Prejudice In EMS

[Underoath87]

My original point was actually that firefighters tend to be pretty backwards/politically incorrect/culturally insensitive or whatever you want to call it, per my years of interactions with them (and the stuff I just heard at the dinner table). I just added that being a demographically homogeneous group (white, rural, and Southern) probably doesn't help (because they can usually say whatever they want without offending anyone).

 

[triemal04]

My original point was actually that firefighters tend to be pretty backwards/politically incorrect/culturally insensitive or whatever you want to call it, per my years of interactions with them (and the stuff I just heard at the dinner table).

Got it, all firefighters are backwards/politically incorrect/culturally insensitive. Is there anything else you want to add to the list?

I just added that being a demographically homogeneous group (white, rural, and Southern) probably doesn't help (because they can usually say whatever they want without offending anyone).

Don't worry, I understand completely. If you are white and from a rural area in the south you are automatically a bigoted mysoginist. Makes perfect sense to me.

Would you like to try this again?

What you did in your original post was state a problem; "every other sentence spoken contains something bigoted or misogynistic." You then followed it up with the reason for that problem; "Granted, this is a more rural department with almost nothing but white guys." Makes it sound like you think that being a white man from a rural area automatically makes you have problems with various people. Your response above doesn't help with that.

Do you see how this could be an issue?

 

[Underoath87]

Let's try this again. Please reread my original post. Only this time, don't be an apologist and quit trying to infer things that I didn't write.

 

[triemal04]

Apologist? Not in the least, though that is an interesting word for you to use. Personally I just find it very annoying and a bit abhorent when someone paints an entire group of people as acting a certain way, or believes that someone belonging to a certain group means that they are going to do and think specific things for no reason other than being part of that group. ANY group.

Sadly, that's what you did, and with the content of your posts, continue to make clear that's who you actually think.

 

[CALEMT]

My original point was actually that firefighters tend to be pretty backwards/politically incorrect/culturally insensitive or whatever you want to call it, per my years of interactions with them (and the stuff I just heard at the dinner table). I just added that being a demographically homogeneous group (white, rural, and Southern) probably doesn't help (because they can usually say whatever they want without offending anyone).

Wow just wow. Obviously you have never seen a professional fire department. No you can't say what ever you want because you're a firefighter. Look up Fresno Fire Dept. open mic and there's a perfect example that contradicts your whole stament of we get away with everything just cause we're with the fire dept. And politically incorrect and culturally insensitive are you kidding? That's just a completely obsurd statement.

 

[Underoath87]

Wow just wow. Obviously you have never seen a professional fire department. No you can't say what ever you want because you're a firefighter. Look up Fresno Fire Dept. open mic and there's a perfect example that contradicts your whole stament of we get away with everything just cause we're with the fire dept. And politically incorrect and culturally insensitive are you kidding? That's just a completely obsurd statement.

Show me where I posted that (because I did not).
If anything, you just helped make my (actual) point for me by pointing out horribly backwards behavior running rampant in some departments. I don't have an ax to grind with firefighters, and I really don't have an agenda here. My opinion is not based on cases in the media (though ones like Fresno sure don't help), but direct observation and my own personal conversations with local firefighters. And yes, most of these guys I'm thinking of are career firefighters.

And for both of you: I did not imply anything about ALL firefighters or ALL white guys. It just so happens that a "good ol' boy" culture still prevails in many departments due/leading to a lack of diversity. When you get a bunch of the same kinds of people (in this case, blue collar white guys) together in a big group, spending a third of their life together, they sometimes develop some narrow-minded attitudes and habits (racism, male chauvinism, homophobia, etc) that the OP (and pretty much anybody else who isn't just like them) may find distasteful. Things may be vastly different in Cali or other progressive states, but this is often the case in the Southeast, and probably the Midwest as well (where the OP is).

The OP mentioned "firefighter wannabees" as one of the possible factors. Well, those guys are usually volunteering at fire departments and learning through imitation (in case you were going to argue that there is a difference between "professional firefighters" and vollys/wannabees).

I assert that if there is "prejudice in EMS", old-school fire culture is largely to blame.

 

[CALEMT]

because they can usually say whatever they want without offending anyone).

Need I say more? While yes I may have used the wrong wording, you insinuated that we can say whatever we want and not get in trouble for it cause were the fire dept.

 

[Underoath87]

Need I say more? While yes I may have used the wrong wording, you insinuated that we can say whatever we want and not get in trouble for it cause were the fire dept.

Had I written "because they can usually say whatever they want without getting in trouble with the public", you would have a foot to stand on. But I didn't, because I don't care about getting them in trouble.
My point is that having their distasteful opinions echoed and encouraged by their peers (rather than being met with disdain or outrage as in most other environments or workplaces) emboldens them and perpetuates the problem.

But I was actually cutting them a break, by suggesting that this maybe isn't an innate quality in firefighters or white American males, but rather a question of environment (nurture over nature, if you will).

 

[triemal04]

you just helped make my (actual) point for me by pointing out horribly backwards behavior running rampant in some departments.

That's an odd thing to say; can you explain how a single person making some innapropriate comments is "backwards behavior running rampant in some departments"? I guess we must have different definitions of what the word "rampant" means.

I did not imply anything about ALL firefighters or ALL white guys.

But you did, and continue to do so, and that's the problem. "My original point was actually that firefighters tend to be pretty backwards/politically incorrect/culturally insensitive or whatever you want to call it,...this is a more rural department with almost nothing but white guys...It's probably because of all the wannabe fire fighters... (white, rural, and Southern)" I suppose you have gone from talking about "white guys" to now narrowing it down to white guys from the rural south and firefighters, but don't you think it's a problem that you continue to paint an entire group of people as believing certain things for no reason other than where they live and the color of their skin?

Really, when you say things like this:

I just added that being a demographically homogeneous group (white, rural, and Southern) probably doesn't help (because they can usually say whatever they want without offending anyone).

Then continue with this:

When you get a bunch of the same kinds of people (in this case, blue collar white guys).. they sometimes develop some narrow-minded attitudes and habit.

And follow it up with:

having their distasteful opinions echoed and encouraged by their peers

I don't know...sure makes it sure sound like you think that people in that group are predisposed to thinking a certain way and only refrain from being open about it when they are in mixed company. Interesting stance to take, to be sure...

But I was actually cutting them a break, by suggesting that this maybe isn't an innate quality in firefighters or white American males, but rather a question of environment (nurture over nature, if you will).

I am curious. Are you always this biased and prejudiced, or is it only when talking about specific ethnicities and cultures? If you aren't that's good, but wow...you should really consider what it is that you are saying.

 

[joshrunkle35]

I would like to see a published, peer-reviewed study that shows that firefighters of one type, culture, subculture or race have specific biases over firefighters of a different type.

If you have come to these conclusions by saying, "Well, come on, everyone knows this information", rather than through some specific scientific data, haven't you formed your own personal biases and prejudice? Would you not be a specific example of prejudice in EMS?