Staging in EMS

[WuLabsWuTecH]

I'm not saying to go in on a shooting in the projects when the cops aren't there yet. Safety is still paramount, but staging on a full arrest? Think about the odds that's some kind of trap vs the odds that you're delaying care to that patient? You ever seen a cop do CPR? I think not. Everything in life involves risk, and if you're not willing to take some to help real people, get out of EMS and let the big boys do the hard work.

The reason for this one is crowd control. In the city, this is never a problem as the cops usually beat us there anyway and we send in 9 guys (2 medics, an engine, and a supervisor) so we have help in the crowd control department. Out in the country, we'll take the first due medic, but everyone else is responding from home so the engine is going to be at least 5 minutes behind us if not more as is our second squad. In this case, we'll wait until we have enough manpower to control a scene. If the sheriff's office tells us that we are not getting a deputy on the run, I have seen them stage at station before and wait until the engine is in service and rolling both trucks out at the same time.

And yes, I've seen plenty of cops do CPR or otherwise help out on scene.

We don't stage at all. I don't think the dispatchers in my system know what that means. Hell, we're lucky to get the local sheriff to respond. We go in ready to take the patient down in those situations. We don't have the time to wait around for PD in the country.

If we have time to wait around for half an hour where I work, I'm sure you guys can wait there too if there is an active shooting. Would you go into a shooting scene to avoid waiting around?

Once you have a little experience you'll learn that the odds are just as good that any shooter is going to bolt to avoid capture way before you get there. That's why you leave your sirens on until you're stepping out. Give them plenty of warning to run, so they don't feel trapped by your presence.

And we see plenty of cops doing CPR in my area. You need better cops.

A trapped shooter is an unpredictable shooter. And +1 on the needing better cops wherever he works!

 

[mcdonl]

We don't stage at all. I don't think the dispatchers in my system know what that means. Hell, we're lucky to get the local sheriff to respond. We go in ready to take the patient down in those situations. We don't have the time to wait around for PD in the country.

This type of thinking is WHY our chief makes us stage at the station. He would rather have live crew members instead of dead hero's. You go in ready to take the patient down? Really? I am under the impression that taking a BP against the patients will is assault... I can only imagine what "taking the patient down" would be...

 

[WuLabsWuTecH]

This type of thinking is WHY our chief makes us stage at the station. He would rather have live crew members instead of dead hero's. You go in ready to take the patient down? Really? I am under the impression that taking a BP against the patients will is assault... I can only imagine what "taking the patient down" would be...

Oh boy! We know what next month's dispatcher's training is going over! How do they not know what staging is?

And any situation in which I could possibly need to go in ready to take the patient down, is exactly the situation I am staging on 100% of the time!

 

[Elk Oil]

Everything in life involves risk, and if you're not willing to take some to help real people, get out of EMS and let the big boys do the hard work.

Well, looks like I'll be getting out of EMS to let the big boys do the hard work.

It's been real!

 

[mcdonl]

Oh boy! We know what next month's dispatcher's training is going over! How do they not know what staging is?

And any situation in which I could possibly need to go in ready to take the patient down, is exactly the situation I am staging on 100% of the time!

Dont get me wrong, we stage when asked or when we suspect we need to without being asked. Our service chief just prefers we stay right at the station. Too many nuts go after the first shiny vehicle with flashing lights. No staging near the scene for us.

 

[Sasha]

Well, looks like I'll be getting out of EMS to let the big boys do the hard work.

It's been real!

Byeee.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk

 

[firetender]

Don't miss his point...

We don't stage at all. I don't think the dispatchers in my system know what that means. Hell, we're lucky to get the local sheriff to respond. We go in ready to take the patient down in those situations. We don't have the time to wait around for PD in the country.

You can't just assume that every system is either able or willing to provide the backup necessary to have the luxury of staging when immediate intervention is needed to preserve life of the patient. There are a lot of services out there -- especially "country" -- where the medics are thrust into a situation and must make the best of it.

Sometimes people here base their judgments of others on an ideal system that simply does not exist.

 

[reaper]

You can't just assume that every system is either able or willing to provide the backup necessary to have the luxury of staging when immediate intervention is needed to preserve life of the patient. There are a lot of services out there -- especially "country" -- where the medics are thrust into a situation and must make the best of it.

Sometimes people here base their judgments of others on an ideal system that simply does not exist.

I have staged for an hour on calls. I do not care if the pt is going to die before then. If the call warrents staging, then you stage. Our lives are not expendable just because we work in EMS. I have worked very "country" systems and have never not staged for a call. When they want to deputize me and give me a gun, then I will enter a bad scene.

A certain posters comments on here shows inexperience. No ones life is more important then yours, NO ONES! When they gain some real experience, they will see what working EMS is all about.

 

[Addicted2Narcan]

I have staged for an hour on calls. I do not care if the pt is going to die before then. If the call warrents staging, then you stage. Our lives are not expendable just because we work in EMS. I have worked very "country" systems and have never not staged for a call. When they want to deputize me and give me a gun, then I will enter a bad scene.

A certain posters comments on here shows inexperience. No ones life is more important then yours, NO ONES! When they gain some real experience, they will see what working EMS is all about.

See that's where you're wrong. Would I trade my life for a crackhead in the projects? Hell no. But would I trade my life for my partner's or an innocent child's if I had to make a decision that meant stepping up? You can count on it.

And I love my job. They said, "you wanna stick tubes and needles in people and not go to jail?" I said, "hell yeah, who don't?"

 

[reaper]

Like said, no experience!

Sent from little black box

 

[Sasha]

See that's where you're wrong. Would I trade my life for a crackhead in the projects? Hell no. But would I trade my life for my partner's or an innocent child's if I had to make a decision that meant stepping up? You can count on it.

And I love my job. They said, "you wanna stick tubes and needles in people and not go to jail?" I said, "hell yeah, who don't?"

Hmm.... its more like playing god when you sit there and decide what patient is worth the risk. All human lives are valuable, the only one i hold in higher value are my own and my loved ones for obvious reasons. Other than that its all or nothing.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk

 

[Elk Oil]

But would I trade my life for my partner's or an innocent child's if I had to make a decision that meant stepping up? You can count on it.

And I love my job. They said, "you wanna stick tubes and needles in people and not go to jail?" I said, "hell yeah, who don't?"

You have just convinced me how wrong I've been. I'm going to make sure on my next violent call in which a child or my partner is present, I will sacrifice myself for them without question.

 

[Elk Oil]

Byeee.

Sent from LuLu using Tapatalk

Feelin' the love. Thank you.

 

[Bullets]

If dispatch requests that we stage then we will stage until police clear the scene. The crew doesn't have a choice on to stage or not to stage if dispatch requests it. The crew can also make a choice to stage on calls if dispatch doesn't tell us to.

Thats some real BS. Im on scene, i know the situation better then the Dispatchers sitting in a room miles away. IF i feel the scene is safe thn i will make entry. Im not waiting for the cops to tell their dispatchers who call mine who tell me, how about i just walk over there?

Dispatchers never supersede on-scene EMT's, especially my dispatchers

 

[Elk Oil]

Thats some real BS. Im on scene, i know the situation better then the Dispatchers sitting in a room miles away. IF i feel the scene is safe thn i will make entry. Im not waiting for the cops to tell their dispatchers who call mine who tell me, how about i just walk over there?

Dispatchers never supersede on-scene EMT's, especially my dispatchers

Depends on your system. Ours is different. We can't possibly know if the scene is safe PRIOR to arriving, so if it is suspected that it's unsafe, we stage.

I used to work in a system in which the dispatchers' word was equal to a supervisor, so yes, they did supersede field units.

 

[guttruck]

around here staging is a must due to the high amount of meth od's and other od's that are not in the "best" parts of town. Its never a bad idea to request that an S.O. be in rout or there in this neck of the woodsh34r:

 

[AJ Hidell]

You have just convinced me how wrong I've been. I'm going to make sure on my next violent call in which a child or my partner is present, I will sacrifice myself for them without question.

Some of us are alive today because someone did that. It's no laughing matter.

 

[DesertMedic66]

Thats some real BS. Im on scene, i know the situation better then the Dispatchers sitting in a room miles away. IF i feel the scene is safe thn i will make entry. Im not waiting for the cops to tell their dispatchers who call mine who tell me, how about i just walk over there?

Dispatchers never supersede on-scene EMT's, especially my dispatchers

Dispatchers here are basically supervisors. So if you want to argue and not listen to them, then you can kiss your job goodbye. The dispatchers always have more info then the crews get so they can make a more informed choice. All the info we are given is just the location and possibly the nature of the call. If we stage fire is staging also. Neither us or fire will go into a scene until the all clear is given by the police.

I honestly don't have a problem with that one bit. Yeah it takes longer for us to get to our patient but it means me and my partner are that much safer.

 

[WuLabsWuTecH]

Dont get me wrong, we stage when asked or when we suspect we need to without being asked. Our service chief just prefers we stay right at the station. Too many nuts go after the first shiny vehicle with flashing lights. No staging near the scene for us.

I guess it depends how far away you are from the scene. We'll stage at the firehouse if it's in town since the village is less than a square mile. But if the scene is 30 miles away, we'll head that way! You do propose an interesting idea though. We usually stage about a half mile to a mile away on the side of the road. Maybe we can stage at other department's firehouses on their ramps--it would put us closer to other people...

 

[WuLabsWuTecH]

You can't just assume that every system is either able or willing to provide the backup necessary to have the luxury of staging when immediate intervention is needed to preserve life of the patient. There are a lot of services out there -- especially "country" -- where the medics are thrust into a situation and must make the best of it.

Sometimes people here base their judgments of others on an ideal system that simply does not exist.

I have staged for an hour on calls. I do not care if the pt is going to die before then. If the call warrents staging, then you stage. Our lives are not expendable just because we work in EMS. I have worked very "country" systems and have never not staged for a call. When they want to deputize me and give me a gun, then I will enter a bad scene.

A certain posters comments on here shows inexperience. No ones life is more important then yours, NO ONES! When they gain some real experience, they will see what working EMS is all about.

I work out in the country, and have 2 deputies that cover our county at night. We still wait when we are unsure or if there is a history of violence at the address. It's a risk just not worth taking.

And yes, if you work in TEMS, staging would not be an issue for you!

Thats some real BS. Im on scene, i know the situation better then the Dispatchers sitting in a room miles away. IF i feel the scene is safe thn i will make entry. Im not waiting for the cops to tell their dispatchers who call mine who tell me, how about i just walk over there?

Dispatchers never supersede on-scene EMT's, especially my dispatchers

Why are we on this dispatchers vs. on scene personnel thing again? It shouldn't be a head to head who is superseding whom thing! Work with your dispatchers to try and determine the best information. If they have a bad feeling about it, find out why! But once we start working for dispatchers, or they start working for us, we're going to lose some utility out of a very good resource!