General Biology, or Fundamentals of Microbiology?

[JJR512]

I'm looking at the local community college's EMT-P program, and for the core program, the student must take either General Biology 1 or Fundamentals of Microbiology. (This is done before getting to A&P-1, of course.)

BIOL-101 General Biology I
4 Credits (Science Core)
Following successful completion of Biology 101, the student will be able to describe the characteristics of living things at all levels of organization-from the atomic through the molecular, cellular, and organismal levels. The study of human genetics, development, and anatomy and physiology will enable the student to relate the chemical activities of the cell to the overall function of man.

BIOL-107 Fundamentals of Microbiology
4 Credits (Science Core)
Fundamentals of Microbiology is a course designed with a strong emphasis towards the allied health careers. Following the successful completion of Biology 107, the student will be able to describe the characteristics of living things from the molecular to the cellular level for both prokaryotic and eukaryotic cells. The study of microbiology will enable the student to understand the biology of bacteria, fungi, protozoa and viruses in terms of morphology, classification, reproduction, metabolism, genetics, population growth, and disease production. In the laboratory, the student will gain experience with the tools and techniques used in the study of microorganisms.

BIOL-107 says it is "designed with a strong emphasis towards the allied health careers," but BIOL-101 says the student will be able "to relate the chemical activities of the cell to the overall function of man," which also sounds pretty important.

So my question is: If someone is interested in pursuing the EMT-P program at this college, which of these two classes would be the better one to take?

http://www.howardcc.edu/academics/program_information/catalog/web/courses/biology.html

 

[aewin90]

Microbiology is not something that you need to know for EMS as far as I know. In CNA class we spent a decent amount of time on the basics of microbiology because infection control was a major responsibility for the CNA; not so much for EMT's and Paramedics.

General Biology is what you want. However, if you are more interested in microbiology you will probably receive higher grades in that course as compared to General Biology...

(Someone feel free to correct me if I'm misguided.)

 

[JPINFV]

In CNA class we spent a decent amount of time on the basics of microbiology because infection control was a major responsibility for the CNA; not so much for EMT's and Paramedics.

How, exactly, would you figure that one? Are infected patients not allowed on ambulances where you live?

 

[Veneficus]

General biology with lab an taxonomy.

 

[Lifeguards For Life]

I second the 'general biology' vote.

 

[JJR512]

So that's three for General Biology, and none for the other.

General biology with lab an taxonomy.

Are you saying "general biology" because it includes lab and taxonomy, or are you telling me to make sure I get that some other way?

 

[medic417]

I vote both. But if going to slack off and only do one take biology.

 

[Veneficus]

So that's three for General Biology, and none for the other.


Are you saying "general biology" because it includes lab and taxonomy, or are you telling me to make sure I get that some other way?

make sure your general biology course includes taxonomy and a lab. (to get the maximum experience out of it. Taxonomy does have considerable medical application)

Microbiology will discuss some concepts of general biology, but not in any depth.

You do not construct a building starting with the second floor. You lay the foundation first.

 

[TransportJockey]

Any chance you can take both? That's really what I would do
EDIT: To CAO~ Some of the micro courses I've seen it's a co/pre req. That's why I'd try to do both.

 

[CAOX3]

Isn't biology a pre req to sit for micro any more?

I agree take both if you can.

 

[JJR512]

I don't see why it wouldn't be theoretically possible to take both courses, assuming I have the ability to pay for a superfluous course (superfluous in terms of being needed to complete the EMT-P program).

And I'm certainly not opposed to more education, especially if its relevant to the desired goal.

That being said, would you advise taking both at the same time, or could that be too confusing? They are both 4-credit courses, and I'd probably take the required math course (MATH-105, Drug Calculations) in the same semester, so I'd also need to make sure I'd have the time to devote to a full course load as well.

 

[abckidsmom]

I don't see why it wouldn't be theoretically possible to take both courses, assuming I have the ability to pay for a superfluous course (superfluous in terms of being needed to complete the EMT-P program).

And I'm certainly not opposed to more education, especially if its relevant to the desired goal.

That being said, would you advise taking both at the same time, or could that be too confusing? They are both 4-credit courses, and I'd probably take the required math course (MATH-105, Drug Calculations) in the same semester, so I'd also need to make sure I'd have the time to devote to a full course load as well.

If you don't already have a background in biology, that would be an extremely difficult load. 4-credit courses, both with labs, both with exams...I would get pretty tired of it all, and my grades would slip. But that's me.

I love biology, and took AP Bios in high school, so in college I took microbiology without a second thought. I do remember and use that information, but I think that overall, if you don't already have a strong foundation in biology, your career as a health care provider will suffer if you skip that step.

 

[CAOX3]

I wouldnt suggest taking both at the same time, how heavy is the course load?

Taken it with some electives like intro to computers or figure drawing, naked h34r:

I found it easier to bury a science class in the middle of some fluff courses, worked out better for me.

 

[akflightmedic]

I am with whoever mentioned it earlier...have you asked the counselor???

I had to take Biology as a pre req prior to AnP and Microbiology....

 

[JJR512]

I wouldnt suggest taking both at the same time, how heavy is the course load?

Taken it with some electives like intro to computers or figure drawing, naked h34r:

I found it easier to bury a science class in the middle of some fluff courses, worked out better for me.

Well, as I mentioned in my previous post, the only other course I was planning on taking in the same semester was the math class (Drug Calculations).

I am with whoever mentioned it earlier...have you asked the counselor???

I had to take Biology as a pre req prior to AnP and Microbiology....

I've talked to the counselors before (not about this exact question, though) and they didn't seem to know jack beyond what was printed in the catalog.

It's already going to take three semesters to get to the paramedic core courses: the first semester for whichever of these two is selected, the next for A&P-1, and the third for A&P-2. The only other prereq for the certificate program* is the math course I just mentioned. I'm all for getting as much education and possible, but I don't want to delay completing the paramedic program by a semester just so I can take both options of an either/or prereq.

* I do have a degree plan, but for personal reasons I'm going to do the general education portion after the actual paramedic portion. I might do the paramedic certificate program, then the gen-ed courses to get the AAS, then do a paramedic-to-RN bridge program...not sure. My point is I'm not planning on just stopping at the paramedic cert program. If I have the time and money, then I might do a gen-ed course in the same semester as an A&P course, but for both time and money reasons, I probably won't be able to do more than two courses per semester.

 

[aewin90]

How, exactly, would you figure that one? Are infected patients not allowed on ambulances where you live?

No.

From my experience working in two different health care facilities and interacting and assisting with ambulance crews, clinical infection control and pre-hospital infection control appear to be two entirely different ballgames.

In a pre-hospital environment one is generally in contact with the patient for a short amount of time. In addition, paramedics do not have a formal diagnosis to work with. A formal diagnosis carries with it all shapes and sizes of precautions-- PPE, airborne precautions, contact precautions, reverse precautions, the use of negative pressure rooms, the list could go on.

I'm all for improving the art of pre-hospital infection control, but so much of it revolves around a formal diagnosis via lab work and other tools that ambulances simply do not carry.

 

[abckidsmom]

No.

From my experience working in two different health care facilities and interacting and assisting with ambulance crews, clinical infection control and pre-hospital infection control appear to be two entirely different ballgames.

In a pre-hospital environment one is generally in contact with the patient for a short amount of time. In addition, paramedics do not have a formal diagnosis to work with. A formal diagnosis carries with it all shapes and sizes of precautions-- PPE, airborne precautions, contact precautions, reverse precautions, the use of negative pressure rooms, the list could go on.

I'm all for improving the art of pre-hospital infection control, but so much of it revolves around a formal diagnosis via lab work and other tools that ambulances simply do not carry.

Paramedics may not have the formal diagnosis to work with, but the understanding of infectious diseases that comes with microbiology can help anyone. Paramedics who are able to recognize and incorporate the patient's presentation and make infection control decisions based on that presentation and the education that they've recieved are doing as much to control infection spread as anyone who follows a contact/droplet sign on a patient's door.

Understanding how the size of microbes affects the PPE you use, which cleaners will kill the microbes in question, and how drug-resistant microbes affect your practice are useful to and healthcare provider.

 

[JPINFV]

In a pre-hospital environment one is generally in contact with the patient for a short amount of time. In addition, paramedics do not have a formal diagnosis to work with. A formal diagnosis carries with it all shapes and sizes of precautions-- PPE, airborne precautions, contact precautions, reverse precautions, the use of negative pressure rooms, the list could go on.

I'm all for improving the art of pre-hospital infection control, but so much of it revolves around a formal diagnosis via lab work and other tools that ambulances simply do not carry.

I'm going to disagree and say that out of the PPE/intervention options, the only thing that can't occur (and I know it isn't all inclusive) is negative pressure. However ambulances routinely transport patients with diagnoses (not all calls are coming from non-health care facilities), and even still the ability to identify sick patients and take precautions is important, even if it's more of an all/nothing than location specific (i.e. gloves/gown/maks instead of picking and choosing).

If the only important thing is infection control, then I could argue that the only people who need microbiology are those diagnosis and prescribing antibiotics. You don't need a background in micro if all you are doing is following what the sign on the door says to do.

 

[bstone]

Gen Bio. It's a pre-req for micro.

 

[JJR512]

Gen Bio. It's a pre-req for micro.

It's a prereq for Microbiology, as you say, but Microbiology is not a course being discussed in this thread. Besides General Biology, the other course being discussed is Fundamentals of Microbiology.

The straight-up Microbiology course is not a required or even suggested part of the Paramedic program at this particular school.

That being said, since the overall consensus seems to be General Biology, that's the one I think I'll go with.