# Medical Marijuana perscriped to kids with ADHD



## bunkie (Nov 24, 2009)

http://www.sphere.com/2009/11/24/marijuana-prescribed-to-kids-with-adhd/

Setting aside the medical marijuana debate, what are your thoughts on giving it to kids?


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## RyanMidd (Nov 25, 2009)

Maybe I'm a traditionalist, or maybe I'm just a mean guy, but I firmly believe that modern medicine treats FAR too many diagnoses pharmaceutically instead of homeopathically or rehabilitatively.

These same conditions were present in children a hundred years ago, and I doubt that even recognized and accepted disorders were given as much pharmacological intervention as many of today's plethora of "day-to-day disorders", to coin a phrase.

I understand that pharmaceutical technology has come a long way since many of these conditions came to light, but I don't believe prescription pads should be the first avenue taken when dealing with these types of disorders. 

Every drug has adverse effects. There are no exceptions to this rule. Its just a matter of which side effects you are willing to deal with in lieu of the original disease. There are other, more wholesome ways to deal with ADHD & similar behavioral malaises, and thousands of families are able to manage or even eliminate the problem with the help of psychology, counselling, or lifestyle changes as simple as finding creative outlets or changing diet.

I don't mean to make light of disorders like this, and I understand their validity and veracity, but I view pharmacological intervention as the last line of defense against conditions and diseases otherwise incompatible with a productive and happy life. Drugs aren't magical cures.


I sometimes surprise myself with how strongly my replies resemble rants...oh well, its what I believe, and its an online forum. I'm entitled, damn it!

Edit: To more specifically address the marijuana & kids topic, I believe that if you are forced to consider chemical intervention, I suppose there are greater evils than oral sprays or gels containing THC (which I understand are the most common form of "medicinal Mary Jane" these days). I have a few adult acquaintances that have marijuana regimens in the management of pain, but I suppose if it is deemed useful in the management of ADD/ADHD, then it should be used solely on a case-by-case trial basis. If it works, and it works well, great; monitor and document its use carefully. If it does not seem to have an impact on your child's condition, then drop it and consider something else. Just because you are forced to take medication doesn't mean it should be given ad nauseum.


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## Summit (Nov 25, 2009)

I support the idea of medicinal marijuana. I also have ADD. I imagine THC would be the absolute worst drug you could possibly give someone to alleviate ADD symptoms.

Someone needs to take their medical licenses.


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## spinnakr (Nov 25, 2009)

I also support the idea of medical marijuana.
I also think this is highly unintelligent.
My mom has been working in special ed all her life and would go absolutely bonkers if any of her kids were on maryjoe, medical or not.  They've got enough problems already - they don't need to be perpetually stoned on top of it.


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## RyanMidd (Nov 25, 2009)

spinnakr said:


> I also support the idea of medical marijuana.
> I also think this is highly unintelligent.
> My mom has been working in special ed all her life and would go absolutely bonkers if any of her kids were on maryjoe, medical or not.  They've got enough problems already - they don't need to be perpetually stoned on top of it.



My mom has also worked with special needs people forever, from babies to boomers, and I think she'd agree that most kids don't need medication, they need personalized learning & rehab plans. Some kids need it, but often the side-effects are of the same severity as the illness. But paramount, I think she'd say that the number of kids who need to smoke a bowl is comparable to the number who need a shot of espresso and a puppy.


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## Seaglass (Nov 25, 2009)

RyanMidd said:


> My mom has also worked with special needs people forever, from babies to boomers, and I think she'd agree that most kids don't need medication, they need personalized learning & rehab plans. Some kids need it, but often the side-effects are of the same severity as the illness. But paramount, I think she'd say that the number of kids who need to smoke a bowl is comparable to the number who need a shot of espresso and a puppy.



I did a few years of working with special ed lower school kids way back when I wanted to teach, and those sound like wise words to me. A lot of high school-level kids at the place where I worked were trying to get off meds or find something cheaper before college, and the process gave them all kinds of hell. 

THC really doesn't strike me as a great idea for long-term use with ADD symptoms, either, as the article and others have already mentioned.


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## Aidey (Nov 25, 2009)

As someone with ADD I think this is a horrendous idea. I do support the idea of medical marijuana for the treatment of some things, but I DO NOT support the idea that it is some kind of panacea. 

Without getting too technical, ADD/ADHD is thought to be to be an issue with dopamine and the reward centers in the brain. Ritalin and Adderall both stimulate dopamine, leveling everything out. In my 10 minutes of quick research on medical marijuana there really wasn't any information on what affect it has on dopamine, which makes me wonder what mechanism of action the doctors are expecting it to have. 

Yes, a lot of pharmaceuticals have side affects, but at least they have been studied and tested in kids. Medical marijuana hasn't really even been extensively tested (in scientific, controlled tests) in adults, let alone kids. Which I think is a good reason to gather more information before handing it out.

Ryan, before chalking ADD and disorders like it up to "behavioral" issues, do some research on ADD, addiction, and psych disorders like anxiety, depression, and eating disorders and the roles of neurotransmitters in those issues. Yes, they primarily manifest as behavioral issues, but the cause of them is much more rooted in physical problems than you might think.


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## Shishkabob (Nov 25, 2009)

There isn't a single thing marijuana can do that a legal drug, either a derivative of THC or otherwise, cannot do.  Not a single thing.  


Peoples beliefs on validity of ADD/ADHD existing aside, I was diagnosed with ADHD back in 4th grade.  Put on Ritalin, had bad side effects, and taken off within a month.  Went the rest of my school career without any drugs, and actually graduated highschool early, with honors.


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## RyanMidd (Nov 26, 2009)

RyanMidd said:


> I don't mean to make light of disorders like this, and I understand their validity and veracity



I didn't mean to make them out to be solely behavioral. I understand the rudimentaries of the disease and its most common S&S. What I meant to point out is that they are trying to use chemical intervention for a medical problem that is often successfully dealt with in other ways. Sorry for the misunderstanding.


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## fortsmithman (Nov 26, 2009)

Linuss said:


> There isn't a single thing marijuana can do that a legal drug, either a derivative of THC or otherwise, cannot do.  Not a single thing.
> 
> 
> Peoples beliefs on validity of ADD/ADHD existing aside, I was diagnosed with ADHD back in 4th grade.  Put on Ritalin, had bad side effects, and taken off within a month.  Went the rest of my school career without any drugs, and actually graduated highschool early, with honors.




I agree with linuss on this topic.


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## Michael Sykes (Nov 26, 2009)

fortsmithman said:


> I agree with linuss on this topic.



My grandson was diagnosed with ADHD, takes Ritalin, and it has been a Godsend. Regarding medical marijuana, I understand it is now available in tablet form, so kids wouldn't have to worry about toking a bowl in class. I disagree with this use, however; I think it's just another way for the pharmaceutical companies to get rich at the expense of our kids. It also makes it too easy for teachers to "label" the kids, tell the prents to get them on something, and then :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: because the kids sit in class like zombies.


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## Aidey (Nov 26, 2009)

Are you referring to Marinol Michael? Someone else jump in here if I'm mistaken, but I thought Marinol basically only had the anti-nausea and increased appetite affects of Marijuana? Or is it that those are just the diagnoses it is supposed to be used to treat?


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## Michael Sykes (Nov 27, 2009)

Aidey said:


> Are you referring to Marinol Michael? Someone else jump in here if I'm mistaken, but I thought Marinol basically only had the anti-nausea and increased appetite affects of Marijuana? Or is it that those are just the diagnoses it is supposed to be used to treat?



I really couldn't tell you; I've just heard that there was a tablet form as well. If all they wanted to do was to increase appetite, just give them Prednisone; it's put about 40 pounds on ME. Makes me want to go out and gnaw the bark off the trees.


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## nomofica (Nov 29, 2009)

Drugs like medicinal marijuana and Ritalin is, in most cases, like a band-aid on a broken bone.


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## Jeffrey_169 (Jan 12, 2010)

RyanMidd said:


> Maybe I'm a traditionalist, or maybe I'm just a mean guy, but I firmly believe that modern medicine treats FAR too many diagnoses pharmaceutically instead of homeopathically or rehabilitatively.
> 
> These same conditions were present in children a hundred years ago, and I doubt that even recognized and accepted disorders were given as much pharmacological intervention as many of today's plethora of "day-to-day disorders", to coin a phrase.
> 
> ...



I am sorry to say, but i am glad to finally happy to someone agree with me. Some of these kids do need meds, but very few. I did a term paper on this last semester for my psychology, and believe it or not 99% of these meds have never been tested on children. They have no studies on how it effects the developing brain, and there have been numerous case where they caused death and bran damage. 

The put these children on this stuff, and when side effects arise they prescribe something for them, and then they have to prescribe something for the side effects of them and before long these children are zombies and on 8 or 9 meds that are not intended for the pediatric patient. 

Symptoms of ADD are: inability to sit still for several minutes, hyperactivity, inability to stay focused for more then a few minutes, and fidgityness. Hmmm, correct me if I am wrong but isn't this also symptomatic of CHILDHOOD!!! 

There was an article I stumbled upon about a child in NY. The school told the child's parents that if they didn't put her on Ridilin she would have to dropout of school. After a couple of weeks the child was a complete zombie, and her grades dropped so low mom decided to take her daughter off the meds. The child"s grades began to improve, and when the teacher asked her what had changed, the child informed her of her mothers decision. The teacher and administrator threatened to call CPS if she didn't start taking the meds, even though her grades were worsening and she was a zombie on them. This is bologna..kids will be kids, get over it or don't have em.


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## atlasD (Jan 13, 2010)

I have ADD and I smoked marijuana a few times in high school.  Most of these times were just before school coincidently enough.  All of these occasions I found myself incredibly more focused on lectures and school work.  Also I started to notice that friends that also had ADD, had quite similar experiences after smoking marijuana.  We didn't have the common giggly all over the place high.  I thought I found the miracle drug (illegally), because even then I wasn't up to getting hooked on pharm.  Personally, I found that there was a fine line between smoking enough so to focus and smoking into hyper paranoid focus off to oblivion.  Difference between the focus required to do algebra homework and the focus to concentrate on house noises.  This fine line, plus the legal implications and how it would affect me physically - I chose to continue finding my own way to learn sans illegal/legal drugs.

I can definitely see how medicinal marijuana can help those with ADD - just based on my experience.  To prescribe it to a child just seems unethical though.  Then again, I feel that way about most psychiatric pharmaceuticals given to children as kids today are far far far too over prescribed.


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## Veneficus (Jan 13, 2010)

Jeffrey_169 said:


> I am sorry to say, but i am glad to finally happy to someone agree with me. Some of these kids do need meds, but very few. I did a term paper on this last semester for my psychology, and believe it or not 99% of these meds have never been tested on children. They have no studies on how it effects the developing brain, and there have been numerous case where they caused death and bran damage.
> 
> The put these children on this stuff, and when side effects arise they prescribe something for them, and then they have to prescribe something for the side effects of them and before long these children are zombies and on 8 or 9 meds that are not intended for the pediatric patient.
> 
> ...



Well said...

As for the effects of THC, the drug is a neuromodulator (specifically GABA) and an endogenous form, endocannaboid, is produced in the CNS. (just like endorphins) The drug has several medical uses.

The major issues with using it prescriptively is the side effects as well as abuse potential. 

Effects such as hallucinations, decrease in muscle strength and fine motor activity, delusions, and psychosis do not contribute to an active and socially productive life. 

Many of the patient populations that THC is indicated for are disabled already or declining in function and will no longer be expected to produce for society.  

It would seem soley on the medical merits, THC would not be a good choice of treatment to improve patient functions.  

I do not agree that these diseases have been around for ever a sstated. The science of paleopathology is quite advanced and I have learned in my studies many diseases, similar to obesity, have been shown to be created or exacerbated by Homo Sapiens' direct alteration of its environment. 

If you look at the anthropological studies of PTSD, it is a disease of modern man. As society becomes more removed from the hostilities of the natural world, an increase in cases and severity follows almost a linear progression. Almost unheard of in the time of the Napoleonic wars but started to appear in WWI. Today consider the number of individuals affected and causes. It is a disease of the 20 and 21 century. 

I suspect many "attention" and other disorders are also a recent product of advancements in the 20 and 21 century. Consider for example "play behavior" in primates. It is the primary method of social interaction and learning. How many schools have done away with recess? In the effort to "get ahead" how much mental and sociological dysfunction is created with the reduction of "play time?" How about the modification of play from personal social interaction to an isolated electronic format?

It would be great if there was a pill that could solve these problems. I doubt it will be the case ever. By the time you solve today's problems, new ones will be showing up. I think the real question that has to be addressed is: "Is modern medicine capable of addressing these illnesses at all?"

I'd share my opinions, but they are quite lengthy to type out here. I use enough space as it is.


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