FDNY blizzard responses

[94H]

According to the article there at 1300 calls backlogged in the CAD, 3 Hr wait times for critical calls, anyone else hear about this?


http://gothamist.com/2010/12/27/fdny_ems_response_compromised_durin.php#comments

 

[Chimpie]

FDNY EMS has a aprox 5 hoour delay to Emergencies. FDNY personal are advised not to do CPR more then 20 min due to high vol of jobs.

Source: Twitter

 

[46Young]

Source: Twitter

The last time I worked there, medics were required to contact On-Line-Medical-Control in order to pronounce the pt. It would take roughly 12-15 minutes to drop a tube and push your standing order IV meds, and another five to ask for and execute OLMC options. 20 minutes sounds about right to pronounce a pt with the full algorithm and options onboard. Really, if there's no positive prognostic indicators in that timeframe, they're not going to make it. I don't see why people are still stuck in the mindset of needing to txp every cardiac arrest pt.

They can hold jobs based on priority, so the injury minors, EDP's (non violent), sick jobs and such will be waiting for a quite a while.

 

[firecoins]

The cooling protocol must have been easier to perform.

Cant imagine transporting a code in this weather anyway. Just terrible weather.

 

[emt seeking first job]

My vollie took the vehicles out of service.

They invited people to respond on foot in the area near the base, but no rigs on the road.....

 

[ffemt8978]

My vollie took the vehicles out of service.

They invited people to respond on foot in the area near the base, but no rigs on the road.....

I can just see a couple of responders transporting a patient on a gurney pushing them down the street in order to get them to the hospital.

 

[firecoins]

I can just see a couple of responders transporting a patient on a gurney pushing them down the street in order to get them to the hospital.

Unfortunatly we had so much snow, that wasn't a possibility

 

[EMSLaw]

I didn't have to ride during this particular blizzard, but last time, it was a mess. Ambulances getting stuck in the snow, long response times... Call volume always shoots up for some reason, and, of course, even when you get to the patient, getting him or her out and onto the rig is an adventure and then to the hospital... well, not fun.

Fortunately, we're looking at unseasonably warm weather this coming weekend. Otherwise, I'm sure we'd be going to houses with snowed-over steps and icy driveways for weeks after a storm like this.

 

[firecoins]

call volume shoots up during a snow storm because they don't worry about their nonsense complaints until they are trapped at home. Than they think we can drive em.

 

[DrParasite]

around 8pm, NYC had 500 ambulances in service, and a backlog of 2000 EMS calls. 20 ambulances were requested from NJ, 10 went to Queens, and the other went to either Brooklyn or the Bronx.

CFR engines were told to do CPR for 20 minutes, then call medical control to pronounce the patient.

My buddy was working in brooklyn last night when the snow was falling... his paramedic unit was stuck in the snow for 8 hrs.

When I came into work at 6pm (at a large city in NJ), we have 45 calls holding. 5 ambulances and the heavy rescue were all stuck in the snow. I took over CityWide operations around 930pm. we still had between 30 and 45 calls holding, some who had mad their first request for an ambulate before noon, and one by one, we got them all answered (very often by sending a unit and finding the person had already left by private auto, the caller was nowhere to be found, or the caller decided they no longer wanted an ambulance), and all stuck ambulances were freed. around 3am, we finally cleared all pending calls.

sounded like what Pittsburgh experienced when they had their major storm. And before anyone asks, in my city, the FD didn't help dig us out at all. I worked last night at my side job, and it was the same way. the ambulance handled all EMS calls, DPW helped plow the way to get to the scene, and the EMS-Rescue and CERT helped clear the path to the ambulance from the front door, but this town has a better snow removal plan than the the city that I work in full time. no where was a firefighter anywhere on scene for ANY EMS calls.

 

[Hockey]

call volume shoots up during a snow storm because they don't worry about their nonsense complaints until they are trapped at home. Than they think we can drive em.

Absofreakinglutely I never realized that until a few weeks ago. I ran 14 calls in 12 hours. 13 of them being absolutely bs from "ankle pain" to "I aint feelin right and ma wants me to shovel in the morning"

I don't even remember what was legit but it surely wasn't anything either

 

[emt seeking first job]

I am not a socialist, but,

I think NYC could tax a bit more on the upper end, and have services to keep the city from shutting down after a little snow.

It does not snow that often here, but when it does, everything gets shut down.

Sanitation was testing those snow melting machines.

With the equipment and the personal they could truck a lot of it out, and I can see shutting buses down, but both subway lines near me are down. Having the subway up and running should be more of a priority. They should run MORE trains in the snow. Keep people out of their cars....

This is sad.

 

[mgr22]

I think lots of folks have unrealistic expectations about the abilities of public services to function at 100% during disasters. I understand the sense of entitlement, but resources are neither unlimited nor omnipotent.

 

[emt seeking first job]

yes and no

There are limits but NYC could do more.

In Canada, it snows more, they have the structure in place to deal with it.

Without getting too involved, one thing, if drugs and gambling were legalized and taxed, then the revenue gained in those taxes and saved from enforcement could go towards better services.

If LE can buy special equipment for drug interdiction, they could buy Snow Cats and things like that...

Again, there are limits I know, but they could have done more.

 

[mgr22]

There are limits but NYC could do more.

In Canada, it snows more, they have the structure in place to deal with it.

Without getting too involved, one thing, if drugs and gambling were legalized and taxed, then the revenue gained in those taxes and saved from enforcement could go towards better services.

If LE can buy special equipment for drug interdiction, they could buy Snow Cats and things like that...

Again, there are limits I know, but they could have done more.

You're there, I'm not (not anymore), so I admit you've got a better sense of what's happening right now.

I'm not sure if the Canada comparison is valid. Canada's a big place but, in general, heavy snow in Canada is much more the norm than in NYC. I spent lots of time in the Barrie, Ont area, where winter blizzards were not uncommon, and didn't qualify as "disasters." I'm talking about scenarios where public services are overwhelmed by very unusual conditions. I think it's a little like commercial aviation: there are all sorts of safety features built into the system and its equipment, but when two engines fail, all the pilots can do is try to find someplace to land.

Hmmm...that analogy sounds a bit extreme. Oh well, you get my...uh...drift, right?

 

[jjesusfreak01]

Nah, its not a bad analogy. The difference between, say, NY and Edmonton Canada isn't in the ability of their emergency services to cope, but in the mindset of their citizens. Whilst in NY (and generally anywhere in the US), people will call 911 for every stupid thing in the middle of a blizzard, I can imagine in Canada they probably all sit at home and deal with it until the storm blows over.

 

[EMSLaw]

There are limits but NYC could do more

To be fair to NYC, this was the largest recorded snowfall in Central Park. Two feet of snow is a heck of a lot, and I don't think anywhere is really prepared to deal with that smoothly.

 

[abckidsmom]

I think NYC could tax a bit more on the upper end, and have services to keep the city from shutting down after a little snow.

It does not snow that often here, but when it does, everything gets shut down.

Sanitation was testing those snow melting machines.

With the equipment and the personal they could truck a lot of it out, and I can see shutting buses down, but both subway lines near me are down. Having the subway up and running should be more of a priority. They should run MORE trains in the snow. Keep people out of their cars....

This is sad.

This is inflammatory, and exaggerated. Public services prepare for dealing quickly with the most likely scenario. We get a few inches of snow a few times a year. Except last year, when we got a couple of feet, 4 times. I would not and do not expect my public services, be it snow removal or fire department, to prepare for a winter on that level every year. People should be prepared to provide for themselves, with or without power, with or without help, for the duration of what is an emergency for THAT area.

As for the taxing...how do you think property taxes work? Those who own all those high-dollar real estate places pay WAY more taxes than those who own nothing, or own a very small apartment or townhouse or whatever small real estate looks like in NYC.

 

[46Young]

I think NYC could tax a bit more on the upper end, and have services to keep the city from shutting down after a little snow.

It does not snow that often here, but when it does, everything gets shut down.

Sanitation was testing those snow melting machines.

With the equipment and the personal they could truck a lot of it out, and I can see shutting buses down, but both subway lines near me are down. Having the subway up and running should be more of a priority. They should run MORE trains in the snow. Keep people out of their cars....

This is sad.

How much more do you expect the residents to be taxed? You're already paying out for city tax on top of federal, state, etc. Remember when Bloomberg greatly raised the traffic and parking tickets? If you want to stay out of the ghetto, you're paying 1700-1900 amonth for a 2 BR, 1200+ for a decent 1 BR in the outer boroughs. How about those in Nassau County paying upwards of 10K a year in yearly property taxes? The insane cost of living coupled with a poor quality of life relative to other areas of the country are why I left.

The city is broke. The enttitlement crowd are sucking up all the resources, and not contributing to the local tax base. Asking the affluent to buck up to carry those that contribute little to nothing is wrong. After I first moved to Virginia, I would complain about the lack of services and recreational facilities when compared to NY. I experienced the same snowstorms the abckidsmom did. I was taken aback by the lack of resources for snow removal. But then I realized that the state is required to balance it's budget by law. If we run out of funds, we run out of funds. Perhaps the federal gov't could learn from VA's example.

Looking to the affluent to carry everyone else reminds me of a story that explains our tax law:

UNDERSTANDING THE TAX LAW

This is a VERY simple way to understand the tax laws. Read on - it does
make you think!!

Let's put tax cuts in terms everyone can understand. Suppose that every day, ten men go out for dinner. The bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this.

The first four men -- the poorest -- would pay nothing; the fifth would pay $1: the sixth would pay $3; the seventh $7; the eighth $12; The ninth $18. The tenth man -- the richest -- would pay $59.

That's what they decided to do. The ten men ate dinner in the restaurant every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement -- until one day, the owner threw them a curve. "Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily meal by $20." So now dinner for the ten only cost $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still eat for free. But what about the other six -- the paying customers? How could they divvy up the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his "fair share?" The six men realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would end up being "paid" to eat their meal.

So the restaurant owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay. And so the fifth man paid nothing, the sixth pitched in $2, the seventh paid $5, the eighth paid $9, the ninth paid $12, leaving the tenth man with a bill of $52 instead of his earlier $59.

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to eat for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings. I I only got a dollar out of the $20," declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth. "But he got $7!" "Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a dollar, too. It's unfair that he got seven times more than me!" "That's true!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get $7 back when I got only $2? The wealthy get all the breaks!" "Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison. "We didn't get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night he didn't show up for dinner, so the nine sat down and ate without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They were $52 short!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and college instructors, is how the tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up at the table anymore.

Unfortunately, Some people cannot grasp this straight-forward logic!

This is why money is leaving our country. In my personal example, I cleared over 110k this year. I bought a house in VA, and I'm happy to support the local economy and housing market. My wife and I were two former tax paying citizens of NYC, w/ combined income of over 140k before we left. That's 140k less with which the city can tax. There are many more like us, I can assure you.

When I lived in Queens, when I knew a storm was coming, I would park on the left side of the street, on the corner facing a main road. The plows push more snow to the right. All I had to do was dig a path straight out. Run your errands in the mid morning, after all the spots open up from commuters going to work. Some put their garbage cans in the spot they digged out in order to hold it. Just toss the cans back to the sidewalk. Walk to the corner bodega if you need groceries. You can't count on the city for everything.

 

[46Young]

This is inflammatory, and exaggerated. Public services prepare for dealing quickly with the most likely scenario. We get a few inches of snow a few times a year. Except last year, when we got a couple of feet, 4 times. I would not and do not expect my public services, be it snow removal or fire department, to prepare for a winter on that level every year. People should be prepared to provide for themselves, with or without power, with or without help, for the duration of what is an emergency for THAT area.

No one feels they should be accountable for anything anymore, to help themselves, don't be silly.

As for the taxing...how do you think property taxes work? Those who own all those high-dollar real estate places pay WAY more taxes than those who own nothing, or own a very small apartment or townhouse or whatever small real estate looks like in NYC.

See the tax story in my previous post. You hit the nail on the head.

I remeber reading a while back that roughly half of Americans don't pay any federal tax, and that a family of four taking in under 50k/yr won't pay any federal taxes. The most affluent in our country, that pay the lion's share of our federal taxes, are international people. We have the second highest corporate tax rate in the world, behind Japan, I believe. The money continues to leave our county for others that don't punish the rich, and they're taking their potential for job creation with them.