Super-confident EMT's Vs Humble Emt's

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mrhunt

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We've all seen it, Not necessarily just in EMS but the medical profession in general.
I get more upset or passionate about it when someone is at generally a lower Medical skill level (such as an EMT/LVN/ CNA type) but have this....

Because DR's and surgeons can get away with the god complex a little more and be like......OKAY! he's a surgeon, i get it........Whatever..

BACK ON TRACK!
Whats your train of thought on this? Is it better to be humble in your profession or Full of EMS pride and confident / cocky? Myself personally, i dont have EMS clothing, go bags or any other ricky rescue crap. Nothing on my car and barely tell people what i do. Im extremely low key and dont think of myself as anything special really. Yeah, i have years of ER experience, Army Medic & in paramedic school now and have done years of 911 experience where the rig was medical authority and not a transport to hospital to suck on fires teet.

Alot of EMT's ive come to see have this overly confident god like complex but the funny thing is...and i know several of them personally....They all do Straight IFT work! And im talking take people to dialysis all day, no 911 experience, emt for less than 2 years but strutting around in public with abuncha ems logos and clothing when theyre off duty and just a head bigger than a hot air balloon. One of em isnt even trying to advance to medic and just wants to stay an emt as his career yet supremely cocky.

Another is a 3x recycle at medic school and supremely cocky after doing nothing but LA IFT/Gurney van for 2 years.


So whats your take? Is it an individual basis? Is it some sort of Chiwawa sindrome where theyre over compenstaing? Maybe theyre super passionate about EMS and im just burnt the **** out?
 
I like to think I am humble. I tend to not like the super cocky people which is probably why I am not a huge fan of the majority of firefighters but am a fan of a decent number of police officers.

I have zero EMS decals on my truck, I don’t wear EMS pants off duty, I don’t wear any sort of EMS related shirts off duty. When I’m off duty unless you know me you will have no idea about what I do for a living.
 
My thoughts? Humble is good. Humble means admitting to yourself that you don't know what you don't know -- a pretty healthy attitude, I'd say.

I don't think people with advanced degrees or bigger paychecks are necessarily less humble. Take a look at Facebook posts; the capacity for self-indulgence and self-promotion doesn't seem to be a function of socio-economic status.
 
I agree with @DesertMedic66 if there are people that piss me off when I'm working, I'll be more vocal with my knowledge(vs keeping it in my big head). However, I also don't wear anything off duty that resembles what I do(or used to do for the current time). I never wore Blue line shirts when I was in LE, never had decals on my cars, never wore "EMT pants". If I knew something my paramedic partner didn't I told him, and he listened. If a doctor asked my opinion I told them, if it made sense, they listened. However, at the end of the day, I would leave work(I always worked part time EMS) and realize that I am an EMT for a reason, I CBF to go to medical school. My class was 250 hours tops, I am not a medic, nor am I a doctor, I don't know 1/100th of what most doctors know yet alone some people on this forum (our advanced practitioners on here) and IM COOL WITH THAT. The same way if somebody came into my domain (previously LE now InfoSec.) they should be open to listening to me.

In my honest opinion, being cocky and overzealous gets people killed, being confident doesn't. Cocky people have confidence, but it comes from a different place than actually knowing your ****.

something to take with a grain of salt @mrhunt you never who people are right away. One of my best friends is a GI surgeon, one of the best in NY, and he rides a volunteer ambulance as an EMT-B. Meeting him on scene at first all you see is EMT-B, but he may have knowledge that surpasses anybody else's on scene.
 
I don't think humility and confidence need to be exclusive of each other. One can be humble and appreciate the role they play on the larger health care team and still be confident in providing excellent care within their scope, skills, and knowledge.

The over-the-top, ricky rescue, "sir I'm here to save your life" crowd are problematic. In fact, I'd say those are the dangerous providers because they usually have absolutely no concept of what they don't know.
 
I think the less you care, the less it matters. What I mean by that is, basically, the less you feed into these types, the less it affects you.

Certainly these “types” will never die out, and I’d go so far as to say that with the advent of SM, TV dramatics, and the like, these people are at an all-time high.

Some days, sure, they can be exhausting but having an actual life aside from inside the hours that that clock is punched is the real lifesaver.

We’ve all been new and overzealous at some point and time, so just deal with it, do your job and go home. Dealing with overly confident, and often foolishly arrogant types, is only what you—individually—make it out to be.

I may think I’m humble, the next person may not, but what’s it all matter so long as you’re doing you, and I’m doing me the way that works best for each of us?

Allowing me to bother you to the point of frustration begins to play on, well, your ego.
 
As other have said, there is a difference between confident and cocky.

When i was an EMT, if you got hurt in my town and i was working, you were going to get great care from me. Now if im your medic, you are going to get great care from me. Id like to think that i am a good provider who knows my job inside and out. As a medic our directors and med control give us a decent amount of latitude to speak our mind if we think something aberrant is going on and im not afraid to consider multiple treatment courses when i consult with the Docs. Thats what i want from EMTs i work with, know their jobs and do that job exceptionally well. I know that my medic card cant stand up against the training of an MD, even a 1st year resident, so im always willing to listen and learn.

However, youd never know i was in EMS. When i was a cop, i never told anyone i was, i would just say i worked in municipal sanitation. same thing now. I dont need to advertise what i do, that doesnt bring me any satisfaction
 
Awesome replys everyone. Actually gave me a different and unique outlook on the whole thing.

Very awesome, Thanks To Vent monkey :)
 
I guess I'm in the minority.... I have three winter jackets: a ski parka, my denim embroidered FD blanket lined "chore coat" from my FD in NJ and my "varsity style" embroidered jacket from a previous department. They are warm, and I have never been ashamed on what I do, nor felt the need to hide it. usually my demin jacket is my go to coat on winter days, because it's warm, and the ski parka is too warm. It's not "hey, look at me," it's "hey, I'm warm, and IDAF what you think about my super stylish jacket, because I'm warm"

When I go to the gym (when I was going to the commercial gym), 95% of the time I work a t-shirt from either a FD or EMS agency that I worked at, or used to work at. No need to use a different one. When I finished, I changed into normal clothes.

I tend not to wear agency identifying T-shirts when not on shift; the exception being if I am just working around the house, and not planning on going somewhere, I might pull the first thing out of my dresser (and I have waaaaaay too many blue FD shirts). and if I end up running out to home depot, I don't change. I never wear EMT pants off duty, (although I did have a partner who lived in BDUs when he was not at work), but I do know of a FF who mows lawns at his side job in them. And saw a full time career FF who was wearing his uniform polo shirt and hat along with his orange apron when at his side gig of home depot:rolleyes:.....

my car usually has one sticker on the back window of the agency I am working for. it's generally small, in the lower right corner. and since NC doesn't require a front license plate, I now have a cosmetic one from my department (issued by the department).

I don't have any go bag (well, I do, it was a present from my agency when I was on their Spec Ops team, but it's got clothing in it for shifts, not EMS equipment), and do keep an bag full of my EMS crap in my trunk (belt, helmet, jacket, scope, radio strap, jacket, winter hat and gloves etc, but nothing for patient care), as well as my turnout gear (I work out of two stations, so it's easier to keep my gear with me than travel to the other station to get it for my shifts).

I've only been in public safety since 1998, and as a paid job since 2005. I've done a lot of BLS 911, some BLS IFT, some PICU CCT, some ALS CCT (when the scheduling lady was mad at me....), and some ALS 911. and a decent amount of 911 communications and volunteer EMS, and my current role as an EMS instructor and a part time FF/EMT in both an urban and rural setting who first responds to EMS calls. Medic school was ok, but I accepted a private sector job that gave me more options for better pay.

I can honestly say I'm pretty competent as a provider, have seen quite a bit, have screwed up quit a bit, and pretty good at determining sick vs not sick. And I don't need a paramedic to hold me hand or tell me what to do; I'm actually a lot better off doing things on my own and directing my crew. I'm also a horrible paramedic helper, especially to inexperienced paragods, but most experienced paramedics who come from busy systems enjoy working with me (yes, I know where my weak areas are too).

I know a few careers EMTs (who would take a paycut if they went to medic school), and some paramedics who I wouldn't trust to treat my worst enemy (as well as some really stupid EMTs, and amazing paramedics). That's their decision, and doesn't affect me one bit.

The reason I explain all that is because I know what I am, I've been there and done that, and your opinion of me really doesn't affect my self esteem. When I was on the truck full time, I had doctors who trusted my EMT assessment, and when I needed one of them to listen to me, they did. And I have had paramedics who trusted my assessment of the patient, because they have worked with me. I know how to do my job, am proficient in my job, and at the end of the day, I go home. And what I do on my off hours, or how I act, doesn't affect my ability to do my job.

If @Bullets is working for NJ's evil EMS empire (and I'm pretty sure he is, based on where he lives), than his medical director is likely one of the biggest ricky rescue's you'll ever meet. He's also intelligent, experienced, and one of the most approachable MDs I've met, as well as one who has no issues helping carry down a patient from the 8th floor a construction accident. Do you really think he cares what others think of him? or thinks that what others do reflect poorly on him? So if he doesn't, why should you let it bother you?
 
I’m not ashamed of what I do either, however, I am ashamed of the zealots that posses “hero complexes” and inhibit progress in what I consider to be my chosen profession. John Q. can’t tell the difference between me and said zealot, so to me, this aspect hardly matters.

With that, I wear my shirts from my house to work, or from work to the gym if I get straight off of my shift. Only when I’m on the helicopter though because my “uniform” outside of our flight suits consists of a company polo, maybe a company t-shirt, and ballcap or beanie with or without a vest/ quarter zip with our logo embroidered onto them.

When I work ground I won’t wear my uniform shirt on the way to, or on the way from work; maybe my uniform pants, a t-shirt, and some slippers. I keep my boots in my car.

Above all, it is about comfort when I’m not clock punching.
 
VentMonkey said:
I think the less you care, the less it matters. What I mean by that is, basically, the less you feed into these types, the less it affects you.
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This. I pretty much have the mindset of "you do you" meaning who cares what other people think. Some are going to like you and others not really, theres only so much you can do why spend the time and energy worrying about it. Pretty much theres two types of people: those who have opinions about you and those who have worked with you that can form their own honest opinions.

VentMonkey said:
Above all, it is about comfort when I’m not clock punching.
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Board shorts, flip flops, and the über comfy tank top is my work commute attire. Makes going in in the early mornings or evenings a bit easier. Also, when its hotter than a stripper on payday here it feels good to change out of the uniform at the end of shift.
 
At my fulltime job, we have as a staff decided that everyone will show up in enough of a uniform to immediately get on ambulance. A few times a year, that means driving POVs to the scene and swapping out with the crew. Such is life in rural areas. So when I stop to get coffee, I'm in uniform. And I'm ok with that. I'm not trying to advertise how great of a person I am, but I do actually really love what I do. If someone wants to talk about it, I'm happy to (briefly) oblige. I think it's probably good for profession to see people in an approachable light.
 
At my previous private ambulance job, I typically showed up to the station around 20-30 prior to official start of shift...which just so happened to be the time incoming crew could 'legally' jump a call for the off going crew (and at my station where it wasn't uncommon to run a dozen or more calls in a 24hr shift, the single biggest favor the other shifts did for each other was be early fir those early calls).
There were times I'd be walking in as the guys I was relieving were walking out for a call, so I'd basically go straight to the ambulance instead...ot was so much easier for my morning routine to wake up at home, shower, brush, put on my uniform, maybe hit Starbucks or 7-Eleven and otherwise show up ready to run calls.

My current fire service is almost the opposite. Everyone shows up in t shirt, board shorts and flip flops (slippahs lol). While in Academy we weren't even allowed to wear our uniform shirts out of the training center (even just going to lunch) so even now that we can, with no one else wearing uniforms to/from and just changing at station, that's what I've been doing now too.
 
CALEMT said:
Board shorts, flip flops, and the über comfy tank top is my work commute attire. Makes going in in the early mornings or evenings a bit easier. Also, when its hotter than a stripper on payday here it feels good to change out of the uniform at the end of shift.
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My partner and i are the only two department employees who show up in street clothes. Everyone else thinks its weird. I started doing it back when i worked for the PD and we had a locker room and its kinda stuck. When i leave work, if i have to stop on the way home at a store or whatever, i dont want to even possible be confused for someone who is tangentially associated with public safety
 
I think there’s a fine line between being confident and being cocky. In my opinion, I think being confident in your skills as a professional is important but staying humble is equally as important. You can know you’re good at what you do but remain level-headed about it. I know many people who are just that and they seem to be the most successful. As for the the Rescue Rick whose truck is covered in stickers, well...... usually he stays just a sticker collector in my experience.
 
soflomedic14 said:
I think there’s a fine line between being confident and being cocky. In my opinion, I think being confident in your skills as a professional is important but staying humble is equally as important. You can know you’re good at what you do but remain level-headed about it. I know many people who are just that and they seem to be the most successful. As for the the Rescue Rick whose truck is covered in stickers, well...... usually he stays just a sticker collector in my experience.
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How ironic, I was about to post the same thing! I remember decades ago a Flight Nurse that was preparing a patient for transport from an CCU to CCU. As he was reviewing medications he noted that one of the IV med's was not mixed or correctly at the right rate. Instead of bosting and making a big deal about it; he re-calculated and pulled the charge nurse aside and informed her. Meanwhile he re-instituted the correct mixture and IV rate & re-assessed the patient. So calm, confident, and corrected the situation without any attraction.

I remember thinking; how cool was that? That was 30 years ago... something I hope I have left the same impression.

I have always taught Paramedic and Nurses there's a fine line between confidence and cockiness...How do you want to be remembered?

R/r911
 
Ridryder911 said:
How ironic, I was about to post the same thing! I remember decades ago a Flight Nurse that was preparing a patient for transport from an CCU to CCU. As he was reviewing medications he noted that one of the IV med's was not mixed or correctly at the right rate. Instead of bosting and making a big deal about it; he re-calculated and pulled the charge nurse aside and informed her. Meanwhile he re-instituted the correct mixture and IV rate & re-assessed the patient. So calm, confident, and corrected the situation without any attraction.

I remember thinking; how cool was that? That was 30 years ago... something I hope I have left the same impression.

I have always taught Paramedic and Nurses there's a fine line between confidence and cockiness...How do you want to be remembered?

R/r911
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Such a great example of how to be a positive cultural leader in the profession... lead by example!
 
CALEMT said:
there’s two types of people: those who have opinions about you and those who have worked with you that can form their own honest opinions.
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Quoted emphatically for the truth.
Jim37F said:
My current fire service is almost the opposite. Everyone shows up in t shirt, board shorts and flip flops (slippahs lol). While in Academy we weren't even allowed to wear our uniform shirts out of the training center (even just going to lunch) so even now that we can, with no one else wearing uniforms to/from and just changing at station, that's what I've been doing now too.
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Well then, maybe those Kona Brewing dudes are on to something. Happy Teenie Tiny Friday, Brudduh.
 
Jim37F said:
At my previous private ambulance job, I typically showed up to the station around 20-30 prior to official start of shift...which just so happened to be the time incoming crew could 'legally' jump a call for the off going crew (and at my station where it wasn't uncommon to run a dozen or more calls in a 24hr shift, the single biggest favor the other shifts did for each other was be early fir those early calls).
There were times I'd be walking in as the guys I was relieving were walking out for a call, so I'd basically go straight to the ambulance instead...ot was so much easier for my morning routine to wake up at home, shower, brush, put on my uniform, maybe hit Starbucks or 7-Eleven and otherwise show up ready to run calls.

My current fire service is almost the opposite. Everyone shows up in t shirt, board shorts and flip flops (slippahs lol). While in Academy we weren't even allowed to wear our uniform shirts out of the training center (even just going to lunch) so even now that we can, with no one else wearing uniforms to/from and just changing at station, that's what I've been doing now too.
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Im assuming your with HFD?? Honolulu im guessing?
Im from there and miss it So badly.......Tell me how you like it? Id love to go back and work as a medic with C&C But its so tough to get in over there even as an emt now.... :(
 
I wear BDU's off duty (I buy 2 or 3 pair a year out of my pocket): but I carry my phone in a pocket, 2 inhalors; EMS gloves and a couple of shopping bags to pick up after my dog who I walk 2 or 3 times a day when I am off work. So it is easier. When I am around the house in and out I am usually in some type of EMS shirt (Non duty shirt, just old EMS or conference shirts), but everyone knows who I am and what I do so no big deal.
When I go to town (45 miles to 90 miles) I don't wear EMS shirts. I never wear work EMS shirts away from home due to where I work.

I have a jump bag that I was given as a gift, I keep it under the back seat of my truck; I keep it there cause it is easier to store than anywhere else. I use it for 1st aid classes with Scouts more than anything; but I have used it on accident scenes on the highway between jobs (home and PT is 115 miles with nothing in between). So I may be the only responder for well over an hour. I have called 911 from the side of the freeway on a bad wreck, told dispatch to send a helicopter and waited almost an hour for them to land and they only got there 5 minutes before the ground units got there. So it was nice having bandaging gear with me.

I think I am humble but I think I am good at what I do.

I always try to be at least 30 minutes early for a shift so that I can relieve out going crews if they get a late run: especially since FT job is min of 42 miles to the hospital and PT job is min of 105 miles to the hospital.
 
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