IN YOUR OWN WORDS: saline versus sterile water

Any situation involving elemental sodium, potassium, etc on the skin would be about the only ones I could think of.
 
LOL Riddle me this Batman....how the do bacteria get through a membrane that's not permeable to water molecules such as that in breast implants? Also, I'd like to see your source for that bit of information you're trying to pass along there about "toxic to the vascular system".
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Really good and valid point. You caused me to say Hmm. My only thought was (If claim is valid) that perhaps the bacterium were introduced into the saline during the manufacture of the implant. Considering extremophiles, and despite our best efforts to produce a microbial free prosthetic, there is always the possibility.

I have nothing to cite to support this, it was just a thought and one should always explore the implausible as it may be plausible.
 
usafmedic45 said:
Nothing. It's just regular old normal saline. It's just that it's not QCed to the same standards as the IV grade stuff.

You mean, 2.5 mg, right? ;)

BTW, in my experience diluting it is not a good way to give the medication in young kids. The pedi dose (for kids under 6-8 years) I've used most places is 1.25 mg of albuterol. That said, I've never seen a serious issue arise from giving a toddler or older child an adult dose.
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My mistake!!! Thanks for catching.
Sorry for hijacking, one more note: I agree, but can't justify carrying the separate dosage (my supplier doesn't carry it), and my state protocols calls for 2.5mg in 6. For BLS, state protocol also doesn't allow it to be given to kids under 6. All it's doing is diluting the med, so it's given over double the time.

Should the decreased QC standard translate into any change in practice? Should we not be using it for non-resp procedures?
 
the_negro_puppy said:
We draw up the 10ml ina 10ml syringe, then pushed through

we also mix 9ml of saline with 1ml of morphine to make 10mg in 10ml in the same syringes.

We carry Sodium Chloride 0.9% but we also caryy small quantities of "Water for injection" which is used to dissolve and mix certain drugs such a Ceftriaxone as they dont mix with NaCl.
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Interesting thanks for the reply! That seems like a lot of work compared to our (assuming these are used all over the US not positive) pre-filled 10ml flushes. Also from my experience of patients coming in (I am not a US paramedic maybe one can contribute) that those who get a IV also get a saline lock. The tubing as access points and we have cool little adapters that have a shot blunt needle on one side to draw stuff up and a plastic needle to access the port in the tubing.
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Nebulizer saline is plain, opthalmic has buffers etc.

And take it from me, don't use nasal saline as an eye flush...I did the little dance from point A to the sink with great vigor and language. Again, must have buffers and preservatives or something in there, but it stung.:o
 
Sterile waters tastes good on a hot day. Saline, not so much.
 
Sandog said:
Really good and valid point. You caused me to say Hmm. My only thought was (If claim is valid) that perhaps the bacterium were introduced into the saline during the manufacture of the implant. Considering extremophiles, and despite our best efforts to produce a microbial free prosthetic, there is always the possibility.

I have nothing to cite to support this, it was just a thought and one should always explore the implausible as it may be plausible.
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Actually implants are inflated with saline at the time of surgery. They come with a small amount of saline with an anti-microbial agent added from the factory. The inner most membrane also contains anti-microbial agents. The possibility of bacterium in FDA approved implants is virtually impossible. In addition, my wife has 780cc in each breast. The surgeon injected an additional 10% of anti-microbial in each breast to ensure no future infection.
 
780 is nucking futs, those things must be huge...
 
That's something around an F or G cup, depending upon the size of the torso involved. Either way....some big ol' titties.
 
Getting back on track here.....

Thank you for all the replies.

Even the jokes and the tangents.

From a BLS standpoint, ie, external use only, is there an instance you can think of where you would not use the saline or the plain water or is it that they can be both used but the saline is better ?

Why does the NYS DOH mandate both ?
 
From a BLS standpoint, ie, external use only, is there an instance you can think of where you would not use the saline or the plain water or is it that they can be both used but the saline is better ?
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Either or....for irrigation and wound cleaning (which you honestly shouldn't be doing in the field to begin with 99.99% of the time), it's the force of the flow that matters, not what you're using (so long as its clean).

Why does the NYS DOH mandate both ?
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To be difficult and to spark debates like this one. That or they are taking kickbacks and bribes from the sterile water manufacturers.
 
crazycajun said:
Actually implants are inflated with saline at the time of surgery. They come with a small amount of saline with an anti-microbial agent added from the factory. The inner most membrane also contains anti-microbial agents. The possibility of bacterium in FDA approved implants is virtually impossible. In addition, my wife has 780cc in each breast. The surgeon injected an additional 10% of anti-microbial in each breast to ensure no future infection.
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Really, so it is not even done in a factory clean room? This further supports my supposition that microbes are introduced at the beginning stage. And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?

And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and how she treats others.
 
Sandog said:
And for you and your wife, I am sure you are so proud, and good for you. I prefer a less superficial woman. Woman should know that there are men who love them for who they are and not what they look like. The true beauty of a woman is in her actions and how she treats others.
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I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.

What makes you think his wife isn't a great person? Why does she have to be superficial just because she has implants?

I don't see why you need to make a simple medical conversation into a personal attack.
 
And do you think that a anti-microbial is a 100% effective, it only takes a few to survive?
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You know...in the absence of a sustainable food supply and in a environment that's toxic.

I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.
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Agreed. She may have a medical reason for having them put in and decided to just go for that particular size to match her body type.
 
systemet said:
I just got to say, I think that's way out of line.

What makes you think his wife isn't a great person? Why does she have to be superficial just because she has implants?

I don't see why you need to make a simple medical conversation into a personal attack.
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I can appreciate that and I appreciate what you are saying. Perhaps I was over the line. I reacted to some of the proceeding comments and equated them to that particular post. You are correct, I was out of line and my apologies.
 
Likewise, I hope my earlier comments were not excessively crass. If so, my apologies are also hereby extended.
 
usafmedic45 said:
Likewise, I hope my earlier comments were not excessively crass. If so, my apologies are also hereby extended.
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Perfect example of the problem with forums. Somehow the context is often lost. If one cannot articulate themselves just quite right, perceptions are made as to the intent of the post that are often not the true and original intention of the post. At any rate, I meant no disrespect.

USAF, I was USN, as a fellow person who served, I extend a hand.
 
USAF, I was USN, as a fellow person who served, I extend a hand.
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Next time I find myself in San Diego (my fiancee's aunt lives there so we're trying to figure out how to get out there to visit soon), I'll do you one better. I'll extend you a beer or lunch if you're not 21 yet.
 
usafmedic45 said:
Next time I find myself in San Diego (my fiancee's aunt lives there so we're trying to figure out how to get out there to visit soon), I'll do you one better. I'll extend you a beer or lunch if you're not 21 yet.
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I work at a nice National Park here in SD, if you want to see some nice tide pools teaming with ocean life, I can help ya out. Also make sure you take your wife to http://www.sandiegorestaurants.com/keyword.cfm?keyword=bacci

Best Filet in San Diego. Be prepared to spend a few bucks though, but it is worth it. Oh sorry, I guess I went off topic... :P Bacci steak is to die for....

P.S. Been over 21 for quite some time. B)
 
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