# Afghan medical mission ends in death for 10



## enjoynz (Aug 7, 2010)

News articles as attached:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Htg66NqeG2I

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-taliban-ambush-20100808,0,1161367.story

Enjoynz


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## akflightmedic (Aug 7, 2010)

*Martyrs in Afghanistan*

I posted this thread on another site, so I have copied and pasted my same words.

I am sure this story will generate some interesting responses and this is more of a rant for me than anything else

http://www.wesh.com/...543/detail.html

A medical team was killed in Afghanistan today. They were non profit, good heart people. I knew Dr. Woo and she did some very good work, especially with the women of Afghan and getting them competent medical care.

However, at what point do we start to think we are invincible? Is it because we are medical and being charitable or because in this case, we have "God" on our side..which spins me up even more, as if he picks and chooses.

Anyways, aside from giving care to remote areas, they preached. You can not preach in these people's back yards. What gives you the right to come to their country and then try to sway them from their beliefs? This is what pisses me off the most about faith based charities as their services come with a price.

Those who are religious of course will say they were doing their "calling" and it was time for them to go home to their maker. Hell of a way to exit the planet for doing such good deeds on his behalf, but I digress.

In the end, we all have martyrs and we all have fanatics...yet this will be more justified than the "other people's methods.


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## firetender (Aug 7, 2010)

*The Tragedy of Choice*

Clearly, no one doing medical intervention should be shot on the job. Especially in the field when you are called upon to render aid. But you cannot eliminate the power of choice in this one. 

It would have to take a real numbskull to go over "there" (anywhere) in the midst of war and think they would NOT get killed or worse. Personnally I don't give a damn whose side they were on, what God they worshiped, who sent them there, why, how, when they got popped or in whose name, it's all very simple.
_*
They put themselves in danger during time of war and lost. Period.*_

So it goes.

Now the stuff that amuses me is that all sides will claim them as Martyrs for the cause (even EMTs!) as conveniently defined by the individual group. 

Assuming a certain amount of Religious fervor went in to their task, I'd say it might be fair to congratulate them because they showed the abject cruelty of the other side and that proves the purity of their own beliefs; a Lamb to the Slaughter kinda thing.

Yet, Death sucks enough on its own without politicizing every one!


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## jjesusfreak01 (Aug 7, 2010)

I don't want to argue against anyone with more info than me, but the original article states that the Taliban "claimed" they preached, while another article I read quotes the director of the aid organisation saying that they absolutely don't preach on these aid trips. Seems like they were doing nothing but giving medical care, and were accompanied by Muslim Afghan translators, who probably wouldn't have assisted their preaching.


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## mycrofft (Aug 7, 2010)

*Confirm JJ's note. And they question if it really was Taliban.*

Sportsfans, as impossible as it is for we Americans to understand it, there are folks out there who live and thrive on chaos as long as they land on top.


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## akflightmedic (Aug 8, 2010)

jjesusfreak01 said:


> I don't want to argue against anyone with more info than me, but the original article states that the Taliban "claimed" they preached, while another article I read quotes the director of the aid organisation saying that they absolutely don't preach on these aid trips. Seems like they were doing nothing but giving medical care, and were accompanied by Muslim Afghan translators, who probably wouldn't have assisted their preaching.



They also had boxes of Bibles in Dari...the local language. Yep, no intent on preaching or converting there. 

An agency that garners all it's financial support from religious groups and donors,  then claims to not "preach" while on medical missions. Sounds fishy, no?

If they admitted to preaching, they would be thrown out of the country again like when the Taliban was in control, so no they can not ever say they were. If they were thrown out, how would they ever impose the word again?

I recall someone saying they smoked but did not inhale too yet we didn't buy that for a second now, did we?

In regards to the Muslim Afghan translators...they work very closely day in and day out with this organization. It is amazing how a few dollars a day can change a man's life for himself and his family in this impoverished country. Let me put it this way...if I were absolutely broke, no job, no money, kids starving...I would absolutely become the best Christian possible and milk every single agency that would help me because MY FAMILY is number one.

I would do anything to ensure their survival or better their conditions. Having said that, after my Christian conversion, if I suddenly found myself staring down the barrel of those immoral/amoral atheists who start wars and create violence all the time, I think I would easily be able to "revert" back and say all the right things to ensure my survival. Again, my family would need me alive and of course the individual survival instinct kicks in at that time as well. 

So, no that piece of "evidence" about the translators...just does not work.


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## akflightmedic (Aug 8, 2010)

mycrofft said:


> Sportsfans, as impossible as it is for we Americans to understand it, there are folks out there who live and thrive on chaos as long as they land on top.



I sincerely hope you are including Americans in that distinction.


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## Aidey (Aug 8, 2010)

I agree that it is very unfortunate that people who were providing desperately needed medical care were killed. 

I'm with AK and Firetender on this one though. As was pointed out, it is a war zone. If you are in an anti-Christian country and you even mention the word "god" prepare to run into problems, whether you preach or not. Acknowledging there is an alternative theory is enough justification for someone to be shot by an extremist.


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## akflightmedic (Aug 8, 2010)

Aidey said:


> I agree that it is very unfortunate that people who were providing desperately needed medical care were killed.
> 
> I'm with AK and Firetender on this one though. As was pointed out, it is a war zone. If you are in an anti-Christian country and you even mention the word "god" prepare to run into problems, whether you preach or not. Acknowledging there is an alternative theory is enough justification for someone to be shot by an extremist.



Why does their defense of the faith have to be extremist? Just asking out loud here...why do we make their approach any less moral or acceptable than ours?

Were the early Christians not as extreme? Did the only reason the christian faith survive and expand due to "extremism"? (Think Crusades)

So if it were not for extremism, would we even be having this discussion today? So based on that historical evidence, would it not be prudent for them to now display their own extremism to protect their belief systems?

Just asking...


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## Aidey (Aug 8, 2010)

Extremist wasn't the best word, but I couldn't think of a better substitute.


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## mycrofft (Aug 8, 2010)

*The folks were robbed and their driver is under arrest.*

Just another day in the Fourth World.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/08/world/asia/08afghan.html
The_* anonymous person *_claiming responsibility for the Taliban claimed there was _*a*_ (_singular_) Dari bible, as well as spy maps of fortifications, and they were shot trying to escape. Other sources said they were lined up and executed.

If you see someone from another faith on your block you don't shoot them, then steal their wallets. Militarist faction Islam is what put two airliners into NYC, one into the Pentagon, and another targeted for who knows where before it was crashed. Nothing but no-class murdering thieves wrapping themselves in the cloak of Islamic "purity".

It took seven hundred years to reclaim Europe from the Moorish invasion (it is only five hundred and change since that occured), the Crusades in response were a masterpiece of wasted lives and greed; no one has a lock on religious violence. But when people are being lined up and shot for their wristwatches...spare me


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## akflightmedic (Aug 8, 2010)

Are we reading the same article you linked?

The Taliban spokesman, Zabiullah Mujahid claimed responsibility on behalf of the Taliban.

Nothing mentioned about robbery but it is not uncommon to take what you can to finance future attacks as the dead do not need to tell time.

In addition, no mention of a driver being held.

What are you quoting???


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## enjoynz (Aug 8, 2010)

I wasn't expecting posting this news article to start a religlous debate.
My personal feeling about such things is everyone has a right to believe in whatever religion they which.
You should not push your religion onto others unless they are willing recievers and want to know about it.
Almost all wars on this planet of ours have been started by religion of one form or another, or misunderstanding another man's culture. 
You'd think in this modern age of technology that we have grown enough to see through such prejudice behaviour...
but alas it still goes on, thousands of years down the track.

'United Nations' and 'Human Rights' was set up after the second world war, so that the next generation would understand and not have to deal with the mistakes of the past.
At least that is my understanding as to why it was started.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but even in the wars gone by, there seemed to be a code that...the medic's, red cross, ambulance, mash units....
were not targets to be shot at or bombed.
I'm sure that the medical team in this case knew the dangers they were working under and the risks they took.
Cold blooded murder of civilians, whether they are foreigners or not, is still pretty cowardly,
especially when they are there trying to help your own people!


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## Veneficus (Aug 8, 2010)

When doing "God's work" has it ever occured to anyone that the original physicians as we celebrate in medicine were polytheistic Greeks?

Preaching or not I agree with firetender. 

When in a war zone everyone is a target. From "civilians," (which I don't think there are any in that part of the world) to militia, doctors, aid workers, etc, a person should expect they might get killed.

In war there is no right or wrong, good or bad, there is simply us and them.

News flash, whether from inaccurate propaganda, ignorance, envy, or whatever the reason, people in that section of the world are genrally anti west. 

If medical providers go there and try to demonstrate our compassion and people start to identify or have sympathy with/about the west, it hurts the cause of those who want to perpetuate the conflict. They kill people for stuff like that.

If you hae a look in the glass, we are not much different. We have a habit of locking up, killing, and even torturing people we think hurts our cause.

all is fair in love and war.


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## billincie (Aug 9, 2010)

What does one do if you run across a Taliban medical unit on your way to work?..  Giving away the Qur'an in english... Carrying loads of commmunications equipment? It's sad.


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## akflightmedic (Aug 9, 2010)

billincie said:


> What does one do if you run across a Taliban medical unit on your way to work?..  Giving away the Qur'an in english... Carrying loads of commmunications equipment? It's sad.



We kill them.


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## mycrofft (Aug 9, 2010)

*Dropped by.*

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=129047100


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