Partner help

[Tommerag]

USAF how is this any different than a chain of command..

USAF was right. Why do you think in the military chain of command for every officer there is a senior enlisted sergeant with an officer. Example:

Platoon Leader (1st or 2nd Lt) with a SFC
Battery Commander (1st LT or Captain) with a First Sgt
Battalion Commander (LTC) with a Sgt Major

Although the Officer is the final authority at that level, there is a senior enlisted personnel as well because of their experience.

 

[rhan101277]

The issue I primarily have with him is he butts in on my assessment, and butts in on my report to the hospital. But those really are minor issues.

Yeah this happens to me all the time. Especially on hospital reports. He interjects the same info I am about to say. When asked about allergies one time, I knew them but wanted to double check before saying and before I could get the transfer paperwork from the table he grabbed it. Its like he wants to be the paramedic on scene but doesn't want to take on the responsibility or the education required to really be the paramedic.

He does what I ask on scene and all, I guess it could be worse.

 

[CAOX3]

I see this with new/inexperienced providers all the time.

The thing is they don't have the experience, they follow the regimented step process taught and any deviation from isnt considered, they don't realize yet that there is a hundred different ways to get to where your going, experience will teach them that. I'm not overtly concerned with the path taken as long as we get there.

You should speak with him, explain you respect his opinion, but the final decision is yours and it's never appropriate to question in front of patients/family unless it's dire. We must portray a united front, it should appear we are all on the same page for the patients benefit.

 

[ebass30920]

And in this case the lazy partner needs to know his place. The statement was referencing this case not every incident in the history of man. I know a lot of dirtbag providers at every level. I never said medicine wasnt a team effort. Dam when this forum decides to come after someone everyone jumps on the whipping post.

 

[Chief Complaint]

After reading your thread, i actually dislike the guy. And ive never met him!

Sounds like you are the kinda guy who doesnt like to stir the pot, which is fine, but your partner isnt going to change his actions unless you say something to him.

You should put your foot down, especially on him underminig your treatment plan in front of the patient. Thats unprofessional to say the least.

His experience is definitely good to have by your side, but in life threatening situations he should be there to assisst you, not look over your shoulder to see what he can pick on.

 

[boingo]

Wait, you mean a physician that isn't even fully licensed yet might still be learning? Say it isn't so!

What is your point? I tried to point out that just because you have a higher level of practice doesn't mean we should discount the years of experience of a lower level one. Do you disagree?

 

[rescue99]

Explain to him that you will no longer tolerate his questioning of your judgement in front of the patient. If he has a suggestion to improve efficiency or care, he can bring it up after the call, where it can be discussed /s compromising patient care or the integrity of the patient / paramedic relationship. If he continues to question your orders, or disregard your orders while in the process of caring for a patient, you will have to move forward /c a formal complaint to the chain of command.

This is the most reasonable response. I might add that IF, I am about to make a grave mistake....please, by all means, say something. Otherwise, wait to discuss the call, after the call is over. If he persists, he can do all of the patient care. Do that a few times and he'll "experience" a little education in common respect.

 

[systemet]

Sounds like your partner doesn't want to be told what to do by someone with less experience, who he / she perceives as junior to them.

You can probably improve the situation by making them feel respected and valued for their experience. That is, if you want to improve it. Just ask them a few questions after the call, like "have you seen that before?", "what do you think was going on?", etc. Make them feel like part of the team.

But you need to stamp on them if they are interfering with call management and making you both look unprofessional in front of patients. Unless you're about to seriously hurt someone, it gets discussed after the call. The sooner you have this conversation / shouting match, the quicker the problem gets fixed. They need to know that you can be a nice guy, but there's a limit. This is a less pleasant part of being a higher level care provider.

I had similar experiences as a new paramedic. I think it's ok to let it slide when it's not interfering with the call. You can't make them respect you, and it's best not to make waves unless they're necessary. Time will take care of this situation -- because eventually you're going to walk into a serious call, and your partner is going to be staring at you, expecting guidance. If they have even the slightest bit of self-realisation, it's going to be hard for them to keep acting like they know it all after that.

 

[rhan101277]

I had the talk and we will see how it goes.

Another thing did happen yesterday, not about questioning me but about putting patient belongs somewhere and not giving me the full story about it because I am trying to do an assessment. I don't have time to babysit my partner and make sure he is doing things correctly. He puts the pt cell phone in the ALS bag and refrains from making sure I understood it was there.

I told him lets not do that anymore, he knows not to do that. I find the phone and give it to shift supervisor to run it out to patient.

I am starting to get very frustrated, I am doing my best to make him understand and most of the time he is good. It is the little things that are going to get us in trouble. I am expected to be the leader on this truck, I can't lead someone who refuses to follow.

He may get talked to by a supervisor on this one and maybe he will straighten up. As one poster responded, I don't like to rock the boat, but I will if I have to. I don't want to be seen as the partner that tells on people etc. and then it will be hell to work everyday.

 

[82nd medic]

You are absolutely right: it is YOUR responsibility and therefore your behind that's on the line if things go wrong. If you know he is wrong then drive on, otherwise keep in mind that "I thought I was right but I wasn't" isn't as bad as "he told me I wasn't right but I continued to be wrong anyway". I would be surprised if a lot of his opinions aren't based off of working with more experienced paramedics. (just something to keep at the back of your mind)

 

[carbonated]

As the highest medical authority on scene (assuming its just the two of you) you're ultimately responsible for the patient. I'm not saying this is a "My patient, shut up kid!" situation at all, but maybe it should be explained that you're handling what is your responsibility, and if he has suggestions or input he can talk to you about them after the patient has been handed off to the ER

 

[rhan101277]

As the highest medical authority on scene (assuming its just the two of you) you're ultimately responsible for the patient. I'm not saying this is a "My patient, shut up kid!" situation at all, but maybe it should be explained that you're handling what is your responsibility, and if he has suggestions or input he can talk to you about them after the patient has been handed off to the ER

Sent an email to supervisor, it is small things but he has done them multiple times and I want to have some documentation supporting it. If he keeps acting unprofessional and unreasonable then I will just have to keep doing it.

 

[medicstudent101]

Sent an email to supervisor, it is small things but he has done them multiple times and I want to have some documentation supporting it. If he keeps acting unprofessional and unreasonable then I will just have to keep doing it.

Sorry to hear you're in that predicament, but you're going about it the best you can. Do you work for a 911 or IFT service?

 

[rhan101277]

Sorry to hear you're in that predicament, but you're going about it the best you can. Do you work for a 911 or IFT service?

911, we do transfers as well.

 

[systemet]

I had the talk and we will see how it goes.

Another thing did happen yesterday, not about questioning me but about putting patient belongs somewhere and not giving me the full story about it because I am trying to do an assessment. I don't have time to babysit my partner and make sure he is doing things correctly. He puts the pt cell phone in the ALS bag and refrains from making sure I understood it was there.

I appreciate that this could have got you in trouble, but it's a fairly minor mistake. No one was hurt. If you've asked them not to interfere with your calls, it's a somewhat predictable response. They don't want to bother you and get in the way, so they don't tell you until later.

I told him lets not do that anymore, he knows not to do that. I find the phone and give it to shift supervisor to run it out to patient.

Sounds like a reasonable reaction. Crisis averted.

I am starting to get very frustrated, I am doing my best to make him understand and most of the time he is good. It is the little things that are going to get us in trouble. I am expected to be the leader on this truck, I can't lead someone who refuses to follow.

He may get talked to by a supervisor on this one and maybe he will straighten up. As one poster responded, I don't like to rock the boat, but I will if I have to. I don't want to be seen as the partner that tells on people etc. and then it will be hell to work everyday.

I had a personal rule. If I saw someone doing something wrong, and it wasn't a big deal, I wouldn't say anything. Then if management came to me, I would do anything except deliberately lying to back up my partner. Because, if it was that big a deal, I should have dealt with it at the time.

On the other hand, if it was a big deal, if I didn't agree with another ALS member's treatment, but it wasn't life-threatening or going to cause serious injury, I'd make a point of telling them I disagreed out of earshot of the patient's family. If they chose to ignore me, after a direct warning, then I felt my responsibility to back up my partner was gone. Management could come talk to me, and I'd tell them anything they wanted to know in full detail.

[Obviously in a truely dangerous situation, the call has to get ugly, and someone has to step in. I have also had to do this, as I'm sure, have most of us at some point].

My long and rambling point is, that you only have the responsibility to protect your partner from their own mistakes to a certain point. If you've confronted the guy several times on the same issue, they keep doing it, and you've warned them -- then you have every right to tell management that if they come to you.

On the other hand, you can't go to management to avoid having a heated argument with your partner. You guys have to discuss it first, outside of a truly ****** up situation where your partner has attacked someone or stolen something, or got intoxicated at work.

I would be very cautious about reporting your partner to higher powers unless you know they have a pattern of behaviour that is going to endanger your patients or other crew members.

If the situation continues to be really bad, perhaps you can ask to be assigned to a new truck? It may well be that management is well aware that the person you're working with is difficult. You may be working with them because no one senior will.

 

[rhan101277]

I appreciate that this could have got you in trouble, but it's a fairly minor mistake. No one was hurt. If you've asked them not to interfere with your calls, it's a somewhat predictable response. They don't want to bother you and get in the way, so they don't tell you until later.



Sounds like a reasonable reaction. Crisis averted.



I had a personal rule. If I saw someone doing something wrong, and it wasn't a big deal, I wouldn't say anything. Then if management came to me, I would do anything except deliberately lying to back up my partner. Because, if it was that big a deal, I should have dealt with it at the time.

On the other hand, if it was a big deal, if I didn't agree with another ALS member's treatment, but it wasn't life-threatening or going to cause serious injury, I'd make a point of telling them I disagreed out of earshot of the patient's family. If they chose to ignore me, after a direct warning, then I felt my responsibility to back up my partner was gone. Management could come talk to me, and I'd tell them anything they wanted to know in full detail.

[Obviously in a truely dangerous situation, the call has to get ugly, and someone has to step in. I have also had to do this, as I'm sure, have most of us at some point].

My long and rambling point is, that you only have the responsibility to protect your partner from their own mistakes to a certain point. If you've confronted the guy several times on the same issue, they keep doing it, and you've warned them -- then you have every right to tell management that if they come to you.

On the other hand, you can't go to management to avoid having a heated argument with your partner. You guys have to discuss it first, outside of a truly ****** up situation where your partner has attacked someone or stolen something, or got intoxicated at work.

I would be very cautious about reporting your partner to higher powers unless you know they have a pattern of behaviour that is going to endanger your patients or other crew members.

If the situation continues to be really bad, perhaps you can ask to be assigned to a new truck? It may well be that management is well aware that the person you're working with is difficult. You may be working with them because no one senior will.

Yeah he told me I was his sixth partner in three years

 

[systemet]

Yeah he told me I was his sixth partner in three years

That's probably telling you something I would say that if you have to have some conflict with him, no one's going to look at you badly unless you physically assault him.

How do they assign partners are your job? We used to pick spots on trucks once a year. They used to go down the seniority list from to bottom, and the least senior guys always got either (i) terrible hours / location, or (ii) to work with the biggest problem child no one else wanted to work with, or (iii) both. For me, option (i) always seemed preferable.

 

[rhan101277]

Moving to my original partner after I first cleared as a paramedic. I got used to working with this partner but he has his good days and bad. He has tried to talk over me on a couple of assessments, I can't win for losing with this partner. Going to a new one next week.