Gold Cross Ambulance Strike

exodus

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Ive heard its much worse than that... rumor has it that the strikers are interfering with the 911 calls and are inhibiting the ambulance crews of doing their jobs while on scene of those calls. Rumors of course... I don't know if there is any hint of truth in that.

Do they not understand that every call they don't run, but we do, their company still gets in trouble for and fined... They're acting like children if these rumors are true.
 

Handsome Robb

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This strike is becoming more ridiculous as it keeps going on. If any of you have seen the comments on social media sites by the union president, throwing around the F-word like crazy toward company representatives, you'll understand that things are getting out of hand. These workers have mouths to feed and the union president is manipulating them into thinking they're fighting for some higher cause when it's really the well-being of the community that they should be focusing on.

When those who are on strike finally have to resort to work are threatened and slandered by their former peers, what is the real purpose of this strike anyway? It's not uncommon for some medics to be making $60-70k per year with a base pay rate in the $10 range and yet they have the nerve to demand more money. Many people seem to forget how quickly overtime multipliers and chart completion bonuses add up in this industry. Mind you, this for individuals with a 1 year degree, not even an associates degree.

In the end, it's important to understand all of the facts and circumstances that are not being mentioned before listening to the mindless banter of those who are on strike and have no regard for serving their community as they vowed to do.

How do you figure 60-70k/year at 10/hour?

I make 16.35/hr (soon to be more with a company wide raise) and my base salary is in the 42k range before taxes.
 

DesertMedic66

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How do you figure 60-70k/year at 10/hour?

I make 16.35/hr (soon to be more with a company wide raise) and my base salary is in the 42k range before taxes.

I'm assuming he/she is counting in picking up extra shifts.
 

MMiz

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Do they not understand that every call they don't run, but we do, their company still gets in trouble for and fined... They're acting like children if these rumors are true.
I don't understand why you aren't troubled by the fact that you and your company is undermining their efforts to gain safe equipment, fair compensation, and career stability.

I don't care if it's EMS, there is something to be said about advancing the profession by not crossing a picket line.
 

DesertMedic66

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I don't understand why you aren't troubled by the fact that you and your company is undermining their efforts to gain safe equipment, fair compensation, and career stability.

I don't care if it's EMS, there is something to be said about advancing the profession by not crossing a picket line.

So what just let their citizens suffer and not have EMS because they are on strike?

A 911 service always needs to be staffed to handle calls. If PD goes on strike and no one wants to or is allowed to "cross the line" does that mean we should go on looting sprees and start shooting people because there is no PD?
 

PotatoMedic

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There is also something about not leaving a community without proper emergency care. (Including transport to a hospital.)
 

MMiz

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So what just let their citizens suffer and not have EMS because they are on strike?

A 911 service always needs to be staffed to handle calls. If PD goes on strike and no one wants to or is allowed to "cross the line" does that mean we should go on looting sprees and start shooting people because there is no PD?
That's part of the problem with EMS. We're so blinded by doing the right thing at any cost, that we're willing to take abysmal pay, horrible working conditions, and even worse job security in the spirit of being a lifesaver.

Police, fire fighters and EMS threaten to go on strike frequently and sometimes actually strike. I'm sure you understand the sense or urgency negotiators would feel should their community not have access to EMS. I can guarantee you that a solution would be found promptly.

This isn't your battle to fight, but you're hurting your brethren at Gold Cross Ambulance when you cross the picket line to perform a service that should be provided by Gold Ambulance employees.
 
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PotatoMedic

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I can't think of a single fire or police department in my area that is allowed to strike. My understanding is that if they do strike it is instant termination.
 

DesertMedic66

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That's part of the problem with EMS. We're so blinded by doing the right thing at any cost, that we're willing to take abysmal pay, horrible working conditions, and even worse job security in the spirit of being a lifesaver.

Police, fire fighters and EMS threaten to go on strike frequently and sometimes actually strike. I'm sure you understand the sense or urgency negotiators would feel should their community not have access to EMS. I can guarantee you that a solution would be found promptly.

This isn't your battle to fight, but you're hurting your brethren at Gold Cross Ambulance when you cross the picket line to perform a service that should be provided by Gold Ambulance employees.

Yes it is a service that should be provided by GoldCross ambulance employees. However their employees are refusing to do that service. Their negotiations aren't going well at all (from what I've been hearing). So until their employees are willing to preform that service (once they make an agreement) their citizens are left without any form of EMS service.

There is no guarantee on how long a strike will last, so the assumption of "if no service is provided at all, they will settle very quickly" can not be made. The company could not have any money to pay their employees any higher wages (other 911 services in that area have gone under).
 

MMiz

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Yes it is a service that should be provided by GoldCross ambulance employees. However their employees are refusing to do that service. Their negotiations aren't going well at all (from what I've been hearing). So until their employees are willing to preform that service (once they make an agreement) their citizens are left without any form of EMS service.

There is no guarantee on how long a strike will last, so the assumption of "if no service is provided at all, they will settle very quickly" can not be made. The company could not have any money to pay their employees any higher wages (other 911 services in that area have gone under).
I don't understand who you are to make those determinations. Their employees are refusing to work in dangerous rigs. No one should have to work in a dangerous environment.

The rest of your arguments are all speculation. We don't have first hand knowledge of their negotiations, we don't know how long a strike would last without scab workers, and no one on this board knows if they have enough money to pay for the raises in salary and benefits workers are asking for.

I'm not an expert in EMS, and I'm not an expert in much, but I recognize the value of organized workers demanding a better quality of life and safer equipment. I recognize the value of a work action/strike, and how much scab workers can undermine their efforts.

I don't think labor unions serve many purposes today, but my conscience wouldn't allow me to actively undermine a group's efforts.
 

DesertMedic66

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I don't understand who you are to make those determinations. Their employees are refusing to work in dangerous rigs. No one should have to work in a dangerous environment.

The rest of your arguments are all speculation. We don't have first hand knowledge of their negotiations, we don't know how long a strike would last without scab workers, and no one on this board knows if they have enough money to pay for the raises in salary and benefits workers are asking for.

I'm not an expert in EMS, and I'm not an expert in much, but I recognize the value of organized workers demanding a better quality of life and safer equipment. I recognize the value of a work action/strike, and how much scab workers can undermine their efforts.

I don't think labor unions serve many purposes today, but my conscience wouldn't allow me to actively undermine a group's efforts.

Since we don't know anything about what is actually going on then we don't know how long negotiations will last. So once again we are in the same situation.

So what you would do is let the workers go on strike and not let any ambulance company (or companies) cover their area and put the citizens at risk?

They would call for mutual aid agreements to run calls. By not having our units already in their area it would take us 1-3 hours to respond to every one of their 911 calls.
 

MMiz

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Since we don't know anything about what is actually going on then we don't know how long negotiations will last. So once again we are in the same situation.

So what you would do is let the workers go on strike and not let any ambulance company (or companies) cover their area and put the citizens at risk?

They would call for mutual aid agreements to run calls. By not having our units already in their area it would take us 1-3 hours to respond to every one of their 911 calls.
In a typical business scenario the executives, or business owners, have all of the power. Just a few generations ago in the United States that meant that workers were compelled to work long hours in dangerous environments for little pay. The work day was often 16+ hours, the pay was just enough for a worker to get by purchasing food and staple items at the business store, and there was little protection if one was injured on the job. Lost an arm in a machine? You lost your job, your way to make a living, and you hope it grows back.

Labor unions helped organize workers to provide the group a stronger voice when negotiating with their employers. Labor unions fought for the eighth hour work week, minimum wage, and pushed for safety regulations that made working in America significantly safer. Workers now had a grievance process when complaining about company practices, and were afforded due process before being disciplined or fired. Labor unions levels the playing field between employers and employees.

A job action or strike is a fundamental tool for labor unions. They can't withhold pay, they surely can't fire anyone, but they can refuse to work until their demands are met.

The public is absolutely inconvenienced during a labor strike. When pilots strike it can shut down an entire airline, causing major chaos for a vital transportation service.

In the case of EMS, the company would be responsible for mobilizing a workforce to take the place of their workers on strike.That may mean calling for mutual aid, activating HEMS for every priority call, or even putting nurses and doctors on ambulances. It would be a major pain for the employer. This would pressure the employer to negotiate and come to a swift resolution.

The crux of my whole argument is that scab workers, those crossing picket lines and filling in for striking workers, hurt the industry
.

When scab workers and companies step in as a replacement for Gold Cross Ambulance employees, putting rigs on the road to respond to calls as normal, Gold Cross Ambulance executives have less incentive to negotiate an immediate end to the strike.

While my conscience wouldn't allow me to actively undermine a group's efforts and cross a picket line, that's a personal decision you have to make.
 

exodus

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So we should just let people die. Good plan. Because that is exactly what will happen. I honestly hope gold cross shuts down and someone like us or desert ambulance takes over.

The company is losing money and will lose contracts if they keep behaving this way, every mutual aid, aka us, is a call lost for them and a major fine.
 

Jim37F

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I don't understand who you are to make those determinations. Their employees are refusing to work in dangerous rigs. No one should have to work in a dangerous environment.

The rest of your arguments are all speculation. We don't have first hand knowledge of their negotiations, we don't know how long a strike would last without scab workers, and no one on this board knows if they have enough money to pay for the raises in salary and benefits workers are asking for.

I'm not an expert in EMS, and I'm not an expert in much, but I recognize the value of organized workers demanding a better quality of life and safer equipment. I recognize the value of a work action/strike, and how much scab workers can undermine their efforts.

I don't think labor unions serve many purposes today, but my conscience wouldn't allow me to actively undermine a group's efforts.

Is Gold Cross surviving by scab workers? Are there enough scab workers to field enough ambulances that Gold Cross can basically just ignore the strike and continue business as usual?

Or with the strike are the majority of EMS calls being handled by mutual aid from other companies that don't normally operate in the area? If so than Gold Cross will not make any money off a transport by AMR or whoever is picking up the slack. Not to mention any fines or penalties Gold Cross is incurring by not meeting contractual obligations with local governments to provide services.

So I fail to see how other providers stepping to pick up the slack and provide emergency medical services to the people in Imperial County are failing their brethren EMTs demanding (rightfully so IMO) better working conditions.
 

MMiz

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So we should just let people die. Good plan. Because that is exactly what will happen. I honestly hope gold cross shuts down and someone like us or desert ambulance takes over.

The company is losing money and will lose contracts if they keep behaving this way, every mutual aid, aka us, is a call lost for them and a major fine.
No one is going to die because of this work action, federal regulators wouldn't allow it. Right now the company is still operating, but instead of using their own labor they're exclusively using mutual aid.

I'm quoting your post for posterity. AMR... AMR... AMR (until they realize it's not profitable, close up shop, and lay off all of their employees with a couple weeks notice.)
 

exodus

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And were not running calls for gold cross, we are picking up mutual aid, just posting in the area because we know what's going on.
 

exodus

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No one is going to die because of this work action, federal regulators wouldn't allow it. Right now the company is still operating, but instead of using their own labor they're exclusively using mutual aid.

I'm quoting your post for posterity. AMR... AMR... AMR (until they realize it's not profitable, close up shop, and lay off all of their employees with a couple weeks notice.)

Amr will use desert ambulance which already has a foot hold out in the far north portion of the area.

Really? Nobody will die? What about the full arrests with rosc not going to be transported for an hour and half due to the wait for flight? Or stemis? Or strokes?
 
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exodus

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No one is going to die because of this work action, federal regulators wouldn't allow it. Right now the company is still operating, but instead of using their own labor they're exclusively using mutual aid.

I'm quoting your post for posterity. AMR... AMR... AMR (until they realize it's not profitable, close up shop, and lay off all of their employees with a couple weeks notice.)

Mutual aid which costs them money in fines with every call.
 

Jim37F

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No one is going to die because of this work action, federal regulators wouldn't allow it. Right now the company is still operating, but instead of using their own labor they're exclusively using mutual aid.

I'm quoting your post for posterity. AMR... AMR... AMR (until they realize it's not profitable, close up shop, and lay off all of their employees with a couple weeks notice.)

How do federal regulators keep anyone from dying?

How is AMR picking up extra business putting money in Gold Cross' bank account?
 
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exodus

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And morals aside. What gives them the right to destroy property taking emergency serviced out of service. I hope they catch the people who did it and lock them up for a while and get that felony on their record. We don't want those people around.
 
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