Omg dont touch me!

[MissTrishEMTB08]

Yesterday we had this female patient that was very very touchy. It got to the point where I was ready to take her hand off my freaking knee!

It started out as me taking her BP en route, I always support their arm with my knee while I take it. Well, after I moved her arm back to her, she ended up putting her hand on my knee and rubbing it and everything. I would stand up to throw my gloves away, or turn away to move my knees, but she always put her hand on my knee. I dont think she meant anything by it, she said I reminded her of her favorite granddaughter and she was going to hospice, so Im sure she was scared, so I didnt want to embarrass her by asking her not to touch me, but jeez! I wouldnt mind holding her hand if it would make her feel better because it must be terrifying, but touching my leg is kind of off limits

In the end I asked her if she was cold and went to go fiddle with the controls by the captains chair.

So have any of you run into a situation where you had to tactfully ask a patient to take their hands off you? How do you do it?

And yes! THis one made it all the way to hospice alive! (Though the same hospice case worker was kinda p!ssy when I asked, privately and away from all family and the patient, if she was really ok to transport and wasnt going to conk out half way.)

 

[emt19723]

hmmmm.....dont know about this situation....but myself personally...not a whole lot bothers me. if she just wanted to rest her hand on my knee, or rub it, or whatever.....as long as it keeps her calm and makes her a better pt, go for it. granted, there are limits to that. as long as you have good judgement on where those lines may be, you should be all right. something as harmless as what youre describing wouldnt alarm me though.

 

[Flight-LP]

Just wait until you get the happy drunk patient. Touching your leg will be the least of your concerns................................

BTW - Ummmm, hospice pts. typically go to hospice for one reason and one reason only; to die. With this knowledge in mind, why would one even ask the case worker if the pt. could possibly "conk". Of course she could, will that change you transporting, not in the least bit. I would probably be a little annoyed too if I were the case worker.......................

 

[BossyCow]

A little old lady reaching out for some human contact in a scary situation creeped you out? Our work involves touching people, sometimes they touch back. I've done a lot of hugging and comforting of the smelly, old and odd. But then I'm not too bothered by the touchy feeley stuff.

There is a difference between that and the more sexual contact that some of our more chemically enhanced pts want to engage in. I have looked some of these directly in the eye and told them in no uncertain terms that I was going to pull the rig over, put them in restraints and get a LEO to ride with us the rest of the way if they didn't knock it off immediately.

Its all about boundaries. Know where yours are and enforce them firmly.

 

[Ridryder911]

Okay newbie.. New flash! Your the one that has the problem, not the patient. Personally if you asked me in those terms or words.."if she was really ok to transport and wasnt going to conk out half way".. I would be more than irritated. I would contact your Supervisor and ask for some form of actions be taken or I would assure there would be another transport for our patients. You know what occurs then?....

Alike Bossy described, .. she is going to die and your worried about your feelings and uncomfortableness.. shame on her, how dare she reach out as a human!

My opinion is to think about things.. maybe a change in career or how you perceive patients. Personally, we have enough ambulance drivers, time we get some empathetic professional medics. Remember, it's easy to be replaced.

 

[JPINFV]

It started out as me taking her BP en route, I always support their arm with my knee while I take it. Well, after I moved her arm back to her, she ended up putting her hand on my knee and rubbing it and everything. I would stand up to throw my gloves away, or turn away to move my knees, but she always put her hand on my knee. I dont think she meant anything by it, she said I reminded her of her favorite granddaughter and she was going to hospice, so Im sure she was scared, so I didnt want to embarrass her by asking her not to touch me, but jeez! I wouldnt mind holding her hand if it would make her feel better because it must be terrifying, but touching my leg is kind of off limits

Well, you could have just, you know, held her hand. It gives the patient the contact that she was looking for and you the personal space that you're looking for. Win win situation.

 

[MissTrishEMTB08]

The whole asking if she was going to conk out thing was because the last hospice patient I transported died in the middle of transport, cleared by the same case worker. Wasnt a long transport, 10-15 minutes. I KNOW what hospice patients do, but they shouldnt be doing it on the 10-15 minute ride to the hospice.

I know you touch the patients, but the thing is the patient was touching me in a manner that I found uncomfortable. I stated clearly in my post that I wouldnt have minded holding her hand but I find touching my leg to be inappropriate. Just because Im an EMT does not mean I should be subjected to touching which makes me feel uncomfortable.

 

[Ridryder911]

I know you touch the patients, but the thing is the patient was touching me in a manner that I found uncomfortable. I stated clearly in my post that I wouldnt have minded holding her hand but I find touching my leg to be inappropriate. Just because Im an EMT does not mean I should be subjected to touching which makes me feel uncomfortable.

You know, I would think that the call should had been about the patient not you...

Would you object from a hug from a patient? .. Even you described you knew it was non-sexual, so again .. Who has the problem?

Sorry, somewhere in the EMT program they should had informed you this was a caring, profession and yes... patients need to be touched and in return they may touch you back. How much is excessive? Move or as others described, hold her hand. Deal with it appropriately.

Yes, I don't care to be touched all over (by patients) especially with those with feces or bodily fluids. So I deal with it by clasping their hands, talking to them. Still giving them the care and empathy they need and deserve.

Things will be much more than this.... and yes, I am serious of reconsidering professions.

R/r 911

 

[MissTrishEMTB08]

You know, I would think that the call should had been about the patient not you...

Would you object from a hug from a patient? .. Even you described you knew it was non-sexual, so again .. Who has the problem?

Sorry, somewhere in the EMT program they should had informed you this was a caring, profession and yes... patients need to be touched and in return they may touch you back. How much is excessive? Move or as others described, hold her hand. Deal with it appropriately.

Yes, I don't care to be touched all over (by patients) especially with those with feces or bodily fluids. So I deal with it by clasping their hands, talking to them. Still giving them the care and empathy they need and deserve.

Things will be much more than this.... and yes, I am serious of reconsidering professions.

R/r 911

I did move, quite a few times, yet her hand always found a place back on my leg.

Jesus christ, calm down. I didnt say anything to her about it, I just stated, on this board, not to her, that I was uncomfortable with it, youre acting as if I screamed in horror and started to scrub at my knee feverishly with the foam antiseptic.

The call was about her, I got her to her hospice comfortably, adjusted her 02 when she said it was drying out her nose, fixed her cannual with some 2x2s because her ears were irritated by it and so on and so forth, she got there smoothly. I made sure she was comfortable, I didnt embarrass her or anything by telling her that the hand on my knee makes me uncomfortable, didnt make her feel icky or gross or burdenful, nor even wince away when she sneezed in my face, she actually told me she had been transported hospital to hospital by many different people and I was the nicest to her.

Yeah, but Im a horrible EMT because I dont like to have my legs touched, I should quit right now, while Im halfway through medic school.

 

[JPINFV]

Jesus christ, calm down. I didnt say anything to her about it, I just stated, on this board, not to her, that I was uncomfortable with it, youre acting as if I screamed in horror and started to scrub at my knee feverishly with the foam antiseptic.

Full disclosure time:

While I didn't scream, I did scrub my cheek once with antiseptic after having a patient plant a kiss on my cheek when I was dropping her off (long story). Sneaky cougars.

 

[BossyCow]

The point is that a patient, touching you in a non-sexual way during a time of physical crisis, made you uncomfortable. Uncomfortable enough for you to come in here and post with the title.. OMG don't touch me..

While you may have been able to cover your discomfort in front of the pt.. (bully for you) you are still missing the point of Rid's and my comments..... this will happen again, often. I find it interesting that you commented about being okay with touching pts but uncomfortable with them touching you. Hmm so who has the control in the situation where you are comfortable? you stated

It got to the point where I was ready to take her hand off my freaking knee!

That's not something you say about something that is a mild annoyance. It sounds like you have issues with being touched without your permission which is simply a matter of personal preferences and the boundaries of your personal space. While it is certainly your right and privledge to set those boundaries wherever you please, the placement of yours will be in conflict with the line of work you have chosen.

So, we are not going to pat you on the head and sympathize with you over the handsy little old lady that made you uncomfortable. In my opinion, she was not out of line and you will either have to loosen up your boundaries or face continual discomfort.

 

[mikie]

ok, I too would feel a little weird about someone rubbing my knee. I'd survive though

 

[Ridryder911]

I'll take a rub on a a knee than being urinated, defecated or even vomited upon any day.

 

[reaper]

I actually like the knee rubbing!!!!

 

[VentMedic]

Get a little closer Rid. You too reaper. I can't reach you guys way over there.

 

[Ridryder911]

LOL... You can tell us that have been in EMS for a while. We consider a rub on the knee as a company benefit rather than an annoyance.

 

[daedalus]

I think ill go on the dissent here, and agree with the OP. I was taught on no uncertain terms by my CCT RN that patients, other than comforting hand holding (with gloves), should not touch you other than that. There is a huge difference in us touching them, its professional and serves a work related purpose. Touching someone else for other reasons can be an invasion of someone's personal space. Remember, we all have our own comfort levels. Besides, no one wants hands that have been covered in urine/feces/mucous/sweat/etc toughing them. Thats dangerous and carries its own hazards.

Its perfectly okay to be not okay with someone touching you. Period.

 

[daedalus]

In my opinion, she was not out of line and you will either have to loosen up your boundaries or face continual discomfort.

I believe she was out of line. Touching someone without permission is not okay, regardless of your age. If it made the OP uncomfortable, that makes it wrong.

 

[VentMedic]

And that is why they made recipe books for EMTs and Paramedics.

If you can not use your own judgement or don't have the clinical skills to know when a patient is frightened or has just spent the last several months inside a hospital and is now on their way to hospice to die, then find a career with cadavers. At least they won't reach out and touch you or express some form of human emotion.

 

[rmellish]

And that is why they made recipe books for EMTs and Paramedics.

If you can not use your own judgement or don't have the clinical skills to know when a patient is frightened or has just spent the last several months inside a hospital and is now on their way to hospice to die, then find a career with cadavers. At least they won't reach out and touch you or express some form of human emotion.

X2
I guess I'm not really understanding the issue the OP is having. It's a shame that we as ems professionals, and I use that term loosely at times, could be expected to not only do paperwork and transport a dying patient across town, but to care just a little bit as well?

Based on the description given by the OP and the tone of the post I'm agreeing with Rid and Vent on this one.