Career Change

[VentMedic]

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> DO NOT tell me how much you want to be a Firefighter or Nurse! BINGO! Your through! Sorry, but you want me to place money and time on you for you only to tell me that you are going to leave me? Kinda like a love relationship saying, I want to marry you but I plan on divorcing you in a few years or months..... Sorry, administration does not want temps... or to be used as stepping stones. It costs and takes a lot of time to employ people. Hiring process, drug tests, physical, background checks, over time to test, plus then we average 3-6 months of field orientation with an FTO before they are cut loose on their own. Now, you say your going to leave as soon as your "dream" job comes available.

R/r 911

I usually agree with R/r on everything except this. I would like to know that you plan to continue your education. I don't want to encourage someone to be an EMT-B or even a Paramedic forever once they see what the medical profession is all about and how many opportunities there are. We definitely don't discourage CNAs, Phlebotomists or RT equipment techs in the hospital from advancing even if it is not within the same department. In the U.S., both EMT B and Paramedic require barely enough hours of education and training to give a student a true chance to evaluate the profession. Being an EMT can still compliment the nursing profession if their ambitions take them to the ED, CCT and Flight. Even if it doesn't, the experience can be worthwhile. The same with someone who has worked as a CNA during EMT school. If nothing else, it will give them a chance to see the differences between prehospital and inhospital care. Both CNA and EMT-B are entry level where there is still room for a lot of exploring while searching for the right fit. 120 hours of training should not lock anyone into a career that is not right for them.

To pass up an ambitious candidate who could provide a breath of fresh air into an otherwise stale job academically because they don't want to remain an EMT-B for the next 20 years could miss out on a great employee even if just for 2 years. The ideal employer should also be supportive, even if it is not always financial, of any academic endeavors whether it is for Paramedic or Accounting. I would have more respect for a candidate who is honest about their ambitions for better things than one who has no ambitions at all except to ride in an ambulance.

I think it would also be a little hypocritical of someone with other licenses listed behind their names to discourage someone from pursuing other areas of medicine. I know many people who have done a lot of college while working as EMTs or Paramedics. It did not affect their performance on the ambulance especially if they were taking more sciences and medical classes. If anything it helps in their communication skills and professional presentation.

I don't believe the nursing or RT professions get offended if someone advances to NP, PA or MD school.

One of the reasons people do move on and out of EMS is working with people with no ambition or any concept of what healthcare is about. Too many of their co-workers believe their 700 hours of training is more than enough education.

Of course, "I want to be a Paramedic so I can be a FF" doesn't cut it as being academically ambitious. So no, those candidates should not make the top of the list for selection in a non-fire based service.

There is also the warm body mentality present in some ambulance services that do prefer their employees have no ambitions.

 

[John E]

best line I think I've ever read here...

"There is also the warm body mentality present in some ambulance services that do prefer their employees have no ambitions."

That's beautiful, man, just beautiful...

And oh so true.

I'm a little confused as to why anyone would simply discount volunteer work out of hand, given for example that many colleges take volunteer work as a positive when reviewing applications. I know that my son, the wannabe Eagle Scout is gonna be doing some volunteer work pretty soon and I find it hard to believe that it would count against him on a future job/education application.

John E.

 

[Ridryder911]

"There is also the warm body mentality present in some ambulance services that do prefer their employees have no ambitions."

That's beautiful, man, just beautiful...

And oh so true.

I'm a little confused as to why anyone would simply discount volunteer work out of hand, given for example that many colleges take volunteer work as a positive when reviewing applications. I know that my son, the wannabe Eagle Scout is gonna be doing some volunteer work pretty soon and I find it hard to believe that it would count against him on a future job/education application.

John E.

As one that also sits on University applications, there is a difference in community service and just volunteering. Would one be as apt placing "volunteers" as aircraft mechanics, or nuclear energy plant? Hmmm.... many would say that is too much responsibility, yet a life is not?

As an employer though, as honorable as it may appear, I and many others do not see volunteerism as part of our profession rather as a community service. I much rather see a person that takes his/her professional life very serious and perform the time in associated professional organizations linked to EMS. Not that it would be placed against them, but rather it would not count either.

Would I be more apt to hire a nurse that was a candy striper or one that has worked as a tech in a hospital or nursing home? Obviously, the later because of the responsibility associated with the position. Again, how serious and what the ideology of our profession is.

In fact, we do not even have a place on our application on volunteering, or have personal details such where volunteer could be placed. Of course maybe in a resume or curriculum vitae, maybe but again, like reading they are involved in picking up trash, church choir, etc.. is not going to influence me to hire someone. I would question anyone if they placed it as on the "employment" section and would find it distasteful if they did so, if they did not participate or it was not an active service.

I do understand Vent's position and yes agree to some parts, however; as long as we present ourselves as a stepping stone and promote our profession as such, we will always be considered as one. No one pays or respects the stepping stone professions... (look at clerks at McDonald's). Nor do I consider increasing within one's profession as a stepping stone. A NP has to be a RN first, then if they want to pursue or increase their knowledge they will ... advance.. not hop or skip. The same if we had higher level of Paramedics.

As a RN, I never heard or seen any of my professors discuss leaving nursing as an option. Nor do I see or heard of any of my NP professors discuss the options of going to medical school. Again, one should investigate the profession thoroughly and in detail before going or entering it... my point of attempting to direct those that want to be a nurse, to be exposed to nursing, etc... We would not suggest someone that wants to be a Firefighter to work in a nursing home, but we would encourage someone to work in EMS that wants to be in a totally separate profession? ..

Again, I see more and more employers shifting to those that are really serious about this profession. Like I said, one of my first interview questions is ..."where do you see yourself in 5 years?"... Anything other than EMS or as an employee, definitely gets a bad point. Again, it costs several hundred dollars to even process an applicant. In estimation, it costs thousand of dollars to properly process a new employee and several thousands of dollars to loose one. So yes, economics does play a big role in the hiring process, especially since there is a shortage and difficult to fill. One has to get the best bang for the bucks...


R/r 911

 

[Jon]

That kinda depends on the area you live in. In my area I know of some departments that hire their full timers / paid crew exclusively from their volunteers. There are also some departments that hire FIRST from their volunteers and then if they can't fill from their volunteers will then advertise to the public. I also have heard of some departments, like Rid's, that wouldn't hire a volunteer to save their life. However, my experience has been that it's the exception rather then the rule.

Some places, espicially combination departments, like to see that their employees volunteer...somewhere else. They will often look outside their ranks for full-timers, to avoid members complaining that so-and-so got the job and not me...but hiring someone who is a volunteer means that they can relate a little better with the volunteer staff.

Ok, now I KNOW you're joking. Getting 'chained to a desk job' is about the last thing you should be worried about with a job in EMS. Now, with that said, there IS a lot of paperwork involved. However, any job in any field involves a lot of paperwork so you might as well just accept that fact that having a job is not all fun and games even if you LOVE your job.

Depending on the company... the entry-level "desk" jobs are Call intake/billing and perhaps dispatch. They have their pluses and minuses.

 

[Alexakat]

Get your Bachelor's degree while you're in the academic mode (ie. don't take a break after you get your AA---go straight back to start working on your BA the very next semester). Having a degree has opened up so many doors for me.

EMS will always be there. After you get your EMT-B, volunteer & make sure EMS is what you thought it would be.

Get your degree!

 

[Ridryder911]

As I heard one person describe the importance of education..."you may see my Dr. dig a ditch, but you will not see my ditch digger be a Dr."....

 

[MSDeltaFlt]

Hi Everyone,

I am currently a 25 year old student, residing in Westchester County, New York. I've just completed an Associate's degree from community college, and am thinking of transfering to a four year school. However, I have had an interest in healthcare for quite some time now, and have been looking into paramedicine and the EMS field as a stepping stone into healthcare. Currently, I am taking an EMT-B cert course with hopes of getting certified by the end of the summer.

I've noticed that many of the people in my class are already working in or volunteering in Fire Depts. or Ambulance Services around the area. I know it's a silly question, because the answer seems so obvious, but how much does having a volunteer position increase your chances of landing a job as an EMT? And does this influence one's earning potential? Most of these guys seem really experienced, like so much of what we're learning is familiar territory. I can't help but feel slightly ignorant in comparison.

I've been advised by several people to go on and finish up a BA. I'd like to do so, but I am getting old and am afraid that if I don't seize this opportunity to become a medic then I won't ever get into healthcare. I was thinking about possibly staying at community college and completing the medic program they offer there.

I've also heard many unpleasant things about wages, salaries, and conditions, although most people who truly enjoy this line of work seem to put up with it and deal with it as best they can. I don't mean to be unrealistic or idealistic, but I am just worried about getting chained to a desk job, and miss out on a potential career in medicine. It's funny, but sometimes when I sit around the house or office I'll hear a siren in the background or see some kind of medical advertisement and feel like I'm missing out on something I can't quite name..

I'm very open to suggestions and informed opinions regarding my situation. I am relatively new to this field, but I am honestly finding much of it fascinating, and most of it surreal.

Volunteering can help, but I can still see where Rid would show his biases against it. The more you do, the more you're exposed to. Case in point, I got my experience for flying from a ground service that runs 1,000 calls per month with 4 trucks. That's usually considered busy, but nowhere near the busiest out there. Every volunteer service in my area can't even get close to that kind of accuity; let alone volume.

Volunteering helps with your exposure, but I wouldn't call it the "end all". IMHO, I'd say go for it if that's what you want to do. You could also do this: complete your degree. Get your Basic, and get a part time job at the busiest EMS service/hospital as possible.

On a side note, 25 is not old. My best friend is damn near 40 with two kids and in medical school. Do what you love, love what you do, and you'll have the best job in the world.

Good luck

 

[BossyCow]

I know many RNs who have gone on to further their academic careers, Nurse Practitioner, Licensed Nurse Midwife, Nurse Anesthetist, etc.. so is 'just an RN' merely a stepping stone?

I think many of us, when pursuing a career, are not fully aware of all the opportunities available within any system of employment. There are generally going to be more certs, more degrees which are not apparent until we enter the field.

I have a friend who started out VOLUNTEERING in her child's classroom. She ended up with a paid position (making about EMT wage) as a classroom aide. Through that experience, she decided that she wanted to pursue a degree in education. Her time spent in the classroom was helpful in her studies. She now holds a masters degree, and is employed as a teacher. Should she have not volunteered in her child's classroom? Should she have not taken the job as a classroom aide because it was 'only a stepping stone and detrimental to the image of teachers as professionals'? What she did worked and the path was the one that fit her life. Her experience as a classroom aide gave her a perspective that has served her well as a teacher.

I think sometimes you can't see where you want to go, until you get to that first step, or sometimes even a second or third step. Some of us follow a more directed path, a more linear life, but for some of us a more meandering path beckons. If someone believes that its best for them to test the water before jumping in, more power to them!

 

[LE-EMT]

As I heard one person describe the importance of education..."you may see my Dr. dig a ditch, but you will not see my ditch digger be a Dr."....

I think this is probably the most important statement I have ever seen.
Education is ultimately the most important thing in anything. With out education you can't provide PT care. Or for that matter really do anything of any value. Get your education and as much of it as you can.

Trust me you are never to old to change your career path. I too am 25 and I have just changed again for the 3rd time.
Good luck

 

[GonnaBeEMT]

WOW! I understand that you guys are passionate about what you do and all, but have you ever seen volunteer firefighters pushing eachother out of the way to do something because they think they know a better way of doing it? That is almost what this thread reminds me of. It seems to me that some of you.... not all! think that your way is the only way to skin a cat.(good ole southern talk) I hope that this poor guy doesn't mistake you for the norm in this "proffesion".

 

[Ridryder911]

WOW! I understand that you guys are passionate about what you do and all, but have you ever seen volunteer firefighters pushing eachother out of the way to do something because they think they know a better way of doing it? That is almost what this thread reminds me of. It seems to me that some of you.... not all! think that your way is the only way to skin a cat.(good ole southern talk) I hope that this poor guy doesn't mistake you for the norm in this "proffesion".

Yes, I have seen F/F push each other out the way. Also cause a third stage into a fiasco!
Now, do you we think we came of these opinions by chance? Seriously, it comes with decades of experience, education and seeing the experience of others as well.

Also, it comes from working in EMS as a profession, not a hobby or something "fun to do"! This is my livelihood, my profession and career. I have spent literally thousands of hours trying to change it into something more than a whimsical event.

Now, one can come on here with the only experience being a 150 hour course (and assuming they are an expert afterwards) or make or ride a few calls a month, which is much different than the real world of EMS. Yes, it has some particulars areas that varies from region to region.. but one will find out most EMS business is that, and it usually has the same hiring requirements and demands everywhere...

Bossy.. NP & CNS are not really stepping stones. It is within the same profession, and as well one has to be a RN before achieving those levels.

R/r 911

 

[BossyCow]

Bossy.. NP & CNS are not really stepping stones. It is within the same profession, and as well one has to be a RN before achieving those levels.

R/r 911

And in my state, you have to be an EMT-B for a year before applying to paramedic school.