Flying as an EMR?

I'd bring one of those kids helmets with siren and the rotating light on top,slap that bad boy on. Just in case. But seriously, I would not just offer up my status, EMR,EMT,PARAMEDIC,however if your a fireman,anounce that over the loud speaker, I'm sure they will roll out the red carpet for ya.:P
 
I get up once we take off, go toward the cockpit and announce loudly so everyone can hear: ATTENTION EVERYBODY, THIS WILL ONLY TAKE A MINUTE AND I DON'T WANT ANYONE TO GET HURT BY DOING SOMETHING STUPID.

Then you can let em all know what you do
 
Flight-LP said:
Actually, most flight attendants receive specialized education on frequently encountered issues in flight. I place a lot more confidence in their abilities to assist vs. that of an EMT who has no knowledge of flight physiology or the nature of the aviation industry.
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You're honestly giving too much credit to flight attendants. My mom was one for 6 years and she has told me countless times the 'training' they go through on first aid. It IS below even the first responder level, and has nothing on flight physiology or anything of that nature.

Essentially CPR, AED and use the intercom to get a medical professional.
 
i personally wouldnt tell them, unless something happened mid flight, then if i hadnt already had a few drinks, and was bored of all the movies, id consider making myself known.
 
Personally, the in-flight emergency I'm looking forward to is when the pilot, co-pilot, and anyone else up in that little room at the front of the plane all get sick and incapacitated. Then they'll ask if there's a pilot on board and I'll raise my hand and proudly proclaim, "NO, but I've played a lot of flight-sim video games so we're in Perfectly Safe hands!"
 
JJR512 said:
Personally, the in-flight emergency I'm looking forward to is when the pilot, co-pilot, and anyone else up in that little room at the front of the plane all get sick and incapacitated. Then they'll ask if there's a pilot on board and I'll raise my hand and proudly proclaim, "NO, but I've played a lot of flight-sim video games so we're in Perfectly Safe hands!"
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hahaha epic!! just like the movies...

imagine the ammount of free travel miles you'd get after that one!
free travel for life
 
As a 15 year light attendant and a brand new EMT my advice is this. Feel free to introduce yourself to the flight attendnt at the front of the plain. Over the years I've had doctors and nurses jump to the rescue on the plane and be of no use at all. I will take one decent paramedic over any 5 doctors. As Flight attendants we have a decent amount of training in handling the basic stuff but there is nothing that makes us hapier then when a paramedic steps in and saves the day. And jst a little FYI the o2 masks on the plane blow 2 liters on low and 4 on high
 
JJR512 said:
Here's what you do.

Wait until the steward/stewardess has just finished the pre-flight safety announcements and demonstrations, then stand up, and proclaim loudly for all to hear that you are a Trained Medical Professional so everyone can rest assured that they are Perfectly Safe. Then thank the steward/stewardess and remind him or her that if there are any problems, you're in seat # <whatever>.
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Also it's very important to wave around a improvised weapon while doing this. It establishes dominance over the other medical personnel on board so that they know their place.
 
MrBrown said:
All commercial jets carry an AED and a physicians kit which is basically an IV roll with standard advanced airway supplies and drugs. Most airlines allow the Captain to release it for use to a doctor upon sighting credentials however this may not extend to ambulance Paramedics, Brown knows of one or two airlines where this is the case.

Brown, CPL-C
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Only an actual doc can start an IV in the field without online medical control. Its possible they might be able to authorize a paramedic to do it with them watching (well, its probably still not legal but you likely wouldn't get in trouble for it), but still unlikely. I guess this may not apply in countries where paramedics are independently licensed to practice without physicians oversight, but it holds in the US.
 
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bigbaldguy said:
I will take one decent paramedic over any 5 doctors.
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I'll take the five guys with four years of pre-med, four years of medical school, and two to three years of residency over the guy with at best two years of EMS education. Surely, between those five physicians' combined fifty years of training, they can figure something out. :D

Now, if you make me choose between one decent gynecologist and one decent paramedic, give me the medic. :D
 
jjesusfreak01 said:
Only an actual doc can start an IV in the field without online medical control. Its possible they might be able to authorize a paramedic to do it with them watching (well, its probably still not legal but you likely wouldn't get in trouble for it), but still unlikely. I guess this may not apply in countries where paramedics are independently licensed to practice without physicians oversight, but it holds in the US.
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While I think I see where you are coming from, there are some Paramedics that have standing orders that are applicable throughout the country (and even internationally in some cases depending on their service area). Thats not really an accurate blanket statement.
 
rook901 said:
I'll take the five guys with four years of pre-med, four years of medical school, and two to three years of residency over the guy with at best two years of EMS education. Surely, between those five physicians' combined fifty years of training, they can figure something out. :D

Now, if you make me choose between one decent gynecologist and one decent paramedic, give me the medic. :D
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I'll take the medic with 5 years of emergency medicine EXPERIENCE over any doc who's been practicing in a barely related field. Internal medicine? Sure, i'm maybe ok with that, maybe surgery or anesthesiology too, but you could have a psychiatrist, a gynecologist, or a pediatrician with absolutely no emergency experience besides a few weeks during their clinicals.

The purpose of a residency is to give a doctor experience in their field before they are allowed to practice independently. This is why you have board exams, to show competency in the field. While we may have no equivalent to board exams and residencies, we do have the badge of experience to show.

In any real emergency, you want someone with real experience dealing with these emergencies. This could be an experienced EMT, a medic, an ER nurse, or an emergency medicine physician . . . it could even be a firefighter or a CNA working on a code team.

@Flight-LP...yeah, that's why I put in the qualifier about this being for the US. After I started writing that, I remembered that other countries are not like the US. Most don't have states, and some don't require physicians oversight for practice.
 
Thank you for the information on what a residency is. :rolleyes:

I was poking fun at the foolishness of making the statement that one "decent paramedic" is better than five doctors. I really don't care what their specialty is. I'm quite certain that the experience of five physicians, regardless of specialty, would be more useful than the experience of one "decent" paramedic (decent is the quoted poster's word, not mine). Now, if we throw egos into the mix between the five physicians, there may be a problem.

I also clearly stated that I would rather have one medic working on me than one gynecologist.

Try not to be so defensive next time. Perhaps I'll have to call that gynecologist after all. Seems like there's a case of MPH floating around. ;)

jjesusfreak01 said:
I'll take the medic with 5 years of emergency medicine EXPERIENCE over any doc who's been practicing in a barely related field. Internal medicine? Sure, i'm maybe ok with that, maybe surgery or anesthesiology too, but you could have a psychiatrist, a gynecologist, or a pediatrician with absolutely no emergency experience besides a few weeks during their clinicals.

The purpose of a residency is to give a doctor experience in their field before they are allowed to practice independently. This is why you have board exams, to show competency in the field. While we may have no equivalent to board exams and residencies, we do have the badge of experience to show.

In any real emergency, you want someone with real experience dealing with these emergencies. This could be an experienced EMT, a medic, an ER nurse, or an emergency medicine physician . . . it could even be a firefighter or a CNA working on a code team.

@Flight-LP...yeah, that's why I put in the qualifier about this being for the US. After I started writing that, I remembered that other countries are not like the US. Most don't have states, and some don't require physicians oversight for practice.
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busmonkey said:
Yes. Emergency Medical Responder will be one level above them, as they will have First Responder versus EMR which is an actual Paramedic level (as in I can work on Ambulances)... Yes I suppose if there is an emergency I will announce myself :) Thanks for your help guys!!!

JB
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JB,

A couple of points, first Paramedic level in the states is different from the same title in Canada. EMR and First Responder are more or less synonymous though. In most states there are three basic levels starting with EMR, EMT and concluding with EMT-P or Paramedic level with the highest level of training. Flight attendants will have some level of training but not usually an EMS level cert, more than likely CPR on or up to BLS level along with advanced first aid such as ASHI's Emergency Responder (which is 14 hours as opposed to ASHI's First Responder which is 40+), they also will probably have some basic flight physiology training as well as one other responder pointed out that O2 apparatus is different on-board commercial aircraft (in part due to cabin pressure considerations). FYI, the tubing on commercial aircraft is different than O2 tubing that we use on the street and a bag-valve will almost never attach but think about it, with 4 or so LPM your not going to push that much more than 21% O2 to begin with.

More info on the equipment and differences between "street" EMS and the kits and capabilities found on commercial passenger aircraft can be found in a fairly recent article on JEMS, here's the link:

http://www.jems.com/article/patient-care/handling-flight-medical-emerge

You will be amazed at what is on board that fits into many scopes of training.

As for announcing yourself before the flight, I have to agree that it does in fact sound a bit whackerish, the odds of someone on the flight having equal or higher training is likely and even if a doc is on-board you will be amazed how often they will want you around if you step in, act professional and know what you are talking about. The same goes for in hospital codes as everyone is an integral part to the ACLS team and anyone who disregards any individuals input is ignorant, absolute poppycock. My advice to you is have your credentials ready, perhaps keep a set of gloves in your wallet or carry on and if it looks like a mess, then step in.

Cheers!

Jay
 
jjesusfreak01 said:
Only an actual doc can start an IV in the field without online medical control. Its possible they might be able to authorize a paramedic to do it with them watching (well, its probably still not legal but you likely wouldn't get in trouble for it), but still unlikely. I guess this may not apply in countries where paramedics are independently licensed to practice without physicians oversight, but it holds in the US.
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There are different rules while in flight. You are allowed to practice to your scope during an in flight emergency. Also, the Airlines have medical control available which you can consult with, especially if you need to redirect the flight to a closer airport.
 
U.S. DOT vs. State-Level Protocols for In-Flight Service

wyoskibum said:
There are different rules while in flight. You are allowed to practice to your scope during an in flight emergency.
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It should be noteworthy to comment that national EMS standards are set by the DOT and each state bases their specific protocols around this national framework. Practicing within the state means that in a hospital or ground ambulance that you are required to keep with the state protocols. I recently was speaking with a medic instructor here in Philly that is on a lot of state-level programs and he said it to me best that once you are off the ground, in an aircraft, all rules are off when it comes to state protocol and the larger national-level scope applies, which is set by the DOT. The EMS practitioner falls under the national scope for his or her level until they land and then is bound to the rules of the state that they land in. I am not sure if this applies as soon as they are an inch off of the ground with takeoff or if there is a set footage when the transition applies but he did make it sound like it was as soon as the aircraft is airborne.
 
Jay said:
It should be noteworthy to comment that national EMS standards are set by the DOT and each state bases their specific protocols around this national framework. Practicing within the state means that in a hospital or ground ambulance that you are required to keep with the state protocols. I recently was speaking with a medic instructor here in Philly that is on a lot of state-level programs and he said it to me best that once you are off the ground, in an aircraft, all rules are off when it comes to state protocol and the larger national-level scope applies, which is set by the DOT. The EMS practitioner falls under the national scope for his or her level until they land and then is bound to the rules of the state that they land in. I am not sure if this applies as soon as they are an inch off of the ground with takeoff or if there is a set footage when the transition applies but he did make it sound like it was as soon as the aircraft is airborne.
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The problem with this is that even if you are held to national scope in the air, the second you hit the ground you no longer have a certification to do anything if you don't practice in that state, am I right?
 
jjesusfreak01 said:
The problem with this is that even if you are held to national scope in the air, the second you hit the ground you no longer have a certification to do anything if you don't practice in that state, am I right?
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My understanding is that no matter where you go, you continue to function under the rules of the jurisdiction in which you started functioning. So if you start in the air, under national scope, you continue to function under the national scope until care is transferred.
 
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