# Second time taking it, and i failed..



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Hello im new here, i recently completed a EMT-Basic College Program passed it with a 93 in the class average, did my practical (skills testing) passed everything just fine. I undermined the NREMT the first time and i got to 70 questions then it boot me off i took the test in under 30 mins. i was very nervous. i got below passing on trauma and cardiology, near passing on everything else. this was on 8/20 
i just took it yesterday at 7pm and i went all the way up to about 120 or so questions with about 30 minutes left on the clock i was very calm and collected just as kaplans says to remain. i felt the questions were hard but i was answering them right. i stuck to my ABC's and BLS always there was two obvious wrong answers and then two obvious right answers on every single question. 
this morning i go to check it and there it is unsuccesful. 
i got near passing on everything except EMS Operations. 
i really dont know what to do or how else to do it, i made flash cards read a few important sections in my AAOS book used JB Test prep and Kaplans. 
can someone please help me out this really sucks and its a nasty feeling. i just dont understand i know the stuff i was doing just fine in paramedic academy but this was a prerequisite so now i am dropped.. help please from houston, texas :/


----------



## Veneficus (Sep 11, 2012)

diegoislas said:


> read a few important sections* in my AAOS *book used JB Test prep and Kaplans.
> can someone please help me out this really sucks and its a nasty feeling. i just dont understand i know the stuff i was doing just fine in paramedic academy but this was a prerequisite so now i am dropped.. help please from houston, texas :/



This is your first problem. You need a better book.

Second, find out if your class is using the new or old curriculum.

If it is the old, remember the NR test is based on the new one. You may not have had the instruction you needed.

If you are near passing on all, it sounds like you don't have the depth of knowledge required.

I would drop the test prep for now and review the material.


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Better book? which book should I use????
and im not one hundred percent sure but we used EMStesting.com im not sure if its old or new curriculum but previous students who did not pass the program in my school stated that the test reviews and quizzes were identical so it may be the old curriculum... 
So the near passing, and the test going to 100 and something questions does'nt really mean much?


----------



## Veneficus (Sep 11, 2012)

diegoislas said:


> Better book? which book should I use????



Anyone but that one. It is the dreg of EMS texts.

I am partial to the ones published by Brady because I know what is in them.



diegoislas said:


> So the near passing, and the test going to 100 and something questions does'nt really mean much?



How the testing works is it asks you an easy question in a topic, if you get it right it escalates the difficulty of the question in the same topic. Eventually when you answer enough levels it stops giving you that topic. 

If you answer it wrong, it will ask you more of that topic until you either cannot pass or you do pass it. (with a limited number of tries)

Sometimes the test runs all the way to 150 questions in order to validate its own controls.  (I don't teach basics, but this really freaks the medic students out)

But if you are trying to memorize answers from test prep, I can predict things will not go well unless you read why the answer is right and why all the other ones are wrong. At that point you are better off with a book. Otherwise you are gambling on whether your next real test will be close to your practice test prep. ( I don't gamble)


----------



## Sandog (Sep 11, 2012)

This is why I think A&P should be a pre-req for EMT. Once you know how the machine works, you can fix it, just like a mechanic knows when the carburetor is broke. Once you understand the mechanics of the body, it is much easier to know how to approach the problem. 

If I recall the NREMT exam, it had very goofy questions designed to trip you up. Study your AHA BLS book and know it well. If I call you at 3 AM and ask you what the breath/compression ratio for an infant is with two providers, you should know it. 

Study your A&P although when I took the test, not many A&P questions. Remember your steps.. BSI/scene safety/ABC.

If you got a 93% in class but failed the exam, your instructor is doing something wrong.

Good luck next time.


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Anyone but that one. It is the dreg of EMS texts.

I am partial to the ones published by Brady because I know what is in them.

So I should use the Brady basic books to study? Also how do I know where to find the new curriculum?


How the testing works is it asks you an easy question in a topic, if you get it right it escalates the difficulty of the question in the same topic. Eventually when you answer enough levels it stops giving you that topic. 

If you answer it wrong, it will ask you more of that topic until you either cannot pass or you do pass it. (with a limited number of tries)

Sometimes the test runs all the way to 150 questions in order to validate its own controls. (I don't teach basics, but this really freaks the medic students out)

So basically what I am getting from this is that near passing means that I almost proved competency in those subjects but, did not quite show it thus "near pasing" ?  and thats a very scary thought on the 150 questions.. I honestly thought I was on a roll...  
what made me think a lot is how does an objective statement prove competency in an emt, it seems like a stupid subject to ask a question IMO


But if you are trying to memorize answers from test prep, I can predict things will not go well unless you read why the answer is right and why all the other ones are wrong. At that point you are better off with a book. Otherwise you are gambling on whether your next real test will be close to your practice test prep. ( I don't gamble) 


This is EXACTLY what I did i wrote the question on one side of an index card and the answer on the other. Im not 21 yet and Im definetly not going to be gambling the next time I take my NR. Besides reading the book can you suggest another study method? 
also thank you very much for all of this, this morning I was very depressed and I just thought I was just plain dumb.. this is extremely helpful


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

@sandog  that makes sense its something along those lines I do believe I knew a lot of A&P but maybe just not enough... and thats 2:15 from what ive studied.. most definetly the assesment is important, some questions really dont pertain to a patient assesment at all which really makes me wonder about this exam. and most definetly i dont understand the college program, there was some bums in there who almost did not pass the program and aced the registry or passed the registry in 30 minutes with 70 questions i dont get it.


----------



## Sandog (Sep 11, 2012)

Maybe your over thinking the questions. Go with your first instinct.


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Sandog said:


> Maybe your over thinking the questions. Go with your first instinct.



on my first attempt I was definetly too nervous to function and i could not read and most likely over thought all of them, but on the second attempt it was almost like i saw the answer in my head after i slowly read the question, and then selected it... what could my problem be?


----------



## Veneficus (Sep 11, 2012)

You are not dumb.

You are having the same problem that EMS students have all over the country have.

They have no idea a quality program from a poor quality program until they get hit on registry. 

The main problem is how EMS education is set up and the requirements to be an instructor. (rather the utter lack of requirements)

Most instructors teach what they know or what they do. Which as the EMS curriculum advances over time, may not be enough for new students to pass. 

If I had $1 everytime I heard this, I would be as rich as Croesus.

http://www.bradybooks.com/store/product.aspx?isbn=0133251942

"this edition meets the 2010 American Heart Association guidelines for CPR and ECC, providing all the practical information students need to succeed in the classroom and in the field. Using the National EMS Education Standards as a foundation,"

Near passing means you are close to the passing level. I interpret it as you cannot reliably pass those topics. 

It is not enough to know the answer is right, you must know why the others are wrong too. 

2 distractors (answers) are always close, one is "more correct." If you don't know why one is more or less correct, that is a knowledge deficit. (not because you are dumb, because you just didn't learn it properly or thorough enough)

The test measures your ability as an EMT because it determines if you have the base knowledge to know if a decision/action is reasonable or not.

Think of it like surgery, if all you had to do was know how and where to cut and sew, there would be no need for surgeons to go to medical school. 

EMS is the same way, it is now more than just skills. But it wasn't always.

My advice is don't rush to take the test again. Get a good source and teach yourself what you need. Students all over the US have to do this for Basic and Medic class all the time because of poor programs. 

If they can do it, you can do it.


----------



## DesertMedic66 (Sep 11, 2012)

At my college we are using the book that Ven said and we have been getting great national registry testing results (went from roughly 60% pass rate to above 80% pass rate for ~120 students)


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Veneficus said:


> You are not dumb.
> 
> You are having the same problem that EMS students have all over the country have.
> 
> ...



Its all very clear now, well now that its been pointed out to me, and thats going to be my next purchase. the brady book. It really makes sense the critical thinking part. and I like that analogy of the surgeons. Im definetly not going to rush into my next attempt, this is my last shot before a refresher course which i do not want to find out what is like. 
I really appreaciate this, I had a complete 180 with EMS related emotions today. but I see now the importance of the plain and simple basics.. Thank you very much for this.


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

firefite said:


> At my college we are using the book that Ven said and we have been getting great national registry testing results (went from roughly 60% pass rate to above 80% pass rate for ~120 students)



hmm, I can see where the orange book (AAOS) can fail to meet the new curriculum, thats good im glad there is a forum for this information.


----------



## Sandog (Sep 11, 2012)

For my class, we had the brady book. It is very redundant, but that is to emphasize certain skills. At about 3 inches thick, it could take quite some time to read. 

I would recommend you shell out the bucks for an online study center. I used 
http://www.emt-national-training.com/emt-b-test.php?gclid=CO_sycrHrrICFYeDQgodoRUAXQ

When you take the exams, you should be scoring 80% or better.

I signed for the online program at the start of my EMT program, Took the test almost every night. The above website helped me a lot. At least I think it did.


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 11, 2012)

Sandog said:


> For my class, we had the brady book. It is very redundant, but that is to emphasize certain skills. At about 3 inches thick, it could take quite some time to read.
> 
> I would recommend you shell out the bucks for an online study center. I used
> http://www.emt-national-training.com/emt-b-test.php?gclid=CO_sycrHrrICFYeDQgodoRUAXQ
> ...




I see... hmm Ive never seen this before, would it be better to buy the brady book study it learn it, then later buy this test prep or buy brady book and test prep at the same time?


----------



## Sandog (Sep 12, 2012)

At this point, I would say you should already know your stuff. The book is expensive, I would go with the online testing site I mentioned. Be sure to understand why your answers were wrong when you take test.

That's about all the advice I can give.

Also, ask questions here when you get confused about a question.


----------



## pa132399 (Sep 13, 2012)

i used emtprep.com for my registry medic test it was a decent website that had  both good questions and good reasoning for why the answers were correct or incorrect. use it for a bit and then try again. as said before the test is difficult but not impossible. many students have to take it sometime up to the last attempt before they finally pass it but my suggestion is use the knowledge you were taught in school use that practice site and when you are passing those test with decent scores give the registry another shot.


----------



## sweetpete (Sep 13, 2012)

Hey man,

Like what has been said. Study A&P alot. Understand what's going on with the body before studying how to fix it. You'll be ok. Just take it easy and don't over think the questions too much.


----------



## Mountain momma (Sep 13, 2012)

Ok so I gotta put in my 2 cents here, I'm a newb but this was also a midlife career change. I just took NREMT back in June, I used the orange book for class. This was specifically the tenth edition of the book. My only study guide for NREMT was JB test prep online. First off I am older and have been out of school and the learning environment for a very long time.
   I went to a private school for EMT basic. I did my research before I decided where I was going. Math is not my friend so avoided CC. Went private. 
But an accredited school. Teacher was very good ! Always answered any questions and helped in any way possible. However exams were extremely tough! The exams made NREMT look like a piece of cake. Not kidding. Yes the exam was tough , I got cut off at 80 questions with almost an hour left on the timer. Yes I was freaked out by all of it. The actual exam is to me very poorly written and very vague as compared to what I was used to. The exam is different every time and with every person. I passed first time. There were questions I expected that we're not on it and stuff I did not expect on it. Also unfamiliar terms were used. 
 My point being don't give up ! One thing we were told all through class was " don't add to the question and don't take anything away from the question" .
2 distracter answers 1 correct and 1 almost correct.  I always went back to my ABC 's  . If I can get thru this , anybody can! Best of luck to you!


----------



## sweetpete (Sep 14, 2012)

Excellent post Mountain Momma!


----------



## EMSANTHEM (Sep 16, 2012)

SIMPLY.  = EMTB.com


----------



## stickclicks (Sep 17, 2012)

sweetpete said:


> Hey man,
> 
> Like what has been said. Study A&P alot. Understand what's going on with the body before studying how to fix it. You'll be ok. Just take it easy and don't over think the questions too much.




I feel like this is one of the differences between good and bad instructors. Good instructors not only teach you the step by step algorithms, but a fair amount of the WHY behind it and force you to use both to make your way through scenarios in class. I felt like once I began thinking about the cause and effect of the body's systems and how the interventions and injuries / diseases alter those cause and effect relationships, I was ready for the NREMT. I believe that the "Emergency Care and Transportation of the Sick and Injured (AAOS Orange Books)" (10th Edition?) provided a good balance of the how and why. 

Not passing can be discouraging, but keep fine tuning your study strategy. Focus on the areas you know you are weak first and don't forget to review the stuff you are already proficient at. Best of luck!


----------



## nguyenKLT (Sep 25, 2012)

Where'd you take your class?  I took mine at HCC and I used the 10th edition orange book.  

Advice do not use EMTZONE (the online quizzes).  They are very vague and I found some of the questions to be poorly written and misleading.  

I didn't use any extra prep and I passed the test first time stopped at 70.  Don't worry about that (question numbers, time left) though, it just makes you panic while you're taking the test. 

If you don't want to spend crazy money since the textbook was so expensive, I'd advise you to do the quizzes at the back of each chapter and understand why.  You should look through the powerpoints from your instructor (I had good ones at HCC) and perhaps old quizzes and tests.  I also had to fill out the entire workbook for the course.  It's busy work but it helps for memorization.  

Everyone's right you should know the basics front and back. ABCs for all ages.

Goodluck!


----------



## diegoislas (Sep 25, 2012)

Thanks to everyone who's posted, after this little bit of time that passed since I've taken the registry I'm going to keep studying and plan to take the test in October or November. I don't want to waste my last try. I'll most likely buy the Brady book or rent it and read it over and that test prep might be a good idea as well.


----------

