# Should I do the 2 week EMT program?



## MedicineMan (Feb 22, 2008)

I have a desire to do some real clinical work and really get to help people. I love medicine and hope to go to med school in three to four years. I have worked in hospitals and clinics as a volunteer but it is not enough because I am not able to help patients until I am certified.  I really want to learn these skills now because I will not be able to help people otherwise for five to six years.

The reason that I am having trouble deciding to get into an EMT-basic program is that I have a very tough schedule with my pre-med classes. This year I have time to do the two week program during the month of May. Then I do not have another chance until next summer to take a summer program. The other issue about my schedule is that I will not be able to volunteer more than four hours a week during the school year. Then I have three whole summers to work part to full time.

Is the two week program this May beneficial?
Would I be able to volunteer when I get back from the program?
Should I wait and take longer program?


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## Chimpie (Feb 22, 2008)

Would you feel comfortable being in charge of saving someone's life with only two weeks worth of training?

Would you feel comfortable knowing that the person in charge of saving your life only has two weeks worth of training?


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## reaper (Feb 22, 2008)

I would say NO NO NO!

But, since you are in premed, what type of classes have you had so far.
If you have had Micro, A&P, or any other med classes, you may be able to pick up the curriculum pretty well.

If you have no clue about any thing medical, then I would wait for a regular class. You don't get much from them, but they are better then a two week course.


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## Katie (Feb 22, 2008)

Personally I think that's a lot of stuff to learn in just two weeks.  It's not just about knowing what to do on an intellectual level there's also a good amount of practice needed in order to actually be able to carry out the skills you know how to do.  Just my opinion.


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## Canoeman (Feb 22, 2008)

What is the real rush here son. Do one thing and do it well. Then do another and do it better. 

canoeman


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## VentMedic (Feb 22, 2008)

I take it you are already in college taking college level classes and managing well with a pre-med schedule?

Then yes, you probably have the discipline to do the two week course.

I would hope by now you have also done your research on the EMT course and what it involves.   Since you have already been exposed to the medical field even if as a volunteer, you should have a good idea about what patient care is about.   Most people enter into an EMT class without any prep including college classes or previous medical knowledge and do very well.  

Of course, this would depend on if you can not find something else better to do during your two weeks off.


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## Diver911 (Feb 22, 2008)

Canoeman said:


> What is the real rush here son. Do one thing and do it well. Then do another and do it better.
> 
> canoeman




Sound advice.. 

A lot COULD be overlooked in a two week course.  Either the programs fault or yours...


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## MedicineMan (Feb 22, 2008)

*thanks for the advice guys*

I see the drawback for such a short course. I  am just afraid that if I wait that I wont get enough experience under my belt to really call myself an EMT. I want this because it will satisfy my desire to help people and to prove to myself that I really want to be in medicine. 

My daily thoughts of becoming a doctor hold little merit in comparison to being their for the patient's last moments and their second chance. Even though I Know that I have a place in medicine others will not see that, for actions are what define people not their thoughts.

If you were me and you only had one summer to become an EMT-basic and one or two summers to help people before going off to med school, Would you do it?
Do you think that is enough experience to compensate for the 2 months spent in class?

Thanks so much for all your help. This is one of my biggest decision for me to make in my undergraduate years and im glad I have all of you guy's advice to help me decide.


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## VentMedic (Feb 23, 2008)

It appears that you are dedicated to following your dream.  If you have no other distractions in your life right now like a FT job, kids, spouse and are disciplined in studying, an EMT-B class will not be too difficult.  You may be able to find a good mentor to help you perfect the skills.    

Often, people who enroll into an EMT class have too much going on in their lives or their study habits are not focused. Many find themselves doing all their studying the hour before class when the class only meets once or twice a week.  They may enjoy the skills but don't excel in the books. 

The EMT class is only a taste of EMS education.  However, it does give you the opportunity to do some patient care.  Your story is not that different from other physicians who grabbed every chance they could to get hands on experience and just see different aspects of medicine before med school. Many doctors have  very interesting resumes from their undergrad days that introduced them to something that would shape their future later.  If you see a benefit for the EMT class in your future, then go for it.


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## Markhk (Feb 23, 2008)

MedicineMan, are you by chance in Nor Cal? If you are, there are other options than the Unitek 2 week boot camp program that might fit your summer schedule.


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## Ridryder911 (Feb 23, 2008)

Personally, you probably would do okay in such a class, but if you don't have the time for class then you don't have the time to be an EMT. I am not in favor of Basic EMT's role other than MFR, but even then abbreviated courses are horrible. Do us, the profession, and focus your attention in possibly another area. EMT will not train you in areas for the hospital work. We do not need another just card carrying member. 

I suggest that you explore possibility areas of lab, even ER tech's sometimes do not have to be an EMT. 

Good luck,

R/r 911


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## StarOfLife (Feb 23, 2008)

Everyone's level of ambition and ability to absorb material effectively is different.

I took a 28-day WEMT immersion course through SOLO.  It was M-F, 8:30 a.m. until 4:30 - 5:00 p.m. and until 7:00 on Tues and Thurs evenings after breaking for dinner.

They have a campus and most of the people live there for the month, however, I was fortunate enough to live 10 minutes away.

I lived and breathed emergency medicine while I was taking the class.  I didn't have to work, and my family was entirely supportive.  Many of us were practicing together for a couple of weeks before the practical exam until 11:00 p.m.

I absolutely loved it and it really served me well.  Like I said, though, each person is different and you will only get out of it what you put into it.

I hope my perspective helps.  Good luck with your endeavors.


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## KEVD18 (Feb 24, 2008)

there is one set of circumstances where i would be in favor of someone taking the 2 week shake an bake emt course:

in ma, you have to have all of your con ed and refresher done by 12/31. if, for whatever reason you dont get it all in by then, you have to take a refresher and challange the exam, which you have one shot at. if you fail, your done. you have to go through an acredited program and redo the exam(however this time you get three tries at it)

if that were your situation, i would say go for it. i might even be in favor of the idea of you had held a ticket back a few years, let it go and wanted it back. so all you really need is to brush up on your skills, learn what may have changed and be good. but someone that has never been an emt should never ben allowed to take a shake and bake course. its just not right. 

stick with med school.


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## MedicineMan (Feb 24, 2008)

MedicineMan, are you by chance in Nor Cal? If you are, there are other options than the Unitek 2 week boot camp program that might fit your summer schedule.

Markhk I do not live in cali, I live in tennessee

 it sounds like being a part time volunteer as an EMT basic would be impratical. I mean I would never want to hurt the profession or the patients for my lack of experience and time that I could provide for them. For many of you this is your profession and I wish I could make it mine for a couple of years if time permitted but that is not my situation. I am excited to get into the "thick of medicine" if I may. I will continue to volunteer until it's time to start my path of heart.


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## MMiz (Feb 24, 2008)

I took my EMT course over the summer semester for 6 weeks.  This was while I was doing 20 credit semesters during the school year, and while taking two courses in addition to my EMT ones over the summer.

I can't imagine going any faster than six weeks of 9-5 training.  One advantage of doing it at a local community college was that I actually got college credit, even if it didn't apply towards my degree program.


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## MikeRi24 (Feb 24, 2008)

I cant even immagine doing it all in 2 weeks. I am doing an 8 week course right now, everyday from 8-5 and its a LOT, and and study a lot after class and on my days off I dont even know how you could do all that in 2 weeks and feel prepared for the exam.


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## disassociative (Feb 24, 2008)

MedicineMan said:


> Markhk I do not live in cali, I live in tennessee



Woah! TN DOES NOT RECOGNIZE EMT-B. We have a more advanced provider level, EMT-IV; which is at least a 1 yr course; as the providers administer IV therapy, administer certain meds, Combitube/Ptl, and perform a more thorough assessment. You must complete the EMT-IV course or higher to work with a service in TN. The state requires NREMT-B's to take the transition course to EMT-IV before obtaining TN licensure. As well, to be licensed in TN, you must pass the National Registry, have a background check TBI/FBI on File(1 month process), and documented physical evaluation by an M.D.

As far as I know, there are no two week EMT-IV courses; and TN no longer licenses EMT-B's.

I went through all the levels, 

First Responder, EMT-IV & Paramedic

I have yet to see a 2 week course for TN licensure. Furthermore, I would not challenge EMT-IV without the proper amount of time in training.

For those of you who are scratching their heads, this is one of those situations where you have to be familiar with TN EMS and the expanded roles of our providers to grasp the gravity of the situation.

Now, if you want your EMT-IV; You can get it from:

Motlow State(mscc.edu)
Columbia State
Roane State
Tennessee Tech University
Chatanooga State
and many more.


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## disassociative (Feb 24, 2008)

MikeRi24 said:


> I cant even immagine doing it all in 2 weeks. I am doing an 8 week course right now




Sorry for the double post, my jaw hit the floor when I read this.

8 Weeks?!? That is All?  

Wow; now I know why Rid is always going on about EMT-B course lengths being embarrassing.

I guess having lived in TN all of my life--I have been exposed to a different EMS than that of other states. Wow, I had no idea how short EMT-B courses were. None of our EMT-IV programs are shorter than 1 yr.(2 semesters)


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## Lisa (Feb 24, 2008)

*Emt-iv*

Diss.... you have been misinformed. Chattanooga state and Cleveland State both offer an Accelerated EMT-IV course. Only one semester (14 weeks) is all I went. And from my understanding one of them is offering an on-line pilot course this fall, don't remember which one. I personally took the accelerated program at Chatt. State 2 years ago. I loved it although it was tough. We didn't have much clinical time, which I didn't like, but I was lucky enough to be able to do ride alongs with my local service. I also have been involved with the Fire Dept for several years and had my MFR license.

I personally think that there is no way you could learn all you needed too i 2 weeks!!! Good luck on whatever you decide.


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## JPINFV (Feb 24, 2008)

disassociative said:


> Sorry for the double post, my jaw hit the floor when I read this.
> 
> 8 Weeks?!? That is All?
> 
> ...



Well, to be fair, 110 clock hours [NHTSA standard] isn't that long. My course was about 4-5 months long, but that was with it being 1 night a week [4 hours] plus 1-2 Saturdays and 16 hours of clinicals [8 hospital, 8 ambulance]. 

There were also programs in the area that were 2 week accelerated courses. The low level of class time is the reason why people aren't happy with the basic level of education. See the "Is 110 hours enough" thread for a good discussion.


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## disassociative (Feb 24, 2008)

Well, considering the fact that he is in TN; where EMT-IV's are starting IV's and doing more advanced skills--this isn't the program to take shortcuts in.


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## JPINFV (Feb 24, 2008)

There shouldn't be shortcuts for people providing care regardless of what state they may be in.


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## disassociative (Feb 24, 2008)

I am forced to agree with that 100%(even if I were not forced, I would still agree 100%).


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## StarOfLife (Feb 24, 2008)

MikeRi24 said:


> I cant even immagine doing it all in 2 weeks. I am doing an 8 week course right now, everyday from 8-5 and its a LOT, and and study a lot after class and on my days off I dont even know how you could do all that in 2 weeks and feel prepared for the exam.



The school I attended in that 28-day program has an 88% first time pass success rate with the NREMT basic exam.

It can be done well, it simply depends on the quality of the school.


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## DocPetey (Feb 27, 2008)

Holy crap!  A *two week course?????*  Yeeouch.

Here in Utah, the EMT-B course at the University of Utah is 12 weeks long, sixteen classroom hours a week, IIRC.  (Back when I took it in 1985 it was an entire college quarter, four hours classroom time on tues and thurs, eight hours practical field work on saturday for eleven weeks.)

Honestly, I wouldn't entrust the well-being of my goldfish to someone with two weeks training.


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## StarOfLife (Feb 27, 2008)

DocPetey said:


> Holy crap!  A *two week course?????*  Yeeouch.
> 
> Here in Utah, the EMT-B course at the University of Utah is 12 weeks long, sixteen classroom hours a week, IIRC.  (Back when I took it in 1985 it was an entire college quarter, four hours classroom time on tues and thurs, eight hours practical field work on saturday for eleven weeks.)
> 
> Honestly, I wouldn't entrust the well-being of my goldfish to someone with two weeks training.



I understand your concern, but there is an exam that is standardized.  I'm not saying it is perfect, but it measures every EMT candidate the same and if you know the material the NR deems to be necessary to practice as an EMT, then you are not necessarily worse off than your peers that have more classroom time.

My gripe with our EMT-B requirements is not the classroom time, but with the clinical time invested.  I think 10 hours is ridiculous.  I am currently doing ride time with the local ambulance I want to work for because I am a firm believer that practical experience is key to understanding all classroom concepts and interventions.

JMHO.


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## DocPetey (Feb 27, 2008)

StarOfLife said:


> I understand your concern, but there is an exam that is standardized.  I'm not saying it is perfect, but it measures every EMT candidate the same and if you know the material the NR deems to be necessary to practice as an EMT, then you are not necessarily worse off than your peers that have more classroom time.
> 
> My gripe with our EMT-B requirements is not the classroom time, but with the clinical time invested.  I think 10 hours is ridiculous.  I am currently doing ride time with the local ambulance I want to work for because I am a firm believer that practical experience is key to understanding all classroom concepts and interventions.
> 
> JMHO.



And I understand where you are coming from.  However, consider the implication in a two week course, even if it has a standardized exam.   Any schmoe with a Brady guide could memorize the material, but does it mean they can handle the real world?  

Don't get me wrong; I'm not one of those EMS-snobs with a "my training is superior to your training" attitudes.  However, I'm a strong believer in the importance of field training.  Any municipality that would entrust the lives of its public to someone with two weeks of classroom training is inviting disaster.

Knowing the material is not the same as experiencing it.


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## JPINFV (Feb 27, 2008)

Assuming that the class hours are the same between a 3 month and 3 week program, why should the 3 month be any more adapt than a 3 week EMT-B? Most of the care an EMT-B providers is basic to advanced first aid.


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## DocPetey (Feb 27, 2008)

JPINFV said:


> Assuming that the class hours are the same between a 3 month and 3 week program, why should the 3 month be any more adapt than a 3 week EMT-B? Most of the care an EMT-B providers is basic to advanced first aid.



I know I'm new here, and I'm probably stomping on toes, but for crissakes, how can you compare a 3 week course with a three month course, as there is simply not sufficient time for clinical hours?  Classroom is all fine and dandy, but it doesn't mean much if you don't get out and do it for real.

You need time in an ER, learning the use of extrication equipment, A&P, Mass Casualty, comm, etc.  You don't learn that in a classroom.  You learn that in practicals.

When I was an instructor, I found the best way to teach was to get those students up to their elbows in it.

Maybe I'm old, and set in my ways, but I stand by my opinion that a two week course would churn out nothing but liabilities on the hoof.


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## JPINFV (Feb 27, 2008)

There is no guarentee that the 3 month program has any long clinical time. I took a semester long program and only was required to have 8 hours on an ambulance and 8 hours in the ER. 

Now I'll be honest, I'll be the first one to come out and state that the EMT-B cirriculum is too short, both diadatic and clinical time. You simply can't learn the science during clinicals and you can't learn how to apply the science during diadatics. Hence both should be longer. I would love to see an extensive amount of time on A/P and would love to see clinicals in places outside of the ER and ambulance [psych ward, for example]. 

I don't necessarily buy, though, that 2 courses with the same amount of hours is going to necessarily differ because one is spread out over 3 months and the other is condensed.


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## DocPetey (Feb 27, 2008)

I think, perhaps, we are arguing semantics.

My point was, no one can get sufficient training in two weeks regardless of the amount of class hours.  I don't care if you go eight hours a day, for fourteen days.  It's not going to work, not without concurrent practical time.

In the Army, their most basic course, the Combat Life Saver, which every soldier must pass, includes 40 hours of practical field time _after_ an extensive classroom course.

Why should civilian medics be any less trained?  Granted, we're not working in a combat theater of operations, but many of the injuries we respond to are similar.

Perhaps the issue isn't that it's only two weeks long.  It's that there is simply no way to properly train in that amount of time.


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## JPINFV (Feb 27, 2008)

I'll definately agree that any course that can be fit in 2 weeks (be it 2 weeks or spread out in 3 months) is two short for a medical provider.


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## So. IL Medic (Feb 27, 2008)

Medicine Man, something to consider...

The best physicians, PA's, and nurses I have worked with 'came up through the ranks.' That is, they were medics before they went on for further training. It shows in their demeanor, their superior patient relationships, their wider knowledge base, their ability to handle stressfull, hard calls, their skills.

It might help you in the long run to dive into EMS for a few years before med school. When you start med school, you'll have an advantage in your grasp of clinical thinking, skills, and patient care. AS a better student, you can become a better physician.


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## VentMedic (Feb 27, 2008)

So. IL Medic said:


> It might help you in the long run to dive into EMS for a few years before med school. When you start med school, you'll have an advantage in your grasp of clinical thinking, skills, and patient care. AS a better student, you can become a better physician.



I would disagree in delaying med school to work as an EMT or even a Paramedic.  

There is a big difference from the clinical thinking done in the field and the Critical Care thinking needed to be a physician.  That is why some Paramedics also have a difficult time making the transition to being on CCT or a nurse in a critical care unit. 

12 years of one's life will be invested in medical school and residency.  Being a nurse or paramedic is not a prerequisite.  Many believe that working in the field first helps them and it may offer some advantages. But, eventually time slips away and they still find themselves not going for the med school dream.  If the chance to go to med school is now, then do it.   In med school there'll be opportunities for you to get hours in various clinics to get hands on patient experience long before you start residency.  

Taking an EMT course is not that big of a deal if you want an introductory to a few basic rescue skills.   You could also pick up a lot of the same stuff at the Red Cross on weekends and do volunteer work for them.   Your goals seem to be bigger than working full time for an ambulance and there is nothing wrong with exploring different modalities in healthcare even if it is for a short time.  

If your life's ambition was to be a Paramedic, then yes you should build a more solid foundation. But, your foundation is already in the sciences with the prep you have probably already done in high school to beef up your academic resume for entrance into a decent pre-med program which is even heavier.  For you, reading 100 - 200 pages and retaining the information every day is probably no big deal for you by now. 

Maybe you should visit the campus of a medical school and talk to people who have actually "been there and done that".  You would be surprised at what ambitious people can do when they have a dream.


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## rmellish (Feb 28, 2008)

Being Pre-Med I'd assume you would have absolutely no problems with the "book" work side of the course. EMT-B is not very in depth and frankly does not require much if any background knowledge to utilize. 

The real challenge for EMT-B is the skills, and combining them with the book concepts. Assessment, immobilization, patient interaction, ALS assist, etc. 

The best way to learn and master these skills is by doing. If you truly understand the "book" side of the course when you exit the program and can find a service which is willing and able to give you substantial on the job training, I don't see why you couldn't become a good EMT. The key is this, understanding that the books are only half (Some would argue less) of the equation.

It all depends on the person, their motivation, and their work ethic.


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## griz1974 (Mar 4, 2008)

*2 weeks*

i think two weeks is a short time for alot of info pre med or not remember doctors usually dont see pt in the field and we really dont want them to but it is up to u and how comfortalbe u fell with it all we can do is give advice good or bad good luck and god bless


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