NREMT-P Expired

[Phillyrube]

First time in 36 years, I am no longer NRP. Retired from EMS in 2017, freshly certified as NRP. 32 years ALS, 3 years ALS in Virginia before that, and 1 year EMT-A from the Navy. Why did I keep it so long?

Always thought (and hoped) NREMT would become a clearinghouse through which I could certify, and then get a job anywheres in the US. Not to be. Tried several times, and each time the hoops I had to jump through were insurmountable. Virginia used the NREMT paramedic exam for testing, and once you passed, you were given reciprocity in Virginia. There was no incentive to keep NREMT, especially with the 2 year requirement. Virginia paramedic is 3 years. I thought keeping the 2 year cert showed a higher level of commitment. So through the latter part of a 20 year Navy career, I kept up National.

Got hired as a police officer in Virginia, and stayed running as a volunteer on the box. Picked up two associates in emergency management and EMS, plus started going to nurse school part time (get hurt on the job, you need a fallback). Lots of great medical knowledge, which I used in the PD, getting stuff done like AEDs, CPR in service training, getting better equipment for patrol officers, tactical medical training, and TCCC. I carried ALS gear in the cop car, and we saved a few lives with bystander CPR and advanced airway care. Got me promoted through the ranks.

Retired from law enforcement in 2013, and went to work doing critical care transports, and ED work at a local trauma center. Community medicine, home visits, taking out sutures. What a blast. Started some hospital emergency management, dealing with hazmat patients, and succeeded in getting a bus converted to a MCI rig.

Daughter moved from Virginia to Florida in 2016, taking our only grandson, so the cards were dealt. 2017 I recertified everything, all my instructor certs, National Registry, and moved to Florida. Once here, found out I could get reciprocity as a Florida paramedic, but then the requirements got to be too much. Having to do clinical rotations, ride times. Hate to say it, but nurses, RPTs, RTs, RPhs, all don't have these hoops to jump through. You know what? I'm 65, time to retire, so.......

I am just disappointed that NREMT never reached the status I hoped it would. We've seen the debates about it. Should a degree be required for paramedic? I don't feel it's necessary. Many many firefighters in Virginia test out as EMT Intermediates. Fastest way to get bodies out of the classroom and into the box. Once there, the path to NRP should be a career step, and warrant extra pay and responsibility. THEN, get the degree. Tired of the cold and wanting to pump your own gas in New Jersey? Get National Registry and move to warmer climes.

Thought about going back to nursing school for a year finishing clinicals, and working. WHAT? 12 hour days, on your feet, doing paperwork? I salute you, guys and gals. Not for me now.

So what will National Registry do for you? If we want to be recognized in the same breath as nurses, etc, we need to standardize training and testing. Put a degree requirement in place, as the other allied health professionals have. I'll sit back and watch the fireworks here, while enjoying the Florida sun.

Stay safe, everyone. Don't get hurt, don't break anything!!!

 

[planetmike]

Virginia closed out new Intermediates about a year ago. Current Intermediates can recertify as long as they keep up with the CE. But if you miss that deadline by a day, bam! you're an Advanced.

 

[StCEMT]

I would assume the process is the same as it was a few years ago, any words of wisdom on the VA to FL process? Currently a medic in VA looking to move to FL in the near future and it's getting close to the time where I need to start looking into the reciprocity process before long.

 

[Carlos Danger]

Congrats on your retirement. Here's to having more time to live your life the way you want to live it.

I could not agree more with your comments regarding the NREMT. At several points in my twenty-year EMS career, I was forced to let my NREMT lapse because I happened to briefly not be working as a paramedic when my NREMT recert month rolled around, meaning I had to start from scratch and take a 40-hour refresher and sit for the exam 3 times during my career. The last time it happened I was in CRNA school, literally taking graduate courses in physiology and pharmacology and practicing resuscitation and airway management all day every day at a very high level, and again they would not let me renew because I was not in a paramedic role. If i had some super-part time position working one shift every other month for a podunk EMS service that uses antiquated protocols and hardly runs any calls and never does any real education, I could have recerted my NREMT easily. But because I was in a clinical graduate program that was too rigorous to allow me the time to do anything else, I was not allowed to recert. Add that to the other hoops that one has to jump through to work in different states that don't give reciprocity automatically, and it was the last straw….I won't redo my NRP testing for a 4th time, meaning I'm unfortunately done with EMS.

 

[hometownmedic5]

It’s odd how things change from year to year. I got my Florida medic on a lark in 16 or 17. All I had to do was show them my national and take their written, which I was able to do at a CBT center in Massachusetts. A shot while later, my Florida license showed up in my mail box. No real hoops to jump through whatsoever.

I think I’m going to let that one go this year. The stack of unneeded cards is getting to be a bit much.

 

[Phillyrube]

It’s odd how things change from year to year. I got my Florida medic on a lark in 16 or 17. All I had to do was show them my national and take their written, which I was able to do at a CBT center in Massachusetts. A shot while later, my Florida license showed up in my mail box. No real hoops to jump through whatsoever.

I think I’m going to let that one go this year. The stack of unneeded cards is getting to be a bit much.

Agree, thats about all I had to do. It was the requirements that the private companies put on. Now, I agree that I can't just hop on the box, but the hour requirements, preceptor time, was a bit much. You don't see that in other health fields.

 

[Alan L Serve]

What other health care field requires one to be employed by an EMS agency in order to be licensed in that state? Surely this is not the case in every state but being that it exists at all only serves to indicate how poorly viewed EMS is.

 

[mgr22]

My situation is closest to Remi's, although not exactly the same. I was NREMT-certified for 20 years, then had to give it up because I was no longer employed by an EMS agency. I'd gotten hurt in the field and couldn't ride anymore, but retained my state medic license and continued to work independently on EMS-related projects. I had contacted the NREMT about options, but never got a reply.

I have mixed feelings about the outcome. I suppose the NREMT has a right to decide how inclusive they're going to be. On the other hand, if EMS does become less of a trade and more of a profession, it's likely there will be a greater number of state-licensed individuals who are not necessarily active as clinicians -- e.g., they may be full-time teachers, writers, researchers. Would it be a bad thing for the NREMT to find a way to certify such people, perhaps with a different set of criteria? Or maybe those of us in that situation have even less use for the NREMT than they have for us.

 

[DrParasite]

What does NR certification gain you? When I was in NY, they gave a higher wage for NR certification.... but that's about it. Outside of that, no one really cares

I got my NR in 2014, as I was leaving NJ and planning a move to NC, after being certified since 1999. I figured it would make the transition a little easier....

It didn't. I still have to fill out paperwork with NC, and they accepted my NJ EMT, my NR EMT and my NJ EMD with equal validity. I've kept it up since then, but my FD doesn't care, my county EMS system doesn't care (although I need to deal with them for my reciprocity, which can be annoying), so I really question why I keep doing it. The only saving grace is my county runs their own con ed program (different than the state), and they have chosen to follow NR standards for both medics and emts, so it's pretty easy to maintain both, and I have always said its easier to keep a certification than to try to get it again.

What other health care field requires one to be employed by an EMS agency in order to be licensed in that state? Surely this is not the case in every state but being that it exists at all only serves to indicate how poorly viewed EMS is.

What are you talking about? There is no requirement to be employed by an EMS agency in order to be license. You also don't need to be active as a provide to renew, as per NR https://www.nremt.org/rwd/public/document/paramedic-recert You just renew as inactive, which shouldn't matter since you aren't working as a provider anyway.... once you want to go back to active, you just need a medical director to sign off on your competency (since you are working under their license anyway). not really that hard

However, requiring a training officer (or any type of person in authority) to sign off on a certification renewal isn't necessarily a bad thing; with the amount of low quality continuing education that exists, simply filling out paperwork to renew (without any validation at the local level) places a huge burden on the state to validate, or else you end up with rampant fraudulent certification applications. In theory, having the local level at least perform a cursory verification to make sure the requirements were met means the state office doesn't have to do it.

oh, and @Phillyrube , Florida seems to be one of the hardest states to get reciprocity in. NR helps, but you still need to jump through hoops. Doesn't help that they have a glutton of newly graduated paramedics, who are paying their own way through fire school, hoping to get hired by a fire department.....

I've contacted NR a few times when I had issues.... always got a reply. sometimes the email didn't get a response, but they always answered the phone.

BTW, NREMT is a great initial testing, as it ensures that every new provider has the same baseline knowledge. As a continuing cert, with it's 2 year cycle, it's value to the industry decreases drastically.

 

[mgr22]

What does NR certification gain you? When I was in NY, they gave a higher wage for NR certification.... but that's about it. Outside of that, no one really cares

NREMT certification is required in many states. And being NREMT-certified often makes it easier to relocate and get a new license -- like when I moved to TN from NY. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who cares about such things.

 

[DrParasite]

As I mentioned previously, NR can make it easier when you change states, or if you are planning to move. But keeping it after your initial certification? Which states require you to maintain your NREMT? The only one I am familiar with is Delaware. What others do you know of? After all, even the NR website says "The National Registry of EMTs is an independent, not-for-profit organization. National EMS Certification is not a license to practice, but it the process utilized to validate competent practice by EMS professionals. "

and NY didn't require NR back in 2001 when I first got it... has anything changed?

 

[mgr22]

As I mentioned previously, NR can make it easier when you change states, or if you are planning to move. But keeping it after your initial certification? Which states require you to maintain your NREMT? The only one I am familiar with is Delaware. What others do you know of? After all, even the NR website says "The National Registry of EMTs is an independent, not-for-profit organization. National EMS Certification is not a license to practice, but it the process utilized to validate competent practice by EMS professionals. "

and NY didn't require NR back in 2001 when I first got it... has anything changed?

Here are a couple of links that'll help answer your questions:

State EMS Agency Map +

The National Registry of EMTs is an independent, not-for-profit organization. National EMS Certification is not a license to practice, but it the process utilized to validate competent practice by EMS professionals. For information about licensure, contact the Office of EMS in the state you...

www.nremt.org

That first one is an interactive map of the U.S. from the NREMT. You'll find a number of states that require ongoing certification.

State Department: Connecticut

Geographically and culturally, it’s where New England meets Manhattan.

www.emsworld.com

The second is one of a series of articles EMS World is running under the heading, "State Department." A different state is profiled each month.

 

[johnrsemt]

When I lived and worked in Indiana, and was looking to move back towards Utah to be closer to family and I was applying to companies and departments all over the West, I was doing phone interviews and a few of them were sending paperwork into their State EMS offices for me due to my NREMT certification. I never even had to send them a copy.
So when I was hired by the Federal Government as a medic (which I had to have NR-EMT within a year, which I already had so it was easy) I was also certified as a medic in: Nevada, Wyoming, Arizona, New Mexico, Montano, Idaho, Texas, Oregon, Colorado (none of which charged me anything) and Indiana.
In fact I was certified in every state I applied except the one that I ended up working in: working for the feds, I don't have to certified for the state that we work in, even to transport off the base to civilian hospitals (which helps since our base doesn't have a hospital).
Interesting thing is 2 of the states keep recertifying me and sending me new paperwork ever 2 to 4 years even though I don't work there and never have. They don't charge me for it.
After working for the feds for 8 years, I finally got certified in the state I work in, so that I could work PT in that state and the next state for a small town that straddles the 2 borders, and we transport to both states: closest hospitals are 110-130 miles away.

So NR-EMT is not always a bad thing to keep up.

 

[DrParasite]

Here are a couple of links that'll help answer your questions:

State EMS Agency Map +

The National Registry of EMTs is an independent, not-for-profit organization. National EMS Certification is not a license to practice, but it the process utilized to validate competent practice by EMS professionals. For information about licensure, contact the Office of EMS in the state you...

www.nremt.org

That first one is an interactive map of the U.S. from the NREMT.

That didn't answer my question at all..... all it did was list what states use NREMT for their initial certification. And it's the exact same same link that I listed, that you quoted above..... So you really didn't support your point of view.....

You'll find a number of states that require ongoing certification.

aside from Delaware, which ones? Yes, it's used as the entry level standard among many states, but the mythical "number of states" you claim that require the ongoing certification is no where to be found

State Department: Connecticut

Geographically and culturally, it’s where New England meets Manhattan.

www.emsworld.com

The second is one of a series of articles EMS World is running under the heading, "State Department." A different state is profiled each month.

Well, i'm not going to do your HW for you, however since you brought up Ct, I can tell you with 100% certainty that EMTs do not need to get NR to maintain their credential. Want to know how I know? It's on their FAQ Website which states:

Are currently certified providers (EMR, EMT) who do not hold NREMT certification required to become nationally certified?

No. Currently Connecticut certified EMR and EMT personnel may choose to continue as state certified providers only, however they must utilize the new system of education to maintain certification (see NCCP below).

In fact, Ct requires NRP at sometimes in your career, usually at the beginning; as long as you had your NRP at one point, and maintained a current state credential, you don't need to maintain it to remain a paramedic in Ct.

So like I said before, there is very little value in maintaining your NR certification if you no intention of working in another state. And the only state that currently requires you to maintain your NREMT credential is Delaware, so if you don't live or work in that state, it isn't required and likely won't benefit you at all.

But if anyone can list what states require you to maintain your NR credential as a condition of having a valid credential in that state, I will gladly revise my statement.

 

[mgr22]

DrParasite, no need to thank me. You're welcome...for the two links I sent you. I was trying to help you answer some of those questions you asked about states. Let me double check...yup, there they are in your 11:21 AM post.

I'm well aware of Connecticut's rules because I interviewed their EMS director before I wrote that piece. If I were trying to prove a point, I wouldn't have sent you a link to that article. I probably would have highlighted the Alabama piece instead, because Alabama does require ongoing NREMT certification. I was just trying to acquaint you with that EMS World content. I thought you might be interested, given all those questions you were asking. Sorry.

If you'd like to find other examples, besides Delaware and Alabama, of states with ongoing NREMT certification requirements, go back to that map -- you know, the one with the "mythical states" that are "no where to be found" -- and click on New Hampshire, or maybe Vermont, or perhaps Massachusetts, or even South Carolina. There are probably others.

I appreciate your offer to revise your statement, but I think it means a lot just the way it is.

 

[DrParasite]

I'm well aware of Connecticut's rules because I interviewed their EMS director before I wrote that piece. If I were trying to prove a point, I wouldn't have sent you a link to that article.

so you gave bad information.... and thought you wouldn't get caught on your BS.... guess you failed on that one.

Oh wait, you wrote that piece? So you have all the information all in one location.... don't you have a spreadsheet with all the information? one would think you could just list every state that requires NREMT to maintain your credential...... and no, I'm not going to go state by state, it's not worth my time, especially when you already have the information and just don't want to share.

I probably would have highlighted the Alabama piece instead, because Alabama does require ongoing NREMT certification. I was just trying to acquaint you with that EMS World content. I thought you might be interested, given all those questions you were asking. Sorry.

that would have been more useful..... if you had done it earlier.... but alas, swing and a miss....

If you'd like to find other examples, besides Delaware and Alabama, of states with ongoing NREMT certification requirements, go back to that map -- you know, the one with the "mythical states" that are "no where to be found" -- and click on New Hampshire, or maybe Vermont, or perhaps Massachusetts, or even South Carolina. There are probably others.

yeah, so you're at 6 out of 50..... or 12%.... not even a quarter...... however.....

I appreciate your offer to revise your statement, but I think it means a lot just the way it is.

You have given me more information, so I think I need to revise it.... if you are in a state that requires you to maintain your NR credential, than it makes sense to keep it up. If you're in the 88% of the entire United States that doesn't, than it doesn't matter. That number might wiggle a bit if more states require it, but I doubt it will change much.

 

[mgr22]

"...you already have the information and just don't want to share."

DrParasite, how about you PM me your name? You already have mine.

 

[Gurby]

 

[Alan L Serve]

What are you talking about? There is no requirement to be employed by an EMS agency in order to be license.

My very dear yet underinformed friend,
There exist at least two states,
Perchance more,
Which have policies and laws which are elderly,
And preclude any EMT from being licensed,
Unless affiliated with an agency.

 

[hometownmedic5]

My very dear yet underinformed friend,
There exist at least two states,
Perchance more,
Which have policies and laws which are elderly,
And preclude any EMT from being licensed,
Unless affiliated with an agency.

You are correct, but your writing style makes me want to burn down an orphanage.