Raise of Minimum Wage

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RocketMedic

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Heck, everyone has to wait in line. It's not like triage for serious medical concerns is a problem anyway, emergency medicine works for the masses regardless of how much people make. Unless you're in a hyper-affluent area where there is literally a hospital only for rich folks (we've got them here, but they're not emergency hospitals), health care is an equalizer.

The rich simply tend to need less of it due to healthier lifestyles.
 

Christopher

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I forgot who said it but, "capital is a coward. It goes where it feels safest." Business owners will not think twice about taking their capital to other countries if they feel it is threatened here in the U.S. and I don't blame them.

This is the truth, but only for capital expenditures which are flexible in locale. EMS is lucky in this regard in that it is a local capital expenditure. Much like plumbing or carpentry or emergency medicine.

You currently can't outsource your EMS to Mexico or India...you'd have to import workers on a work visa. Or pay folks under the table.

Thankfully for EMS, we won't see this happen for two reasons:

1. We're held in such low regard that you won't see a class of visas carved out for foreign EMT's and Paramedics.
2. The requirements to be an EMT or Paramedic varies so greatly from State to State that most foreign nationals wishing to work for beans have no hope of getting reciprocity.

Due to the inability to transfer work outside the area where it is generated coupled with a myriad of hyperlocal regulations, you will likely never have to worry about the "outsourcing" of EMS or "EMS capital".
 

Veneficus

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It's also not like the other countries aren't going to retaliate. Sure, cheap assembly line consume crud like electronics aren't produced in the US. That doesn't mean we don't export a ton and that also doesn't mean that people would support higher prices for everyday goods. Protectionism isn't some panacia to our trade issues.

I never suggested that it was a panacea or that other countries wouldn't retaliate.

I also don't think Americans would be amiable to pay more for goods.

I do suggest that a better balace be reached.
 

Aidey

Community Leader Emeritus
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Lets keep this discussion to EMS wages and how they may be affected by changes in the minimum wage. I'm going to start getting real cranky real quick if this turns into a healthcare debate or a liberal vs conservative debate.
 

Christopher

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Lets keep this discussion to EMS wages and how they may be affected by changes in the minimum wage.

Simple: if you're below the new minimum wage you will receive a raise. If you are not below the new minimum wage, you probably will not.

It can possibly lead to wage lagging for older hires when compared to newer hires who start at a higher initial pay.
 

fortsmithman

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The rich simply tend to need less of it due to healthier lifestyles.

I can think of a few rich people who do not lead healthy lives
Charlie Sheen
Lindsay Lohan


If you want to up wages that is earned by EMS in the USA increase the education requirement needed and have more govt run EMS like it is in just about everywhere else on this planet.
 

Aidey

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Simple: if you're below the new minimum wage you will receive a raise. If you are not below the new minimum wage, you probably will not.

It can possibly lead to wage lagging for older hires when compared to newer hires who start at a higher initial pay.

If companies are forced to start at a higher initial pay, won't some of them probably just not give raises for a while to make up for it? So instead of getting a raise every year, you might not get a raise until you've worked there 3 years.
 

EpiEMS

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Simple: if you're below the new minimum wage you will receive a raise. If you are not below the new minimum wage, you probably will not.

It can possibly lead to wage lagging for older hires when compared to newer hires who start at a higher initial pay.

Hold on, though: employers can also fire people, cut their hours, etc.
There are lots of demand-side responses that can occur on a micro level.
 

TB 3541

Forum Lieutenant
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Fair tax.

http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer?pagename=HowFairTaxWorks

This way, everyone who buys anything past basic necessities cannot avoid paying into the system. If you want to save and invest, you can. If you choose to buy an expensive car, buy a big home, designer clothes, you get banged over the head for some $$$. That's the way it should be. How many stories have we heard in the ghetto where you roll into an apartment in some decrepit tenement, and inside is nice furniture, the huge flat screen, etc. Then they hand you a Medicaid card.

From the illegal aliens, to anyone working off the books while receiving assistance, to the alcoholic buying booze at 12:00 Sunday afternoon, they all now have to pay their part into the system.

Basically, if all you pay for is the true necessities of life, you pay little to no tax. If you want to treat yourself to some treats or a dinner out, if you want to buy a computer, a car, some bling bling, you're going to pay a heavy tax. That's the most fair way to go about it, IMO.

I do like this solution. I don't know how far it will get though because politicians will see this as a massive decrease in tax revenue to them, even if it is truly the same.
 

TB 3541

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I believe you are incorrect sir.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Promoting the general welfare means something different to me than what it means to you. As much as I love to debate, I don't think that anyone would appreciate this portion of the debate going further on this forum.
 

JPINFV

Gadfly
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Promoting the general welfare means something different to me than what it means to you. As much as I love to debate, I don't think that anyone would appreciate this portion of the debate going further on this forum.
Cough ...

here...

cough...
 

Veneficus

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Do you mean to tell me I'm NOT a special snowflake?

I guess you haven't heard that there is a limited pattern of snowflakes based on the the chemical formation of chyrstal structures?

(Damn those scientists again...)
 

Christopher

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If companies are forced to start at a higher initial pay, won't some of them probably just not give raises for a while to make up for it? So instead of getting a raise every year, you might not get a raise until you've worked there 3 years.

Wage freezes are very common, regardless of minimum wage changes. Outside of bigger companies, I'd wager the majority of hourly workers see few pay increases without a change in job title/description.
 

Christopher

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Hold on, though: employers can also fire people, cut their hours, etc.
There are lots of demand-side responses that can occur on a micro level.

Hours of operation are fairly inelastic for 911 EMS services. Hours of operation for IFT EMS services on the other hand...

Most private 911 companies typically pay above the minimum wage anyways, so this will be a non-issue. Where you'd see the firing/hour reductions is on the IFT side and hiring/wage freezes on the 911 side.
 

EpiEMS

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Hours of operation are fairly inelastic for 911 EMS services. Hours of operation for IFT EMS services on the other hand...

Most private 911 companies typically pay above the minimum wage anyways, so this will be a non-issue. Where you'd see the firing/hour reductions is on the IFT side and hiring/wage freezes on the 911 side.

Yep, that's what I was thinking -- I can't imagine that most 911 is run at the minimum wage (or below the proposed increase).
 

jd3123

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can't believe how many people here thinks raising taxes is our solution. These "evil" rich guys here in ny are paying 60% taxes, same in cali and jersey. Three of the worst economies in our country right there. Close loop holes and lowers taxes so you encourage businesses to invest in the u.s. You want to see how a functioning economy runs? look at Texas best run state by far and it is not close. When you have 17 trillion in debt I think it is time to look at our spending problem and what is the biggest cause of our debt? entitlements. And anyone who thinks the rich should pay more then 60% of THERE money is immoral.
 

jd3123

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Most reckless idea ever, we are the most hated country in the world and you want to cut defense by 50? just little over ten years after 911?
nationalize all education

edit:

and cut defense spending by at least 50%

especially weapon systems R&D.

Quit buying high tech weaponry that can't kill men in caves.
 

NYMedic828

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Most reckless idea ever, we are the most hated country in the world and you want to cut defense by 50? just little over ten years after 911?

You realize we already possess more high tech/super powered weapons than almost every other nation combined and have enough firepower to blow up the planet 100x over at the push of a button?

The next countries in line behind us in the arms race are our allies...

What more do you need that we need to continue to spend hundreds of billions a year. With that much money spent we should have a death star by now...
 
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jd3123

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You realize we already possess more weapons than almost every other nation combined and have enough firepower to blow up the planet 100x over at the push of a button?

What more do you need that we need to continue to spend hundreds of billions a year. With that much money spent we should have a death star by now...

yup but we need defense, after 911 we need to do whatever it takes to keep us safe.
 

ffemt8978

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