usafmedic45
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Prove it.
Ultimate Rescue Rick POV
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Prove it.
usafmedic45
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Once again, prove it. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim not otherwise backed up by evidence.
DesertMedic66
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Prove it.
No way to prove it. We have 8 medic ambulances to cover 2,400 square miles. So response and transport times can be 45+ minutes.
The only "proof" I have of it is the countless MVC where 2 ambulances leave the scene at the same time (1 going code and 1 not) and arriving at the hospital at totally different times.
.....prove that it doesn't save us minutes on response times and transport times for my area.
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usafmedic45
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Then it's not fact. It's conjecture and speculation.
Actually, if you were to go back and pull times, etc and apply a proper statistical analysis to it to account for other factors that is a way to prove it at least marginally so.
That's not how it works, but I'm not surprised that EMS personnel don't realize that. There's existing evidence that says it doesn't save time in a variety of settings (including remote areas) so therefore the l don't have to prove you correct or incorrect. The logical assumption is that you are simply operating under some form of a selection or confirmation bias.
epipusher
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Whether it saves time or not, is it worth the added risk to transport at a presumably higher rate of speed?
DesertMedic66
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I am operating off of personal experience. You are also not able to prove me correct or incorrect on saving time. Yes there maybe a study from a "variety" of areas. But it's not from my area directly.
I can go back and pull all the times from different calls but I know nothing about statistical analysis. Yes the ambulance not going code may have had heavier traffic or had to stop at more red lights. However the ambulance going code gets around these factors due to code 3. We hardly ever have to go thru a red light due to the opticom system.
How long does sitting at a normal red light take? 30 seconds if not alot more. Now imagine having no red lights to wait at.
Sitting in stopped traffic on the freeway vs going 15 mph on the shoulder of the freeway. I can keep giving more examples of tons of time saved during code 3 then normal driving.
If there are studies that show code 3 doesn't save time, then why are ambulances, fire engines, police still going code 3?
ArcticKat
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82MPH in a 55 Zone
In case anyone was curious, I deduced the speed of this particular Whacker by counting the dotted lines between 3:36 and 3:56 and came up with 60. Based on the requirements that dotted lines be 40 feet apart, (center to center) he travelled 2400 feet in 20 seconds. That equates to 82 MPH, give or take.
I'm really on the fence to be honest. I don't have a light for my POV but I used to have a supervisor SUV with light bar and markings that I would use to respond to scenes or to go get the ambulance when we have a call.
Sometimes the lights came in handy, sometimes they were best left turned off. The problem is, we don't get any dispatch information when the tones go off, we only get that when we get into the ambulance. We respond from home not knowing if the 911 call was for a cardiac arrest or for a stubbed toe.
I guess it's kinda like owning a firearm. I don't own one, I don't use one, but I will defend your right to have one if you are a responsible firearm owner. If you abuse the weapon or commit a crime with it, you should never be allowed to hold one again. Same with lights on a POV, if it's legal and you use them responsibly, then by all means. If you're a whacker....get a life.
In case anyone was curious, I deduced the speed of this particular Whacker by counting the dotted lines between 3:36 and 3:56 and came up with 60. Based on the requirements that dotted lines be 40 feet apart, (center to center) he travelled 2400 feet in 20 seconds. That equates to 82 MPH, give or take.
I'm really on the fence to be honest. I don't have a light for my POV but I used to have a supervisor SUV with light bar and markings that I would use to respond to scenes or to go get the ambulance when we have a call.
Sometimes the lights came in handy, sometimes they were best left turned off. The problem is, we don't get any dispatch information when the tones go off, we only get that when we get into the ambulance. We respond from home not knowing if the 911 call was for a cardiac arrest or for a stubbed toe.
I guess it's kinda like owning a firearm. I don't own one, I don't use one, but I will defend your right to have one if you are a responsible firearm owner. If you abuse the weapon or commit a crime with it, you should never be allowed to hold one again. Same with lights on a POV, if it's legal and you use them responsibly, then by all means. If you're a whacker....get a life.
usafmedic45
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Yes, but then again you rely on medical research that wasn't done on the specific patient you are working on, correct?
...and in science, anecdotal evidence ("personal experience") is a very low quality data source to base something upon. As the saying goes "n=1 equals nothing".
I don't have to nor do I feel compelled to. The burden is with the person making the "unreasonable claim" (not my choice of words...it comes from another scientist's statement on this subject) that is not in line with prior data. I'll use the example of the existence of aliens. It's not the non-believers to disprove that we are being visited by alien lifeforms, since it's an a priori logical error to assume that they exist without evidence to that fact in the first place. The burden is with the redneck who is claiming he was "probed" and the nutjobs on that UFO Hunters show to bring forth evidence that the counterpoint to current scientific opinion is, as a point of fact, correct.
I am simply you not make extrapolations based upon shaky data that may or may not be correct due to biases, either intentional or unintentional.
Ah, that's the kicker there! It's not your lights and siren that are giving you a speed advantage. It's the Opticom system which I don't believe most rednecks and whackers have access to.
I had it estimated at around 70 mph just from an educated guess.
Anyone know where this crackpot (the driver, not ArticKat) is from? I think his local LE agency should know about this.
Because people are :censored::censored::censored::censored:ing stupid and resistant to change, especially if you take away things they feel make them feel more important than they actually are or showcase to others how important they think they are.
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DesertMedic66
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The opticom system is integrated into the code 3 lights (company got mad at people turning it on at red lights for no reason). And as a red neck myself I just need a couple hundred dollars and I could be a wacker with an opticom :rofl:
epipusher
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Most ambulances probably are running hot, code3 etc., to the hospital due to the fear or lack of confidence from the attendant in the back regarding their patient.
EMTSTUDENT25
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I'm wondering if these POV's are mainly in a certain area of the US because I've NEVER witnessed one of these vehicles go flying by.
ArcticKat
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Whoops, sorry, I screwed up. The time frame was 3:38 to 3:56, thus 18 seconds to drive 2400 feet.
ie, 90+ MPH in a 55MPH zone.
Yikes.
That is exactly why ambulances use lights and sirens to the hospital...the paramedic in the back is incompetent of providing the treatments that this particular patient requires and has to get them to someone who is competent in a timely manner.
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usafmedic45
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In a lot of states, that's illegal.
A lot of states don't allow it at all. Mostly you see it in the same areas where having a gun rack in your truck is both legal and considered something of a status symbol.
usafmedic45
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Seriously, any idea where this idiot is from?
EDIT: Based on some of the stuff in the background of his videos, he's in Hammond, LA.
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ArcticKat
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Louisiana
According to one of his other vids....he was even kind enough to include his plate number on the vid. Any interested Police Officers, see the attachment.
I think this one is the worst though.
Seizure anyone?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l62dUX4e8E
According to one of his other vids....he was even kind enough to include his plate number on the vid. Any interested Police Officers, see the attachment.
I think this one is the worst though.
Seizure anyone?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l62dUX4e8E
Attachments
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According to one of his other vids....he was even kind enough to include his plate number on the vid. Any interested Police Officers, see the attachment.
I think this one is the worst though.
Seizure anyone?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l62dUX4e8E
At what point after the first few lights are you compensating for something? You already have the biggest truck with the biggest tires but now you need the biggest display of "look at meeeee" glaring in everyone's face. I mean did you see how many people quickly responded to him being right behind them? If you missed it the answer is about 1 and a half people if you count the guy that waves him by @ 55mph. Point being unless its a GIANT red truck (your muddin truck doesn't count), a BIG moving box with lights and sirens or more importantly
something that will potentially give you a ticket, a large amount of people won't even take them seriously. I wouldn't even think this was an emergency vehicle it really looks like a show truck with for poops n' giggles lights on it.... probably flip him off since I'm now wearing my shades at 1 in the morning
+1000
I found the more experience and confidence I gained as a medic, the less I transported emergently
Good lord. Aside from the fact that, in this situation you are wrong (long transports from remote areas are really the only time that increased speeds will save time) your whole premise in refusing to answer is asinine. Allow me to paraphrase; "I'm right, you're wrong, but I won't prove that I'm right because I'm right." Come on...do you really think that's going to work, especially for this, where simple basic math that any highschooler can do would prove this?
Lets see...driving 55mph vs 70mph (random numbers, insert whatever you want). 55mph=4840ft/min, 70mph=6160ft/min. So every 10 minutes you travel 61600ft at 70mph, or 2.5 miles further than you would have at 55. Which works out to be 2 minutes 45sec (roughly, actually 2.72min) saved for evert 10 minutes of travel time at 70 vs 55mph. So, for a 45 mile transport you'd save about 10.5 minutes.
Now, all that discounts the fact that the average speed that you travelled would be lower, and that it isn't always safe to drive the average ambulance at that high a speed, but the principle still remains the same; higher rates of speed will save time if the total distance travelled is increased. Of course, this doesn't mean that it's worth it to drive like that just to save some time, but it does mean that...you are wrong.
Why would you say that?
We run code 3 when we have a code, or when myself or a basic have called for a EMT-P intercept and we stay code 3 until we get a medic onboard or we get to the hospital.
And, as I stated in my post I go through several 3 towns and two cities to get to the hospital, all of them with main roads and traffic lights. It is not so much about the speed, it is about being able to get cars to yield so we can go without stopping in traffic.
As far as proving it try this... the next time you are in traffic... put on your lights and sirens and see if the cars in front of you yield, pull over or otherwise let you by. I suspect that you will find that they do. If not, than your community is significantly different than mine. Around here, people pull over to the side when they see emergency vehicles with lights and sirens. Again, not about speed as much as getting through rural, main street traffic.
fast65
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Right...around here we get about 4/10 cars that actually yield to us, and I'm in a rural system. Our company policy requires we run code 3 to all calls, but I can count on one hand the number of code 3 returns I've done in the past 3 months.
Sent from my mobile command center