Apparatus Parking at Scenes

[MedicPrincess]

Watch the video of the FD CPT being arrested because he refused to allow the fire truck to be moved after the police officer ordered it. This is sometimes a problem everywhere.

What do you think?

I know we have had officers "threaten" to arrest both FF and EMS for blocking a lane. It hasn't ever actually happened. Generally safety prevails.

Now, lets try not to focus TOO MUCH on the CPT jumping out of a moving fire truck..... Good grief!

[youtube]DKzojYvXn20[/youtube]

 

[karaya]

This happened just up the road from where I live. Pretty overzealous cop with a known reputation for such. I was glad to see the fire captain win in federal court. Here is a link about his trial:

http://www.firerescue1.com/incident...for-apparatus-placement-awarded-17-500-in-Mo/

Your correct in that safety prevails and every case that I've seen of such arrests, have all been tossed out of court. I witnessed such an arrest one time many years ago. This arrest infuriated the highway patrol so much, that the arresting highway patrol officer was reassigned somewhere in north Missouri to watch the corn grow.

 

[rhan101277]

I think he did right. The police were in the wrong.

 

[CFRBryan347768]

I think he did right. The police were in the wrong.

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.
This whole video is a train wreck, when the cop approaches he starts yelling and throwing his hands up. I would have cuffed him and took him away also.

 

[seanm028]

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.

You are exactly correct... they are blocking a highway. A highway with lots of cars. Fast cars. Being driven by people who probably aren't paying much attention, or people who are rubber necking. Do you want to risk the safety of your whole crew? No, so you park the rig between your crew and the oncoming traffic. That's standard procedure for every FD I've ever heard of.

 

[BEorP]

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.
This whole video is a train wreck, when the cop approaches he starts yelling and throwing his hands up. I would have cuffed him and took him away also.

You may reconsider this opinion once you've done some calls on a busy highway. My safety is more important than keeping an extra lane open. The responders on that scene are lucky to have had a Fire Captain who stood his ground for the safety of everyone there.

 

[KEVD18]

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.
This whole video is a train wreck, when the cop approaches he starts yelling and throwing his hands up. I would have cuffed him and took him away also.

you know not of what you speak, sir. that is textbook perfect placement of the engine. as it said in the vid, you now have a box(well, a three sided box) around your responders. can they still get hurt, sure. but the chances of it are much less. my safety while doing a job on the highway is one million times more important than you making it to your meeting.

 

[MedicPrincess]

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.
This whole video is a train wreck, when the cop approaches he starts yelling and throwing his hands up. I would have cuffed him and took him away also.

As a paramedic, I COUNT ON those firefighters parking that big red/yellow/white (depending on which district I happen to be with) box BEHIND my truck on a MVC. Their truck not only protects the scene itsself, but it protects me, my partner, and our patient as we are loading them into the back of the ambulance from that lookie-lou rubbernecker trying to get a good eyefull of the person we are putting into the ambulance.

He threw his hands up, because the cop GRABBED HIM while he was taking care of a patient. You can almost read the "Don't touch me" on his lips.

 

[daedalus]

Why does the truck need to be right their? They are not loading the pt. in. And they are blocking a highway. The driver had no right to sit their. Grab your jump bags and move over.

Look closely. Is than an ambulance on the side? Move the truck in front of the ambulance.
This whole video is a train wreck, when the cop approaches he starts yelling and throwing his hands up. I would have cuffed him and took him away also.

When you are killed on the side of the freeway when you step back into the lane and get plowed halfway to california from acar shooting by at 65, maybe you will change your mind.

Due to the fact that NOBODY follows the "slow down for parked emergency vehicles" slogan, it necessitates the need to block the lane next to the incident so that rescue and law enforcement do not get killed. One only needs to travel down a freeway in Califnornia to see the many memorials to highway patrol officers and firefighters killed on the side of the road.

 

[Ridryder911]

This makes my blood boil! This is one of the greatest problems EMS is facing!! You know we lost almost over 40% of our EMS brothers in the line of duty because the LEO will NOT DO THEIR JOB!!! It is called staging and apparently something LEO is no longer taught or they do not want to perform. Personally, every time a EMS or F/F gets injured or killed at a MVC; the Officer(s) at the scene should be charged with negligence and if death occurs manslaughter or an account of murder.

I hope the the F.D. sues the living poo poo out the LEO and causes a national change.. I am meeting with my local Capt tomorrow and see if we can start shutting down lanes with placing a pumper across the lanes...

One of the busiest metro areas now does this because of the State Troopers and local LEO failed to do so and they lost 2 firefighters. Shame is they (LEO) did not learn.. but the F.D. did and they no longer take crap from them. If they are not careful, the F.D. will declare the scene a HazMat area and will shut everything down...

Sorry. this is a touchy & sore subject with those that just enough knowledge to get someone killed. They are now giving us a hard time about scene flights, wanting to know justification, etc. Really, they teach you medicine in that 16 week academy?.. Wow!..

R/r 911

 

[2serveothers]

WOW!!! Not in the exciting sense mind you, this is a stellar example of a stubborn, pig-headed, egotistical individual with a badge. The control that the Captain maintains during this situation is utterly amazing and professional. I am not sure I could have faired as well, without creating a worse situation, it would be all I could do to refrain from knocking the officers teeth down his throat, then he would have legitimate reason to cuff me and haul me to the car. I have a respect and admiration for all services but this one takes the cake.

I know that things can be stressful and unpredictable at times, but myself I would love to know there was thousands of pounds of rescue truck blocking me and my crew from the likes of unattentative drivers. As mentioned it only takes one vehicle to kill or injure more folks in this type of situation. The officer should have spent his aggression on re-routing traffic to a reasonable path for continueing traffic. Or slowing traffic at least. That is one of the many things going downhill in this world, everything is hurry, hurry, hurry. And communities wonder why it is that there loved ones have been subjected to pain, disability or death.

WOW!!!

 

[traumateam1]

...
MedicPrincess, do you have a link or info on how the trial went? I would like to see what happened to the officer that made once of the stupidest moves I've ever seen!
Honestly, I hope that captain was able to sue the junk outta the cop for being so stubborn and "power hungry". He endangered all the other emergency responder lives at that scene, and God forbid one of them had been killed.. he woulda (or hopefully) been charged with murder!
Another rant... anyways Stay safe out there!

 

[MedicPrincess]

...
MedicPrincess, do you have a link or info on how the trial went? I would like to see what happened to the officer that made once of the stupidest moves I've ever seen!
Honestly, I hope that captain was able to sue the junk outta the cop for being so stubborn and "power hungry". He endangered all the other emergency responder lives at that scene, and God forbid one of them had been killed.. he woulda (or hopefully) been charged with murder!
Another rant... anyways Stay safe out there!

Yes, the link in Karaya's post is it.

The CPT won a settlement.

 

[traumateam1]

Haha.. how did I not see that?!?! :wacko:
Thank you very much.

 

[WuLabsWuTecH]

We were taught in our class that at least in Ohio, EMS and FD have control of the scene until they turn it over to the PD in almost every circumstance. There was a case study where an LEO arrested an EMT. He (the LEO) was later charged with felony assault. (Its a felony to assault an EMT in the state of Ohio.)

 

[MMiz]

I agree with the EMT on this one, but according to the article they awarded the guy more than $17,000. The article reads:

Jurors, including a nun, said they went easy on the defendant, Officer Todd Greeves, because he has a family and they weren't sure who would pay the bill.

Don't you think that it was a bit much?

 

[mycrofft]

CFRBRYAN, I work with LE, but I have to respectfully disagree.

I know why the officer arrested the captain, as you do. It is not a good idea to flap your arms at an officer, there's this overriding reflex to snatch one, twist 'em and cuff 'em. The officer felt (felt) he was losing control of the scene and behavior was exhibited which was conducive to a battery. But feelings need to be curbed when you're on the shoulder, no pun intended.
I wish we'd had that sort of lane blockage when I was working the street.

 

[Ridryder911]

I agree with the EMT on this one, but according to the article they awarded the guy more than $17,000. The article reads:


Don't you think that it was a bit much?

Nope add another 0 and get their attention. This should be against them personally as well as have the patient or family sue as well for interference and delay in medical care. A couple of months behind the cell bars should be included as well...

R/r 911

 

[Bosco578]

We have a staging policy at MVC's in regards to unit placement. Fortunatly for the most part our PD has had no issues with blocking traffic,be it our units,fire or even PD themselves.

That video clearly shows the LEO was a tard.

 

[Jon]

This video has caught lots of questions every time I've seen it posted.

This is the 20th post... and no one has talked about the fact that there was at least one occupant of the engine not wearing their seatbelt... the Captain. Where is his gear? Where is his reflective vest?

How come I only see one FF in full gear?

Where is the EMS providers gear? Vests?
Where is the LEO's vests?

We have PPE for a reason. TOG (Turn out gear) and reflective vests are PPE on MVC's. A seatbelt is PPE EVERY TIME YOU ARE IN A VEHICLE.


I don't have an issue with how this turned out... but this isn't a shining example for either side. Yes... the LEO was wrong in pulling the captain away from patient care and arresting him... but there are lots of other stupid things in that video that concern trained people watching it.