# EMT-B class, online test cheating....a rant.



## SSwain (Feb 24, 2012)

Our Basic class is the beta model for converting to online testing. Several reasons being lower cost (less papers), free up more time in class for practicals, getting students prepped for National Registry...

Turns out some students were cheating. As far as I can figure out, they were grouped together and multiple people were helping with the answers, then the next would take the test, and so forth.

Our instructor was able to back track the IP address and the times of certain people's tests....Also, when one or more people go from 80% averages to 95% averages ....and they all have the same test results...it seems a little skeptical.


It pi$$es me off because I study my a$$ off, and put in the time needed to earn the 94% average I am carrying...only to have some people try to undermine it by taking the easy way out.

Long story short, one...maybe two (or even three) students might get expelled from the course because of it.

Sorry for the rant...


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## TheGodfather (Feb 24, 2012)

It's sad, but unfortunately cheating happens everywhere.. People did it in my class and got away with it, but not one of them were able to pass the registry..

Stay positive, keep your focus up and your eye on the prize.. you'll be rewarded for your hard work in the end...


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## adamjh3 (Feb 24, 2012)

Bah if you need to cheat to get through EMT school you probably aren't even fit for a job cleaning toilets at mcdonalds. 

They'll get weeded out eventually. If not in class then in the field.


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## TatuICU (Feb 24, 2012)

SSwain said:


> Our Basic class is the beta model for converting to online testing. Several reasons being lower cost (less papers), free up more time in class for practicals, getting students prepped for National Registry...
> 
> Turns out some students were cheating. As far as I can figure out, they were grouped together and multiple people were helping with the answers, then the next would take the test, and so forth.
> 
> ...



Just watch the pigs wallow in the mud.  Nothing you can do about it.  I know its frustrating but those people who don't know anything will get run off from their stations in no time.


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## TatuICU (Feb 24, 2012)

adamjh3 said:


> Bah if you need to cheat to get through EMT school you probably aren't even fit for a job cleaning toilets at mcdonalds.
> 
> They'll get weeded out eventually. If not in class then in the field.



huh? I though working a McDonalds was a prerequisite for getting into EMT school? 

"ya gotta know how to make a egg mcmuffin if you wanna work at this sumbitch!"


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## SSwain (Feb 24, 2012)

I worked a Burger King 20+ yrs ago....does that count?


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## medicdan (Feb 24, 2012)

The few programs in my area that offer hybrid EMT or Medic classes online have devised some interesting methods to deter or detect "cheating". Some programs don't "require" you to watch all lecture videos, and offer the texts "open book", but the questions are difficult and there isn't enough time offered to look them all up (you need to have enough knowledge to answer most without the textbook). 

Others, which require "attendance" or viewing of the lectures embed a password or code somewhere in the lecture (location changes) that students must write down in order to get credit for the lecture.

When writing tests, these classes tend to use large test banks, with question selection and order randomized across students. Two students taking the exam next to eachother will get different questions, and in different orders, deterring cheating. The software does, however, pick up trends across students and exams when students get the same answer on a question wrong, and alerts the instructor if students are testing from the same IP address as a concurrent student.

Not all foolproof methods, but generally effective keeping "cheating" down alongside a well-written honor code or plagiarism policy.


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## Shishkabob (Feb 24, 2012)

They won't be able to cheat on the NREMT....


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## Sasha (Feb 24, 2012)

It doesn't matter if they cheat. If they don't know it they won't pass their state. 

Don't concern yourself with others. All you're going to do is distract and concern yourself with others.


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## Maine iac (Feb 24, 2012)

TatuICU said:


> huh? I though working a McDonalds was a prerequisite for getting into EMT school?
> 
> "ya gotta know how to make a egg mcmuffin if you wanna work at this sumbitch!"



Damn right. Everything I order at those places comes with a "round" egg because those eggs are actually cracked right into that round moulding, cooked, then put on the sandwich. Those folded or scrambled eggs- fake as :censored:


But look man... those kids got caught and will get the boot. Before they get the boot find out the area they live in or plan on working in and AVOID it.

Like others have said, when push comes to shove they won't pass the NR.


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## Medic Tim (Feb 24, 2012)

wow. It shouldn't suprise that people can be so dumb. Where I am if you get caught there are no do overs


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## emtvic17 (Feb 25, 2012)

One thing I learned in EMT school, and now through Medic school, dont worry about what every one else in your class is doing. Alot of my classmates did the very same thing you are talking about, get together for online tests, ect. Came along cardiology and Pulmonology in Medic school, all of those people failed their fill in the blank tests, and were dropped from Medic school. Eventually, they will regret their lack of effort.


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## Pneumothorax (Feb 25, 2012)

Just shake your head and laugh that they lack the braincells to think thru a -B test. When they can't get a job even putting band-aids on they'll wish they put effort into their program. Good for you , for not cheating. Keep it up!


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## CBentz12 (Feb 25, 2012)

No reason to be upset, I passed my EMT class IMO with a bunch of dumbies except for a certain 3 or 4. They will eventually take the National/State test and fail if they continue to cheat their way through the EMT course.


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## jjesusfreak01 (Feb 25, 2012)

I don't think anyone cheated during our tests, but some of the kids definitely should not have passed the scenarios. It annoyed me, but none of those people passed the class final or were able to even take the state exam, so it all evens out eventually.


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## medickat (Feb 26, 2012)

I hope that they do get expelled - and if they don't, don't worry. They're not going to pass their certification exam

Good for you on maintaining that high of an average! It shows that you're in it for the right reasons and are working hard to make sure that your future patients are well taken care of.


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## Steveb (Feb 27, 2012)

*Good luck*

Keep working you a$$ off and wish them luck on the NR. As others have said stay away from the area where the group does the test's. Try doing it at a buddies house so that the IP isn't the same as the others.
Sent via BlackBerry.


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## firetender (Feb 27, 2012)

Don't forget:

Time wounds all heels.


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## Mountain Res-Q (Feb 27, 2012)

firetender said:


> Don't forget:
> 
> Time wounds all heels.



And a knife opens them back up...  :huh:


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## mycrofft (Feb 27, 2012)

My microbiology class at university...the little preppies (pupal yuppies) all asked "Is this class graded on a curve?" every day a new class started. Micro wasn't but some got it into their heads to sabotage others to supposedly make their grades look better. Workbooks were stolen, cultures were tampered with. The final had to be taken in groups of twelve with a proctor. No idea if destiny caught up with any of them (they probably became hedge fund managers and real estate loan brokers), but I didn't suffer any. Wouldn't help them either, really ticked them off!


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## SSwain (Feb 27, 2012)

Well turns out none were expelled...they have to take their tests with a proctor present now. More of a pain in the butt for them...the online tests allowed you to take it when it was a convienient time for you. Now they have a set time to take it.
Maybe our instructor is banking on them failing out and not have to expell them...?


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## crispymedic (Mar 5, 2012)

SSwain said:


> ...
> Turns out some students were cheating. As far as I can figure out, they were grouped together and multiple people were helping with the answers, then the next would take the test, and so forth...



Part of being an EMT/medic is having integrity. Medics have to be above reproach. They enter people's homes when those people are at their most vulnerable.

Cheaters have no integrity. Therefore they should not be EMT/medics. Simple. The cheaters noted by the OP should be banned for life from EMS.

Respectfully,
crispymedic


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## WuLabsWuTecH (Mar 5, 2012)

SSwain said:


> I worked a Burger King 20+ yrs ago....does that count?



No, McD is obviously a harder job than BK... Obviously...

And to the OP, they'll get what's coming to them.  I'm in a huge class right now with lots of students, and it's no secret that cheating goes on in the class.  But the students who cheat now won't get far in the next class.  It's not surprising that many students who "do well" in this class fail the next because it's easy to cheat in the class due to the nature of it and it's large size.

It's tough now (I hate working my butt off for my 98% and having someone else in the class getting 95's while doing a fifth of the work if even that), but I know that next quarter when they are failing the next class (which is much more difficult) I'll be able to rest on my laurels of the material I actually learned this quarter.

Chin up!


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## SSwain (Mar 15, 2012)

Quick update...

We had a Module final last night. 7 chapters from the book, and Phamacology drug profiles.
As it stands, only 2 people passed the test. (out of the 14 that are left)
It was a hell of a test!

Those who failed, will get a chance to re-test (but only get a max of 75% for a grade)

I think those who were cheating online...well it came back to bite them in the a$$ because we took the test in class. On paper. With our instructor sitting in front of us. Desks were cleared empty. All cell phones were away from the people.


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