Officer goes hands on on medic on scene.

[VentMonkey]

Not perfection....respect for other humans and their space without over reaching into the bully or we are above law mentality because we are the law.

Ak, I hear ya, I do. I grew up in LA in the 80's and 90's amidst that whole police scandal, and have been "profiled" more than a handful of times. I've experienced (if you want to even call it that) firsthand, this abuse of power. It really does suck, BTW.

I have nothing to gain or lose by defending anyone, especially one I don't know off some snippet from the internet. Like I said my take is we collectively rush to judgment and scream lawsuit, ot battery.

It's just sad to me how things are spun. This is why I hate watching the news, the world is negative enough, so can we be. Cynicism seems to beget cynicism. I could not imagine being a cop; many are, or end up being some of the most cynical people on earth with an extremely jaded outlook on life.

The medic wasn't harmed, which is good (that would have definitely been crossing the line, IMO), but all I really want to know is what it is/ was they were conversing about before he turned and walked away, cheers.

 

[akflightmedic]

The medic wasn't harmed.

Not physically....any harm to future relations, perceptions, mindsets?

 

[Carlos Danger]

I know and think as you do.

There was a discussion a few years back and I commented how early in my career, I used to stand by silently while cops who I knew and hung out with off the job would be total ****s and aggressive on the job. I was young, shocked and could not believe it was going on....and I did nothing. I lost a lot of friends after I started speaking up both on and off the job.

What I repeatedly saw firsthand as a young paramedic working in the inner city is the major reason for my views on this, too.

 

[VentMonkey]

any harm to future relations, perceptions, mindsets?

All consequences and repercussions that the LE agency has coming to them, and needs to be willing to accept if things aren't handled accordingly. This goes for any agency, service, or company ever.

 

[VentMonkey]

What I repeatedly saw firsthand as a young paramedic working in the inner city is the major reason for my views on this, too.

Again, having lived it firsthand this too made for a very jaded, and confused young man in myself.

I could have just as easily been like many a childhood friends I once had, and blame the ignorant posturing and physical bullying by some burnt out cops actions as a crutch for aimlessness.

Having seen it from this side like you guys have/ had as well, and not necessarily backing down from conflicts in the past with LE has given me a confirmation that I once had regarding their behaviors. I choose to remain indifferent of the situation at hand as each person, not cop, FF, paramedic, EMT, etc. should be viewed based independently on their own merit.

It is sad it's not this way, but if I had let any of that get to me I wouldn't have come out the other end that much stronger for it.

 

[NysEms2117]

Is it safe to say there are bad apples in every bushel?? I find it hard to believe that people can judge others on jobs they haven't done. I have never been a paramedic in my life, so what right do i have to judge their actions? Same way as I have never been a computer scientist, so what right do i have to judge their code? By the current logic presented(which is fine) means that all cops are bad, or burnt out, because of actions 5/10/15/20 years ago? Policing differs based upon region, different styles of policing don't matter? yet again, not saying anybody is excused. Is it fair to say your burnt out because a paramedic that brought me to the hospital was a grouchy person at that exact time? Maybe he just revived somebody, 2 hrs ago, maybe he just lost somebody 2 hrs ago. Again, may be optimistic parole officer here, but is it really fair to judge somebody based on 1 action? Have you brought 100% of your best for ever single second that you were on duty in your life? Every single second in school? I don't honestly think anybody can truthfully answer that question and say yes.
*I fully acknowledge and respect your point, and it is very valid. Just trying to present the other side as well.*
**i mean no disrespect in any of my words, just how it came out of my head**

 

[VentMonkey]

@NysEms2117 everyone on this thread has their own take, and position. There's no need to worry about disrespecting anyone.

We're all big boys and girls, and can conduct ourselves as such. Look at the police/ public relations nationally though, particularly in urban areas.

It hardly matters or reflects to the people in those communities that policing varies by region. It's a sad and well known fact that the wrong person (people) is (are) often given powers that are way beyond what their personal psyche can handle.

Back to the thread topic, EMS did a stellar job and from th accounts of the "witnesses" to his actions regarding the fact that the patient (perp or not) required medical attention, is heroic.

"EMT saves both cop and patient" Where's that headline? What's that? That doesn't count as a "save"? Why? Because it isn't as "cool" as a clinically dead arrest post ROSC. It still shows heroism in my book.

Kind of messed up how we mainly focused on the interactions between LE and EMS, and not the act of human kindness the medic/ EMT displayed. Also, was the patient/ suspect rightfully detained after being medically cleared at the hospital?

 

[BobBarker]

i tend to agree with vent. before i get reamed I AM NOT DEFENDING THE LEO. I think it is absurd that we(outsiders) would even begin to judge this. Does it look bad, yes. I dont see hands around throat, i see hand on shoulder/collarbone, however I am not the medic, nor the officer, nor the person videotaping so i cannot tell for sure. Good on the medic for not reacting, do i think there was another way to handle it, absolutely. But, as somebody who has had an "improper" videotape taken of myself (luckily body cam cleared up everything). Video is very often misleading, because it can start and stop when people want. However, cynical as it may be, i will not judge somebody from a video released on social media, or any media for that matter. Where was the video 5 minutes prior to that? bodycam footage?

Quoted for accuracy I agree with this 100000%, and i think most younger adults and teenagers should understand this is the way it should be.

I don't know if anyone was filming before the cop/medic incident happened. Most Police Departments won't release Body Cams that fast, especially if there is a pending investigation. Unfortunately, I have seen and heard many times where a department "loses" footage or says the bodycam wasn't "working" when an officer's actions are in question. This story kind of reminds me of the story in CA when the CHP officer detained and handcuffed an FF/EMT for not moving the engine from the highway which was protecting his crew. Last I heard, that Department and the CHP met to improve relations and the FF settled with CHP for a small amount of $$.

 

[VentMonkey]

This story kind of reminds me of the story in CA when the CHP officer detained and handcuffed an FF/EMT for not moving the engine from the highway which was protecting his crew. Last I heard, that Department and the CHP met to improve relations and the FF settled with CHP for a small amount of $$.

That's a huge negative. Dig it up, and create a thread. Completely different story, apples and oranges.

 

[NysEms2117]

It hardly matters or reflects to the people in those communities that policing varies by region. It's a sad and well known fact that the wrong person (people) is (are) often given powers that are way beyond what their personal psyche can handle.

Was just trying to illustrate that places like Newark NJ, and Newburgh NY get far different treatment then a place like Chicago. https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/commp.pdf Community policing has a much different outcome then normal policing (Aggressive). But i fully agree with you here:

"EMT saves both cop and patient" Where's that headline? What's that? That doesn't count as a "save"? Why? Because it isn't as "cool" as a clinically dead arrest post ROSC. It still shows heroism in my book.

AS well as here! *almost* myself included.

It hardly matters or reflects to the people in those communities that policing varies by region. It's a sad and well known fact that the wrong person (people) is (are) often given powers that are way beyond what their personal psyche can handle.

 

[NysEms2117]

I don't know if anyone was filming before the cop/medic incident happened. Most Police Departments won't release Body Cams that fast, especially if there is a pending investigation. Unfortunately, I have seen and heard many times where a department "loses" footage or says the bodycam wasn't "working" when an officer's actions are in question. This story kind of reminds me of the story in CA when the CHP officer detained and handcuffed an FF/EMT for not moving the engine from the highway which was protecting his crew. Last I heard, that Department and the CHP met to improve relations and the FF settled with CHP for a small amount of $$.

Agreed with vent. That situation is 100% different, start your own thread if you'd like responses on that. Also if you want a job, become a computer scientist, figure out how to store and save Petabytes of data every day. My body camera is always on for MY protection when i work in the field(warrants or whatever else i may be doing). I go back, plug it into the body camera dedicated computer, hit a big button that says okay. Now this is the very important part in your discussion. IT IS OUT OF MY HANDS AT THAT POINT. After i press okay/sync, that is 100% on IT at that point.

 

[BobBarker]

That's a huge negative. Dig it up, and create a thread. Completely different story, apples and oranges.

No need for me to create a thread on it, thanks for the suggestion though. The main reason I was putting that story out there was, probably like this story, the 2 departments(police + ems) will get together, talk and ultimately improve their relationships, trying to put this story behind them.

 

[VentMonkey]

No need for me to create a thread on it, thanks for the suggestion though. The main reason I was putting that story out there was, probably like this story, the 2 departments(police + ems) will get together, talk and ultimately improve their relationships, trying to put this story behind them.

I'd actually be quite interested to know what others on the forums take would be. I certainly have my spin.

I will say it's a hilariously amusing sight to see the FF in full turnouts being cuffed and detained. Awww, he isn't invincible...

#NoFurtherCommentOnItTilThreadIsCreated

 

[BobBarker]

Agreed with vent. That situation is 100% different, start your own thread if you'd like responses on that. Also if you want a job, become a computer scientist, figure out how to store and save Petabytes of data every day. My body camera is always on for MY protection when i work in the field(warrants or whatever else i may be doing). I go back, plug it into the body camera dedicated computer, hit a big button that says okay. Now this is the very important part in your discussion. IT IS OUT OF MY HANDS AT THAT POINT. After i press okay/sync, that is 100% on IT at that point.

There are plenty of things that can happen to a body cam, agreed. I do build/fix computers, surveillance cameras and networking on the side, so I know about data and technology quite well. Sounds like you are an honest person, which is what this world needs more of. One of my old managers always used to tell us to "Act like you are always being videotaped", because you never know who actually is!

 

[BobBarker]

I'd actually be quite interested to know what others on the forums take would be. I certainly have my spin.

I will say it's a hilariously amusing sight to see the FF in full turnouts being cuffed and detained. Awww, he isn't invincible...

#NoFurtherCommentOnItTilThreadIsCreated

I created a thread under this forum about that incident, so feel free to post your comments

 

[Carlos Danger]

I find it hard to believe that people can judge others on jobs they haven't done. I have never been a paramedic in my life, so what right do i have to judge their actions?

I'm sorry, but if you intimidate or assault someone who isn't a threat to you, you are wrong, period.

Again, may be optimistic parole officer here, but is it really fair to judge somebody based on 1 action?

If I intentionally assault someone will the criminal justice system and society as a whole judge me based on that action, even though it's never happened before?

What if I get behind the wheel of a car drunk, and hurt or kill someone? Does the fact that it's my first time doing it matter much?

If my poor choices as a paramedic or anesthetist causes a person harm, do I get off the first time it happens?

I would argue that those in positions of special authority and with special training in handling conflict should be held to an even higher standard that the average joe.

 

[NysEms2117]

If I intentionally assault someone will the criminal justice system and society as a whole judge me based on that action, even though it's never happened before?

no, you'll get plead out to a misdemeanor (another problem with the system but i digress), the judge will probably tell you to do community service, or pay a fine.

I believe killing somebody is much different then pushing them against a car? However again, it'd be manslaughter not murder, maybe even
S 120.04-a Aggravated vehicular assault. (if you have a really good lawyer, i do have 1 parolee with that charge for the case you presented ironically).

I don't know i'm not a paramedic. i'm sure that in your many years experience as a high leveled practitioner you've made at least 1 mistake? Doesn't have to be a fatal one, just as an officer pushing/shoving/holding or however you would like to phrase the scenario isn't fatal. It's undoubtable you certainly know your stuff about healthcare, but again everybody makes mistakes.? isn't that part of being a human?

I 100% agree, but the fact and the matter is, we don't..

 

[Carlos Danger]

no, you'll get plead out to a misdemeanor (another problem with the system but i digress), the judge will probably tell you to do community service, or pay a fine.

I believe killing somebody is much different then pushing them against a car? However again, it'd be manslaughter not murder, maybe even
S 120.04-a Aggravated vehicular assault. (if you have a really good lawyer, i do have 1 parolee with that charge for the case you presented ironically).

I don't know i'm not a paramedic. i'm sure that in your many years experience as a high leveled practitioner you've made at least 1 mistake? Doesn't have to be a fatal one, just as an officer pushing/shoving/holding or however you would like to phrase the scenario isn't fatal. It's undoubtable you certainly know your stuff about healthcare, but again everybody makes mistakes.? isn't that part of being a human?

I 100% agree, but the fact and the matter is, we don't..

I'm not sure what your point is here.

You agree that we are accountable for our actions. So this cop should be held accountable for his.

Any way you slice it, this cop was wrong, and should be held accountable. Unless of course there was some good reason for putting his hands on this medic.

 

[Mufasa556]

There's a big difference in someone providing care in good faith and making a mistake and this officer grabbing hold of a fellow first responder.

I'm sure there are circumstances where it could be warranted, but in all my years of doing this I'm hard pressed to find any situation where a cop would be grabbing hold of one of us.

Say the news report is 100% correct, then this is a situation where the two of them should've hashed this out like adults after the call in the hospital parking lot.

I would like to see the raw unedited version of the video. I searched around for it, but this is all I could find.

 

[NPO]

Body cam footage now available:

The scene was a mess. Poorly managed by all agencies. Not knowing how their system works, I couldn't tell if FD or EMS was in charge, but by the looks of it, they didn't know either.

Medic can be heard shouting "Do not tase him!" Shortly after you hear the taser. The officer and EMS dude step out of the circle and have words and that's when the officer removes him.

I still believe the officer was inappropriate, but no one handled themselves very well IMO.

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