Would benadryl help anaphylaxis any?

chaz90

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Proof please. I'm very agreeable to believing what I see.
http://www.dmemsmd.org/sites/default/files/Quick Reference Guide.pdf

Here is one of the first links when I Googled "EMT OTC medication." It appears to be standing order Denver Metro guidelines. Page 1, in the upper left, lists EMT standing orders and states "OTC Medications: Aspirin; Ibuprofen; etc."

For future reference, since you clearly have Internet access, you may get more productive discussion when you do your own basic searches for information that most people understand to be intuitive.

Choosing to have intelligent debates using facts is great, but repeatedly implying that since you haven't seen it before it must not exist is not conducive to any kind of dialog.
 

GloriousGabe

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Yeah that's definitely within the same scope as what we got in my retched BLS system. Definitely not the "any OTC as long with a label".
 

DesertMedic66

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Maybe if you're a paramedic but definitely not if you're an EMT. I once asked if we can use a Pulse Ox (not in our protocols) and was told by the state medical board that I'd be practicing medicine without a license. We can't do anything unless we have a law that permits it and a protocols that tells us.
Please remember that you are just in one state. EMS changes greatly based on the area. Take my area for example, EMTs can not use a King airway, intubate, start an IV, IO, or give Narcan. Now if we slide over to Texas there are medical directors who have given their EMTs protocols or better yet guidelines that include King Airway, intubation, IVs, IOs, and Narcan.

CA has a statewide protocol list that county medical directors can not add on additional things to (unless they get approved for a trial study). Our medical directors can have use operate to the full extent of what is in the state protocols or can narrow it down as much as they want. Now you have other states who don't have statewide protocols and instead leave it up to the individual medical director to make protocols or guidelines that they want (which may include OTC medications).

Calling your state EMS board will get you responses based on your states protocols. So if your state does not have protocols for OTC meds then you are operating out of your scope (same with pulse ox). Just because that is true for your state doesn't mean it's true for other states.

I think I gave OTC meds once as an EMT but I got a base order from the doctor.
 

CALEMT

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I am reading very closely. I specifically asked about helping (aka assisting) someone in taking their own meds. The state EMS board said if we did anything other than ASA and NTG we'd lose our certifications. Thanks but no thanks. I don't know how anyone has protocols for that but I would LOVE to see them. Can you post a link?
Since you would LOVE to see protocols I am going to give them to you.

http://www.remsa.us/policy/
Treatment Protocol: REMS 4101
Universal Pt. "Flow chart": REMS 4102
Chest Pain protocol that ALLOWS the EMT to ASSIT with administration on prescription of Nitro and other clinically indicated medication: REMS 4402
Respiratory protocol that ALLOS the EMT to ASSIST with administration of prescription MDI AND Nitro or other appropriate med: REMS 4408
Hypoglycemia protocol that is a STANDING ORDER which ALLOWS the EMT to give Oral Glucose PO: REMS 4501
Anaphylaxis protocol that ALLOWS the EMT to ASSIST with administration of prescription Epi Pen or other clinically indicated medication: REMS 4601

So you see, yes there are places which allow you to administer prescribed medication. Furthermore, your way of thinking that every place is like yours is absolutely driving me up the freaking wall. Every county and state is different and just because you can't do something does not mean that I can't also. Oh and for the record we can use SP02 AND tritrate 02 and still be within our scope of practice (REMS 4102).
 

EMSComeLately

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Since you would LOVE to see protocols I am going to give them to you.

http://www.remsa.us/policy/
Treatment Protocol: REMS 4101
Universal Pt. "Flow chart": REMS 4102
Chest Pain protocol that ALLOWS the EMT to ASSIT with administration on prescription of Nitro and other clinically indicated medication: REMS 4402
Respiratory protocol that ALLOS the EMT to ASSIST with administration of prescription MDI AND Nitro or other appropriate med: REMS 4408
Hypoglycemia protocol that is a STANDING ORDER which ALLOWS the EMT to give Oral Glucose PO: REMS 4501
Anaphylaxis protocol that ALLOWS the EMT to ASSIST with administration of prescription Epi Pen or other clinically indicated medication: REMS 4601

So you see, yes there are places which allow you to administer prescribed medication. Furthermore, your way of thinking that every place is like yours is absolutely driving me up the freaking wall. Every county and state is different and just because you can't do something does not mean that I can't also. Oh and for the record we can use SP02 AND tritrate 02 and still be within our scope of practice (REMS 4102).
Ah, but in Gabe's way of protocol-as-gospel way of thinking, getting the patient some of the patient's juice for mild hypoglycemia wouldn't be allowed. It'd be glucose paste or nothing.
 

GloriousGabe

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Ah, but in Gabe's way of protocol-as-gospel way of thinking, getting the patient some of the patient's juice for mild hypoglycemia wouldn't be allowed. It'd be glucose paste or nothing.
Just watch a lawyer win when that happens.
 

SandpitMedic

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I can see Gabe is only on day 2 of EMS.
 

SandpitMedic

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:rolleyes:Oh... My bad.
 

GloriousGabe

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Is this based on reality or fear mongering in EMT class? There aren't squadrons of vicious lawyers lurking in the shadows waiting to prey on minimum wage EMTs assisting patients with orange juice and Tylenol.
How long have you been in EMS? Not long enough. Yes, there are lawyers who desire to scour everything and then sue. I'm on my third case now.
 

EMSComeLately

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Is this based on reality or fear mongering in EMT class? There aren't squadrons of vicious lawyers lurking in the shadows waiting to prey on minimum wage EMTs assisting patients with orange juice and Tylenol.
Regardless, perhaps Gabe could list the 4 elements of negligence. Of course standard of care needs to be considered in that.

Scenario for Gabe. You're a BLS crew responding to a sick person call. Conscious patient who can follow commands with BGL of 50 who refuses oral glucose, but states he has juice and crackers that normally works just fine, but can't walk to get them due to "whatever".

Do you whip out the refusal of care form? Do you excitedly phone med control? What do you do?
 

CALEMT

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How long have you been in EMS? Not long enough. Yes, there are lawyers who desire to scour everything and then sue. I'm on my third case now.
Im pretty sure Chaz has been doing this job longer than you and may know a thing or two more than you. Just a thought, take it with a grain of salt.

I'm curious, in going back to the original topic would you @GloriousGabe give your buddy PO benadryl?
 
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