# Huh?



## Martyn (Sep 7, 2012)

Question for our Russian friends, is this normal? No C spine precautions?

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvpVpDxh5xQ[/YOUTUBE]


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## Chimpie (Sep 7, 2012)

Moved from Contests to the International EMS section.


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## bigbaldguy (Sep 7, 2012)

Hard to say what's going on here. It looks like kid was hit by a car but for all we know she might have just collapsed in the road then the BMW stopped to help. I'm not sure what level of training Russian ambos have on board but it seems like I remember one of our Russian members saying they usually have a doctor on crew so the guy in the lab coat might have cleared c spine or decided immediate transport was more important. I agree thought that in the US if this was what it appeared to be, we would do full C spine.


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## phideux (Sep 11, 2012)

I didn't know Larry the Cable Guy was a medic in Russia!


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## firecoins (Sep 11, 2012)

He's a communist red neck


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## akflightmedic (Sep 11, 2012)

I like how the immediate perception is that they did something wrong.

They had a trauma patient, they loaded and went.

I know it is a bit old but there was a massive study done about 20 years ago in Johannesburg (trauma capital of world) which studied c-spine precautions by trained EMS personnel and cab ride by untrained people. Study showed those with no cspine fared better than those who were. 

This was over 20 years ago...someday America will catch up to EBM (evidence based medicine) and ditch the "We're "muricans man" attitude.


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## Tigger (Sep 11, 2012)

I rode a St. John Ambulance in New Zealand a few months ago, when we needed to "spinal" someone, that consisted of putting a collar on them and then using the scoop to put them on the stretcher. Then the scoop was taken off and the patient was instructed to lay still. No one was worse for their wear (obviously n=4 but still).


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## akflightmedic (Sep 11, 2012)

Good post on your NZ experience.

Here is what a great friend of mine who happens to be a Medical Director for several large departments says about spinal immobilization....it is not needed, simple.

When someone has a fractured arm, a fractured leg...what are they doing when you arrive? They are in a position of comfort and they have already self splinted. They may need support as it is tiresome keeping an arm elevated in a certain position but for all intent and purposes, they have found the best position for them and have "splinted".

When we see this, do we start manipulating it? No we do not. We ask them if it is comfortable and we help them support it in that position.

Now change the scenario to a neck injury or a spinal injury. Do you really think the patient is going to move about when they are in pain? Absolutely not! They have already found the best position for themselves prior to your arrival....or they will soon find it if they are stuck (elderly between toilet and tub) once you extricate them from that position.

They will self splint and may need a little support for transport (such as the scoop) but those are removed once the move is made.

So why is it we feel the need to start manipulating necks and spines when the patient has already self splinted, when we do not do this for any other fracture? We can tell them to stay still and not move...simple.


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## firecoins (Sep 11, 2012)

Merical! They took err jobs!


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## TB 3541 (Sep 12, 2012)

firecoins said:


> Merical! They took err jobs!



Dey took 'is job!


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