# EMT I's In PA



## Jayxbird521 (Mar 23, 2008)

For those of you who don’t know EMT I’s having not been recognized in the state of pa does anyone know why? and I have heard a lot of talk a bought them be recognized soon does anyone know?


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## Devilz311 (Mar 24, 2008)

Not sure why each state has its ways... NJ doesn't recognize EMT-I's either


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## Ridryder911 (Mar 24, 2008)

EMT/I are considered a thing in the past in many states and are no longer even training them or letting them finish out without any more be trained. 

There are two divisions the old EMT/I  & the EMT/I 99 which is a cheap version of a substitute Paramedic.

The goal is to get full ALS coverage, and one to start and finish the Paramedic program. 

R/r 911


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## ResTech (Mar 24, 2008)

The new EMS Act in PA is getting ready to be approved here in a few weeks. Within the new EMS Act is the provision for an advanced intermediate care provider called an "Advanced EMT". The title "Advanced EMT" and other language contained in the proposed EMS Act comes directly from the National EMS Scope of Practice.

Once the EMS Act is approved and placed into law, it will take a year or two for the rules and regulations (ie scope of practice, etc) to be written, approved, and implemented.


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## Jon (Mar 24, 2008)

The PA Advanced EMT would allow more squads to provide ALS... so it might not be a bad thing... also... wouldn't an EMT-A/EMT-P MICU be a good thing?


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## Vizior (Mar 24, 2008)

Jon said:


> The PA Advanced EMT would allow more squads to provide ALS... so it might not be a bad thing... also... wouldn't an EMT-A/EMT-P MICU be a good thing?



EMT-A/EMT-P would be awesome, but if you're charging insurance the same, why not just run an EMT-B/EMT-A truck?  I'm not saying what's in the best interest of the patient, just what happens sometimes.  

And I always wonder about EMT-A or EMT-I/99 or whatever... they can do almost all the same skills, and give almost all the same meds with 1/3 or 1/4 of the training.  How can this be an acceptable substitution in an emergency or even an ALS transfer?

I'm not necessarily knocking it, but just wondering if that's how others view the situation?  The only true advantage is that it allows ALS to be more accessible to volunteer squads, but then we're talking about having an ALS tech treat our patient, having not only less experience per week(on average it seems volunteers run less calls then full-time paid staff do, but it's just a general blanket statement, don't shoot me), but also less didactic training.


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## triemal04 (Mar 25, 2008)

Vizior said:


> And I always wonder about EMT-A or EMT-I/99 or whatever... they can do almost all the same skills, and give almost all the same meds with 1/3 or 1/4 of the training.  How can this be an acceptable substitution in an emergency or even an ALS transfer?


Well, since you opened the door to this (something that's happened way to many times...but nobody ever seems to learn from the arguements that follow) I might as well just take it completely off the hinges.

The answer to your question is an emphatic *IT IS COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE TO DO THAT.*  Giving out skills without even the most basic knowledge to apply them appropriately is wrong.  Allowing people to believe otherwise because "we've always done it like that" or "we can't afford the real thing" or "we can't get enough people to be paramedics" or "we're volunteers so we don't need/want/can't become paramedics" or "we don't need the education because we can do the same skills" or "you don't need to really understand what you're doing" is still wrong.  Just like it was last week, and still will be tommorow.  Period.  End of story.

Now let the same old arguement commence.  :beerchug:


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## Ridryder911 (Mar 25, 2008)

Vizior said:


> EMT-A/EMT-P would be awesome, but if you're charging insurance the same, why not just run an EMT-B/EMT-A truck?  I'm not saying what's in the best interest of the patient, just what happens sometimes.
> 
> And I always wonder about EMT-A or EMT-I/99 or whatever... they can do almost all the same skills, and give almost all the same meds with 1/3 or 1/4 of the training.  How can this be an acceptable substitution in an emergency or even an ALS transfer?
> 
> I'm not necessarily knocking it, but just wondering if that's how others view the situation?  The only true advantage is that it allows ALS to be more accessible to volunteer squads, but then we're talking about having an ALS tech treat our patient, having not only less experience per week(on average it seems volunteers run less calls then full-time paid staff do, but it's just a general blanket statement, don't shoot me), but also less didactic training.



Hence the problem! Cheap labor but profit the same. Unfortunately, there are two persons getting penalized. The patient, and the EMT/I. Nothing like a freebie worker and thanks to you, why would administration want to change? 

As usual EMS is always full of excuses instead of results. 

R/r 911


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## paramedix (Mar 25, 2008)

I am so glad it's not just our country that's "confused" about their qualifications. Fortunately once you have a qualification, BLS/ILS/ALS or ECT you are recognized countrywide.


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## TNEMT06 (Mar 26, 2008)

Tennessee is implementing the EMT-Advanced level as well, which is an extension of the current EMT-IV level.  The EMT-A will be intubating unresposive pt's, administering Narcaan, applying CPAP, and doing 12 lead EKG monitoring...might as well go to Paramedic school....no use doing ALS at BLS pay.  Tennessee is also putting the CombiTube and PTL in the first responder level.


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## Pittsburgh Proud (May 20, 2008)

I hear the vote was yesterday or today and it look like the were going to reenact act 45 also. any news on what happened? Or even where we could find out? I googled it but didn't find much.


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## Pittsburgh Proud (May 20, 2008)

Pittsburgh Proud said:


> I hear the vote was yesterday or today and it look like the were going to reenact act 45 also. any news on what happened? Or even where we could find out? I googled it but didn't find much.



I swear Pa DOH website has got to be one of the worst to try to find something on. :unsure:


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## Jon (May 20, 2008)

I heard Joseph Schmider (State EMS director) speak on Sunday. He said that they were going to announce the changes to the PA EMS Act... I'm not sure if that meant they would be passed as fait accompli, or if they would get a first reading and then there would be lots of debate.

The revision includes wording to move towards an EMT-Advanced level. This could be fun.


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## Pittsburgh Proud (May 20, 2008)

Jon said:


> I heard Joseph Schmider (State EMS director) speak on Sunday. He said that they were going to announce the changes to the PA EMS Act... I'm not sure if that meant they would be passed as fait accompli, or if they would get a first reading and then there would be lots of debate.
> 
> The revision includes wording to move towards an EMT-Advanced level. This could be fun.



Interesting, I'm a basic with absolutely no desire at all to be a paramedic but however might be interested in the "I" or advanced.

I looked all over the PA doh website and could make sh@# out of it.

Please let me know if you hear anything or figure anything out.

I was looking here too http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/session.cfm
I don't know what the number was. :unsure:


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## Pittsburgh Proud (May 20, 2008)

I was looking here also...  http://www.emsi.org/tasking/ems_act_evolution/index.shtml


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## Webster (May 23, 2008)

TNEMT06 said:


> Tennessee is also putting the CombiTube and PTL in the first responder level.



Wow! Do any other states do this or any considering it?  That seems like a lot of skills for a first responder to have at his discretion.


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## BirdtheEMTB (Jul 17, 2008)

I'm a EMT-B in the Pittsburgh, Pa area...the whole EMT-A would be a good thing, just to better prepare me for P school. Nothing wrong with more education in my book!


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## emt19723 (Aug 12, 2008)

from what i hear from quite a few reputable people, look for PA to have EMT-I within the next 5-7 years.


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## upstateemt (Aug 14, 2008)

NYS makes things even more confusing with EMT-D; EMT-I; EMT-CC and EMT-P and then there are the regional differences..........


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## stephenrb81 (Aug 14, 2008)

Hi, new member here...

Our medic instructor was informing us today that the national guidlines are changing all together.  That First Responders are becoming Emergency Medical Responder's, Intermediates are becoming Advanced EMT's, EMT's are losing a few skills, and Paramedics are going from EMT-Paramedic to just Paramedic

From my understanding, it's going to affect Intermediates the most on the national level...dropping their scope to between I-85 and I-99 model.

I'm trying to find the source but can't find the exact document....its buried somewhere within NHTSA


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## stephenrb81 (Aug 14, 2008)

Found a document, around page 22 it begins discussing the different titles.  Looks like I might have interpreted it a little differently initially.  I have just skimmed it, haven't actually studied it in its entirety, appears that it is a future "mission-statement" type of thing

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/DO...mation/Articles/Associated Files/EMSScope.pdf


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## Ridryder911 (Aug 15, 2008)

stephenrb81 said:


> Hi, new member here...
> 
> Our medic instructor was informing us today that the national guidelines are changing all together.  That First Responders are becoming Emergency Medical Responders, Intermediates are becoming Advanced EMT's, EMT's are losing a few skills, and Paramedics are going from EMT-Paramedic to just Paramedic
> 
> ...



Actually the First Responders are becoming Emergency Medical Responders, EMT are Basic EMT's and EMT Intermediate are EMT Advanced and the EMT Paramedic will remain the same. NHTSA has NOT lowered any the skills for any of the EMT levels. 

NHTSA has NEVER recognized the I-99 Intermediate level as one of the 3 standard levels, rather those are for those states that choose to do so. Again, this is at the National Level and does NOT change local or state levels. 

Basically, it means that the curriculum has changed where the new EMT programs will have to increase their education and hours and include more A & P. Ditto the same for the Intermediate level. 


One can read look up the new proposed curriculum. 

R/r 911


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## ResTech (Aug 22, 2008)

Pennsylvania has approved the all NEW EMS act with the "Advanced EMT" provider level. It is now just a matter of the rules and regulations part of implementing the act and adopting the scope of practice. Probably won't come into the field for 2-3 years yet. 

Also, CPAP for BLS has been officially approved in PA and was announced at the States EMS conference. This follows a pilot project for CPAP that started in 2006. So, many exciting changes for EMS in Pennsylvania!


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