Are there search and rescue EMS jobs besides military....

[jesse24b]

Are there EMS jobs besides military that you revolve around SAR. I haven't found details about any, but who looks for lost swimmers, or hikers. Just people who get hurt in some remote area?

 

[adamjh3]

Depends on the area, most will have .civ SAR teams. Sheriff's department runs it in my AO.

 

[mycrofft]

Forest Service, law enforcement, TV shows. Oh, and Border Patrol.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Are there EMS jobs besides military that you revolve around SAR. I haven't found details about any, but who looks for lost swimmers, or hikers. Just people who get hurt in some remote area?

See here:

http://emtlife.com/showthread.php?t=12602

As was stated before, Wilderness SAR in the United States (involves far more than some EMS training) is, at the local level, the legally responsibility of a local Law Enforcement Agency, Emergency Management Agency, or in some rare cases I have heard about, Fire. In the western United States, the standard is the Sheriff's Office being jurisdictionally in charge. SAR Teams acting under the authority and direction of these agencies are almost always volunteer. (In California, the exception to this is three National Parks who cover their own SAR Incidents with "Paid Per Call" Volunteers). Depending on the needs of the area and the professionalism of the team, these volunteers are often highly trained not just in Wilderness Medicine, but in Technical Ropes, Swiftwater/Flood Rescue, Search Theory, Mantracking, Search Management, Survival, Navigation, Lost Person Profiling, Helicopters, Mine Rescue, Dive Recovery, Alpine Rescue, etc, etc, etc...

If you are interested in volunteering in this type of stuff, find out who has jurisdictional and functional responsibility in your county and check with them. NOTE: This only applies to Land SAR (What is known at the Federal Level as the Inland Region in the United States), and not the Maritime Region or Oversees.

 

[jesse24b]

thanks guys. I plan on being a game warden, so maybe they do some search and rescue. I also plan on doing a paramedics after my military leave.

 

[2BFFSAR]

My ultimate goal is to one day become part of CA-TF2. theyre one of some 22 task force teams across the country organized by FEMA and USAID that get deployed around the nation for SAR missions. CA-TF2 is one of 2 teams that get deployed internationally, the other being in Virginia if my memory serves me correctly.
Theyre mostly comprised of firefighters.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

My ultimate goal is to one day become part of CA-TF2. theyre one of some 22 task force teams across the country organized by FEMA and USAID that get deployed around the nation for SAR missions. CA-TF2 is one of 2 teams that get deployed internationally, the other being in Virginia if my memory serves me correctly.
Theyre mostly comprised of firefighters.

These 28 teams (last I checked) are FEMA USAR Teams, not WSAR. While there are some cross-over in capabilities and usages, USAR is not a resource utilized in Wilderness missing, overdue, lost, or injured incidents, just as you will never see one of my mantrackers or alpine survivalists crawling through a collapsed building.

That said, USAR is a great goal. I know several people who have done that in NorCal, having been deployed to Katrina, Haiti, etc. I would have liked to go down that path, but as you said, USAR is more of a FF concept, and ain't no FF, and am working to go down a different path than EMS and SAR at this point in life.

 

[2BFFSAR]

very right mountain res-q. sorry jesse, i thought you were looking at sar in general

mountain res-q, i would be also very interested in your line of work in wsar. really any kind of sar interests me, but you are right that femas task forces are usar.

 

[jesse24b]

im with 2BFFSAR i also am very interested in your line of work!

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

very right mountain res-q. sorry jesse, i thought you were looking at sar in general

mountain res-q, i would be also very interested in your line of work in wsar. really any kind of sar interests me, but you are right that femas task forces are usar.

You can have anything in my head related to WSAR, provided you take it ALL and leave NOTHING behind. :sad:

 

[2BFFSAR]

Dont quite know what you mean by that.. why the sad face?

How did you get into helicopter EMS? I've been searching for companies around SoCal but havent had any luck. I would love to work on a helicopter before joining fire.. Of course I'm assuming you need a bit of experience first.

Where are you located by the way?

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

thanks guys. I plan on being a game warden, so maybe they do some search and rescue. I also plan on doing a paramedics after my military leave.

Not in the western United States. I have heard that some Fish & Game Agencies in the east are charged with WSAR, but not in any western state. The few times I have interacted with F&G in SAR, they were just there, playing no important role. They have no jurisdiction, and therefore no training to participate in or manage a search operation...

Best bet is National Park Service as a Ranger. If you are a reader, take a look at the book "Ranger Confidential" by Andrea Lankford. That is a great book that will either encourage this career path or permanently dissuade you.

Dont quite know what you mean by that.. why the sad face?

How did you get into helicopter EMS? I've been searching for companies around SoCal but havent had any luck. I would love to work on a helicopter before joining fire.. Of course I'm assuming you need a bit of experience first.

Where are you located by the way?

I am just not too happy with the SAR Gods right now. Trying to move on in life and getting drug back to a place I thought I was done with. It is complicated. I love SAR... I hate some people, politics, and bullsh*t.

My helicopter experience is based solely on SAR. EMS protocol states that we are classified as a BLS Rescue Aircraft when we have at least one equipped EMT on the helo. County Policy states that SO/SAR is the only agency allowed to conduct Helicopter Rescue Operations (or other agency under the direction of SO/SAR). We have had an Air Ops Team for years, originally training with the Navy back in the 80's. Currently I am Crew Member qualified through my team, which means I can, among other things, do Short Hauls and Helo Repels. So my SAR affiliation, my EMT experience, and my Crew Member Qualifications, make me (per various policies) one of only a few people in the county who can fly as the medical provider on a Helicopter Rescue in the county. Of course, we are not classified as an EMS Air Ambulance, but as an EMS BLS Rescue Aircraft. We can do some pretty cool things on the rescue side if need be, but are as limited as a BLS IFT Rig on the medical side. Still, I am on a short list of people who have flown and will fly as the Dope on a Rope Medic. I prefer to be in the helo... not under it...

Northern California... Sierras... Above Yosemite (right above)...

 

[2BFFSAR]

All sounds very cool and amazing.. Yosemite is an amazing place also, you must feel very lucky to be able to work there. As for you situation, I trust that it is too complicated to explain, but I hope the best for you and that it all works out in the end. Although I cant help but wonder why you cant just quit or leave?

Would you be so kind as to give me some tips on how I might start a career in SAR? WSAR or USAR? I know almost nothing about how people get into it, so any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Jon]

I don't know if you ever visit www.usajobs.com - I've seen a couple of jobs for NPS staff in the western US where climbing and SAR are primary responsibilities.

Worth a look if it's really what you want to do.

Jon

 

[onrope]

As previously stated the only real paid professional SAR outfit is NPS rangers in yosemite. In California SAR is the duty of the county sheriff. The skill and dedication varies greatly between units and counties. If you join LASD SAR you get a whole $1 a year.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

As previously stated the only real paid professional SAR outfit is NPS rangers in yosemite. In California SAR is the duty of the county sheriff. The skill and dedication varies greatly between units and counties. If you join LASD SAR you get a whole $1 a year.

Actually, there are three national parks in California that break the "Sheriff has legal jurisdiction for SAR in CA" rule... Yosemite is just one... and paid rangers are just part of their SAR capabilities. They still rely heavily on the non-ranger SAR Siters from the two camps (valley and tuolumne). That said, for the average NPS Ranger (especially the positions advertised on previously mentioned sites) SAR is less than 1% of the job; they are not really paid SAR Responders, but paid rangers who also respond to SAR Incidents, although some are more heavily involved in SAR than others due to training and experience, like Lobo was or is (haven't heard if he actually retired as planned)...

 

[wildmed]

As others have already pretty much said, really the only paid SAR "team" in the country is seasonal YOSAR in yosemite valley and tuolumne meadows. Even then they are paid on call and just sit in camp and climb until they are paged. It is ridiculously competitive to become apart of YOSAR. In reality, you must have advanced medical, be able to solidly lead 5.11+ trad, and have previous MR experience for them to even look at you. Other alpine National parks (RMNP,YNP,Denali,Tetons ect) have climbing rangers, as mentioned above. These positions are realistically more competitive than YOSAR and require ability to 5.10+ Trad, technical mountaineering experience, NPS ranger experience, and advanced medical. Many NPS climbing rangers are certified to the NPS "park medic" standard which is roughly equivalent to EMT-I. Technically the climbing rangers are in charge SAR in their respective parks.
In reality, there is just not enough call volume anywhere to support a fully paid SAR team. Even the busiest MRA teams in the US only run between 150-180 calls per year on average, and I only know of 2 teams that have anywhere close to that kind of volume.

 

[DavidM]

Not in the western United States. I have heard that some Fish & Game Agencies in the east are charged with WSAR, but not in any western state. The few times I have interacted with F&G in SAR, they were just there, playing no important role. They have no jurisdiction, and therefore no training to participate in or manage a search operation...

I know from working with them that in New Hampshire the Game Wardens are lead on most SAR stuff although there are a large number of volunteer local agencies that also respond because F&G doesn't have enough resources on its own. I believe that is also how it is in Maine.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

In reality, there is just not enough call volume anywhere to support a fully paid SAR team. Even the busiest MRA teams in the US only run between 150-180 calls per year on average, and I only know of 2 teams that have anywhere close to that kind of volume.

Search Teams don't have the call volume to justify maintaining a paid team. Traditional SAR Teams, like the ones that were the pioneers of rescue disciplines in the 70's, would have had the call volume to justify being paid had the Fire Departments not been in a better political position to take these disciplines over. What I mean is this: Realistically, there are not enough fires to be fought to justify the size and budget of Fire Departments as a whole. In order to justify their budgets, they branched out into areas that were not traditionally theirs, such as EMS and Rescue. In doing so they encroached upon the jurisdiction of other agencies. Saying that the call volume is not there for SAR to be paid is like saying that the call volume is not their for FIRE to be paid; technically true in the traditional sense... FIRE had been organized and developed as a profession for a long time, with the political clout to assume the rescue responsibilities that SAR was probably in a better position to provide, but was too young to do so. Swiftwater, Ropes, Helo, Dive, Heavy Rescue, etc... these are all things that FIRE had moved into (depending on the area) despite the fact that it was the old timer SAR folks that pioneer these disciplines... case in point, modern swiftwater rescue in the U.S. was developed by a bunch of white water rafters turned SAR Responders in the later 70's / early 80's. While swiftwater is usually viewed as a FIRE responsibility in many areas, in some areas (like mine) SAR maintained control over this discipline. If SAR had maintained jurisdiction over all types of rescue (leaving firefighter to fight fires; novel idea) than it is possible that SAR would be paid and FIRE would be fighting to lose the "bast*rd step child of emergency services" logo that SAR has in most areas. It is Search AND RESCUE... and if the Fire Department had not pulled the Fire/RESCUE card, the call volume would be there fior SAR both in searches and in rescues. But no, as it stands, for SAR to be paid is a pipe dream...

I know from working with them that in New Hampshire the Game Wardens are lead on most SAR stuff although there are a large number of volunteer local agencies that also respond because F&G doesn't have enough resources on its own. I believe that is also how it is in Maine.

Ya, it is that area where I have heard of F&G Agencies having jurisdiction based on function. In the western United States, that is never the case. Sheriff's Office is almost always in charge. The exceptions are a handful of National Parks (like Yosemite; half of which is in my county, but we do not respond to SAR's in the park unless requested on mutual aid) and, at least in CA, incorporated cities, where the Police Department is technically in charge, but often requires assistance from the SO and their SAR Team (if one exists) because most cities and urban areas do not maintain a SAR Team, while the SO might and usually does. For those in CA, you might remember a few child abductions in the central valley over the last few years such as the one in Tracy (girl found in a suitcase in a pond). The Tracy PD was technically in charge of the search, however, recognizing their lack of experience in running a ground search, they requested SO and SAR assistance. I know several Search Managers who were requested on mutual aid to head up the Operations Section and Planning Section, while the PD maintained IC. Of course, in all cases, one must remember that if a SAR Mission is not resolved in the first 24 hours, most teams will be relying on mutual aid (one of the few things we do well in CA). Even the wonderful paid Yosemite folks call for mutual aid from the unpaid professionals. Because of the liability and legal ramifications associated with what is a Law Enforcement Investigation, jurisdiction must be established so that the agency that will be under the microscope later has the ability to limit liability during the mission... not that those in the field should care too much about that...

 

[wildmed]

Search Teams don't have the call volume to justify maintaining a paid team. Traditional SAR Teams, like the ones that were the pioneers of rescue disciplines in the 70's, would have had the call volume to justify being paid had the Fire Departments not been in a better political position to take these disciplines over. What I mean is this: Realistically, there are not enough fires to be fought to justify the size and budget of Fire Departments as a whole. In order to justify their budgets, they branched out into areas that were not traditionally theirs, such as EMS and Rescue. In doing so they encroached upon the jurisdiction of other agencies. Saying that the call volume is not there for SAR to be paid is like saying that the call volume is not their for FIRE to be paid; technically true in the traditional sense... FIRE had been organized and developed as a profession for a long time, with the political clout to assume the rescue responsibilities that SAR was probably in a better position to provide, but was too young to do so. Swiftwater, Ropes, Helo, Dive, Heavy Rescue, etc... these are all things that FIRE had moved into (depending on the area) despite the fact that it was the old timer SAR folks that pioneer these disciplines... case in point, modern swiftwater rescue in the U.S. was developed by a bunch of white water rafters turned SAR Responders in the later 70's / early 80's. While swiftwater is usually viewed as a FIRE responsibility in many areas, in some areas (like mine) SAR maintained control over this discipline. If SAR had maintained jurisdiction over all types of rescue (leaving firefighter to fight fires; novel idea) than it is possible that SAR would be paid and FIRE would be fighting to lose the "bast*rd step child of emergency services" logo that SAR has in most areas. It is Search AND RESCUE... and if the Fire Department had not pulled the Fire/RESCUE card, the call volume would be there fior SAR both in searches and in rescues. But no, as it stands, for SAR to be paid is a pipe dream...

I dont really know if Mountain Rescue is the :censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored::censored: stepchild here in CO anymore, Its very competitive to get on the more prestigious MRA teams here, way more than any volley FD that I know of . If anything we are gaining more respect every year. It is true that we run more way more missions than FD runs fires, however "The no charge for rescue" culture means that we do not get reimbursed for what we do.
With the solid increasing trend of outdoor recreation, and corresponding amount of rescues, I wouldn't be surprised if we see the advent of a small paid rescue culture here in the rockies at some point, much like there is in europe. In my opinion there is probably already a need for a highly trained, rescue specific HEMS operation in the rockies to better cater to the ~500 MR missions every year and ski patrol operations. Although we already have way too many HEMS agencies in the front range......:wacko: