EMS Carrying Firearms

[Veneficus]

While being armed is nothing to do with cops, in a very real sense, they do not show up to "save the day" except in some very unusual circumstances. A lot of times what they end up doing is taken report and file it, later the detective might follow up and do some additional investigation and perhaps the person responsible is arrested and brought into the justice system. Law enforcement in the United States is under no obligation to protect any one particular person, just society as a whole.

While I am not afraid of the Bogeyman, I know several people that have been actively targeted by persons who clearly do not have peaceful intentions in mind. These same several people live in my county. In particular, these folks were very obviously targets for robbery. How do I know? If you look at the behavior of the attacker, and their accomplices, it becomes very obvious that they weren't approaching another person for the purpose of saying hello, rather they were approaching from a very tactical standpoint, choosing their approach to their victim in such a way that their victim could be somewhat easily overpowered. Now these particular episodes did not make the news simply because of one of two things. One, the would-be victim was aware of the setup and was able to leave and in that instance was actively followed for short distance, before it became obvious that the would-be victim was heading to a place where more assistance was readily available. In a second instance, with a separate individual, three people approached him in an attempt to block him from escaping. The gentleman in question was going to be the victim position themselves in such a way that he had his back protected and could visualize the other three persons that were attempting to bracket him. In that instance, a few rather strong commands to back away and, very obviously getting ready to draw firearm and use it caused those three persons to rethink their plan. They beat a rather hasty retreat and left. Had it been a slow news night, and somebody had the video available of that event, that might have made the news. Because nobody got shot, the news was uninterested.

Now in case you are perhaps thinking that these folks were actively seeking out crime or were involved in a criminal element themselves, you would be sorely mistaken. Other than these incidents, neither these individuals have ever been involved in a criminal act by criminal elements, and the closest they ever got anything like that was seeing it on TV. Simply because there are 300 million of us in the country and there are perhaps a few thousand orders per year that are not guided by a criminal element upon criminal element. There are a lot more crimes involving use of force such as robbery and assault with a deadly weapon crimes the door are of people actually being killed as a result of crime. Most of the time, events like this do not result in anything other than the would-be victim turning the tables on their attacker and the attacker runs. And of course no one get shot because the incident didn't rise to that level where deadly force needed to be imminently used. Thankfully, the amount of violent crime in this country has decreased over the past couple of decades but it is still a concern and still prevalent enough to be a concern. Put another way, most of us will never be a victim of violent crime, most of us will never have to perform CPR or have a fire in our house that is in a place where it's not normally expected, like the fireplace or the kitchen stove. Yet we tell the general public that they should be CPR trained and that they should have a fire extinguisher in the house because of the what if that happens problem.

Simply because I am armed doesn't mean that I go out to places where I think problems might happen rather I go to those places where I normally do anyway, unarmed. My behavior, other than a heightened awareness, does not change.

I am generally not a big fan of these threads, simply because people are entrenched from both sides of the pro-gun/anti-gun argument begin to each attempt to convert the other to their side. I do not profess to know what is best for everyone, I however know what is best for me in my situation because I am in it. Because I do not profess to know what is best for everyone, the furthest I will go is to simply suggest that everyone look at their own situation, do their own research, and determine for themselves what is best.

I think the point and intention is somehow twisted.

I don't see anyone here who is suggesting an individual should not carry or be able to carry a weapon. I am certainly not suggesting that. I firmly support the individual right to carry a weapon. (i'll even help you pick one out and show you how to use it)

What I am suggesting is that in the course of their official duty, EMS providers should not be armed against a delusional threat under the same auspices as a person who is not officially responding. AKA somebody minding their own business as you describe in your post.

Like I said, if you want armed EMS providers, that is fine. But there needs to be specific laws, training, oversight, and rigorous selection of employees in place, which does not exist right now.

Right or wrong, there is going to be significant fallout if somebody gets shot or killed. Not least of which is making any EMS provider a target for retribution, similar to what police officers face. That will require a constant defensive awareness in every area of the country, exactly the same as a law enforcement officer. (Obviously there are too many consequences in addition to discuss here, this is only one example.)

But the overt fear mongering of certain aspects of US society coupled with volume of exposure EMS providers to violence and crime, in my trained observation imparts a delusional impression on the need for deadly force while performing EMS functions.

Again for emphasis, a private citizen carrying a weapon is fine. But once you become an "official" or act in official capaicty, it is too complex a situation to allow the tenents that apply to individuals to be the default governance.

 

[WhiskeySix5]

it was an old article (several years), I am trying to find it. for you.

Thank you sir

 

[WhiskeySix5]

I just wonder, how many on this thread are full of foo foo?

Hmmmm, I could not begin to speculate as I do not know anyone on here personally, but I know what I have done, and where I have been so I can only speak from my experiences.

 

[WhiskeySix5]

In general I do not think that EMS workers should be required to be armed because we should be seen by the public as being a neutral party. That means of course that ideally, EMS will not be seen as a threat, and therefore not come under attack simply because they happen to "be there".

Choosing to be armed, outside of the law enforcement community, or the military, is an intensely personal decision. When I choose to be armed in a given situation, I have weighed the consequences of being armed.

Well said.