Ride-Alongs

rescuepoppy

Forum Lieutenant
236
2
18
Like I said if all else fails, then people have to be moved around. If thats not possible, than it's simply not possible. I cannot, and will not leave crew members on scene. whether a student, volunteer, observer, or another paid medic. Irregardless of the pt. wishes. If it is simply impossible to move a crew member to the front of the truck, or out of view of the pt. The pt. will just have to deal with it. I am not going to put someone out on the side of the road.
So Firemedic what you are saying is that if for some reason the patient has a problem with either of these people being in the ambulance with them the only recourse is to sign off AMA? A patient can refuse any part of our treatment which could be to refuse to have extra people in the back with them. They can even refuse to be treated by one medic or another if they so choose. I for one would not want to have to submit a refusal form that states that my patient decided to forgo transport that may have been needed because I did not want to arrange transportation for my ride-along. It may be a hassle to have somebody come out and pick the rider up but it sure does beat what the alternative could be.
 

Sasha

Forum Chief
7,667
11
0
Who said the volunteer was a third wheel?

There you go making an assumption.
Then what, may I ask, are they used for? Do you need a volunteer, a student, and you all in the back to treat your patients?
 

HotelCo

Forum Deputy Chief
2,198
4
38
I'm still trying to figure out what you would do on a truck, as a pre-student. Just sit there and watch? Seems like you'd just be taking up space.
 

Mountain Res-Q

Forum Deputy Chief
1,757
0
0
SEE, OP...

This is why the seach feature is great. Instead of creating a new "Ride Along" arguement (although this one is very interesting since IMHO a 5 man Ambulance makes so much sense :rolleyes:) you could have just relived one of a several equally as entertaining arguments, none of which alswers your question... which, again, is just contact you local Ambulance / EMS agency and see if it is allowed and what is required...

Now back to this wonderful tango... ^_^
 

firemedic7982

Forum Lieutenant
120
0
0
Then what, may I ask, are they used for? Do you need a volunteer, a student, and you all in the back to treat your patients?
The volunteers are just as qualified to be on the truck as me, you, or any other cert toting medic.

Just because they are a volunteer doesnt mean they are any less qualified. There are a lot of career medics who started out as volunteers, there are many medics who have retired, and chose to continue to volunteer their time. Moreover there are many agencies that are wholly volunteer.

To presume that a volunteer is useless, and a third wheel is presumptuous, and rude. Maybe a little condescending as well.

Once again I grow increasingly tired of entertaining your assenine comments, and your presumtuous attitude. Unless you have something valid to say, or constructive I am done with you and your continually ignorant comments that seem to bash everyone who is not a paid medic.

Remember you were once a student, and Im sure would have not enjoyed the time if the crews had the same rotten attitudes about students and volunteers as you seem to have. I sincerly hope that you do not treat students and volunteers with the same disgruntled, and tasteless attitude as you have in this post. That my dear would be a black eye on the EMS profession, and public safety indeed.

Allow me to reiterate, unless you have something constructive to say I am done. This has clearly become an opportunity for you to berate services that don't follow the same doctrine as you do. I wish you the best of luck in your endevours.
 

firemedic7982

Forum Lieutenant
120
0
0
I'm still trying to figure out what you would do on a truck, as a pre-student. Just sit there and watch? Seems like you'd just be taking up space.
The concept is a little different I will agree.

We dont have observers all that often. Maybe once every couple of months. Usually it is a family member of an employee, or someone who is cosidereing a career in EMS.

The thought behind it is to give them an idea of what 911 EMS is, what we do, and how we do it. They are paired with a crew of more experience, usually one if not both of the crew members are FTO's, and they are only on the truck for 12 hours which is half of the shift. If it is a family member of an employee, they are not permitted to ride with their family member, that is not the idea of the program. The idea is to give the individual an abstract idea of what a career in EMS is all about.

Something similar to the explorer posts throughout the country, or LEO ride-alongs. Same concept.
 

A140160

Forum Probie
14
0
0
The volunteers are just as qualified to be on the truck as me, you, or any other cert toting medic.

Just because they are a volunteer doesnt mean they are any less qualified. There are a lot of career medics who started out as volunteers, there are many medics who have retired, and chose to continue to volunteer their time. Moreover there are many agencies that are wholly volunteer.

To presume that a volunteer is useless, and a third wheel is presumptuous, and rude. Maybe a little condescending as well.

Once again I grow increasingly tired of entertaining your assenine comments, and your presumtuous attitude. Unless you have something valid to say, or constructive I am done with you and your continually ignorant comments that seem to bash everyone who is not a paid medic.

Remember you were once a student, and Im sure would have not enjoyed the time if the crews had the same rotten attitudes about students and volunteers as you seem to have. I sincerly hope that you do not treat students and volunteers with the same disgruntled, and tasteless attitude as you have in this post. That my dear would be a black eye on the EMS profession, and public safety indeed.

Allow me to reiterate, unless you have something constructive to say I am done. This has clearly become an opportunity for you to berate services that don't follow the same doctrine as you do. I wish you the best of luck in your endevours.
Thanks for that. I happen to know several volunteer EMT-B's that I would trust with my own life more than some paid Medics! What you must understand is most volunteers do it for their whole life, and probably have a family tradition of doing this. Their experience can sometimes be a better tool then a memory from school.

As for ride alongs. I approve of ride alongs, but in limitation. Students can ride with whenever as far as I see it, but only 1 at a time. No more than 3 on a rig, including driver. We usually pick someone up at the scene too, seeing as almost every FF is also an EMT here, and EVERYONE shows up to the scene. Usually FF can get there first and will have started care, transfer to us, and the FF that was doing the medical care will just hop aboard.
 

Sasha

Forum Chief
7,667
11
0
The volunteers are just as qualified to be on the truck as me, you, or any other cert toting medic.

Just because they are a volunteer doesnt mean they are any less qualified. There are a lot of career medics who started out as volunteers, there are many medics who have retired, and chose to continue to volunteer their time. Moreover there are many agencies that are wholly volunteer.

To presume that a volunteer is useless, and a third wheel is presumptuous, and rude. Maybe a little condescending as well.

Once again I grow increasingly tired of entertaining your assenine comments, and your presumtuous attitude. Unless you have something valid to say, or constructive I am done with you and your continually ignorant comments that seem to bash everyone who is not a paid medic.

Remember you were once a student, and Im sure would have not enjoyed the time if the crews had the same rotten attitudes about students and volunteers as you seem to have. I sincerly hope that you do not treat students and volunteers with the same disgruntled, and tasteless attitude as you have in this post. That my dear would be a black eye on the EMS profession, and public safety indeed.

Allow me to reiterate, unless you have something constructive to say I am done. This has clearly become an opportunity for you to berate services that don't follow the same doctrine as you do. I wish you the best of luck in your endevours.
You totally missed the question. it doesnt mater if they are volunteer or paid, why do you need a third or fourth person? do you really need that many people in the back? had you ounce considered that your patient might not want five people back there with them? i have no problem with students but if the patient is uncomfortable... they ride in the front. its not about you or the student or a volunteer or paid third crew member. its about the patient and their comfort. there will be other patients if that specific one do$snt want to be observed.
 

Linuss

Forum Chief
8,264
32
48
Wow medic, calm a bit down.


I see where Sasha is coming from and agree for the most part. Boxes are not big, and you as a medic should know that there never is enough room to move back there when family is present.


5 providers is excessive, unless it's a code and every single one is working it.


I'm willing to bet no observer can legally do any pt care aside from CPR if qualified, correct? Are they cleared for HIPAA? CPR/First aid / AED? Any advanced care?




Calm down and take a breather.
 
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firemedic7982

Forum Lieutenant
120
0
0
I never argued that point. The whole point I made was on the RARE occasion I have that many people on the truck, it is completely out of my control.

If there are that many people on the truck, I may not have any place to put the people.

I havent really ever come across a situation where my pt. was absolutely against people in the truck with them. I have had a few that were a little apprehensive. But after explaining to them that they were here to learn, and that if they were not comfortable with a student treating them, than I would do all of the care, and there wouldnt be a problem. I tend to have an excellent bedside manner, and it just hasnt really ever been an issue.
 

nightstar22

Forum Crew Member
40
0
6
well i do not know about baltimore.. but here in tennessee, i went on ride alongs and then decided to go to emt classes... just call up the ambulance/fire services in your area. (even if they are private services) and ask them if you can do a ride along.. most places will be more than happy to let you!!! good luck!!
 

bmennig

Forum Crew Member
42
0
0
I was a ride along, I got the attitude of disgruntled medics. It definately made me mad, but found the experience wonderful. I defiantely learned more doing it that just reading it in text. There is no way you can take an EMT class and tell if you like it without going out and doing it. As I have been told around here where I live, take the EMT, pass it, then throw the book out and learn how to really do it. I find that practical experience will make you a better provider. I take 2 people in the back on a regular basis. We only get about 400 calls a year so every call counts to teach the newbies.
 

Flight-LP

Forum Deputy Chief
1,547
16
38
Ignorance is such a blinding path.......................

Folks, the agency you are ridiculing has been a professional model for EMS for the greater part of 20 years as is historically known as one the nations best EMS services. As a former In-charge Paramedic and Clinical Educator for this agency in question, I can attest without a shadow of a doubt that the open acceptance of volunteers and students strongly helped the agency get where it is today. I started with this particular agency in 1997 as a volunteer (yes, I'll admit it!) and owe a great deal of my current career to them. It was not uncommon for me to have a 4 person crew (I guess people do actually like me). It was never a question of need as I am more than capable of running an MICU unit with my EMT or medic partner, or even alone as I have had to do for the last year. Having additional trained resources on the truck is unmeasureable. Believe it or not there are some agencies that have a variety of luxuries. This one is one of them. Top rated equipment, autonomous advanced protocols, one hell of a medical director who routinely responds with the crews and is available to all medics when needed, nice stations; the list goes on and on. The trucks are some of the best built in the industry and have some of the latest safety features available. The volunteers enjoy being a part of these luxuries. And there is more to come..................

I precepted hundreds of students while I was there, usually with a volunteer third person. I never ONCE had a complaint from a patient or a request for their removal. In fact, most voiced additional appreciation to the dedication for them and their community. I know this appears to be a 180 from my usual view of volunteers (specifically the half a$$ed belief that 2 volunteer EMT-B's remotely qualifies as EMS), I attest that it is not, yet a heartfelt appreciation for those who do continue to assist their local community. I emphasize the assist part as these folks augment the on duty crews in the community, instead of being completely relied as many disgruntled communities current contend with.

Despite not being a part of this exciting team anymore, I am excited for their future. This is an agency that is on the cutting edge of EMS and pre-hospital research. Unless you have walked a mile in their shoes, please keep your ignorance to yourself...............

A.J., your good people and Sasha, you know I luv ya, but I really never expected to see either of your names attached to some of the responses in this thread. You both are better than that...........................
 

paramedic_23

Forum Ride Along
1
0
0
I see nothing wrong with a civilian ride-along program. I am the head of our civilian ride-along program, and we have several "guidelines" that must be in place before a civilian can do a ride-a-long shift.
- HIPAA Training.
- Infection Control Training
- Liability Waver
- Safety Class concerning the ambulances, distress procedures, fire extinguishers, etc.

(About 10 hours total.....usually knocks out the "I wanna hear a siren people right there.)


The civilians are clearly identified as an observer and are NOT allowed to particpate in ANY aspect of patient care, regardless of their background.

I totally disagree with the "wait til you start class to ride". We used to have that policy, and our department was paying out boo coo bucks (we pay for our members training) for people who "thought they were interested" to take the EMT class, only to make their first run, drop out of the class because it "just wasn't for them". I'd rather someone who is interested in EMS decide prior to cutting a $1,000 check to the training program!

If the rider presents a safety issue, then the police would be the ones who would return them to the station!
 

Seaglass

Lesser Ambulance Ape
973
0
0
I did my ridealong as a EMT-B student with a fire crew, and rotated between the engine and the truck. Before I got on, the chief sat down with me and went over what I was certified to do (a bunch of really random stuff), and what my class had already thoroughly covered. No patients complained about me, and the crew was very nice.

It seems to me like ridealongs are important. I remember one kid in my class decided she wasn't so interested after all during a pretty gory one. But I could also understand being a patient and being uncomfortable and embarrassed, especially if an observer was tactless.
 

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