# Canadian College of EMS



## Cholo (Oct 8, 2010)

Hi All,  Here is a sad but true story of my experience in the last week.
I was registered to take my EMT with the Canadian College of EMS starting on Monday.  They called me on Tuesday (the week before the program is supposed to start) and informed the course was not going to run because the lost their accreditation with ACP....
This has really left me high and dry, I am down $1000.00, a uniform as well as all my textbooks that I can not use anymore.  I am told by the secretary that cut backs are happening daily there and she does not even know if her job is safe.  I feel right now that if I see a penny back I will be lucky.  Just wanted to warn people as well as figure out if anyone on here was supposed to take the program (it was a full class of approx 18 students).  
Any feedback or opinions would be great.  Again the school is the Canadian College of EMS also know as CCOEMS.  The guy who apparently runs the show and is know where to be found (secretary's words) is Greg Clarkes.  Talk about a nightmare, and apparently he is the Canadian Coordinator of NAEMT.....


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## Cholo (Oct 8, 2010)

Hi All, Here is a sad but true story of my experience in the last week.
I was registered to take my EMT with the Canadian College of EMS starting on Monday. They called me on Tuesday (the week before the program is supposed to start) and informed the course was not going to run because the lost their accreditation with ACP....
This has really left me high and dry, I am down $1000.00, a uniform as well as all my textbooks that I can not use anymore. I am told by the secretary that cut backs are happening daily there and she does not even know if her job is safe. I feel right now that if I see a penny back I will be lucky. Just wanted to warn people as well as figure out if anyone on here was supposed to take the program (it was a full class of approx 18 students). 
Any feedback or opinions would be great. Again the school is the Canadian College of EMS also know as CCOEMS. The guy who apparently runs the show and is know where to be found (secretary's words) is Greg Clarkes. Talk about a nightmare, and apparently he is the Canadian Coordinator of NAEMT.....


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## Outbac1 (Oct 8, 2010)

Sorry to hear that. Check with your provincial Dept of Education, as I believe all private carreer colleges in Canada have to post insurance(or a bond or something) so that students do not get left high and dry if a college goes under. Also ceck and see what the colleges policies are for courses that do not run. File what ever paperwork is necessary for a refund,(keep a copy of everything). Even if the college were to go under you should be able to get your $1000.00 back, though it may take awhile. Check with other students so you can pool information. Unfortunatly you will have to apply to another school which may not have an intake until next year.


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## WolfmanHarris (Oct 8, 2010)

I know it's hard to see it, but there is a bright side. Had you started the program and paid full tuition and it lost its accreditation you'd be further along and high and dry. Or had it lost it's accreditation as you were graduating you would have just completed an education at an obviously faulty program and be out money, holding a tainted diploma and worried about whether you're truly prepared to work.

Do what you can to get your money back. With luck many of the textbooks will be used in another program, otherwise they just become a good resource to keep on your bookshelf.

Go find an accredited program. Look around and see if you can even find one that is part of a larger institution or partners with one and you may be able find a program that can give you transfer credits towards University for later education.

Obviously it would have been WAY better if you'd found out before it was last minute and you were out all that money, but it could have been way worse too. (Have heard of it happening to schools just as they were about to turn out a graduating class)


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## bstone (Oct 8, 2010)

How did you pay? If by credit card then reverse the charge. If by check then talk to the bank about reversing it. Check with the government about a bond they may have had to produce.


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## fortsmithman (Oct 8, 2010)

When selecting any EMT/PCP program to take here in Canada go to the Canadian Medical Association web sitv to chec if the program is accredited by them.
http://www.cma.ca/index.php?ci_id=50602&la_id=1


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## fortsmithman (Oct 8, 2010)

Cholo said:


> The guy who apparently runs the show and is know where to be found (secretary's words) is Greg Clarkes.  Talk about a nightmare, and apparently he is the Canadian Coordinator of NAEMT.....



I checked the NAEMT site and he is not listed here is the link for their Board of Directors.
http://www.naemt.org/about_us/Leadership/bod.aspx


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## Probi (Oct 13, 2010)

I went to this school as well.  not only did we not recieve skill books during our course, but also missed out on the adv. vehicle driving  BOTH of which we need as an EMT to work and both of which I PAYED FOR IN MY TUITION!   neways.  Greg is a funny guy, its to bad his school sucks so bad.   Our teacher even went on like a 1.5 week vacation right before our trauma exam which really hurt us i believe.  Neways!  theres always Nait/Sait/ Anywhere but CC of EMS lol.  This job is worth the trouble.


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## InsidiousStealth (Oct 13, 2010)

Probi said:


> I went to this school as well.  not only did we not recieve skill books during our course, but also missed out on the adv. vehicle driving  BOTH of which we need as an EMT to work and both of which I PAYED FOR IN MY TUITION!   neways.  Greg is a funny guy, its to bad his school sucks so bad.   Our teacher even went on like a 1.5 week vacation right before our trauma exam which really hurt us i believe.  Neways!  theres always Nait/Sait/ Anywhere but CC of EMS lol.  This job is worth the trouble.



ADV vehicle driving needed to work? Never heard of that one before....Thought it was just a class 4


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## Sandog (Oct 13, 2010)

Sounds like the school will refund your money. This from their website.



> Notice!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Probi (Oct 14, 2010)

InsidiousStealth said:


> ADV vehicle driving needed to work? Never heard of that one before....Thought it was just a class 4



ya ur right just class 4's... but it would of been cool!  and i payed for it.  so... i want it :n)

So now the question remains for poor cholo, where can he find a new school?  This is probably for the best Cholo theres better schools out there, where youll learn much, much more.  I hear ESA gives you a PDA loaded with the EMT course power points.  But that could just be propaganda


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## skivail (Oct 14, 2010)

fortsmithman said:


> When selecting any EMT/PCP program to take here in Canada go to the Canadian Medical Association web sitv to chec if the program is accredited by them.
> http://www.cma.ca/index.php?ci_id=50602&la_id=1



I did a lot of research before I chose a school and after a lot of time spent on the phone with school, services and governing bodies in several provinces.  The final result was the realization that, in regards to Paramedic education, the CMA means nothing any more.  The labor mobility act that recently passed has resolved all of the issues that used to be present.  I was not able to find a single benefit to going to a CMA accredited school.


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## fortsmithman (Oct 14, 2010)

skivail said:


> I did a lot of research before I chose a school and after a lot of time spent on the phone with school, services and governing bodies in several provinces.  The final result was the realization that, in regards to Paramedic education, the CMA means nothing any more.  The labor mobility act that recently passed has resolved all of the issues that used to be present.  I was not able to find a single benefit to going to a CMA accredited school.



There still may be a problem if you want to upgrade to ACP from PCP the ACP program may require that the PCP course be CMA accredited.


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## skivail (Oct 15, 2010)

fortsmithman said:


> There still may be a problem if you want to upgrade to ACP from PCP the ACP program may require that the PCP course be CMA accredited.



Possibly in other provinces.  Several of the ACP programs in Ontario are delivered at collages that are not CMA accredited. It would seem a little hypocritical, however I have not been able to find written evidence either way.  Even ORNGE is not CMA accredited.


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## fortsmithman (Oct 15, 2010)

skivail said:


> I did a lot of research before I chose a school and after a lot of time spent on the phone with school, services and governing bodies in several provinces.  The final result was the realization that, in regards to Paramedic education, the CMA means nothing any more.  The labor mobility act that recently passed has resolved all of the issues that used to be present.  I was not able to find a single benefit to going to a CMA accredited school.



You're right.  Actually it's the AIT the agreement on internal trade.  The Labour Mobility Act is actually legislation passed by the Ont Govt.  Under the AIT You could move to Alberta if you so desired.  You would still have to write the ACoP exams and upon passing since you will be a PCP in Ont you would be eligible to be licenced as a EMT in Alberta.  To be eligible to be registered as EMT-P in Alberta you would have to be registered as a ACP.


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## fortsmithman (Oct 15, 2010)

skivail said:


> Even ORNGE is not CMA accredited.



ORNGE is in fact CMA accredited.  ORNGE has a 6 yr accreditation which is the highest CMA gives.  The accreditation expires Jan 31, 2012.  As well ORNGE is the only Critical Care Paramedic program in Canada that has CMA accreditation.  I checked to listing of accredited programs and that is what I discovered.

http://www.cma.ca/index.php?ci_id=50602&la_id=1


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## skivail (Oct 16, 2010)

I stand corrected.


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## GClarkes (Oct 22, 2010)

Cholo said:


> Hi All, Here is a sad but true story of my experience in the last week.
> I was registered to take my EMT with the Canadian College of EMS starting on Monday. They called me on Tuesday (the week before the program is supposed to start) and informed the course was not going to run because the lost their accreditation with ACP....
> This has really left me high and dry, I am down $1000.00, a uniform as well as all my textbooks that I can not use anymore. I am told by the secretary that cut backs are happening daily there and she does not even know if her job is safe. I feel right now that if I see a penny back I will be lucky. Just wanted to warn people as well as figure out if anyone on here was supposed to take the program (it was a full class of approx 18 students).
> Any feedback or opinions would be great. Again the school is the Canadian College of EMS also know as CCOEMS. The guy who apparently runs the show and is know where to be found (secretary's words) is Greg Clarkes. Talk about a nightmare, and apparently he is the Canadian Coordinator of NAEMT.....


Good afternoon:  as the President of CCEMS I am concerned about this thread and how information can get confused along the way. Let me answer some concerns in point form:
1. We are not going out of business as we provide other training and services.  2. All those folks who have paid tuitions and deposits will receive refunds in accordance with Alberta provincial training guidelines which stipulate 30 days from date of written notification.  3. We voluntary removed our own accreditation from the list for both EMR and EMT. This was done as the ever changing requirements and demands from the Alberta health disciplines board, and the content expert, the Alberta college of paramedics, has made this process very difficult for a non-governmental school to function with limited staff, no provincial funding, and this provincial movement towards government run ambulances. 
That being said, every student that was waiting for a programme has been notified in writing and by phone. No one is more disappointed about this difficulty than I. I started this school in 1988, and being the first private school approved in Alberta, well, this is a real shock. To discredit me personally is one thing, but to question the education and training of our recent grads and alumni based on rumor is unfair, and unprofessional to our trade. 
Please note that my staff are working diligently to see that current students on Practicum are taken care of, and know that all current students are recognized to seek provincial registration and testing with the ACP. This is a fact, and only those whom we cancelled on are affected.
Once again, my sincere apologies for the current situation, and know that we are working very hard to remedy this situation. Feel free to email me directly should you have any further questions or concerns. 

John (Greg) Clarkes, President & Owner since 1988.


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## GClarkes (Oct 22, 2010)

Cholo said:


> Hi All,  Here is a sad but true story of my experience in the last week.
> I was registered to take my EMT with the Canadian College of EMS starting on Monday.  They called me on Tuesday (the week before the program is supposed to start) and informed the course was not going to run because the lost their accreditation with ACP....
> This has really left me high and dry, I am down $1000.00, a uniform as well as all my textbooks that I can not use anymore.  I am told by the secretary that cut backs are happening daily there and she does not even know if her job is safe.  I feel right now that if I see a penny back I will be lucky.  Just wanted to warn people as well as figure out if anyone on here was supposed to take the program (it was a full class of approx 18 students).
> Any feedback or opinions would be great.  Again the school is the Canadian College of EMS also know as CCOEMS.  The guy who apparently runs the show and is know where to be found (secretary's words) is Greg Clarkes.  Talk about a nightmare, and apparently he is the Canadian Coordinator of NAEMT.....


Good afternoon:  you certainly have some strong feelings about this situation. I apologise about the cancellation of the programme. I am available anytime via email at: [I]**removed**[/I]  I am traveling a great deal providing training across Canada and the USA. I cannot confirm the nightmare status, but am available anytime you wish to mail me. I have been in this field for a long time now, and have dedicated my Life to it like many others. 
Other than my sincere apologies and your refund, I truly hope that you find another school that will accommodate your training as an EMT. 

John (Greg) Clarkes, President/Owner since 1988.


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## ffemt8978 (Oct 22, 2010)

Duplicate threads merged.


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## Mobey (Oct 22, 2010)

Thank you for clearing the air Greg.

I think the OP needs a wake-up call on professionalism.
You are entering a health care profession and before you are even educated, the first thing you chose too do was personally nail a fellow EMS professional against the wall on a public forum and include his name.

Your post was highly unprofessional and did not hold water. In the medical profession we use facts! You obvioustly did not gather the facts before smearing this school and Greg personally.

Greg is indeed a leader in our industry, you have no idea (nor do I) what schools have to go through as far as accreditation or practicum problems.
You need to be careful since you never know who your preceptor/instructor/partner/boss will be in the future. You cannot hide behind a computer in this profession.

Please do not take my comments as threatening, I only want you to be a true professional if you are entering my profession. We really do not need anymore whiners in this buisness.


Greg: Please note that the OP views and the views followed by it are not that of the entire EMS community. You have full support of your "real" brothers/sisters in EMS as you make the changes necessary to keep your buisness financially stable, and focus on your work leading the way in this province of forming a new association of ems practitioners.

M. Mobey
ACP/EMT-P


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## InsidiousStealth (Oct 23, 2010)

GClarkes said:


> and this provincial movement towards government run ambulances.



Huh??? EMS take over is going provincial to federal??


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## GClarkes (Oct 28, 2010)

*Provincial Activities*

Good Afternoon:

I feel that as the Provincial Government continues to take on ambulance services under the AHS banner, that the movement may/will continue onto education and training. For over 20 years now the medical community (Physicians) in Alberta has been asking for a Provincial Ambulance system, similar in structure to British Columbia. There were also grumblings about the setting up of a Provincial EMS Training Academy, similar to the Justice Institute in BC.
Some may say that I am paranoid, but when you follow the information on accreditation requirements in Alberta, and the pressure on the private institutions, it is interesting. The requirements to have an approved programme for EMR, EMT, and Paramedic have yet to be defined. The process is under review, and as the rpovincial government moves legislation through in the next few weeks and months, I believe Alberta EMS will look much different than it does now, or has in the past.
Don't get me wrong..I am an advocate for better working conditions for EMS, better wages and benefits, and a safer environment. I am also supportive of moving EMS as a job to a career. I am just hopeful that if major changes are underway/on the way, that some consultation would occur.

These are my thoughts on the subject,

Greg Clarkes


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## InsidiousStealth (Oct 29, 2010)

GClarkes said:


> Good Afternoon:
> 
> I feel that as the Provincial Government continues to take on ambulance services under the AHS banner, that the movement may/will continue onto education and training. For over 20 years now the medical community (Physicians) in Alberta has been asking for a Provincial Ambulance system, similar in structure to British Columbia. There were also grumblings about the setting up of a Provincial EMS Training Academy, similar to the Justice Institute in BC.
> Some may say that I am paranoid, but when you follow the information on accreditation requirements in Alberta, and the pressure on the private institutions, it is interesting. The requirements to have an approved programme for EMR, EMT, and Paramedic have yet to be defined. The process is under review, and as the rpovincial government moves legislation through in the next few weeks and months, I believe Alberta EMS will look much different than it does now, or has in the past.
> ...



That is some very insightful information Greg and I certainly appreciate your view on things. You seem pretty genuine and I am sorry for the loss of your accreditation for those courses or whatever...I MAY be interested in taking your NAPD [or is it called IAPD now?] Through your college when i go up to write my ACP for EMT whenever that may be....

So you think this transition will be for the better you think? I am in EMT right now and I just feel super discouraged at times because when I go on albertahealthservices.ca I see nothing but jobs that are just "casual" everywhere on the website for anything EMS related and its super discouraging....Any thoughts about that changing? Do you think there will be lots of job availability in the future? Any thoughts would be appreciated


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## Probi (Nov 6, 2010)

Although likely very impossible for you Greg,  if YOU taught the classes your school would be amazing.  You came in to teach Anatomy and, wow I never took in so much info so well in my life.  YOUR an amazing teacher, I trully do hope things go well for you.  And if they do,  that You teach as many classes as you can, because you Are an amazing teacher,  and most importantly you make learning fun 

- Annonymous (probi) h34r:


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## RAMZ (Jan 30, 2011)

*Ccoems*

Good Luck Guys


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## Cholo (Feb 1, 2011)

No money back.... The school has gone bankrupt after being told through repeated letters that it was still operational.  The last letter before the holidays stated we should see the return before christmas, a week after christmas was a letter stating that they went bankrupt.  Lots of lessons learned.....


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## GClarkes (Feb 10, 2011)

Cholo said:


> No money back.... The school has gone bankrupt after being told through repeated letters that it was still operational.  The last letter before the holidays stated we should see the return before christmas, a week after christmas was a letter stating that they went bankrupt.  Lots of lessons learned.....


Hello Everyone:
It has been a rough ride for this college since the fall of 2010. I wanted to update those following these threads with the "official news". We did seek Bankruptcy protection in December 2010. However, under Canadian Law we opted for an option referred to as "notice of intention to pay". What this means is that the brakes are put on us financially, and we present an offer to everyone that we owe money to. This includes students, companies, etc. 
It was always my intention to repay everyone affected when the provincial powers withdrew our accreditation and ability to operate. To that end, each and every person or company we owe money to will be paid 100cents on the dollar. This means full and complete refunds.
I have always been transparent on this issue, but needed to have the assistance of a Trustee to handle the details, and the calls.
If anyone has any questions or concerns, I can be mailed at any time. The college will continue to provide continuing education in PHTLS, EPC, and AMLS. We will also be offering the new Tactical Combat Casualty Care (TCCC) class in May 2011. We have already qualified in this class, and will be audited at that time.

Thank you for hearing my side of the situation, and again, my apologies to those affected. We have persevered, and will do the right thing by those affected.

Greg Clarkes, EMT-P, NREMT-P, MICP - President CCEMS Edmonton


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## ABEMS (Feb 13, 2011)

Wonder if students will every get the driving course that was suppose to be offered or refunds for it?


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