Holy Mother of god... found the perfect jump kit for the whackers

[TransportJockey]

He'll probably try to put it through the nose knowing him. I mean he wouldn't know better, no medical knowledge. ^_^

If it got in the trachea it would work just fine. Nasotracheal intubation is a common field procedure for medics in a lot of places.

 

[fast65]

He'll probably try to put it through the nose knowing him. I mean he wouldn't know better, no medical knowledge. ^_^

Can you say "dental trauma"?

 

[Cameron]

If it got in the trachea it would work just fine. Nasotracheal intubation is a common field procedure for medics in a lot of places.

Most people I know in the civilian field go through the mouth, I know most military uses the nostrols... So I guess its up in the air with this guy, He is using a Blackwater kit, he may think he is military too! :wacko:

 

[MassEMT-B]

What the hell? This guy is nuts. I wonder what made him think having any of this would be useful without training. If I was crazy enough to start a zombie apocalypse kit I wouldn't get ALS stuff I don't know how to use h34r:

 

[fast65]

Most people I know in the civilian field go through the mouth, I know most military uses the nostrols... So I guess its up in the air with this guy, He is using a Blackwater kit, he may think he is military too! :wacko:

Well as far as I know nasal intubation isn't real common, but it is a skill that paramedics are taught. When you say the military uses the nostrils, are you thinking of an NPA? I'm pretty sure the only medics that actually intubate in the military are special forces, but I'm not sure.

 

[Motojunkie]

His certifications:

Back to the original point of your thread, I currently have Red Cross certifications in Standard First Aid, CPR/AED for the Professional Rescuer, and WFASRM (Wilderness First Aid, Safety and Risk Management). I had originally planned to attend the 180-hour Wilderness EMT program offered through the Wilderness Medical Institute/NOLS last fall, but had to postpone due to having to be out of the country on business. I hope to find an opportunity to get out for this before the end of the year.

Beyond having access to a neighborhood full of physicians during evenings and weekends, my wife was originally in an RN program before changing her major, and several of her aunts, uncles, and cousins are physicians, surgeons, one dentist, and two OB/GYN's.

 

[Cameron]

Well as far as I know nasal intubation isn't real common, but it is a skill that paramedics are taught. When you say the military uses the nostrils, are you thinking of an NPA? I'm pretty sure the only medics that actually intubate in the military are special forces, but I'm not sure.

Hmmm, whats the difference of NPA and intubation? NPA = Nasal Passage Airway, Right? Has the same purpose?

 

[fast65]

Hmmm, whats the difference of NPA and intubation? NPA = Nasal Passage Airway, Right? Has the same purpose?

No, an NPA is a nasopharyngeal airway, it's just a rubber tube that guys up the nose and the distal tip sits in the pharynx; it's an airway adjunct. Intubation uses an endotracheal tube that actual goes down the trachea; it's a definitive airway.

NPA

ETT

 

[TransportJockey]

Hmmm, whats the difference of NPA and intubation? NPA = Nasal Passage Airway, Right? Has the same purpose?

NPA= Nasal Pharyngeal Airway. It only helps open the airway, doesn't secure it like an ET tube. Nasal intubation actually threads a tube down the trachea and it's secured at the vocal cords with an inflated balloon.

Those are NPAs

That is an endotracheal tube.

And the military doesn't tend to intubate in the field anymore, they've gone to the King Airway a lot.

 

[Cameron]

No, an NPA is a nasopharyngeal airway, it's just a rubber tube that guys up the nose and the distal tip sits in the pharynx; it's an airway adjunct. Intubation uses an endotracheal tube that actual goes down the trachea; it's a definitive airway.

NPA

ETT

Thanks for the clarification... the old saying is true, "You learn something new every day!"

 

[TransportJockey]

Well as far as I know nasal intubation isn't real common, but it is a skill that paramedics are taught. When you say the military uses the nostrils, are you thinking of an NPA? I'm pretty sure the only medics that actually intubate in the military are special forces, but I'm not sure.

Sorry I meant commonly trained in.

 

[Cameron]

NPA= Nasal Pharyngeal Airway. It only helps open the airway, doesn't secure it like an ET tube. Nasal intubation actually threads a tube down the trachea and it's secured at the vocal cords with an inflated balloon.

How do you know when you have enough air in the ballon?

 

[fast65]

How do you know when you have enough air in the ballon?

Well it's not like a Combitube where it tells you specifically how much air too inject, but I've been taught to just inject about 10-15 mL of air into the balloon.

 

[TransportJockey]

How do you know when you have enough air in the ballon?

You don't hear an air leak in the epigastric region. They commonly hold 10cc or so.

 

[Cameron]

Well it's not like a Combitube where it tells you specifically how much air too inject, but I've been taught to just inject about 10-15 mL of air into the balloon.

You don't hear an air leak in the epigastric region. They commonly hold 10cc or so.

So 10-15 is the amount to shoot for?

 

[fast65]

So 10-15 is the amount to shoot for?

10 mL is what I use. Are you a basic student?

 

[TransportJockey]

So 10-15 is the amount to shoot for?

10 is what I start with as well.

 

[Veneficus]

Sorry I meant commonly trained in.

When devising a trauma care program for field medics, one of the draft revisions from years ago that I saw was that the NPA was preferred as it was easy to place, required minimal maintenence, and in field conditions intubation placement or maintenence was not practical.

As a disclaimer I was never a military medic, nor was I ever in combat, but just looking at the logistics of it:

You are in a gunfight, the scene is definately not safe and therefore not exactly conducive to all kinds of invasive procedures.

You have to get to the casualty, there may be multiple.
You then you have to get him/you out of direct fire. (perhaps by yourself as "the best first aid is superior fire power" as I once heard from a SF medic.)

So if you use a King or ET tube, how are you going to bag this person/people?

It doesn't seem very wise to start pulling the fighting folk off the line to tend to wounded. At least not if you want to survive the day.

Triage for many years has advocated that positioning an airway, which is really what an NPA is designed for, is one of the most basic and useful interventions.

I am sure many of us can attest that even in the civillian world, ET tubes are a risk everytime a patient is moved. From direct fire, to a fall back position, to the evac, to the first doctor, to perhaps another area, seems like a lot of moves for tubes.

Perhpas some of the members here with actual experience would expand upon this a little?

 

[fast65]

When devising a trauma care program for field medics, one of the draft revisions from years ago that I saw was that the NPA was preferred as it was easy to place, required minimal maintenence, and in field conditions intubation placement or maintenence was not practical.

As a disclaimer I was never a military medic, nor was I ever in combat, but just looking at the logistics of it:

You are in a gunfight, the scene is definately not safe and therefore not exactly conducive to all kinds of invasive procedures.

You have to get to the casualty, there may be multiple.
You then you have to get him/you out of direct fire. (perhaps by yourself as "the best first aid is superior fire power" as I once heard from a SF medic.)

So if you use a King or ET tube, how are you going to bag this person/people?

It doesn't seem very wise to start pulling the fighting folk off the line to tend to wounded. At least not if you want to survive the day.

Triage for many years has advocated that positioning an airway, which is really what an NPA is designed for, is one of the most basic and useful interventions.

I am sure many of us can attest that even in the civillian world, ET tubes are a risk everytime a patient is moved. From direct fire, to a fall back position, to the evac, to the first doctor, to perhaps another area, seems like a lot of moves for tubes.

Perhpas some of the members here with actual experience would expand upon this a little?

All very good points, the only time I was actually thinking an SF medic would intubate would be a medevac where they're not taking fire, however, I didn't think of all the moving they've got to do, that is a HUGE risk of tube displacement.

 

[Meursault]

Hey, there's no reason to criticize this guy. If there ever is a major disaster in his area, he's provided a great cache of medical supplies for any trained persons willing to step over his dead body and take it.