Did I do everything I could have/did I do anything wrong?

[Sasha]

WHERE in the EMS books does it say your life is worth less than others, and that you are supposed to put your life on the line for other people who are already sick/injured?

Who is going to support your family or pay your medical bills when you're in the hospital from getting run over?

Do you know hospital bills are one of the leading causes of bankruptcy?

 

[ffemt8978]

If the fact that I even stopped was the only thing that was going to be discussed I would have never even asked, I was referring to what I did for the people involved in the MVA, I made the choice to stop and I stand by that choice. I have two BIG EMS stickers on my back window, how would that look if I just rolled on by when no one was on site to help them yet? I could have EASILY been sued for not stopping or offering to help in anyway.

You can be sued for anything. You're also making the assumption that the people involved would have noticed your stickers, remembered your vehicle description and license plate, and then gone through the effort to have you identified from the plate, find a lawyer willing to file the lawsuit and have you served, and then be able to make the case that because you didn't stop you caused further harm to the victims.

You come up on the scene of an accident, in a vehicle with two "BIG EMS" stickers on it and an "e light" on a jeep. You have no equipment to treat anybody who is seriously injured, so what's the best tool you have available to you to help them? A cell phone.

The aid that you are going to be able to give when off duty is limited to very basic first aid. If they are seriously injured nothing you are going to be able to do on scene is going to make much difference in their final outcome.

In my EMT class they stressed the importance of duty to act, on and off the clock.

Your class taught you wrong, then. NV does not require you to act when off duty.

 

[ffemt8978]

I live in KY. I will have to find the link, but that is the way it was a couple of years ago. I had a friend who is a medic, get a summons for court because he came up on an accident and didn't stop to help. Someone who knew he was a medic told the police that he drove on by and didn't stop. That is how they found out he was there.

If you do find the law, please update the other thread and I will update the first post. Thanks.

 

[Blessed187]

You have no tools with you. You can't do anything to help anyone.

I am no risking my safety for someone else. Or did you skip that chapter and go right to the "cool stuff"

LMFAO! I couldn't have done anything to help huh? Do you just stand around all day and collect a pay check? The "cool stuff" as you mentioned involves how to save someone's life and offer care at an EMT-B level. If your just in it to save your own *** why would you be in the field to help others?

 

[ffemt8978]

LMFAO! I couldn't have done anything to help huh? Do you just stand around all day and collect a pay check? The "cool stuff" as you mentioned involves how to save someone's life and offer care at an EMT-B level. If your just in it to save your own *** why would you be in the field to help others?

Seriously, what can you do as a lay rescuer that would actually save somebody's life? Use an AED if you have one with you, perform the Heimlich Maneuver, and apply dressings to bleeding.

At the EMT-B level, there are a few other things that can be done, but remember, when you stop at the side of the road while off duty, you are NOT responding as an EMT-B.

 

[Sasha]

Sweetheart you will learn EMS is rarely saving a life. The "cool stuff" you talk about is not part of the day to day. Do yourself a favor and get out of this "always on" mentality and learn what EMS really is.

 

[mycrofft]

Partially disagreeing with ffemt

"The aid that you are going to be able to give when off duty is limited to very basic first aid. If they are seriously injured nothing you are going to be able to do on scene is going to make much difference in their final outcome".
Actually, learning when not to do something will be the greatest good, especially when you are unequipped and understaffed and EMS is not far off.

 

[Handsome Robb]

Edited for bad reading comprehension haha

 

[ffemt8978]

"The aid that you are going to be able to give when off duty is limited to very basic first aid. If they are seriously injured nothing you are going to be able to do on scene is going to make much difference in their final outcome".
Actually, learning when not to do something will be the greatest good, especially when you are unequipped and understaffed and EMS is not far off.

I agree with that, and was working up to it.

I'll argue the point that even as a layperson, bleeding control, the heimlich and AED use is all ok.

AED isn't available on the freeway though so that point is moot.

That's what I said. As a lay rescuer, those are about the only interventions I could think of that would actually "save somebody's life".

 

[Anjel]

Just give it a year. She will change. she will realize it isn't about saving lives. It is about just helping others and doing no harm.

 

[Blessed187]

There are lot's of things an EMT-B can do for a patient with no medical supplies.

Some of you just get on here just to pick fights and look down your nose at people who are of a different skill set. I asked for simple comments regarding the situation as a whole not to nit pick and the fact I chose to stop to offer whatever help I could, and talk about law suits and other non-important bs. I really have to wonder why the hell some of you are in EMS at all. Is that all you care about? Then to get on here and talk a bunch of crap when YOU yourselves have posted threads asking others for basic input?

 

[HotelCo]

There are lot's of things an EMT-B can do for a patient with no medical supplies.

Such as?

 

[Sasha]

You seem to be good at telling who should and shouldn't be in EMS.

 

[ffemt8978]

There are lot's of things an EMT-B can do for a patient with no medical supplies.

Some of you just get on here just to pick fights and look down your nose at people who are of a different skill set. I asked for simple comments regarding the situation as a whole not to nit pick and the fact I chose to stop to offer whatever help I could, and talk about law suits and other non-important bs. I really have to wonder why the hell some of you are in EMS at all. Is that all you care about? Then to get on here and talk a bunch of crap when YOU yourselves have posted threads asking others for basic input?

But you weren't acting as a EMT-B when you stopped...you were acting as a lay rescuer. If you provide care beyond what is the accepted norm for a lay rescuer, you can face the following actions:
1) Lose your EMT cert
2) Be sued
3) Be charged with practicing medicine without a license

Since NV requires EMT-B's to be affiliated with an agency and have medical direction, have you brought up this incident with them?

 

[Blessed187]

You seem to be good at telling who should and shouldn't be in EMS.

No that's your job, remember?

 

[JPINFV]

:huh: I'll take the risk of a lawsuit to save someone's life, if my best "tool" is a cell phone then why the hell did I become an EMT???? O no wait, I'm only allowed to help someone who may be hurt while on the clock?? WTF?

Realistically, what are you going to do to treat a car accident victim without the proper tools to do the job? The best thing you can do is communicate a proper assessment to 911 to ensure the correct amount of resources is dispatched.

 

[Handsome Robb]

MVA standard response is ILS Engine, ALS unit, 2 pd. If extrication is needed a truck responds on top of the engine and the engine can clear once the extrication is complete. Always a charged line with a FF in full PPE including SCBA during extrication operations here.

 

[JPINFV]

Also if you come up on an accident and you are in the EMS field and do nothing and you leave you can be sued for not giving medical attention.

 

[mycrofft]

ffemt, got ya. I thought so. Note to OP.

OP, yeah, the forum can seem top-heavy with criticism and folks can seem overly flippant and sarcastic.

There is a strong sentiment here against "eager beaver new folks responding on their off time", (aka "Whackers") and it has become an archetype.

Not to say this applies to you, but many of us have seen eager but unequipped and unexperienced people flittering around events and it is bothersome, not to mention dangerous. Many of us were one of "those people" when we started. (NOTE: many obvious typos and lack of syntax in a post also seems to initiate negative responses too).

I think you did ok, and will continue to develop a personal and "professional" ethic and philosophy with time and experience, as we all should. In response to your original question, you did more than you could have done, you did no harm. Not looking down my nose, just speaking from experience. (Looking down my nose just makes me cross-eyed).:wacko:


A sidebar to the gallery, not exactly appropos to this: "Good Samaritan", at least in California, will not cover you if superior medical authority is present and you continue to freelance; this was adopted, I'm told, to curtail people squatting in waiting rooms or parking lots and offering to treat or give advice, but also establishes the on-scene supremacy of arriving official medical EMS. Interestingly, giving or taking of a report between official and ad hoc responders is not covered. That will be next year....

 

[mycrofft]

JPINV, yes in (at least) California you can be cited if you have started care.

You can leave if it is unsafe, or to get help or the pt is deceased (that counts as getting help I guess), but part of "good faith" is to remain once care is initiated. I was told the rationale was that other potential good sams might pass by if they see someone is helping; if you split, then the aid process starts all over, but later and maybe with a sicker pt.
Not stopping at all...I know some states might have laws forbidding health professionals from driving by without stopping (Nebraska was considering one when I left) but it is essentially unenforceable and probably unconstitutional.

I am getting that "5=4" feeling about playing the "you could be sued" card in discussion.

I heard about a lifeguard who was sued by the parents of a kid he restrained (without injury) from knifing someone he argued with at a volleyball game.

Suits are like bees, sometimes you just get stung no matter what, but don't drip honey on yourself and complain when you get nailed big time.