shake and bake courses

[reaper]

Most FF's that have been on the job for a month know about shift swapping. If the OP's dept will not allow it or give him time for school, Then quit!!!!!!! Find a job that will work for furthering your education. If this means working as a waiter, then that is what you do. Sometimes it takes sacrifice to get ahead in life.

If all he wants is to be a Firemedic, then go the tech route and be happy. If he wants to have an education and strive for excellence, then he will find a way to get his degree. Most of us did it, without problems. No reason he can't.

 

[Ridryder911]

Short and simple answer. You want to be a Paramedic then do so. Just alike millions of others that have to make choices and decisions and determine what their priorities should be, (why would EMS assume to be different?).

Please, don't say lies of "it can't be done; or "I can't" then either your not able to at this time or you will not be able to attend. Period.

Amazing, we never criticize those that take out loans for truck driving school or attending medical school and not working during that time but golly geez whiz, those in emergency services should be an elite and be exempt from the rest of the public. Why? Really; what makes us so special?

Again, just how important is delivering good quality patient care or is just a promotion for a raise? Looking for the easiest route answers that question.

Paramedic schools are too damn easy already. Easy to get in and easy to get out. With the turnover ratio as high as it is .... amazingly we never have a serious shortage crisis.. so it can't be that hard.. (shorter than most beautician school)

Annie up.. instead of looking for an easy route.... look for a quality that will produce competent providers.


* alike many others.. I worked a 24 hr shift FT job and obtained multiple degrees and license.. so yes, one can .. IF they really want to..
R/r 911

 

[medichopeful]

Short and simple answer. You want to be a Paramedic then do so. Just alike millions of others that have to make choices and decisions and determine what their priorities should be, (why would EMS assume to be different?).

Please, don't say lies of "it can't be done; or "I can't" then either your not able to at this time or you will not be able to attend. Period.

Amazing, we never criticize those that take out loans for truck driving school or attending medical school and not working during that time but golly geez whiz, those in emergency services should be an elite and be exempt from the rest of the public. Why? Really; what makes us so special?

Again, just how important is delivering good quality patient care or is just a promotion for a raise? Looking for the easiest route answers that question.

Paramedic schools are too damn easy already. Easy to get in and easy to get out. With the turnover ratio as high as it is .... amazingly we never have a serious shortage crisis.. so it can't be that hard.. (shorter than most beautician school)

Annie up.. instead of looking for an easy route.... look for a quality that will produce competent providers.


* alike many others.. I worked a 24 hr shift FT job and obtained multiple degrees and license.. so yes, one can .. IF they really want to..
R/r 911

It's nice to see you posting again Rid.

 

[sleepless near seattle]

Wow!

I'm sure you'll see this is my third post...ever. It will likely be my last. Vent, I believe you DO have time read ALL those threads. For the record, I'll clear everyone up on my situation. My department does support the IDEA of furthering my education. I LIKE my local AND my Chief. We are a damn good ALS agency that DOES have IV techs who DO start IV's. (NOT a BLS agency) We have NO private in our county and are known for high quality patient care ALL of which is Fire based. I never said fulltime school was impossible. This program is what will work the best for me. I DON'T think it would be good for someone with no college and no field experience. I have a BS in sportsmed from the Medical School of the University of North Dakota, have been working ALS for 8 years, and voly'd for 5 years prior to that. I WILL likely take out a student loan to pay the tuition AND keep my pay and benefits to support my family. My wife will continue to work part time and take care of the kids full time while I'm away from my family for 3 straight months. Then, as you know, they will continue to put up with my 24 hr shifts, and add on to that my clinicals and rides for another total of around 400 hrs. Is this still sounding like the easy way out? I'm not seeing it. It will mean a 10% incentive pay that will have to be approved by the mayor (the Chief already supports it) making our dpt 15 medics instead of 14. I have no interest in changing to "bigger" dept, I like it here. We run close to 12 calls/day, have very aggressive protocols, have a lot of trust from our MPD and therefore a lot of autonomy in the field. It is not a mother may I system and I will enjoy being an excellent medic in it. I realize some Fire based EMS can lack quality, just like some private can, just like some public/hospital based can. Please don't generalize FF's level of care or our intent to provide the best possible care for our patients. With 2 or 3 degrees each, and well over 10,000 blogs between them on this forum alone (was vent really bragging about that?) I can see that you've got a lot of hands on in the field caring for real patients. At work, gotta go.

 

[VentMedic]

I realize some Fire based EMS can lack quality, just like some private can, just like some public/hospital based can. Please don't generalize FF's level of care or our intent to provide the best possible care for our patients. With 2 or 3 degrees each, and well over 10,000 blogs between them on this forum alone (was vent really bragging about that?) I can see that you've got a lot of hands on in the field caring for real patients. At work, gotta go.

You must realize that many of use old timers here do have FD experience. You also might be surprised to know that a degree in EMS was encouraged in the 1970s which is why many of us at least have an Associates in Paramedicine from that time. The FDs were very selective about who rode the ambulance and it is that quality that should have been maintained, not every FF be a Paramedic as quickly as possible.

As far as all the posts, many came from trying to answer many of the questions we get expecially by PM. Sometimes it is easier to answer them in a thread.

Both Rid and I have been in EMS for a long time and have also added other degrees and credentials to enhance the care we give our patients to get them from point A to point B safely. Anyone can throw someone in the back of an ambulance and drive real fast with L&S to the nearest ED. We've been doing that for centuries by various modes of transportation. But, to improve one's chances for survival with a better outcome with few or no deficits has been something we strive for in modern EMS. Also, as hospitals specialize and optimize their resources, it becomes necessary to move patients from one facility to another safely. For the Paramedic to have a role in this, they must expand their knowledge which is very difficult to do without a solid foundation.

Medicine continues to advance and EMS should do the same. Other professions saw this long ago and raised their standards. Even Sports Medicine has come along way. Several states are also being petitioned to recognize the Exercise Physiologist with a Masters degree. The Athletic Trainer has been recognized for many years.

If you already have a degree in Sports Med that has decent A&P and science courses, you may have no problem with an accelerated Paramedic program especially if you have done Sports Med clinics with thorough hands on assessment for patients of all ages.

However, the skills mentality has to go to the wayside.

We are a damn good ALS agency that DOES have IV techs who DO start IV's. (NOT a BLS agency)

Just starting an IV does not make you ALS. Who cares if you can start an IV if you don't know why or can do little else once the IV is started? Washington is also known, but not in a good way, for its 7 or 8 different certs with some based on ONE skill and is often used as an example of the fragmentation that has taken place in EMS education and certifications. That is truly something not to be proud of. Imagine if all the other health care professions had a state or national level "cert" just for one skill and every skill they could do.

Do you want people to think your Sport Med degree was just about how to toss a ball correctly or tape an ankle? If so, then I would say you wasted 4 years of education if all you got out of it was a couple of "skills". I do know the education behind some of those degrees are extensive to where the person is able to adapt to several areas in health care and sports.

I WILL likely take out a student loan to pay the tuition AND keep my pay and benefits to support my family. My wife will continue to work part time and take care of the kids full time while I'm away from my family for 3 straight months. Then, as you know, they will continue to put up with my 24 hr shifts, and add on to that my clinicals and rides for another total of around 400 hrs.

What makes you so different with the rest of us or anyone who has sought higher education? 400 hours is about 1/3 of what other heath care programs (including a good 2 year Paramedic degree) require in clinicals. No one is telling you to go through 4 more years of college as those who want to enter other health care professions must do. Look at Phyisical Therapy. That profession wants a Masters at entry with a doctorate preferred. Yet, many still make the sacrifices it takes if that is what they want to do for a CAREER and not just a job with a union card.

And yes if you choose a private medic school for your training you will pay for it heavily financially whereas a state college will have more reasonable tuition and may even take your previous education into consideration. If you want to be a good Paramedic and not just brag about having a patch, go with a quality school.

If you or your family can't survive for 3 months of training then you may have other issues that need to be worked out before you start any project. If you lack the confidence in yourself or your family maybe you should just be satisfied with what you have until whatever other issues are resolved.

 

[MrBrown]

You've never mentioned why you want to become a Paramedic: money? skills? fancy toys? flash patch?

Our ALS course is four years, ILS is three, I can only immagine the quality of graduate you'd get out a 3 month wonder tech-cert-gone-horribly-wrong type of patch factory.

 

[Ridryder911]

Amazing, there is always an excuse! Either do it right or don't do it at all. If we had that type of attitude then EMS would have the proper respect and benefits associated to a profession.

Does one think that nursing or any other medical related profession does not require sacrifices, yet we don't see them whining as much. Of course then again, they as a profession require a formal education prior to entering the workforce (yes, we are the only health profession that does not.

R/r911

 

[sleepless near seattle]

Wow, you two really read a lot in to what gets said and go off on a lot of tangents. Enjoy the rest of your forum careers, and welcome to a third insane blogger, I'm done.

 

[reaper]

You asked for advice, then get defensive when they don't agree with you!

 

[ffemt8978]

I've removed 16 posts from this thread that were completely off topic.

If I have to do it again, those involved will be getting a forum vacation.

 

[Achromatic]

Just starting an IV does not make you ALS. Who cares if you can start an IV if you don't know why or can do little else once the IV is started? Washington is also known, but not in a good way, for its 7 or 8 different certs with some based on ONE skill and is often used as an example of the fragmentation that has taken place in EMS education and certifications. That is truly something not to be proud of. Imagine if all the other health care professions had a state or national level "cert" just for one skill and every skill they could do.

I am -so- glad that as of about 25 hours ago, Washington state is now an NREMT state.

 

[JPINFV]

So... umm... is Washington doing away with the IV, airway, IV/Airway, intermediate life support, and intermediate life support/airway levels or just starting to use NREMT for first responder and EMT-B?

On the bright side, what ever disservice that having so many middle level is doesn't compare to the fraud that Iowa commits against its citizens by calling an EMT-I/99 a "paramedic."


Edit: Actually, it does look like Washington did away with the intermediate levels:
http://www.doh.wa.gov/hsqa/emstrauma/download/draftwac246-976.pdf

 

[Achromatic]

So... umm... is Washinton doing away with the IV, airway, IV/Airway, intermediate life support, and intermediate life support/airway levels or just starting to use NREMT for first responder and EMT-B?

On the bright side, what ever disservice that having so many middle level is doesn't compare to the fraud that Iowa commits against its citizens by calling an EMT-I/99 a "paramedic."

To the very best of my knowledge, ILS is not recognized on a statewide level (unsure if any counties implement, but certainly not King (Seattle), Pierce (Tacoma), or Thurston (Olympia)).

EMT-P's have been on NR for a little while, and now FR and -B are joining them.

Though I am new to the whole thing, also to my knowledge, IV / Airway techs are not used in a prehospital emergent care context (hence my question much earlier in the thread querying the original poster on this - unfortunately 'coastal' Washington encompases 5-9 counties, depending on your perspective - Pacific, Grays Harbor, Jefferson, Clallam, San Juan, Whatcom, Skagit, Snohomish, Kitsap)...

 

[MrBrown]

.....unfortunately 'coastal' Washington encompases 5-9 counties, depending on your perspective - Pacific, Grays Harbor, Jefferson, Clallam, San Juan, Whatcom, Skagit, Snohomish, Kitsap)...

So where is Grey's Anatomy?

 

[EMSLaw]

Edit: Actually, it does look like Washington did away with the intermediate levels:
http://www.doh.wa.gov/hsqa/emstrauma/download/draftwac246-976.pdf

Seems like they're going with the EMR > EMT > AEMT > Paramedic levels from the National Scope of Practice Model.

Good for them, definitely an improvement over the schizophrenic system they had.

Though it seems like they are making one year of EMT experience a prerequisite for Paramedic training by law, which kinda stinks.

 

[VentMedic]

Though I am new to the whole thing, also to my knowledge, IV / Airway techs are not used in a prehospital emergent care context

This was mentioned because of what the OP stated:

We are a damn good ALS agency that DOES have IV techs who DO start IV's.

 

[medichopeful]

So where is Grey's Anatomy?

Probably where you left your sense of humor

I kidd I kidd.

 

[AKidd]

I kidd I kidd.

Yes? You called? Oh, sorry, I'm A Kidd... never mind. h34r:

 

[medichopeful]

Yes? You called? Oh, sorry, I'm A Kidd... never mind. h34r:

Boo!

 

[JPINFV]

You get a Rick Roll and a rimshot.