Has anybody seen this? Family Blames Medics After Pregnant Woman Dies in Ambulance

From the description, it sounded like a PE to me.
 
Yeah, so warfarin + DVT + fall down stairs + god knows what else ≠ "natural causes."

Man, the ER must have been an exciting place after the rig pulled up. Good day not to be working there.
 
KellyBracket said:
Yeah, so warfarin + DVT + fall down stairs + god knows what else ≠ "natural causes."
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She had all of that and naturally she died :)

KellyBracket said:
Man, the ER must have been an exciting place after the rig pulled up. Good day not to be working there.
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I was working as an ED tech when EMS brought in 2 seriously messed up pregnant women, both died in the ER with emergent c-sections done simultaneously in the trauma bay. One kid lived, the other was not viable due to gestational age.

That was an exciting day for sure. I live for stuff like that. (undoubtably I am a little off :unsure:)
 
I think this call was not handled well by the medics and that the patient would have had a better chance if transported to the hospital sooner however it's crazy how people assume she would have lived if she got there 3 mins earlier and that the medics are 100% to blame. Not defending the medics, they obviously could have done much better, but the comments like "the medics should go to jail for murder" are just idiotic.
 
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Yeah if not a PE I would guess an amniotic embolus. Had one long ago when she tossed it lying back for an exam. Worked her for 45 before we got pulses back. Even during the emergency section we were doing CPR. Mom lived with some residual stroke signs and the daughter ended up with CP but is doing great 11 years later.
 
Don't know the medics, wasn't there, but...

It seems like they may not have realized the acuity of the patient presentation.
 
I will say that whenever I find grandma with pneumonia lying flat in bed the first thing I do is sit them up, so I don't really see anything wrong with that.

I also don't think a 20 minute scene to hospital time is all that insane. But I agree with Kyle that it sounds like they didn't realize how sick the patient was.
 
Weird seeing a patient with respiratory distress....even PERCEIVED (by pt or crew) respiratory distress that they allow the patient to stay flat on her back. Then add in she is 9 months pregnant and again I ask at the most basic level, why is she flat on her back?
 
If anything she should have been in left lateral recumbent. IVC syndrome anyone?
 
Aidey said:
I will say that whenever I find grandma with pneumonia lying flat in bed the first thing I do is sit them up, so I don't really see anything wrong with that.

I also don't think a 20 minute scene to hospital time is all that insane. But I agree with Kyle that it sounds like they didn't realize how sick the patient was.
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Doesn't seem unreasonable to me either, that's probably better than most ALS scene times around here. I don't think that the public generally realizes that it's easy to get a patient worked up in the back of the ambulance on scene than anywhere else. For better or for worse, immediate transport to the hospital is often not the first thought, though in this case that may have been more appropriate.
 
bigbaldguy said:
Poorly handled. Would it have made a difference? Maybe maybe not but still very poorly handled.
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I don't think it would have made a difference.

But nobody cares. They care how it looks.
 
Aidey said:
I will say that whenever I find grandma with pneumonia lying flat in bed the first thing I do is sit them up, so I don't really see anything wrong with that.
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Apparently it's bad, wrong, and lazy to tell the patient to do ANYTHING. She was a big lady looking at the video.. I too would be telling her to do her part to sit on up.


"If they would have came here better trained, with all their equipment, oxygen on time, yes, she would have been maybe in the hospital still, but alive," said Morales.
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If 3 minutes mean THAT much, then it was already too late, no matter how "better trained, with all their equipment and oxygen" sooner would have been.





Having said that, the bag goes in with me on every call, no matter how BS sounding, just for such reason as we've all been sent to the toe-pain that became an arrest. That is really the only part I fault the crews on without any further info.
 
I kind of wonder what the dispatch was for. There is a big difference between an bravo "Fall, possible lift assist" and a delta "difficulty breathing, ALOC".
 
Although, not bringing anything into the house is a little strange. I don't know how you guys do it, but I bring an ALS bag (with oxygen) and a monitor in on EVERY call.
 
n7lxi said:
Although, not bringing anything into the house is a little strange. I don't know how you guys do it, but I bring an ALS bag (with oxygen) and a monitor in on EVERY call.
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I agree. It's just lazy to go in without equipment.
 
starting at the end and moving to the begining....

1) the door locks failed... they worked on scene (how else did they get the stretcher out), and failed for some reason. can't blame the crew for that (but I am sure the family will try to). it's just really really bad luck that they failed at that time.

2) 20 minutes from arrival on scene to arrival at the ER? that's better than most places.

3) so everyone gets a NRB at 15lpm immediately. regardless of if it's clinically indicated or not. The commissioner said it himself, if someone says they have difficulty breathing, they should get oxygen.

4) it's downright lazy to not bring ANY equipment in with you. even for a simple fall victim.

5) based on the article, and my experience as a dispatcher, this would be dispatched as a fall victim. her history as an asthmatic or her being on meds for a blood clot wouldn't affect my dispatch. the statement "she can't breathe" would absolutely upgrade it, but without listening to the tape, I don't know for sure. But knowing philly has an all ALS ambulance system (or used to, I heard they put on BLS trucks to handle the volume), i am assuming a paramedic crew showed up 3 minute after dispatch

Not for nothing, but this crew is being tried in the court of public opinion, just like the FDNY dispatchers were. Not allowed to defend themselves, and the city/agency isn't standing up for them either. The media is destroying their careers and they aren't even able to tell there side of the story.

And in my experience, when someone dies, and the family is looking for someone to blame, the story that they tell the press is rarely 100% accurate, and very often made without all the facts, and with a lot of angry emotions clouding their recollection.
 
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