Mountain Rescue

[WarDance]

Medically speaking, yep, dead or stable by the time you get to them, for the most part. Our team is more minimalistic in our gear and we travel light when it comes to medical gear. Find em, get em warm, bandage up any wounds, and get em out... there is little you can do for them in the middle of nowhere. Most only carry a ziplock sized bag of medical gear. I carry a little more, but when you are searching for hours and days in crappy terrain, you learn to leave the O2, splints, and BP Cuff in the truck. If it is a pure rescue (know where they are now get to them) we try to use helo, horses, or OHV to get to them and get em out, but humping it in is often the only way... expect to carry tech packs, medical packs, and a litter (w/ a patient) in addition to your 40+ lbs of gear. GOT TA LOVE IT!

Do you guys use a RIT team in search situations? We carry a "hasty med" during the search but once the patient is found the RIT team responds and brings us more medical gear.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Do you guys use a RIT team in search situations? We carry a "hasty med" during the search but once the patient is found the RIT team responds and brings us more medical gear.

By RIT, I assume you mean "Rapid Intervention Team". That is a term I haven't heard used outside of Fire in California. On a search we utalize Hasty Teams; basicly the first 3-4 team members to show up on a call get sent out to the scene first and utalize sign cutting and other clue awareness techniques. On a pure medical deal (we know where they are now we need to get to them) it really depends. Yes, we would like to send in an EMT or Medic ASAP, but what if this is a high angle rope rescue gig, and the best ones suited to get down there are just First Aid? They get tdown there first and then we well send in an EMT/Medic if available. Typically, though, I prefer to have the first person/people sent is to be EMT or higher and for search teams we try to have at least one MFR/EMT/Medic per team, but when 1/2 our team is First Aid only and you are never sure who will be available to respond... you work with what you got. I respond to 80% of all calls myself, so if it is medical in nature, I prefer to go in since I am the only team member whose skills (even as a lowely EMT) I am 100% confident. We only have 2 Paramedics and 1 Doc on the Team, so they may not be available, otherwise I would send them in. Generally speaking though, our people have become used to going light; the less we carry on a call, the faster we move and the more energetic we are. Most personal medical packs consist of a few gloves, bandages, gauze, and maybe a sam splint. If more is needed then, yes, another team, carrying basicly just the requested medical/tech gear will move in next... or we will get a helo to short haul it in... or we will use what gear we have and set up an LZ (if possible) for an air Ambulance w/ a completly geared MICN and MICP.

 

[Summit]

Mtn Res Q should write a novel... I can't read all that!

Do you guys use a RIT team in search situations? We carry a "hasty med" during the search but once the patient is found the RIT team responds and brings us more medical gear.

We do that... of course we share training and, over time, personnel.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Mtn Res Q should write a novel... I can't read all that!

:blush: Ya, I've been accused of that from time to time. I actually wrote a couple teenage novels when I was younger just for fun... I also tend to ramble alot. But on the bright side, my skills come in handy when writing PCRs and when I was elected to rewrite our teams training manual. :blush:

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

I thought some of you in SAR / Mountain Rescue might appreciate this...

Our Monthly Team Meeting was last night. 1 hour refreasher on UTMs followed by the business meeting. As always, some interesting stuff was discussed, recent misssions, trainings, etc...

We got ourselves a new vehicle. Currently we have 4 vehciles:

SAR 1, a 2000ish 2 person utility that carries 90% of our tech/medical gear.
SAR 3, a 1970's ford pickup that has been rotting on its rims since I joined.
SAR 4, a 1970's For Ceturian 350 that can make 50mph if we get out and push, but it seats 9
SAR 5, a big old mack truck that the team modified to orinigally carry the mine rescue gear. It barely runs.

Basiclly, we are the bast*rd stepchildren of County Emergency Services and never get anything new or good. Last night we show up and there is a Black and White Ford Expedition in the Bay. Turns out that our Sheriff is getting a couple more Expeditions for the Patrol boys and they were gonna get rid of what is a perfectly good SUV (minus it's electircal fire last year). It is completely decked out (more so that what we usually get) with red/blue lights, siren, 4WD, gun rack, and a cage in the back for the criminals. Ya, you heard me... gun rack for the shotgun and cage! What's more, we are not allowed to remove any of that or repaint it white so that isn't a b&w. Why? Becasue even though they were gonna get rid of it, when they realized that the unit would still be used within the SO, they decided that it we could add a few extra SAR decals and insignia to the car and house it at the Cache, but if Patrol needed it in winter, then they could steal it back. So, we have gotten rid of SAR 3, stocked the new boy with ropes, tech gear, and medical gear... but were given several warnings;

1. You are driving a b&w w/ a big ol' SHERIFF decal on the sider. You are a target for thugs and those that would wave you down. Which means that we must stop for virtually ever fender bender, when we would have normally radioed (assuming it was non-injury) it in and continued to our call.
2. If you are a passenger in the back, you will be behind a glass cage and the dorrs won't open from the inside!
3. MY FAV: While there is a shot gun mount inide the cab, they took out all LE equipment, so we have to bring our own shotguns now! j/k

But, at least we got a new vehicel that runs!

 

[LucidResq]

I thought some of you in SAR / Mountain Rescue might appreciate this...

Our Monthly Team Meeting was last night. 1 hour refreasher on UTMs followed by the business meeting. As always, some interesting stuff was discussed, recent misssions, trainings, etc...

We got ourselves a new vehicle. Currently we have 4 vehciles:

SAR 1, a 2000ish 2 person utility that carries 90% of our tech/medical gear.
SAR 3, a 1970's ford pickup that has been rotting on its rims since I joined.
SAR 4, a 1970's For Ceturian 350 that can make 50mph if we get out and push, but it seats 9
SAR 5, a big old mack truck that the team modified to orinigally carry the mine rescue gear. It barely runs.

Basiclly, we are the bast*rd stepchildren of County Emergency Services and never get anything new or good. Last night we show up and there is a Black and White Ford Expedition in the Bay. Turns out that our Sheriff is getting a couple more Expeditions for the Patrol boys and they were gonna get rid of what is a perfectly good SUV (minus it's electircal fire last year). It is completely decked out (more so that what we usually get) with red/blue lights, siren, 4WD, gun rack, and a cage in the back for the criminals. Ya, you heard me... gun rack for the shotgun and cage! What's more, we are not allowed to remove any of that or repaint it white so that isn't a b&w. Why? Becasue even though they were gonna get rid of it, when they realized that the unit would still be used within the SO, they decided that it we could add a few extra SAR decals and insignia to the car and house it at the Cache, but if Patrol needed it in winter, then they could steal it back. So, we have gotten rid of SAR 3, stocked the new boy with ropes, tech gear, and medical gear... but were given several warnings;

1. You are driving a b&w w/ a big ol' SHERIFF decal on the sider. You are a target for thugs and those that would wave you down. Which means that we must stop for virtually ever fender bender, when we would have normally radioed (assuming it was non-injury) it in and continued to our call.
2. If you are a passenger in the back, you will be behind a glass cage and the dorrs won't open from the inside!
3. MY FAV: While there is a shot gun mount inide the cab, they took out all LE equipment, so we have to bring our own shotguns now! j/k

But, at least we got a new vehicel that runs!

Wow! I'm jealous. Hmmm.....

Basiclly, we are the bast*rd stepchildren of County Emergency Services and never get anything new or good.

Sounds strangely familiar. I'm often tempted to strike. Let's see how they handle all the SAR calls, evidence searches, crime scene securities, trainings, event "presence" and traffic direction, etc without us. I'd like to see them dig up the funds, and then manage getting enough personnel trained and available. SAR is Sheriff's legal responsibility, after all.

It's interesting. Some SAR teams out here are absolutely pampered by their SOs... constantly getting new equipment and $. Others get jack. Like mine.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Wow! I'm jealous. Hmmm.....

Sounds strangely familiar. I'm often tempted to strike. Let's see how they handle all the SAR calls, evidence searches, crime scene securities, trainings, event "presence" and traffic direction, etc without us. I'd like to see them dig up the funds, and then manage getting enough personnel trained and available. SAR is Sheriff's legal responsibility, after all.

It's interesting. Some SAR teams out here are absolutely pampered by their SOs... constantly getting new equipment and $. Others get jack. Like mine.

Don't be too jealous. It's the first "nice" thing we have gotten in forever. Let's put it this way... Our yearly budget is $12,000 if we are lucky. Most of that goes to "rebuilding" the drysuits, new ropes, new tech gear, new jackets, etc... Whatever is left over we get to "play" with... you know, unimportant things like snowshoes, flashlights, helmets... Ya, I too would like to see what they would do if we striked. But, then again, we don't do it for teh pay or the recognition... there is none... But I would like to see a bigger budget so that we can be kept as well equiped as our $500,000 a year volunteer fire department. Until that day "never comes", we got a new SUV. YA!!!

 

[James 61]

Mountain Res-Q,

I was quite impressed with the way you answered the OPs questions. I seriously doubt I could have done that well and I've field several questions on another forum I belong too.

I started in SAR at the beginning of 2004 so I'm going into my 6th year. We have a small handfull of peole who have been at it for longer than me but most of our team is fairly new. You sure nailed it on the head about being a thankless and tough job/hobby. Usually the families of the missing person(s) are very appreciative but the public as a whole doesn't appreciate what we do. Additionally we get a lot of disrespect from the fire community. Retention is tough for us also. Our manpower numbers have been dwindling for the last couple of years but we have gotten some new members recently. One of them is extremely on fire so we appointed him to the board and put him in charge of recruitment and fundraising. He has been doing a great job.

Somebody brought up missions in which the subject cannot be located. I can't remember the number of searches I've been on over the years but I'm afraid to say a half of the missions we have been on have not been sucessful. Either we cannot find the subject or the subject passed on. I clearly remember the missions that resulted in a recouvery. I've been lucky in that all the searches I have been on involving children have been successful and we have returned them to their families alive. I also will never forget my first rescue. It was all I talked about for three days. It is a feeling that will never leave you. Knowing that you reached into the jaws of death and snatched a life from back makes all worth it.

I hear you about outdated gear. We are a independent and non-profit so all of our funding comes from donations and fundraising. We bring in about $10k a year and most of it is spent on maintance and operations of vehicles. We also have a building and vehicle bay.
Our mechanized gear consists of
42 - a 1983 4wd suburban. It is main rig and carries all the medical and rope gear plus our personnal gear
52 - a vietnam era 2 1/2 ton truck that carries our sno-cat and tows trailers.
54- a 60s vintage sno-cat. It has been modified with a completely enclossed box that can carry 8 rescues plus a driver and asst and gear, a two axis plow blade and has a can tow a sled
We also recently sold a 1976(?) motorhome that was our comms/command/rehab vehicle and bought a 1996 mid length school bus that is currently being heavily modified to become our new base vehicle.
We have a rescue sled designed to be towed behind a snowmobile and one snowmobile. Several people on the team have their own snowmobiles.
We also have a 10k military surplus generator on a trailer and recently put together a second trailer with two 5k generators a light tower and a repeater. This trailer is also being fitted with skis so it can be towed up to a mountain top in the winter and set up.

Just on a side note. A couple of years ago several team members sudied for and got their amateur radio licenses. We currently have 9 operators with a mixture of Tech and General licenses. We also invested in 5 dual band amateur radios. The added capability has been really helpful. I know some other teams in our area have done this also but I was wondering if anybody outside our area has goten into this.

 

[LucidResq]

Just on a side note. A couple of years ago several team members sudied for and got their amateur radio licenses. We currently have 9 operators with a mixture of Tech and General licenses. We also invested in 5 dual band amateur radios. The added capability has been really helpful. I know some other teams in our area have done this also but I was wondering if anybody outside our area has goten into this.

Our team has our own FCC license, and we are licensed or permitted to talk on several different area public safety channels, including sheriff, fire and some police. There are 2 (maybe 3? but only 2 are in regular use) channels that almost every team in the state use, primarily for big missions with multiple agencies/teams working together. We have quite a few (15+) VHF and digital radios, some donated, some purchased. Members must go through our own day-long communications class and pass a test before they are allowed on the radio.

Oh, and when I was Lt., I was issued a take-home motorola 800 mhz radio. I miss it

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Our team has our own FCC license, and we are licensed or permitted to talk on several different area public safety channels, including sheriff, fire and some police. There are 2 (maybe 3? but only 2 are in regular use) channels that almost every team in the state use, primarily for big missions with multiple agencies/teams working together. We have quite a few (15+) VHF and digital radios, some donated, some purchased. Members must go through our own day-long communications class and pass a test before they are allowed on the radio.

Oh, and when I was Lt., I was issued a take-home motorola 800 mhz radio. I miss it

We run things a littel different in that regard. OUr county has a post WW2 Radio Team that was set up with the thought of providing radio comms in teh event of a huge disaster. They are still around and still have all their towers, members, and gear, but just aren't needed much anymore. But they are there and have access to all the channels we use. our radios have way too much in them. Our primary 40ish channels allow us to communicated with everyone in the county on numerous command, operations, and tactical channels, including the Sheriffs Office (us), CalFire, County Fire, the PD, Forest Service, Yosemite NP, and the Hospital. If we need to then we also have access to thousands of other channels if we work on mutual aid in another area. Our county SO just updated the entire comms network (including new towers, dispatch, and radios) and we requested 30 brand new $1,500 potables! And we got them. A few of the team members have their own radios (like me) but we primarily rely on those real expensive ten-billion channel ones.

 

[LucidResq]

And we got them.

Hate you. We have gotten more stuff from random private ambulance companies and fire depts than our SO.

 

[James 61]

I guess I should have clarified. We also have a FCC license and VHF radios programmed with State SAR, our own team freq, Fire Comm etc... The problem is, with the exception of the one radio programmed with a neighboring counties freqs, everything we have access to is line of sight. (Oddly enough we have more lattitude in the use neighboring county's radio system than we do on the freqs in our own county.)

Where the amateur radios come in handy is we can talk to a team member back in town and tap out additional resources, clarify resources need etc... We are can also provide a comms resource for the community in the event of a natural disaster. In light of what happened in the aftermath of Katrina and how useful it had been it seamed like a worth while investment.

Case in point. I was working a PR event up on the southernside of Mt St Helens in the Smith Creek area and was able to talk to a fellow team member all the way down in Vancouver WA. About 35 miles away. I was using a 5 watt handheld, bounched the signal through a dual band radio configured for cross band repeat, that was then sent to a conventional repeater and then the signal was received by the receiving radio. Not bad considering the signal started with a little handheld.

Well enough about that. Each team needs to decide what works for them I was just tossing it out there for consideration.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Hate you. We have gotten more stuff from random private ambulance companies and fire depts than our SO.

Sometimes we get lucky. This only happened becasue someone screwed up. In the process of the SO updating the entire radio system from low band to vhf they also decided to change out all the radios in the vehicles (including ous) and then replacing the old patrol King potables that barely work with new Kenwood $1,500 beauties. Last year when the guy running this "little" upgrade was ordering new radios he walked into the SAR Coordinators Office (who was out on medical) and asked his temp replacement is SAR wanted any radios. "Sure," he says skeptically, since we always want new things but rarely get anything. "How Many?" He pulls an unrealistic number out of his a**, "30." "Excellant. I am already getting 30 for patrol, so I will just double the order." Now the deputy laughed it off as a "yah right, we will see those radios when pigs fly." 10 months latter, as the progect nears completion, the regualr coordinator (who has no idea 30 new ones were requested) goes to the radio folks and requests that when the old patrol Kings to augment our stash of 12 old Kenwoods. The radio folks are confused as to why we would want these junkers when we have new ones on teh way. Tuns out that all our 30 new radios were sitting in box waiting for the new radio network to go on line, along wiht a huge stash of chest harnesses, lapel mics, helmet mikes for ATV/Snowmo, and more battery packs than we need. We have so many radios that the plan is to keep most of them in boxes until the old ones crap out. So, ya... hate me. On the other hand, we are unlikely to get anything new or cool for a good long time...

 

[KiloSierra]

I'm not sure what exactly you are looking for, but I'll give you some more information specific to my team:

In order to be on our team you must meet these basic requirements: U.S. resident, county citizen, in good physical shape for what you plan on taking part in (no testing and "good" is subjective - we had a 300+ pound 5'8" guy who wa an expert in Horses and ATV's, but was... well, fat.), Basic First Aid/CPR, Low Angle Rope Rescue, ICS 100/200, and a clean NCIC background check. That may seem pretty basic, but since our team members all specialize in differnet areas, thats all we require for all people. Example: The year I joined, two others joined with me: One was a 55yo former rock climber with no background in rescue, but within that first year he took a ton of classes and certified as a Rope Rescue Technician and a Swiftwater Rescue Technician and was elected training officer for 2 years. The other was a 35yo soccer mom whose only asset was that she was a horseback rider and had her own horse. She is awesome and trained/volunteers for anything; ropes, helo, logistics. Of corse we love when team members join with massive amounts of ropes, water, medical, helo, search, dive, etc... training/certification, but the biggest assest any volunteer can have is the desire to volunteer and help. We have taken 18yo out of high school with no training and turned them into expert team leaders. However, all newbies are on probation for one year and can be canned at any time (they must also meet certain mission/training hour requirements that first year). I joined the team with just those basic requirements and my EMT (+ 4 years experience in EMS) and within the last ~4 years have trained and certified in Swiftwater Rescue, Search Management, ATV Rescue, Helos, Canines, and am now a Team Leader.

Now, our team is divided up into 10 sub-specialty-teams: Search, Technical (Ropes), Swiftwater/Flood, Dive, Nordic (Winter), OHV (ATV & Snowmobiles), Mounted, Air Ops, Medical, and Canine. All team members are required to be a member of at least 2 (Search and one other). If you meet that teams qualifications, then you can respond as a member of that team. For instance, I am a member of the Medical, Swiftwater, Canine, OHV, Technical, and Search, and am a support member for Air Opsl. I have little intereest in Horses, Dive, and Nordic. That said, when the pager goes off, no matter what the call, we all respond. It it is a Ropes call, and you are not on the Ropes Team, all that means is that we will not put you into the hot/warm zones. You will assist in the cold zone in some fashion. Since this thread comes from the Medical Srandpoint: In order to be on my Medical Team you have to have MFR or Higher (MFR, OEC, WFR, EMTB, WEMT, EMTP, RN, or MD). But if you are not a part of the ropes team, air ops, mounted, OHV, nordic, you are walking your a** into the patient. (I prefer the helo or ATV, myslef). We are BLS equiped only, but as said before have barrowed ALS supplies/people from ER/Ambulance if need be. We use any means to get to our goal asap. The basic run down on how we are dipatched is as follows:

911 gets called by either the victim or family/friends. Call gets turfed to the Sheriffs Office (who once again is responsible for all SAR in the county). The dispatcher takes all the info they can and calls the Deputy Liaision. These are paid SAR trained Deputies that rotate on-call weeks. Whatever deputy is on that week takes the call and determines if it is a SAR call. This is because many calls should either be fire dept calls, or can be handled by other (quicker) means than paging out the team. For instance: If we get a cell phone call form the vic who broke a leg in the middle of the wilderness and we know right where he is, we can call the Air Ambulacne, who can be on scen in 30 minutes wiht a MICP and MICN. Other times the call is handled by the deputy faster than mobilizing the team, or orest Serivice drives out to them, or it isn;t really an emergency that we can do anything for (well supplied, healthy group "stranded" on the otherside of a creek that will receed in 24 hours). If the deputy recognizes this as a SAR team call, he tells dispatch to page us. We all carry alpha-numeric pagers. Pages read: "All SAR memebrs (or a specific team) respond to the cache (or other place) for __________." We usually respond to the SAR Cahce, where we store the team gear/vehicles, get briefed, and respond according to the IC's commands. Now, this isn't always the case, which is why the deputies exist to detemine what course of action to take. Two completely different examples:

2 girls go over a waterfall about 1 hour from the closest town/ambulance. This is an emergenct rescue call. I just happened to be 25 minutes away and responded Code 2.5 in my POV becasue going to the Cache would have taken an extra hour. I (along with 2 other team members) get on scene 1.5 hours before the rest of Swiftwater Team can. We rescued one girl; the otehr died about 3 minutes before the 911 call went out. Had I been in town, I would have gone to the cache, preped the vehciles, and waited for a few others to show before we responded. FYI, a helo, the SAR Swiftwater Unit, 2 SAR trucks, 2 deputies, Forest Service, and 1 Fire Unit all responded, but we were the only ones equiped to perform Swiftwater Rescue.

60 year old female outdoor enthusiast walks away from camp to go meditate. BERKLEY LIBERAL! Seriously, the camp was run by UC Berkley. She fails to show for dinner, so at 2000 hours, the camp calls the SO. Hypotheticly, the deputy could have paged the team, and by the time we mobilized and got on scne it would have been midnight or latter (perhaps as late as 0200 hours). The area is not extreme, 4000 elevation, summer cool weather, she is an experiened adult outdoors person, no medical known medical issues, etc... Searching at night in teh conditions that area was in would have been futile, exhausting for the team who would have had to do it all nigh and day. The page went out to mobilize teh following morning at the Cache at 0600. We all got sleep, we had the time to secure additional resources (Mutual Aid Team, outside ATV's, outside dogs, and a helo), the team got briefed properly, we formulated a plan, and conducted a great search that resulted in a rescue.

The big thing you have to realize is that we are all volunteers who love what we do and cannot be experts in everything. We all have our own talents. Any prior training, certification, and experience you have is desirable. But every team has it's own requirements based on their area. i.e our neighbor to the south, Yosemite SAR requires all team members to be certified in Swiftwater and High Angle Ropes.

I know I ramble, but does any of that help? If not, keep asking for more specifics. B)

Thank you! Its so few and far between to find a real and effective response!

 

[yowzer]

Thank you! Its so few and far between to find a real and effective response!

You know you're replying to a 5 year old thread, right? :unsure: