# Your thoughts on UTSW/accelerated EMT-P programs



## 04_edge (Dec 7, 2010)

I am currently attending UTSW's Paramedic program, and about a month into it.  I was under the impression it was one of the better schools in the country until a few minutes ago when reading a post about it.  For those that dont know, its an accelerated programs lasting ~ 6-7 months total, 4 days a week in class, 8 hours a day, with a hospital rotation every week, generally at a level I trauma center.  

I didnt realize that there was such disdain in the EMS community for schools like this.  You do get crammed in this class, if your not dedicated to studying and putting in time to learn the material, there is no way your going to make it through the course.  Basically my goal is to be a great Medic someday, but after reading some of the comments about this school/type of school, it almost seems like im being set up for failure?  I am dedicated to learning the material and putting in the effort it takes.  So far its paying off for me, im doing fairly well in the class and things seem to be clicking.

I guess my question is, after completion of this course, am i really going to be at that much of a disadvantage/undereducated compared to those that went to a full length school?


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## MS Medic (Dec 7, 2010)

These schools have a usually only farm you for registry rather than teach you the critical thinking skills and immerse you in the knowledge you need to know. I felt that the 12 mth program I went through too short for all the info I was given. 
As far as being a good medic goes, just remember to keep your nose in a book and continue to learn once you get out of school.


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## MrBrown (Dec 8, 2010)

UTSW is one of the finest academic medical centres in the world and Parkland is one of the worlds top trauma and critical care facilities.

It is a shame that it associates itself with a patch factory for barely homeostasasing Dallas Fire Rescue Parathinktheyare's.

You get out what you put in, but, consider to reach the equivalent level in Australia/New Zealand takes five to six years, in Canada three to four and in the UK three.  Brown thinks all patch factory medics are at a serious cognitive disadvantage in terms of being able to dexteriously apply fundamental tennants of clinical science and reasoning in praxis of procedures and decisions which represent disproportinate clinical risk.

But that should not be taken as a reflection on you personally but when you look at how small the amount of education is in the US for Paramedic compared to the UK, Australia, Canada, NZ and South Africa it makes you wonder ... and offers no suprise why medical control and medical direction is still so prevalent in the US ...


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## medic417 (Dec 8, 2010)

6 months is way to long should have tried for the 10 week class.


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## Veneficus (Dec 8, 2010)

MrBrown said:


> UTSW is one of the finest academic medical centres in the world and Parkland is one of the worlds top trauma and critical care facilities.



It is a shame that it associates itself with a patch factory for barely homeostasasing Dallas Fire Rescue Parathinktheyare's.[/QUOTE]


With the current healthcare economy in the US, every "respectable" organization will :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: themselves out if the price is right.


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## Shishkabob (Dec 8, 2010)

I love Parkland. I love Childrens. I love the docs, PAs, etc who study under the wing of UTSW. 


 However I would not trust most medics that come from there. There are a few I would, but if I were involved in an accident in am area primarily staffed by medics from there, I'd crawl to another agency down the road.    

They primarily cater to FDs that want to rush their employees through certification as easy as they can, and it shows.


But like I said, that's not all medics from there, and you can still be damned good...you just have to want to.

Plus, clinicals at Parkland make other schools in the area jealous.


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## 04_edge (Dec 8, 2010)

I think part of the problem is that a majority of the FFs sent through the program dont really want to be paramedics at all.  You cant expect someone to be good at something, if they dont want to be doing it in the first place.  I have met medics from this program that are on their second attempt and theres no way in :censored: i would ever trust my life with them.  At the same time though, i have met several medics that are really good that went through this program.

I guess im just suprised at how lowly this program is thought of.  If i would have known i would be getting an inferior education and possibly less prepared, i would have chosen schools differently.

Out of curiousity, how many hours/days a week do the usual 2-4 year schools meet?


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## MrBrown (Dec 8, 2010)

The Paramedic (ILS) program here is a full time college degree, you are expected to put in 2,400 hours of lecture/skills lab and 1,200 hours of practical experience over the three years.  A typical week might be eight to twelve hours of lectures, another six to eight hours of labs and twenty four hours of practical shifts on the ambulance or in various other settings eg ED plus time doing essay assignments, studying, research, clinical logbooks and rationale etc

Intensive Care Paramedic (ALS) is another course ontop of Paramedic which requires lots of logbooks, clinical logbooks, skills lab and research plus working as a Paramedic at the same time.


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## JJR512 (Dec 8, 2010)

04_edge said:


> Out of curiousity, how many hours/days a week do the usual 2-4 year schools meet?



Two of the community colleges near me have their _core_ paramedic classes meet for about seven hours a day, three days a week, for three semesters. These two colleges just have three core paramedic classes (one calls them Paramedic I, II, and III; the other calls them Medical Emergencies I, II, and III). Another area community college breaks up the core classes into a bunch of individual classes with more specific class names, but they meet for about the same number of hours each week as well. Keep in mind that so far I've only been talking about the actual paramedic classes; this does not include related classes that are prerequisites or co-requisites, plus general education classes if you're getting a degree, or any clinical time.

My instructor (who is a paramedic and EMS officer) has advised that the paramedic students who do well invest about four to six hours of studying for every _single hour_ of class time. This may be one reason (apart from the apathy of those who are only doing it for job advancement or higher pay) that students in accelerated courses do not do as well: there just isn't enough time to study adequately.


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## terrible one (Dec 8, 2010)

You get out of it what you put in. The reason a lot of accelerated schools have poor reputations, aside from the fact that they are short in the education hours, are the individuals attending the schools. Think about it if someone wants to be a great medic they'll find a school that promotes higher standards, more pre-reqs, etc. if someone wants a faster way to join a FD, then that individual will do the minimal amount of work to pass and get a P-card.

Someone who is truely dedicated to the profession with a desire to learn and perform well can do so at any school. If you want to be better complete the program since you already started (no sense and turning back now) and continue your education. I'd suggest A&P, Chem, Micro, Pharm classes if you haven't already. Then push on towards a BS in a related medical field.


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## Outbac1 (Dec 8, 2010)

04_edge said:


> Out of curiousity, how many hours/days a week do the usual 2-4 year schools meet?




 Without looking it up and if my memory doesn't totally fail me. PCP school is about 900 - 1000 hrs of lecture/lab  and about 700-800 hrs clinicals in 10 months. ACP school requires PCP first and is about 1400-1500 hrs of lecture/lab and 900 -1000 hrs clinicals in 13 months. It is pretty much 5 days a week 7-8 hrs a day for 23 consecutive months.  Consider a university year is only about 7 months long Sept to mid Dec and Jan to mid April. Many "days" are only 3-4 classes long, not 7-8 hrs of the day. So our "Paramedic School" is a little over three university years.


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