How can we help reduce DUI's ?

I am scared if we cure all the alcoholics and drug abusers then there would be no EMTs/Paramedics left....I mean how else would we get through our shifts without those helpers?
 
akflightmedic said:
I am scared if we cure all the alcoholics and drug abusers then there would be no EMTs/Paramedics left....I mean how else would we get through our shifts without those helpers?
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I may be out a job too :( lol.
 
I know I'm extremely sensitive about this subject because of how it's affected our family. Please tell me you guys are kidding. Your profession is to help people and and I know that's why you got into this. There will always be plenty of people to help.

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Your sarcasm meter is broken
 
Not speaking for Ak because that ain't cool. I was joking. I think you should see a broader scope, I made it clear that I was kidding. Life tip: Ease up a bit, you'll drive yourself crazy otherwise
 
Being so emotionally invested into something is a double edged sword; while that passion may give you additional drive, sometimes it can blind you in other areas that are relevant but do not fit with your individual experience.

If you are serious about informing people and effecting change, maybe find a group that has an established reputation and work towards formalizing some pub ed materials. You could join/form a non-profit which has a solid online/social media presence as well as booths etc at events.

Going off about a single method on a random internet forum and having such a contentious approach to the audience you say you are trying to influence is sure to get you nowhere fast.


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I don't wish to argue, but your post seemed a little contentious as well - maybe you didn't mean it that way. You may not have a friend or relative dying by alcohol, I don't know. I will admit to being emotionally invested. You might be as well if a loved one of yours had come close to death from alcohol.

As to finding another group, I still think EMTs that deal with alcohol deaths (especially the innocent families) on a daily basis, is a group that should at least know of a new treatment. I'll admit I came on a bit strong - sorry - but the science and the evidence is staggering to me. I was really just asking EMTS to watch one 15 min talk and then think about it for the people they know who are suffering.

This isn't just some random new 'single' method to just try and see how it might help. It's ground breaking. I would compare it finding insulin for diabetics, so to not talk about it is a crime. Again, I am sorry for seeming contentious - didn't mean to be.
 
Why are you not getting this?

EMS doesn't (and IMHO shouldn't) offer counseling services to alcoholics. It's not our mandate.

We customarily see patients for a short period of time, primarily dealing with acute instances of injury or illness. And frankly, were undertrained to perform most of those tasks.

You'd be better off posting your crusade on a social work or public health/nursing forum.

Good luck with your mission, but in continuing to push this on an EMS forum, you're trying to cram a square peg into a round hole.
 
Stopper1 said:
I don't wish to argue, but your post seemed a little contentious as well - maybe you didn't mean it that way. You may not have a friend or relative dying by alcohol, I don't know. I will admit to being emotionally invested. You might be as well if a loved one of yours had come close to death from alcohol.

As to finding another group, I still think EMTs that deal with alcohol deaths (especially the innocent families) on a daily basis, is a group that should at least know of a new treatment. I'll admit I came on a bit strong - sorry - but the science and the evidence is staggering to me. I was really just asking EMTS to watch one 15 min talk and then think about it for the people they know who are suffering.

This isn't just some random new 'single' method to just try and see how it might help. It's ground breaking. I would compare it finding insulin for diabetics, so to not talk about it is a crime. Again, I am sorry for seeming contentious - didn't mean to be.
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I felt as though I was (maybe) being direct but trying to offer you a more appropriate avenue.

As @DEmedic alluded to, when we see these people, they usually are not in a state where they can hear anything in regards to the consequences of their life choices... Hell, if we're lucky, we may get them to accurately tell us what they've been doing the past 4-8 hours. Our role is to pick up the pieces and to deliver them to a facility in (hopefully) a slightly more improved state than we found them. The facility will render care until they are out of their acute event and then maybe/hopefully there is somebody who can show them a better way... But that somebody isn't us.
By the time they get out, we are onto our next shift and have likely seen 6-8 more patients who are suffering from an acute event that is maybe NOT a direct result of their conscious poor choices over the past 24 hours.
Frankly, getting emotionally invested in our patients does not lend well to a long career in this field. In fact, we often got into this field because the single-dose approach fits best with our personalities; if we wanted long invested relationships with our patients, we would become PAs or MDs... Those professions certainly pay more. That said, I want to see all my patients improve but realize that I have very little control over that simply due to the fact that our encounters are so short. Every now and again I will have a patient that strikes a chord and I will go out on a limb to have a mini "come to Jesus" talk with but these cases are few/far between and I usually have no way to get any feedback as to whether what I said made a difference; so I say my peace and move on.

I also wish you the best in your endeavor, but I believe you have a misunderstanding about what our job actually is.


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Last thing I have to offer:
If you want to integrate EMS into the education effort, be part of a legitimate organization and create a simple postcard which has all the necessary info to help the alcoholic navigate to a specific website.
Once that is done, talk to each provider agency and find out if they would support handing them out.
If they agree, the EMS crew would have the option to leave the info sheet with the pt belongings so that they have it when they sober up.

That is about all I would be willing to do if my agency said this is a thing they are supporting.

This will require significant work on your part and you will likely meet with significant resistance due to possible legal implications because every decision made in EMS has to pass the "will I be sued for this" test.

Maybe @akflightmedic has more info from an owner's perspective


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I'm not sure that reducing DUI's is necessarily the same thing as treating chronic alcoholism. It seems to me that a large percentage of DUI's are among folks who party too hard and don't have the best judgement, but aren't necessarily chronic alcoholics. That said, it seems logical of course that anything that has a significant impact on the overall problem of alcoholism would likely have a significant impact on DUI-related morbidity and mortality.

I never heard of using naltrexone to treat alcoholism before I read this thread. It certainly sounds interesting. Not being able to access any of the current literature on the topic though, I have to believe that if it were really an efficacious and feasible treatment, it's use would be much more common.

As others have said, as paramedics we aren't really in a position to advocate effectively for this type of treatment.
 
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At this time, I simply would be hands off. This is not what EMS is set up to do at this time...even being an advocate of this product or any therapy/treatment..whatever. I do not like the phrase "that's not my job" however there are times where it truly applies and in my opinion at this time...it is not the smart thing to even think about taking on. EMS is NOT the right audience or movement for any of this.

So much more to expand on but most of it has been already covered by other posters. In short...no.
 
You know what I am going to do next time I get a DUI patient? Treat the patient like any other patient for any acute injuries or medical illness and transport if needed. In my report, I am going to write a non-bias patient care report that only has to do with the patient's injury and illness findings or maybe a SOAP chart. I am not going to touch any legal issues or assumptions, and I am certainly not going to give drug and alcohol counseling to someone in a pending criminal case, because I am not licensed to do that. There is an entire healthcare system; we are merely the first 15 minutes of what could be hours, weeks, months, or even years of patient care for one incident. There are the specialist, drug and alcohol counselors, ect, etc. If you want to make an impact in prevention of alcohol-related injuries or even DUI specifically, then get a master of public health degree and work on an evidence-based public health campaign. If it's successful, publish it in a peer-reviewed journal and have it replicated with the same successful results multiple times.
 
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