Call me an Idiot...

[fm_emt]

EMS Rule #17: Until proven otherwise, all doctors on emergency scenes are gynecologists.

EMS Rule #18: The exception to rule #17 is if the patient is in labor, in which case the doctor will invariably be a dermatologist.

Or psychologists, which can sometimes be useful. Unlike the "holistic medicine" types that seem to spring out of the woodworks around here sometimes.

"Ma'am, please stop rubbing tea leaves on the patient. Mmkay? Thanks."

 

[chrissyk]

I would have rolled him with cspine precautions and checked for breathing, etc. The nurse was an idiot and/or didn't have any emergency experience. It does worry me you wanted to laugh in that situation. Nothing really funny about someone seriously injured and an idiot nurse.

I wasn't laughing to be cruel here---I was laughing because the nurse was so intoxicated--she couldn't find a pulse and I hadn't even got 2 sips down on my first drink--and she was telling me how stupid I was!!! I really am not an insensitive person at all-there are a few exceptions: one of them being IDIOTS, STUPID PEOPLE!!

Thanks to everyone for all the comments! I appreciate it! Thanks for the advice it is really needed and appreciated! I love the EMS field, I actually feel part of a extended family!!

 

[Tincanfireman]

We responded to a FDGB call the other day in the terminal of the airport. UOA, the patient was being attended to by another passenger who immediately stepped back when we approached, told us the patient was doing fine and had just rolled her ankle and bumped her head while deplaning. He stayed close but never got in the way while we treated her and never tried to intervene. After EMS transported her and we were packing up, he approached and complimented us on our care for the person, then produced his identification as the Medical Control Physician for a major fire/EMS department, not to mention the fact he was the chief of staff for trauma surgery (probably bamboozled the title a little, but you get the idea) for a Level I trauma center in the Southeastern US. First time in over 25 years I had an honest to God ER doc in attendance, and he was a peach of a guy. Just wanted to let y'all know it does happen...

(FDGB= Fall Down, Go Boom)

 

[Ridryder911]

I have found those with true credentials and education, are more than happy to allow you to perform your job, and the reason we do not see very many "real ones" are they prefer not to stop (like me!). It is usually those that do not know what to do, or assume because they have a license or certification they immediately want to stop and rescue someone.

I too have had only occasional similar incidences of where I was on the scene of a real bad trauma patient and a physician and a resident had stopped to assist. Turns out one of the physicians was a well known trauma surgeon and author. Ironically, the resident was in trauma residency from another state, and was shocked it was this "famous surgeon"..that he had studying his books!

Both of them did a excellent job, and complimented the crews afterwards, again those that do know, also know when it is appropriate to intervene and when not to.

R/r 911

 

[oldschoolmedic]

Had a cardiac arrest once upon a time (right after a church supper, in front of the whole congregation) with a doctor on scene who was more than willing to call the shots and rode with me to the ED. Thought it was okay until he starts asking me questions like, "What do you want to do next?" and "How much of this do you think he needs?" I would tell him, and he would tell me go ahead and do it, whatever it was. Luckily I had the presence of mind to keep the things I was doing right in line with our protocols because when I gave the patient report to the ED doc and introduced "Dr. So-and-so" they began exchanging professional pleasantries right up until I heard the words "...a WHAT?!? PODIATRIST.... WHAT THE HOLY HE..." The ED doc couldn't speak in complete sentences for about five minutes he was so angry. It was at this point my education truly began as to what different doctors do . From that point on, unless I recognize the physician, I say "Hey we appreciate your help, but we've got it from here, thanks." More often than not they are glad to turn over the patient.

 

[jalbanese]

Everyone in here summed it up pretty nicely. As my one EMT instructor once told me "Airway is most important, because if you bring in a perfectly packaged corpse it may be impressive till everyone realizes the patient is blue"

A spinal injury is definitley important to take care of. But if you aren't breathing or aspirating blood - thats worse.

Doctors make nurses feel inferiour, nurses make techs feel inferior, techs make first responders inferior, first responders make the lay person feel inferior. Its just how the medical field works. She wanted to be on a pedistool because she works around that stuff even though she prolly has no idea what to do. Its an importance complex. Dont be too hard on urself bud you did the right thing.

Always remember your ABC's...Airway Breathing Circulation, as well as Always Be Cool

 

[Trailpatrol]

I would have stayed inside and kept drinking...................

Yeah, but you're from Texas.

I'm big enough and old (and grey) enough that most other healthcare providers don't give me many problems on-scene. Any who do always get the same litany: "MOI is _____, Airway is patent, Pt. is breathing, Pulse is ___, Spine is stablized....NOW, what would you like me to do?" Usually, at that point either EMS has arrived or they just give me a dumb look and humm and haw until EMS does get there.

A long, long time ago, (1979) when I was a medic, I lost a patient where I was second on scene after some Public Health RNs, who put a pillow under the head of a cervical spine patient. I never forgot that.

 

[Canadian_EMT]

It is all what your comfort level is. Doctors and nurses are used to a contolled enviorment such as a hospital, where as we are used to the sometimes chaos of a bar scene. I have seen off duty doctors come up to a scene and just back up like everyone else and let us do our job!

 

[LIFEGUARDAVIDAS]

Recurrent situations on every beach in the world:

1) 85% of the times...
_"It's OK, I'm a DOCTOR, let me take care of it." :glare:

2) 10% of the time, a doctor a bit more humble will show up...
_"I'm a DOCTOR! Let me help you!"
My response in those cases:
_"Sure! Tell those bystanders to back off for me, thanks!" B)

3) 5% of the times, a doctor who actually would be useful (ER/Trauma specialist) shows up and without pretending to take control of the situation will offer his/her assistance...
_"?????????" (Missing an example. Sorry it has never happened to me but I want to believe that that actually happens, sometimes, looking forward to it) ^_^

 

[old hand]

Turned out he was a dermatologist.

....

You should have told him if acne breaks out you would give him a call.

 

[firetender]

I would have rolled him with cspine precautions and checked for breathing, etc. The nurse was an idiot and/or didn't have any emergency experience. It does worry me you wanted to laugh in that situation. Nothing really funny about someone seriously injured and an idiot nurse.

Sorry, Guardian, we're in the midst of such incredible absurdity from so many angles, to not laugh is to not be alive. Taking life too seriously, even amongst us who are dedicated to saving lives, actually limits our effectiveness because those without a sense of humor live in a world of judgment. Living there prevents you from seeing what is really in front of you. When you live there, your relationship is with yourself and yourself only.

This is a relationship business. I'd say it's a connection business, except I think you'd freak!

I'd enjoy seeing you lighten up!

...and I also want to say, regardless of what you bring to this table, you're being yourself and honest and presenting a viewpoint that is very real and far too often not spoken. I see it as extremely valuable. That's what we're supposed to be doing...

But I'd add one extremely important point to that, we are here to affect each other and to be affected by each other so that the people we serve can benefit.

 

[smacphee]

Something similar happened to me. My friend was driving me and we saw a motorcyclist on the ground, motorcycle totalled. I jump out, there are plenty of people around but they are on the sidewalk. There was a woman there wo claimed to work at a hospital and one other guy squating down next to the patient. I came out, offered my help but nobody responded. Nobody was holding c-spine and the woman was taking a pulse rate off of the corotid. She was freaking out big time, yelling at everybody. So I just held proper c-spine with the helmet still on. The guy was in pain, moaning, and had some memory problems, didn't know what he said 30 seconds earlier and didn't know what happened. When Fire/PD showed up, everybody else split, including the 2 other people next to me. Fire took over and I got to shake hands with the battalion chief and give him my name.
I felt like slapping that lady because she wasn't doing anything correctly.

 

[Mercy4Angels]

i would have told her i was an EMT, I know what im doing and if she was comfortable with the fact or me leaving this mans life in her hands then legally i can do that cause she is higher medical authority. now where the heck is my beer ?

 

[emtingham]

what could i have don different

I asked the same question as a new emt. However; my pt died due to head injury on scene. Age 15. But I kept calm and kept trying (her mom was on the scene of the accident). The medics told me that by trying, kept mom calmer. I feel you have done well. I have learned that nurses on scene don't play well with EMS.

 

[mfrjason]

Stevo is right Chrissy, if you are calm while treating someone than the patient will be calm but if you are all excited,which seemed like the nurse was,you can mistakes alot faster,and in the EMS world mistakes are unacceptable. Dont worry about that nurse. GOOD JOB!

 

[gnh2276]

I would say kudos to you scene safety and your safety are #1 after that you are 100% right airway FIRST and I had to laugh where you said " she said she was a nurse and bla bla bla" that was something my instructor harped on if a nurse comes on scene tell them you are all set same with doctors some will say they are a doctor and kid you not you will find out they are a proctologist. Again kudos to you you did good.

 

[gnh2276]

Stevo is right Chrissy, if you are calm while treating someone than the patient will be calm but if you are all excited,which seemed like the nurse was,you can mistakes alot faster,and in the EMS world mistakes are unacceptable. Dont worry about that nurse. GOOD JOB!

Having been a combat life saver we train and train and train some more and when we are tired of that we train as we fight so that when in combat (which I have had the unfortunate opportunity of doing) its a clear head and you NEVER second guess yourself case in point your instructor is doing a great job and is a great teacher if you are able to stay calm in a stressful situation.