But, I'm a pilot.

[NomadicMedic]

And there's no monitor, EKG leads or therapy pads in sight and they've left the guys shirt on... but they've already drilled an IO.

This whole thing is propaganda of the most vile sort.

 

[NysEms2117]

"I want my tax dollars spent to keep firefighters super muscle-y," said no taxpayer ever!

Idc what they look like as long as they can carry my fat *** out of a building lol.


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[akflightmedic]

Look at all that diversity!!

Male....Check
White...Check
Muscles (stereotypical FF)...Check

Looks like a very well rounded department to me!


**Edited to comment that #2 MIGHT be Hispanic. So they got a token in there, I guess.

 

[SpecialK]

What a very funny poster!

Before co-response it'd be common to run a cardiac arrest with three to four staff; now it's more like six because four firefighters show up routinely.

There's very good evidence in the cardiac arrest database that routine co-response with the fire brigade increases survival.

As for anything other then cardiac arrest what's the point? I don't see one and neither do the fire service hence why they've been so strongly opposed to any medical duties! I know by reading the news from England and Australia they feel the same way too.

 

[Summit]

I'd speculate that co-response increased survival is 99% due to with compression fatigue, thus an autopulse or lucas device will offer the same benefits (per the studies) except you can do it with 1 $20K device instead of 4 extra $100+K/year (actual cost) firefighters in their $1 million dollar fire apparatus.

 

[DrParasite]

There's very good evidence in the cardiac arrest database that routine co-response with the fire brigade increases survival.

makes sense.... more firefighters means more hands to do compression, and because there are more fire engines than ambulances they tend to get there more quickly, leading to earlier start of compressions, which increase the chance of survival.

what the data doesn't support is if fire based ALS first response has better patient outcomes, but it does support the idea that BLS interventions are more time critical than ALS ones.

 

[Summit]

what the data doesn't support is if fire based ALS first response has better patient outcomes, but it does support the idea that BLS interventions are more time critical than ALS ones.

FD wants to bill for ALS to fund their low frequency high cost fire protection business, and they don't like playing second fiddle.

 

[EpiEMS]

Looks like a very well rounded department to me!

Any felons?

As for anything other then cardiac arrest what's the point?

Lift assists, my good sir! Or technical rescue, I guess.

thus an autopulse or lucas device will offer the same benefits (per the studies) except you can do it with 1 $20K device instead of 4 extra $100+K/year (actual cost) firefighters in their $1 million dollar fire apparatus.

Or for those systems not progressive/willing enough to get a Lucas, they can always just have 2 FFs respond in a fly car - seems like a nice happy medium (more expensive than a Lucas from an economic perspective, but not from a status-quo budgetary one).

 

[EpiEMS]

FD wants to bill for ALS to fund their low frequency high cost fire protection business, and they don't like playing second fiddle.

To this point, it could very well be that the fire service needs to rethink its model...
Perhaps they would be well served to meet with Falck or Rural Metro or, you know, consolidate stuff that isn't needed very often?

 

[Summit]

To this point, it could very well be that the fire service needs to rethink its model...
Perhaps they would be well served to meet with Falck or Rural Metro or, you know, consolidate stuff that isn't needed very often?

That would mean deviating from the mindset of: Expand Kingdom, Buy Apparatus, Maintain Staffing

 

[VentMonkey]

I gave up fighting this fight years ago, and moved to a place that very much let's pilot fly, and carpenters build houses.

That being said, every now and again there's talk about the departments becoming ALS. Can it happen? Sure. Will it happen? Who knows. I have found most fire-based ALS programs to typically be a fraternity-styled delivery models with a few former long time paramedics sprinkled in that can manage to pull off both fairly well.

The reality is, even almost 17 years later, the aftermath of 9/11 is something that they continue to bank on. Now if that isn't opportunistically immoral I don't know what is.

 

[EpiEMS]

The reality is, even almost 17 years later, the aftermath of 9/11 is something that they continue to bank on. Now if that isn't opportunistically immoral I don't know what is.

It's certainly a message that resonates with the public, whether it should or not...but hey, it works for fire - gets municipalities without any meaningful targets to buy and staff significant fire resources "just in case" of a CBRNE incident.

 

[VFlutter]

Just saying every one of those dudes is jacked beyond belief lol

The Captain looks a little scrawny ha

 

[Handsome Robb]

I'd speculate that co-response increased survival is 99% due to with compression fatigue, thus an autopulse or lucas device will offer the same benefits (per the studies) except you can do it with 1 $20K device instead of 4 extra $100+K/year (actual cost) firefighters in their $1 million dollar fire apparatus.

We're looking at our survival rates pre/post Lucas and they actually went down when we switched to the Lucas. Too much time off the chest early on in the resuscitation to apply it. We've done a lot of tweaking and training and survival rates are at where they were before and moving towards better the more we mess with our system of applying it.


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[Scott33]

I've visited a couple fire stations in various other countries (for example England and Australia) and sort of casually asked if they have any involvement in medical work, specifically interested in their first-responding to cardiac arrests. The answer has sort of been a perplexed look, then a firm "NO" usually followed quickly by "and we want to keep it that way". In England, the union had even sought a court order to legally prevent them responding to cardiac arrests.

Times are slowly changing. It may have been the case that the mere suggestion UK fire bods co-responding to medical emergencies has been met with considerable resistance. However, recently there have been several new schemes around the UK aimed at doing just that.

http://www.derbys-fire.gov.uk/files...regional_Emergency_First_Responder_scheme.pdf

http://www.secamb.nhs.uk/about_us/news/2016/surrey_co-responding.aspx

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-35581157

http://www.gov.scot/Resource/0046/00460152.pdf

 

[Operations Guy]

What if I'm a fighter pilot in a county ran fighter pilot service. Problem solved cause carpenters are carpenters only like it should be!

 

[Summit]

What if I'm a fighter pilot in a county ran fighter pilot service. Problem solved cause carpenters are carpenters only like it should be!

I'm a nuclear stealth bomber pilot!

I think...

The metaphors are getting confusing...

 

[Flying]

I'm a flight attendant.

Flight attendants save pilots' asses.

 

[Summit]

I'm a flight attendant.

Flight attendants save pilots' asses.

Who saves carpenter's asses?

 

[Operations Guy]

Who saves carpenter's asses?

Carpenters Union who sells home buyers with fear.....