Are most EMS personnel THIS unprofessional?

[Kookaburra]

Calling something "gay" is part of everyday vernacular, you're going to find that wherever you go, whatever the profession. There are chauvanists in every profession.

Google "sexism in fire service" or "racism in EMS".
Here's a bit to get you started:
http://www.ournewanahuac.net/racism-and-sexism-in-houston-fire-department/2009/09/17/
http://www.pbs.org/itvs/testofcourage/diversity2.html
http://www.firerescue1.com/fire-job...ne-fire-chief-sexism-spurred-his-resignation/
http://www.crotonblog.com/archives/...joe_streany_sexist_opponent_of_womens_rights/
http://www.greencommons.org/node/807
http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cach...ft.doc+sexism+in+EMS&cd=9&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

The fact that you think people have to "look" for things to be offended over shows just how completely you are blinkered.

Calling someone a n****r or a ch**k used to be part of the everyday vernacular too. And yes, there are chauvinists EVERYWHERE. There's hurt and suffering EVERYWHERE. Does that mean we don't have the right to call it like we see it, when we see it? To help when and where we see hurt? Using "gay" as an insult is hate speech, and should not be tolerated in a government institution.

FTR, I, personally, have never been called any of these names... but I've seen the way other women have been talked about back at the station, or around the BBQ over a brewsky. Some of them thought they could buy the men's approval by denouncing "those crazy feminists" as well. It didn't protect them from scorn.

You can keep reaching for that cookie from the boys all you want, but you're never gonna get it.

Also, it's amazing how defensive people get when you point out their "-isms". Hmmm, hit a bit too close to home, perhaps? If you dismiss a person's experience just because "well, I've never seen anything happen like that"... well, then there's really no use discussing anything, is there?

Your experience and your life are obviously how the world works for everyone, after all.

 

[DrParasite]

Wow that is naive. Not that I blame you - I was pretty happy when I was in denial about the true depth of hatred our society has for non-men. North America isn't even in the top ten when it come to gender parity. We get paid less for the same jobs, the rape conviction rate is appalling, and we just had one of the most disgusting, misogynistic election cycles I've ever seen.

you apparently wanted hillary to win

hmm, the rape conviction, now that is an interesting topic. completely off topic, but interesting. I guess innocent until proven guilty doesn't cross your mind. or how SOME (not all, some) rape accusations are untrue, yet the reputations of the men are still ruined (cough cough, duke lacross team).

If you're a woman in this industry (and in patriarchal society as a whole) who happens to have secondary sex characteristics, you're a :censored::censored::censored::censored:-target. If you make it clear that you are not interested, you're a dyke and a :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored:. If you make it clear that you don't approve of hate-speech, you're a kill-joy.

and yet, my director, who started out as a secretary in the department, became an EMT, became a paramedic in one of the bussiest systems in the nation (per unit), l not only has a job, but is in charge of the entire ems sysem

Sorry, I'm not going to shed tears for teh poor menz who are having to keep a rein on their hatred for the first time in 5,000 years, and are crying because 52% of the population is now demanding equal standing.

wow. you must not like men, becaue they all hate you (well, your gender anyway). Most men don't hate women. most actually love women

what most men hate is women who think they deserve something just because they are women. or when women get something over a man who is more qualified, but since his organs are on the outside not inside, it must go to someone else. or women who expect men to do the hard work for them because they are men, yet the woman takes the credit.

I bet if you stayed away from the feminist magazines, you would be much happier, and probably even find a date.

 

[JPINFV]

FTR, I, personally, have never been called any of these names... but I've seen the way other women have been talked about back at the station, or around the BBQ over a brewsky. Some of them thought they could buy the men's approval by denouncing "those crazy feminists" as well. It didn't protect them from scorn.

...and there was never any gossip about the men behind their backs either, right? Only women can be gossiped about!

You can keep reaching for that cookie from the boys all you want, but you're never gonna get it.

Calling us "boys" and stereotyping all males working in EMS in the same light? Physician, heal thyself!

Also, it's amazing how defensive people get when you point out their "-isms". Hmmm, hit a bit too close to home, perhaps? If you dismiss a person's experience just because "well, I've never seen anything happen like that"... well, then there's really no use discussing anything, is there?

Your experience and your life are obviously how the world works for everyone, after all.

Ah. I get it now. You're the only one who's allowed to discuss this because only your experience is correct?

 

[Sasha]

FTR, I, personally, have never been called any of these names... but I've seen the way other women have been talked about back at the station, or around the BBQ over a brewsky.

I have seen the way men have been talked about in an ambulance, back at the station, and over a smoothie. (Because i don't drink beer.) I know what most of my male coworkers man parts look like, how well they perform in bed, etc, but have never slept with them. There's a running poll amoung us who'se a closet homosexual, etc... Women are not as innocent as you'd like to believe.

You can keep reaching for that cookie from the boys all you want, but you're never gonna get it.

I don't need their cookie, because I have their respect, as an equal. Because I do my part, do my job, and accept that I am not going to be put on a pedestal because I am a woman.

should not be tolerated in a government institution.

Not all EMS agencys are government run, many of them are private. As is mine.

 

[eveningsky339]

There is indeed sexism in EMS... and finance, aerospace engineering, and every other profession you can bother to think of.

There will always be a few insecure dodo-brains who call someone out based on gender or race. It happens everywhere.

I have several female co-workers, and I have nothing but the utmost respect for them. They were my seniors when I was a new hire and were treated as such. Other than an occasional joke (out of love, mind you) regarding the "heavy lifting" part of the job, we don't even bother distinguishing male or female when the tones go off.

 

[Miss Xina]

Google "sexism in fire service" or "racism in EMS".
Here's a bit to get you started:
http://www.ournewanahuac.net/racism-and-sexism-in-houston-fire-department/2009/09/17/
http://www.pbs.org/itvs/testofcourage/diversity2.html
http://www.firerescue1.com/fire-job...ne-fire-chief-sexism-spurred-his-resignation/
http://www.crotonblog.com/archives/...joe_streany_sexist_opponent_of_womens_rights/
http://www.greencommons.org/node/807
http://74.125.155.132/search?q=cach...ft.doc+sexism+in+EMS&cd=9&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

The fact that you think people have to "look" for things to be offended over shows just how completely you are blinkered.

Calling someone a n****r or a ch**k used to be part of the everyday vernacular too. And yes, there are chauvinists EVERYWHERE. There's hurt and suffering EVERYWHERE. Does that mean we don't have the right to call it like we see it, when we see it? To help when and where we see hurt? Using "gay" as an insult is hate speech, and should not be tolerated in a government institution.

FTR, I, personally, have never been called any of these names... but I've seen the way other women have been talked about back at the station, or around the BBQ over a brewsky. Some of them thought they could buy the men's approval by denouncing "those crazy feminists" as well. It didn't protect them from scorn.

You can keep reaching for that cookie from the boys all you want, but you're never gonna get it.

Also, it's amazing how defensive people get when you point out their "-isms". Hmmm, hit a bit too close to home, perhaps? If you dismiss a person's experience just because "well, I've never seen anything happen like that"... well, then there's really no use discussing anything, is there?

Your experience and your life are obviously how the world works for everyone, after all.

you seem to hold a whole lot of hostility to men and the EMS/Fire departments.

Maybe this career isn't right for you. Maybe you should look elsewhere. You seem to feel the need to attack everyone that is male. I don't know what happened to you, nor do I need to know. I just think you have unresolved issues that maybe a counsellor could help you with...

"your experience and your life are obviously how the world works for everyone"... you seem to think your experience is the norm.

I don't think you're setting a good example though. You expect men to treat women with respect and equality, but you're treating every single man the same way. With disrespect, prejudice and hostility.

If it were a man doing this to a woman, you'd be all over them!

 

[reaper]

When you hold the hostile attitude, all you will see is hostility. Again, maybe it is time for a move, if that is how you are treated. EMS around the country is very diverse and almost all are treated equal. Unless you are the one with an attitude, then you will be treated equally with like attitude!

 

[Kookaburra]

I bet if you stayed away from the feminist magazines, you would be much happier, and probably even find a date.

So you are using a sexist and homophobic remark to say that sexism and homophobia aren't a problem in EMS? Interesting strategy. Keep going! I've almost got my butt-hurt dude bingo card filled out!

 

[reaper]

In everyone of your posts, you have put down men. You are grouping all men together. That is the perfect example of "sexist"!

 

[Lifeguards For Life]

you seem to hold a whole lot of hostility to men and the EMS/Fire departments.

Maybe this career isn't right for you. Maybe you should look elsewhere. You seem to feel the need to attack everyone that is male. I don't know what happened to you, nor do I need to know. I just think you have unresolved issues that maybe a counsellor could help you with...

"your experience and your life are obviously how the world works for everyone"... you seem to think your experience is the norm.

I don't think you're setting a good example though. You expect men to treat women with respect and equality, but you're treating every single man the same way. With disrespect, prejudice and hostility.

If it were a man doing this to a woman, you'd be all over them!

sasha's always been nice to me

 

[JPINFV]

So you are using a sexist and homophobic remark to say that sexism and homophobia aren't a problem in EMS? Interesting strategy. Keep going! I've almost got my butt-hurt dude bingo card filled out!

How in the hell is that homophobic? Are you saying that only homosexuals can't score a date?

 

[Luno]

Hmmmm.....

So you are using a sexist and homophobic remark to say that sexism and homophobia aren't a problem in EMS? Interesting strategy. Keep going! I've almost got my butt-hurt dude bingo card filled out!

I agree with most of what you said, OP. There's a difference between "gallows humor" and being plain offensive. Just because it's "culture" doesn't mean it's above reproach, and the EMS/Fire "culture" is a very hostile environment for anyone who is not a white, heterosexual male.

Wow, kookaburra, you definitely need to speak with someone. If it is regarding specific events, then you need to speak to their supervisor. If it does not involve specific events then a psychologist. Your attitude is exactly the type of attitude that I've experienced from people who could not do the job, and felt that it was some sort of bias that held them back. I will state that as I do not know you personally, I cannot conclusively state this is your issue. Yes, there is the "gay guy," in our station, and no, he is not homosexual. If we had a homosexual partner, he most likely would be referred to as the "straight guy." Equal treatment all around... If it offends you, feel free to mention it on your first shift with us, and we will change it. You may just be referred to as "eggshell" or something alike, but we won't cross the protected category line.

With everyone that I've worked with whether a man or a woman, I could care less what you do in your bedroom, church, personal life, I care simply if you do the job to the best of your ability, no excuses. I don't care if you're a woman, I don't care if you are on your menstrual cycle, I don't care if you've just been dumped by your girlfriend, I don't care if you're a man, you will all be held to the exact same standard. There is no deviation for sex or orientation, and for me to treat anyone differently would be exactly that, sexism. I refuse to "cut breaks" for women, any more then I would for men. If you can't handle that, then I suggest that you reconsider the career you've chosen. That being said, I've noticed an abrupt attitude change since your joining this board, has there been something to negatively affect you while you've been in the field? If so, then it is something that you should address, and not let it affect your opinion of the field in general.

 

[zaboomafoozarg]

Guess I'll come back to this thread seeing as how it's about something interesting again!

First off, let me say: PEOPLE, stop telling people with whom you do not agree that they need to find another career!!!!! It's the epitome of ignorance. Every industry is made up of tons of people from all backgrounds with every conceivable characteristic. Just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean that YOU get to determine that THEY are not suitable for the job. You're nothing but a forum troll when you spew crap like that. Forgive the bluntness but it's the way it is.:blush:


Secondly, I cannot speak from both sides of the fence because I am male. But I would not hesitate in the slightest to say that there are a LLLOT of selfish, filthy-minded men out there who talk like dirtbags and behave like animals. It's a fact. I'm not saying it doesn't happen with women too. Just that it DOES happen with men, for sure. One only has to walk through a college campus or any place where there are groups of same-gender people talking to see it. Sometimes it's even difficult to get away from. And thus is only reasonable to assume that, by the rule of averages, at least SOME men like this will have spilled over into EMS.



So simmer down everybody. There's no need to have a gender equality war right here.

 

[Seaglass]

It serves no purpose to be angry at men as a whole. Yes, some of them are the chauvinist jerks who've made parts of my life hell, often without even realizing it. But some of them are also the men who've encouraged me to pursue nontraditional interests, provided me with the same mentoring they gave to the boys, or even talked coworkers into giving me a shot on a team. All of my hard work would be worth nothing if nobody ever gave me a chance... and the people who've most often had the power to do that are men. I think it's incredibly unfair to tar them with the same brush.

I don't think they're exceptions to the rule, either. I just think most people fall somewhere in the middle, and are easily swayed for bad or good by their peers and upbringing.

In the seriously sexist places I've worked, I've learned two strategies. Either I persevere and win enough to be satisfied, or persevere and eventually give up on a lost cause. The day they see me as an exception to 'how women are' is the day I win... it'll take a lot more of me, or arguments from men, to change their minds. Regardless, being constantly bitter is very counterproductive. People can smell it a mile away, and nobody likes it. Besides, I really don't enjoy living like that. When I stay bitter no matter what, it's time for me to find a new workplace.

 

[Seaglass]

First off, let me say: PEOPLE, stop telling people with whom you do not agree that they need to find another career!!!!!

Seconded. Along with the rest of your interestingly colored post.

 

[ffemt8978]

I think that this thread has now run it's course.