# Tactical EMT Class



## dank (Feb 4, 2015)

Does anyone know of any tactcical EMT class in or around Maryland where one can get certified to be a tactical EMT.  I'm already an state certified EMT-B.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 4, 2015)

What do you think a "tactical" emt class will do for you?


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## InNoViSiOn (Feb 4, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> What do you think a "tactical" emt class will do for you?



So he can be certified as a tactical EMT of course! Duh.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 4, 2015)

The idea that anything 5 days long teaches anything 'tactical' just screams money-making bs...also the tccc powerpoints are online and free to read if you want to save some money and realise how little is actually taught...maybe some pictures of people getting shot by snipers is worth the money.

Ive spent 12 years operating in various roles and I don't ever remember seeing or using the word tactical. My advise is do a paramedic course, or use the money to goto a country with a high volume of trauma patients and you'll benefit much more greatly.


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## chaz90 (Feb 4, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> The idea that anything 5 days long teaches anything 'tactical' just screams money-making bs...also the tccc powerpoints are online and free to read if you want to save some money and realise how little is actually taught...maybe some pictures of people getting shot by snipers is worth the money.
> 
> Ive spent 12 years operating in various roles and I don't ever remember seeing or using the word tactical. My advise is do a paramedic course, or use the money to goto a country with a high volume of trauma patients and you'll benefit much more greatly.


NREMT sells subdued tactical patches, so it must be legit! Don't try to trick me and keep me out of your tacticool club. My bulletproof vest and fanny pack are ready to go.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 4, 2015)

I wonder how long before you get paramedics responding to active shooter scenes dressed in the same way as PD (I know what you're thinking 'but i don't see any cops in this photo only trees')


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## NomadicMedic (Feb 4, 2015)

I'd pay big money for an EMS ghillie suit.


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## redundantbassist (Feb 4, 2015)

DEmedic said:


> I'd pay big money for an EMS ghillie suit.


With a big blue star of life on it... lol


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## InNoViSiOn (Feb 4, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> I wonder how long before you get paramedics responding to active shooter scenes dressed in the same way as PD (I know what you're thinking 'but i don't see any cops in this photo only trees')
> 
> View attachment 1781



I'll match you ghillie suit with fat tacticool multicam cop and raise you backwards eotech


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 4, 2015)

Makes me wanna vomit


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## NomadicMedic (Feb 4, 2015)

As long as I get one of these...


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## InNoViSiOn (Feb 4, 2015)

In all seriouness would the international school of tactical medicine be the closes you can get without joining the military or law enforcement SWAT medic?


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## chaz90 (Feb 4, 2015)

InNoViSiOn said:


> In all seriouness would the international school of tactical medicine be the closes you can get without joining the military or law enforcement SWAT medic?


I think the point is that none of these schools or certifications is going to matter as much to anyone seeking medical personnel for the few true "tactical" roles that exist. In that business more than perhaps any other, who you know, where you've been, and what experience you already have matters more than words and abbreviations on a resume. 

My impression has always been if one really wants to get into this realm, military and possibly LE experience is a necessary pre-req. Particularly now that most jobs in these fields have dried up, any other shortcuts people are looking for just seem like attempts at avoiding the longer and more difficult path.


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## InNoViSiOn (Feb 4, 2015)

chaz90 said:


> I think the point is that none of these schools or certifications is going to matter as much to anyone seeking medical personnel for the few true "tactical" roles that exist. In that business more than perhaps any other, who you know, where you've been, and what experience you already have matters more than words and abbreviations on a resume.
> 
> My impression has always been if one really wants to get into this realm, military and possibly LE experience is a necessary pre-req. Particularly now that most jobs in these fields have dried up, any other shortcuts people are looking for just seem like attempts at avoiding the longer and more difficult path.



Oh no i realize that and completely agree. Was just asking if their modules are something worth going to that anyone with the dough to drop on it assuming their department doesnt pay would be a suitable option. Of course it wont count as any type of certification or anything...


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## Chewy20 (Feb 5, 2015)

Do not waste your time or money. If your department has tactical medics they will be trained by your cities SWAT team and work closely with them. Our tactical medics actually are used a ton for a number of different things, and when they arnt doing that, they are rotating between training and working normal ALS trucks.


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## dank (Feb 5, 2015)

So what you are telling me is that, an EMT off the street, who wants to be a tactical EMT needs no tactical experience, no formal training and will be able to pick up a tatical EMT position and the SWAT team will train you.  Seems a little to far out there.


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## NomadicMedic (Feb 5, 2015)

No. What he's saying is; If you get a job with a service that uses Tactical EMTs, and you're  selected to join the team, you'll be trained. 

Until then, don't waste your money.


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## STXmedic (Feb 5, 2015)

Chewy20 said:


> Do not waste your time or money. If your department has tactical medics they will be trained by your cities SWAT team and work closely with them. Our tactical medics actually are used a ton for a number of different things, and when they arnt doing that, they are rotating between training and working normal ALS trucks.


This. We go through a couple of outside classes, but nearly the entirety of our training is with our SWAT team. The BS card classes we go through really didn't teach anything that wasn't common sense; they're just a box to check.


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## Chewy20 (Feb 5, 2015)

dank said:


> So what you are telling me is that, an EMT off the street, who wants to be a tactical EMT needs no tactical experience, no formal training and will be able to pick up a tatical EMT position and the SWAT team will train you.  Seems a little to far out there.


 
Nope, you have to tryout and then pass all their training.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 5, 2015)

I'd also hazard to use the term 'SWAT' loosely too. Some standards, training and members of swat swat teams are excellent, others are still called 'SWAT' but the only accurate part of that would be the 'special' part....


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## dank (Feb 10, 2015)

So, the https://contoms.chepinc.org/EMT-TRegistration.html is not worth anything.  Not worth the money.


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## WildlandEMT89 (Feb 10, 2015)

dank said:


> So, the https://contoms.chepinc.org/EMT-TRegistration.html is not worth anything.  Not worth the money.



Indeed. Unless your job requires it of you. As others have said, any job where you are going to need to have these skills will train you to have these skills.


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## cprted (Feb 10, 2015)

dank said:


> So, the https://contoms.chepinc.org/EMT-TRegistration.html is not worth anything.  Not worth the money.


Save your money.


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## Luno (Feb 10, 2015)

dank said:


> So, the https://contoms.chepinc.org/EMT-TRegistration.html is not worth anything.  Not worth the money.


 
It is, if you can verify the need to attend, by the sponsoring agency, on agency letterhead... please see below...  FYI, I'm still trying to get .mil to pay for me to attend...  

*Letter of Affiliation: *Applicants must submit a signed and authorized letter of affiliation from their sponsoring agency on agency letterhead stating that the applicant works with the agency and has a legitimate need for this training based on that work. *The letter of affiliation must be uploaded at the time of application.*


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## dank (Feb 11, 2015)

I have been in a situation where we were not allowed to go into the "hot zone" because we did not have the training.  We were told they would bring the people out to us.  In a matter of life and death we should not have to wait for people to be brought to us.

"Indeed. Unless your job requires it of you. As others have said, any job where you are going to need to have these skills will train you to have these skills."  Not necessarily, my department does not have the resources and my academy does not offer a class.


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## luke_31 (Feb 11, 2015)

If it's a hot zone there isn't much we would be doing other than pulling the people out to a safer area to treat them. The most that would be done in the hot zone is some bandaging to try and stop the bleeding and basic airway maneuvers to see if the patient can breathe on their own. The Closest EMS should really be on a scene is the warm zone, going into the hot zone doesn't do anyone any good, it's just adding to the potential body count. Most EMS agencies that are involved in situations like that will wait for the area to be deemed safe. Although now there is a push for EMS to get brought in faster to try and provide care for people down, they are still only going to the areas that have already had the primary search done, and the perpetrators are not suspected to be in.  Even then they go in with LE who provide security and at any time can pull EMS out if the scene safety changes.  Bottom line EMS isn't trained for providing treatment under hostile fire and shouldn't be. The amount of times that having EMS right on top of where the bullets are flying will make a difference isn't worth the overall risk. These situations really end up needing a trauma surgeon more than an EMS provider. If your set on getting this type of training the military is the primary place to get it. Police departments that have medics with their SWAT teams tend to have them as officers first and medics second.  There are some EMS agencies that provide medics, but like others have said the agencies will provide the training needed and tend to use paramedics to provide the care.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 11, 2015)

No offence, but wanting to attend a 4 day course just to be able to enter a contact situation is the worst idea possible. 

Also cant imagine how that would even work- " you guys cant come in youre not trained"
"Hey i did my 4 day emt tacti-crap course though!"


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## Ewok Jerky (Feb 11, 2015)

My guess is that its more about the patch than it is about the work.  Seriously, if you want to get shot at join the military.  

EMS should not be in the hot zone. Maybe in the warm zone as long as you are moving in the direction of the cold zone quickly.


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## Luno (Feb 11, 2015)

dank said:


> I have been in a situation where we were not allowed to go into the "hot zone" because we did not have the training. We were told they would bring the people out to us. In a matter of life and death we should not have to wait for people to be brought to us.


 
And unfortunately, this is where the ignorance begins, I would recommend some TC3 long before anyone decides they should be a "tactical medic."  Concern for the patients in their "life or death" crisis only lasts as long as I do not have a "life or death" crisis.  There also seems to be a misunderstanding of the risks that bringing in an untrained bandaid slinger bring.  Even the benefits to the team for a "trained" bandaid slinger don't out weigh the risk of bringing one.  That being said, it isn't a terrible idea to have a team member trained on medical emergencies, but I'm pretty sure that I've posted about this before.  On the other side, of all courses you decide bring up, it is the grand-daddy...


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## Jim37F (Feb 11, 2015)

The system our FD and PD is looking at (last I heard) calls for only PD in the hot zone, with a "hunter" team(s) whose sole job is to find and neutralize the threat (at most tossing a TQ to casualties and telling them put it on, if that) while they move towards the suspect(s)) with Rescue teams (PD only) to grab casualties and pull them out. Plus Rescue Task Forces of mixed PD/FD operating in the warm zone to do limited treatment on casualties (basically control hemorrhaging) and pull them to the cold zone where triage/treatment is.


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## Tigger (Feb 11, 2015)

dank said:


> I have been in a situation where we were not allowed to go into the "hot zone" because we did not have the training.  We were told they would bring the people out to us.  In a matter of life and death we should not have to wait for people to be brought to us.
> 
> "Indeed. Unless your job requires it of you. As others have said, any job where you are going to need to have these skills will train you to have these skills."  Not necessarily, my department does not have the resources and my academy does not offer a class.


If you don't have the ability to defend yourself you are just a liability to everyone else.


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## DesertMedic66 (Feb 11, 2015)

Entering a hot zone without a weapon is like entering a HazMat hot zone with a N95. There is a very good chance it's going to end ugly.


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## MackTheKnife (Feb 11, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> What do you think a "tactical" emt class will do for you?


Private Military Contracting hires people to teach TCCC without having the NAEMT credential. An EMT with a Tactical course can get hired. That's one thing you can do with it.


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## Jim37F (Feb 11, 2015)

Where I can see some guys who aren't trained or handle weapons with any sort of regularity not wanting to deal with one all of a sudden, especially when there's a team of cops providing security, that being said:





Tigger said:


> If you don't have the ability to defend yourself you are just a liability to everyone else.





DesertEMT66 said:


> Entering a hot zone without a weapon is like entering a HazMat hot zone with a N95. There is a very good chance it's going to end ugly.


I fully agree with both the above statements. I myself, even if surrounded by 4 SWAT officers in a warm zone that's been cleared...the fact that it's a warm zone means there's still a bad guy/gal with a gun with demonstrated intent to harm me that's not yet been caught...so therefore even with a level III+ hard plate carrier and ballistic helmet, I'd feel naked and vulnerable without a personal defense weapon. I'd be fine with a pistol, or even if they want to get all hooah tacti-cool and give me a SMG or carbine, I could work with that slung on my back (in a TCCC role with a dedicated security element in a civilian TEMS environment I'd feel better with just a pistol....put me in Afghanistan, give me a foxtrot-ing rifle). A bit of a moot point being that my position is single role EMT my FD would leave me parked in the cold zone and have the FF/Medics assigned to the rescue task forces...but I have a sneaking suspicion that if an active shooter scenario happened tomorrow most of our medics would not want to go into the warm zone leaving PD only rescue teams to haul casualties out to us (unless they called for an LAFD TEMS team).


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 11, 2015)

MackTheKnife said:


> Private Military Contracting hires people to teach TCCC without having the NAEMT credential. An EMT with a Tactical course can get hired. That's one thing you can do with it.



and it doesnt mean i want to work with people with that 'qual'.


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## Handsome Robb (Feb 11, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> I wonder how long before you get paramedics responding to active shooter scenes dressed in the same way as PD (I know what you're thinking 'but i don't see any cops in this photo only trees')
> 
> View attachment 1781



Our TEMS Team wears a very similar uniform to the SWAT Teams they operate with minus the weapon and the medic patches everywhere. 

It's pretty rare for Tac Teams to use anything under Paramedics for the simple fact that crichs and needle decompressions aren't in the scope of EMTs.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 12, 2015)

Handsome Robb said:


> Our TEMS Team wears a very similar uniform to the SWAT Teams they operate with minus the weapon and the medic patches everywhere.
> 
> It's pretty rare for Tac Teams to use anything under Paramedics for the simple fact that crichs and needle decompressions aren't in the scope of EMTs.



A while back I went into a store to get some new clothing for an afghan project, only to find it had been all bought up by the local SWAT team, there is no requirement for cops to dress up in green, khaki or camo gear at all. If the idea is to make an entry in pure stealth, then let the military sf have the job.


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## STXmedic (Feb 12, 2015)

Our guys use green and khaki as their training gear. I might laugh if I saw them in camo, though... Especially on a call.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 12, 2015)

Anything is cool for training, i just think it is easy for certain departments to forget they are there to be positively id'd as police...the universal color is blue generally, as opposed to being geared up like a paramilitary organisation.


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## MackTheKnife (Feb 12, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> and it doesnt mean i want to work with people with that 'qual'.


I should have added that having EMT and a tactical certification alone will not get you hired. Prior experience is a necessity. I worked for a PMC teaching TCCC to SF, SEALS, and OGA' s with "only an EMT" qual. However, as a former Hospital Corpsman (Field Med), former EMT-P, and with tactical experience, I was hired. But I was hired with the EMT qual.


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## dank (Feb 16, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> A while back I went into a store to get some new clothing for an afghan project, only to find it had been all bought up by the local SWAT team, there is no requirement for cops to dress up in green, khaki or camo gear at all. If the idea is to make an entry in pure stealth, then let the military sf have the job.


 The military does not have the legal authority to do that kind of LE.


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## irishboxer384 (Feb 16, 2015)

dank said:


> The military does not have the legal authority to do that kind of LE.



That would depend on the nature of the task if domestic actually, but the gist of my post was that I do not believe police should be geared up like a tier one operator when johnny redneck decides to get drunk and barricade himself and wife in the house.

- no offense to LE or rednecks.


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## Carlos Danger (Feb 16, 2015)

irishboxer384 said:


> I do not believe police should be geared up like a tier one operator when johnny redneck decides to get drunk and barricade himself and wife in the house.



This.


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## bajramkrasniqi (Oct 3, 2015)

Dear colleagues, I need the Tactical Medicine Essentials handbook in pdf format, since there are no agencies who will send it as a hard copy in my country ( Kosovo). Thanks


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