Career Change

[Anu]

Hi Everyone,

I am currently a 25 year old student, residing in Westchester County, New York. I've just completed an Associate's degree from community college, and am thinking of transfering to a four year school. However, I have had an interest in healthcare for quite some time now, and have been looking into paramedicine and the EMS field as a stepping stone into healthcare. Currently, I am taking an EMT-B cert course with hopes of getting certified by the end of the summer.

I've noticed that many of the people in my class are already working in or volunteering in Fire Depts. or Ambulance Services around the area. I know it's a silly question, because the answer seems so obvious, but how much does having a volunteer position increase your chances of landing a job as an EMT? And does this influence one's earning potential? Most of these guys seem really experienced, like so much of what we're learning is familiar territory. I can't help but feel slightly ignorant in comparison.

I've been advised by several people to go on and finish up a BA. I'd like to do so, but I am getting old and am afraid that if I don't seize this opportunity to become a medic then I won't ever get into healthcare. I was thinking about possibly staying at community college and completing the medic program they offer there.

I've also heard many unpleasant things about wages, salaries, and conditions, although most people who truly enjoy this line of work seem to put up with it and deal with it as best they can. I don't mean to be unrealistic or idealistic, but I am just worried about getting chained to a desk job, and miss out on a potential career in medicine. It's funny, but sometimes when I sit around the house or office I'll hear a siren in the background or see some kind of medical advertisement and feel like I'm missing out on something I can't quite name..

I'm very open to suggestions and informed opinions regarding my situation. I am relatively new to this field, but I am honestly finding much of it fascinating, and most of it surreal.

 

[Ridryder911]

It all depends upon your location. In my area, it actually decreases your chances. Check your location...

R/r 911

 

[Twix623]

It all depends upon your location. In my area, it actually decreases your chances. Check your location...

R/r 911

Really? Wow. Why would it decrease your chance of landing a job by volunteering?

 

[Vizior]

You shouldn't have too much trouble getting a job as a basic tech in the Westchester area. They are fairly in demand, but don't expect much more than $10/hour.

I'd like to say one thing about using EMS as a stepping stone to another profession. Don't think that I'm looking down on the idea, I'm not. If you're going to use EMS as a stepping stone, realize how much there is to learn, even on BLS inter-facility transports. Any patient that is coming out of the hospital to a nursing facility, or another hospital, has a chart with them. You are allowed to read it, you are directly involved in the patient's care. Understand how they got to the hospital, why, what procedures were done, etc. If you don't know something you read, ask questions, read up on things.

It's real easy to work for a transport company and get into the mind set of "another 3 hour trip, at least I should be able to sneak on a nap in on the ride down." What you may not realize is that the patient was admitted to the hospital because of a massive MI, talk to your patient on the way down, and ask him/her questions about the experience, what it felt like, etc.

 

[dtermnd]

Really? Wow. Why would it decrease your chance of landing a job by volunteering?

Rid probably just says that, because he dose not know any better. My question to Rid, is how long have you run in the field and how advanced was it???

 

[Ridryder911]

Rid probably just says that, because he dose not know any better. My question to Rid, is how long have you run in the field and how advanced was it???

Well, let's put it this way. I was a Paramedic nearly 8 years before you were a gelatin ovum developing in your mother.

As far as credentials you can read them: (apparently, you do not understand what the abbreviations of my titles are)
http://www.emtlife.com/showthread.php?p=80276

Yeah, I know better. I am one of the few on here that actually does the hiring of EMT's and Paramedics. So yes, I can say I do NOT hire volunteers. If one has volunteer experience, I do not count it. I determine on not so much what they have done, but what they will do. Running a few calls or not being sole responsible for a patient to me is not experience.


p.s. nice to see, that you learned to use spell check this time.
R/r 911

 

[akflightmedic]

Hee Hee...oh my


This will be interesting.

 

[Twix623]

I can't say that I agree with Rid on this one, just putting my opinion out there. You're the experienced one here I agree with that, and I'm not even certified for anything yet. But it just doesn't seem right not to count Volunteer experience.

I know a few guys who Volunteered with the local Rescue Squad that takes on about 13,000 calls a year, and they have been there for a few years. If anything, I would see it as an advantage for job opportunities in the future after volunteering.

 

[mikeylikesit]

finish your BS and get into nursing in an emergency setting. yes this job doesn't pay much but if you have the passion for it, it's fine. in a lot of areas agency's look at volunteering as experience and that is sadly what a lot of agency's hire off of. going from a Basic to Medic right away will take time and will be extremely demanding. you will feel like your always behind your peers. until you get your A&P and let your basic knowledge sink in a bit then your pushing the limit. i did it but what's true for one is not true for all. i offer this advice to you...unless the programs that you are doing are accelerated, the time it will take you to get your BS will be way shorter. 6 months of Basic, followed by 2 semesters of A&P + depending on your institution and state ECG cert and IV cert. Good luck with this though. EMS is sometimes a hard field to get into since EMT's are a dime a dozen but if it what you are truly passionate about then you will not let that stop you.

 

[mikeylikesit]

I can't say that I agree with Rid on this one, just putting my opinion out there. You're the experienced one here I agree with that, and I'm not even certified for anything yet. But it just doesn't seem right not to count Volunteer experience.

I know a few guys who Volunteered with the local Rescue Squad that takes on about 13,000 calls a year, and they have been there for a few years. If anything, I would see it as an advantage for job opportunities in the future after volunteering.

Mind you that some places don't like it when you are already trained with another companies operations and SOP. it could be something else way different but that is the way that i see it.

 

[ffemt8978]

Do I really need to remind everyone of our #1 Rule here?

 

[dtermnd]

Well, let's put it this way. I was a Paramedic nearly 8 years before you were a gelatin ovum developing in your mother.

As far as credentials you can read them: (apparently, you do not understand what the abbreviations of my titles are)

http://www.emtlife.com/showthread.php?p=80276

Yeah, I know better. I am one of the few on here that actually does the hiring of EMT's and Paramedics. So yes, I can say I do NOT hire volunteers. If one has volunteer experience, I do not count it. I determine on not so much what they have done, but what they will do. Running a few calls or not being sole responsible for a patient to me is not experience.


p.s. nice to see, that you learned to use spell check this time.
R/r 911

For your info, I do know what all the alphabet soup means behind your name (congrats). But that dose not always mean much, because I've worked with medics in the hospital that would never make it in the field, and nurses with all the soup that didn't seem to know their head from a hole in the ground...
P.S. Remember that spelling dose not always make a good medic.

 

[Ridryder911]

d

For your info, I do know what all the alphabet soup means behind your name (congrats). But that dose not always mean much, because I've worked with medics in the hospital that would never make it in the field, and nurses with all the soup that didn't seem to know their head from a hole in the ground...
P.S. Remember that spelling dose not always make a good medic.

Here's the deal. How do you know if they know it or not, when you do not have the education & experience to differentiate ? Really. Kinda like me judging a surgeon if he/she does not perform exactly like I believe they should. This does not mean that they are performing poorly or do not understand it. Chances are most do not "get" what they are thinking or maybe even performing because it is so over one's head. ( p,s, I have and still work in the field for now as of Monday for 31 years, one can actually be good at both!)

EMS is attempting to be a profession. When a candidate applies for a job, I want one that displays that they actually want to pursue a profession (EMS or Nursing) seriously.

Want to know sure killers on applying an interviewing?

> Misspell anything on a job application. It displays ignorance and stupidity. (This is for any job). As well, it demonstrates you lack the general education (elementary school). How can I trust you, or believe you are smart enough to perform patient care, if you cannot even spell correctly? Also this will represent how you will present yourself in patient care documentation, where it is a MUST to spell correctly! Attorney's love misspelled words in litigation, as it again can represent you are poorly educated and thus might have performed as such.

> Expect anything but professional service as "real experience". Sorry, I do not care if your volunteer service made 50,000 calls a year. Most volunteer departments lack formality, and "real" hands on experience. One on one, patient care. Just you and the patient, not you and fifty other guys. It appears there is a much different attitude for those that know their paycheck depends upon how well they perform and function than doing for fun or something to do for the community.

> Don't wear any logo's, shirts with star of life, EMT caps, etc. when applying for a job or interview. Chances are you will be wasting my and your time. Seriously, we all know we are and what job we can do. We do not need to advertise or wear billboards. Again, professionalism.

> Do NOT assume ER experience is the same as field. It is MUCH different and vice versa.

> DO NOT tell me how much you want to be a Firefighter or Nurse! BINGO! Your through! Sorry, but you want me to place money and time on you for you only to tell me that you are going to leave me? Kinda like a love relationship saying, I want to marry you but I plan on divorcing you in a few years or months..... Sorry, administration does not want temps... or to be used as stepping stones. It costs and takes a lot of time to employ people. Hiring process, drug tests, physical, background checks, over time to test, plus then we average 3-6 months of field orientation with an FTO before they are cut loose on their own. Now, you say your going to leave as soon as your "dream" job comes available.


Just remember, those with all "titles" that you had assume do not know anything are the ones that usually will be hiring or firing you. So I be VERY CAUTIOUS on making my opinion known. As a ER Nurse Manager, the same general ideas go towards nursing, only more stricter. Remember, chances are I have several applicants to choose from, so make yourself shine ahead of others...

I sit on more than one services review panel for hiring. Yes, they want multiple opinions from outside sources, even from the ER. I see and hear, what is discussed on candidates. Yes, there is a shortage of Paramedics (not EMT's) so one has to compete for spots, even though there is a shortage of some does not always mean that they have to hire. Much rather be short staff than hire a "bad" or "poor" applicant.
Admin. .. they asked, I informed.

R/r 911

 

[CFRBryan347768]

but I am getting old and am afraid that if I don't seize this opportunity to become a medic then I won't ever get into healthcare. I was thinking about possibly staying at community college and completing the medic program they offer there.

Old? Most Paramedics are in thier early 40's around here, mostly because they wait so long to become a Paramedic, they want to master BLS skills entirely first. Around here you'd be one of the very few young ones.(Rockland County, NY) But from my stand point and what im doing with the next 4 years of my life id say ABSOLUTELY 100% GO FOR IT!

 

[MAC4NH]

Going back to luvadea's original post, it's never really too late to change plans or careers. I'm planning on transitioning to emergency nursing after 20 years as a chiropractor and EMT (17 years volly and 3 years both volly and paid). I know many paramedics and nurses who joined the field in their 40's and 50's. If you go to school for paramedicine, don't be surprised if you're in the younger half of the class.

Remember that many paramedic programs (at least in NJ) will not accept an applicant who does not have at least 1-2 years of field experience. I don't know how much volunteer experience counts. I guess it depends on the program and on how busy the volly agency is.

As far as money goes, I'm not sure what the going rate for EMTs, Medics and nurses is in your area but around here (northern NJ), EMTs make about $12-$17/hr. Medics make a little more (I've heard as high as $30/hr per diem). Nurses make a lot more and many paramedics transition to nursing for that reason. One of the nurse-paramedics with whom I work showed me an article from a nursing journal which describes an increasing demand for ER nurses that were previously paramedics. According to the article, paramedics bring a skillset that works better in the ED environment than traditional nurse training.

So don't worry about your age, follow your dreams and don't call yourself old when you're dealing with people in their 40s. It makes us cranky

 

[dtermnd]

d


Here's the deal. How do you know if they know it or not, when you do not have the education & experience to differentiate ? Really. Kinda like me judging a surgeon if he/she does not perform exactly like I believe they should. This does not mean that they are performing poorly or do not understand it. Chances are most do not "get" what they are thinking or maybe even performing because it is so over one's head. ( p,s, I have and still work in the field for now as of Monday for 31 years, one can actually be good at both!)

EMS is attempting to be a profession. When a candidate applies for a job, I want one that displays that they actually want to pursue a profession (EMS or Nursing) seriously.

Want to know sure killers on applying an interviewing?

> Misspell anything on a job application. It displays ignorance and stupidity. (This is for any job). As well, it demonstrates you lack the general education (elementary school). How can I trust you, or believe you are smart enough to perform patient care, if you cannot even spell correctly? Also this will represent how you will present yourself in patient care documentation, where it is a MUST to spell correctly! Attorney's love misspelled words in litigation, as it again can represent you are poorly educated and thus might have performed as such.

> Expect anything but professional service as "real experience". Sorry, I do not care if your volunteer service made 50,000 calls a year. Most volunteer departments lack formality, and "real" hands on experience. One on one, patient care. Just you and the patient, not you and fifty other guys. It appears there is a much different attitude for those that know their paycheck depends upon how well they perform and function than doing for fun or something to do for the community.

> Don't wear any logo's, shirts with star of life, EMT caps, etc. when applying for a job or interview. Chances are you will be wasting my and your time. Seriously, we all know we are and what job we can do. We do not need to advertise or wear billboards. Again, professionalism.

> Do NOT assume ER experience is the same as field. It is MUCH different and vice versa.

> DO NOT tell me how much you want to be a Firefighter or Nurse! BINGO! Your through! Sorry, but you want me to place money and time on you for you only to tell me that you are going to leave me? Kinda like a love relationship saying, I want to marry you but I plan on divorcing you in a few years or months..... Sorry, administration does not want temps... or to be used as stepping stones. It costs and takes a lot of time to employ people. Hiring process, drug tests, physical, background checks, over time to test, plus then we average 3-6 months of field orientation with an FTO before they are cut loose on their own. Now, you say your going to leave as soon as your "dream" job comes available.


Just remember, those with all "titles" that you had assume do not know anything are the ones that usually will be hiring or firing you. So I be VERY CAUTIOUS on making my opinion known. As a ER Nurse Manager, the same general ideas go towards nursing, only more stricter. Remember, chances are I have several applicants to choose from, so make yourself shine ahead of others...

I sit on more than one services review panel for hiring. Yes, they want multiple opinions from outside sources, even from the ER. I see and hear, what is discussed on candidates. Yes, there is a shortage of Paramedics (not EMT's) so one has to compete for spots, even though there is a shortage of some does not always mean that they have to hire. Much rather be short staff than hire a "bad" or "poor" applicant.
Admin. .. they asked, I informed.

R/r 911

I like the way you dodge the origanal subject. I never said anything about interviewing. I agree that profesionalism is a must, and you must present yourself to stand above the rest. The way you talk is like a typical HR. desk sitting, pencil pusher. Yes the same ones that will hire or fire, but the one in the same with someone who knows how to read and recite a book verbatum but when it comes to preforming they lack. So tell me does that sound like you?

 

[Ridryder911]

I learned long time ago there are certain type of individuals that rather debate than attempt to understand. I will attempt to describe one can be academically and clinically proficient at the same time. Do you attempt to belittle physicians because they are "book smart" as well as "clinically proficient"?

It appears that you fail to recognize one can actually be very proficient in both. If you must know, I am on my 24 hour shift as a working medic. Just finished my 10'th emergency call for the day.. As well, I will work in a Level I Trauma Ctr tomorrow night at one of my part time gigs, then lecture Monday. Yeah, amazing one can do more than one thing in life. Just alike most EMT''s here that work more than one job.

Skills are just that. Education and knowledge is the key of determining when to apply and use those skills. EMS skills are very simplistic in nature and with any practice one can be very proficient. Thousands do it everyday. It apparently does not take a rocket scientist.

It seems that you do not understand those so called "titles'. To even earn some of them, one must validate they have clinical experience (hundreds to thousands of hours) before one can even take some of those board exams. So those that you acclaim that may "not know it" have way demonstrated proficiently and worked more hours in one month, than a whole EMT program.

Then again, most Flight Nurse/Paramedics are not employed for having poor knowledge and lacking clinical skills. Yeah, they are usually able to have good communication skills (writing and verbal) as well.

I have nothing to prove, I am very confident in my patient care skills, as well as general knowledge and good old common sense.

Back to the original post, do what one wants to do. There are those that prefer to get employed and be able to be considered professional. EMS is a heavy competition market.. Just be sure to know the difference in dose and does...

R/r 911

 

[daedalus]

I can back Rid up here, even though he needs no backing from me. Volunteer "Corps" and/or departments carry NO weight around where I live, and good luck even trying to call back your recruitment guy at LA City Fire or LA county if you put a volunteer department on your app. While I respect those that do it out of necessity, for the most part we are professionals (some of us like to actually see EMS as a profession), and as such we do not offer our services for free. Of course you say doctors will go volunteer in developing countries and so do we in times of crisis (katrina), but we should act like professionals any other time. Check your area for more detailed information however, because you may want to volunteer if it helps.

 

[BossyCow]

So... to sum up... it depends on where you are. If you want an accurate assessment of the hiring criteria and educational, experience requirements, probably best to check around with local agencies.

Call and ask them what they require and if they count volunteer time as experience. I know very few "HR Types" who are unwilling to take the time to help someone prepare for a job adequately. It makes their lives a lot easier if an applicant comes to them with the credentials they need, valid experience and already showing the ability to adapt and follow instructions.

Agencies vary wildly by location. My area has a private company, one hospital based agency, three vollie Fire/Ambulance districts and two city based Fire EMS agencies. They all hire based on different criteria, they all pay differently, they all require different levels of experience and education.

And that's within a fairly small geographic area. Out of the vollie agency I belong to, every volunteer who has expressed an interest in diong this as a career has been hired. Not all of them work here locally but some have. One of the fire departments makes it a practice to hire from their volunteer pool. But they are a very strict agency regarding their training and performance standards.

The key is, if you are good, professional and possess decent social skills, you will probably get hired. If you know you have 'grammar issues' or 'typing deficits' get someone to proof your application before you send it in.

 

[wolfwyndd]

[snip]However, I have had an interest in healthcare for quite some time now, and have been looking into paramedicine and the EMS field as a stepping stone into healthcare. Currently, I am taking an EMT-B cert course with hopes of getting certified by the end of the summer.

Just my personal opinion here, but I don't think EMS can be used as a 'stepping stone' into anything in the Healthcare field. If you decide to continue getting health related education, either nursing or pre - med or anything like that, you'll probably be looking to get a job in either a hospital or doctor's office. Chances of you using any of your EMS skill in either of these two places is pretty slim. If you're interested in doing EMS, that's one thing, but it's not a stepping stone into the healthcare field though.

but how much does having a volunteer position increase your chances of landing a job as an EMT? And does this influence one's earning potential?

That kinda depends on the area you live in. In my area I know of some departments that hire their full timers / paid crew exclusively from their volunteers. There are also some departments that hire FIRST from their volunteers and then if they can't fill from their volunteers will then advertise to the public. I also have heard of some departments, like Rid's, that wouldn't hire a volunteer to save their life. However, my experience has been that it's the exception rather then the rule.

I've been advised by several people to go on and finish up a BA. I'd like to do so, but I am getting old and am afraid that if I don't seize this opportunity to become a medic then I won't ever get into healthcare. I was thinking about possibly staying at community college and completing the medic program they offer there.

That's a joke right? PLEASE. If you think 25 is 'too old' then you have a lot to learn about LIFE. You have plenty of time to do BOTH if you really want too.

I've also heard many unpleasant things about wages, salaries, and conditions, although most people who truly enjoy this line of work seem to put up with it and deal with it as best they can. I don't mean to be unrealistic or idealistic, but I am just worried about getting chained to a desk job, and miss out on a potential career in medicine.

Ok, now I KNOW you're joking. Getting 'chained to a desk job' is about the last thing you should be worried about with a job in EMS. Now, with that said, there IS a lot of paperwork involved. However, any job in any field involves a lot of paperwork so you might as well just accept that fact that having a job is not all fun and games even if you LOVE your job.

I also hate to say this, but at the risk of repeating myself, the wages, salaries, and conditions of the job vary by location and department / company. I know of some departments in this area where you can make some very good money and some departments in the area where you'll be lucky to put a roof over your head and food on the table and have ANYTHING left over.