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Gold777

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I am a new member on here and i thought this might be a good time to introduce myself, i am 17 years old and my name is Ryan, I have my Firefighting 1 and 2, and i am a first responder, and by the end of this year i will have my EMT-B. I ride out a lot with local fire departments and am currently trying to become an EMT on an ambulance in a neighboring county. I come from a family of police officers, firefighters, and military personnel. I am from Indiana and live in Hamilton county, unfortunately every fire dept. here has there own ambulance so i am attempting to get on an hospital ambulance in the next county over. (Yes, i do know i basically just repeated myself) I love the medical aspect of being a firefighter, i am training hard and studding to become a great FF/EMT. I have recently got my LED Lights on my POV and yes i did go through my chief, and homeland security. I do understand that i have to obey all laws while my lights are on, i also understand that my lights are nothing more then courtesy lights. I am not a freelancer, and i do not listen to the scanner turn my lights on and just go. I only respond to calls if i know that the department needs an extra pair of hands or if for some reason the department can't get there. Also in advance i will apologize if i use such terminology like DRT or DOA which seems to frustrate some people, i am not cold hearted it's just that my local department use that terminology so it is pretty much second nature to me. In case u are wondering y i am explaining myself so much, it is because on a FF forum some individuals got angry at me for alot of reasons, i think it was simply because of my age and they saw me as a little kid. I promise i am responsible and do take my future profession very seriously, i am not in it for the glory, i am in it to help people and make a difference, as well as be there when people need it most. One more thing u probably have noticed that while i type i text as in i use u instead of you and r instead of are and you get the idea. I also do not use correct grammar while typing. I do this because forums are made for typing quickly and getting a point across, forums are not meant for grades (this is not grammar class) reason i mention this is because i got trash talked by alot of FF's on the other forum because of it. Well anyways its great to meet u all and i am looking forward to have in depth discussions about the job as well as anything else that may be brought up.
 
Yes, you're age will attract dissenters that will target you especially if you try to convince a few of us that forums are an excuse for poor grammar, punctuation, spelling, etc. I see it as just pure laziness.

You would go farther here by reconsidering your charter of introduction and make an attempt at what I just stated in the above paragraph. Anyhow, welcome aboard!
 
No offense to you but lights on a 17 years olds POV is a BAD idea. Lights on anyones POV is pretty much a waste and just asking for trouble.
 
No offense to you but lights on a 17 years olds POV is a BAD idea. Lights on anyones POV is pretty much a waste and just asking for trouble.

Clearly, that is your opinion. Volunteers with lights is fairly common in rural areas and if his department allows it, I can respect that as well. Many years ago, I was a volunteer and ran with a dash light from time to time. I used it more to advance to an accident scene when traffic was backed up than anything else. In the years that I worked as a volunteer, we never had a single accident from any member's POV response. I don't think they really ever had an accident in the history of the department (it's an all paid IAFF union shop now).

It's interesting to hear how some folks here take on a tear about lights on a POV, but then all year long I read article after article of ambulance accidents being driven by the "pros".
 
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Well, with the whole concept of lights and sirens being debated with the latest evidence (which suggests that they are close to useless in EMS), and with the amount of injury and death that occurs from their use, adding to the fact that a 17 year old is not yet a mature adult (want the science, look into the frontal cortex development) we get a dangerous situation. Can that even be argued?

Also, 911 would never be contacted by me if in my area, 17 year olds responded to calls. I would drive my family member to the ED.

Anyways OP, welcome to the forum. I am not trying to knock you down as a person, the above is my opinion on your situation. I would advise you to instead of putting lights in the car, hit the books and get into a good college.
 
Well, with the whole concept of lights and sirens being debated with the latest evidence (which suggests that they are close to useless in EMS), and with the amount of injury and death that occurs from their use,

It would be helpful to us if you could cite this evidence.
 
It would be helpful to us if you could cite this evidence.

Conclusion: In this setting, the 43.5-second mean time savings does not warrant the use of lights and siren during ambulance transport, except in rare situations or clinical circumstances.
http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0196064495702679

There are others but I cannot easily find them right now. They say the same thing.

**I think this applies to most systems in the United States. Esp. Rural ones. However, in Los Angeles, the use of lights and sirens has saved my time on the tens of minutes range.**
 
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http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0196064495702679

There are others but I cannot easily find them right now. They say the same thing.

**I think this applies to most systems in the United States. Esp. Rural ones. However, in Los Angeles, the use of lights and sirens has saved my time on the tens of minutes range.**

Okay, this refers to ambulance transport and not the use of lights and siren on POV. Your earlier posted lead me to believe that there was evidence that disputed the use on volunteer POVs.
 
Okay, this refers to ambulance transport and not the use of lights and siren on POV. Your earlier posted lead me to believe that there was evidence that disputed the use on volunteer POVs.

No, I said the concept of lights and sirens was being debated, but I think it is generally safe to extrapolate that the use of lights and sirens is not as effective for any response as we once thought.

I don't know, I have serious reservations with young people using them in their own cars. But then again, I do not make decisions for him or his locality. I am just glad it is not even a possibility for anyone to place lights in their POV in my state (even volunteers or mayors or whoever).
 
No, I said the concept of lights and sirens was being debated, but I think it is generally safe to extrapolate that the use of lights and sirens is not as effective for any response as we once thought.

I don't know, I have serious reservations with young people using them in their own cars. But then again, I do not make decisions for him or his locality. I am just glad it is not even a possibility for anyone to place lights in their POV in my state (even volunteers or mayors or whoever).

All fine and said. However, your statement seems more anecdotal and not evidence based as you suggested earlier.
 
Its one thing to have lights on a mature adults POV but it is tottally another to put them on an underage persons POV, thats a recipe for disaster if I had ever heard one. What the hell is that department thinking? Better yet what the hell is his parents thinking for allowing that to happen? I dont know of any departments ANYWHERE that would think that would be a good idea.
 
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¶ (Pilcrow, baby, pilcrow!)

I am a new member on here and i thought this might be a good time to introduce myself, i am 17 years old and my name is Ryan, I have my Firefighting 1 and 2, and i am a first responder, and by the end of this year i will have my EMT-B. I ride out a lot with local fire departments and am currently trying to become an EMT on an ambulance in a neighboring county. I come from a family of police officers, firefighters, and military personnel. I am from Indiana and live in Hamilton county, unfortunately every fire dept. here has there own ambulance so i am attempting to get on an hospital ambulance in the next county over. (Yes, i do know i basically just repeated myself)


I love the medical aspect of being a firefighter, i am training hard and studding to become a great FF/EMT. I have recently got my LED Lights on my POV and yes i did go through my chief, and homeland security. I do understand that i have to obey all laws while my lights are on, i also understand that my lights are nothing more then courtesy lights. I am not a freelancer, and i do not listen to the scanner turn my lights on and just go. I only respond to calls if i know that the department needs an extra pair of hands or if for some reason the department can't get there. Also in advance i will apologize if i use such terminology like DRT or DOA which seems to frustrate some people, i am not cold hearted it's just that my local department use that terminology so it is pretty much second nature to me.


In case u are wondering y i am explaining myself so much, it is because on a FF forum some individuals got angry at me for a lot of reasons, i think it was simply because of my age and they saw me as a little kid. I promise i am responsible and do take my future profession very seriously, i am not in it for the glory, i am in it to help people and make a difference, as well as be there when people need it most. One more thing u probably have noticed that while i type i text as in i use u instead of you and r instead of are and you get the idea. I also do not use correct grammar while typing. I do this because forums are made for typing quickly and getting a point across, forums are not meant for grades (this is not grammar class) reason i mention this is because i got trash talked by alot of FF's on the other forum because of it.


Well anyways its great to meet u all and i am looking forward to have in depth discussions about the job as well as anything else that may be brought up.

First, it is correct that correct spelling, grammar, and punctuation are not always required online. However, good spelling, grammar, and punctuation, along with a logical progression of thought, will almost always lend credence to any position you wish to take.

Secondly, any "time saved to get a point across" is nullified if paragraphs are not used. There is a ton of science on why paragraphs work. It would have been nice to see some, but everyone forgets now and again.

I hope I don't sound like I'm treating you as a little kid, as I'm not. I'm treating you as a peer, which people sometimes do not recognize, which leads them to go away with bent feelers. Don't let that happen. I'm young, also, at 21, and I did my initial EMS training at the age of 17. I think I might have some valuable insight, if you don't let your feelings get hurt. Others do as well, although some of our best haven't been posting too much lately. Feel free to PM me whenever, if you happen to have a question, and I'll answer you. Some things I will not ever discuss in a public place, and that is for the safety of my career. ;)

Anyway, I've worked the gamut of jobs in EMS, including volunteer, and I would say that POV lights are never needed. Keep in mind the risk you are taking with them, and the fact that you will lose respect of many EMS professionals for having them. Consider the following:

-Why are you using them?
-If the department cannot get there, as you state, then you are
there alone. Are you a part of a team? There is added danger in
being by yourself. Many people may also not feel comfortable with a
lone teenager showing up first to help them. Are you actually saving
lives by doing so? Remember, I still am often in the same position.

-Do they save time? More importantly, do they save time that is relevant to patient outcome?
-Consider the added risk to yourself and the public due to their use.
Many people do not expect a POV to have lights on it, and may not
know how to react. Many people are also have a harder time
acting rationally and being calm when they have lights on.

-If they are a "courtesy light," then you are not allowed to break any traffic laws, period, unlike ambulance lights, where one is allowed to while also taking on the added liability. So why, then do you have one? What function are they serving?

I would suggest you remove the light. Attempt to obtain a position with a professional, paid service where you are reimbursed for your time. Don't accept systems where "anything goes." Despite my age, I spent this entire summer helping "reorganize" one service, as it had fallen into a dangerous state. The service was a small, paid-per-call service where volunteers were often adrenaline junkies or those seeking money (Up to $75/call.). Along with a new medical director, some chaff got cut, as well as people responding POV, due to some terrible events with EMTs responding POV "to help."

I can say definitively that such a system is a danger to the public. Work to streamline your volunteer system. If there is a need for you to respond POV, then your system's operational needs are not being met. Strive for excellence and promote a progressive change that eliminates this. Promote scientific- and safety-based standard operating protocols. Be the force for change. At a recent meeting with over 200 EMS personnel, I was the youngest person in attendance, yet I was the most up-to-date on current trends in medicine and in EMS curricula. Don't be the system that stays stuck in the past, and don't be the system that struggles with stagnation. Be the person that improves your system, so that when your members show up at the local emergency departments, the nurses and physicians are pleased to work with you, have trust in your decisions and skills, and feel that you are a valuable peer.

Welcome to the site.
 
Well. I think that him being so young with not a whole lot of (legal) driving experience, plus having lights on his car is a bad thing. He's a fairly new driver in a "high risk" driving accident bracket... adding lights to your car is a bad idea.

I think that having lights on a POV isn't a horrible idea... but only if used in the right circumstances. when I say that, I mean using them for freeway accidents at night to demarkate an accident and slow traffic, or intersection accidents. aside from that, they are just plain old trouble.

So... welcome, but be weary what you post. you might get eaten alive :P
 
All fine and said. However, your statement seems more anecdotal and not evidence based as you suggested earlier.

Agreed. It boils down to an opinion.
 
This is the OP's post on Firehouse.com on 10/16/09

Firehouse.com said:
Alright i am 16 years old and i am training to be a firefighter through explores as well as a career center program with chief Hayes as my instructor, this may sound stupid, but i really want to know. I am a certified first responder and i have a scanner for my county, i was wondering since i am a first responder can i run green led lights on my pov, since i tend to hear calls come out around me and i usually go help. The local fire dept. know me from riding out and have no problem with me arriving on scene to lend a hand. I understand the lights are simply a courtesy light, and that i must follow all rules of the road. I was simply just curious cause it would be nice if i could have the possability of drivers pulling over so i can get to the scene faster. Yesterday was a great example i heard a call go out for a serious PI by my house, i attempted to go help but traffic was to heavy and i didn't get there in time, a 3 yr. old little girl was thrown from the vehicle and was DRT, the local fire dept. was already on a call and didn't get there in time either. I was just thinking if maybe i got there sooner maybe i could of saved that little girls life. Go head and say what u will, trust me your not going to hurt my feelings, i already know i am not a firefighter yet and i am unexperienced and probably dont desearve to use a light on my pov, i was just asking. If i can use a light on my pov how do i do it and who do i need to talk to to get it approved, thx for reading this thread i greatly apperciate it.

This is not only an issue of whether or not he should put lights on his POV, this kid as some other pretty serious issues to deal with and some maturing to do before even thinking about being involved with any aspect of public safety.

For starters, 2 days ago on Firehouse he was 16, today here he's 17. :rolleyes:

His post on Firehouse stated he was a fire explorer and in training to try and become a firefighter, he then comes to this site to tell us he's got his Firefighter I+II certs :rolleyes:

Even more disturbing is the callousness with which he speaks about a 3 year old fatality involved in an MVA. This kid has a definite hero complex and is going to get himself or someone else killed with his actions. He posted on Firehouse.com, didn't get the response that he wanted, and figured he would try here.

To the OP, leave the patient care and firefighting to the trained ADULT professionals and stop freelancing. If you are truly interested in helping people then you need to follow the correct procedures, get the education you need, get hired into a service, and then you will be able to help. Scanner jumping and racing to the scene POV with lights blazing, while not having the knowledge and training to do anything once you get there, only puts peoples safety in jeopardy and doesn't help anyone.
 
Info

Thanks for that info. The actions described would be both dangerous and irresponsible if true. Emergency services should discuss the matter with the individual and make sure that ill advised path is swiftly terminated.
 
I suspect he isnt telling the truth about having the lights in his POV approved by his department and homeland security.
 
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Guys, I think he is just a young man excited at the prospect of getting into EMS. I don't think belittling him makes him or anyone any better. This is just a forum! After all, some of you are only just a few years older.
 
It is not a point of belittling him. He came here and lied to everyone from the start. Now he will never get an answer to a question, because no one will have trust in him. Maybe he will learn a lesson, to be honest from the start!
 
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