AHA pushing for CPR in Middle School

[CMillican]

http://circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/reprint/CIR.0b013e31820b5328

I wish they did this when I was in school. I'm telling you we have a selfish sadistic society but it only takes one bystander that knows sufficient CPR to aide in transfer of care. But I talk to my 13 year old brother that's in 7th grade learning CPR in health but see's it as a joke. I mean I know he doesn't understand the magnitude of learning CPR at his age. I just presented this here because I need some help of really getting the message of how serious learning CPR is to him. I know that being an EMS professional it should be easy to do so, but when i try to present it from my angle it still doesnt quite get across to him

 

[usafmedic45]

I'm telling you we have a selfish sadistic society

...and nothing will ever change that. It's basic human nature to be selfish but it has been getting more pronounced the last 3 or 4 generations.

but it only takes one bystander that knows sufficient CPR to aide in transfer of care.

Very true.

But I talk to my 13 year old brother that's in 7th grade learning CPR in health but see's it as a joke.

Welcome to the attitude of 99.99% of kids.

I mean I know he doesn't understand the magnitude of learning CPR at his age.

Nah, he just doesn't see what is in it for him.

I know that being an EMS professional it should be easy to do so, but when i try to present it from my angle it still doesnt quite get across to him

It doesn't translate for him because you're no longer his peer. Then again- with you as my peer- I don't necessarily see eye-to-eye with you either. I'm very selective with when, where and how I get involved clinically while off duty. Unless I have a defib on scene (or will within 4 minutes), I see little point to doing CPR. It's a personal choice we all have to make and I make it based upon the clinical evidence. On a very related topic see:
http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=22108


For more on the reality of our role as off-duty EMS personnel and other related topics see:
"Help Me Fill My Personal Jump Kit" http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=18342
"Dozens Ignored a Man Dying on a Sidewalk in Queens, NY" http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=17911
"Why do YOU carry a personal jump/trauma bag?" http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=18192
"Off Duty EMT-Basic" http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=20282
"Trauma Bag Any Good" http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=21773

 

[bigbaldguy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gb7Nfra91fs

Relevant segment of an old show about a kid performing cpr on his teacher.

 

[Nimrod_BasketCase]

My sister is the same age as your brother she kinda knows CPR. When she was 10 we were bored and walked down to the fire department for a tour with her friends. We kinda knew CPR then, but they brought out the dummie showed us know to use a BVM and what they use them for, they showed us the AED and what different heart rates look like and stuff. It was pretty cool as soon as we got home we looked up the CPR guidelines and practiced on our big Mummble penguin. She though she was all cool when she went to school and her friends didn't know CPR and stuff and she did. I try and teach my younger siblings CPR.

 

[medicRob]

http://circ.ahajournals.org/cgi/reprint/CIR.0b013e31820b5328

I wish they did this when I was in school. I'm telling you we have a selfish sadistic society but it only takes one bystander that knows sufficient CPR to aide in transfer of care. But I talk to my 13 year old brother that's in 7th grade learning CPR in health but see's it as a joke. I mean I know he doesn't understand the magnitude of learning CPR at his age. I just presented this here because I need some help of really getting the message of how serious learning CPR is to him. I know that being an EMS professional it should be easy to do so, but when i try to present it from my angle it still doesnt quite get across to him

I think that being CPR certified should be a requirement for getting a drivers license in the US.

 

[akflightmedic]

I think that being CPR certified should be a requirement for getting a drivers license in the US.

Thanks Big Brother but no thanks...I have every right to choose not to learn and assist someone as much as everyone else has the right to learn how.

CPR has absolutely nothing to do with safe vehicle operations, there is no correlation; therefore, to mandate a class in order to obtain the driving privilege is utterly ridiculous.

 

[medicRob]

Thanks Big Brother but no thanks...I have every right to choose not to learn and assist someone as much as everyone else has the right to learn how.

CPR has absolutely nothing to do with safe vehicle operations, there is no correlation therefore to mandate a class in order to obtain the driving privilege is utterly ridiculous.

Who cares whether or not CPR has anything to do with safe vehicle operations? Millions of Americans have a drivers license, and making CPR a requirement for that license would result in millions more individuals knowing what to do in cardiac arrest. Moreover, organ donation has nothing to do with safe-vehicle operations, yet we have a check box for that right on the license..

 

[RGRTavs]

Who cares whether or not CPR has anything to do with safe vehicle operations? Millions of Americans have a drivers license, and making CPR a requirement for that license would result in millions more individuals knowing what to do in cardiac arrest. Moreover, organ donation has nothing to do with safe-vehicle operations, yet we have a check box for that right on the license..

No! just no!
This is wrong on so many levels. We're talking about peoples rights.
Why not go ahead and mandate military service for all medical professionals.
Please, just stop.:excl:

 

[medicRob]

No! just no!
This is wrong on so many levels. We're talking about peoples rights.
Why not go ahead and mandate military service for all medical professionals.
Please, just stop.:excl:

First and foremost, I will stop when I am good and ready. Moreover, I could care less about your Government control theories, etc... I simply do not care. I made a statement about something I would like to see happen, and if you don't like it then cry me a cup of tears, then go whine about it on one of the conspiracy theory forums about how your government is brainwashing its people, etc. News flash, they have been brain washing you for years, so what. It is not freedom to choose when someone else picks your options, either way I could care less. You aren't gonna change it, I am not gonna change it, so no point in whining.

I stated my feelings so I am done with this thread.

 

[akflightmedic]

Who cares whether or not CPR has anything to do with safe vehicle operations? Millions of Americans have a drivers license, and making CPR a requirement for that license would result in millions more individuals knowing what to do in cardiac arrest. Moreover, organ donation has nothing to do with safe-vehicle operations, yet we have a check box for that right on the license..

Organ donation has more in common with driving than CPR.

Since everyone is required to carry some form of ID and for the majority that ID happens to be a driver's license, then it makes every sense for the person to have ticked a organ donation box in the event of their demise.

Ticking a box cost me a nano-second and was free. It is also a statement not a course...

Has nothing to do with conspiracy theory, has everything to do with my own personal freedom. You might as well mandate all teachers take furniture repair courses before getting their license to teach...wait that makes sense cause it could be a budget saver.

 

[clibb]

Organ donation has more in common with driving than CPR.

Since everyone is required to carry some form of ID and for the majority that ID happens to be a driver's license, then it makes every sense for the person to have ticked a organ donation box in the event of their demise.

Ticking a box cost me a nano-second and was free. It is also a statement not a course...

Has nothing to do with conspiracy theory, has everything to do with my own personal freedom. You might as well mandate all teachers take furniture repair courses before getting their license to teach...wait that makes sense cause it could be a budget saver.

You're seriously comparing those two to CPR? As soon as someone doesn't like that the government is making them do something in this country they say "Oh my god, my freedom!" give me a break and quit acting like a child.

 

[Flight-LP]

No! just no!
This is wrong on so many levels. We're talking about peoples rights.
Why not go ahead and mandate military service for all medical professionals.
Please, just stop.:excl:

Why not make it mandatory for all? It may bring back a few fundementals principles this country was founded upon. JMHO. I think some discipline and organization would help this current generation (and future ones) understand their is more to society than just them.

Plus it would make most of them get haircuts! That damn Justin Beiber look has got to go!

But on this note, I think learning CPR during drivers Ed may not be a bad thing. It takes all of 2-3 hours to learn and the target audience are students. That's what they are there for, to learn. Hell, I say throw in 1st aid and make a day out of it. Not that big of a deal.

 

[usalsfyre]

Driving is NOT a right. It is a privilege that has been granted as long as you meet the requirements set forth by the regulating authority, I'm this case the state. Were it a right, they wouldn't be able to restrict your ability to drive, or require you to take classes to do so. (which is why I have such an issue with gun "control").

Making CPR mandatory to gain a driver's license infringes in no rights, it's simply another component of the administrative rules governing such. Just like requiring driver's ed. No one is requiring you to perform it (which would be infringement), just that you know it in the hope that you will use it if needed. If your going to speak about rights, please understand what is and isn't a right. Our right's are too valuable to misinterpret that way.

Edited to add:I'm very much in favor of requiring a current CPR card to obtain or renew a driver's license.

 

[CAOX3]

Driving is NOT a right. It is a privilege that has been granted as long as you meet the requirements set forth by the regulating authority, I'm this case the state. Were it a right, they wouldn't be able to restrict your ability to drive, or require you to take classes to do so. (which is why I have such an issue with gun "control").

Making CPR mandatory to gain a driver's license infringes in no rights, it's simply another component of the administrative rules governing such. Just like requiring driver's ed. No one is requiring you to perform it (which would be infringement), just that you know it in the hope that you will use it if needed. If your going to speak about rights, please understand what is and isn't a right. Our right's are too valuable to misinterpret that way.

Edited to add:I'm very much in favor of requiring a current CPR card to obtain or renew a driver's license.

Well said!

 

[akflightmedic]

I am pretty sure I spoke of it as a privilege.

I am also pretty sure the Beiber look has got to go.

Re: Clibb

First, I never say god anything as I have no god. I am also a liberal with some conservative tendencies as there is no black or white on every single policy and labels just do not work for very stance. Having said that I am vehemently opposed to a government trying to force a class for a privilege which have no relation.

Yes I used a far reaching example, the same as Rob did, only mine had more cost saving measures over long term and would probably be far more useful as it would reduce some expenses and lessen the tax burden as well.

I am glad you think I am acting like a child for expressing my opinion. Good to know rationalization is still frowned upon by the majority of Americans.

Flight LP: Yep the Beiber has got to go! Along with skinny jeans please...especially on males!

Other than that, I do not think our generation, the one just previous, present or up and coming is all that bad. We all have societal issues, every country does and every generation says the same rhetoric over and over. But in a nutshell, we are doing ok...

I cringe when I hear fundamental principles this country was founded on because it is usually followed with religious intonations which are entirely inaccurate but we can save that for another thread. The principles were freedom...yet ironically it is ok to take that away and support it with the founding fathers principles??? Me be confuzzled!!

However, should such an atrocity ever take place and CPR class be mandated with license issuance or renewal, I will capitalize on it and make a fortune!

 

[usafmedic45]

Millions of Americans have a drivers license, and making CPR a requirement for that license would result in millions more individuals knowing what to do in cardiac arrest.

...and maybe 1-5% of them actually doing something about it. Not to mention the costs associated with it.

No! just no!
This is wrong on so many levels. We're talking about peoples rights.
Why not go ahead and mandate military service for all medical professionals.
Please, just stop.

A bit much don't you think? "Just remember, the nails go through your wrists and not the palms of your hands as commonly portrayed in paintings."

 

[usafmedic45]

Why not make it mandatory for all? It may bring back a few fundementals principles this country was founded upon. JMHO. I think some discipline and organization would help this current generation (and future ones) understand their is more to society than just them.

...or you're giving the selfish little gangbangers the chance to learn military tactics from something other than Call of Duty. I don't believe- as a veteran- that simply being in the military or even serving in combat is the cure for the deeply engrained selfishness that permeates this society. In many ways, it only makes it worse because then these little :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored:s have something more to crow about when it comes to getting what they are "owed" from the rest of society.

 

[medicRob]

...and maybe 1-5% of them actually doing something about it. Not to mention the costs associated with it. "

I'll accept that point. Then again, whether or not they use it strictly a call that is up to them. I don't expect someone to just perform mouth to mouth on anyone.. However, compressions only CPR is more readily accepted. This is true that many who have CPR training will not stand out, but I think it is worth it for those 1% - 5% more people who will actually do something about it. After all, when talking about a population of milions, 1% and 5% represent thousands of people.

 

[usafmedic45]

Then again, whether or not they use it strictly a call that is up to them. I don't expect someone to just perform mouth to mouth on anyone.. However, compressions only CPR is more readily accepted.

OK. So you're willing to spend millions, potentially billions on something that is not all that useful?

After all, when talking about a population of milions, 1% and 5% represent thousands of people.

Actually it's between 3 and 9 million people. However, let's look at the numbers that actually matter: the survival rate to discharge from cardiac arrest. I'll even give you the benefit of going with the higher end of the average (8%). The best estimate for sudden cardiac death out of hospital in the US is somewhere in the neighborhood of 300,000. Using some very basic (and admittedly oversimplified) regression, under your plan you're willing to inconvenience and add an additional expense to the roughly 200 million drivers in the US- along with the increased costs of government record keeping, enforcement and recourse when people don't comply- to maybe bump the survival rate a fraction of a percent of 24,000 or so cases a year.

It's a nice idea, but it's not economically or practically feasible.

 

[akflightmedic]

"Just remember, the nails go through your wrists and not the palms of your hands as commonly portrayed in paintings."

And the fact that hands were commonly stretched over the head, not out to the side...but it evokes more emotion when it is out to the side a'la cross fashion and gives millions upon millions yet another false image to play with. Who cares about historical accuracy, it is all about the image baby!