# woman went unresponsive at my job



## wlamoreemtb (Jul 29, 2008)

So today at my job (i work in a restaurant) a woman fell to the floor and went completely unresponsive. When I was told by the manager what happened i immediately went over. pt was lying on the ground unresponsive with extremely shallow resps. 911 was called and i had one of the other employees get my jump bag from my truck. I was told by the friend that was with the woman that she was severely allergic to peanuts. By this time pd was there with o2 and a defib. i  began baging the pt and instructed pd to expedite the ambulance. than the woman went pulseless. I immediately began cpr. I was doing compressions for about 20 mins while the officer bagged the pt. I was told they couldnt get a crew for the rig and had to go mutual aid. so I asked pd to tell dispatch to tone out my squad which is literally 2 mins from my job. The officer than said to me no we are toning out another squad who was 10 mins out. als arrived and took over pt care. than bls arrived another 10 mins later. This was ridiculous having a squad 2 minutes away and them toning out a different one. It was a very aggravating experience and I just need to vent.


----------



## rhan101277 (Jul 29, 2008)

How did the pt. turnout?  Good job on fast acting.


----------



## Airwaygoddess (Jul 29, 2008)

*Good Job!!*

You were at the right place at the right time!!!  Great job!


----------



## BEorP (Jul 29, 2008)

wlamoreemtb said:


> So today at my job (i work in a restaurant) a woman fell to the floor and went completely unresponsive. When I was told by the manager what happened i immediately went over. pt was lying on the ground unresponsive with extremely shallow resps. 911 was called and i had one of the other employees get my jump bag from my truck. I was told by the friend that was with the woman that she was severely allergic to peanuts. By this time pd was there with o2 and a defib. i  began baging the pt and instructed pd to expedite the ambulance. than the woman went pulseless. I immediately began cpr. I was doing compressions for about 20 mins while the officer bagged the pt. I was told *they couldnt get a crew for the rig/b] and had to go mutual aid. so I asked pd to tell dispatch to tone out my squad which is literally 2 mins from my job. The officer than said to me no we are toning out another squad who was 10 mins out. als arrived and took over pt care. than bls arrived another 10 mins later. This was ridiculous having a squad 2 minutes away and them toning out a different one. It was a very aggravating experience and I just need to vent.*


*
Seems to be a final nail in the coffin of anyone who still thinks that ambulances should be staffed by volunteers.

You didn't mention using the AED. Did you apply it? Did you deliver any shocks?*


----------



## firecoins (Jul 30, 2008)

get rid of volunteers. Its bout time.


----------



## MagicTyler (Jul 30, 2008)

30 Minutes before any ems arrived? Where do you live?


----------



## Flight-LP (Jul 30, 2008)

Good 'ol NJ..................


----------



## wlamoreemtb (Jul 30, 2008)

the pt did end up surviving ..... WOW!   i talked to the medics last night


----------



## enjoynz (Jul 30, 2008)

wlamoreemtb said:


> the pt did end up surviving ..... WOW!   i talked to the medics last night



Good job on your quick response with CPR!!!!.
Just one thought though. Did the patient not carry an epi-pen with her, for her allergy to peanuts?:sad:

Cheers Enjoynz


----------



## BEorP (Jul 30, 2008)

Patient "survived" as in there was a return of spontaneous circulation or actually survived to be discharged already? 

Also, please answer my question about the defib.


----------



## mikie (Jul 30, 2008)

firecoins said:


> get rid of volunteers. Its bout time.



was that comment really necessary?  We are here to commend the OP about his fast acting skills at his non EMS-related job.  There are plenty of other threads to bash us.  

Where did the AED, O2 & BVM come from?  Restaurant?  Office?

Good work!


----------



## daedalus (Jul 30, 2008)

Actually mike, there are not enough threads addressing the negative aspects of a volunteer system. I hold volunteers to the highest, and if I lived in a community with a volunteer EMS system, I would be thanking you people for the work you do, but all while pushing for a paid service ASAP. This case here is a prime example. 

OP, you did a fine job attending to the patient.


----------



## mdkemt (Jul 30, 2008)

Interesting.  Response times vary up here but I also live in a remote area of the province.

MDKEMT


----------



## Jon (Jul 30, 2008)

Folks - before we start on the paid vs. vollie discussion... there is a different issue at play - Politics... or "my kingdom". Lots of county dispatch centers are required to dispatch from run streams provided by the local municipalities/fire chiefs - that means that if they don't like XYZ company, they can put other, farther away companies in the run streams ahead of XYZ company. This happens in both vollie and paid systems.

THe solution is for the COUNTY to say we will send the CLOSEST unit... and remove inter-department personality conflicts from the table. But that often tramples on the "home rule" of the local chiefs.


----------



## NJN (Jul 30, 2008)

I don't know how it is in his town, (which is the next town over from mine), but I am dispatched by city PD.


----------



## firecoins (Jul 30, 2008)

mikie333 said:


> was that comment really necessary?  We are here to commend the OP about his fast acting skills at his non EMS-related job.


yes the comment is necessary and I am a volunteer.  There is no excuse that any area can not come up with a rig.  Or that mutual aid agreements prevent the closes rig from proceeding to the scene.


----------



## mikeylikesit (Jul 30, 2008)

I have rarely had to respond or act on my off time, and never when working another job, i am kind of jealous.


----------



## Foxbat (Jul 31, 2008)

BEorP said:


> Seems to be a final nail in the coffin of anyone who still thinks that ambulances should be staffed by volunteers.


The key word is "staffed", not "volunteers". There are volunteer services that have personnel at the station 24/7.


----------



## firecoins (Jul 31, 2008)

Foxbat said:


> The key word is "staffed", not "volunteers". There are volunteer services that have personnel at the station 24/7.



Thats the exception.  Not the rule.


----------



## MedicAngel (Aug 1, 2008)

Sorry that I have a job  and also am a  volunteer...

Seriously, I would think that if the volunteer station didn't respond after the 1st set of tones, a second set would be dropped as another station would be added to the call. Is that done in your area?


----------



## Jon (Aug 1, 2008)

firecoins said:


> Thats the exception.  Not the rule.


Depends. In busier areas... it seems to be gradually becoming the standard.

I run with a system like that... the vollie vs. paid line is a blur... we wear the same uniform, have the same response time... except that we do it at night... and we are a lot cheaper.



MedicAngel said:


> Sorry that I have a job  and also am a  volunteer...
> 
> Seriously, I would think that if the volunteer station didn't respond after the 1st set of tones, a second set would be dropped as another station would be added to the call. Is that done in your area?



Let's move this to a different thread... This thread isn't a vollie vs. paid debate.
Link to thread HERE


----------



## BEorP (Aug 1, 2008)

I'm still just curious to hear the details of this event from the OP...


----------



## mikie (Aug 1, 2008)

BEorP said:


> I'm still just curious to hear the details of this event from the OP...



Here Here!  Any shocks?


----------



## BEorP (Aug 1, 2008)

wlamoreemtb said:


> So today at my job (i work in a restaurant) a woman fell to the floor and went completely unresponsive. When I was told by the manager what happened i immediately went over. pt was lying on the ground unresponsive with extremely shallow resps. 911 was called and i had one of the other employees get my jump bag from my truck. I was told by the friend that was with the woman that she was severely allergic to peanuts. By this time pd was there with o2 and a defib. i  began baging the pt and instructed pd to expedite the ambulance. than the woman went pulseless. I immediately began cpr. I was doing compressions for about 20 mins while the officer bagged the pt. I was told they couldnt get a crew for the rig and had to go mutual aid. so I asked pd to tell dispatch to tone out my squad which is literally 2 mins from my job. The officer than said to me no we are toning out another squad who was 10 mins out. als arrived and took over pt care. than bls arrived another 10 mins later. This was ridiculous having a squad 2 minutes away and them toning out a different one. It was a very aggravating experience and I just need to vent.



Just in case some questions have been lost in the thread I will ask some again and some for the first time.
- Did the patient suffer a cardiac arrest due to an anaphylactic reaction?
- Just to confirm times, it was 30 minutes to the first ambulance arriving and at least 10 minutes after that before the patient was transported? 
- Did you do compressions yourself until the first ambulance arrived or did you switch out? It doesn't matter who you are, you cannot do effective compressions after 30 continuous minutes.
- Was the police officer's AED applied? And if so, how many shocks or no shocks were given/obtained?
- When you say that the patient survived, do you know if they just had a return of circulation or did they actually survive to discharge? How is their neurological function?


----------



## mdtaylor (Aug 2, 2008)

Jon said:


> Lots of county dispatch centers are required to dispatch from run streams provided by the local municipalities/fire chiefs - that means that if they don't like XYZ company, they can put other, farther away companies in the run streams ahead of XYZ company. This happens in both vollie and paid systems.



As it is with mine as well. However, once a _certified rescuer_ arrives on scene and makes contact with the dispatchers, the rescuer can call for a specific apparatus thereby getting the most appropriate personnel and equipment on scene expeditiously.


----------



## fortsmithman (Aug 3, 2008)

BEorP said:


> Seems to be a final nail in the coffin of anyone who still thinks that ambulances should be staffed by volunteers.
> 
> You didn't mention using the AED. Did you apply it? Did you deliver any shocks?


In rural communities volunteer EMS and fire are the only services that the communities can afford.  The rural communities can't afford it without a major increase in property taxes.


----------



## fortsmithman (Aug 3, 2008)

The agency I'm with is all volunteer.


----------



## BLSBoy (Aug 9, 2008)

Volunteer EMS, you get what you pay for. 
And my comments are not just firing from the hip, generalized anti volly comments, they are the result of me, and more importantly, the public getting burned by them. 



Jon said:


> I run with a system like that... the vollie vs. paid line is a blur... we wear the same uniform, have the same response time... except that we do it at night... and we are a lot cheaper.



Like it or not, you are stealing jobs. Now, granted, in an area with <200 or so calls a year, VEMS can be understood, but the whole doing it to save the community money thing is extremely over played, and needs to stop. Want to save the community money?
Go work for DPW for free. 
Be a city secretary for free.

Want to drive down the health care system cost?

Volunteer for Transport EMS. 
When you take out the lights and sirens, and exciting calls, who is gonna be left?


----------



## fortsmithman (Aug 9, 2008)

BLSBoy said:


> Volunteer EMS, you get what you pay for.
> And my comments are not just firing from the hip, generalized anti volly comments, they are the result of me, and more importantly, the public getting burned by them.
> 
> 
> ...




In the Northwest Territories where I live there are only 2 paid agencies they are the Yellowknife Fire Dept ems division, and Medic north who is responsible for air ambulance.  There are many smaller communities in the NWT where there is no EMS.  The majority of the communities in the Northwest Territories are not connected to the highway system only by air.  In those communities they would put the patient in the back of a vehicle and drive fast to the nursing station. and in those communities that do have EMS my community and another are the only ones where EMS is an independent agency the others are part of the Volunteer FD. Last year my agency did 250 calls.  Most communities in the NWT cannot afford to pay for full time EMS.  Most communities in the NWT don't have any Doctors just RN's and NP's.  I personally believe that paid is the way to  go.  But we also have to look at certain fiscal realities in most communities the last thing in most municipal budgets have been police fire ems are the last.  What takes priority are lower taxes, better roads, etc.


----------



## BLSBoy (Aug 9, 2008)

My comments were mostly directed at the fracked up state that is NJ. But I stand by my comment of if you want to save the citizens money, go volunteer for DPW, or volunteer to be a clerk.


----------



## fortsmithman (Aug 9, 2008)

BLSBoy said:


> My comments were mostly directed at the fracked up state that is NJ. But I stand by my comment of if you want to save the citizens money, go volunteer for DPW, or volunteer to be a clerk.



In non rural area's they should have paid EMS.


----------



## Jon (Aug 12, 2008)

BLSBoy said:


> Volunteer EMS, you get what you pay for.
> And my comments are not just firing from the hip, generalized anti volly comments, they are the result of me, and more importantly, the public getting burned by them.
> 
> 
> ...



BLS.... I have to agree, to a point.

however, given our set up, I don't think we are going to go 24x7 paid anytime soon.
So I'll keep doing my 1-2 6 hour shifts a week.


----------



## ride2k (Aug 12, 2008)

Good thing you were there, or else she would have been gone for sure. That is a long time for you to have to be doing CPR. Wow.

And as far as volunteer and paid, were I live we have a paid staff on from 6am-6pm suring the day, and it's volunteer at night. It works quite well. The town is fairly small but we have a lot of calls during the summer.


----------

