Help finding station pants.

[NWemsgeek]

I recently got on to a volunteer department in a rural area and we have to provide our own pants. I was told they have to be the Workrite nomex pants. The ones I have found are over $100. Does anyone know of any places that sell used ones?

 

[Bullets]

I recently got on to a volunteer department in a rural area and we have to provide our own pants. I was told they have to be the Workrite nomex pants. The ones I have found are over $100. Does anyone know of any places that sell used ones?

Do they have to be Nomex? Can they be 100% cotton? That satisfies NFPA and are easier and cheaper to find

 

[NWemsgeek]

Do they have to be Nomex? Can they be 100% cotton? That satisfies NFPA and are easier and cheaper to find

Department said nomex. We use them for wildland as well.

 

[DrParasite]

you are providing your own fire gear? hard pass. if they want you to do firefighter stuff, even wildland, they can provide you with the proper gear.

I'll buy my own uniform pants (and have in the past), but there is no way I am buying my own wildland PPE. it's a workman's comp nightmare, because if you get hurt, they department (or their insurance company) can deny the claim because they didn't provide the gear, nor did they verify that it was in good working condition at the time of the incident.

 

[CALEMT]

Check amazon, sometimes you can find them cheaper than market price. Also are these strictly station pants? Are you issued wildland gear or do you just roll in the station pants? Reasoning behind that is posted above me. PPE should be issued, not bought.

 

[NWemsgeek]

The rest of the gear is supplied except for pants and boots.

 

[NWemsgeek]

As far as I know they did not have separate nomex (green ones) wildland pants.

 

[DrParasite]

Requiring you to purchase your own PPE is a very slippery scope; it's fine until an injury occurs and an OSHA investigation is initiated, and then insurance companies don't want to pay.

As Cal EMT stated, "PPE should be issued, not bought." EMS is a little bit different because we don't have specialized equipment (a pair of uniform pants is a pair of uniform pants). Nomex PPE is a different story, even if it is for wildland use. And that's ignoring the OSHA rule that says Employers Must Provide and Pay for PPE.

I understand rural fire departments, and tight budgets..... do you understand what OSHA requires, and how your department can get fined big time for not following the rules?

 

[hometownmedic5]

Everybody else has explained why this shouldn’t be happening, and I couldn’t agree more, but there’s another issue, which I’ll cover.

Do you want to wear used pants designed to keep you safe in a fire? I understand that these things don’t expire overnight and so on. Here’s my point. Over the winter, I bought a new winter coat. Hi viz, BBP safe, zip out liner, in other words fully loaded. Inside that coat is a label that states you can only wash it xx times before the BBP protection is eliminated. If I only read the website, which says none of this beyond read the washing instructions, before buying a used coat, I might think I was protected when I really have no idea how many times the previous owner washed it. If you dont launder nomex properly, it doesn’t work correctly, or as long as designed. Who’s to say the previous owner took care of it correctly.

I get they’re expensive pants that you’ll only wear at ‘work’(which is why they should be issued by the department), but if that issue can’t be solved while maintaining your affiliation(which personal experience says is going to be a hard nut to crack), I would say either quit(best option) or buy new pants.

 

[CALEMT]

Just as a point, I'm curious on how the Feds work. I.e the forest service/ BLM..., I know you can buy your own nomex pants (crew boss, coaxsher, true north). I'm curious as to the SOP/SOG's that the USFS has and if the USFS has a "standard issue" wildland pant.

 

[Peak]

When I was in the fire service we were required to wear undergarments, pants/shorts, and t-shirts that were NFPA complaint to be worn under our wildland gear or turnouts. We didn't actually care what they were made out of, everyone wore cotton. If it was a red flag day we were encouraged to wear our wildland gear. We could purchase our own wildland gear if we wanted, but the department did supply us with wildland gear. Any wildland pants/shirts or structure gear that were not provided by the department had to be approved by one of the chiefs.

I would stay away from any department that requires you to purchase your own PPE. If a department is requiring a specific brand of station gear they should be providing you a uniform allowance and a specific channel to purchase through.

 

[DrParasite]

Just as a point, I'm curious on how the Feds work. I.e the forest service/ BLM..., I know you can buy your own nomex pants (crew boss, coaxsher, true north). I'm curious as to the SOP/SOG's that the USFS has and if the USFS has a "standard issue" wildland pant.

Some departments will allow you to buy your own gear if you so chose: for example, if you want to use your own helmet, you can, provided it is approved (in writing) by the chief. It typically needs to meet the same standards as your issued gear, and if it is damaged, the department will not pay to replace or repair it. That is the big difference: you are still issued said equipment, and chosing to use your personal gear instead. I have quite a few helmets (personal fire helmet, personal TR helmet, spare TR helmet for EMS, and a retired fire helmet that is hanging on the wall), and my personal fire helmet is more comfortable than my issued one.

My hunch is they use an allowance system which says "there are the approved vendors, buy these types of approved pants" so they don't need to maintain storage of all the pants sizes.but it is still recorded as you have a pair of approved pants. and if you want to buy your own, it needs to meet their standards.

 

[CALEMT]

Some departments will allow you to buy your own gear if you so chose: for example, if you want to use your own helmet, you can, provided it is approved (in writing) by the chief. It typically needs to meet the same standards as your issued gear, and if it is damaged, the department will not pay to replace or repair it. That is the big difference: you are still issued said equipment, and chosing to use your personal gear instead. I have quite a few helmets (personal fire helmet, personal TR helmet, spare TR helmet for EMS, and a retired fire helmet that is hanging on the wall), and my personal fire helmet is more comfortable than my issued one.

My hunch is they use an allowance system which says "there are the approved vendors, buy these types of approved pants" so they don't need to maintain storage of all the pants sizes.but it is still recorded as you have a pair of approved pants. and if you want to buy your own, it needs to meet their standards.

I kinda figured this were the case. Since the Feds roll with the "greens" as their wildland pant and say you buy your own (approved) pants... cause Merica and God forbid you were injured on a fire you should still be covered through your job insurance I would like to assume.