Atropine in asystole

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broken stretcher

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had an arrest recently... extended down time, rigor starting to set in... i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor... QA/QI was not too happy with me when they reviewed by chart... my opinion is it doesn't get much more bradycardic then asystole :D
 
Extended down time with rigor?? Why for the love of all things holy was this worked at all! I know it's easy to forget things sometimes, but atropine (or anything else) is not going to help this patient. He has shuffled off this mortal coil, and anti cholinergics are doing a whole lot of nothing at this point.
 
QI/QA didn't have a problem with working a patient with rigor?
 
I'm sure the atropine didn't harm the patient....
 
had an arrest recently... extended down time, rigor starting to set in... i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor... QA/QI was not too happy with me when they reviewed by chart... my opinion is it doesn't get much more bradycardic then asystole :D

1. you worked a patient with rigor.

2. you went outside of the protocol.

3. you made a ridiculous defense for what you knew to be an error.

4. you make a mockery out of old time medics when you use that defense too.

So what was your question?
 
had an arrest recently... extended down time, rigor starting to set in... i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor... QA/QI was not too happy with me when they reviewed by chart... my opinion is it doesn't get much more bradycardic then asystole :D

EMS before ALS, ya know? I thought you were a basic?

im a better PROVIDER than most medics i work with and I'm a basic. EMS before ALS. if the patients cared for and comforted in their time of need and i can get them to more definitive care than that is a job well done. thats the problem with SOME ALS providers. they forget about the pt's and just go robo-medic through their protocols and forget that they have a person to care for and comfort. and its not all their fault. a lot of them are scared that some doctor is gonna widen their :censored: if they :censored::censored::censored::censored: up so they focus on the protocols and not the pt.
 
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had an arrest recently... extended down time, rigor starting to set in... i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor... QA/QI was not too happy with me when they reviewed by chart... my opinion is it doesn't get much more bradycardic then asystole :D

Are you proud of this?

EMS before ALS, ya know? I thought you were a basic?

Interesting
 
I am confused what the point of this post is? I usually don't brag about making medication errors...


"a lot of them are scared that some doctor is gonna widen their :censored: if they :censored::censored::censored::censored: up so they focus on the protocols and not the pt."

I am surprised your Medical Director has not widen yours. Maybe you should have focused more on the protocols than the obviously dead patient.
 
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had an arrest recently... extended down time, rigor starting to set in... i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor... QA/QI was not too happy with me when they reviewed by chart... my opinion is it doesn't get much more bradycardic then asystole :D

I have to agree with the other responses. The use of atropine in the situation is almost the lest concerning. If you've been a medic for any length of time what made you think working a patient in rigor was a good idea?
 
i know ACLS took atropine out of the protocols for arrests recently but the old timer in me went back to the old days and pushed atropine. asystole on the monitor...
ok, dumb question from a basic here for the OP: was the patient in asystole before you pushed the atropine? So did it work? did it do anything? Can you see why QI had an issue with your actions?

plus the whole working a dead body with rigor, yeah, I'm just a basic, but last i checked, even a paramedic can't raise the dead (despite what some like to think:rolleyes:)
 
worked it because fire was already working it when we arrived and they had a probie with them and their captian wanted him to get experience
 
worked it because fire was already working it when we arrived and they had a probie with them and their captian wanted him to get experience

Bunny_facepalm_by_shlj23-d4s3yaj.jpg
 
Words escape me
 
OP, do you understand the (very reasonable) challenges being raised to your patient management, and questions about your training and certification? "Just because fire already started", and "I got confused with old protocols", and "it can't hurt the patient" are NOT valid ways of thinking about patient care, and reverse decades of evidence-based medicine (research), undermine the professionalism of our industry as a whole, and amount to poor patient care (which ultimately is why we all do this...). Do you see where these (wise) people are coming from?

If you don't follow protocol (or loosely defined best practices) in cardiac arrest, which is relatively black and white, what indications would your supervisors (or QI staff) have that you follow it when your patients aren't dead? Is this how you medicate using narcotics? RSI meds? What do you believe to be the purpose of these protocols, if not to be followed in these situations (other than a reminder of the incorrect beliefs of yesteryear)?
 
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What did the ED say when you brought this patient in? I am sure they loved taking up resources and a trauma bay for your "practice" arrest. That is ridiculous.
 
The only problem I see is you should of given zofran first
Zofran ODT, right?

Edit But I actually think that a lot people are like this everywhere. It's why we hear all these aphorisms like EMTs save Paramedics, and stuff.

OP, you should browse previous threads regarding doing codes for practice and stuff. It's frowned upon here. Also pushing unnecessary drugs is frowned upon. Although I think a lot of us feel restricted by our protocols and want things to be changed, we do not advocate not following your protocols either.
 
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