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CFRBryan347768
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Med Control? Uhh EMS Director of some sort maybe lol
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Med Control? Uhh EMS Director of some sort maybe lol
JPINFV
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Med control. Other medics. Physicians/RNs/PA/NP/RT/list goes on at the hospital.
"Which is why EMS will, for the unfortunate foreseeable future, be a low paid trade and not a profession"
Think about it... Lawyers make more money than god (thanks to our paying them)... Doctors make almost as much as Lawyers (thanks to our paying them again)...
Who keeps someone alive so they can see (and pay) the Doctor and later see (and pay) a lawyer so they can sue whomever put them in the position to need us to keep them alive in the first place!... We should get a kick back!
Think about it... Lawyers make more money than god (thanks to our paying them)... Doctors make almost as much as Lawyers (thanks to our paying them again)...
Who keeps someone alive so they can see (and pay) the Doctor and later see (and pay) a lawyer so they can sue whomever put them in the position to need us to keep them alive in the first place!... We should get a kick back!
mikeylikesit
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you are....awesome. i like that a lot.
JPINFV
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How, exactly, does that deal with the flawed notion that "class is just a formality?" The simple fact is that you should learn the concepts and theories in class in an environment where you won't be killing people. Sorry, but the real education happens in the classroom. Not that learning how to apply it (clinical experience) isn't important, but it's useless without having a base knowledge to build off of.
BossyCow
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I'm not sure I'd use "We Keep Lawyers Alive" as a slogan for a pay increase campaign
BossyCow
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Agreed JPINFV. While the application of what we learn is integral to the development of our skills. The biggest thing we gain from the classroom and the ongoing CME required by our licensure is not how to do something but when to do it, when not to do and and an understanding of why.
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CFRBryan347768
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I disagree, and I strongly believe that most people also on here agree that this IS A PROFESSION NOT a trade.
BossyCow
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So, the trades are a bad thing?? Think of that the next time your toilet backs up.
el Murpharino
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You're right - trades take a few years to go through school. EMT's only need 120 hours. It's sad that a car mechanic has more education than the average EMT, or in some cases, medics as well.
JPINFV
Gadfly
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1. Full disclosure. The quote is actually from me.
2. It is slowly moving towards being a profession and is worthy of being one. I just don't see it there yet. When the top level doesn't even require a year of education, it's kinda of hard to justify it yet as a profession.
Outbac1
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Show both the closet where they can check any holier than thou attitude they may have. It is a team effort on the truck, at the base and at the hospital. We can all learn something from each other.
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CFRBryan347768
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The top level is more than a year here. And why are you saying that you said that quote? I said that.
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CFRBryan347768
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Did I say trades WERE a bad thing? Because if I did point it out to me.? NO! I work with a GC, and im an ASE Tech. So before you assume im not involved in any trades dont try and throw that line at me. And lastly don't put words in my mouth.
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CFRBryan347768
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And as more and more agencys are becoming paid....
Trade is the voluntary exchange of goods, services, or both. Trade is also called commerce. A mechanism that allows trade is called a market. The original form of trade was barter, the direct exchange of goods and services.
A profession is an occupation, vocation or career where specialized knowledge of a subject, field, or science is applied.[1] It is usually applied to occupations that involve prolonged academic training and a formal qualification. It is axiomatic that "professional activity involves systematic knowledge and proficiency."[2]
Sounds to me like EMS falls under PROFESSION.
Trade is the voluntary exchange of goods, services, or both. Trade is also called commerce. A mechanism that allows trade is called a market. The original form of trade was barter, the direct exchange of goods and services.
A profession is an occupation, vocation or career where specialized knowledge of a subject, field, or science is applied.[1] It is usually applied to occupations that involve prolonged academic training and a formal qualification. It is axiomatic that "professional activity involves systematic knowledge and proficiency."[2]
Sounds to me like EMS falls under PROFESSION.
You seemed to have skipped over a few key words in your definition of a "profession", those being "prolonged academic training".
A semester at a community college, or even worse, the 2 week "we guarantee you'll pass" sham trade schools doesn't constitute prolonged, are mostly not academic and most barely cover the training involved in becoming an EMT, much less a paramedic.
A respiratory therapist needs a 2 year degree in order to work in their field, an RN needs a minimum of an AS degree, a freakin Vet tech needs more education to work in their field than do the majority of EMS workers. Could it become a profession? Absolutely, are most people in the EMS world professionals? Not even close. I include myself in that group by the way.
John E.
A semester at a community college, or even worse, the 2 week "we guarantee you'll pass" sham trade schools doesn't constitute prolonged, are mostly not academic and most barely cover the training involved in becoming an EMT, much less a paramedic.
A respiratory therapist needs a 2 year degree in order to work in their field, an RN needs a minimum of an AS degree, a freakin Vet tech needs more education to work in their field than do the majority of EMS workers. Could it become a profession? Absolutely, are most people in the EMS world professionals? Not even close. I include myself in that group by the way.
John E.
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CFRBryan347768
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And what about the people who dont stop at EMT-B and go on to the highest level their state allows for Emergency care, then is it a profession? For the paramedics that go above and beyond and and take classes outside of the paramedic class so they can be more knowledgeable then is it a profession?
Jango
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Good stand there CFR.....however I must say this....trade/profession....why does it matter? I dont care what a person does for a living, if you are happy flipping burgers or flying jets for a living what does it matter?
Ridryder911
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Actually, the "Plumber" is more of a profession than those in EMS. They require longer education and increased skills, as well as require more clinical time (journeyman).
Thus, the reason many make more than some physicians. My next door neighbor is a plumber, also a graduate of West Point, and lives in the nicest home in the community...
Something, we in EMS should think about...
R/r 911
Thus, the reason many make more than some physicians. My next door neighbor is a plumber, also a graduate of West Point, and lives in the nicest home in the community...
Something, we in EMS should think about...
R/r 911
Ridryder911
EMS Guru
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The reason it matter is for multiple reasons. One can be "happy" at their job, but never really be able to afford to stay in it. For example; I know of Paramedics that make less than those working at Wendy's. As well, the classification of "trade" versus "profession" is not only just wording but also classifies upon how we are perceived, reimbursed, and growth.
For example, one university has classified us (EMS) as trade. In which that means we as a profession are more "skill" than knowledge base. Which means I do not use cognitive (brain) rather a repeated manual use of skill. This type of classification can limit the amount of reimbursement (payment) to EMS providers from Medicare & Insurance providers. As a Paramedic, I must use cognitive skills to diagnose (yes, we diagnose) then provide care (sometimes using skills) to perform a procedures.
We must remove the stigma that we are a "trade" to ever be considered a peer in medicine, and be recognized as a profession. Also remove all Paramedic programs from "trade" and vocational training institutions and should be placed in collegiate level educational facilities.
R/r 911
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