States and EMT-B Morphine Administration

[paradoqs]

Tigger, do you have a url for that site pertaining to emt_iv scope? Funnily, in practice emt's push whatever they are told regardless of pt condition, and I bet alot of people dont even know about the rule you mentioned. I have a waiver for iv and odt zofran although its nowhere near as serious as morphine. If all basics do is get a good history, make pts comfortable and transport, how many calls do we get where thats all that is needed? A lot

Nevermind, i found the website

 

[Tigger]

Tigger, do you have a url for that site pertaining to emt_iv scope? Funnily, in practice emt's push whatever they are told regardless of pt condition, and I bet alot of people dont even know about the rule you mentioned. I have a waiver for iv and odt zofran although its nowhere near as serious as morphine. If all basics do is get a good history, make pts comfortable and transport, how many calls do we get where thats all that is needed? Alot

Try http://www.cdphe.state.co.us/regulations/ems/index.html. Then look at "Chapter 1 - Rules Pertaining to EMS Education and Certification." It's in section 5, located on page 7.

I will willingly agree that many of the emergencies that are handled by EMS can be handled by BLS without any detriment to the patient's condition. However, having a an advanced level provider available can improve the patient's condition. Pain and nausea management isn't going to save the patient's life but surely you agree that it is beneficial to the patient? I'm just arguing that EMS can do more than just make sure the patient is any worse by the time they arrive at the hospital. I'd have done a lot for some pain meds the last time I was in an ambulance, sadly the truck was non-narcotic ILS.

 

[Basermedic159]

Only because I haven't spent the time checking all off your posts yet.

Check them. I haven't done anything wrong other than state my opinion, just as everyone else here is doing. I'm rubbing people the wrong way because I disagree with some things, and state my opinion. Isn't that what this site is for?

What am I supposed to do? Not comment on things I disagree with or have a different method and or opinion, just because "I'm new"?

But check my posts, you'll see I haven't done anything wrong. I read the CR and T&C

 

[Basermedic159]

OK, since we are going to play on the semantics....................

I am not a Nationally Registered Paramedic, I only currently hold a Texas License. No where in my title or licensure does it say EMT.

Why am I being an ***? Simple.........

You come in here with your smart a$$ attitude waving around unsubstantiated statements and then have the audacity to say you are "new" and only complaining about things that you "think are incorrect or stupid". Who are you and on what grounds does your inexperienced opinion hold any validation of fact? MY friend, everyone is entitled to an opinion. But remember the old saying about opinions?

I believe if you altered your approach a bit and became more inquisitive instead of confrontational, you may get farther with this crowd. You may also learn something along the way...........................

Inexperienced? You don't know me or my level. What grounds does my "inexperienced" opinion hold any validation? - I imagine it's the same as everyone else.

 

[Basermedic159]

OK, since we are going to play on the semantics....................

I am not a Nationally Registered Paramedic, I only currently hold a Texas License. No where in my title or licensure does it say EMT.

Why am I being an ***? Simple.........

You come in here with your smart a$$ attitude waving around unsubstantiated statements and then have the audacity to say you are "new" and only complaining about things that you "think are incorrect or stupid". Who are you and on what grounds does your inexperienced opinion hold any validation of fact? MY friend, everyone is entitled to an opinion. But remember the old saying about opinions?

I believe if you altered your approach a bit and became more inquisitive instead of confrontational, you may get farther with this crowd. You may also learn something along the way...........................

Also, Who says I'm not here to learn? Appearantly thats not going to be the case because you can't contradict or question anyone w/o being accused of an altered approach or "guns blazing".....

 

[Flight-LP]

Perhaps it's the approach instead of the intent?

 

[Basermedic159]

Perhaps it's the approach instead of the intent?

I really think thats it and I cam off as being an A$$ but i'm not, time will tell.

 

[RocketMedic]

Inexperienced? You don't know me or my level. What grounds does my "inexperienced" opinion hold any validation? - I imagine it's the same as everyone else.

By your attitude, you're either new or don't want to learn to interact professionally.

 

[STXmedic]

From baser's most recent posts, he seems like he's making an effort to come off as less of an a$$... Let's ease up and give him more of a chance... Just sayin'

 

[Basermedic159]

From baser's most recent posts, he seems like he's making an effort to come off as less of an a$$... Let's ease up and give him more of a chance... Just sayin'

I am. Like I said I just went about things the wrong way. I understand people being pissed off about the way I went about things, but all I can do is learn from it and move forward.

 

[ffemt8978]

That is enough about the attitude of certain members, especially since it appears to have changed.

So lets get this back on topic before the dancing lock makes an appearance

 

[RipCity]

Not entirely true, the armed forces count as states to the NR and FedGov and allow poorly-trained EMT-Bs (68W10/20s) to administer quite a bit. Big ones on this list are morphine, fentanyl, and valium/versed.

Who says army medics are "poorly trained EMT-b's"?? Thats quite an insult and i hope you have some proof to back it up.

 

[STXmedic]

Who says army medics are "poorly trained EMT-b's"?? Thats quite an insult and i hope you have some proof to back it up.

Pretty sure Rocket is 68W...

 

[RocketMedic]

Who says army medics are "poorly trained EMT-b's"?? Thats quite an insult and i hope you have some proof to back it up.

I am an active-duty 68w and I'm saying it. The average 68w is a poorly trained EMT-Basic. Later on that may change, but every new medic in the Army starts like that.

 

[medic417]

Check them. I haven't done anything wrong other than state my opinion, just as everyone else here is doing. I'm rubbing people the wrong way because I disagree with some things, and state my opinion. Isn't that what this site is for?

What am I supposed to do? Not comment on things I disagree with or have a different method and or opinion, just because "I'm new"?

But check my posts, you'll see I haven't done anything wrong. I read the CR and T&C

Are your statements rude or attacking? If so that makes them rules violation.

 

[bw2529]

Are your statements rude or attacking? If so that makes them rules violation.

Ironic considering your avatar.

I'm just yanking your chain, but you see my point.

 

[Maine iac]

Who here has seen the TV show Trauma? It was on a few years ago and is floating around on Hulu. If you have not seen it is is great, well worth rotting your brain in front of the TV for that level of entertainment.

In one of the episodes the new basic on the team loads up a guy complaining of chest pain with nitro, and the pt hits the floor completely out. The medic rushes over and magically runs a 12-lead and says something about RVI causing the guy to collapse... The basic had no idea that the simple nitro which is given to everybody could be very dangerous.

Why do I bring that up? The entire premise around advancing ones skill level is the amount of education involved with moving through the ranks. Medics are trusted with giving medications because they are taught about them, the side affects, what to watch out for, what questions to ask.... Basics are not typically taught this.

IMHO if you as a basic want to give medications show that you have an understanding of the medication. This argument is way larger than "well.. .just give them preloaded syringes", or "only give them 2mg of MS," or any of the other useless answers that people are giving. WFT is 2mg of MS going to do? Nothing. The loading dose for somebody 100kg+ is 10mg MS...

Why are we not teaching BLS providers EKG interpretation (rural areas, long ALS intercept times)? Don't you want to save somebodies life by DIAGNOSING an MI? That is way more important than MS, and EKG interpretation is much easier to learn than even the basic pharmacology.

End of long rant- you want MS? Show me you know what you are doing with it.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Who here has seen the TV show Trauma? It was on a few years ago and is floating around on Hulu. If you have not seen it is is great, well worth rotting your brain in front of the TV for that level of entertainment.

In one of the episodes the new basic on the team loads up a guy complaining of chest pain with nitro, and the pt hits the floor completely out. The medic rushes over and magically runs a 12-lead and says something about RVI causing the guy to collapse... The basic had no idea that the simple nitro which is given to everybody could be very dangerous.

Why do I bring that up? The entire premise around advancing ones skill level is the amount of education involved with moving through the ranks. Medics are trusted with giving medications because they are taught about them, the side affects, what to watch out for, what questions to ask.... Basics are not typically taught this.

IMHO if you as a basic want to give medications show that you have an understanding of the medication. This argument is way larger than "well.. .just give them preloaded syringes", or "only give them 2mg of MS," or any of the other useless answers that people are giving. WFT is 2mg of MS going to do? Nothing. The loading dose for somebody 100kg+ is 10mg MS...

Why are we not teaching BLS providers EKG interpretation (rural areas, long ALS intercept times)? Don't you want to save somebodies life by DIAGNOSING an MI? That is way more important than MS, and EKG interpretation is much easier to learn than even the basic pharmacology.

End of long rant- you want MS? Show me you know what you are doing with it.

Basing an argument on Trauma? LMAO. It sparked a number of debates when it was on and the general consensus was that it was crap and a disservice to EMS. There is a reason why it never even completed a single season.

That said, I agree with you general reasoning for the average EMT (maybe not as it pertains to nitro; every FR should know that). Solution: keep the scope small or increase EMT standards for education. IMO, the EMTs that think they should have more drugs in their box are either new and do not understand the validity of you statements regarding pharmacological knowledge. Or they are old and seasoned, not recognizing that while they may be at a knowledge level to have their drug box expanded, the certification is what must be judged, not the person.

 

[Basermedic159]

Are your statements rude or attacking? If so that makes them rules violation.

Dude, your only about 2 days late... I've already talked to someone about it.
Plus if you read the community leaders post, I think he said thats enough about members attitudes...Like the other guy said look at your avatar, and your other posts:lol:

 

[ffemt8978]

Are your statements rude or attacking? If so that makes them rules violation.

Ironic considering your avatar.

I'm just yanking your chain, but you see my point.

That whole topic was handled via PM, so that's enough of it. Let's get back on topic, please.