BLS Recruiting

himynameismj said:
Does any body here have any experiences with recruiting tactics that worked successfully in regards to finding motivated candidates, particularly in a volunteer BLS organization?
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Drop that V word, insist on high quality applicants who are motivated, pay them like they deserve, have an educational bonus, so they can move up to Paramedic.

First off, that first grade council video made me sick to my stomach. They are a HUGE reason why we in NJ are still being held back in the dark ages.

We are far removed from the days when it was OK for your neighbor to pick you up, slap a NRB at 15 on you, throw you in the back of the Caddybulance, and go screaming to the hospital.

All other professions have advanced.....why not us?

Like Flight-LP said, NOT ONE SINGLE un-certified person has any buisness touching a pt, unless they are an EMT student on a clinical, supervised by an EMT or higher.
 
:rolleyes:
wxduff said:
Flight, I think your missing a few points...

#1. There are no helpers helpers or helper helpers in training.
If you need a helper, you need help.
#2. There is a maximum of 2 helpers/HIT's per shift.
:rolleyes:
#3. What does the average ambulance ride cost? $500? That's more then I have in my bank account right now:rolleyes:... I'll take a free ride by fully trained and experienced EMT Basic then an expensive ride by trained paramedics any day, as long as I don't need ALS.
Why? Because its not our hobby! We need to put food on the table, clothes on our backs, and gas in the tank. Do you see a volunteer hospital? Do you not get a bill from the ED?
#4. Helpers have a place in the ambulance... My fellow Helper and I have helped my EMT a ton so far. He's grateful that were there, and tells us that after every call we've made a smooth operation. And I'm sure our patients were happy that everything went quick and easy. Plus once were through Basic, think of the experience we'll already have. Won't that make us better EMT's?
It is called higher education requirements. A 120 hr course is a joke. 200 hrs of education/lecture, 100 hrs of education/lab, and 150 hrs of clinical time for EMT would be a START.

So flight, if I need a paramedic, I'll get one, but if I don't need one, that's money I'm not spending. And if I'm a patient, and I want to be taken care of fast and efficient, I'm not going to mind that the EMT has 2 assistants to delegate too.
A joke. I hope.
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Seriously, is this helper in training thing even legal? What do you do when you find out oops...my helper (being an untrained, unlicensed wannabe) doesn't know how to take a proper set of vitals and this supposedly stable pt. really has a BP of 300/200 and a pulse of 160. Guess who's on the hook for that screw up?

the EMT is responsible for the assessment, treatment, and even proper movement of the patient - that doesn't mean delegating to untrained cronies. When I call 911 I expect to be assessed by a qualified medical professional, not some half-trained monkey.

What if you don't have a helper show up - do you just pull joe-blow off the street to help? If you're that hard up maybe you need two EMT's in the back in addition to a driver....

Unless the "helpers" are doing official clinical hours they have no business in an ambulance. If this is clinical time, it's very strange to have two students at once.

I knew there was a reason I always felt like these campus organizations were kind of hokey....

EDITED TO ADD:

To OP. Second on the pay your volunteers. You can still have an on-call service even, just pay per call. I know a lot of places can't pay to keep people on a salary, but surely you can spare 20 or 30 bucks per EMT per call.
 
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I really wish I knew what the problem is.

"my helper (being an untrained, unlicensed wannabe)"
- I thought I made it clear that these people are trained in what they are asked to do. You don't take vitals on a patient until you can prove to you attendant that you have the ability to do so accurately. They also must go to drill which is additional training.

And you keep forgetting that were a BLS rig. We don't get calls to those sort of things, and if we arrive on scene to find someone pushing a heart rate like that, the EMT will be calling for ALS right away...

The college rigs aren't a joke. I feel insulted. We do a great volunteer service to our campus communities. And we were the first in the nation to do this too. Don't you think we have a system that works down by now?

I'll get back to this later, I have to go to EMT class.
 
wxduff said:
I really wish I knew what the problem is.

"my helper (being an untrained, unlicensed wannabe)"
- I thought I made it clear that these people are trained in what they are asked to do. You don't take vitals on a patient until you can prove to you attendant that you have the ability to do so accurately. They also must go to drill which is additional training.

They are not state licensed or certified. I betcha they aren't legally considered trained. Plus it sounds like they're doing a lot more than just taking vitals...that just an example.

And you keep forgetting that were a BLS rig. We don't get calls to those sort of things, and if we arrive on scene to find someone pushing a heart rate like that, the EMT will be calling for ALS right away...

In other words...you DO get calls for that. If you respond initially and than call ALS - you were responsible for the pt. for a period of time. Plus in my silly little scenario the helper screwed up and you didn't know to call ALS.


The college rigs aren't a joke. I feel insulted. We do a great volunteer service to our campus communities. And we were the first in the nation to do this too. Don't you think we have a system that works down by now?

I'll get back to this later, I have to go to EMT class.
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It sounds like you'd have more to be proud of if you had been first to abandon your system. I'm sure your system works for you as students who want to play EMT, but the issue is if it works for your patients. Sorry, but EMT is a very very minimum standard as it is, no one under EMT should be responsible for any aspect of patient care.
 
wxduff said:
The college rigs aren't a joke. I feel insulted. We do a great volunteer service to our campus communities. And we were the first in the nation to do this too. Don't you think we have a system that works down by now?
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Nope. Look at Jersey. One of the oldest EMS systems in America. They have messed it up from the start, and continue to do so.

Old does not mean good.
 
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wxduff said:
And you keep forgetting that were a BLS rig. We don't get calls to those sort of things, and if we arrive on scene to find someone pushing a heart rate like that, the EMT will be calling for ALS right away...
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Yep... and I was never, ever called to transport a critical patient when I was working on a BLS interfacility transport unit. :rolleyes:
 
jrm818 said:
It sounds like you'd have more to be proud of if you had been first to abandon your system. I'm sure your system works for you as students who want to play EMT, but the issue is if it works for your patients. Sorry, but EMT is a very very minimum standard as it is, no one under EMT should be responsible for any aspect of patient care.
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jrm818 said:
Seriously, is this helper in training thing even legal? What do you do when you find out oops...my helper (being an untrained, unlicensed wannabe) doesn't know how to take a proper set of vitals and this supposedly stable pt. really has a BP of 300/200 and a pulse of 160. Guess who's on the hook for that screw up?

the EMT is responsible for the assessment, treatment, and even proper movement of the patient - that doesn't mean delegating to untrained cronies. When I call 911 I expect to be assessed by a qualified medical professional, not some half-trained monkey.

What if you don't have a helper show up - do you just pull joe-blow off the street to help? If you're that hard up maybe you need two EMT's in the back in addition to a driver....

Unless the "helpers" are doing official clinical hours they have no business in an ambulance. If this is clinical time, it's very strange to have two students at once.

I knew there was a reason I always felt like these campus organizations were kind of hokey....
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Let's correct some insults:
I'm not a half trained monkey, don't you dare insult me like that. I'm an eagle scout with tons of first aid training, I'm AHA CPR and AED Certified, I'm in EMT Class, and I've been to every drill.

If you going to call me a wannabe for wanting to be an EMT, and doing as much learning as possible now, as well as using the skills I do have to help my fellow student, then thank you. That's what I "wannabe."

I'm not playing EMT, I'm assisting my EMT in providing quick quality medical care to his/her patient, so that their medical treatment is quick and as painless as possible.

Do you think we'd pull anyone off the street. I guess you missed me explaining that we have requirements for all members. Or you're having more fun bashing then providing a real argument.

And if you get in an accident and break you're neck jrm818, make sure you tell the CFR's that you'd rather not have them give you oxygen and do c-spine, because they're not good enough for you.
 
wxduff said:
Let's correct some insults:
I'm not a half trained monkey, don't you dare insult me like that. I'm an eagle scout with tons of first aid training, I'm AHA CPR and AED Certified, I'm in EMT Class, and I've been to every drill.
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Oh puuulease.

Oh, and AHA does not certify anymore, due to liability concerns of bumblefracks not doing it right.

This thread just got interesting.... EMT student vs. EMT(s) and Paramedic(s)

I got the popcorn, whos bringin the beer?B)
 
beer....check!

what does being an eagle scout have to do with anything? i was in the scouts too(life). the bsa first aid course is a band aid course, nothing more. i know, i have taught it.

"helpers" are unlicensed trainees without official training. they have no business doing anything out side of carrying equipment, opening the trucks doors and other unlicensed tasks. maybe, maybe hand me something out of the bag etc but under no circumstances do they belong in a patient care role. their existence in that capacity wouldnt be just dandy. when they step out, it becomes a legal liability.

did you really just try to trot out aha bcls certs as if they actually mattered? well my oh my you can use an aed! so can the bagger at the supermarket.

you're fighting an uphill battle here chief. while i admire you desire to get into the business, im appalled that you work in a system that allows you treat patients before you're properly trained. come back when you've got your emt ticket and you'll do just dandy.
 
Play nice or become the focus of my complete and undivided attention!
 
You all need to step back a moment, take a deep breath, and bring that back in line with what the thread is about. This WILL NOT turn into a Student vs. EMT/Medic fight.
 
oh no, two moderators. scary......
 
I hear saber rattling....:rolleyes:
 
KEVD18 said:
beer....check!

what does being an eagle scout have to do with anything? i was in the scouts too(life). the bsa first aid course is a band aid course, nothing more. i know, i have taught it.
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Kev,

Actually... between First Aid, Emergency Preparedness, and Medicine... I learned more medical history than in EMT school. And BSA's first aid stuff isn't that different from EMT-B training. In fact... I KNOW how to use board splints... and I use them, when needed. (and I know other EMT's who don't.. because EMT school glosses by it).

However... it isn't a cert. You need an EMT cert (at least some form of recognized First Responder cert) before you start treating patients on your own.

WXDuff,
My concern with your Squad's apparent operational policies NOT WITH YOU!

I run with a volunteer squad that often rolls with 4-person BLS crews. Add an ALS responder, perhaps with a student... and police.. and we've got 7 people to treat one patient... it becomes ridiculous. If our BLS crew rolled with 5 or 6... where would I put a patient?
 
Jon said:
I run with a volunteer squad that often rolls with 4-person BLS crews. Add an ALS responder, perhaps with a student... and police.. and we've got 7 people to treat one patient... it becomes ridiculous. If our BLS crew rolled with 5 or 6... where would I put a patient?
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/cue clown music

B&BA - Barnum & Bailey Ambulance
 
It's an ambulance, not a clown car.
 
It says we need to seriously clean house, especially in New England where there is still the belief that this substandard level of care is remotely acceptable. I am so tired of hearing about tradition and that "we were the first blah blah blah". This is a prime reason why this industry has gone no where in 40 years. Lets move on, there is really no point continueing this debate as the OP's limited vision will only see how great his system is despite other professionals knowing that is a complete liability and joke to the industry.

Now to think of a subject so raw that we can get all of the CL's involved in one thread. Hmmmmmm..........................................................................................
 
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