EMT duo on break let pregnant mom die
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DV_EMT
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Who said anything about playing superman? Are you trying to say that your playing superman when you off the clock and helping someone from dying? last time I checked, that was called patient care... regardless if your on or off the clock. Playing superman is driving around with all your lights and sirens on your POV trying to interfere with all agencies that are already on scene. that's called playing superman... or ricky rescue.
If you don't want to risk it, that's fine, that's your own decision, you have a right to it.
Thank you.
Sasha
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You have to have a patient to deliver patient care. If I'm off the clock, I don't have any patients.
+ 1
Looking beyond the specifics of the story in this particular thread, there are many people who subscribe to the opinion that they are "always on the clock". Not only can it be unhealthy to have the inability to switch off from ones job, but there always seems to be an element of selectivity attached to those with the 24-7-365 mentality. Without trying to cause offense, in my experience it is usually the lower-end providers that have this opinion. You will usually find that those who feel the need to have their scanners on constantly, rarely feel the need to rush out for a "slip and fall, "finger lac", or "insomnia". Why not, if it is no less ones duty of care than the sexy jobs?
BTW, as far as EMS goes, whose medical license is the off-duty, or out of town have-a-go-hero working under? The Good Samaritan Law only provides so much protection, and in limited circumstances.
I think we all agree that if something were to happen in front of our eyes while off duty, we would intervene as we see necessary - even if only to call 911. As should always be the case, our safety should come first, and as already mentioned, most of us don't walk around with gloves which puts us with the rest of the public in certain emergency situations.
Stopping for an MVC on a highway in the dark / with adverse weather? Knock yourselves out!
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It's common for the rookie to carry an aid bag and maybe some other gear and be on the lookout for anything, with much motivation and enthusiasm. When you get a little time on, many will find that they get enough stimulation at work, and won't be as apt to jump in wherever they can, unless it's life and death. It's unhealthy when you lack the ability to divorce yourself from your job when off duty, and/or if you lack any sense of identity and self worth without your job affiliation.
Yeah, I don't see the problem in carrying a first aid kit in the car. In fact it is mandatory to do so in some European countries.
The more kit and lights one has in and on their POV however, the more BS they seem to attract (be that intentional or not). You can always tell the new grad doctors - they are the ones with the "MD" plates
The more kit and lights one has in and on their POV however, the more BS they seem to attract (be that intentional or not). You can always tell the new grad doctors - they are the ones with the "MD" plates
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DV_EMT
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Yeah, I don't see the problem in carrying a first aid kit in the car. In fact it is mandatory to do so in some European countries.
The more kit and lights one has in and on their POV however, the more BS they seem to attract (be that intentional or not). You can always tell the new grad doctors - they are the ones with the "MD" plates
agreed... Its good to have a bag with some things that you can render some first aid with. I have a total of 3 bags - 1 of which was issued by our county, and the other 2 are mine (one large one, and a shoulder pack that i use instead of a fanny pack). they come in handy
I ditched the aid bag maybe 6 years ago. I was all gung ho at first but I got that out of my systyem pretty quick. It just took up space and collected dust. My wife said "would you get rid of that thing already? You'll never use it". I do carry a pocket face mask in my car and I've memorized the number for 911 so I can call if I see something that deserves attention. I also carry an OB kit around when my wife is pregnant along with an infant BVM, cause you just never know. I might need more than some shoelaces and a buck knife. That would be bada$$ if I delivered my own kid.
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Piper76
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There is a really interesting thread on Fark concerning this...
http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4875992
Disclaimer for the un-farker - Some content on Fark may be NSFW...
Slainte!
http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4875992
Disclaimer for the un-farker - Some content on Fark may be NSFW...
Slainte!
A quote from one of the news stories:
Jeff Samerson, a representative from the EMT and paramedics union said that the EMTs followed protocol.
"[Jackson] called 911. She didn't have an ambulance. She didn't have equipment. She does not work in the field as an active EMT in an ambulance," he said. "She is a dispatcher. She works as an emergency medical dispatcher. [Green] is also a dispatcher. These are people that are not in the field, that have not had patient contact in years. And they did the best they could.
http://ny1.com/1-all-boroughs-news-...ended-after-they-allegedly-ignore-dying-woman
Jeff Samerson, a representative from the EMT and paramedics union said that the EMTs followed protocol.
"[Jackson] called 911. She didn't have an ambulance. She didn't have equipment. She does not work in the field as an active EMT in an ambulance," he said. "She is a dispatcher. She works as an emergency medical dispatcher. [Green] is also a dispatcher. These are people that are not in the field, that have not had patient contact in years. And they did the best they could.
http://ny1.com/1-all-boroughs-news-...ended-after-they-allegedly-ignore-dying-woman
ExpatMedic0
MS, NRP
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Wow what a mess!
On one side, it turns out they are both dispatchers. They both had no equipment, ambulance or radio and told bystanders to call 911. This all checks out
On the other side, Witnesses claim they said " I am on break" (real bad choice of words) It was stated they are EMT certified as dispatchers. If they do keep there EMT cert up, there is continuing education for that every year regardless of how long they have been out of the field. They could have at least put something soft under the patients head and managed airway some by atleast placing the patient in the recovery posistion when she was done having the seizure or started CPR if she arrested in the coffee shop, especially for the unborn child. They could have also tried to gather a SAMPLE history and reassure bystanders.
On one side, it turns out they are both dispatchers. They both had no equipment, ambulance or radio and told bystanders to call 911. This all checks out
On the other side, Witnesses claim they said " I am on break" (real bad choice of words) It was stated they are EMT certified as dispatchers. If they do keep there EMT cert up, there is continuing education for that every year regardless of how long they have been out of the field. They could have at least put something soft under the patients head and managed airway some by atleast placing the patient in the recovery posistion when she was done having the seizure or started CPR if she arrested in the coffee shop, especially for the unborn child. They could have also tried to gather a SAMPLE history and reassure bystanders.
Aidey
Community Leader Emeritus
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I wonder if their EMT certifications are being sponsored right now since they are working as dispatchers?
There was also a line in one of the articles that said that the Ambulance crew that did respond did not have the proper equipment to revive her. I wonder what they didn't have. Were they a BLS crew, or an ALS crew that was missing equipment?
It sounds like a royal cluster of a mess. I am on Fark quite a bit, and it is always interesting to see what the comments are because there is such a wide demographic of people who post. Just from the first 100 comments or so you can tell people have a lot of preconceived notions about pre-hospital care and Good Sam laws that aren't accurate at all.
There was also a line in one of the articles that said that the Ambulance crew that did respond did not have the proper equipment to revive her. I wonder what they didn't have. Were they a BLS crew, or an ALS crew that was missing equipment?
It sounds like a royal cluster of a mess. I am on Fark quite a bit, and it is always interesting to see what the comments are because there is such a wide demographic of people who post. Just from the first 100 comments or so you can tell people have a lot of preconceived notions about pre-hospital care and Good Sam laws that aren't accurate at all.
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paramedichopeful
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This is an outrage. I agree with what someone else said that this qualifies as abandonment. I think it's ironic that FDNY EMS always says they don't get any respect but then they go and do stunts like this one. What is wrong with people? When I see something happen I at least try to help the person, even if it's just talking to them and calming them down while waiting for the Medics. Jeez, how lazy can you get. Those 2 should have their cert. jerked and be charged with involuntary manslaughter and abandonment. They need to make a example out of this before it happens again. How distasteful.
firecoins
IFT Puppet
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whoa! slow down there buddy. This was 2 people. Not all of FDNY EMS. You act like everyone did it. You don't know all the facts. No one here does. Let this go through the system.
Manslaughter........:unsure:
Lifeguards For Life
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If the provider/patient relationship is never established, can services be "terminated", if they never began?
When does your "patient" actually become your patient? Is it when they summon your aid, when you first make contact(visual contact or physical contact)? Is it when you begin your assessment, or when a treatment plan is initiated?
Two JEMs articles explaining what abandonment is and what it is not:
http://www.jems.com/news_and_articles/columns/Maggiore/Patient_Abandonment.html
Part II:
http://www.jems.com/news_and_articles/columns/Maggiore/Patient_Abandonment_Part_Two.html
zmedic
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Some places argue that if you are representing yourself as an EMT, you have a duty to act. So if you walk up to a patient and say "I am an EMT," you have assumed patient care. My understanding is that in some places if you are non-verbally indicated that you are an EMT (via stickers on the car, being in uniform etc) it is the same as verbal telling the patient you are an EMT, and therefore have a duty to act.
Lifeguards For Life
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A legal duty to act or a moral duty to act?
EMS LAW............ we need your assistance
zmedic
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Not sure what the law says, but when I took my EMT they told us that if we were rocking around with EMT stickers or wearing a tee shirt with the big EMT on the back we'd better be ready to render care since we were announcing to the world our training.