Volunteering

[Lucy212]

Hello,

I am interested in volunteering with an agency out in Brooklyn. However, they are not on the 911 system, which is okay of course but if their services are needed the public is advised to call directly to the office itself. I'm a bit confused as to why it works that way. It seems to me that they would only be used for transportation purposes. Am I wrong?

I know about the agency because a fellow EMT friend of mine is also on the crew, but she's currently out of town and I can't ask her the question today. Figured I hopefully would get the possible answer from one of you on this forum.

Thanks,

~ Lucy

 

[firecoins]

Volunteer agencies in NYC are not in the 911 system. I have never volunteered in NYC but from what I understand, they buff calls and stand by at events. Sometimes FDNY EMS dispatch call them up for "mutual aid" due to high call volume in their area.

 

[Lucy212]

Firecoins,

Thanks for the quick reply. I wasn't aware that all volunteer agencies are not on the 911 system. Shows how tiny my mind is...

~ Lucy

 

[firecoins]

Firecoins,

Thanks for the quick reply. I wasn't aware that all volunteer agencies are not on the 911 system. Shows how tiny my mind is...

~ Lucy

well just those in NYC. Doesn;t mean they do not do 911 jobs. Many do as mutual aid.

 

[Foxbat]

they buff calls

Like, show up to FDNY EMS's calls without being dispatched? Wow.

 

[firecoins]

Like, show up to FDNY EMS's calls without being dispatched? Wow.

considering they aren't dispatched by FDNY, because the unions won't allow them in the system, yes. Politics is a nasty thing.

Many of these volunteer corps were created when NYC was bankrupt in the 1970s and there were long response times. NY is cutting positions now for the same budget like problems. VACs will pick up the extra slack for some of the calls.

 

[Foxbat]

considering they aren't dispatched by FDNY, because the unions won't allow them in the system, yes. Politics is a nasty thing.

Do FDNY EMTs get upset about these services buffing their calls, or are they OK with that?

 

[firecoins]

Do FDNY EMTs get upset about these services buffing their calls, or are they OK with that?

Generally they are okay with that because they are busy. Any chance they can get a break, they take it. Alot of the paid units from FDNY and hospitals are guilty of buffing calls so there is blame all around on that part.

It was found some FDNY units were notifying volunteer units of calls so they themselves didn't have to take it. There is a thread somewhere on the forum about that.

 

[46Young]

Hello,

I am interested in volunteering with an agency out in Brooklyn. However, they are not on the 911 system, which is okay of course but if their services are needed the public is advised to call directly to the office itself. I'm a bit confused as to why it works that way. It seems to me that they would only be used for transportation purposes. Am I wrong?

I know about the agency because a fellow EMT friend of mine is also on the crew, but she's currently out of town and I can't ask her the question today. Figured I hopefully would get the possible answer from one of you on this forum.

Thanks,

~ Lucy

I rode at a vollie house at Middle Village for a brief time back in the day, and I also interacted w/ many different vollies when I was working in the NYC 911 system. The vollies were only allowed to buff street jobs. This was because they could be flagged down if they passed an MVA on the street or something. Otherwise, they were only allowed to respond if they were called directly by someone rather than call 911. They were never authorized to buff a job at someone's house, but they do it all the time.

When I used to work 46 Eddie, the Forest Hills vollies would listen to the radio, and try to beat us to the job. It was funny when they would be outside the address, and not know which apartment to go to (because they had no business going there in the first place), since the specific apartment number wasn't given over the air, only the KDT. They rushed all the way over there, risking an accident, just to wait there, and then follow us upstairs and still try to assume pt care. We were against this for several reasons: First, they had no authorization to buff these jobs in the first place. It's just that no one made any real issue of it, although we could have. Second, it took away jobs from us. We liked working, and the vollies were taking away pt contacts from us. Some liked the vollies stealing jobs, since they were lazy and could remain available. Last, it was stealing revenue from our hospital. We had the right to run these jobs, and also to bill for it. They didn't.

The vollie system in NYC basically works by them trying to beat the professional units to the jobs. Otherwise, they would only respond to private calls, just like a private interfacility business.

 

[46Young]

Volunteer agencies in NYC are not in the 911 system. I have never volunteered in NYC but from what I understand, they buff calls and stand by at events. Sometimes FDNY EMS dispatch call them up for "mutual aid" due to high call volume in their area.

Correct. I know that the Corona VAC would handle Mets games at Shea.

 

[46Young]

Like, show up to FDNY EMS's calls without being dispatched? Wow.

I was okay with it at first, then two things happened. First, someone pointed out that for every time the took a txp away from us, they also took revenue away from us, which affected our agency's bottom line. This is important when you do this for a living, and are dependent upon your employer for salary and benefits. Second, they picked and choosed what jobs to go on. Fair enough, until one vollie crew buffed our CVA job, and then advised us that we had pt care when we arrived two minutes later. For every job buffed by vollies, we still had to look in and make sure they could handle the call before we advised that the vollies assumed pt care, and where they were transporting to. Why did they pass back pt care? The pt was covered in urine and feces, which was also all over the floor. They took one look and then passed the scene back to us. There were several similar situations like this that turned me against these particular vollies. I liked Corona, Glen Oaks, Queens Village, and that was about it.

 

[46Young]

considering they aren't dispatched by FDNY, because the unions won't allow them in the system, yes. Politics is a nasty thing.

Many of these volunteer corps were created when NYC was bankrupt in the 1970s and there were long response times. NY is cutting positions now for the same budget like problems. VACs will pick up the extra slack for some of the calls.

I don't know if it was a union thing. North Shore LIJ, Transcare, NY Presbyterian, and AMR are all non-union voluntary NYC 911 EMS providers. That's well over half the voluntary units, especially with the union SVCMC units gone.

 

[46Young]

Generally they are okay with that because they are busy. Any chance they can get a break, they take it. Alot of the paid units from FDNY and hospitals are guilty of buffing calls so there is blame all around on that part.

It was found some FDNY units were notifying volunteer units of calls so they themselves didn't have to take it. There is a thread somewhere on the forum about that.

The thing about professional units buffing jobs is that we were legitimately in the system, and would give an ETA. I would typically say, for example: I don't know where 46 X-Ray is coming from, but we're 2-3 from the job. 46X would give their ETA. If it was greater than ours, then they would defer to us. Around 2005-2006, IIRC, we went to the AVL. There were penalties for falsifying an ETA just to get the job. If you think about it, since we were all using the AVL, it was the closest unit to the job. We were "currented" by police atom (district), so it wasn't an exact science. If you're in a ghetto or otherwise densely polulated area, the police atom could be just a few blocks. In a wealthy area, it could be much larger. Giving an ETA to a job was legitimate, since it was aiding the AVL system. That's why there were penalties for giving false ETA's. By the same token, we were required to be within three blocks of our 89 (cross street location), and could be penalized for roaming. We did it all the time anyway. We would buff the PD frequency, and start rolling toward the job before our dispatch gave it out, so we would be the most recommended.

 

[Lucy212]

46 Young,

It almost sounds as though most if not all vollies are terrible people. I don't want to be viewed that way. I understand the part where they would try to beat the pros to a call or stay longer at the call, and I don't deny that it's not cool - but I also feel the need to say deep down ( this is my ignorantly happy to be a volly voice now ) those EMTs and Medics became vollies because they were willing to help people and learn something in the first place.

However, I appreciate your reply and never knew that some vollies did any of those things.

~ Lucy

 

[firecoins]

46 Young,

It almost sounds as though most if not all vollies are terrible people. I don't want to be viewed that way. I understand the part where they would try to beat the pros to a call or stay longer at the call, and I don't deny that it's not cool - but I also feel the need to say deep down ( this is my ignorantly happy to be a volly voice now ) those EMTs and Medics became vollies because they were willing to help people and learn something in the first place.

However, I appreciate your reply and never knew that some vollies did any of those things.

~ Lucy

your a terrible person. B)

 

[46Young]

46 Young,

It almost sounds as though most if not all vollies are terrible people. I don't want to be viewed that way. I understand the part where they would try to beat the pros to a call or stay longer at the call, and I don't deny that it's not cool - but I also feel the need to say deep down ( this is my ignorantly happy to be a volly voice now ) those EMTs and Medics became vollies because they were willing to help people and learn something in the first place.

However, I appreciate your reply and never knew that some vollies did any of those things.

~ Lucy

It's not that most vollies are terrible people. That wasn't the message I was trying to get across. To use the fire/EMS service as an example, there are some vollie depts that take their role dead serious, and there are others that are little more than social clubs. Some volunteers are very professional, and then there are others that pick and choose their calls, costantly create conflict w/ others, and make the whole thing very political. I treat each person and each organization on a case by case basis.

What I was speaking about in the earlier post was my position from the paid side. Loss of revenue from EMS txp that is rightfully ours can result in several things: reduced opportunities for OT due to budget constraints, loss/reduced pay raises and COLA's, reduced deployment and staffing that makes everyone busier (and have to turf jobs on the interfacility side, compounding the problem), reduced fringe benefits such as tuition reimbursement, increased medical premiums, less paid time off, possible layoffs, etc. If the reduced revenue affects my livelihood, then that's a real problem. Take food off my table and there's gonna be beef between us (pardon the pun). Remember that the NYC EMS volunteer agencies are not authorized to buff these jobs. If they were, it would be a different story altogether. Just for comparison's sake, in the county that I work for, the vollies put out buses and run EMS transports. Quite a few even ride with us on our medic units as a third person. They have every right to, and no one here, including myself, has a problem with it. Here, the volunteers own a number of firehouses, pay bills there, and also purchase the apparatus for their stations, which are career staffed 24/7/365. Their EMS revenue helps out both sides. In NYC, those txp funds don't make their way back into the system.

 

[46Young]

your a terrible person. B)

I guess I'm going to Hell in a handbasket.

No tangents on religion, please.