Stretcher wars...

[PCT EMS]

I'm specing out new stretchers for a BLS transport/ALS intercept concept.

The Ferno 28-Z PROFlexx seems to be the only model that can become
a stair chair (albeit, maybe a bit of a heavy one).

Does anyone know if this meets the requirement (DOT or otherwise) of both
the primary stretcher and stair chair for minimum equipment?

Crews in our rural area use both often, so being able to remove the stretcher and not have to get the stair chain instead or in addition seems logical. Is this correct? Field Comments?

 

[Jim37F]

I've used the Ferno 28Z ProFlexx, and I love them vs the Stryker X Frames I currently have, and would rather we get the Fernos vs the Stryker Power Load system we actually are getting. That said.....unless you're talking about curbs and 2 or 3 little stairs in a sidewalk coming up to someone's house or in a condo/apartment complex, the Ferno is NOT a stair chair. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO USE IT TO CARRY A PATIENT DOWN A FULL STORY OF STAIRS. Now it'll handle those short little 2 or 3 stair sets better than the Stryker because it is lighter and in chair mode you can lean it back on the rear wheels and SLOWLY drop down a step at a time without having to have someone completely support the weight at the other end like the Stryker.....but remember, the 28Z is still 82 pounds (according to Ferno), you do NOT want to carry it down a full flight of steps, even without a patient on it. The standard Stryker Stair Chair we use is about 30 pounds for comparison.

It folds into a chair mode, which is awesome because you can squeeze into tighter places a lot easier than Stykers, and the way the legs fold up under it when loading/unloading from the ambulance make it so simple, just push in/pull out, so much easier than the Strykers....but you DO NOT want to try and use it as a primary stair chair. You will only hurt yourself and your patient, it is too big, too heavy to be used as such. Invest in proper equipment.

 

[PCT EMS]

I've used the Ferno 28Z ProFlexx, and I love them vs the Stryker X Frames I currently have, and would rather we get the Fernos vs the Stryker Power Load system we actually are getting. That said.....unless you're talking about curbs and 2 or 3 little stairs in a sidewalk coming up to someone's house or in a condo/apartment complex, the Ferno is NOT a stair chair. DO NOT ATTEMPT TO USE IT TO CARRY A PATIENT DOWN A FULL STORY OF STAIRS. Now it'll handle those short little 2 or 3 stair sets better than the Stryker because it is lighter and in chair mode you can lean it back on the rear wheels and SLOWLY drop down a step at a time without having to have someone completely support the weight at the other end like the Stryker.....but remember, the 28Z is still 82 pounds (according to Ferno), you do NOT want to carry it down a full flight of steps, even without a patient on it. The standard Stryker Stair Chair we use is about 30 pounds for comparison.

It folds into a chair mode, which is awesome because you can squeeze into tighter places a lot easier than Stykers, and the way the legs fold up under it when loading/unloading from the ambulance make it so simple, just push in/pull out, so much easier than the Strykers....but you DO NOT want to try and use it as a primary stair chair. You will only hurt yourself and your patient, it is too big, too heavy to be used as such. Invest in proper equipment.

Thanks for that input. I would not buy without trying and I'm really thinking as much about crew as patient. I would think that someone would have designed a better carbon fiber option at this point. Still think it looks like a killer option and we're gonna look into other ways of reducing the MEL for simplicity and weight savings overall. Cheers Jim!

 

[DrParasite]

Why does your stretcher need to turn into a stair chair?

When I was on the ambulance, I always took a carrying device into the house, typically a stair chair. More than once have I carried out wheeled the patient out of the house, down the driveway, to the back of the ambulance, and then transferred them to the cot for transport in the ambulance to the hospital.

A stretcher is heavy and bulky, I DON'T want to ever have to carry it up more than 3 steps

 

[Tigger]

Can you adjust the height of a 28Z or is it only ever the one height?

 

[hometownmedic5]

I don't see the problem with a standard stair chair. I can't imagine any combination device that wouldn't pre prohibitively heavy. I haven't actually weighed these devices, but anything heavy duty enough to be a stretcher can't be light enough to be a stair chcair without adding unnecessary weight.

I have personally never seen a combination device that didn't represent a significant sacrifice in at least one of its functions.

 

[Jim37F]

Can you adjust the height of a 28Z or is it only ever the one height?

One height only. Legs are either fully extended, or fully collapsed. In chair mode the back is pretty much full Fowlers.

 

[Tigger]

One height only. Legs are either fully extended, or fully collapsed. In chair mode the back is pretty much full Fowlers.

Can you stand and pivot people into them or are they too high?

 

[Jim37F]

Stand and pivot wad our preferred method. When folded up, the bottom of the leg portion of the stretcher folds out into a little step that they can use. If not then we'd just GS them into the gurney, pretty much the same as we do at my current service with our Strykers.

 

[EpiEMS]

If you don't do a stair chair that has tracks (or don't have lots of lift assistance available), you're just begging for workers' comp claims.

 

[Handsome Robb]

That thing looks like a nightmare.

Stryker PowerPro and the Stryker tracked stair chair FTW. The Ferno stair chairs are a PITA.


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[Jim37F]

That thing looks like a nightmare.

Stryker PowerPro and the Stryker tracked stair chair FTW. The Ferno stair chairs are a PITA.


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After using both, I still say give me the 28z ProFlexx lol

But give me that AND a stair chair

 

[EpiEMS]

@Jim37F, after we got power stretchers and power lift, I don't want *anything* to do with manual stretchers.

 

[NomadicMedic]

We've got two power stretchers and one load system. I'm spoiled.

 

[Jim37F]

@Jim37F, after we got power stretchers and power lift, I don't want *anything* to do with manual stretchers.

We currently have the manual Strykers, but are switching over to the power ones, complete with the little trolley load system in the rig....def a lot nicer than the manuals, have had more than a couple patients where I've had the thought "too bad we didn't have the power loads for this guy".....but the nice thing about the 28z is that other than getting the patient into and off of the gurney, there is virtually no lifting at all. You literally just push it into the ambulance and the legs fold up under it as it goes in, no need to lift. Same when coming out, vritually a one man operation wit out havin to wait on electronic components. Unlike the Strykers where all 4 wheels can rotate 360°, which really means they love to roll away in every random direction (especially when the patient is trying to sit down on them), the Ferno has two fixed wheels, and 2 that can spin, so it'll still go wherever you want, but once the brake is applied, it stays put, doesn't roll away at whatever crazy 47° angle it wants like the Strykers do lol. Also because it goes into chair mode, that means it folds up to like half the length of a Stryker (ok maybe not exactly half if you take a ruler to it, but it is a LOT more compact). Meaning I can get the Ferno in and out of much tighter spaces, get it to the patient. The power lift system doesn't help your back at all when you have to leave it out on the front porch and carry the patient out of the narrow twisting hallway. Seriously, with the Stryker, we pretty much leave it outside then go and do recon inside just to see if we can get it closer (half the time we can't), vs my old job with the Ferno we'd go straight inside all the way to the patient far more often than not....anecdotally I find myself lifting and carrying patients far more often with Strykers simply because most people's homes in our service area they can't get as close to the patient as I could with the Ferno.

Sorry if this sounds like a sales pitch (if only I could get a commission! Lol) but seriously, after using manual Stryker X frame cots for my first year as an EMT, then using the Ferno 28z ProFlexx for an year and an half before switching jobs back to the Stryker for the last year, I really cannot think of anytime I would rather have a Stryker over Ferno....maybe once I get more time with the new Power Lift/Power Load system I'll change my mind, but really all the advantages of the ProFlexx are in areas where the Power Lift wouldn't apply...

 

[NomadicMedic]

I worked at a service* that had the old stryker H frame cots. Those really were nice.


*for you Cali guys, it was ProTransport-1 during their brief foray into King County Washington.

 

[Jim37F]

I worked at a service* that had the old stryker H frame cots. Those really were nice.


*for you Cali guys, it was ProTransport-1 during their brief foray into King County Washington.

When I used to work at Gerber before they shut down we had one old dinosaur of an H Frame cot, no one knew how to use it, so no one liked it lol

 

[NPO]

For what it's worth, we have both H frame Ferno and X frame power Stryker gurneys.

I can. It understate how much I hate the Ferno gurney. It looks like something Joe plumber built at home depot, and it sounds and handles like it too. Parts are stiff, movements are clunky and abrupt, and screws Re always backing out and the handle system to unlock the gear teeth is failure prone. I've never had a Stryker fail, be it manual or power X frame, but I've had SEVERAL Ferno H frames leave me stranded.

Maybe the problem is not Ferno vs Stryker but H vs X frame. But the design and craftsmanship of Stryker is better than Ferno IMO.

I have also use a power X frame Ferno and it was much better than the H frame, but it was abrupt in its adjustments and the Stryker was still better.

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[Kevinf]

We had a single Ferno (x-frame) among our Strykers and I have to agree with NPO. The Ferno seemed 'unfinished' in comparison to the Strykers. The only reason we kept it around was because it would take a bariatric plate if needed. We bought a Stryker Bari stretcher and the Ferno went into the landfill.

 

[TransportJockey]

We have a stretcher graveyard full of ferno power cots and old h frames. The old h frame fernos are our backups until we get our next shipment of Stryker power cots. I had never touched a ferno until I got out here and I wish I never had. They are absolutely a pain.

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