Patient Question

You know I do have a lot of complaints of the speculum's being too "cold"! :D

R/r 911
 
not being on scene....i have no right to judge someone elses care because i dont know the circumstances....that being said if i had a seizure Pt i dont think i would do a pelvic exam unless the was a significant MOI....but hey we also dont know the whole story this kid never checked back...so...idk
 
JPINFV said:
Sorry people, but to me someone saying 'full medical exam including a pelvic' does not fully equate to my mind as 'checking for pelvic instability,' especially after a patient has been fully stripped. I won't rule out that I'm reading too far into it, but with how it was worded came across with giant red flags, shiny red lights, and noise makers.
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So you're saying you jumped to conclusions and didn't think like an EMT? When an EMT says pelvic to me I think checking pelvic stability/deformity.
 
The thread has been moderated and off topic posts have been removed. Let's try to stay on track from this point forward.
 
Ok thanks everyone for helping me understand the situation. She examined around my pelvis and not my genitals, so thank you for clarifying for me that this is standard protocol. She did not give me an i.v or ekg so I'm guessing she was an EMT-B (not sure though). I still can't understand why my principal was allowed to see me in that state, or why the paramedic didn't cover me up until we arrived at the hospital (even though she had finished examining me). But I really appreciate all of your professional feedback. The whole situation just kind of freaked me out, it was my first experience like this.
 
There could be one more logical reason for not covering you. Seizures do not always have to be in the form of the "grand mal". There can be just slight tremors that are isolated in the extremities. She may have been watching for other signs of any type of seizure activity.

Your principal has a vested interest in your safety while you are on school property. Remember the principal is your pal.
 
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Emt /b/ said:
Yeah...there was really no need to cut off all of your clothes. Or any of them, really.
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If you had a seizure I can see no reason to remobe any clothing.
Since you said you were conscious, and could tell them what happened, I would say they should of just immobilized you, and taken you to the hospital.
I believe in patient modesty, and actually was trained to give a patient cover, when removing clothes.
I would say you should report this to the chief, of the department that ran the call.
 
They could have just been trying to be careful. If they had missed anything it would have landed on them.

I wouldn't have removed all the clothing, I would have asked do you feel pain any where besides your head?

Then maybe a rapid trauma assessment with the clothes on, just to be safe, I wouldn't have removed really anything unless you were complaining of pain when I palpated. Check PMS.

They definetly should have covered you up after they assessed you, theres no reason to have you uncovered for no reason.

You did go unconcious.

They probably where just trying to make sure they didn't miss anything, but I could be wroung.

Report it and see where it goes.
 
VentMedic said:
Your principal has a vested interest in your safety while you are on school property. Remember the principal is your pal.
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Ha! I haven't heard that one in years!!!!!!!

OP, listen, it is understandable that you feel violated and all, but if you have thoughts or intentions of pursuing this matter further, A) have an adult pursue as you will get no where, and B) do not solicit information on an anonymous forum website. Have legal experts gather the info needed, getting it here will only discredit you and harm any potential case you may have. And honestly , based on what you have posted, you do not have a case of anything other than self perceived embarrassment. You are still considered a minor and you were on school property. As such, the principal has every right to be present. Did the medics over do it, maybe, but was it such a traumatizing experience that necessitates legal action, highly doubtful. Personally I think there is more to this, but again, should you feel that there was an injustice done, have the pros look into it.
 
Don't know the entire situation or anything, but perhaps for a seizure pt, they were inspecting for any incontinence (as it can happen in seizure pts).
 
daveg said:
Ok thanks everyone for helping me understand the situation. She examined around my pelvis and not my genitals, so thank you for clarifying for me that this is standard protocol. She did not give me an i.v or ekg so I'm guessing she was an EMT-B (not sure though). I still can't understand why my principal was allowed to see me in that state, or why the paramedic didn't cover me up until we arrived at the hospital (even though she had finished examining me). But I really appreciate all of your professional feedback. The whole situation just kind of freaked me out, it was my first experience like this.
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You do have rights as the patient. Did the EMT's let you know everything that they were intending to do for you and the reason why?
It's called 'Informed Consent'.
If you were left uncovered in the ambulance and felt uncomfortable about it, you did have the right to ask the EMT to cover you up! If she felt it was necessary to monitor you uncovered, she should have told you the reasons for it, and given you the options.
I'm not saying what the EMT did was wrong, but if you had concerns at the time, you could have said something!
Maybe something to remember if you find yourself in that situation again.

Cheers Enjoynz
 
enjoynz said:
You do have rights as the patient. Did the EMT's let you know everything that they were intending to do for you and the reason why?
It's called 'Informed Consent'.
If you were left uncovered in the ambulance and felt uncomfortable about it, you did have the right to ask the EMT to cover you up! If she felt it was necessary to monitor you uncovered, she should have told you the reasons for it, and given you the options.
I'm not saying what the EMT did was wrong, but if you had concerns at the time, you could have said something!
Maybe something to remember if you find yourself in that situation again.

Cheers Enjoynz
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Actually, since the OP was a minor, they can not give consent. It must come from a parent/legal guardian or the school under the In Loco Parentis doctrine.
 
ffemt8978 said:
Actually, since the OP was a minor, they can not give consent. It must come from a parent/legal guardian or the school under the In Loco Parentis doctrine.
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That's interesting. In New Zealand under our Health and Disability Act, the legal age to give Informed Consent is from 16 years old.
What age do they need to be in the States?


Cheers Enjoynz
 
While strip - n - flip is warrented in pts. that are possibly major traumas becuse you don't have time to play peekaboo looking for injuries . This didn't seem appropriate for the situation , however , none of us were there and we're only hearing the pt's side of the story . The pelvic exam was probably a pelvic rock to check for a possible fx . Again , seems like overkill , but we weren't there . This does remind us of the need to talk to our pts. and let them know what we're doing and why . It also reminds us that our pts. can feel embarressed and intimidated by what we feel is appropriate treatment .


Craig
 
Talk is good!
I would prefer, and can, talk to my pts before I carryout my intended proceedures. At least then they can refuse if need be, to any treatment/s intended.
I believe the attending EMT was doing what they felt was the best for their patient. Why would they jeopardise their welfare?

Responda
 
enjoynz said:
That's interesting. In New Zealand under our Health and Disability Act, the legal age to give Informed Consent is from 16 years old.
What age do they need to be in the States?


Cheers Enjoynz
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18 except in certain circumstances.
 
Does anyone else recall the section in pt assessment about age specific concerns.. particularly the part about adolescents being deeply concerned with their modesty and very easily embarrassed? This is a perfect case in point. Being the age the pt is, the disrobing and sense of personal space violation is more embarrassing than the fact they were thrashing and seizing. A good reminder for us all to remember how differently kids react at different stages of development.
 
I did have a pretty big cut on my head that required 8 stitches from falling off my chair. I was pretty woozy the entire time and had alot of neck and back pain. I don't really remember having the seizure but i apparently fell pretty hard. When I got to the E.R they took x-rays and several different doctors checked out my spine.
 
If you were having neck/back pain, then a strip and flip may have been warranted, especially with the head injury.
 
i could understand stripping to the underwear in that case, but its the removal of the underware itself that i see as excessive
 
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