L.A. County EMS Laws

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elnemt

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LACO_EMT-P_VECTORED.jpg


Regarding Los Angeles County EMS and its rules, codes, laws and regulations.

1. When both EMT's (EMT-I, EMT-P) are licensed ambulance drivers and transporting a patient BLS (non-emergency, non-ALS), can the Paramedic drive while the EMT-I (in LA County an EMT-I is basically an EMT-B not to be confused with EMT-I's in other counties where most EMT-I procedures are ALS criteria in LA County) attends to the patient? While I and most of us will have no issues with it in LA County, what does the law say concerning such practice in Los Angeles County?

2. Do most EMS, Ambulance companies (911 and/or IFT/non-911) allow scanners in their ambulances? The current LA County law states:

7.16.100 Ambulance operator--Prohibited acts.

D. Use a scanner or radio monitoring device for the purposes of responding to an emergency call when not authorized or requested to respond to that call by the appropriate public safety agency​

If the operators of a 911-emergency ambulance have a scanner can they use the scanner as a supplement to the radio transmission of the city and/or fire department they are servicing? What are common laws and or rules regarding said practice with most, if not all, 911-emergency ambulance operators?
 
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Why would you have a scanner when you have a RADIO with your frequencies that you can respond in your district to? You already have the channels and you won't be hearing anything less, if not *more* on your radio then you would on a scanner...
 
Point Missed

If you would have read the thread carefully you would have noticed that I never mentioned "I" had one. The question is general knowledge regarding things that "Ricky Rescues" and/or "Timmy Traumas" usually carry onto the rig.
Other similar questions would be regarding: knifes, and/or other equipment not usually supplied by the employer and/or not clarified in local protocols.

Please read carefully before drawing judgement.
 
Please read my post too! How exactly would the scanner supplement you! While you are on duty, while you are working?! It won't!
 
elnemt said:
LACO_EMT-P_VECTORED.jpg


Regarding Los Angeles County EMS and its rules, codes, laws and regulations.

1. When both EMT's (EMT-I, EMT-P) are licensed ambulance drivers and transporting a patient BLS (non-emergency, non-ALS), can the Paramedic drive while the EMT-I (in LA County an EMT-I is basically an EMT-B not to be confused with EMT-I's in other counties where most EMT-I procedures are ALS criteria in LA County) attends to the patient? While I and most of us will have no issues with it in LA County, what does the law say concerning such practice in Los Angeles County?
Click to expand...
Actually, the "I" in EMT-I stands for the roman numeral 1 and is a state wide thing. County adherence to using EMT-I vs EMT-B in day to day operations varies, but the proper legal term for an EMT-B in California is "EMT-I." The EMT-Intermediate level in California is restricted to areas that can't provide paramedics and is known as an EMT-II (2).


2. Do most EMS, Ambulance companies (911 and/or IFT/non-911) allow scanners in their ambulances? The current LA County law states:

7.16.100 Ambulance operator--Prohibited acts.

D. Use a scanner or radio monitoring device for the purposes of responding to an emergency call when not authorized or requested to respond to that call by the appropriate public safety agency​

If the operators of a 911-emergency ambulance have a scanner can they use the scanner as a supplement to the radio transmission of the city and/or fire department they are servicing? What are common laws and or rules regarding said practice with most, if not all, 911-emergency ambulance operators?
Click to expand...

Why would you need a scanner when you have a radio? Also, even if the 911 ambulance can't specifically communicate with a central 911 dispatcher, the time saved 'predispatching' yourself would be minimal since most times the private company ambulance responds non-emergently while the fire department units respond emergently.
 
I can address the last question about scanners.

If you are Dispatch, you do not want your units self-dispatching or "getting the jump". What a dispatcher might want his units to have instead of a scanner is a GPS tracking device to see where they are and how fast they are going etc. Whether a company has a specific rule about scanners, there are only two basic uses for them: entertainment/morbid fascination, or freelancing/self-dispatch, including sort of moseying to where the action is so one could get the dispatch. Neither is something a company wants you doing on company time.

As to the LA County law, no idea; it would seem that if the P (as the clinical superior) decides the pt is not needing her/his special skills, then the P could drive.

Someone trying to settle a bar bet here or what?
 
True on the EMT-1,I,B vs EMT-II, however, the question wasn't semantics.

Both questions go unanswered.

"mycrofft" understood the question and answered it directly as being a question regarding "laws" and not whether or not it would be cool to carry a scanner while on duty as an EMT at any level in areas where radio communication has already been established and in good working order.

For those of us that are having a hard time dissecting the question, an employee (EMT-P) for a company "I" work for carry's a scanner with them at all times. What does any, if not all, company state as a rule, regulation, law, etc. regarding scanners in ambulances?

The law doesn't not say that it shouldn't be "heard" but should not be used as a tool to respond to emergencies that have not been dispatched to the unit in question.

As to the first question, What does county protocol or "law" say about having a Paramedic drive while the EMT-I, B attends to the patient on a BLS call/run in Los Angeles County?

Different scenarios may be:

1. ER Runs
2. IFT's
3. Discharges
4. 911 runs with local city/county Paramedic on board with patient.
And if so, what is your company's regulation/rules regarding said practice (if in fact performed)?


:deadhorse:
 
elnemt said:
LACO_EMT-P_VECTORED.jpg


Regarding Los Angeles County EMS and its rules, codes, laws and regulations.

1. When both EMT's (EMT-I, EMT-P) are licensed ambulance drivers and transporting a patient BLS (non-emergency, non-ALS), can the Paramedic drive while the EMT-I (in LA County an EMT-I is basically an EMT-B not to be confused with EMT-I's in other counties where most EMT-I procedures are ALS criteria in LA County) attends to the patient? While I and most of us will have no issues with it in LA County, what does the law say concerning such practice in Los Angeles County?

2. Do most EMS, Ambulance companies (911 and/or IFT/non-911) allow scanners in their ambulances? The current LA County law states:

7.16.100 Ambulance operator--Prohibited acts.

D. Use a scanner or radio monitoring device for the purposes of responding to an emergency call when not authorized or requested to respond to that call by the appropriate public safety agency​

If the operators of a 911-emergency ambulance have a scanner can they use the scanner as a supplement to the radio transmission of the city and/or fire department they are servicing? What are common laws and or rules regarding said practice with most, if not all, 911-emergency ambulance operators?
Click to expand...

Why do you have the paramedic seal if you just a basic?^_^
 
you can't respond unless requested by that agency. Even if you roll up on an accident you must still notify that city or county's 911 provider, I know LA County does not hand off any calls its part of there policy, but smaller departments like Compton, or Downey might let another ALS private company transport.
 
It got your attention didn't it? If you see my title is EMT-Basic. Not making myself out to be someone I'm not.
 
Just a thought...

have you gone to the Los Angeles County DHS website and looked up any of the rules you're asking about?

Seems like one could either get the accurate information straight from the source or rely on the opinions of folks in a web forum.
 
"Got our attention"? Our attention is easily "got" (:(>>

How does this all apply to education and training?As I always say, "cut to the chase" and follow John E's suggestion.
 
Reference No. 517:

Transport Modalities
B. ALS Transport​
  1. Unit is staffed with two paramedics unless the ambulance provider has
    been given approval by the EMS Agency to staff ALS IFT units with one
    paramedic and one EMT-I.

So... according to John Telmos @ L.A. County EMS Ambulance Licensing

Most ALS companies participating in this program (1 on 1 Staffing) have L.A. County approved training manuals. He also mentioned that while it isn't in the protocols, common sense would dictate that the medic should always be in the back in case the patient's VS deteriorate. He also mentioned that the jury will almost always side with the plaintiff.

So, I appologize for the run around and yes, I did look at the L.A. County EMS website and nothing concrete just the above reference.

If I can help anyone research this type of stuff i'll see what I can do that way you don't get a silver seal from someone that finds it amusing (but couldn't give the answer).

Thanks everyone!
 
Sacramento has a similar policy in place. While this county does have ALS permitted ambulances that are held to the same educational and staffing standards as the 911 system units, they do not want non-911 units responding to 911 system calls without prior authorization. That being said, if a non-system unit is flagged down or sees an emergency on their own, they're to report it and may provide full care, including transport, under the 911 system protocols... however, they're encouraged to wait for a system unit to arrive and turn-over care to the 911 unit, if the patient meets transfer of care criteria.

It's not illegal to have a scanner on-board, however, using it to "poach" system calls is very much against the rules and can result in loss of the operating permit. A company (that no longer operates here) began poaching calls when they first started operating here. They did the same in another county as well... in both cases, the 911 system quickly realized what they were up to and that company came VERY close to losing their operating permits in both counties.
 
I think it's a great policy too may Ricks out there, and the privates just really don't seem to know what their doing.
 
I get it now...

it's a game to see if folks are paying attention...

You need to dig a little deeper at the L.A. County EMS website.

Thanks for playing...
 
atropine said:
I think it's a great policy too may Ricks out there, and the privates just really don't seem to know what their doing.
Click to expand...

I would not trust most of the private folks in LA with my dog's life. However, I would say the same thing about the fire folks as well. It is just a terrible area.
 
What's so terrible about it?, yeah I guess its really bad if you want to make 100k plus a year.
 
atropine said:
What's so terrible about it?, yeah I guess its really bad if you want to make 100k plus a year.
Click to expand...

Terrible area for patient care. I do not care what the fire guys make, in fact, I heard a rumor that LA City Fire is laying off over 100 firefighters within the year.

Are you even a firefighter?
 
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