How long in the field before medic school?

Hastings said:
I am a medic that went straight from Basic to Paramedic with no prior experience before or in between. Best decision I made. I highly suggest just doing it all at once (Basic and Medic). Don't stop in between.
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I just want to make sure that we're on the same page. By going straight from Basic to Medic, do you mean transitioning from the emt-basic program straight into the Paramedic Labs/Clinicals?

The school where I am currently taking the basic course offers two degrees for Paramedics; an AAS and certificate. The AAS is two years long, and for the first year you are basically fulfilling general education requirements and some EMS courses in research and distaster preparedness. The second year consists of pretty much only the laboratory/clinical coursework, and Pharmacology. I took the course during the summer and wanted to jump in directly to the certification program, since I had just completed as AS degree just a few months before. However, when I spoke to the program directors, they seemed pretty strict about having at least several hundred hours of experience in an ambulance before getting started as a medic. The director of my local ambulance company told me the same thing. I had no experience in an ambulance prior to this, and so I took their advice.

I loved the basic class, and felt that it would have been a great introduction to the Paramedic program. But towards the end of the course I started to feel a little more than disillusioned. I thought that working as a Basic for an entire year would have been a waste of time, and completeting another degree seemed improbable. I felt the certification program would have been more than adequate, but there seemed to have been a great deal of resistance since many in the community kept overemphasizing the 'experience' factor. Considering my previous educational background, I don't think that going straight to the certification program would have been an unrealistic endeavor. I partially regret not being clear about this to my instructors in due time.

I'm starting to think the only purpose of the EMT-B is to let pre-medical and nursing students make some extra money while they go to school. <_<
 
NREMT requires you to be a current Basic or Intermediate for Paramedic certification. And requires you to be a basic to become and Intermediate, So how can one skip being a Basic all together and jump straight to Paramedic?

Copy & Pasted from the NREMT website (http://www.nremt.org/EMTServices/reg_para_history.asp#Paramedic_Entry_Requirements)
Paramedic Entry Requirements

All individuals applying for NREMT-Paramedic certification must meet the following requirements to be eligible for national certification:

1. Applicant must be 18 years of age or older.

2. Current National Registry or state certification at the EMT-Basic, EMT-Intermediate/85 or EMT-Intermediate/99 level.

3. Successful completion of a state-approved EMT-Paramedic educational program, within the past two (2) years, that equals or exceeds the behavioral objectives of the EMT-Paramedic National Standard Curriculum as developed and promulgated by the U.S. Department of Transportation.

If the candidate's initial EMT-Paramedic educational program was completed more than two (2) years ago and the candidate has maintained state certification at the EMT-Paramedic level, the candidate must submit documentation verifying completion of a current EMT-Paramedic refresher-training program within the past two (2) years.

If the candidate's initial EMT-Paramedic educational program was completed more than two (2) years ago and the candidate has not maintained state certification at the EMT-Paramedic level, the candidate should refer to the "NREMT-Paramedic Re-entry Policy" section on this page.

If the candidate's initial EMT-Paramedic education program was completed more than two (2) years ago and the candidate had never gained state certification at the EMT-Paramedic level, the candidate must complete a new, state-approved EMT-Paramedic educational program prior to application.

4. Truthfully complete the Licensing Action and Felony Statements on the application and supply the documentation if necessary.

5. Possess current CPR credential at the healthcare provider or equivalent level.

6. Successful completion of the NREMT-Paramedic cognitive and psychomotor examinations.
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Hey there. I am new to this forum. I was reading through this thread and have a question. A lot of you are saying to jump right from one to the other. This is what I wanted to do but the program director would not let me. Has anyone else ever run into that?

That said I have now worked for 10 months as a basic. 8 of that were for a private company doing strictly transports. My plan is to start medic class in January but my supervisors here keep saying that "being a good medic comes from first being a good basic and a good intermediate." Either way I plan to take the class. I already have an associate degree. It is only liberal arts but I have all my basics. I also have Anatomy and Physiology and medical terminology because I had planned to go into radiography and changed my mind. Those of you that are medics, do you think it would be ok and I would do well if I went for my medic now instead of waiting and/or doing intermediate like my supervisors keep pushing? Thanks for any replies.
 
Ok, let me clear up the misunderstanding about what I tried to explain.

Step 1 ... Basic school. Anyone can join that if they meet the requirements and are accepted.

Step 2 ... ----- Graduate Basic School -----

(Optional: Get Basic license) - Not necessary. Can move onto step 3.

(Optional: Work in field) - Not necessary. Can move onto step 3.

Step 3 ... ----- Take Medic School Requirements: A&P, Medical Terminology -----

Step 4 ... ----- Apply to Medic School -----

Step 5 ... Down here is Medic School. It comes after Basic school. After you graduate Basic School. When you graduate Basic School, you can apply to Medic School. Again, you have to graduate Basic School up there before you apply for medic school. However, you do not have to have a medic license. The rule was that you had to have a Medic license before testing for a medic license. Requirements for entry into Medic school is graduating the Basic school up there, doing Anatomy and Physiology requirements, applying, and being accepted.
 
Most states (especially those that utilize NREMT) requires one to complete and pass the NREMT EMT exam before acceptance and definitely before clinicals are performed at advance level skills.

Go to school, obtain your basic, take NREMT exam and state license, apply for medic school if applicable. Some states do require length of experience before going forward.

R/r 911
 
stephenrb81 said:
NREMT requires you to be a current Basic or Intermediate for Paramedic certification. And requires you to be a basic to become and Intermediate, So how can one skip being a Basic all together and jump straight to Paramedic?

Copy & Pasted from the NREMT website (http://www.nremt.org/EMTServices/reg_para_history.asp#Paramedic_Entry_Requirements)
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You can't skip it completely. I have seen Zero to Hero programs that take someone off the street, ram EMT-B down their throat 40 hours a week, then go right into medic. I would assume that the syllabus doesn't call for as much BLS review in the class.
 
Ridryder911 said:
Most states (especially those that utilize NREMT) requires one to complete and pass the NREMT EMT exam before acceptance and definitely before clinicals are performed at advance level skills.

Go to school, obtain your basic, take NREMT exam and state license, apply for medic school if applicable. Some states do require length of experience before going forward.

R/r 911
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^ That.

What I listed above is how my school works. All schools are different. Some have different prerequisites and requirements, some require experience in between Basic and Medic, so on. However, if available in your area, follow the advice,

"Go to school, obtain your basic, take NREMT exam and state license, apply for medic school if applicable."
 
I spent two years as an EMT on a truck before I went to Medic school. From what I've seen from the people at my service that never worked as an EMT before they became a Paramedic. Spend some time in the field as an EMT first. Those of us who did transitioned and completed our requirements fast than those who didnt.
 
Been There, Done That

So I see benifits to both sides of the argument.

I'm a medic who went actually straight from high school to EMT to Medic school. Didnt work as an EMT before I went to Medic school. I wanted to, but no one could hire me because I was too young for insurance.

Now that I'm working in the field, I am glad that I knew what I wanted and didnt waste time with extra schooling. But I see how working as an EMT would have helped. BLS maybe not as much, but at least I would have learned how the ambulance was set up and how things work in the slower setting and on in a BLS setting you definitely get you basic assessment down really well. And if you get the chance to work on a ALS unit as an EMT, you get to see Medics in action, learn how to run a scene, learn how to deal with the chaos without having all of the pressure on you. So I definitely wish I had had the opportunity to work as an EMT, even for 6months or so before being thrown out there trying to learn everything all at once.

That being said, I'm still glad that I did things the way I did. I'm the youngest medic around but I can still hold my own and I love my job, so it is definitely do able. Just make sure you know what you're getting yourself into if you decide to skip working as an EMT and know that it's going to be a lot of work.
 
Here in BC with the wonderful Justice Institute the old rules were 2 years of PCP-IV, or 1,000 Code 3 patients before they would even consider you in the ACP program. However, now they are revamping the guidelines.
Old Rules:
  • Valid PCP license or equivalent credentials from an accredited training agency
  • Valid (within the previous year) C level CPR certificate
  • Minimum of 1,000 patient exposures
  • Valid BC Class 4 driver's license
  • Criminal record check. No conviction for a criminal offence related to the job of a paramedic will be accepted
  • Proof of immunization for Diphtheria & Tetanus, Measles, Polio, Rubella, Hepatitis B (HBV), Influenza
  • Physically able to perform the required tasks of a paramedic
  • IV Endorsement
  • Successful completion of the ACP Independent Study course*

However under the new rules (which aren't in effect yet...)
Liberal Studies:

  • 3 credits of first year Mathematics (for example, TRU-OL: Math 150)
  • 3 credits of first year English (for example, TRU-OL: English 106 )
  • 3 credits of Critical Reading and Writing (for example, TRU-OL: English 110 Critical Reading and Writing)
  • 6 credits of first year introductory Psychology (for example, TRU-OL: PSYCH 101/102 Intro to PSYC I and II )
  • 3 credit course in research (for example, TRU-OL: Research PSYC 220 Statistics in Social Science)
Medical Sciences:
  • 6 credits of Human Anatomy & Physiology (for example, TRU-OL: HLSC 159/169)
  • 3 credits of Pathophysiology (for example, TRU-OL: CEHS 202)
  • 3 credits of Pharmacology (for example, TRU-OL: CEHS 204)
Recommended Courses:

  • Medical Terminology (for example, TRU-OL: CEHS 198: 2 credits)
EMS Courses:

  • Emergency Medical Responder JIBC – EMR 100

I know this is making a lot of people mad in BC because some of the old timers who actually had to do the 2 years or 1,000 p/t contacts are upset that they had to wait this whole time, where as someone off the street can walk in take those Liberal, and Medical Sciences courses and start the ACP program.
 
KEVD18 said:
every state i know of required you to be a basic to sit for the medic exam.

now, that doesnt mean you have to be a basic with even one day of experience on a truck, just that you have to have the ticket. the ink doesnt even have to be dry.

there was a woman in my medic class that had been a basic a while back but had lapsed, not long maybe three years.

they let her into the program without a basic ticket, with the caveat that she had to have a basic ticket to test. she basically did basic and medic concurrently and by the time the class ended, she had her bls ticket and then of course her medic ticket.
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The program I'm in has the option to do both intermediate and medic at the same time (most GA services won't hire basics, so it's rare to find a basic program). The program started in May and the fast track students will test for intermediate in December, then everyone will test for medic next May. So, yes, they will have their intermediate card before testing for medic, but they will have everything done within one year.

My suggestion is the same as r/r911...take your A&P, psych, English and all the other core classes first. LEARN the A&P, you will appreciate it when you get to pharmacology and cardiology. Then when you get to medic, you can concentrate on that and not have to worry about the other stuff. Find a good program, not a quickie sort of program. Make sure that the clinical aspect of the program is intense as you will appreciate that when you go to work. There's a HUGE difference between a real patient and a mannikin. Study, study, study. It will be hell while you're going through it, but if it's the right career for you, you will also love it (strange to think of it that way LOL). And don't let anyone else try to make your life choices for you. Only you can do that. ;)
 
1000 hours of calls (not simply on-shift time) is the minimum here - if you have less, you are not even allowed to apply to paramedic school.
 
jochi1543 said:
1000 hours of calls (not simply on-shift time) is the minimum here - if you have less, you are not even allowed to apply to paramedic school.
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wow, 1000 hours of actual call time could take a decade here on one of our rigs.
 
marineman said:
wow, 1000 hours of actual call time could take a decade here on one of our rigs.
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LOL, yeah, my station is in the middle of nowhere and averages only about 200 calls a year. I don't think I'll be staying there after I get my EMT-A, though.
 
marineman said:
wow, 1000 hours of actual call time could take a decade here on one of our rigs.
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That is why there is little way to compare clinical hours within the U.S. system.

The majority of the healthcare professions require no less than 1000+ hours of patient contact with many of the minimums starting at 2000 hours.

U.S. EMS has too many places that offer coffee clincials or ALS engine ride time with minimum patient contact and no transport time.
 
And that is exactly why those of us that have performed thousands of hours of clinicals get amused of those exclaiming their experience and knowledge level.

Personally, the minimum level of clinical (real patient exposure) should be at least two years in length in addition to the didactic classroom setting for the Paramedic level.

The Basic EMT should be at the bare minimum of three months. This would at least reduce the numbers of those individuals that proclaim : "I want to be an EMT only to be a firefighter" mentality.

R/r 911
 
Ridryder911 said:
And that is exactly why those of us that have performed thousands of hours of clinicals get amused of those exclaiming their experience and knowledge level.

Personally, the minimum level of clinical (real patient exposure) should be at least two years in length in addition to the didactic classroom setting for the Paramedic level.

The Basic EMT should be at the bare minimum of three months. This would at least reduce the numbers of those individuals that proclaim : "I want to be an EMT only to be a firefighter" mentality.

R/r 911
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I wish I had to do more clinical work than just 10 hours. I am going to go again just to get more work in even though it isn't required. Just because you are a basic doesn't mean you working on a ALS truck, at least in my area. The basic's drive ambulance and the paramedics work the patients. But you are still expected to help the paramedic with whatever he needs. Also if there is more than one patient you are expected to know what to do.

I think that EMT-Basic should at least have 100 hours clinical work.
 
rhan101277 said:
I think that EMT-Basic should at least have 100 hours clinical work.
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Albeit it be better than the 10 you are required, you do realize that is only about 9 shifts?

The Basic EMT course I teaching requires 48 ER and 48 EMS.

R/r911
 
16 hours clinical, 16 ride-along in my program.

And then many, many hours of everything in Medic school.
 
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