Local FF's shopping while on duty

medic417

The Truth Provider
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You'd think someone that did enough research to see why they were there would also have the brain power to research the daily life, rules and regulations regarding such situations...


Just a thought. ^_^

But lets see the reporters point. Playing the devils advocate and using only facts. That's a lot of money ( fuel and wear and tear )for people to drive that big equipment to go shopping. And tax payers are tired of the games being played with their money. Heck honestly with what they are paid why can't they afford to bring food with them to work then only leave if there's a fire.
 

akflightmedic

Forum Deputy Chief
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Shame on those stupid seniors for being concerned about their tax dollars. They should be willing to throw their retirement and fixed income at the FFs. Do you realize that not all of Florida is "Palm Beach"? Many people retired on from jobs with very modest incomes. When they first retired, prices and taxes may have been reasonable. Now FL is supporting some huge FDs and PS districts as well as the schools, parks and roads or other infrastructure. The last major election for a property tax ammendment also showed how much fluff was in the costs to the taxpayers when the books were opened.

I wouldn't know as I have never been to or worked in "Palm Beach", but the other 4 counties I have lived or worked in...way above Palm Beach, they were full of seasonal seniors (snowbirds) and they were quick to remind us that their tax dollars are important...almost as important as MY tax dollars which I paid as well while also living on a pretty set income with a family to support.

I am one of the first to defend the "weak" as I can and do appreciate their situation but when the calls originated out of a very certain area...think of it as our own Boca Raton...it is hard to take serious.

I do know the privilege can and does get abused, as does every other privilege in life, overall however, there is nothing wrong with the practice.

And as for the engine parking right up front, when I worked for an ALS FD, once we determined what we were going to buy, one person stayed in the parking lot in the engine to monitor radios (secondary monitoring) and the truck and we ALWAYS parked way out in the lot so as not to disturb anyone.
 
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281mustang

Forum Lieutenant
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I'm not aware of any career departments that don't go shopping while on duty. Some of you are really scraping at the bottem of the barrel.
 
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nemedic

Forum Captain
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I see no issue with what has happened, for the follwoing reasons:

1. The store is withing a mile of their station, and actually CLOSER than the closest store in their district. (Which happens to only be a small convenience store, but that's beside the point).

2. It is much simpler and efficient to send the crew out to get everything for the day than to send someone or a person at a time in their POVs. Reason being is that if their is a call while out shopping, the entire crew could be at the truck within a minuteor two and be rolling to the call, which is roughly the same response from tones to truck rolling out of the station.

3. It keeps crew integrity. Think of how horrendous the response times would be if a call came in while 1 or more of the crew was out in POVs getting food for the day? And for those of you that might be thinking "send out the SUV, supervisor car, etc, the same applies, as well as nullifying the argument about wasting fuel. Let alone trying to coordinate that for every station in a department the size of Boston.

4. How many people think that the film crew went for lunch, coffee, or dinner ONLY after going back to the news station and getting their POVs.

5. If there was an emergency that required utilization of the fire lane for emergency vehicles, they would have been able to hear it on the radio and move it, or in the more likely scenario, would have responded mutual aid to the stop& shop anyways.

Now I agree those that take the truck to dunks, then starbucks, then honey dew, ..... are wasteful, but all going at once, .....
 
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JPINFV

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And for those of you that might be thinking "send out the SUV, supervisor car, etc, the same applies, as well as nullifying the argument about wasting fuel. Let alone trying to coordinate that for every station in a department the size of Boston.
Ok... send out the fire SUV to get food at the stations that have a fire SUV. If it's a single engine station, than there's no other option. Sure, you're still spending fuel, but are you going to seriously suggest that a fire engine or truck gets the same gas mileage as a SUV? Similarly, want to compare the maintenance cost per mile between an SUV and a fire truck or engine?

4. How many people think that the film crew went for lunch, coffee, or dinner ONLY after going back to the news station and getting their POVs.
Last time I checked, my tax dollars don't go to pay network news crews.


5. If there was an emergency that required utilization of the fire lane for emergency vehicles, they would have been able to hear it on the radio and move it, or in the more likely scenario, would have responded mutual aid to the stop& shop anyways.
How about the problem that parking in emergency lanes generally causes havoc with the flow of traffic? Yes. The flow of traffic is more important that fire fighters at a grocery store for anything that is not an emergency call. Yes, I hate it when private ambulances (regardless of if they are a IFT or 911 unit) park in emergency lanes when running in to stores to shop or grab a bite to eat at a fast food or quick casual restaurant.
 

Hal9000

Forum Captain
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How about the problem that parking in emergency lanes generally causes havoc with the flow of traffic? Yes. The flow of traffic is more important that fire fighters at a grocery store for anything that is not an emergency call. Yes, I hate it when private ambulances (regardless of if they are a IFT or 911 unit) park in emergency lanes when running in to stores to shop or grab a bite to eat at a fast food or quick casual restaurant.

I'm not out for approval, but I felt I should mention that when our ambulance utilized the lane, we never slowed down or blocked any traffic. Of course, we only ever did it at that one particular store, and it was in Montana, where the skies are big and the parking lots empty...

However, I can see fire trucks being an annoyance in some of the more cramped lots. I've never parked in a fire lane unless I knew that the trip was going to be a quick in-and-out, not only because we never had a break (pages always interrupting), but also because we always knew exactly what we were getting, like a bag of jerky.

I suppose that a bunch of people perusing the store might take significantly more time.
 

DrParasite

The fire extinguisher is not just for show
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well, tradition is the first problem. FDs have been doing this for YEARS. So getting them to change is probably not the best of idea, and will be fought.

from the emergency services perspective, I have no problems with this, provided it is still in their first due response area. as long as they are available to respond to calls, I am not going to lose sleep over it. and not every station has a "utility truck" that they can send on errands. plus it keeps the crew together so they can respond for calls.

from the devils advocate point of view, do they really need to take a fire truck to go shopping? they are there for 24 hours, why did one of the firefighters not go to the supermarket the day before and get all the shopping done for work?

side note: two of our EMS units went to the mall one day. they were in their primary coverage area, available for calls. they parked out of the way of traffic, in the fire lane, and entered through a service entrance. the fire inspector took a picture of both units, and sent it to the agency's administration. now no more parking in the fire lane, got to park in a space in the parking lot and if you get a call, run really fast to the ambulance. and that's from a fellow MOS
 

46Young

Level 25 EMS Wizard
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Lets put this into perspective. We rotate who cooks dinner, the engine, the medic, or the truck/heavy rescue depending on the station. One piece goes. If you're driving a mile or two rond trip, how much is that really costing? Oftentimes we'll go after being out on the road for a call, before returning to the station. Sending a utility vehicle or a POV to the store is a horrible idea, since that crew member needs to meet up with the apparatus to respond, costing precious minutes.

If you want to argue the waste of tax monies, then compare a one mile drive to the store vs the various entitlement programs. I'm sure that for every legit recipient there are five that game the system in some way, and I'm being generous with that figure.

Payroll is where the bulk of the budget goes to, not fuel. You're arguing over pennies. Reform all of these entitlement programs, and hold those on these programs accountable, such as mandating them to find jobs within a certain time period, for one. Heck, even if you mandated the welfare recipient to be out of the house for eight hours a day, five days a week doing community service, instead of being allowed to stay at home, you would at least get some return on your money. Oh yeah, if they're forced out of the house and doing community service, perhaps they'll think about it, and realize that they could spend the same eight hours a day working, and making more than they're getting from the gov't. Just a thought.

Given that we're willing to run into burning buildings to save life and property, I think a trip the store with the apparatus to buy dinner supplies (not five trips to starbucks) isn't asking too much.
 
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akflightmedic

Forum Deputy Chief
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Given that we're willing to run into burning buildings to save life and property

Damn dude...I was agreeing with you up until this drivel spewed forth.

You had a valid argument until you brought the hero complex mentality into the equation...I so hate hearing or seeing this crap.

Anyways, nice post until the end.
 

46Young

Level 25 EMS Wizard
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Damn dude...I was agreeing with you up until this drivel spewed forth.

You had a valid argument until you brought the hero complex mentality into the equation...I so hate hearing or seeing this crap.

Anyways, nice post until the end.

I'm sure you're as sick of that as I'm sick of hearing how EMS and fire should be divorced, and that fire should be downstaffed due to call volume. I chuckle every time I hear terms like firemonkey, hose jockey, and such.

I'm a hardcore fire slayer. (I'm kidding, he says this in the video)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWg7Vzpod5U
 

46Young

Level 25 EMS Wizard
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ExpatMedic0

MS, NRP
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Joe Shortsleeve is such a Douche! enough said
 

JPINFV

Gadfly
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Of course the story I want to hear coming out of Boston Fire is how in memory of Payne and CaHill, Boston Fire is now mandating random drug screening. Oh, wait... this is Boston we're talking about again. :D
 

Hal9000

Forum Captain
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Damn dude...I was agreeing with you up until this drivel spewed forth.

You had a valid argument until you brought the hero complex mentality into the equation...I so hate hearing or seeing this crap.

Anyways, nice post until the end.


checkmark-1.gif


I just found this, an xtranormal video response to the reporter of the story in this thread:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aMUrT49Cbc

thumbsdown.gif


Eh, poor attitude...the profanity wasn't professional and seemed unneeded, much the same as the one before it.
 

papabear0276

Forum Ride Along
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The big problem is per the report "We saw Engine 32 shopping at a Stop and Shop. Not only was it out their district, it was out of the city of Boston. The store is located in Somerville."

Why did they make a long drive when they could hit the local?
These guys may cause all to be punished.

Actually - this grocery store is the closest one to their house. It's only about 5 or 6 mins away.
 

medic417

The Truth Provider
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Actually - this grocery store is the closest one to their house. It's only about 5 or 6 mins away.

Read all posts before you respond to one. Some one else listed location and I acknowledged it.
 

triemal04

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Read all posts before you respond to one. Some one else listed location and I acknowledged it.
You did. But then, you also leaped to the conclusion that the company must have been quite a ways out of their district without even doing the most basic checking; a quick look at googlemap would have shown how close Sommerville is to Boston. (though more needs to be known to make an INFORMED decision about this issue) So it's worth repeating, just to make sure everyone has gotten the point; some people here can be...eh...slow sometimes.
 

medic417

The Truth Provider
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You did. But then, you also leaped to the conclusion that the company must have been quite a ways out of their district without even doing the most basic checking; a quick look at googlemap would have shown how close Sommerville is to Boston. (though more needs to be known to make an INFORMED decision about this issue) So it's worth repeating, just to make sure everyone has gotten the point; some people here can be...eh...slow sometimes.

No leap they were out of their district. Sorry that most services require that you stay in district for all errands.
 

triemal04

Forum Deputy Chief
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No leap they were out of their district. Sorry that most services require that you stay in district for all errands.
Sure, not disputing that. And while it doesn't make it right, there is a difference between being less than a mile from their station yet still technically in another city, and being 5,10 miles, 10,15 minutes or what have you, away in another city.

Basically, my point was that many the poster was right in repeating what he said because, as I said, many people here are slow to pick up on some things, and many people do not bother to check anything for themselves.
 

JPINFV

Gadfly
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Sure, not disputing that. And while it doesn't make it right, there is a difference between being less than a mile from their station yet still technically in another city, and being 5,10 miles, 10,15 minutes or what have you, away in another city.

Heck, I'd argue that there's a difference between a mile away in a different city and being 5-10 miles from your station on the edge of your district or in another district in the city. Just because a unit is still in their city doesn't mean that they are in the best position to respond.
 
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