Anyone taken an accelerated EMT-P course?

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ammdancer1

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I was just curious, if anyone has, what you thought of it?
i.e.:
  • Was the extra money/tuition spent worth it in your mind?
  • Did you feel prepared for your NREMT-P/State Examination? And how long did you wait to take it?? Did you need to do any refresher/remedial work???
  • Is/was your primary endeavor at the point solely to be a paramedic? (i.e. were you also balancing other academics around that time? For example, if I were to take an accelerated course, it would probably be in the summer between spring and fall semesters of finishing an undergraduate degree.)
  • How long did you work as an EMT-B prior to the course? (hour estimates would be nice :D)
  • Do you have any other previous healthcare experience? (started a nursing program, ER tech, etc.?)

Just any general impressions/advice would be helpful and are appreciated... :)
Also, if you'd like to list where you attended such a program (since they are a bit more rare in my estimation) that would be great too, but not particularly what I'm asking for.

Thanks! :)

P.S. I took my EMT-B as an accelerated course and really didn't have any problems with it, besides being tired at the end of 12hr days, lol. (And having to wait 8 months to take my cognitive exam...) However, I know EMT-P programs are a wholeeeee 'nother ballpark. From what I hear, I might even say a totally different game.
 
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Popcorn - check
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all systems go for this one. proceed when ready./
 
Scoot over and make room for one more, KEV.
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KEVD18 said:
Popcorn - check
Beverage - check
Comfortable seating apparatus - check

all systems go for this one. proceed when ready./
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Epi-do said:
Scoot over and make room for one more, KEV.
Click to expand...

Guys...it's a new user asking [in his/her mind] a honest question. Wait a few posts before we start snaking down and having a brewski.
 
What's your undergraduate degree in? Are you looking at paramedicine as the end point of your career prep or as a steping stone to a different career?
 
Okay, okay guys. Sorry!!!
I looked through the first five pages for similar posts, and didn't find any. Guess I should have been a non-annoying forum user and used the search option... -_-

Still, I feel like some of my questions are still unanswered, at least in my specific situation.

I'm an athletic training, pre-PT and pre-med major at a major science and engineering university (it's rumored that our physics course required for pre-PT/med has the third highest fail rate of any course in the country... but anyway.) As athletic training is a professional allied health field, I have taken two anatomy courses (introductory and clinical) as well as physiology, exercise physiology, two injury assessment courses (UE and LE), two semesters of chemistry and physics at the major-level, and have over 600 clinical hours logged half-way through my program. Granted, I understand athletic training is NOT AT ALL emergency medicine. Yes, it includes initial emergency management, but we're only expected to manage a patient until EMS arrives. My point being, I feel like I have a decent academic background. For a paramedic course, do you guys think so?

I'm not really sure what I'm looking for to be as paramedic. I wouldn't consider it a stepping stone, but more of a "side-option." Okay, that makes it sound like a stepping stone... but here's where I'm at: I'm leaning towards PT school at the moment (med school is just so daunting...), but I really love what I've seen of emergency medicine. If I'm stuck in a clinic (as I likely will be, as my interests are pediatrics, dance medicine, and specific needs populations), I would like to work part-time with EMS -- or at least have the option to. If I end up going to med school, my current thoughts are physiatry (look it up!) or emergency med/trauma surg. If I do end up going the emergency med route, having experience as a paramedic I think would certainly give me a better understanding of the process as a whole. Also, because I'm still undecided as a undergrad sophomore, I'm considering taking a year or two "off" to work before going to grad school -- either working as a graduate assistant athletic trainer and saving up some money, or as a paramedic/in EMS, to hopefully give me a better feeling and help me decide.

I feel that I'm a very self-motivated, dedicated learner. I read textbooks for fun and watch surgeries online instead of TV (not joking...) But I still don't know if an accelerated paramedic program is going to be adequate/too stressful/etc. I'm used to long days (6am-11pm regularly, with maybe an hour break or two), but learning/retention/the brain in general is a tricky thing. ;)

I've heard very good things out of Pelham Training (formerly EMT Inc.) out of Bloomington, IN, and they have quite high exam pass rates. This is where I took my accelerated EMT-B. However, I do realize that passing exams means little to nothing in being successful in a career.

PHEW! Okay, enough rambling. Time to go buy more textbooks! lol.
I understand the apprehension and real question of accelerated programs, but my main question is do you guys think it's EVER really adequate (even with supplemental clinical experiences, etc.?) Can it be done right, even if by just a small percentage of students?

Thanks, and sorry for being an annoying newbie!
 
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fine, i'll play nice. below, you will find the list of people i feel are candidates for rapid/accelerated/shake n bake paramedic school:

cen/ccrn's with at least 5 years critical care experience and service as an emt basic.
md/do's with an emergency or critical care specialty and service as an emt basic.
pa/np's with emergency or critical care experience and service as an emt basic.

n.b. students of any of the above disciplines dont qualify.

anybody else imnsho doesnt meet the requirements to rush through medic school. however, im not on the admissions board nor an i the one loaning you the money so my opinion is essentially irrelevant, except for the fact that you asked for it.
 
I pretty much agree with Kevs list. What do you want to get out of school. If your willing to bust *** and study you can probably pass the exam at the end of the course. On the other hand chances are slim to none no matter how hard you study of being a competent medic at the end of the course. Your choice, I won't tell you what you can and can't do but if you think about what you're hoping to get out of school it will really help you figure out your answer.
 
Take an accelerated Athletic Trainer course... oh, you can't ... why not? Oh, because they want quality and educated graduates? Get my point.

Want to be in a profession then do it correctly or nothing at all. It will bite you in the end. With your basic science knowledge, it will be beneficial but not as many misinterpret "not complete".

R/r 911
 
I was paging through my PHTLS book and came across a quote that caught my eye. I'll paraphrase- "Your patients did not choose you to be their care provider. YOU chose to care for THEM. They deserve your very best at all times."

In short, I believe this includes your education. If you really want to be a paramedic, you will strive to be the best patient care provider at all times. This includes your choice of education.
 
Let's look at this from a slightly different angle. Right now the average Paramedic "training" is 900 hours with many states requiring less. Several require NO college prequisites.

If you strip away the Paramedic school's version of watered down A&P and pharmacology, you basically have a few hours of class, lab and clinical time. The PHRN and MICN cert classes come up with approximately 150 hours of class time to learn what they may not have been exposed to in their college A&P and pharmacology classes. RRTs can also fast track through college Paramedic programs by using their other sciences.

At least with that educational background and taking some type of Paramedic program, even if accelerated, is different than challenging the Paramedic exam which is what a few other healthcare professionals would do.

While many on this forum are striving to build up EMS as a profession, what we would like to see the minimum norm be and what it actually is are different points of view. Since EMS has not established higher standards across the board, it is difficult hold one poster to what we believe EMS should be while letting others with a whole lot less slide right on in through the same route or continue to be "trained" in the backrooms of FDs and ambulance stations.
 
When I first started in EMS I was gung-ho to keep going. I had my eye on the next level before I was halfway through Basic. Now that I'm an EMT, I find myself much more concerned with practicing at my level and doing it well. There's enough gaps in B level work to keep me busy for a while, and believe me when I say I devote a lot of extra time daily to studying, learning, CME's etc. I could not comfortably go to the next level without B level skills being second nature first. Keep that horse in front of the cart.

I don't think the word "accelerated" belongs anywhere in an EMS course or program.
 
KEVD18 said:
fine, i'll play nice. below, you will find the list of people i feel are candidates for rapid/accelerated/shake n bake paramedic school:

cen/ccrn's with at least 5 years critical care experience and service as an emt basic.
md/do's with an emergency or critical care specialty and service as an emt basic.
pa/np's with emergency or critical care experience and service as an emt basic.

n.b. students of any of the above disciplines dont qualify.

anybody else imnsho doesnt meet the requirements to rush through medic school. however, im not on the admissions board nor an i the one loaning you the money so my opinion is essentially irrelevant, except for the fact that you asked for it.
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ammdancer1,

Kev makes a good point! It is clearly illustrated by the results you attain when you have taken accelerated English and or typing classes.
 
KEVD18 said:
fine, i'll play nice. below, you will find the list of people i feel are candidates for rapid/accelerated/shake n bake paramedic school:

cen/ccrn's with at least 5 years critical care experience and service as an emt basic.
md/do's with an emergency or critical care specialty and service as an emt basic.
pa/np's with emergency or critical care experience and service as an emt basic.

n.b. students of any of the above disciplines dont qualify.

anybody else imnsho doesnt meet the requirements to rush through medic school. however, im not on the admissions board nor an i the one loaning you the money so my opinion is essentially irrelevant, except for the fact that you asked for it.
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The below information is to CHALLENGE the Paramedic exam without any type of Paramedic program accelerated or otherwise. Again, the word accelerated can be misleading since it can be and is done across this country by FDs and ambulance services to get more Paramedics on the trucks. The private schools may do it a little differently but the same concept is there. All that science stuff will just be skipped.

A list of the states that allow other healthcare professionals to "test out" on the Paramedic exam.

http://www.nasemso.org/NewsAndPublications/News/documents/NASEMSOsurvey051208.pdf


Examples:

http://www.emsa.ca.gov/paramedic/faq.asp

California
10. How do I become a paramedic if I am currently a MD, RN, MICN, or PA?


In order to apply for a paramedic license, the following documentation must be submitted to the EMS Authority for review:
  • copy of current MD, RN, MICN, or PA license;
  • <LI class=indent>documentation that training is equivalent to a U. S. DOT EMT-Paramedic National Standard Curriculum, a copy of which can be accessed at www.ems.gov/index.html then click on Education. A suggested way to provide this documentation is to submit a copy of your transcripts from your MD, RN, MICN or PA training, and it is highly recommended that you have also completed one of the following training courses:
    • EMT I Certification
    • MICN Course
    • EMT-P Refresher Course
  • documentation of successful completion of a field internship through an approved paramedic training program which includes 40 ALS patient contacts in a field setting. An ALS contact is the performance of one or more ALS skills, except cardiac monitoring and basic CPR, on a patient (each contact must be documented and signed by a county approved preceptor). Field contacts as a Flight Nurse, EMT II, or other prehospital ALS contacts may apply toward the 40 required contacts;
  • in addition, it is highly recommended that training in the following (or equivalent) be completed:
    • ACLS - Advanced Cardiac Life Support
    • BCLS - Basic Cardiac Life Support
    • PHTLS or BTLS - Prehospital Trauma Life Support or Basic Trauma Life Support
    • PEPP or PALS – Pediatric Education for Prehospital Personnel or Pediatric Advanced Life Support
The knowledge and skills from these courses will assist you in passing the licensure exam.
Once the EMS Authority has reviewed and approved the above documentation, you will be sent verification to submit with your National Registry of Emergency Medical Technicians (NREMT) Application that you have completed the equivalent training of a paramedic program. In addition, you will be sent a Paramedic License Application – Initial Applicant, and a Statement of Citizenship, Alienage, and Immigration Status for State Paramedic License Application/Renewal (Form IS-01) to complete and return to the EMS Authority with a check or money order made payable to EMS Personnel Fund in the amount of $230.00. Fees include:

Initial Application Fee
$100​
License Fee
$125​

State Licensing Match Fee
$ 5​


You will also be sent a Request for Live Scan Service Applicant Submission form and instructions for a Department of Justice (DOJ) criminal history check (see instructions on our website for submission of fingerprints).
Once you have submitted the documentation listed above and we have received the results of your criminal history check and NREMT test results you, will be issued a California paramedic license in most cases within 10 to 15 days.
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http://www.doh.state.fl.us/mqa/EMT-Paramedic/emt-lic-requirements.html#Initial
FLORIDA

Health Professional Licensure - Florida licensed physician, dentist, or nurse may apply for certification as a paramedic and subsequently challenge the paramedic exam, provided he/she holds a Florida EMT certificate which is current and in good standing. You are required to submit a copy of your current Florida license or registration.
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Florida may have recently added PAs.
 
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Let me continue this just a little further so I can get my plug in for higher education.

When your "training" is measured in "hours", the state doesn't care how long it took you to get those hours as long as they are met.

An EMT cert may require 110 hours which could be done in 3 weeks, 3 months or a year. If there are no other pre or corequisites such as a college level A&P involved, it is still 110 hours regardless of the length of time it took to finish the class.

The same for the Paramedic. Some states, like Florida, require only 700 hours to be a Paramedic. While there are many colleges that offer an Associates degree in Paramedicine, many still only do the 700 hours. For some, 701 hours of training/education is too long. Again, the state doesn't care how "long" it takes you to get the 700 hours. If you can get them finished in 3 - 6 months...great. You also have the option to stretch out the same 700 hours to 18 months. However, it is the same 700 hours regardless of if it was accelerated to shorten the time to get the 700 hours or if you spent only 2 hours per week in a classroom for the next 3 years.

That is why the Paramedic should be an Associates degree to have a consistency in measuring "hours" for training and education. This would eliminate the 3 month wonders. It would also close the loop hole that allows other health care professionals to challenge the Paramedic exam if the wording changed to "Associates degree in Paramedine required to apply for the test".
 
ptemt said:
ammdancer1,

Kev makes a good point! It is clearly illustrated by the results you attain when you have taken accelerated English and or typing classes.
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ive read this about nine times now and am at a bit of a comprehension road block. is this a dig at me or the op?
 
there are many variables that play out. I think it's important to ask your self what kind of student are you. If you feel you can handle a large course load in a short amount of time, it maybe worthwhile.

just consider this:
normal medic program (12 months where im from) will take away the majority of your free time. So, you can count on not having a life during the duration of a fast track program. Good luck in whatever you decide to do.
 
Okay, I've had enough accelerated-program bashing! I should start this by saying that I was a accelerated EMT-B student at Pelham Training, and I thought the program was great! I knew going into it that it would be an accelerated course, and made sure I was physically and mentally ready. It is not the first accelerated course I've taken (that was an intensive two-week parachute rigging school to become an FAA Senior Rigger), and it was not the first time I've taken the EMT-B course (that was in college in 2001, and I let my cert lapse).

I can say with absolute certainty that everything that was covered in my "normal" program was also covered in the accelerated one, but it all made more sense because it built on stuff you'd learned and practiced the day before, not the week before, or just before winter break, or... At the end of the class, we passed the same practicals I took in 2001, and a written test that was just as hard. The class was smaller (only 9 in mine), and for skills practice we always had two instructors available, meaning I got a whole lot more hands on time than I did the first time around.

The downside is that if you have a bad day, it can really get in the way. You have to be mature enough to be in class all day and then go home and study, and you may miss a bit for clinicals. All in all, it's a good trade-off.

Interestingly, my husband is an experienced pilot and took all of his advanced ratings in an accelerated format. We are both in agreement that for us, the accelerated program is the only way to go; we just learn better that way.

Oh, and for what it's worth, I passed my NR exam on the first try.
 
javajunkie said:
Oh, and for what it's worth, I passed my NR exam on the first try.
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Pass rate is no indicator of quality education. I could train in a months time a group of 20 decent EMT's on the NR test and at least 16 would pass first attempt, possibly more. Would I want these people to treat me or my family? No. Why? Because they are trained for the test. They were not educated in Medicine. Honestly they would have no real idea what to do in the field as all they were taught to do is memeorize skills and a few points about drugs.

The only way a excellerated program should exist is for real Medical Professionals like MD's, PA's, possibly RN's. They have a true medical background to build with.
 
javajunkie said:
Okay, I've had enough accelerated-program bashing! I should start this by saying that I was a accelerated EMT-B student at Pelham Training, and I thought the program was great! I knew going into it that it would be an accelerated course, and made sure I was physically and mentally ready. It is not the first accelerated course I've taken (that was an intensive two-week parachute rigging school to become an FAA Senior Rigger), and it was not the first time I've taken the EMT-B course (that was in college in 2001, and I let my cert lapse).

I can say with absolute certainty that everything that was covered in my "normal" program was also covered in the accelerated one, but it all made more sense because it built on stuff you'd learned and practiced the day before, not the week before, or just before winter break, or... At the end of the class, we passed the same practicals I took in 2001, and a written test that was just as hard. The class was smaller (only 9 in mine), and for skills practice we always had two instructors available, meaning I got a whole lot more hands on time than I did the first time around.

The downside is that if you have a bad day, it can really get in the way. You have to be mature enough to be in class all day and then go home and study, and you may miss a bit for clinicals. All in all, it's a good trade-off.

Interestingly, my husband is an experienced pilot and took all of his advanced ratings in an accelerated format. We are both in agreement that for us, the accelerated program is the only way to go; we just learn better that way.

Oh, and for what it's worth, I passed my NR exam on the first try.
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But, for education, you have nothing else to base how great an EMT-B program is in terms of educational value.

You have however enforced the fact that the EMT-B is still 110 hours of training regardless of how long or how short the class.
 
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