Horrific EMS providers

thatJeffguy

Forum Lieutenant
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I'm new to the field and I'm just STUNNED at how many people are grossly incompetent.

Some providers complain about the high number of "BS" calls yet when they come to the scene of a serious call they do the ABC's (and usually not even a blood sweep or skin check for the "C"), immobilize without exposing, attempt a PMH on the patient en route to the hospital and that's it, MAYBE one set of vitals if "there is time" (i.e. if they can actually auscultate a b/p with the driver going Mach 1 on windy bumpy roads to shave those critical forty seconds off a transfer).

Other providers spend thousand of dollars on gizmos that rarely relate to patient care and balk at the suggestion that they take additional classes (such as PHTLS, or whatever).

Still others show up at their PHTLS classes and ask how short the class will be and encourage the instructors to skip slides and entire lectures so that they can leave early.

The overall attitude of a great deal of providers upon arrival seems to be; "How quickly can I go through my matrix of questions, determine that it's a 'bs' call, then treat the patient in a rude and condescending manner all the time ignoring the basics of human communication skills let alone anything that might resemble actual patient care or adherence to the protocols?" Once the patient says whatever magic words the "provider" is looking for and he deems it a "BS" call, then it's "Walk to the ambulance, sit here and don't move" while they drive to the hospital to present a near-blank trip report sheet to the nurse.

When I read trip sheets, I wonder if the provider had their adolescent child write the narrative. Basic words are misspelled, medical terminology is frequently improvised and the narrative rarely matches the actuality of on-scene care.

On actual trauma calls it seems most providers are more keen on going through the motions than understanding what's happening and thinking critically about it. For example, lots of providers around here hate the KED and refuse to use it. They slap on a C-collar, then start a series of abrupt twisting and jerking measures to get the patient into what appears to be a semi-Fowlers position, floating in the air above the LSB, with one person supporting the weight of the upper body via the c-collar and what I suppose they'd categorize as "spinal immobilization" (of the curved, non-supported spine that was just twisted as the torso moved and the legs did not). The patient is then immediately boarded, secured and moved to the ambulance. I've only seen three patients have their clothes cut off by -b's, but about a hundred times where the -b asks PERMISSION to cut clothes off and then doesn't even offer an explanation as to why it's so critical to do so.

Is this seriously the profession I'm getting into?
 

NomadicMedic

I know a guy who knows a guy.
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Is this seriously the profession I'm getting into?

Yes.

Sad, isn't it?

Be the change you want to see. Make sutre YOUR PCRs are neat and complete, with correct spelling. Don't be a jerk to your patients. Do proper assessments. Treat your patients as if they were members of your family.

Maybe it will rub off on the people you work with. Maybe it won't.

But unless YOU do something about it, it's just another random "I can't believe this..." BS post on a mesasage board.
 

reaper

Working Bum
2,817
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Do as you wish others to do.

Unless there is a reason to, do not expose pt's on the scene with on lookers. Give the pt some respect. No reason that it cannot be done in truck.
 
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thatJeffguy

Forum Lieutenant
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In my opinion "checking for life threats" is a valid reason for exposure. Immodesty doesn't kill. Obviously I'm not going to strip everyone bare infront of a hundred onlookers, but if someone is a trauma patient I'd prefer them to be at least in their underwear before they get immobilized or loaded.
 

emtstudent04

Forum Lieutenant
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I'm sorry but i would not bare a patient infront of hundreds of on looker's. I would have more respect for the patient then that.
 
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thatJeffguy

Forum Lieutenant
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I'm sorry but i would not bare a patient infront of hundreds of on looker's. I would have more respect for the patient then that.


Your patient has a sucking chest wound and two bullet perforations through the vena cava. The corpse is loaded into your ambulance in a respectful manner.
 

NomadicMedic

I know a guy who knows a guy.
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I think you're a little overly focused on the trauma side of things. Very rarely will you ever say, "OMG! This guy has a sucking chest wound, I better whip out my trauma shears and strip 'em and flip 'em!" More often than not, you'll be called for a medical emergency that will require compassion and a good eye for assessment.

What you should focus on are the more important aspects of patient care that you mentioned are missing in your post. Take good vital signs. Write clear, concise, correct documentation. Strive for excellent patient care, even if it's just a call your partner thinks is "BS".

As a new EMT you should worry more about treating your patients well and less about cutting off clothes.
 
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thatJeffguy

Forum Lieutenant
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I think you're a little overly focused on the trauma side of things. Very rarely will you ever say, "OMG! This guy has a sucking chest wound, I better whip out my trauma shears and strip 'em and flip 'em!" More often than not, you'll be called for a medical emergency that will require compassion and a good eye for assessment.

What you should focus on are the more important aspects of patient care that you mentioned are missing in your post. Take good vital signs. Write clear, concise, correct documentation. Strive for excellent patient care, even if it's just a call your partner thinks is "BS".

As a new EMT you should worry more about treating your patients well and less about cutting off clothes.

Obviously I'm not focusing my frustration on that one thing.

I always do a complete set of vitals on scene, and on the way. Another thing that people think is insane, of course.
 

lightsandsirens5

Forum Deputy Chief
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Is this seriously the profession I'm getting into?

It is. However, it is not, overall a profession yet. When most of the people in this field act prefessional, then it will be a profession. How many lawyers do you see driving around their lifted trucks with "Be nice to me, I may save your a** in court someday" or "Doctors can give you drugs but I can leagally gouge you" all over the rig. With people like that in the field, it will never become a profession.
 

Seaglass

Lesser Ambulance Ape
973
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In most cases, the rapport I'd lose by insisting on exposing the patient in front of bystanders will cost me more than the few moments it'll take me to transfer them to the truck.

Obviously, every case is different, and that's not a hard and fast rule. Besides, you can always have bystanders hold up a sheet or something. Keeps them busy and out of your hair and gives the patient privacy.
 
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thatJeffguy

Forum Lieutenant
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Thread drift detected :) seriously though, I wouldn't expose an alert and oriented patient bare naked in front of a gaping crowd, unless I saw massive bleeding or frothing blood. A sheet, some police officers, instant privacy.

One more thing I don't understand...

A guy with four minitor Vs, complete three sixty coverage lights on every vehicle, a radio and a scanner, but hasn't taken one class or seminar since he barely passed his basic exam.
 

usafmedic45

Forum Deputy Chief
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Still others show up at their PHTLS classes and ask how short the class will be and encourage the instructors to skip slides and entire lectures so that they can leave early.

My response is always "Really short. There's the door. If you don't want to learn, leave now." Usually it garners a lot of snickering, laughing and general embarrassment for the person who asked it. I kind of enjoy watching them try to slink out.
 
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LucidResq

Forum Deputy Chief
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My favorite was the medic who, 20 minutes since she first started talking to the syncope/fall down/hit face real bad patient, as the poor young girl was bleeding profusely, scared, crying, and backboarded, decided to ask....

"History?"

"Wh.. wh.. what?.." the patient asked, confused.

"UGH. Do you have any medical history. Like... diabetes or whatever..." the medic gasped, exasperated beyond belief as if this were the most irritating, dumb person on Earth.

I could've killed her.

Remember these feelings. We all have bad days... but we still need to always treat people with the respect they deserve. Don't tolerate anything less in your presence. I wish I would've stood up in this situation.
 

NomadicMedic

I know a guy who knows a guy.
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Yes, we all agree that there are a lot of crummy EMS providers out there. There are also a lot of very good ones. And from your original post, it sounds like you're on the good side.

But Jeff, I think you're missing the point I've been driving at...

What I'm saying is, YOU need to start making changes in the patient care. Make sure the assessment YOU DO is a good one. Make sure the paperwork YOU WRITE is complete and everything is spelled correctly. If YOU'VE got a PT with a fracture, YOU can expose the leg and splint appropriately. When YOU respond to an MVA, YOU can make the decision to use a KED if it's warranted.

Get it?

It's up to YOU!

Get it?

As long as you're performing good, solid EMT-B skills, maybe it'll rub off on the co-workers that you feel are providing sub standard care.

But, at the risk of saying something that may earn me another vacation from the forum, let me just say... you're pretty new and you don't know what you don't know. From the tone of your original post, you're critiquing other's work, doing a LOT of watching, and not a lot of your own hands on care.

If I'm wrong in that assumption, I apologize.

But if I'm not, you need to get in there. Get your hands on some patients. Do good assessments. Provide good patient care. Keep doing what you feel is right. As long as YOU act in the patient's best interest, you won't go wrong.

And Jeff, I admire your dedication to the profession. But, come back and read this thread in a year or two. After some real experience, I have the feeling you'll look at your post a little differently.
 

usafmedic45

Forum Deputy Chief
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My favorite was the medic who, 20 minutes since she first started talking to the syncope/fall down/hit face real bad patient, as the poor young girl was bleeding profusely, scared, crying, and backboarded, decided to ask....

"History?"

"Wh.. wh.. what?.." the patient asked, confused.

"UGH. Do you have any medical history. Like... diabetes or whatever..." the medic gasped, exasperated beyond belief as if this were the most irritating, dumb person on Earth.

I could've killed her.

I would have fired her or, without hesitation, suspended her without pay for a few days. People like that deserve to be made examples.
 

MonkeySquasher

Forum Lieutenant
160
1
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"Be the change you want to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi

Jeff, I'm currently in the same position you are.

I have a volly company who's EMS is run by someone who doesn't know what he's doing, leading EMTs who ALSO don't know what they're doing, with no rules, standards, or even basic training on things like radios or PCRs or even stretcher lifting/operation.

Then, I have my work environment filled with management who (admittedly) actively look for reasons to fire people, and employees who believe that every call is BS, and their job is just to drive a person from A to B doing as little as possible.

I've complained about it for the last three years. Recently, I've just taken it upon myself to show people how they SHOULD be, and teach them what they SHOULD know on my own. Along with completely rewritting, on my own, my volly company's SOGs, which has since turned into bringing my entire fire company up to code for OSHA, DOH, DOT, and NFPA. I highly doubt I'll even get a pat on the back when it's all said and done.

Change has to start somewhere man, and no one says it comes fast or easy.
 

mycrofft

Still crazy but elsewhere
11,322
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Be sure you are on solid ground before you throw rocks.

I quite agree with you, but as a new person you will actually miss some of the most egregious care lapses due to lack of experience, tend to try to treat protocols as Holy Writ beyond common sense, and focus all attention and judgement on negatives while missing the greater positives.

And that is OK, it's part of the curve and hopefully it will impress or remind your cohorts if you avoid, as I failed, to become a sideways stick in their, er, nether regions.

Hang tough, follow the golden rule, and in time, cut to the chase.;)
 
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MrBrown

Forum Deputy Chief
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Dare I say piss poor education and a workforce that is educated ad nauseam about "emergencies" and "trauma" and barely spoken to about actual medicine is to blame?
 

Eydawn

Forum Crew Member
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Gee, that setup sounds familiar. Ignorant providers, full of their own ego, who treat attempts to behave professionally as an affront. My PCRs were excellent. My attempts to provide care were met with micromanagement at every turn. My attempts to learn to navigate the city I was working in were thwarted because I should "already know" by then (after a mere 120 hours of street time in a city I was not overly familiar with).

Lucid- I had a few situations where I wish I hadn't kept my mouth shut. I think we all experience that... live and learn and use it the next time...

I tried to be the change I wanted to see. I tried to actually think about the medicine I was charged with performing. I was beaten down and it sucked. But if you can stick it out, it may be worth it! Keep truckin' and do your best- that's all that anyone can ask of you.

I agree with the cops/FF + sheet = Privacy! statement. Insta-barrier to thwart onlookers and the media!

Wendy
CO EMT-B
 
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