severely delay this guidance.  



Youn0469 said:


> The use of multimedia messaging service (MMS) or short messaging service (SMS) can greatly help responders. Say a caller contacts the police about a fight or medical emergency. More time than not that person is going to be a bystander and can take pictures to assist cops in the apprehension of offenders or assist EMS in the evaluation of the incident.



If it's a picture of the suspect, why does the 911 operator need to see it? We can get a description of the suspect for officers while they're on their way so they can keep their eye out, but anything more isn't necessary. We apprehend plenty of people this way. 

If they have a picture they can show it to officers once they arrive. I don't care what someone's cheekbones look like. A description of the suspect's vehicle, direction of travel, age, gender, race, build, clothing and anything distinguishing (facial hair, platinum grill etc) is plenty for officers to keep an eye out in the 5 minutes while they drive to the scene. 

In what kind of situation would having a picture en route to an EMS call be helpful?



Youn0469 said:


> My theory is, if we got it, use it!


Again, cost vs. benefit. We can play the what-if game all day long but at the end of the day the cost and pitfalls of implementing a technology must be weighed against the potential benefit such a tool would provide in a 1 in 1000 type of call. 

What if the bad guy steals my one and only phone but I have my WiFi-connected laptop and want to Twitter 911? What if I only speak French... why should I have to wait an additional 3-4 minutes for an interpreter when you can just train 911 operators to speak French? Why don't we equip every ambulance in the country with a $10,000 pocket ultrasound?


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