What the h*ll is wrong with this guy!

[MedicPrincess]

So one of my vol. ff buddies (we were on the same crew for that last 2 years, and can normally read each other without words) is at my house hanging out. My place is closer to the station than his and he is on call tonight. He gets a call for an "unknown problem" at a house that is only about 3 down from mine. He was obviously going to walk over since he was basically next door. Something told me to go with him so we both grab our bags out of our car and on the way there he indicated he had the same bad juju feeling.

So we get there, and the lady says her husband called her into the bedroom, said he felt bad and wanted her to call an ambulance. Now she cant get him to wake up. Now the original call came out at "Unknown Medical, Bravo Response." So my friend and I go in, and WOW, that was a neat color of bluish purple that guy is. Quick ABC's shows..No, No, oh and NO. Ok man...upgrade the Med Unit to Code in progress. He relays to dispatch, as I pull the guy onto the floor. We HEAR dispatch TELL the med unit and FD this. We HEAR the Med Unit acknowledge. They say they are "coming across the bridge now" (thats about 4 min with the Echo Response).

So here we are....seems every code we ever worked together, he does compression, I bag them. No problem..makes things go smoother...we know our roles. So anyway...back to my rant....

So we hear the Med Unit coming down the street and send the wife out to flag them down. And no FD is not there yet. They have a Minimum of 3 minutes before they even get inservice...that is the closest a person lives who can go get the engine. So anyway, wife flags down the Med Unit. And here they come.

NO Lifepack
NO Blue Bag (you know, where they keep all their stuff)
NO Suction

So what do they bring...the stretcher (no backboard) and their clipboard with the patient info sheet.

And then the first thing out of the Medics mouth..."Watcha got?"

Umm...hey dumba$$...notice the compressions...notice the girl with the bag at the head...REMEMBER acknowledging dispatch whey they told you Code in Progress.

Ok..I know this Medic...He is really hard to tell how he is going to treat the vol. ff. It is different on every call. So I decide to play nice at first.

Me - "Code, wife says he called her into the bedroom, he asked for an ambulance, she called right away, we were here in about 1 min."
Him - "You Sure"
Me - just kind of look at him like You have to be kidding me
Him- "Well is he breathing?
Me- still with the bag on the guys face, "NO"
Him- "Pulse?"
Me- again looking at him with that look "Well considering he's workin that chest pretty good, you tell me?"
Him- "You know I don't work codes. Lets call him."

WTF!!!!

Me- "How about you get over here, hook your monitor up and get your strip?"
Him- "Didn't bring it in."

WTF!!!!

Me- to his EMT, "Go get it."
EMT scrambles to the Med Unit, on his way out Medic tells him to cancel Fire.
Him- "I'm not working him."
Me- "Unless you want me to have our Chief talk with your Med Director you'll get your F-ing A$$ over here and do your magic. And ALL of it."
Him- "Aren't you JUST a vol. ff?"
Me- "Yep. Now get your a$$ over here! Don't tempt me tonight."

EMT comes in with Lifepack, blue bag containing all the right drugs and a tube, tells the Medic he isn't loosing his GD job, now get to F-ing work.

So they hook him up, guy is shockable. Tube him. Shock him. Drugs. Load him, and luckily the EMT did not cancel fire...took a FF with them to the hospital. Before they left, he made a point to tell me he will be talking to my Chief about my refusal to stop CPR when he wanted to call the guy and boy wont I regret it when I am suspened from the FD because he wont stop until he has it that way...blah blah blah blah. You know what...bring it on. B/C I can guarantee you the FD Chief WILL be talking to the Med Director first thing tomorrow.

Oh and the REALLY funny thing...this guy is the SAFETY director for the Ambulance service in our county.

 

[rescuecpt]

Sounds like a jerk to me.

If you were in my State you did the right thing - what are the laws for calling a patient where you're from?

 

[ffemt8978]

I know that about half of the codes I've worked have been for the benefit of the family and not the pt. This guy sounds like he needs to attend (and fail :angry: ) one of my CPR classes so that he can't be a medic anymore.

If he had tried that crap with me, I would have been on the phone with his medical director before he got to the hospital 'cuz homey don't play that.

You did the right thing, and I would most assuredly follow up with your chief in the morning.

 

[PArescueEMT]

I can't believe that sh*t. Does he not know his job, or is he just burnt out. He sounds like he is doing more harm to the public than good if he carries an attitude like that with him.

 

[MedicPrincess]

Yea...we had the Chief on the phone about 20 seconds after we got back to my house. My buddy is going to handle is, mainly b/c I am not really "with" the FD right now.

The even more scary thing is, my friend pointed out to me, this Medic is one they put EMT students with during their ride times. So hopefully this problem is solved before I have to start my ride alongs next month.

 

[MassMedic1052]

I'm not a big fan of throwing people under the bus but this Medic deserves everything he gets....It was a code if ever was one. Was all of this said in front of the wife? God help him if it was......that is just not right....sounds like he's burnt out and needs to get out of the field. You did the right thing

MassMedic1052

 

[coloradoemt]

Excellent job I must say. I would work with you on my rig any day before I would the bozo you had to deal with. I would hope that you feel good about the job you did.

 

[MedicPrincess]

Thank you for that. I guess what really bothers me about this guy, and there is one other medic in this area that says the same thing, is the statement "I don't work codes" Is that common for medics to get that way?

I, mean I can see if the guy is cold..but this guy was TALKING less than 3 minutes before we got there.

As far as who can call someone...all my training has been, if one of the obvious signs of death are there, than anybody can.

But once resusitation efforts have been started - in the field only a PM can, and only after "running the strip" (not sure what that means). All the codes I have worked, if I started CPR, the medics never called it...they transported and let the DR in the ER call it...even that one guy who I know damn good and well I should not have even started, but it was my first time I was at a code by myself and I didn't want to be the one to do it (insert chicken noise here).

The wife was not in the room with us. A neighbor had come over when they saw the Med Unit pull up. She kept her out of the room - thank God.

 

[MedicPrincess]

ok...there is more...just got through talking to the Chief.

He woke up the Med Director last night to tell him about this. He promises a "full investigation." And they suggest I dont "tag along" on any more calls. BS!

Here is the funniest part about it all.

Y'all know next month I start my EMT course. This guy teaches one of the blocks. He teaches CPR....

LMAO!!!!!

I guess we'll see....He is also one of 3 medics they assign students to ride along with during the ride times for class.

 

[Jon]

Originally posted by EMTPrincess@Dec 29 2004, 09:23 AM
ok...there is more...just got through talking to the Chief.

He woke up the Med Director last night to tell him about this. He promises a "full investigation." And they suggest I dont "tag along" on any more calls. BS!

Here is the funniest part about it all.

Y'all know next month I start my EMT course. This guy teaches one of the blocks. He teaches CPR....

LMAO!!!!!

I guess we'll see....He is also one of 3 medics they assign students to ride along with during the ride times for class.

Sounds like you are neck-deep in political BS that just hit the industrial-size ventilation device.

If the guy was shockable, he CAN'T be field called in PA, except for them little things like decap or total eviseration (well, that blows the shockable rythym)

Also, if the investigation doesn't happen, this NEEDS to go to the state OEMS - that ridiculous. this guy shouldn't be anywhere near patients, let alone TEACHING EMTs CPR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry: :angry: h34r: :angry: :angry:

I don't know about the "not being with the department" - you know CPR, and as long as you have a Prof. Rescuerer card, you were with someone who ASKED (even wordlessly) for your help. If you didn't ID that you were with the FD, you shouldn't be in any trouble, it was no different than if you'd been waking down the street - yes, little legal gray area, but ethically and morally you were in the clear.

<off soapbox>


KMG365

 

[Margaritaville]

Lord help us all,

Who in the hell has the right to say "I don't work codes." Well if you don't , than here is a suggestion - WALMART IS HIRING EVERYDAY! I have never heard such bulls****!

I am sure a large can of worms has now been opened, but as a provider -that makes me sick. If this person is nationally registered than they know this is against all standards and common sense. I personally would love to have a chat with them before I took thier card and shredded it.

Good luck to you! I hope this is not near where I live. I am having surgery on tuesday and I would like to know that if I need EMS- that I'll at least get some care!

 

[Jon]

Originally posted by Margaritaville@Dec 29 2004, 03:02 PM
Lord help us all,

Who in the hell has the right to say "I don't work codes." Well if you don't , than here is a suggestion - WALMART IS HIRING EVERYDAY! I have never heard such bulls****!

I am sure a large can of worms has now been opened, but as a provider -that makes me sick. If this person is nationally registered than they know this is against all standards and common sense. I personally would love to have a chat with them before I took thier card and shredded it.

Good luck to you! I hope this is not near where I live. I am having surgery on tuesday and I would like to know that if I need EMS- that I'll at least get some care!

Don't say that - walmarts, and most other department stores try to always have someone on staff at all times with layperson CPR - keeps their insurance rates down. If you don't like codes, go work in either a hospice, a motuary, or for the coronor.


Jon

 

[rescuecpt]

Originally posted by EMTPrincess@Dec 29 2004, 09:14 AM
"I don't work codes" Is that common for medics to get that way?

As far as who can call someone...all my training has been, if one of the obvious signs of death are there, than anybody can.

But once resusitation efforts have been started - in the field only a PM can, and only after "running the strip" (not sure what that means).

I've heard people say that they don't work codes - but I've never seen anyone actually follow through with that.

In this situation, there was signs of obvious death.

"running the strip" means doing an ECG and making sure the pt is in asystole. Where I am, only medical control or an ER doc can call once resucitation has started - so you have to run all of your standard orders (here it's epi, atropine, external pacing, epi, atropine, epi, atropine), call medical control, run all of their options (more epi, atropine, bicarb), then it depends how long to the hospital, how long they were down for... and the med ctrl medic has to page the doc and he has to get on the phone and tell you to stop.

 

[MedicPrincess]

Update-

Chief calls me and asks me to stop by after work to meet with him, my friend, and the Medics Supervisor. So I get there and the Chief meets me at my car and tells me to just keep my mouth shut, no matter what is said, b/c he is backing me on this.

So we get in the meeting room and Its our Chief, Asst. Chief, The Capt of the station I had been assiged to, The Med Director, The Shift Supervisor, the EMT and That Medic. They have a tape recorder on the table and say they will let him start.

He opens with

"Who the hell does she think she is telling me to get my F-ing *** to work. SHE is JUST a volunteer. SHE is JUST a First Responder. When I get there that PT is MINE. SHE is supposed to back off and I take over. If I need something from the Med Unit, she is to go GET IT!"

He is almost yelling...and it was probably a good thing the Chief had warned me to shut my mouth. I tend to suffer from "Foot In Mouth Syndrome."

The Shift Supervisor : "He has a point. When we get there the CFR is to give up patient care to the next higher trained individual. In this case it was him."
The Medic: "I expect we are here so you can tell me she will be suspended for talking to me like that in front of a patient, and not getting out of our way" At this point he looks at his partner and says "Right?" (Hey buddy, I guess he doesnt know I am not with the Dept anymore)

His partner moved his chair a good 6 inches away from him and did not acknowledge him.

Shift Super: "Now I dont' think anybody needs to be suspended here. I think it was just a misunderstanding on her part. Maybe we can calm down and discuss it a little more rationally." (Umm...apparently he doesnt have the whole story. I look at my CPT, and he motions me to be quiet and smiles a little)

The Medic: "WHAT? She needs to learn who is in charge of the call!"
Shift Super "From the other medics I have talked to today, she is damn good at what she does. All of them stated the would take her in their units ANY day. They all say, they are looking forward to her becoming and EMT so she can work with them. Perhaps she was having a bad day, or perhaps she didn't realize you were the medic. Well?" (At this point he turns to me.)

Me: "Well, what? What are you asking, because you need to know, I will answer what ever question you ask, but your not going to get me to just start talking so you can find something to use against me." (ok, so I was a little aggravated....and hungry, I hadn't had dinner yet...I get grumpy when I get hungry...)

Shift Super: "My medic here says when he got on scene you would not get out of his way and let him begin working on the patient. He also says you used numerous swear words and ordered him around. Is any of that true?"

I look at the Chiefs and the CPT. And speaking to them I say "Are you kidding me? Does he not know the whole story?" All three nod No. My CPT says they decided to let me tell it after hearing from the Shift Supervisor this A.M.

So instead of retelling it, I hand them my statement concerning the call....and my friend hands over his....and the EMT hands over his....and What do you know...they MATCH!

Shift Supervisor looks at Medic, tells him to go get in the truck they will continue back at their offices. They will get back to us with the outcome.

The Med Director said he would make sure this was "properly addressed." Whatever that means. Guess we will see next month when its time to learn CPR.

 

[ffemt8978]

Originally posted by EMTPrincess@Dec 29 2004, 05:38 PM
The Med Director said he would make sure this was "properly addressed." Whatever that means. Guess we will see next month when its time to learn CPR.

Ummm...don't you have to have a current CPR card to be a CFR?

Sounds like your Chief almost sandbagged the Shift Sup. not telling him your side in advance. I'm sure the Medical Director will correct this situation, but you might want to have a chat with your Chief if this guy is going to be monitoring you during your clinicals. I'd hate to see him hold a grudge when evaluating you.

Let us know what the Medical Director does.

 

[MedicPrincess]

Originally posted by ffemt8978@Dec 29 2004, 08:09 PM

Ummm...don't you have to have a current CPR card to be a CFR?

Yes. You do, and I do. But it is part of the EMT course...will take it again....mine card is a year old, and a refresher will not hurt.

 

[Summit]

I wouldn't want that p anywhere near me. I think you did right. Let us know how this all plays out. I bet the MD rakes that guy over the coals and he will never work in the field again.

 

[Jon]

Originally posted by EMTPrincess@Dec 29 2004, 07:38 PM
<SNIP> Guess we will see next month when its time to learn CPR.

A: If what actually happened was AT ALL close to what you stated, the Medical Director should throw this guy as far away as possible. at the least, mental eval type thing for burnout, and a nice, 30 day suspension, on top of losing command and having to start to precept all over. At the worst, the guy gets reported to the State OEMS and is not allowed to provide care for the rest of his life.

B: I think the whole "teaching CPR" thing isn't a real great Idea, perhaps the guy can be given a good job as the CPR maniqun? The medical director needs to be aware of this, and might want to have a chat with the schools' medical director, Doc to Doc, about this a-hole that works for them. (thats assuming that they aren't the same guy/gal)


Jon
KMG365 (bonus points to anyone who can PM me with what that comes from)

 

[Flrick_]

Hello! New guy here just passed NREMT_B have no experience, and not at a station yet! This is the kinda stuff that makes me nervous about EMS!!!! What the? Any suggestions for a newbie, wannabe etc.....?
Rick

 

[ffemt8978]

Originally posted by Flrick_@Dec 30 2004, 09:38 PM
Hello! New guy here just passed NREMT_B have no experience, and not at a station yet! This is the kinda stuff that makes me nervous about EMS!!!! What the? Any suggestions for a newbie, wannabe etc.....?
Rick

1. Take a deep breath and check your own pulse first. If it's still there, everything else is easy.

2. Relax!

3. Trust your training.

4. **Most Important** ASK QUESTIONS AND DON'T BE AFRAID TO QUESTION THE ANSWERS YOU ARE GIVEN!

BTW, congrats on the NREMT and welcome to the forum.