First Ride Along w/ Funny Story

Double-E

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k, so, first ride along. wewt. was great. dual medic team and they were very nice, very informative etc.

now for the funny story:

last run of the day, long story short, we finally get the kid to tell us he did WAY too much coke the night before and is having an "anxiety attack". total bs. he's fine just coming down and is uncomfortable. all psycho-somatic.

so the medic working on him says "we're going to administer an experimental treatment. we're going to mix nitrous oxide with your oxygen to help with your anxiety."

plugs in nasal canula of pure 02. 3 minutes later:

"feel better?"

"yah :) "

"ok, we're going to try another TOTALLY experimental treatment, you want to try?"

"yah yah, give me everything!" (WAY too eager to have drugs administered)

"it's called transcutaneous aspirin. it absorbs through your skin!"

*tapes an aspirin to his forehead*

2 minutes later...

"feel even better?"

"yah, totally!"

the look on the nurses faces at the ED was PRICELESS :lol::lol::lol:
 
They were actually researching transdermal ASA, not for this of course, I have to look up the results of that.

I have a feeling these little acts of negligence are not going to go over well here, so I am going to move on before the shiit storm begins.

Good luck :)
 
Yeah, I'll pull up a chair and settle in for a bit....:P
 
You think its funny to mock patients? You know cocaine does cause many medical problems, right? And that anxiety is a real medical problem? How do you know its bs? You want props for you and your preceptors being butts? Sorry not here.
 
San Fran EMS at it's finest! They wonder why they are treated like jokes!
 
And that anxiety is a real medical problem? How do you know its bs?

Sasha is right. It is a real problem and based on everything you posted it wasn't BS.

While this wasn't the most profesional way to treat your patient it certainly sounds like it lowered his anxiety level. I'd just suggest next time not being a jerk to your patient just because he chooses to do something stupid like cocaine.
 
At a real loss of words except for ones that get me warnings or banned.

And "we" wonder why we are not considered professionals, why we do not get more pay, more respect, why we do not get more 'mad skillz' to add to our bag of tricks...

Just dumbfounded right now...
 
Not exactly the stuff you want to be learning on a ride along.... way to set the standard of care low before you even get your cert
 
You'll learn that often times we do things in EMS that we don't post brag about in public. You'll find that this is probably should have been one of those times.
 
You'll learn that often times we do things in EMS that we don't post brag about in public. You'll find that this is probably should have been one of those times.

+1, there are somethings that are better left unsaid, this is obviously one of those things.

In EMS we're supposed to treat everyone with the same level of courtesy and respect, everyone receives the same level of care NO MATTER WHAT. The medics you were with might need to be reminded of that.
 
I can't see a problem really. I don't really see a problem with using a placebo effect or psychosomatics to bring about a positive outcome for the pt. They were obviously aware that it might have been some more nasty physical problem - did take him to the ED after all - so it doesn't really seem like they were sacrificing pt care. Seems to me like a clever way of lowering his anxiety levels without having to use any drugs except a little O2.

As far as professionalism goes, everybody in the medical profession makes fun of pt.s a little, in some way (except maybe Vent<_<). I don't think it's unethical, everyone complains about the various aspects of their jobs at some stage, there's no harm done. The student doctor network forum has a 55 page thread on stupid stuff that pts do in ED and the funny ways they were contained or treated, complete with a range of hilariously derogatory acronyms and stereotypes. If you think this is the reason why American EMS is still stuck in the dark ages and is not respected then you are sorely mistaken.
 
Lying to your patient and providing placebo treatments which make him look like a fool is ethical and accepted?

Notice I said make him look like a fool or humiliate him...yes, placebos are used in science and medicine but where is the need in this situation?

Wouldn't professional behavior and a more thorough understanding of potential underlying conditions been warranted in this situation? How about lessening their anxiety by talking to them, educating them on their condition as opposed to silly gimmicks which do nothing but humiliate or patronize the patient and make the providers look like arses when they roll into the ER with a silly smirk on their face seeking approval for their silly antic.

It is a gross display of unprofessional behavior and yes it does continue to perpetuate the stereotype of us in general amongst our other medical colleagues/professionals that we are idiots.
 
When I was working as an engine company member we had a saying, what happens on the engine stays on the engine, nuff said.
 
They were obviously aware that it might have been some more nasty physical problem - did take him to the ED after all - so it doesn't really seem like they were sacrificing pt care.

And how did you arrive at this determination? Just because the drove him to the ER doesn't mean that they thought something could be going on with the patient. It seems pretty apparent by there actions that they believed the entire run was total BS. Why else would they lie to their patient and trick him into allowing ridiculous "treatments" to be administered.

As for the OP, not much more to add that hasn't been said. I am just glad that these particular providers are hundreds of miles from me and my family. If they are willing to treat their patients in this manner, whether they believe the run is BS or not, I don't want them to come anywhere close to me, my family, or friends.
 
We're you there?

Lying to your patient and providing placebo treatments which make him look like a fool is ethical and accepted?

Notice I said make him look like a fool or humiliate him...yes, placebos are used in science and medicine but where is the need in this situation?

Wouldn't professional behavior and a more thorough understanding of potential underlying conditions been warranted in this situation? How about lessening their anxiety by talking to them, educating them on their condition as opposed to silly gimmicks which do nothing but humiliate or patronize the patient and make the providers look like arses when they roll into the ER with a silly smirk on their face seeking approval for their silly antic.

It is a gross display of unprofessional behavior and yes it does continue to perpetuate the stereotype of us in general amongst our other medical colleagues/professionals that we are idiots.

In certain situations..yeah.

If you had a psych pt who was having an anxiety induced asthma attack and wouldn't put a mask on because he was afraid of it stealing his thoughts, and you took out your pen and wrote "thought protector" on a mask and told him it was a special device to actually stop people stealing his thoughts...I'd do that. But its still technically lying, and using a partly psychosomatic approach to calm him down by "protecting his thoughts", and sure look like an idiot being wheeled into ED with a thought protector on his face. But it would work.

Maybe a similar situation ethically. We really don't know how reasonable and rational the guy was, maybe he was going absolutely nuts and they thought it was the quickest and easiest way to calm him down so he wouldn't hurt himself, we weren't there. So I don't necessarily want to write of the medic's actions without knowing more. My comment was not specifically about them, but about the ethics of that sort of action in general. Maybe it was the wrong course of action in that situation (like I said we can't really know unless we were there), but not inherently wrong in and of itself.

Plenty of doctors are immature, make jokes at pts expense, probably even tape the occasional asprin to a forehead or two, everyone still think they are professionals. I guarantee you, if all medics were required to have masters degrees, you could act the goat as much as you liked and people would still think you were pros. You've got bigger fish to fry, mate.

And how did you arrive at this determination? Just because the drove him to the ER doesn't mean that they thought something could be going on with the patient. It seems pretty apparent by there actions that they believed the entire run was total BS. Why else would they lie to their patient and trick him into allowing ridiculous "treatments" to be administered.

Why would you take them to the ED otherwise? Unless they were adamant to go themselves. I spose you might have some stupid protocol over there that says all pts go to ED or something...sigh. Anyway, as I said above, we don't know anything else about what they did to treat the guy. Maybe they monitored him, took vitals assessed, took Hx, we don't really know. Or maybe he rings them every few days having anxiety attacks and he's a little slow, and they know him and this is the best way to calm him down. Just because part of the story was told as a humorous anecdote (the OP may have misunderstood their intentions and because he thought they were humiliating him, he told the story that way...who knows) doesn't mean they didn't take it relatively seriously. I realise that it's quite probably that there was a malicious element to their behaviour, but you really can't hang, draw and quarter a medics level of professionalism based on an anecdote about their practice told by a student who observed them (and may have misunderstood intentions etc) for a day.
 
When a patient calls 911 for an ambulance they believe they're experiencing an emergency whether you do or not. "It's not your emergency" is a saying that I've heard a lot and I believe it to be true. What you may consider to be BS may not be BS to someone else, especially the patient. Our job is to provide care and that certainly includes respect and compassion. Please, don't follow their example. It's unfortunate that they were your preceptors. The example they set for you is irresponsible and downright foul.
 
Nobody considered talking the patient down? I worked on a psych unit for a long time (as a student as well as a CNA). When a pt is coming down from cocaine, the are often able to be helped with conversation. You need to keep their mind focused on a topic, the topic can even be their drug use. Take the opportunity to convince them to seek treatment as well.
 
As far as professionalism goes, everybody in the medical profession makes fun of pt.s a little, in some way

(Not in the profession of EMS yet, so take this at face-value.)

Yes, making fun of patients happens. And it may be necessary to relieve the stress. But if you have to do it, do it AWAY from the patient. I see no reason to berate a patient in person. Having a little fun with somebody who is in no danger and sees the hilarity of the situation is one thing, as long as they are having a good time as well. It may help relieve the stress of the situation for them, which is a good thing.

But telling someone you are going to give them a medication, and then not doing that, is pretty stupid and, let's be honest, immature. Put yourself in their shoes.

As far as being professional goes, here are my thoughts: be a professional when you are "working", and if you must, be comical in private or away from the patient. Be a professional when you are in the public eye, or you are working with a patient. Let loose when you're not.
 
When a patient calls 911 for an ambulance they believe they're experiencing an emergency whether you do or not.

Mind if I put this in my signature?
 
Do you think that these great medics wrote all this in their report? I doubt it highly. This was nothing but immature medics showing off for a student.

It is unprofessional and unethical treatment. It has no place in medicine. If you condone it or try to make excuses for it, then you have no place in medicine.

Making fun of a pt, after the call, between you and your partner, is fine and a way of stress relief. You never have the right to make fun of a pt to their face. You are there to treat them medically, not for your amusement.

I think these medics need a two week vacation(unpaid), to think about their future in EMS!
 
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