Got a problem

[BossyCow]

Thanks guys. I'll deal with it on my own.

Be very careful. Since these guys were not working on a patient, the scope of practice thing is not as much of an issue. Since the guy getting the IV was aware of the level of certificiation of the guy giving it to him.. it's more an issue of two guys being idiots than breaking laws.

Now.. aside from that, the supplies are another issue. Also the liability, when the site gets infected. According to your service, how is inventory tracked? Using patient care items for personal use is generally verboten. Sticking co-workers with sharp things is generally also frowned upon.

If you have a good relationship with someone in authority at the company, I would definitely express my concerns over the incident with emphasis on

• Does military guy have a firm grasp on what is and isn't allowed with patients
• Does his buddy have issues with alcohol abuse that are going to impact his job performance
• Are there honesty issues regarding seeing patient supplies as personal play toys
• Does the non action of the supervisory personnel who viewed the incident mean the company is OK with this behavior

But I'd be careful to have this conversation in a very controlled setting, with someone with whom I already have a good rapport.

 

[NomadicMedic]

I'd have this conversation in a very controlled setting, with someone with whom I already have a good rapport.

That's what I've done. Thanks to everyone for your input.

 

[VentMedic]

I'm not stating that using IV's at work to cure a hangover is ok. I'm simply stating that practicing IV's on one another is not an issue, if the people doing it are trained and able to do it. Their not running chest tubes on eachother, their running IV's. This "common practice" go's on all the time on military posts. The state certification has nothing to do with it. The fact that these two people decided to practice IV's on eachother at work is the only issue. Not the best decision.....but two willing participants practicing a skill,(that they are certified to practice through the military) that will make them more efficient, is very understandable. Just don't do it at work.

We are not talking about a military post in this thread so what you are saying is not relevant to the issue. Whatever their title was in the military is not the title they are functioning under in a private ambulance service. Whatever certifications they held in the military may have to be carried over officially into civilian life. If they are no longer in the military nor in a job that requires IV insertion, then they are just goofing around, showing off or wannabes for something they aren't. If fluids are administered, they also are "practicing medicine" without oversight, documentation or an appropriate reason as well as being out of their job description. I do believe the state would have an issue with that.

Many of us on this forum have skills from previous job titles and employers but may not be allowed to use them at a current job. I can start PICC and arterial lines at one job but can not at another. It would not even be acceptable for me to consider it given the state and company's scope of practice for a Paramedic. There is also no justification to use another employer's supplies on that employer's time to benefit another job.

Now, who do you think should be liable for the medical bills and damages for practicing an invasive skill that is not in your job description and have no civilian IV certification or expanded EMT-B level? The employer who does not require these skills at their level of service? The person getting stuck? The person doing the sticking?

And still, where are they getting the supplies and who is footing the bill if they are no longer in the military? Did the military issue these supplies to be used on civilians without supervision?

 

[EMT-B2B]

Hence the underlined military post and at work

"The fact that these two people decided to practice IV's on eachother at work is the only issue. Not the best decision."

 

[EMTCLM]

It was taking place at the station... and it certainly wasn't done to "practice skills".

Neither one of these guys is an EMT-I or EMT-P. The service, where both are primary providers, is NOT an ILS/ALS service and there is no reason for the equipment to be in the station.

The guy starting the IV had taken his uniform shirt off, and had told me that he was starting the IV on the other guy "because he was dehydrated". I said, "Then give him a Gatorade".

It's just bad stuff to have going on in the building.

lol give him a gatorade. yeah, he probably shouldnt have been starting a sketchy IV because the guy needed to whet his wistle. i wold be like um, theres a water fountain right there put down the needles lol i dont know if they technically could get in trouble but it sounds pretty unintelligent to me