# Ambulance communications



## NewTex (Jan 20, 2012)

Here, in San Saba, Central texas, a large and mainly rural county, we use a cell phone (Motorola m900, 3 watt output) to communicate with the hospitals. We do use VHF FM radio for comms with dispatch and other ambulances/agencies.

I have just had one of our cell phones quit and Motorola no longer makes this model, allthough some distributers still stock them.

 I was wondering what the rest of you use for comms to the hospital.

I did notice my personal cell works just as good in the back of the ambulance as the commercial M900 in the ambulance.

Thinking about changing to ??


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## DesertMedic66 (Jan 20, 2012)

Our ambulances have different brands of cell phones in them to make calls to hospitals, mechanics, dispatch, supervisors, etc. Most crews just use their own cell phones. 

We can also use our unit radios to contact hospitals and dispatch along with other crews by using our main dispatching channel (for short talk), our Tac channel (for longer conversations and setting up plans and other things, Calcord (to once again talk to other crews, sometimes talk to Fire, and to open some gates within our area).

And lastly we use the Fire department channels. Their main dispatching channel to say we are responding, and ask simple small questions. And then their Tac channels to have longer conversations with the fire crew responding.


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## DrParasite (Jan 20, 2012)

I will say this: whatever your agency decides to use as their primary means of communication (radio, cell phone, smoke signals, whatever) needs to be provided by the agency and paid for 100% by the agency.  the agency needs to be responsible for the maintenance of said device (including repair and replacement of batteries).

more and more places are going to cell phones to call the hospital as they provide a more secure line of communication than a radio.  you can also transmit 12 leads over a cell signal.

but while they are great most of the time, I still want a portable radio; after all, when all hell breaks loose, and i'm screaming for help, I don't want to fumble through the phone for dispatches number, or have to hear "all circuits are busy, please try again later."


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## mycrofft (Jan 20, 2012)

I'm finding people are difficult to train to use a handheld radio *because* they are used to cell phones. They do not follow procedures like not "walking" on others' transmission or waiting for the net to clear a little before speaking, or pressing the xmit button and waiting a beat for it to fire up, or not playing with the knobs and buttons and thingees. Yanking the antenna and microphone wire, and holding it sideways or upside down to operate are common also even after classes.

Yeah, do not use your personal phone if the company is supposed to supply. If something goes wrong, it's your head. In a disaster where it is crowded, or if it affects cell tower, cell service can be lost.


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## exodus (Jan 20, 2012)

I always use my phone to call the hospitals medic line. It's much easier than fumbling through the old cell phones contacts when I can just type either DR, EM, or JF on my contact list and it comes straight up.


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## Handsome Robb (Jan 20, 2012)

We use the onboard handset in the box, we have 10 designated med channels. Two main hospitals have a designated channel each. The VA and two smaller hospitals we have to ask dispatch for a patch. 

We use VHF fire uses 800mhz


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## NomadicMedic (Jan 20, 2012)

Everything in my system is 800 MHz. Each hospital has a talk group. They would rather the medics use the radio than call, that way the doc can listen to the report as most sit in close proximity to the base radio.


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## Tigger (Jan 20, 2012)

I've heard of places that do not install mobile radios in their ambulances, and instead do all communications off portables. Does anyone work in such a system, and if so is this a viable option?

My present employer recently doubled its fleet size meaning that only ALS and night BLS get portables, which I do not like. I'd rather have to use a portable all day than have my personal cell phone be my only form of personal communication outside of the truck. At facilities I can use their phone and it's not an issue, but I refuse to do that in someone's home.


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## jemt (Jan 20, 2012)

Some transport companies only have truck mounted radios which is asinine,


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## NomadicMedic (Jan 20, 2012)

Tigger said:


> I've heard of places that do not install mobile radios in their ambulances, and instead do all communications off portables. Does anyone work in such a system, and if so is this a viable option?
> 
> My present employer recently doubled its fleet size meaning that only ALS and night BLS get portables, which I do not like. I'd rather have to use a portable all day than have my personal cell phone be my only form of personal communication outside of the truck. At facilities I can use their phone and it's not an issue, but I refuse to do that in someone's home.




99% of my communication is done with my portable. We have excellent coverage, I have all the channels I need in my radio and I always have it with me. We have radios in the medic units and some ambulances have a radio in the box, but 9 times out fo 10, I just use my portable.


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## NewTex (Jan 20, 2012)

Thank you all for the replies. I guess communications are quite varied depending on area. 

I expect I will suggest that our ems service replaces the 3 watt motorola with a regular handheld type cell phone. Perhaps tethered in the back of the ambulanc so that it doesnt walk away.

We use the cell primarely when we are 5 minutes out from the ED to give them heads up with patient's condition.

Our county is mainly rural with a total pop of about 6000, covering about 1100 sqaure miles. Have one VHF chanel that dispatches Fire, Sherif, PD and EMS as well as one tac channel.  Lots of hills. 

Thanks again


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## traumaluv2011 (Jan 20, 2012)

The squad I've been riding along with doesn't communicate with the hospital. If we have a critical patient, we will have medics dispatched and they will communicate with the hospital. If not, we will just give our oral report to the charge nurse as we walk in the ER.

The only exception is a critical trauma in which we don't have the time to wait for paramedics and need to get them to a Trauma II center about 15-20 minutes away. In that case our mobile radio in the back has the channel to talk to the Trauma center


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## Tigger (Jan 20, 2012)

jemt said:


> Some transport companies only have truck mounted radios which is asinine,


Yes, it is asinine and it plainly sucks. Now my partner and I can't both get a sit down breakfast at the same time! 


n7lxi said:


> 99% of my communication is done with my portable. We have excellent coverage, I have all the channels I need in my radio and I always have it with me. We have radios in the medic units and some ambulances have a radio in the box, but 9 times out fo 10, I just use my portable.



Hmmm. We have excellent coverage in the city so maybe it might need to be suggested. Obviously there is more upkeep on a portable than a mobile radio but it's so much more practical. I work at a place where no expense is spared in certain areas, and then the little things are just forgotten about which is rather maddening.


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## NomadicMedic (Jan 20, 2012)

I'd only suggest portables as the "go to" radio if you're on a trunked system with excellent dense coverage. A VHF or UHF portable, unless you're on a voted repeater system, simply won't cut it.


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## Handsome Robb (Jan 20, 2012)

n7lxi said:


> I'd only suggest portables as the "go to" radio if you're on a trunked system with excellent dense coverage. A VHF or UHF portable, unless you're on a voted repeater system, simply won't cut it.



What he said.

With that said, our portables work just fine but we have repeaters all over the place for the different med channels.


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## mycrofft (Jan 21, 2012)

Think: what security/HIPPA issues arise using mobile radio nets if they are uncoded or analog?
For that matter, after the British tabloid hooraw, are plain old cellphones secure enough?


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## feldy (Jan 21, 2012)

Everyone in my dept is issued their own radio (motorola xts5000R). We talk to dispatch, hospitals, police, fire and have all of the other public safety channels programmed in in case of Mutual aid or large scale events/ disasters.

Part of the reasoning for using the radio is that most of the channels are recorded. (we have a few that arent so we can talk a little more freely if that is necessary).


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## lawndartcatcher (Jan 23, 2012)

NewTex said:


> Here, in San Saba, Central texas, a large and mainly rural county, we use a cell phone (Motorola m900, 3 watt output) to communicate with the hospitals.



_3 watts?_ Can you cook your lunch with it, too? I guess you'd need that kind of transmit power if you're in a rural area, but I'd still be worried about growing a second head...

We use UHF radio for everything. The problem is that even if a hospital records incoming phone communication it's pretty much up to them if they're going to release a tape (court order not withstanding). If there's ever a question our manager can request a copy from the C-MED folks and he can tell right away what kind of notification was given, if a particular medical order was given, etc.

If you could find a way to record your communication via cel phone (without breaking any federal wiretap laws) you'd be in better shape. otherwise you may want to consider moving to a radio-based system only for the CYA component.


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## NewTex (Jan 23, 2012)

Yes, 3 watts..allthough it's coax cable from the telephone handset/transmitter to an antenna on the outside and on top of the box. 

I have informed the powers that be (not me, simply tech advisory) of the various options. They will have to come to a decision.

I doubt there will be any switching to a radio based system. ($$$$$$$) 

A lot of our money out here in the sticks comes from grants. Our last 2 new ambulances were paid for in that manner. We need to replace a third ambulance soon and are dredging all corners for grant money to pay for it.


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## Tigger (Jan 24, 2012)

n7lxi said:


> I'd only suggest portables as the "go to" radio if you're on a trunked system with excellent dense coverage. A VHF or UHF portable, unless you're on a voted repeater system, simply won't cut it.



Truthfully I'm not all that well versed in radio systems. All I know is that we have we're operating off of the Icom Digital Advanced System platform, which I think is trunked.


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## Handsome Robb (Jan 24, 2012)

mycrofft said:


> Think: what security/HIPPA issues arise using mobile radio nets if they are uncoded or analog?
> For that matter, after the British tabloid hooraw, are plain old cellphones secure enough?



No identifying patient information is broadcasted on the air, just age, sex, C/C, interventions, vitals if they aren't "stable", and ETA.

It's HIPAA not HIPPA. Sorry, pet peeve


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## traumaluv2011 (Jan 24, 2012)

Our budget is kind of low, so we only get radios if we show up to the most calls, which makes sense. The only thing quite dumb is the lack of communication we have with police officers on scene prior to any of our members showing up on scene. That would help so that we could get a precise location of the patient, have them start an initial assessment, put on oxygen, etc. 

We have their channel in our radios, however the radios are only programmed to hear, we can't actually talk on them (makes sense though) and their portables don't even have our channel in them.


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## NomadicMedic (Jan 24, 2012)

mycrofft said:


> Think: what security/HIPPA issues arise using mobile radio nets if they are uncoded or analog?
> For that matter, after the British tabloid hooraw, are plain old cellphones secure enough?



There is no HIPAA violation for using a radio to make a base station contact. 

And really, if someone wanted to find out where the call was and who the patient is, there are plenty of quicker ways to do it.


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